Box-to-Box engines

Since Viera revolutionized this role at Arsenal, many people have been hailed as "the new Viera". I find these kind of players essential when I play 3 players across the center midfield. I am trying to compile a list of players who can fill this role well for different clubs with different price ranges. So far this is what I have. Please feel free to add your own ideas and comment on my ideas and their price ranges. Being an African most of the players I know are African

£5m and below:

Anthony Annan - (he plays more of the "Maka" role but can fill the boots of a Viera type player)

David Jones - Derby County (apparently more of a Scholesy)

Geremi Njitap - Newcastle (In real-life pretty crap right now but could benefit from experience stats in game)

£5 - 15 mil:

Sulley Muntari - Inter (about £12-14 mil to mid or high profile club...stats portray him as pretty adaptable to diff styles)

Matiudi (Hot prospect...St Ettiene I believe)

Samba (Massambou Samba?) (Great height and physical attributes, may go for a bit cheaper)

Viera - Inter (about £6-8 mil but only to high profile club)

Ballack - Chelsea (about £15m but only to high profile club)

Emre - Newcastle (totally guessing the price as I dnt know his age)

Zokora - Tottenham (Can do it)

£15 - £25 mil:

Toure Yaya - Barcelona (No idea how much he would cost..just a guess..but great player

Probably upwards of £25 mil:

Gerrard - Liverpool (more of goal-line to goal-line than box to box..take a look at his Positions diagram)

Essien - Chelsea (The name explains the price tag..could go for a bit less if your crafty with the approach..never been succesful though.)

Experimental:

Eboue - Arsenal (Seen him attempt it on TV...not bad.. with his stats..I don't see why it wouldnt work in Manager)

Anyone tried any of these...what happened?..Any cheaper ideas for lower leagues?

M'bia [Rennes] would be another option, as to is Bodmer [Lyon].

Emre is at Fenerbahçe now, but I wouldn't class him as a box to box midfielder myself.

Since Viera revolutionized this role at Arsenal, many people have been hailed as "the new Viera". I find these kind of players essential when I play 3 players across the center midfield. I am trying to compile a list of players who can fill this role well for different clubs with different price ranges. So far this is what I have. Please feel free to add your own ideas and comment on my ideas and their price ranges. Being an African most of the players I know are African

£5m and below:

Anthony Annan - (he plays more of the "Maka" role but can fill the boots of a Viera type player)

David Jones - Derby County (apparently more of a Scholesy)

Geremi Njitap - Newcastle (In real-life pretty crap right now but could benefit from experience stats in game)

£5 - 15 mil:

Sulley Muntari - Inter (about £12-14 mil to mid or high profile club...stats portray him as pretty adaptable to diff styles)

Matiudi (Hot prospect...St Ettiene I believe)

Samba (Massambou Samba?) (Great height and physical attributes, may go for a bit cheaper)

Viera - Inter (about £6-8 mil but only to high profile club)

Ballack - Chelsea (about £15m but only to high profile club)

Emre - Newcastle (totally guessing the price as I dnt know his age)

Zokora - Tottenham (Can do it)

£15 - £25 mil:

Toure Yaya - Barcelona (No idea how much he would cost..just a guess..but great player

Probably upwards of £25 mil:

Gerrard - Liverpool (more of goal-line to goal-line than box to box..take a look at his Positions diagram)

Essien - Chelsea (The name explains the price tag..could go for a bit less if your crafty with the approach..never been succesful though.)

Experimental:

Eboue - Arsenal (Seen him attempt it on TV...not bad.. with his stats..I don't see why it wouldnt work in Manager)

Anyone tried any of these...what happened?..Any cheaper ideas for lower leagues?

Emre now plays for Fenerbache.

What instructions would you suggest with box to box midfielders?

High mentality, high creative freedom, along with;

- Run With Ball: Mixed

- Long Shots: Often/Mixed

- Through Balls: Mixed

- Cross Ball: Mixed

- Cross From: Mixed

- Hold Up Ball: Yes

When you say high mentality hopey, do you mean the attacking slider more towards the right

good question but yes i think thats what he means.

When you say high mentality hopey, do you mean the attacking slider more towards the right

Yes, a higher mentality then say your sitting MC/DM, it's relative to how you play though and at what starting point your box to box midfielder is at. i.e. you could start him in the AMC position technically or the MC position. Should also point out it's dependant on how good the player is stat wise as-well.

Imo Bodmer is also a boxer, Veloso could even be one I think. Pirlo lacks the tackling but still is a very good defensive attacker.

Alex Witsel and Joao Moutinho are great at getting forward for my Roma side. Both have excellent off the ball stats, as well as good pace and finishing. Combined with the right PPMs, and you have a real goal threat.

Marcos Senna most definetly, albeit a little old now. In addition, Morgan Schneiderlin from Southampton has the potential to be one, imo.

Probably the best box-to-box midfielder on the game would be Steven Gerrard. I know he's not much great defensively but he's brilliant at everything. He gets forward a lot and is very effective. But he also have a great engine alongwith great teamwork/work rate. And he tracks back very effectively. Dont think a lot of clubs would be able to afford him though.

Another pretty good one is Edinho from Internacional. Brilliant buy for any mid-table team and is a useful player for any squad tbh. Then there's Mascherano who is very creative and gets forward well. I dont have experience with him but whenever I play Liverpool, he's the one causing most problems.

In youngsters, Bolzoni is pretty good box-to-box. He's more of the tough-tackling types but does do a good job in attack. Denilson from Arsenal is another. Lastly, my current favourite, Younousse Sankhare. Absolute beast. He's better in attack but is a tough tackler and also has a great engine on him.

the most important stats are the work rate, stamina and natural fitness. this basically gives the player the engine he needs. obviously the need tackling, long shots, strength, pace, creativity, off the ball and positioning etc to have more effect in their position.

steven gerrard has to be the best in the game. defensively he is great with solid defensive stats and a 17 for tackling, he works hard, has good stamina, strong, fast, has a hell of a shot and in short he is class at every aspect of football.

players like pirlo lack the engine to do the job properly and while they have most of the stats they are missing a few much needed stats. this is why gerrard is the best, as there is nothing he is missing at all.

scott brown does a good job, as does muntari. i have seen the likes of veloso, alonso and fabregas as box-to-box players but again the lack vital stats.

basically i think the player has to be able to do anything along with good physical stats and good work rate

Would like to add players who I have played there with success:

Ignacio Camacho - had a min fee of 9mil in season 4. I think his starting min fee is <15 mil but not 100% certain.

Ruben De La Red - paid about 23mil for him, season 5. Real Madrid at that point rarely played him.

he's mentioned in the OP but essien is a class act, his physical attributes are top notch and despite fairly low finishing skills he still puts a few away for chelsea. Chelsea again there is lampard who isn't mentioned and for a 2footer has some very very strong stats to be considered as box-to-box.

I play spurs and don't forget wilson palacios as a strong box-to-box player. Mohamed Sissoko for Juve has 'Essien'-like stats too and is in the mould of vieira.

Simon Rolfes, should be about 6m. Very good.

Also, the whole Lyon midfield other than Juninho are good.

I think that that is one of the bet first posts of anyone I've seen, well done mate, I'm sure a lot of people will use this info

Cant believe no one has mentioned the absolute beast that Dainele De Rossi!

Tim Cahill is another. Awesome on 09

aye cahill is epic!

I think we are moving away from the 'box-to-box' players though and just talking about quality CMs now though.

Maybe we could identity some attribute parameters?

15+ in workrate, stamina, teamwork, determination <--- I think these are some of the key ones to get players moving up and down the pitch.

Then there is natural fitness, acceleration, pace, strength, off the ball, passing, tackling, long shots, finishing.

Some names not yet supplied: gareth barry, lucho gonzalez, owen hargreaves

Like you said Theo87, Tackling and Finishing need to be decent for a player to be a real box to box.

Players that come under that category would be (Value Order):

Gerrard

Fabregas

Fellaini

Ballack

Cahill

Lucho Gonzalez

Simon Rolfes

Christian Obodo

McDonald Mariga

Segundo Castillo

John-Joe O'Toole

Taking out the weak link of Mariga from that line up, I would fancy any of them for my Everton side (3 of which start there:))

I'm going to take a closer look at O'Toole from reading this thread

Like you said Theo87, Tackling and Finishing need to be decent for a player to be a real box to box.

Players that come under that category would be (Value Order):

Gerrard

Fabregas

Fellaini

Ballack

Cahill

Lucho Gonzalez

Simon Rolfes

Christian Obodo

McDonald Mariga

Segundo Castillo

John-Joe O'Toole

Taking out the weak link of Mariga from that line up, I would fancy any of them for my Everton side (3 of which start there:))

I'm going to take a closer look at O'Toole from reading this thread

Well...box-to-box does not always mean putting the ball in the back of the net...it could be picking the ball up and distributing at one end and rejoining the play in a later third of the pitch..A player like Pirlo may not need high finishing stats as majority of his goals would come from the 20-25 yard range (Long Shots)

I think that that is one of the bet first posts of anyone I've seen, well done mate, I'm sure a lot of people will use this info

Thanks mate. I try..I must admit this forum makes me feel like a bit of an FM novice but I try to complement my FM knowledge with that from watching football. I'm actually now switching to 09. I was a bit attached to my slightly modified database in 08 and was slow about switching.

In response to questions about stats. I would say if we have a hypothetical 15-20 mil buy in his mid-20s we can expect these stats and tweak them up or down according to price

Acceleration - 15+

Pace - 14+ (Not as important as acceleration in centre of field but depends on style and tempo)

Strength - (all the best b2bers have it)

Passing - 16+ (I would demand at least 17 for that price)

Creativity - 15+

Positioning - 14+

Long Shots - 14+

Finishing - 12+

Essentially, as the price range suggests, this would give you a Yaya Toure or maybe a Michael Essien but not a Gerrard perce

Decent crossing is also useful for quick tempo games with long passing and for players that like to switch flanks, also when you drag arrows for them to drift into the wings (to expose weak wing-backs or exploit good header)

Styles

I find these attributes of style useful for a quick tempo games

Likes to switch ball to other flank

Plays Long passes

Runs ball through middle (when dribbling is good enough)

Takes long shots

for a slower tempo these are more appropriate

Plays short simple passes

plays with back to goal

Does not dive into tackles

Takes long shots

(Excellent positioning needed for slow tempo)

btw Kopsy what vital stats do Muntarik,veloso, scott brown, fabregas and alonso all lack?

I'll throw in Raul Garcia, Zapater, and Gago for the future.

Also, arrives late in opposition area is kind of nice when combined with a good long shooter. Raul Garcia has it, and he seems to know just when to pounce on crosses, but stays further back otherwise.

One more thing, I would think a lot of fullbacks could be retrained to accomplish this position, since they are already box to box players it would make sense.

What about Angelo Palombo? He’s not exactly a natural ‘finisher’ like say Gerrard, but he has all the other requirements to be considered ‘box-to-box’ and has a very good long shot. I’ve had him playing this Viera/Flamini role at Arsenal with excellent effect, so surprised no-ones mentioned him yet.

What about Angelo Palombo? He’s not exactly a natural ‘finisher’ like say Gerrard, but he has all the other requirements to be considered ‘box-to-box’ and has a very good long shot. I’ve had him playing this Viera/Flamini role at Arsenal with excellent effect, so surprised no-ones mentioned him yet.

Came into this thread to recommend Palombo He's top notch.

Others I've had good experiences with are Rafael Carioca, Ruben de la Red and Michael Essien.

PS - There's this player called Caboue, forgot his first name, in Toulouse FC, who seems like he can do the job for low premiership teams

I think its Ettiene or Etienne(sp?) Capoue, looks good and has potential.

In response to questions about stats. I would say if we have a hypothetical 15-20 mil buy in his mid-20s we can expect these stats and tweak them up or down according to price

Acceleration - 15+

Pace - 14+ (Not as important as acceleration in centre of field but depends on style and tempo)

Strength - (all the best b2bers have it)

Passing - 16+ (I would demand at least 17 for that price)

Creativity - 15+

Positioning - 14+

Long Shots - 14+

Finishing - 12+

Essentially, as the price range suggests, this would give you a Yaya Toure or maybe a Michael Essien but not a Gerrard perce

Decent crossing is also useful for quick tempo games with long passing and for players that like to switch flanks, also when you drag arrows for them to drift into the wings (to expose weak wing-backs or exploit good header)

Mate, if you are looking for a box to box midfielder, then read the two first lines in kopsy101's post (nr13) That are the main stats for a box to box midfielder, the rest are purely bonus, you can't have a box to box midfielder with natural fitness under 10, which some of the players you posted in the opening post of this thread have, this doesn't mean that they are bad midfielders, they are just not box to box midfielders, as they won't have the fitness to run box to box through out the game

Mate, if you are looking for a box to box midfielder, then read the two first lines in kopsy101's post (nr13) That are the main stats for a box to box midfielder, the rest are purely bonus, you can't have a box to box midfielder with natural fitness under 10, which some of the players you posted in the opening post of this thread have, this doesn't mean that they are bad midfielders, they are just not box to box midfielders, as they won't have the fitness to run box to box through out the game

In my books under 10 natural fitness is bad for any area of the pitch except goalie..but..to each his own

In response to questions about stats. I would say if we have a hypothetical 15-20 mil buy in his mid-20s we can expect these stats and tweak them up or down according to price

Acceleration - 15+

Pace - 14+ (Not as important as acceleration in centre of field but depends on style and tempo)

Strength - (all the best b2bers have it)

Passing - 16+ (I would demand at least 17 for that price)

Creativity - 15+

Positioning - 14+

Long Shots - 14+

Finishing - 12+

Essentially, as the price range suggests, this would give you a Yaya Toure or maybe a Michael Essien but not a Gerrard perce

Decent crossing is also useful for quick tempo games with long passing and for players that like to switch flanks, also when you drag arrows for them to drift into the wings (to expose weak wing-backs or exploit good header)

Styles

I find these attributes of style useful for a quick tempo games

Likes to switch ball to other flank

Plays Long passes

Runs ball through middle (when dribbling is good enough)

Takes long shots

for a slower tempo these are more appropriate

Plays short simple passes

plays with back to goal

Does not dive into tackles

Takes long shots

(Excellent positioning needed for slow tempo)

btw Kopsy what vital stats do Muntarik,veloso, scott brown, fabregas and alonso all lack?

In my books under 10 natural fitness is bad for any area of the pitch except goalie..but..to each his own

Mate

why post players like Samba and Emre in the first place then??? They are clearly not up for the job as a box to box midfielder as their natural fitness are to low

wilson palacios is an excellent box-to-box. lassana diarra until 9.3 () was my favourite such player in this game because of his insane physical attributes though.

Surprised Hamsik hasn't been mentioned.

he's been doing a great job as a box to box mid for me alongside palombo.

Marouane Fellaini gives you something alot of the others dont in that he is a beast at heading, he can get lots of goals from corners.

From Wiki:

"Box-to-box" midfielder

The term 'box-to-box' player is often used to refer to the most dynamic all-round/complete midfielders, who provide both defensive and attacking prowess. The most versatile of players, they typically possess exceptional stamina and are usually skilled at tackling, passing, shooting and keeping possession

Thank you Gavin...I guess that justifies some of the things i said....DKB?

How about Jimmy 'Fantastic Value for Money' Bullard?

lol...

I think its Ettiene or Etienne(sp?) Capoue, looks good and has potential.

That's the one He looks quality

Im looking for one in league 2 i have seyfo soley but very inconsistant.

your also forgetting Xavi, probably the only midfielder in the world on par with stevie G

Thank you Gavin...I guess that justifies some of the things i said....DKB?

Yes it justifies that "The term 'box-to-box' player is often used to refer to the most DYNAMIC all-round/complete midfielders"

You can't have a DYNAMIC midfielder without stamina, natural fitness and work rate!!! The midfielder should be good at other stuff too, but you can't define a midfielder as a box to box midfielder without those 3 attributes.

Yes it justifies that "The term 'box-to-box' player is often used to refer to the most DYNAMIC all-round/complete midfielders"

You can't have a DYNAMIC midfielder without stamina, natural fitness and work rate!!! The midfielder should be good at other stuff too, but you can't define a midfielder as a box to box midfielder without those 3 attributes.

I completely agree...just wondering...I am at work at the moment...could someone check the natural fitness, stamina and work rate stats of Fabregas and Pirlo? I would assume these are the lacking stats that Kopsy or someone said Fabregas and Pirlo were missing earlier. How about Viera

Don't know what De Rossi's stats are like in the game but I reckon he would make a good Box to Box Midfielder.

work rate for fabregas and pirlo are around the 15 mark. didn't check in the game but i was going by IRL. i suppose they also have to get forward whenever possible?

de rossi is a class box to box player

You can get Ballack for about £5M at the start IIRC.

work rate for fabregas and pirlo are around the 15 mark. didn't check in the game but i was going by IRL. i suppose they also have to get forward whenever possible?

de rossi is a class box to box player

Pirlo isn't a box to box midfielder, but a deep laying playmaker

Scott Brown - The guys a workhorse

Pirlo isn't a box to box midfielder, but a deep laying playmaker

i know thats why i said they are not box to box midfielders...

Toulalan, world class IRL, in game you can buy him for around €17m during the first transfer window and has immense stats to start off with.

Toulalan has great stats. His description has become a world class midfielder in first six months of game time in all saves I have played. In 9.3.0 Madrid bought him for €12.75m in first transfer window.