Meet The System

mikcheck · May 18, 2011

SrFraser, would you buy a player like this ?

John_Cro · May 18, 2011

Can we get a download link or it is again one of those "I only showed it" threads?

thank you

Marsupian · May 18, 2011

Can we get a download link or it is again one of those "I only showed it" threads?
thank you

It's not really about the tactic but the idea behind the tactic. Also when you read the post he basically tells you everything you need to know to create this tactic yourself or at least one that is almost identical. If you choose your roles so they create the same mentalities as Sfrasers and make the adjustments he details then I think you have the exact same tactic (maybe there are some slight changes in roles from fm10 to 11 but I don't think so).

DeadlyWalrus · May 18, 2011

Sfraser are you playing with two deep lying playmakers. This is something I have look at but was unsure how to set it up with my Arsenal Team. I basically have Wilshere, Fabregas, Song and Denilson. Could give some expert advice on this please.

Alright, I'm (obviously) not SFraser but I do have my Arsenal team playing using similar tactics (largely based on SFraser's earlier posts) so I may be able to offer you some advice. You are basically looking at having two DLP type players who generally hang back in the huge amounts of space that the front your tend to create but will venture forward from time to time as the opportunity presents itself. I'm finding this to be a very good role for Fabregas as he tends to sit back in space, control the game with his passing, drop pinpoint throughballs for the attackers and suddenly show up in extremely dangerous positions to bag the odd goal here and there. Where I mainly differ from SFraser's tactics is that my second MC is much less offensively minded than Cesc which is largely due to the players that an Arsenal manager has at his disposal. While Fabregas is absolutely amazing on offense he is decidedly less stellar defensively so I want to pair him with a much more physical workman like midfielder who can win the ball and help screen my lackluster centerbacks. The result is that while one of the MC positions in my formation plays a very aggressive, attacking game, the other spot tends to hold him position further back on the pitch and content himself to simply track down clearances and lay off passes to the more offensively skilled players. Obviously, this makes the team more one dimensional than if I had two playmaker types in the midfield but I feel my back line needs the help of a more defensively minded MC more than my attack needs another midfield playmaker.

Marsupian · May 18, 2011

I actually play similar with Arsenal except I play Fabregas in the AMC. My two MC's stay deep and are both DLP on support so no forward runs (like Sfraser). I can see the benefit of playing an MC who makes the odd forward run and Fabregas is great at creating something from deep so he might be better suited as MC in this system in which case it would be a crime to set his forward runs on rarely. He still does fine for me in the AMC spot but he does sometimes gets marked out of the game a bit which wouldn't happen if you play him as MC. Still I like the stability of two very all round MC's who stay deep so I'm not changing anytime soon.

axehan1 · May 18, 2011

I'm trying playing my 2 MC's as advanced playmakers instead of DLP's.As SFraser says tho they need to have runs from deep set to rare or they will stray to far forward and restrict the space for the AMC,but as adv playmakers they are a lot more attack minded than the DLP's and play some amazing long passes,through balls to those in front.Luckily i have 4 good central midfielders with decent stats in creativity,flair,decisions and good defensive stats also which really is a must as they protect the width of the midfield and can occupy the space taken up by the attacking fullbacks.

footballmanager84 · May 18, 2011

I'm trying playing my 2 MC's as advanced playmakers instead of DLP's.As SFraser says tho they need to have runs from deep set to rare or they will stray to far forward and restrict the space for the AMC,but as adv playmakers they are a lot more attack minded than the DLP's and play some amazing long passes,through balls to those in front.Luckily i have 4 good central midfielders with decent stats in creativity,flair,decisions and good defensive stats also which really is a must as they protect the width of the midfield and can occupy the space taken up by the attacking fullbacks.

What you have would work basically the same as having two dlp's. If you manually set the RFD to "rarely" the only difference between the two roles is that closing down is slightly higher for the advanced playmakers. (I checked it on my balanced attacking 4-2-3-1 system, so I'm not sure if it's different on other systems.)

DeadlyWalrus · May 18, 2011

What you have would work basically the same as having two dlp's. If you manually set the RFD to "rarely" the only difference between the two roles is that closing down is slightly higher for the advanced playmakers. (I checked it on my balanced attacking 4-2-3-1 system, so I'm not sure if it's different on other systems.)

Yeah, once you start manually changing RFD, RWD, etc then the main things you are altering with the TC roles is the player's mentality, creative freedom and closing down. The "DLP" in my system is actually an adv. playmaker according to the TC but because his RFD is set to rarely he tends to sit back and play like a DLP.

axehan1 · May 18, 2011

As advanced playmakers they play higher up the pitch as opposed to the dlp playing in front of the defenders.the run from deep rare means they will hold that position unless they find a situation where they can move into space.

John_Cro · May 19, 2011

As advanced playmakers they play higher up the pitch as opposed to the dlp playing in front of the defenders.the run from deep rare means they will hold that position unless they find a situation where they can move into space.

How do you change where does he stand? In Mentality bar or something else

Romanista1994 · May 19, 2011

So, I've watched a few of the PKM's and aside from the obviously brilliant attacking football, I really enjoyed seeing Ramirez and Sandro dominate the midfield physically, winning headers all over the place and disrupting the opposition's moves early on.

Reading your thread 'How To Meet The Next Season' has left me with a question, however: Of the two midflield playmakers you have brought in, neither is able to challenge for headers and dominate in the same way as Ramirez, so do you intend to change anything in your system to accomodate them, or do you reckon no changes will be necessary?

SFraser · May 19, 2011

So, I've watched a few of the PKM's and aside from the obviously brilliant attacking football, I really enjoyed seeing Ramirez and Sandro dominate the midfield physically, winning headers all over the place and disrupting the opposition's moves early on.
Reading your thread 'How To Meet The Next Season' has left me with a question, however: Of the two midflield playmakers you have brought in, neither is able to challenge for headers and dominate in the same way as Ramirez, so do you intend to change anything in your system to accomodate them, or do you reckon no changes will be necessary?

You have it perfect, and you have nailed down the exact question I have as well.

The truth of the matter is that can I only "theorise" and "experiment". What happens in matches is what is going to tell me how well these ideas work. If I don't miss Sandro in the middle then that's fine, if I do then I will have to adapt.

That adaption may be as simple as playing Sandro in midfield when the opponent has good headers in midfield, it may be something different. Maybe I learn to live with a few missed interceptions and tackles because the new guys attacking ability is much superior to Sandro's defensive ability.

It's true that the new guy wont physically dominate the midfield like Sandro does, but I have to say many kudos to you for spotting in six matches some of the precise details of my teams performances.

That midfield combination is good though, isn't it?

DaLima9 · May 19, 2011

After being inspired by this thread, I tried implementing many of your ideas, and I've had great succes with it so far.

My team is not as creatively gifted as yours, as I've never had a strategy like that when looking for players. I've allways loved having a "big man" up front, and a beast in the midfield, and generally their impressive physique leaves them lacking in creativity. As a result, I've had to cut down on the creativity of one MC and my SC, and after some time for the system to settle in, and my new signings to gel with the rest, my team is now dominating.

My shining star above all is Juan Mata on the AML position, even being left footed he wrecks havoc due to the large amounts of freedom he is offered.

I have Paulo Henrique in the AMC slot, a €40 million deal. While he isn't performing as well as I would think he can, he has still notched up 4gls and 10ast in just 19 games in his first year on the team.

My AMR position is my weakest link atm. I have Vladimir Weiss, who is really more a pure winger than an inside forward, but I have a great regen who I hope can step up his ratings next season (avg around 7 now).

In the SC slot I have some great big men in Lukaku, Babacar and Sanogo. I will be getting rid of Lukaku I think he is simply too big and not technically gifted enoough compared to the other two, and then try and get my hands on a smaller, faster and more creative guy instead. Both babacar and Sanogo work great after I reduced their creativity and passing lenghts.

My MC positions I simply love, they seem to be the glue that holds it all together. With players like Sahin, Fellaini, Rodwell and Nkoulou I have such a greta mic of defensive and offesive balance and work rates, that once they started gelling I started winning big.

Defence is doing pretty good. Mainly I control possession, leaving the without much to do. My fullbacks aren't offensively gifted aside from Alex Sandro, but I am still failing at getting him involved enough offensivly. I think it might be due to the magic of Mata, and I am fine with Sandro just laying it off to him and letting him work it from there. Having guys like Höwedes, Hummels and Subotic in the central defence is great for attacking corners. These guys are beasts even with the standard set piece instructions, and no offense in the german league (I am Dortmund) stand a chance against them. If they do get though, Akinfeev and Delac provide good coverage.

I am loving the 4-2-3-1 now, thanks to this thread.

Anyways, on to my questions:

- I love playing with big guys up front. Do you have any tips on how to set up a better usage of these big, but creatively lacking guys? Generally they seem to keep my AMC a little limited, as they aren't really creating space in synergy between each other very well. Should I aim to bring in a better inside forward for my AMR position, and the drop the AMC back a little to feed more balls to the AMR/SC/AML trio? I feel it might have a negative effect on my MCs contributions offensively, but I could assign them a little more defensively.

- Do you make use of OIs? I keep my OIs very limited, usually focussing on things like DMC playmakers or lone forwards + people who should be tackled hard. Do you do anything else?

- Any chance you could do a quick run-down on what shouts your use in which situations? Sometimes I feel the "obvious" shout doesn't nring about the desired changes.

That's it. Thanks ahead for the answers, and thanks again for this great thread.

SFraser · May 19, 2011

- I love playing with big guys up front. Do you have any tips on how to set up a better usage of these big, but creatively lacking guys? Generally they seem to keep my AMC a little limited, as they aren't really creating space in synergy between each other very well

My AMR position is my weakest link atm. I have Vladimir Weiss, who is really more a pure winger than an inside forward

The answer is already there.

For your particular system fiddle around with the instructions for your RW and FC until you produce a system the RW bombs forward and whips in crosses for your Striker. My players cut in because that's what suits my team, I don't have "big men" upfront to nod crosses into the net.

You might want to fiddle around with targetman and playmaker instructions if you have a giant upfront and an AMC that seems to be getting low ratings. Setting your FC as the target and giving your RW the instruction to aim for targetman after you have set him up with RWB Often, Cross Ball Often, Cross from byline and everything else rare will give you that proper "winger" behaviour while everyone else in your team looks for your AMC, and if your AMC is clever then he picks the best option.

This is why I don't put tactics up for download, they only work for my team. It's not my aim to invent a tactic that always beats the AI, it's my aim to build the sexiest looking football that FM has ever seen and win matches with it. My system has some, I think, very sound details in it that would work well for anyone, but some of the more specialised issues simply wont work elsewhere.

And don't think that I don't tinker either. This thread is my current system, it's a lot different to my original 4-2-3-1 and it's likely to be a lot different from the 4-2-3-1's I build in the future, although the principles will remain the same. Ofcourse I tinker and tweak and adapt and change. But I don't tinker and tweak and adapt and change because I'm losing when last match I won and did nothing.

Set up what makes sense for your team. If this thread gives you specific details you find works then great, but the point all along was the thinking process.

And to show off some PKM's.

...Eternal Sin... · May 20, 2011

SFraser can you send me link to this tactic? and secon question do you have some tactic for fm11 11.3 ?

JesterSTJ · May 20, 2011

Real excellent thread, enjoyed reading through it. I am now inspired to stick to the 4-2-3-1 formation and lessen down on my tweaking. I have decieded to follow you basic outline and try to allow my forward players to use there own initative and creativity and it seems to be working so far!

Although i was wondering if you could tell me the main touchline combinations you use? and the effect they have one your team. The idea of using the shouts is new to me, so knowing the type of combinations possible would be really useful.

John_Cro · May 20, 2011

Can you, SFraser, put the tactic in your first post? I think it would be very usefull so that we can modify it and not lose our time guessing the rest.

Thank you

footballmanager84 · May 20, 2011

He's not going to give anyone the tactic. That's not the point of the thread. If you want to copy his settings, you can, based on the screenshots posted. Again, that's not the point. Sfraser is trying to get people to think about the game, think about their team and how they want to play and think about how to best use the players in the team to achieve that. Basically, he's trying to get people to think.

John_Cro · May 20, 2011

he's not going to give anyone the tactic. That's not the point of the thread. If you want to copy his settings, you can, based on the screenshots posted. Again, that's not the point. Sfraser is trying to get people to think about the game, think about their team and how they want to play and think about how to best use the players in the team to achieve that. Basically, he's trying to get people to think.

ok ... ....

Coentrao · May 20, 2011

When you wrote about FM not being able to maintain a balanced tactic for both attack and defense was something that really clicked for me that i haven't thought about it on detail.

I play a 4-4-1-1 and normally against harder opposition i substitute the AMC for a DMC on the last 20 minutes to make it a 4141 to hold on to a result, i also switch to defensive with a few shouts and the team pretty much shuts down the opposition everytime.

This leads to me think that against tougher opposition specially away where i normally play more defensive and on the counter that i should use the 4141(with the DMC) from the start to have a better defensive shape, since the AMC won't really be helping that much in defense and i'm spending most of the time just trying to defend, it's definetly something i'm going to try.

I shouldn't expect one formation to be able to do both jobs.

DaLima9 · May 21, 2011

The answer is already there.
For your particular system fiddle around with the instructions for your RW and FC until you produce a system the RW bombs forward and whips in crosses for your Striker. My players cut in because that's what suits my team, I don't have "big men" upfront to nod crosses into the net.

You might want to fiddle around with targetman and playmaker instructions if you have a giant upfront and an AMC that seems to be getting low ratings. Setting your FC as the target and giving your RW the instruction to aim for targetman after you have set him up with RWB Often, Cross Ball Often, Cross from byline and everything else rare will give you that proper "winger" behaviour while everyone else in your team looks for your AMC, and if your AMC is clever then he picks the best option.

This is why I don't put tactics up for download, they only work for my team. It's not my aim to invent a tactic that always beats the AI, it's my aim to build the sexiest looking football that FM has ever seen and win matches with it. My system has some, I think, very sound details in it that would work well for anyone, but some of the more specialised issues simply wont work elsewhere.

And don't think that I don't tinker either. This thread is my current system, it's a lot different to my original 4-2-3-1 and it's likely to be a lot different from the 4-2-3-1's I build in the future, although the principles will remain the same. Ofcourse I tinker and tweak and adapt and change. But I don't tinker and tweak and adapt and change because I'm losing when last match I won and did nothing.

Set up what makes sense for your team. If this thread gives you specific details you find works then great, but the point all along was the thinking process.

And to show off some PKM's.

Well, I went with another option, as I can't seem to make a target man work properly. I trained my AMR to dribble through the center of the pitch, and for the new season I've brought in more proper inside forwards :-)

pigfacemonkeyman · May 21, 2011

Well, I went with another option, as I can't seem to make a target man work properly. I trained my AMR to dribble through the center of the pitch, and for the new season I've brought in more proper inside forwards :-)

Do you set your FC to the role "Target Man" or under "Team Instructions"?

(It's just that I've used Lukaku as a "Complete Forward">"Attack" & "Target Man" in "Team Instructions" and he was pretty darn good.)

Rio_V · May 23, 2011

Another outstanding contribution, SFraser. Maybe the best one.

khick · May 23, 2011

Sfraser how do you play your cms to get such great results. I play a similar system but my I just cant get that production that you are. any tips?

b.paterson · May 24, 2011

SFraser,

I have seen a few requests for a downloadable version of this tactic, has it been posted yet?

I tend to go with the basic/automatic settings and I have seen your profile saying you win rate is 80% plus with a high goal difference 900+ I would like to be able to have a closer look at your tactic in my game if possible.

Regards

el_magico89 · May 25, 2011

sfraser,

could you pls explain me, what exactly mentality and creative freedom means?

how does mentality influences the way my attacking players move and pass?

i am trying to play a fast counter attacking football in a 4231-deep formation, but since when you choose counter as a shape, the mentality of the whole team is low, which causes, that a lot of creativity gets lost.

ive heard, that the lower the mentality of an attacking player is, the more he is tend to play short and secure passes instead of the deadly final pass.

im a bit confused, since i cant create a tactic on my own, before i understand the basic elements.

hope you can clarify me.

regards

Ville Valo · May 25, 2011

SFraser,
I have seen a few requests for a downloadable version of this tactic, has it been posted yet?

I tend to go with the basic/automatic settings and I have seen your profile saying you win rate is 80% plus with a high goal difference 900+ I would like to be able to have a closer look at your tactic in my game if possible.

Regards

I don't see him uploading it, to be honest. These threads are more about making you think, rather than a "look at my tactic" sort of thread.

grimness · May 25, 2011

And everything is posted in thread. Few minutes of work and you have tactic. Check Creativity and flair thread for missing info

lam · May 25, 2011

Really not sure how people can not work out the settings.

Use the TC to create the formation.

Play around with the support/attack roles until you find the correct mentalities.... then adjust individual instructions accordingly.

The only position you will need to change .............. I'll give you a clue, apart from the keeper, no other player have has a mirrow image.....

LAM

thebluenosebear · May 26, 2011

I added this to my flat 4-3-3 in 11.3 and it's working perfectly, I look for players under 22 who have fantastic potential abilty (according to my scouts) to grow and sell on and have a rigid set of physical attributes that I go for regardless of the bargains on offer, if someone for instance doesn't have even one of the attributes im after they don't get signed (no matter how much I want them).

I'd always played before with the MC dropping back to protect the defence but this way it lets both the MCR/MCL drop off to protect and the MC push and roam with the help of the full back either side.

I have seemed to have given up the lion share of posession though and chances for less chances and less possesion although my chances are more clear cut ones now. I have also only lost 1 goal in the last 4 and it was an unstoppable screamer through a ruck of players.

Either way Fantastic post as always mate.

fdawsoniv · May 27, 2011

I'm confused. I'm trying to put in place the same kind of split between player/team instructions and using roles/duties to shape things like the mentality structure, but no matter what I change the roles and duties to, the mentality never changes. How exactly am I supposed to go about doing this?

Edit: Nevermind. I kept clicking things and it started working.

Shake Appeal · May 27, 2011

SrFraser, would you buy a player like this ?

A short DM who can't jump with wasted heading ability, and 10 Determination? Physical stats in general are sketchy. I can't see his personality here, but at 23 I probably can't tutor him and his transfer fee is probably the least you will have to pay given he's a talented Real player. But with 10 Determination he's likely going to be a man management nightmare, even if he does look like he'd make a decent DLP.

Would not buy.

fdawsoniv · May 27, 2011

Depending on exactly how much Real make you pay for him, he might be worth a shot. As I understand it, you CAN still mentor him, though I don't know if a player gets less benefit from tutoring as he ages or not. If you can get that determination up, he'd be a decent option in midfield, but he's a long way to go in that stat to be steady. All in all, you can probably find a more promising, younger player for less money elsewhere.

Marsupian · May 27, 2011

His determination and natural fitness are his real downfalls together with his absolutely horrible heading. I'd say it depends on how much you have to pay and on what level you play. In the Eredivisie I'd snatch him if the price is right, in the top of the prem I'd let him pass.

MRW · May 27, 2011

Defending
Ball Usage

I dont know if anyone will care about this or not...or if its been explained anywhere else...but

Wouldn't it be great if you could create custom views that were just like those above. Unfortunitely the game doesn't cater for this because those columns arent selectable from "Insert Column" lists...

However there is a way...

First of all you need to have created at least one custom view on the "Players" screen on your main squad tab (this can be whatever you like - just create a copy of an existing view "Views/Custom/Create Copy of Current View"). Once you create a custom view an XML file is created that stores that custom view. This should be located at "c:\Users\{your windows user id}\AppData\Roaming\Sports Interactive\Football Manager 2011\settings\Version {number}\" where {your windows user id} is your windows login and {number} is most likely {1101}. The file will be named something like "views-v1-team-squad-views.xml".

Make sure you have quit out of Football Manager 2011.

If you open this file with Notepad or something similar you should find your newly created view which (unless you renamed it) will be named something like "Copy of {whatever view you copied}". This can be identified by the line that contains "<string id="name" value="{your custom view name}"/>". This should be immediately followed with a "</record>" line. Find the corresponding "<record>" line that matches that "</record>" line. This should be identifiable by the fact that the "<record>" line you want is followed by a "<list id="cols">" line.

An example view entry would look like this :

</record>

</record>

</record>

</list>

</record>

This only has 3 columns and the custom view name is "Example".

Now to get those views that occurred above you just need to insert into this view the appropriate columns as defined by "<record>" and "</record>" pairs - these are listed below. To do this copy everything between the "<record>" and "</record>" lines that surround the lines starting "<unsigned id=" and "<integer id=" for the column you want into your custom view. You can place these in order between the "<list id="cols"> and the "</list>" lines as long as you dont insert them between an existing "<record>" and "</record>" pair. Once you rerun Football Manager 2011 and choose this view you can then reorder them however you wish and you can easily add whatever other selectable columns you want.

The following are the "<record>" and "</record>" pairs for each of the columns :

Mentality

</record>

Creative Freedom

</record>

Passing Style

</record>

Closing Down

</record>

Tackling

</record>

Run From Deep

</record>

Run With Ball

</record>

Long Shots

</record>

Try Through Balls

</record>

Cross Ball

</record>

Cross From

</record>

Cross Aim

</record>

Wide Play

</record>

Marking

</record>

Tight Marking

</record>

Roam From Position

</record>

Hold Up Ball

</record>

The following are (basic) custom views to recreate the combinations above (they would need to be added to the main custom views xml file named above) :

Positioning and Movement

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</list>

</record>

Defending

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</list>

</record>

Ball Usage

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</record>

</list>

</record>

Notes:

1. These views where created on a 1680 by 1050 display. If yours is narrow you may not get all the columns in. Remove the attributes before may help.

2. It might pay to create basic views in the game beforehand before adding these columns as the line "<unsigned id="inid" value="{id number}">" is important - {id number} needs to be unique.

Well I hope that all makes sense and is of some use to some of you...

mikcheck · May 27, 2011

Shake Appeal, fdawsoniv, Marsupian thanks for the tips but I've bought him already. I'm having hard times to get someone with decent determination in those later stages of the game.

It's been really really difficult to find someone with good jumping, flair and determination.

bbuullddoogg · May 27, 2011

Hey SFraser I have a question. Amazing posts and thank you for putting them up. So my question is (and I apologize if you answered this somewhere) I saw you had Aguero out wide in your system. Did he need to be retrained to play out there or is he (and players like him like Pato etc) able to naturally play out there and excel at it? One thing that’s often stopped me playing some form of 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 is that it doesn’t seem to have a place for an Agureo-like player. I also like to have a trequartista. But maybe I could have both with this system. How many goals do you see coming from your front 4 in a season? Thanks.

Shake Appeal · May 27, 2011

I'm having hard times to get someone with decent determination in those later stages of the game.

This is true, actually, because the AI is really bad at tutoring youngsters. I get so frustrated when I see a regen with potential at one of my rivals in Serie A and he won't come to the club because everyone hates Juve. They'll never develop his personality or talent properly, and he ends up having a middling and patchy career, when I would have turned him into a star. It's 2016 in my save and Lazio are squandering possibly the brightest young Italian ST in the game. He has low DET and a 'Balanced' personality, and it's going to stay that way because they're amateurs.

After the second or third season, apart from one or two superstars, I find I spend most of my money and time on finding all the good under-19s (or younger) I can, and developing them myself. Because unless a player is 'born' with a good personality, he isn't going to improve as well as he could anywhere else.

Luckily, youth development is almost my favourite part of the game.

mikcheck · May 27, 2011

Shake Appeal what you mean good personality, high determination?

Shake Appeal · May 27, 2011

Well, it's a combination of things (Professionalism, Temperament, Ambition, Loyalty, Pressure, etc.) that are mostly hidden from you, but which you can get a sense of by looking at the 'Personal' screen for a player and checking their 'Personality' and 'Media handling style'. Those are the first things, along with Determination, that I check when looking at any player.

My personal preference is for highly determined players (Personality: 'Driven', 'Determined', 'Resolute', 'Spirited', etc.), because I find I have a better sense of how they will react to my personal chats and team talks, tend to respond better to adversity (like going a goal down), are complacent less often, and work harder in training.

I don't mind if a young player has what I perceive as a 'bad' or 'okay' personality like 'Fairly Ambitious' or 'Balanced', because I can use the older players in my squad to tutor them and correct these flaws... which then means the youngsters will go through their career with a better attitude to the game, and generally improve better and faster than they would otherwise. They will also do what I tell them, and respond how I want in difficult situations. And because they are starting out their careers with the personality of veterans, they are likely to develop naturally into even more assured professionals, who will then be able to pass on that culture to the next wave of youth, and so on, to breed a winning mentality at the club.

Whereas I avoid outright worrisome personalities, though, like 'Unsporting' or 'Temperamental', just because those players can be hard even to tutor, let alone control. I certainly wouldn't sign someone over the age of 22 or so with that personality.

And I have a bugbear about only signing established players who have >16 DET, or at the very worst >13 (and other things would have to compensate for a DET this low), because it just becomes too much of a hassle dealing with anyone who doesn't have that attitude. For example, I signed Andrea Poli for Juventus with DET 12, and in most of my team talks I have to single him out for special treatment, because he doesn't react well to the things most of my other players would (like 'Expect a performance!', which tends to make Poli nervous). I did this against my better judgement, and I've often regretted it.

Personality, for me, almost always trumps talent. I have more affection for my journeyman substitutes who always give their best and never complain than I do for a genuine star who won't listen when I tell him he isn't training hard enough, and goes missing in any crucial cup tie when we're trailing.

celtic2006 · May 31, 2011

I have a quick query!

You say 'As mentioned before you cannot change shape so your choices are either to offensive/defensive in terms of numbers, or of skill', but in another thread (analysing the 4-1-3-1) you have screens of Rooney dropping a little deeper.

What exactly do you mean by the shape ? I think I am getting confused and would be grateful if you could clear this up for me.

P.S Sorry if it is completely obvious and stupid!

fdawsoniv · June 1, 2011

You can't have your players play tight in defense then spread out in attack.

Or take the classic Brazil 4-2-4. It functioned as a 4-3-3 in defense and as a 3-3-4 in attack (according to Jonathan Wilson-I'm not smart enough to figure that out). In FM, you can only pick one shape.

axehan1 · June 2, 2011

try play narrow,look for overlap if you use the TC

Uncle_Sam · June 2, 2011

I dont know if anyone will care about this or not...or if its been explained anywhere else...but
Wouldn't it be great if you could create custom views that were just like those above. Unfortunitely the game doesn't cater for this because those columns arent selectable from "Insert Column" lists...

However there is a way...

First of all you need to have created at least one custom view on the "Players" screen on your main squad tab (this can be whatever you like - just create a copy of an existing view "Views/Custom/Create Copy of Current View"). Once you create a custom view an XML file is created that stores that custom view. This should be located at "c:\Users\{your windows user id}\AppData\Roaming\Sports Interactive\Football Manager 2011\settings\Version {number}\" where {your windows user id} is your windows login and {number} is most likely {1101}. The file will be named something like "views-v1-team-squad-views.xml".

Make sure you have quit out of Football Manager 2011.

If you open this file with Notepad or something similar you should find your newly created view which (unless you renamed it) will be named something like "Copy of {whatever view you copied}". This can be identified by the line that contains "<string id="name" value="{your custom view name}"/>". This should be immediately followed with a "</record>" line. Find the corresponding "<record>" line that matches that "</record>" line. This should be identifiable by the fact that the "<record>" line you want is followed by a "<list id="cols">" line.

-CONFIG STUFF-

Notes:

1. These views where created on a 1680 by 1050 display. If yours is narrow you may not get all the columns in. Remove the attributes before may help.

2. It might pay to create basic views in the game beforehand before adding these columns as the line "<unsigned id="inid" value="{id number}">" is important - {id number} needs to be unique.

Well I hope that all makes sense and is of some use to some of you...

I tried to get this to work but I just couldn't, is there any chance you could upload your file?

Finknottle · June 2, 2011

SFraser,top notch, as usual. Please would you answer me this? Do you make out the full quota of tactics, that is Defensive through to Attacking or do you just use the one, Control in your case? I tried to use just the one control tactic but was informed by weight of opinion that I was doing it all wrong and that you need to make the full quota to use as and when required. I was of the thinking that you need only to choose your preference and control the match via the shouts. Kind regards.

DaLima9 · June 4, 2011

I've really gotten my system to gel lately. My system is very close to the original system of this thread, with the excetion of the striker and the MCR, which are both less creative and thus have a bit less freedom.

Last season I won the treble with Dortmund (League, Cup, ChL). And for the past two and a half season I've dominated the german league, loosing only 1-2 games and drawing 4-6 games per season. I have a very young squad, but adding a couple of aging class players (Akinfeev, Henrique and Juan Mata) really made a difference along with players like Sahin and Hummels reacing the mid 20s.

The system produces great football, and it's pure magic to watch your creative players starte to gel and break down opposition defences with ease (most play a 4-1-4-1 against me now).

SFraser · June 4, 2011

SFraser,top notch, as usual. Please would you answer me this? Do you make out the full quota of tactics, that is Defensive through to Attacking or do you just use the one, Control in your case?

My system is set up to exploit a lot of the shouts without changing core behaviours in a players playstyle. So no I don't build tactics sets but I can use shouts to change huge aspects of how my team plays. But at the same time I don't lose the ability to control the details that I never want to see changed, like how many throughballs a rubbish passer tries, or for some reason my Attacking and Creative inside forward having to hug the touchline and whip in crosses.

I heavily modify the TC to strike a balance between both worlds that works for me. A balance between ease of use, change and Shout Exploitation of the TC with specific individual player instructions of the Tactics Sets.

Let me give you an example, when I shout "Get the Ball Forward" my players don't increase their Throughballs, they increase their Passing Directness. When I change my wide players role from Advanced Playmaker Support to Winger Attack, they don't hug the touchline, they don't cross and they don't lose any CF. They simply play more aggressive positionally and pass risk taking.

I can do more things with my tweaked TC than five, six or seven Tactics sets can do. I can play narrow and attacking once I have scored when the opponent is going to open up and play attacking to look for a goal, giving my Inside Forwards the perfect environment to hook up with my AMC/creative FC. I can drop deeper, play wider, look for more possession based passes, stand off the opponent more but dive into hard tackles when I am 3-1 up in the 80th minute, without messing up any of my core instructions.

The Tactics Creator and the "tactics sets" or "classic system" in my mind sit at two extremes of possible gameplay. I have tried to tick the right tactical boxes and set up the ideal starting system so that I can enjoy the best of both worlds.

Even before the TC was officially released I knew that the TC alone wouldn't satisfy me but the "classic system" would give up too many excellent new features, and I played a beta version of the TC on FML so I knew that the ability to design a "custom" TC was possible, and I have spent a long time doing that. Choosing the right instructions to specifically control and others to leave to the TC to enjoy the best of both worlds.

In that way the TC is the perfect SI feature, no where near developed like it could be but it gives the FM power gamer the ability to achieve something close to what the ideal TC would actually be. "New feature? If you don't like it we have included some options that allow you to fix it, although it will never be as robust as if we had spent most of our time devoted to it".

I was a major critic of the TC before it came out. Now I am one of it's biggest fans, because I don't use it properly

Braumiller · June 6, 2011

Sfraser, thank you for a great thread! After reading this is reinvigorated my desire to play FM11 again, so I have started a Dafuge challenge game and implemented the excellent feature of this thread for a tiny team.

Although I am obviously lacking in any kind of quality, I have to say the football they (attempt) to play is fantastic!

One question for you, what size of pitch to you utilize for this type of football? Maximum size to allow more space for the passing and movement, or the default Old Trafford pitch?

Thanks again, loving the new outlook on tactics :thup:

SunDevil · June 6, 2011

...so I knew that the ability to design a "custom" TC was possible, and I have spent a long time doing that. Choosing the right instructions to specifically control and others to leave to the TC to enjoy the best of both worlds.
...

I was a major critic of the TC before it came out. Now I am one of it's biggest fans, because I don't use it properly

SFraser can you tell me where I can find how to customize the TC, including the shouts? If not, can that be your next article? Thanks.

SFraser · June 6, 2011

SFraser can you tell me where I can find how to customize the TC, including the shouts? If not, can that be your next article? Thanks.

Ha, maybe.

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