AI transfer offers and Transfer value make the game tiresome.

[tajj7]

I am currently doing a save where I am in 2034, I've won multiple Champions leagues, have the highest rep club in the game and multiple very good players.

EVERY transfer window I get the same offers, over and over and over again for my players and it is just tiresome for multiple reasons.

1. Transfer values, these seem to widely fluctuate for no real reason, but are also just too low most of the time.

As an example I have a 5 times Ballon d'or winner, he's scored over 400 league goals in barely 300 games, multiple awards, scores multiple goals in the champions league etc. etc. pretty much he is the best performing player in game. He has 4 years left on his contract, where he is on £200k a week. He has also just turned 27, so he is basically peak Ronaldo or peak Messi, yet his transfer value is £43 - 58 million. Which is just bonkers, it shouldn't matter that I am in Portugal (which btw I have boosted rep wise to be top 5 European league ahead of France), this is basically the best player in the world playing for the biggest rep club. PSG as a comparison, have a worse player, on the same money, with 4 years left who has a transfer value of £181 million to £199 million.  Lyon also have a worse player, on a lesser contract, as a less reputable club, that is worth nearly double what my 5 time ballon d'or winner is. 

It makes no sense and then feeds into the other issues with AI transfers. He should have one of the highest transfer values in the world. Even more stupidly, HE DID, at one point his value was near £180 million, but despite performing even better, gaining more and more competition wins and accolades, plus signing a bumper new contract his transfer 'value' most of the time is now in the low 40-50 millions. 

2. AI offers, this then feeds into AI offers for him. Every window I will get offers for this player (and most of my squad) which are below the already far too low 'transfer value' of my players, which I reject, and then the same club will offer again, and again, and again, pretty much always the same bad offer, or basically the same maybe a million more than was offered before. Literally as I am writing this I am on deadline day in my game, Man City offered a deal worth £41 million for my star player at 5pm, 2 hours later they come back with another offer that is just ONE MILLION more, which I then reject, then at 9pm they come back with the SAME offer I just rejected. 

So that is 3 offers on deadline day, all below his already absurdly low transfer value, for a player I don't want to sell, and 2 of the offers were literally the same. Why does the AI act like a toddler? why does it think if it keeps asking over and over you are suddenly going to say yes? 

Every single transfer window this happens, I spent most of it rejecting low ball transfer offers for my players that just get repeated over and over and over. 

Yet if I offer for a good player or clearly high PA player from the AI I have to pay over the odds and they will always ask way more than the transfer value. So why does that logic from human to AI transfer negotiations not apply to AI to human offers?

3. Sometimes the player gets unsettled, despite me having the highest reputation club in the whole game, winning everything going, the players loving the club, me as manager and most of their teammates.  I repeatedly get the 'unsettled would need some serious convincing to stay at the club', even sometimes with mid table PL clubs.  I can pretty much always get out of it through my relationship with the player, often using the 'influential player' thing but I shouldn't have to do it. If IRL like Porto or Benfica were winning multiple champs leagues, dominating Europe and paying huge wages, their players wouldn't be agitating for moves to the PL or PSG. In fact PSG is a good example, PSG players aren't agitating for PL moves, even though they are 'only' in the French league. 

Overall it just makes long term saves, where you become successful, build up a club and nation tiresome when it comes to transfers. Constantly batting away low ball AI transfer offers, over and over again, that unsettle your players in illogical ways. 

[Gangor]

3 hours ago, tajj7 said:

I am currently doing a save where I am in 2034, I've won multiple Champions leagues, have the highest rep club in the game and multiple very good players.

EVERY transfer window I get the same offers, over and over and over again for my players and it is just tiresome for multiple reasons.

1. Transfer values, these seem to widely fluctuate for no real reason, but are also just too low most of the time.

As an example I have a 5 times Ballon d'or winner, he's scored over 400 league goals in barely 300 games, multiple awards, scores multiple goals in the champions league etc. etc. pretty much he is the best performing player in game. He has 4 years left on his contract, where he is on £200k a week. He has also just turned 27, so he is basically peak Ronaldo or peak Messi, yet his transfer value is £43 - 58 million. Which is just bonkers, it shouldn't matter that I am in Portugal (which btw I have boosted rep wise to be top 5 European league ahead of France), this is basically the best player in the world playing for the biggest rep club. PSG as a comparison, have a worse player, on the same money, with 4 years left who has a transfer value of £181 million to £199 million.  Lyon also have a worse player, on a lesser contract, as a less reputable club, that is worth nearly double what my 5 time ballon d'or winner is. 

It makes no sense and then feeds into the other issues with AI transfers. He should have one of the highest transfer values in the world. Even more stupidly, HE DID, at one point his value was near £180 million, but despite performing even better, gaining more and more competition wins and accolades, plus signing a bumper new contract his transfer 'value' most of the time is now in the low 40-50 millions. 

2. AI offers, this then feeds into AI offers for him. Every window I will get offers for this player (and most of my squad) which are below the already far too low 'transfer value' of my players, which I reject, and then the same club will offer again, and again, and again, pretty much always the same bad offer, or basically the same maybe a million more than was offered before. Literally as I am writing this I am on deadline day in my game, Man City offered a deal worth £41 million for my star player at 5pm, 2 hours later they come back with another offer that is just ONE MILLION more, which I then reject, then at 9pm they come back with the SAME offer I just rejected. 

So that is 3 offers on deadline day, all below his already absurdly low transfer value, for a player I don't want to sell, and 2 of the offers were literally the same. Why does the AI act like a toddler? why does it think if it keeps asking over and over you are suddenly going to say yes? 

Every single transfer window this happens, I spent most of it rejecting low ball transfer offers for my players that just get repeated over and over and over. 

Yet if I offer for a good player or clearly high PA player from the AI I have to pay over the odds and they will always ask way more than the transfer value. So why does that logic from human to AI transfer negotiations not apply to AI to human offers?

3. Sometimes the player gets unsettled, despite me having the highest reputation club in the whole game, winning everything going, the players loving the club, me as manager and most of their teammates.  I repeatedly get the 'unsettled would need some serious convincing to stay at the club', even sometimes with mid table PL clubs.  I can pretty much always get out of it through my relationship with the player, often using the 'influential player' thing but I shouldn't have to do it. If IRL like Porto or Benfica were winning multiple champs leagues, dominating Europe and paying huge wages, their players wouldn't be agitating for moves to the PL or PSG. In fact PSG is a good example, PSG players aren't agitating for PL moves, even though they are 'only' in the French league. 

Overall it just makes long term saves, where you become successful, build up a club and nation tiresome when it comes to transfers. Constantly batting away low ball AI transfer offers, over and over again, that unsettle your players in illogical ways. 

Did you try setting an asking price of £200m or something?

[FrazT]

It is hard not to agree with all the points raised by the OP, which have all been raised before

Regarding setting an asking price, I have found that it makes little or no difference to the AI and they will continue to totally disregard any price you have set.

[Gangor]

10 hours ago, FrazT said:

It is hard not to agree with all the points raised by the OP, which have all been raised before

Regarding setting an asking price, I have found that it makes little or no difference to the AI and they will continue to totally disregard any price you have set.

One strategy that might work is when you get a bid that the player wants you to accept, talk to him to say you're going to reject the bid (the Convince To Stay conversation) and choose the option "the finances weren't right". Then you can negotiate a transfer value with the player and generally you can make this much higher than the AI are willing to pay. After that you can happily reject all lower offers without him becoming unhappy.

[Daniel Evensen]

I've got to offer my sympathies to you, @tajj7.  The world of Football Manager reputation and value discrepancies based on country is really frustrating.

If there's any silver lining to offer, it's the fact that you can take advantage of the AI's stubborn reliance on reputation to enrich yourself.  I created a short guide to making money on player loans, for example.  It works pretty well in FM23, and, if you are persistent, can help your club make millions without having to actually develop the players in question.

However, you're correct that the morale system seems a bit heavy-handed, especially when the same problems come up time and time again.  I'd like to see the morale system toned down a bit, and player interactions expanded and made more meaningful.

[Football Manager Guides]

I recently wrote a lengthy piece on selling for more money in FM23. To summarise it, here are a few points that might you: 

• Sell big stars in the summer transfer window.
• Avoid release clauses and trigger extension clauses when negotiating contracts.
• Set asking prices based on the player's age, performance, contract length, and current market conditions.

[conniecardenas]

thanks for sharing

[SergeiG]

On 11/04/2023 at 11:47, tajj7 said:

3. Sometimes the player gets unsettled, despite me having the highest reputation club in the whole game, winning everything going, the players loving the club, me as manager and most of their teammates.  I repeatedly get the 'unsettled would need some serious convincing to stay at the club', even sometimes with mid table PL clubs.  I can pretty much always get out of it through my relationship with the player, often using the 'influential player' thing but I shouldn't have to do it. If IRL like Porto or Benfica were winning multiple champs leagues, dominating Europe and paying huge wages, their players wouldn't be agitating for moves to the PL or PSG. In fact PSG is a good example, PSG players aren't agitating for PL moves, even though they are 'only' in the French league. 

This really pisses me off, I lost some players on a free because of that(some good once at that). Some player was crying for 2 years when I refused to sell him(despite being an important player and playing about 30 league games per season) and after I accepted the fact he is not going to re-new his contract I did try to sell him(and for some low prices to about 20 different clubs) but he would refuse every offer for the next 2 seasons, despite me not playing him anymore as I found a better option. I even tried to include a wage contribution, despite his wage being less than 60K per week. After refusing some of the biggest clubs in Europe, he signed on a free for Fiorentina(A team he rejected a few times too BTW).

The transfers were always broken but this year it's a total **** show.

[|maze|]

Got to agree with the OP.  Got to say, for me, this is probably one of the worst versions of FM I've every played. And I've been playing since the early 90s.
So glad I came to my senses and stopped buying this game at full price. 

[SergeiG]

37 minutes ago, |maze| said:

Got to say, for me, this is probably one of the worst versions of FM I've every played.

I agree, if not the worst then one of the worst in the last 20 years I got with this game.

[eXistenZ]

Its not only AI transfer valuations, its even within your own club. I have a transfer budget of 100k.  Then a scout of mine thought to be funny by going 'i found this relegation release clause of 200k". Or something I else I had in another savegame was that I offered a player out for 7M. He was angry and said it was too much. So we compromised on 9M.....

It honestly feels the game is regressing at this point. There are no major innovations, the lingering issues dont get resolved, and we have to be satisfied with fancy EL/CL graphics and music, and a squad planner that basicly a glorified xls sheet.

The other day the tooltip for the offside trap popped up... you know, which isnt in the game anymore.

Defo not purchasing the next few editions unless they come with something radicaly new and improved

[shirajzl]

Number 3 from OP is what's been bothering me the most for years in FM.

You can take a small club, make them literally the most successful, reputable and richest club in the world, but some of your players will still want to move to present day high reputation clubs. It almost feels hard coded and makes anything you do in a save meaningless in that respect.

[Bielsa1975]

Always ruins the game ,i am on my 8th season now with AFC Wakefield had my  CF since age 15 knocking the goals in 47 as we romped NLN his value is 150k to 400k with a release clause of 1mill ,had managers of derby ,bolton,brentford ,coventry watch him towards end of season , press conference i always answer he has a release clause im powerless as i keep swatting away 50k with 150k add on offers for him ,yet not one will meet his clause , but i want there 7k value player they want 700k for him 🤣🤣

[additiondakku01]

Overall it just makes long term saves, where you become successful, build up a club and nation tiresome when it comes to transfers. Constantly batting away low ball AI transfer offers, over and over again, that unsettle your players in illogical ways.  pikashow apk

ppsspp gold apk

Edited May 1, 2023 by additiondakku01

[Daniel Evensen]

On 16/04/2023 at 02:47, eXistenZ said:

and a squad planner that basicly a glorified xls sheet.

Sorry to take one phrase out of context, but I think the squad planner is actually worse than a simple spreadsheet.  My spreadsheet doesn't automatically add in new players just because I scouted them, for example.

The squad planner concept isn't bad, but I still have to use an external document to keep track of everybody.  If SI wants me to use it and nothing else, it needs to prevent the computer from automatically screwing things up every few weeks.

Also, I've got to chuckle about the tooltip for the offside trap coming up.  I scored a goal in a match yesterday on the back of two passes that were blatantly offside, and yet there wasn't even a "close offside" replay.  Just FM doing FM things.

[pompeyfan]

Got to agree with the OP, the transfer system is really broken with some really stupid low offers.  The other issue that's pissing me off at the moment is when I'm trying to loan out players to get experience clubs keep wanting to include mandatory future fees in the deals, and when I reject or remove the future fees to make them just loans they come back with the same offer I rejected, and it's got worse since the final patch.

[Gangor]

12 hours ago, pompeyfan said:

Got to agree with the OP, the transfer system is really broken with some really stupid low offers.  The other issue that's pissing me off at the moment is when I'm trying to loan out players to get experience clubs keep wanting to include mandatory future fees in the deals, and when I reject or remove the future fees to make them just loans they come back with the same offer I rejected, and it's got worse since the final patch.

Don't you find it somewhat realistic that other managers want different things to you?

[turnip]

I wouldn't say the transfer system is broken, but there are some AI behaviours that need a bit of working out. I wonder if the game would benefit from a member of the backroom staff (DoF or AssMan) chiming in with a bit of advice for some transfer offers you receive.

Say you've got a player and there's been no apparent interest in him all summer and then just before Deadline Day you get a bid from a big club, the staff member could say "Lyon have tried to sign 4 centre-backs this window but lost out on all of them" which you could interpret as them being desperate and it's based on information the game already provides through the News items.

Or you could get a terrible bid for a good player and the staff member says "this bid may be an attempt to unsettle your player". (This would not really based on information the game already gives you). 

[podunkboy]

I did a save with Leverkusen, first transfer period Sardar Azoum demanded that I let him go to Man City, even though they wouldn't meet his value. The club's leaders then demanded I let him so, so I did. The fans were outraged, the board was upset that I let him go. He spent 3 years at Man City and scored 3 goals in 7 starts in those three years. Then they sold him to Madrid for half what they paid me and he did even less there. I took the money from his sale and bought Moukoku. 

[pompeyfan]

On 26/04/2023 at 09:28, Gangor said:

Don't you find it somewhat realistic that other managers want different things to you?

Not when it happens all the time and after rejecting or removing the future transfer they just constantly come back with the same offer to loan + buy when the player is listed for loan only, so when I reject it then it upsets the player who wanted to go out on loan and most of the time the transfer would work out less than half the players value anyway - I lost a very good player from my U21's when the loan manager loaned a player out with a low future fee and I didn't notice. Also if realism was the aim in the game I wouldn't be constantly asked the same pointless questions like Are you pleased to see X score in an international? every bloody time he scores a goal or ask me if I'm confident of getting a WP for a player whose contract is expiring who I put up for sale or set to release on a free.

[Johnny Ace]

18 hours ago, turnip said:

I wouldn't say the transfer system is broken, but there are some AI behaviours that need a bit of working out. I wonder if the game would benefit from a member of the backroom staff (DoF or AssMan) chiming in with a bit of advice for some transfer offers you receive.

That's a very good suggestion! It would help no end with the nonsensical offers, it might be worth posting up on the Feature Requests board 

[Mike J]

The club reputation model is probably the biggest issue with the transfer market. I'm pretty sure there's also an issue where the reputation is only updated once per season as well, leading to stupid situations where you take an unassuming club into the CL but can't attract better players until an arbitrary date in the calendar when you suddenly get a reputation boost.

I'm in that position myself at the moment with Boro. I've had a fantastic second season the the EPL and a bunch of my players are getting interest from other teams. Fair enough. Liverpool and Inter have been sniffing around some of my players and I'll probably struggle to keep them. That's not a major problem, but the silly low transfer offers are becoming tiresome. Even if it's an attempt to unsettle your player, I think there should be the option to talk to your unsettled player and point out the offer was so low it's actually insulting to both the club and the player.

Even more annoying is my star English CB is currently unhappy because he wants to move to West Ham. Not too unusual you think? Except I'm in the CL next season and West Ham have spent the last two seasons in the Championship. They're not even listed as a favourite club, but according to the reputation tracker they're still rated higher than me. I suspect that will change in July, but it's silly I have to wait until then for my player to realise a move to a team likely to be battling relegation next season may not be a good idea.

[Daniel Evensen]

On 26/04/2023 at 14:15, turnip said:

I wouldn't say the transfer system is broken, but there are some AI behaviours that need a bit of working out. I wonder if the game would benefit from a member of the backroom staff (DoF or AssMan) chiming in with a bit of advice for some transfer offers you receive.

Say you've got a player and there's been no apparent interest in him all summer and then just before Deadline Day you get a bid from a big club, the staff member could say "Lyon have tried to sign 4 centre-backs this window but lost out on all of them" which you could interpret as them being desperate and it's based on information the game already provides through the News items.

Or you could get a terrible bid for a good player and the staff member says "this bid may be an attempt to unsettle your player". (This would not really based on information the game already gives you). 

I know this has been mentioned already, but your idea here is really good.  That would help put a lot of this stuff in context.

Of course, you want to make sure it doesn't become a meme, sort of like the system OOTP uses for the same thing...

[obscenesage]

It makes it quite difficult to bolster a club that is isn't in a top league, when you're selling 160CA+ players for under 50m, solely because the league is low reputation.

[Gangor]

4 hours ago, Mike J said:

Even if it's an attempt to unsettle your player, I think there should be the option to talk to your unsettled player and point out the offer was so low it's actually insulting to both the club and the player.

There is and I recommended the OP try it earlier in this thread

[Gangor]

1 hour ago, obscenesage said:

It makes it quite difficult to bolster a club that is isn't in a top league, when you're selling 160CA+ players for under 50m, solely because the league is low reputation.

You mean, teams in top leagues aren't prepared to pay top dollar for players only tested in a smaller league? Quelle surprise!

[Troels Jensen]

On 11/04/2023 at 10:47, tajj7 said:

3. Sometimes the player gets unsettled, despite me having the highest reputation club in the whole game, winning everything going, the players loving the club, me as manager and most of their teammates.  I repeatedly get the 'unsettled would need some serious convincing to stay at the club', even sometimes with mid table PL clubs.  I can pretty much always get out of it through my relationship with the player, often using the 'influential player' thing but I shouldn't have to do it. If IRL like Porto or Benfica were winning multiple champs leagues, dominating Europe and paying huge wages, their players wouldn't be agitating for moves to the PL or PSG. In fact PSG is a good example, PSG players aren't agitating for PL moves, even though they are 'only' in the French league. 

Overall it just makes long term saves, where you become successful, build up a club and nation tiresome when it comes to transfers. Constantly batting away low ball AI transfer offers, over and over again, that unsettle your players in illogical ways. 

This so much. I can't count the amount of times my star players have been unsettled by continous scouting from PSG/Man City etc. only to end up wanting to leave for some weird reason. I'm managing Real Madrid, highest rep club and everybody's happy in general. I've raised the issue in the bug tracker.