Players are now terrible...overnight

[A_Sober_Paddy]

On a run of 16 games unbeaten, lost 2 and drawn 1 of my last three, missing sitters, misplacing passes...dominating games still but making all these mistakes all of a sudden, nothing has changed...

[Earnie is God!]

3 games is nothing of a run to be worried about. It can happen very often in real life too.

[herne79]

nothing has changed...

Something has changed though - your opponents. You think they're just going to sit around and let you beat them? Different opponents play in different ways. Perhaps you've just come across some that happen to use tactics that effectively negate yours. Perhaps these teams have recognised your success and decided to play a little tighter, denying you the space you have been enjoying. Perhaps your players are suffering from over confidence or complacency.

And if, as you say, you've made no changes, where does the responsibility for that lie?

[Smurf]

On a run of 16 games unbeaten, lost 2 and drawn 1 of my last three, missing sitters, misplacing passes...dominating games still but making all these mistakes all of a sudden, nothing has changed...

I beat Barcelona 5-0 in Champs League semi final, then lost to Stoke the following game.

Complacency can set in.

[hluraven]

Did you think there was nothing wrong with the 16 unbeaten then? I'm sure your opponents claimed something was wrong!

[Kenco]

That's football for you. Could be morale, complacency, opposition tactics etc. having a 16 game run doesn't make you a good manager, getting out of a bad run will though.

[cris182]

Did you think there was nothing wrong with the 16 unbeaten then? I'm sure your opponents claimed something was wrong!

Doesn't work that way, we as players only SUFFER we don't benefit from anything ever

[A_Sober_Paddy]

Losing matches isn't the issue as such, it's the fact that the players have literally turned useless over night. Take my striker, scored a hat trick against sociedad in Europa league, and 2 against Newcastle, then in his next 5 games, zero goals, shots on the target zero, despite have 19 shots in those five games, players passing in the 80% range, in the mid 50's, morale was very good, now it's on normal, taking the soft approach as being assertive generally leads to mutany.

If I lost and the players were doing what I told them fine, but they are ignoring instructions. I had a big problem tactically in my first season fixed it, bit now it seems like I'm back to square one. First 3 league games, I won them all 5-1 against Cork, 3-0 against Galway, 1-0 against bohs they finished 5th, 2nd and 3rd the year previous with me finishing fifth...it seems like the players have gone deaf all of a sudden, it's just proper annoying and seems to be random...

[Kenco]

They might not be ignoring instructions exactly, it could be that the opposition is forcing them to make decisions because they are not in a position to carry out those instructions. AI teams don't all play the same way and sometimes a different approach is necessary.

What sort of instructions are they ignoring, specifically?

[herne79]

Losing matches isn't the issue. Nor are players turning useless "overnight" (because they haven't).

The issue is you believing it's your players that are suddenly useless. You are failing to adapt to changing circumstances, and instead of thinking about what you should be doing to evolve your system, you are carrying on regardless, changing nothing and blaming your players (and therefore the game).

Did you actually read any of these replies? All of the following is within your control.

Something has changed though - your opponents. You think they're just going to sit around and let you beat them? Different opponents play in different ways. Perhaps you've just come across some that happen to use tactics that effectively negate yours. Perhaps these teams have recognised your success and decided to play a little tighter, denying you the space you have been enjoying. Perhaps your players are suffering from over confidence or complacency.

And if, as you say, you've made no changes, where does the responsibility for that lie?

I beat Barcelona 5-0 in Champs League semi final, then lost to Stoke the following game.

Complacency can set in.

That's football for you. Could be morale, complacency, opposition tactics etc. having a 16 game run doesn't make you a good manager, getting out of a bad run will though.

[barto123]

I love it how people come onto this forum to berate the game because they are bad at it. "I should win every game without changing tactics and if I don't the game is broken"...

If you go on a winning run, opposition change their tactics to reflect you are a threat. Your striker suddenly does badly cause he might be being closley marked out of the game to an extent that he cant make chances. So its up to you to look at what is happening and react to it!

[ac13]

I love it how people come onto this forum to berate the game because they are bad at it. "I should win every game without changing tactics and if I don't the game is broken"...

If you go on a winning run, opposition change their tactics to reflect you are a threat. Your striker suddenly does badly cause he might be being closley marked out of the game to an extent that he cant make chances. So its up to you to look at what is happening and react to it!

This is the least useful comment imaginable. If he's beating Sociedad and Newcastle with an Irish team he's clearly not bad at the game. No need for the condescension. What are your amazing achievements which make you God of FM.

[scott MUFC]

my main tactic has been nearly useless for 2 seasons now due to terrible finishing.

even if opponent is weak its a struggle.

[sporadicsmiles]

It happens, I had a huge run of bad form in my last season which threatened to derail what seemed to be a canter to the title. It was possibly partly down to complacency (although I did try to combat this as best I could) but one of the main things was that the opposition had changed how they played against me.

I had been playing the ball out from the back and using possession as a defensive strategy. What appears to have happened (and it has transfered to my next season as well) is that teams have (a) stopped playing the ball long every time from defence, which often resulting in me recovering the ball quickly and (b) started to close me down much higher up the pitch, resulting in my defensive players having less time to pass the ball and my midfielders having a lot less space to receive it.

I have had to rethink how I play, and have added back from directness to my game; if a team is pressing me high up the pitch then they are going to leave space in their own defensive area, so I have encouraged players to exploit such space. The football is no longer exactly what I want, but I am winning comfortably again. I suggest watching a few games on full highlights (I use 2D pitch and a fast speed). Look for what is going wrong, and work out how to combat it.

[scott MUFC]

that is all you can do, I have tweaked etc, and then switched to a tactic i rarely used in the first season because it wasn't effective at all, oddly enough. It also has the benefit of going direct or not being a game changer.

[Lenzar]

I always find it amusing how many SI apologists jump to the defence when the game exhibits issues.

Can anyone come up with a sensible reason that doesn't resorted to the long debunked 'it's your tactics' myth?

Tactics don't explain why players shoot from stupid positions when they've been finishing properly all season. Tactics don't explain how a player with far less pace can suddenly catch your striker.

[HUNT3R]

I always find it amusing how many SI apologists jump to the defence when the game exhibits issues.

Can anyone come up with a sensible reason that doesn't resorted to the long debunked 'it's your tactics' myth?

Tactics don't explain why players shoot from stupid positions when they've been finishing properly all season. Tactics don't explain how a player with far less pace can suddenly catch your striker.

We don't know any detail, so we can't say anything. IF you read Herne's post, you'll see that there are a number of factors to consider.

It's not a "myth". People who think it's a myth are the people who struggle.

[Lenzar]

We don't know any detail, so we can't say anything. IF you read Herne's post, you'll see that there are a number of factors to consider.

It's not a "myth". People who think it's a myth are the people who struggle.

It is a myth.

I watch somebody play FM on Twitch.

He doesn't change his tactics, other than to occasionally change player roles if playing a second string.

He's dropped one point all season.

Clearly, the AI isn't adapting there, so why would it be here?

[XaW]

It is a myth.

I watch somebody play FM on Twitch.

He doesn't change his tactics, other than to occasionally change player roles if playing a second string.

He's dropped one point all season.

Clearly, the AI isn't adapting there, so why would it be here?

That don't really prove anything. If you would drop Real Madrid in the third tier of Northern Irish football they would likely do even better without doing anything tactical at all, just because of player quality. And if he manages it, why don't you do it the exact same way?

[HUNT3R]

It is a myth.

I watch somebody play FM on Twitch.

He doesn't change his tactics, other than to occasionally change player roles if playing a second string.

He's dropped one point all season.

Clearly, the AI isn't adapting there, so why would it be here?

That proves nothing.

It depends on the tactic, obviously. If you mostly rely on breaking forward quickly or in any other way (poor movement up front etc) on the opponent giving you space, then your tactic will eventually start to fail as teams sit back more and deny you precisely that space.

If you don't you will largely be successful. I've used the same setup for 3 seasons now and I don't need to "adapt", but that's because I'm creating goals in more than one way and I make small adjustments in matches if I need to.

At the previous club, I used the same tactic for 5 seasons and because my players were some of the best in the world I didn't need to change anything. The tactic itself didn't rely on any specific way of scoring goals either, so opponents couldn't stop it.

In your "example" there are a few possibilities. The AI has already started sitting back from the start, so they can't adapt more, it's an exploit tactic or a tactic that isn't one-dimensional.

[Cougar2010]

It is a myth.

I watch somebody play FM on Twitch.

He doesn't change his tactics, other than to occasionally change player roles if playing a second string.

He's dropped one point all season.

Clearly, the AI isn't adapting there, so why would it be here?

The likely answer is that the OP's situation has changed.

You can cut down what happens into three generic situations:

A) The user starts the season as one of the best teams in the division and expected to finish close to the top.

In this situation most of the teams he is facing play fairly defensive, low risk football against him. If he has a tactical setup that works against this type of opposition approach then there is no reason to change it as the opposition won't change. His results will be fairly consistent all season as long as he controls the mentality of his players through the team talks and doesn't let complacency get out of hand.

B) The user is a mid-table club.

This is one of the common threads you see on the forum where a user can beat the top teams but lose to the teams towards the bottom. The top teams think they are better, play more attacking therefore leaving more space at the back which the user's tactics often exploit due to them tending to play a direct/attacking style. Against the smaller clubs who sit back this approach doesn't work as well as there isn't the same amount of space and results depend on the user nicking the first goal to open the match up. This generally then leads to comfortable wins 3-0/4-0 etc or that 1-0 defeat where the opposition defend well and steal a goal via a set piece or counter attack.

C) The user is expected to finish towards the bottom of the league.

Here the user is initially facing a situation where most teams come to attack leaving more space at the back as in case B. Their often direct/attacking style exploits this space leading to the user's team overperforming in the first half of the season. The AI clubs then re-evaluate their approach for the second half of the season and due to the over performance they then play much more defensive not allowing the user the same amount of space. The user fails to adapt to the AI club's change of approach and fails to recognise the need to adapt their tactic to the new situation they face.

There is a reason people say "Its your tactics" and its not a myth. Its a failure to recognise that the situation has changed and a failure to adapt to the new situation.

[herne79]

It is a myth.

I watch somebody play FM on Twitch.

He doesn't change his tactics, other than to occasionally change player roles if playing a second string.

He's dropped one point all season.

Clearly, the AI isn't adapting there, so why would it be here?

Copy what he's doing, see how you get on.

The bottom line is if (note the word "if" there) something changes and you start losing, the game doesn't suddenly say "that's enough of that my son, I'm going to change my coding and cheat". There will be a reason for what has changed, and the ability to adapt to those changes are within your control.

Clearly this person you've been watching on Twitch hasn't felt the need to change anything and he continues to win, so good luck to him. Unfortunately the OP has observed something and in his case isn't adapting and so isn't enjoying the success he once had.

However, in both cases we have absolutely no idea of what is happening, so we can't be prescriptive and can only make generalisations.

All I would add though is rather than waving the "it's nothing to do with tactics it's the game flag", just think it through logically for a moment. You play many different teams during a season, who use many different tactical systems which contain a wide variety of players who have different abilities and skills. The AI is also very capable of both recognising a successful team and changing its' tactics on the fly during each match. Given all of that, why would you expect your single solitary tactic, to which you never make any changes, be capable of winning all the time?

Edit - Cougar is on the money.

[jayahr]

One should not forget that football is the sport in which results are the most arbitrary and coincidental. One should therefore expect such chance to be in the game as well and that seems to be the case here.

If you are supposedly the best team in the league, then losing 2 out of 3 is just as possible as losing none in 16. Not sure how one can argue that it's unrealistic that a 16-game unbeaten run comes to an end, even after having been the better team.

There will likely also be other factors which influence the odds which may be the tactic (I for my part always fare worse against 3-men d-lines) or over-confidence, but ultimately these just change the odds and within these the results the OP experienced are well within the conceivable.

The only thing with FM which bugs me at times, is that results seem to be a little streakier in the game than irl, but that refers to the long unbeaten run as much if not more than to the 3 games without a win.

[sporadicsmiles]

It is a myth.

I watch somebody play FM on Twitch.

He doesn't change his tactics, other than to occasionally change player roles if playing a second string.

He's dropped one point all season.

Clearly, the AI isn't adapting there, so why would it be here?

That does not tell you much. I played as PSG and did not have to change anything except tweaks when I wanted to see what happened or was aiming for something specific and was unbeaten in three seasons. The league has many average teams and my players are far beyond all others in the league. Tactics matter, but if you have something sensible then players are just as important, especially when so much better.

I now play as Arsenal. My players are not that much better than other top teams in the league (weaker than a few actually), and the bad teams are also not terrible. I now have to pay a lot more attention to what I am doing, because if I do it wrong other teams have the players they need to hurt me if I get it even slightly wrong.

The upshot is that the better the opposition you face, the less leeway you have to get tactics wrong. It is how it works in real life, and it is how it works in game. It is hardly rocket science.