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The 2012-2013 Manchester United Thread: Thank you, Sir Alex


ddidiodion

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Phew. At least we won. Thought we played well the first 20 minutes or thereabouts, and then it kinda got nowhere after that. But we got the points and that's what matters at the end of the day. Clean up-ish against the Braga and Cluj and now and it's settled before the noise-fest in Turkey.

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Will take that :D Really do think games like this are just a bridge too far for Scholes in a central two. Really needed a Cleverley or Anderson (or hopefully soon a fully fit Fletcher) to break up the midfield a bit. Kagawa frozen out too much in the second half I felt, but it's interesting to see how much freer Carrick has played this season, not just tonight, with the added security of an extra body in the 4-2-3-1. Good goal from him and a solid performance all told.

Disappointed RvP never got into the game. Seems to be stuck between being a fixed #9 and more of an allround forward. Thankfully Nani was, penalty aside, splendid - MotM for me. Stupid that RvP didn't take it though. Don't understand what he was(n't) thinking - I swear that prior to the Fulham spot kick all the ones I'd seen him take had been a short run up - about as long as what he ended up with after all that stuttering nonsense - before being blasted postage stamp into the top corner. Brilliant otherwise after those bizarre first 15 mins, promising link play with Evra, and even a few good corners.

Valencia can seem so toothless when his pace, cross/shoot trick is not coming off. I now expect him to prove me wrong by raping that in-form fullback and score.
His pace trick is working. His crossing is not. Or there's no one at the back post.

Think this was the archetypal 'bad' Valencia performance. Had his fullback beaten all ends up and had a couple of terrific mazy dribbles, but his cross selection and execution was horrific tonight. 1 from 13 completed apparently. The issue with him I alluded to in my post at HT is that I think that he is very much a reactionary player, as opposed to the more instinctive nature of our other key attacking players. Fits in with his more reserved demeanour compared to his colleagues I suppose. But when playing the high tempo game we appear to be trying to play he can be such a liability - too often he gets caught on his heels waiting for a pass rather than expecting it; or doesn't execute his part of the move quickly enough as he can't see the opportunities in the same way our other attackers do. I think that may be why he can quite frequently check and simply pass backwards or square when he's not high on confidence, as he doesn't have the imagination to create something when plan A of 'square up fullback; beat fullback; head down; cross to (or often beyond) far post/fizz across six year box'. To criticise our players for not being at the far post tonight is daft since his crosses were so far beyond that nobody in their right mind should be there.

On the pens, Vida's was stonewall, as was ours that was given. Nani's looked likely though I didn't see a good replay. Tony's looked soft. Evans I thought played the ball against the Gala player, can't remember Carrick's (icon)?

Oh, and Big Save Dave :cool:

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The one on Nani looked like a stonewall to me. Could have been about 3 penners each though, just absurd. Horrible match by the referee, and his team. How none of the extra refs see any of those I don't understand. What's the point in having them when they just stand there but don't actually do anything?

Just glad we won the match, and thought Nani was very good apart from the horrible, horrible penalty. Our best player, ahead of Carrick.

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The one on Nani looked like a stonewall to me. Could have been about 3 penners each though, just absurd. Horrible match by the referee, and his team. How none of the extra refs see any of those I don't understand. What's the point in having them when they just stand there but don't actually do anything?

Remember Hernandez getting quite animated with one at the home leg against Bilbao - was clearly asking him what he was actually there to do when he offered no insight on a penalty shout.

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Remember Hernandez getting quite animated with one at the home leg against Bilbao - was clearly asking him what he was actually there to do when he offered no insight on a penalty shout.

I'm not 100% sure of this but I think they may only be there to monitor the goal-line. I don't think they're able to make any other calls. They're supposed to be instead of goal-line technology.

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You could see in the first five minutes what type of game it was going to be. Bad refereeing calls, anything fancy by United wouldn't work with a lot of passes under/over hit and touches poor.

Saying that, the defence did a good job and Kagawa's feet is really impressive. Nani should have been taken off after the penalty, it was obvious he was going to try to make amends and force things, and I'm disappointed that there wasn't any substitutions until really late on.

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You could see in the first five minutes what type of game it was going to be. Bad refereeing calls, anything fancy by United wouldn't work with a lot of passes under/over hit and touches poor.

Goal was pretty fancy tbf.

Saying that, the defence did a good job and Kagawa's feet is really impressive. Nani should have been taken off after the penalty, it was obvious he was going to try to make amends and force things, and I'm disappointed that there wasn't any substitutions until really late on.

Nonsense, if anything it seemed to cause him to redouble his efforts. Made a number of good passes, such as the scooped ball for Hernandez.

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Goal was pretty fancy tbf.

It was very nice but I got the impression of it being a bit of "oh ****, I've got the ball" for a split second.

Nonsense, if anything it seemed to cause him to redouble his efforts. Made a number of good passes, such as the scooped ball for Hernandez.

I never said he didn't do anything good after the penalty.

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We have missed our last 6 pens:

Nani miss against Galatasary

Hernandez miss against Wigan

Van Persie miss against Southampton

Rooney missed against Barca in pre season friendly. Nani and Young miss in the penalty shoot out in the same game.

Step up Mr Kagawa

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I repeat: step up David de Gea :)

Nani said he had decided to let the keeper make a move first and then put it the other way. Then he just stood there and he panicked. Better to just decide beforehand and put it there, and alternatively change plans if the keeper goes early. Strange RVP didn't take it though. Apart from last one, he usually slams them down in a corner, which are the hardest ones for the goalies to take. (Except powered high I suppose, but then you can more easily miss too).

If these refs by the goals actually did something they could be more useful than goalline technology as they are often in a better position to see what happens in the box. But right now it seems like they are afraid to step in and do anything, so they just stand there for 90 minutes.

Thought we had some pretty neet passing going on at times, like on the goal, and plenty of other occasions. There is something to build on there, and we have a great focal point in Kagawa. Can't wait to we get more used to his playing style and thinking. Then he should start to score and assist very regularly.

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For me, you pick a corner, hit it hard and low and even if the keeper goes the right way, if it's just inside the post, you'll score. I think there's too much over thinking going on. Never change your mind. There are players that wait for the keeper, etc or blast it, basically keeper has no chance to react before it's past him but low and corner and you're good

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If these refs by the goals actually did something they could be more useful than goalline technology as they are often in a better position to see what happens in the box. But right now it seems like they are afraid to step in and do anything, so they just stand there for 90 minutes.

I think their biggest problem is that there is no obvious impact the extra officials have on the game. They don't have any flags to wave so fans don't know what decisions they have or haven't helped make. I think most commentators have no clue what their remit is and that adds to the general attitude of them not doing anything.

As for the penalty, it was pretty obvious Nani had a major brain fart.

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So, Liverpool on Sunday. I think this could be the first time we see Kagawa starting from the left.

Would like to see:

-------------DDG (will almost certainly be DIG)

------Rafa Vidic Rio Evra

-----------Carrick

--------Cleverley Ando

Valencia --------------Kagawa

------------RVP

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I never said he didn't do anything good after the penalty.

You said he should have been brought off, despite the fact he was our best player, and played better after the penalty than before.

Make Carrick or Scholes take the next one. Or Valencia. Somehow, I get the feeling that Valencia will just blast it into a corner every single time.

Scholes used to be lethal from the spot but I don't think I've seen him take one since the Cardiff robbery. Maybe felt too responsible or something. Think Tony V would burst into tears if we didn't have a comfortable lead :D

So, Liverpool on Sunday. I think this could be the first time we see Kagawa starting from the left.

Would like to see:

-------------DDG (will almost certainly be DIG)

------Rafa Vidic Rio Evra

-----------Carrick

--------Cleverley Ando

Valencia --------------Kagawa

------------RVP

Would leave Evra exposed.

This team but with Nani in for Valencia - he never seems to work in a front three, not least since we've one less attacker for his crosses to find - and maybe Welbeck for Kagawa. Don't think Evra would be exposed (any more than usual, anyway) since both Anderson and Cleverley cover a lot of ground and Kagawa and Welbeck track back persistently. Scholes, Valencia, Hernandez and whoever doesn't start on the left can be the plan B options.

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You said he should have been brought off, despite the fact he was our best player, and played better after the penalty than before.

We'll have to agree to disagree here because I saw Kagawa and Evra as our best players. I didn't think Nani had a bad game but he definitely wasn't better than anyone else on the pitch for us.

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Kagawa was great first half, quieter in the second. Evra best work was largely down to his link play with Nani, in the second half in particular. Regardless, how you can consider Nani's first half performance as better than his second is beyond me.

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Shouldn't need to practice penalties ffs. If Rooney/RVP/Nani can't bloody well step up and hit the top corner every single time then there's simply something wrong. Penalties are supposed to be an absolute given unless the taker puts it where the keeper can get it or simply has a bad one and puts it wide/high. Just look at RvN's penners, hammered into the corner (admittedly the bottom, not top) almost every single time. The keepers new full well where he would put them, couldn't do a damn thing about it most of the time

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Shouldn't need to practice penalties ffs. If Rooney/RVP/Nani can't bloody well step up and hit the top corner every single time then there's simply something wrong. Penalties are supposed to be an absolute given unless the taker puts it where the keeper can get it or simply has a bad one and puts it wide/high. Just look at RvN's penners, hammered into the corner (admittedly the bottom, not top) almost every single time. The keepers new full well where he would put them, couldn't do a damn thing about it most of the time

This reminds me of a mate who plays Sunday league and is adamant that nobody with a hint of footballing ability should ever fail to hit the target, and that only a quality save should prevent a goal. Proceeded to leather several high, wide and/or handsome at a game stall at Alton Towers :D

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This reminds me of a mate who plays Sunday league and is adamant that nobody with a hint of footballing ability should ever fail to hit the target, and that only a quality save should prevent a goal. Proceeded to leather several high, wide and/or handsome at a game stall at Alton Towers :D

Can't imagine you had a laugh at that at all :D

he's right though, and when you've reached the very top level of professional football I don't think it's excusable to miss penalties like we've been doing. At least force a great save, don't just pass it to the keeper

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Top level maybe (and with all the pressure and the slim margins for error, that's still a 'maybe' imo), but he was adamant that anyone who can kick a ball should be getting it on target :D

Just reading the RoM post on pennergate; clean forgot that Fergie was surprised that Carrick took the kick against Burnley (A) three seasons back, with Rooney and Owen on the pitch.

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