Why the transfer-system is still a mess.

[Nicolai87]

I managed to sign Sergio Agüero for £38m

PSG wants £35m for Mamadou Sakho

Stuttgart wants £34m for Mario Gomez

Lyon wants £60m for Karim Benzema

Udinese rejected £25m offer for Cristian Zapata

Wolfsburg wants £14m for Jan Simunek

Tolouse wants £15m for André-Pierre Gignac

Auxerre wants £17m for Remy Riou

Marseille wants £25m for Steve Mandanda

..and the list goes on.

Their set value is maybe 30-40% of the fee they demand.

For gods sake, fix it somehow.

Other than this, fantastic game.

[dazbowski]

I managed to sign Sergio Agüero for £38m

PSG wants £35m for Mamadou Sakho

Stuttgart wants £34m for Mario Gomez

Lyon wants £60m for Karim Benzema

Udinese rejected £25m offer for Cristian Zapata

Wolfsburg wants £14m for Jan Simunek

Tolouse wants £15m for André-Pierre Gignac

Auxerre wants £17m for Remy Riou

Marseille wants £25m for Steve Mandanda

..and the list goes on.

Their set value is maybe 30-40% of the fee they demand.

For gods sake, fix it somehow.

but you're bidding for their "star" players, why would they sell they cheap, if a team came in for a player you wanted to keep you'd put a huge price tag on them as well!

[Jonfun1980]

Thats what happens if teams don't want to sell thier player.

[Akim]

I managed to sign Sergio Agüero for £38m

PSG wants £35m for Mamadou Sakho

Stuttgart wants £34m for Mario Gomez

Lyon wants £60m for Karim Benzema

Udinese rejected £25m offer for Cristian Zapata

Wolfsburg wants £14m for Jan Simunek

Tolouse wants £15m for André-Pierre Gignac

Auxerre wants £17m for Remy Riou

Marseille wants £25m for Steve Mandanda

..and the list goes on.

Their set value is maybe 30-40% of the fee they demand.

For gods sake, fix it somehow.

Other than this, fantastic game.

imo completly realistic

[tottenham2k7]

i agree completely realistic!!

Berbatov for example we paid like 10mill and held out for 30 M + a player on loan!!

it happens..

[Irchard]

I think that's fair. No team would want to lose one their best players without receiving a massive premium on top of his "value".

[Irchard]

Lol. In the time it took me to type less than one line, four other people posted the same thing!

[Nicolai87]

Yeah, well, Fernando Torres was Atletico's star player and they gave him up for, what, £20m? van Nistelrooy to Real Madrid for £15m, Henry to Barca for £16m, Nasri to Arsenal for £12m, Sagna to Arsenal for £7.5m, Adebayor to Arsenal for £5m, Owen to Newcastle for £17m, Alonso to Liverpool for £11m, Babel to Liverpool for £13m, Afonso Alves to Middlesbrough for £15m, Deco to Barca for £8m, Carvalho to Chelsea for £18m, Benny McCarthy to Blackburn for £2m, and the list goes on and on and on. All these were "star" players for their former clubs.

[A.D]

Those prices are still damn cheap ! I'm forced to but players 3 or 4 times their value. Buying a 5m rated player for 25m+ isn't fun for me.

[arfaern]

but you're bidding for their "star" players, why would they sell they cheap, if a team came in for a player you wanted to keep you'd put a huge price tag on them as well!

Point being that those prices are way of real life prices.

IRL:

Real Madrid will bid 18 m€ for Gomez from Stuttgart in January 2009 (rumor).

Wolfsburg wants £14m for Jan Simunek

Tolouse wants £15m for André-Pierre Gignac

Auxerre wants £17m for Remy Riou

Marseille wants £25m for Steve Mandanda

[/Quote]

Not even their star players IRL, probably making it out at maximum of 10 m€.

If you factor in the current financial state you will see transfers going further down.

[Nicolai87]

It's not realistic at all. Why would I buy mediocre players for £10m? I surely can't pay £30m for every player I want. Prices are completely unrealistic compared to real life. Just look at my summary of top transfers above. Come on, Mamadou Sakho for £30m? PSG'd let him go for £6m in real life.

[Akim]

oh well i correct myself: in pounds its way too high, in euro its imo okay. 18 mio for gomez wont be enough. stuttgart demands 30 mio euro or he stays. munich offered 25 mio this summer and it was rejected

[Matt SFC]

Maybe its their way of saying this player is not for sale. Personally I don't see anything particularly wrong with this.

[Nicolai87]

The problem is that you have to spend £30-40m on a quality player a season, and spend up 80-90% of your budget on that player. I don't want to buy just one player per season for £30-40m. And I really don't want to buy 4 mediocre players and not have a chance in hell to make top 3 in the Premier League with Arsenal.

[SmurfDude]

The problem is that you have to spend £30-40m on a quality player a season, and spend up 80-90% of your budget on that player. I don't want to buy just one player per season for £30-40m

Perhaps you should shop around instead of trying to get every teams star player. Or wait until the player becomes unsettled where they will then be sold for a cheaper price

You are obviously misreading "fixed transfer system" and instead reading "buy whoever you want for a cheap price"

[Nicolai87]

Mighty clever thread. Tell me how the first list I made is realistic compared to my transfer-summary a few post above. Just compare them for yourself, and you'll see.

[Mike260986]

I agree, it's all still f00ked. I LOVED Hugo Lloris (GK) in FM08, and as such i wanted him to replace Joe Hart again in 09. He's valued at around £6.75m at the start of my game and i intended to make him my first signing. I bid in increments of £2-3m until i was at the lofty height of £35M! Bearing in mind he's 21 and so unproven, yet to score an international cap, and that Olympique Lyonnais paid under £7m for him, you'd think they'd accept this. But no. They come back at me with an offer, they want £43m, with £33m being paid up front, even with tweaking i can only muster £32m right now, so i adjust the offer and increase the monthly installments, £30 and £18m over 24 months. No deal! They came back with a revised offer, SEVENTY-ONE MILLLION now, and £7m over 12 months, if anyone deems that realistic i dunno what would be defined as being otherwise.

[Mike260986]

Also, because i was priced out of Lloris I opted to sign Steve Mandada (GK) France's #1, he was rated £5m too, and set me back a cool £35m. This isn't constant however, i offered 2m more than Andre Arshavin's value, and my bid was accepted by the board on behalf of the club as it was too good to turn down. 20m also secured me Joao Moutinho and Gareth Bale, both players who would probably command that in real life, if not more.

[Nicolai87]

It's impossible to justify, though. Lloris £35m, Mandanda £35m, Sakho £30m, C. Zapata £30m, M. Gomez £35m, and so on. It's definitely not realistic at all.

[swisso]

Regardless of whether you're bidding on their star players or not, its unrealistic to expect anyone in France to be sold for more than £20-30million, be they Lyon, Marseille, PSG or Auxerre.

I guarentee you if Man Utd bid £30mill for Benzema from Lyon in the January window, it'll be accepted as quick as a flash. FM has always been unrealistic regarding transfer fees as far back as i can remember.

[saddlerscott]

"Yeah, well, Fernando Torres was Atletico's star player and they gave him up for, what, £20m? van Nistelrooy to Real Madrid for £15m, Henry to Barca for £16m, Nasri to Arsenal for £12m, Sagna to Arsenal for £7.5m, Adebayor to Arsenal for £5m, Owen to Newcastle for £17m, Alonso to Liverpool for £11m, Babel to Liverpool for £13m, Afonso Alves to Middlesbrough for £15m, Deco to Barca for £8m, Carvalho to Chelsea for £18m, Benny McCarthy to Blackburn for £2m, and the list goes on and on and on. All these were "star" players for their former clubs."

really? owen was reals star player? i dont think so. nistlerooy and henry wanted to leave and were approavhing the end of their contract. and when you consider the size of some of these former clubs, then the amounts are realistic. and some of these players didnt become star players until after the transfer

[Aoede]

In the demo.. players were a bit underprized. But now it seems like everyone is back to being way overprized like in FM08.

+ clubs aren't very good at negotiating...

[Negatrev]

You'll find if you are a bit more indirect with your negotiating you'll bring these prices right down.

I bid £11m for Super Mario. The asked for £23m + 30% next sale.

So I bid £15m.

They asked for £23m + 30% again

I decided to go for £15m + 10% profit.

They asked £18m + 30% next profit.

I then thought, % helped drop the price.

Bid £12.5m + 20% profit. Accepted

[Nicolai87]

Guess I'll set away £30m of my budget for a 22-year old french goalkeeper with no international caps, as a long-term replacement for Almunia.

[Xitmail]

I got Mamadou Sakho for £8.5M plus 20% of any profit from future sales...

[The Omen]

I agree, it's all still f00ked. I LOVED Hugo Lloris (GK) in FM08, and as such i wanted him to replace Joe Hart again in 09. He's valued at around £6.75m at the start of my game and i intended to make him my first signing. I bid in increments of £2-3m until i was at the lofty height of £35M! Bearing in mind he's 21 and so unproven, yet to score an international cap, and that Olympique Lyonnais paid under £7m for him, you'd think they'd accept this. But no. They come back at me with an offer, they want £43m, with £33m being paid up front, even with tweaking i can only muster £32m right now, so i adjust the offer and increase the monthly installments, £30 and £18m over 24 months. No deal! They came back with a revised offer, SEVENTY-ONE MILLLION now, and £7m over 12 months, if anyone deems that realistic i dunno what would be defined as being otherwise.

I'm pretty sure I'm not wrong when I say that your method of bidding would raise the price like that.

Going in low with consistent small increments will mean the computer will keep asking for more. Go in with a more sensible bid and you may have found they would've accepted a lot less.

This is to stop people doing what you did just to get the player for as cheap as possible.

[VMX]

Yeah, well, Fernando Torres was Atletico's star player and they gave him up for, what, £20m?

Torres was NOT performing good at Atletico. For some reason he wasn't able to score a damn goal, and his value had dropped to his feet during the last 3 years. Still, 38M € for him was such a good deal, and more considering that the player personally asked to leave.

van Nistelrooy to Real Madrid for £15m,

At the time that happened, van Nistelrooy was HARDLY ManU "star player", plus he signed for Real Madrid when he was 30 y/o... paying that amount for a 30 y/o player has NOTHING to do with buying Agüero right now, ffs...

Henry to Barca for £16m

Again, Henry signed for Barça in the worst moment of his carreer, after a season where he didn't play many matches due to several injuries, and being 30 y/o... in fact, he's performed **** for Barça the 2 seasons he's been there, so it wasn't exactly a cheap price...

Nasri to Arsenal for £12m

You call Nasri a 'star' player? He's, at most, a 'wonder kid' who's still to show everything he's worth. It wasn't an expensive price, but c'mon... he's not a Ronaldo yet!

Sagna to Arsenal for £7.5m

So Sagna is a 'star player' for Arsenal? He came straight from the French league, not the best right back in the world to say the least, and still it was a cheap price... did you know that Diarra moved to Real Madrid for 40M € in almost the same conditions (and being equal or even worse than Sagna)?

Adebayor to Arsenal for £5m

Erm... Adebayor was NOTHING close to a "world-class" striker when he signed for Arsenal... it was a bet by Wenger that happened to come out really well! You can't compare the signing of someone like him at the moment that it happened, with the signing of a raising star who's already playing at his highest level in one of the best leagues of the world and rated by his team as a world star!

Owen to Newcastle for £17m

Erm, should I remind you that Owen was a RESERVE player at Real Madrid when that happened, and they just wanted to get rid of him? (just like he was eager to leave). Real Madrid was lucky to get such high amount.

Alonso to Liverpool for £11m

LOL! Alonso moved to Liverpool from REAL SOCIEDAD in 2004! It was the most expensive fee Real Sociedad have EVER received for a player! He's a DM and he was nowhere near what he is right now, plus Real Sociedad is a team so economically limited that they had to accept such bid! You can't compare that to a move of Mario Gomez from Bayern, or even Karim Benzema, who's already wanted by half of the best clubs in the world!

Babel to Liverpool for £13m

Erm, Babel was 20 y/o when that happened, and wasn't (neither is) near the level of Agüero or any of the players you've attempted to sign.

Afonso Alves to Middlesbrough for £15m

Yeah, a world star... plus what do you expect Middlesbrough to pay? 30m?

Deco to Barca for £8m

Deco was still NOT a world star. He became a world star at Barça. Plus, Porto is not a 'rich' club able to negotiate such high quantities. And the actual transfer conditions were 12M € + the full rights over Ricardo Quaresma, who was then property of Barça as well. Not so cheap as you put it. Then this year they made a crap deal by claiming that they wanted to sell him and transfer listing him, so everybody would make really low bids for him (being 31 y/o also had an influence over that), and he was sold to Chelsea for almost nothing.

Carvalho to Chelsea for £18m

Again, you can't compare that transfer to any of the in-game transfers you've mentioned above. Carvalho WANTED to leave, he persuaded his club to do so, plus 18M at 2004 was quite an expensive transfer considering his a DC. You can hardly find bigger amounts payed by a DC these days (Sergio Ramos, Pepe and little else).

Benny McCarthy to Blackburn for £2m, and the list goes on and on and on. All these were "star" players for their former clubs.

LOL yeah, world star Benny McCarthy.

In my opinion, you're not realising that most of those real life example you're mentioning where made under really 'special' conditions, to say the least. Players who were already by his 30's, or players who played as DC's or defensive positions and where NOT in big clubs (smaller clubs can't 'take the risk' of rejecting good offers to negotiate higher fees), or players who were already transfer listed and willing to leave their clubs, or youngsters who are still in a learning stage and have been spotted early by a big club and signed in an smart way.

While, in the game, you're basically typing in all the big names in the search box and trying to get them for ridiculously low amounts.

Agüero will hardly leave Atletico for less than 50M of € now that he's rated as a world star by most teams in the world. Just like Cristiano Ronaldo or Messi would hardly be sold for less than 80M if they were EVER sold (ask Real Madrid, hehe). But, of course, if you wait until those 3 players are in his 28-30's or happen to be through an injury nightmare or a crap season or two, then we may see that they're sold for 20-30M... but that's just impossible right now in real life, just like it is in the game.

Benzema is maybe the only one that seems a bit high for what he's worth, but considering the president Aulas managed to get 40M € for Diarra and things like that... he's a really tough negotiator and he has NO reason to sell any of his players (doesn't need the money), so prices are likely to be really high.

Basically, you should try to find the next Agüero instead of trying to sign the current one, because that's what the real-life transfers you mentioned involving young players actually were about when they happened.

Also, comparing Henry, van Nistelrooy, etc., you could try to sign them right now in the game and you'll see they're probably cheaper than what they where in real life, when van Nistelrooy, for example, is performing great. But age counts, my friend.

Or try to sign some 18 y/o with high potential, just like the ones you mentioned, and you'll see that you can get them at a cheaper price. Just don't wait for them to turn 23, because then the team they're playing for will ask 60M for them, obviously.

[Nicolai87]

Are you drunk? I said I bought Agüero for £38m, and compared that to the others in my list, e.g. Sakho for £35m which is absolutely absurd. I never said I was unhappy because I had to pay £38m for Agüero. I just used him as an example to compare. If you read my 2nd post again, that list was from players who were star players at their former clubs. Sagna was a star player in Auxerre, Nasri was a star player in Marseille, Babel was a star player in Ajax, Deco was a star player for Barcelona, Afonso Alves was a star player in Heerenveen, Benny McCarthy was a star player in Porto, Carvalho was a star player for Porto. Everyone in here kept saying I shouldnt be surprised of the high fees the teams demand because I'm bidding for their star players. So if Sakho is PSG's star player (which he absolutely ISN'T), and PSG demands £35 for him, well, do the math yourself.

Basically all the arguments you just stated is plain stupid if you read this thread again. "Carvalho is a DC so £18m is alot". Well, what about Sakho and Zapata? "Err, Babel was 20 years old when that happened". Well, Sakho is 19. All this other crap you talk about when saying "world-class player". I never stated anything of the sort, I simply referred to other people in here who said that I was bidding for star players. Well, Adebayor was a star-player in Monaco. I never said he was world-class. Same goes with Afonso Alves in Heerenveen. Alonso was Sociedad's star player, and £10m. If you look at what teams demands for their "star players" in FM compared to real life, you would understand.

And you're saying I should find some young players with potential for cheap to be the next whoever. Well, for me Sakho is the next Gallas. He's 19 and got great stats. Guess what? £35m. And stop acting like you know what I do when I try to bring in players.

[BuckyBoy]

so can we conclude that when players want to leave, the price should go down?... because this is not really happening in football manager imo.

[Nicolai87]

Indeed.

The whole transfersystem seems terribly inbalanced. They've made every league go all Premier League when it comes to money. A class central defender in England is worth probably, £30m, while a class Ligue 1 defender is maybe worth £8m-£12m. FM09 doesn't recognize this at all. I mean, teams on FM demands way more money than their entire balance is. It's simply unrealistic that I should have to pay £27m for Sakho (bid got accepted, just wanted to check how low they would go), and the same with Udinese and Zapata. This guy isn't worth as much as Rio Ferdinand, is he? Well, in FM he is. It the imbalance between the leagues that messes things up. A good player in the Eredivisie or Ligue 1 isn't worth as much as a good player in Premier League. Simple facts. The same comparisons can be made all over. I'm afraid FM09 fails when it comes to balancing the transfer system. Well, it worked in FM08.

[Suttface]

You'll find if you are a bit more indirect with your negotiating you'll bring these prices right down.

I bid £11m for Super Mario. The asked for £23m + 30% next sale.

So I bid £15m.

They asked for £23m + 30% again

I decided to go for £15m + 10% profit.

They asked £18m + 30% next profit.

I then thought, % helped drop the price.

Bid £12.5m + 20% profit. Accepted

This is the crux- you need to negotiate. Clubs will always ask way over the odds but they do come down if you are canny. I think the transfer systerm is much improved, you will always find players that you feel are over-priced but the same is true in real life. Bent 16.5 million for example.

[VDVaart]

It's not realistic at all. Why would I buy mediocre players for £10m? I surely can't pay £30m for every player I want. Prices are completely unrealistic compared to real life. Just look at my summary of top transfers above. Come on, Mamadou Sakho for £30m? PSG'd let him go for £6m in real life.

In FM08 i signed Sakho for just under £1m, seems a bit unrealistic to me

[Nicolai87]

I've tried the suggestion above without luck.

A simple comparison about weird demands. In FM08 you could get Sakho for £4m which is realistic compared to real life, and you could get Zapata for about £10m. Why do PSG want £27m for Sakho on FM09, and Udinese £30m for Zapata? I know they rewrote the whole transfer thing, but somewhere along the road they screwed it up bad.

[backpackant]

Benni McCarthy couldn't get a game at Porto and wanted out. 18M is a heck of a lot for a defender, even one as good as carvalho. The game isn't saying Sakho is WORTH £38million it's saying his club don't want to sell him, so will only settle for a huge fee - his current ability plus his perceived potential make him that valuable -- just like Rooney IRL. I reckon you could get Sakho for a smaller fee up front plus add-ons and sell-ons that will make the price more acceptable.

There are plenty of bargains on FM09. I signed Bratu as a backup for Chelski on the demo for £3m and he's top scorer for me. You don't have to nab the continent's top players.

The system isn't perfect but it's hardly a mess. MUCH better than 08 (the demo, that is, I haven't played the full game yet).

[Guest]

Yeah, well, Fernando Torres was Atletico's star player and they gave him up for Player wanted out, what, £20m? van Nistelrooy to Real Madrid for £15m, Henry to Barca for £16m Both clubs wanted to sell the player, Nasri to Arsenal for £12m Good money, Sagna to Arsenal for £7.5m, Adebayor to Arsenal for £5m Unknown player at the time, Owen to Newcastle for £17m Club wanted to sell, Alonso to Liverpool for £11m, Babel to Liverpool for £13m Club need the money, Afonso Alves to Middlesbrough for £15m, Deco to Barca for £8m Player threatened to leave on a bosman, Carvalho to Chelsea for £18m Not exactly cheap, Benny McCarthy to Blackburn for £2m threatened to leave on a bosman, and the list goes on and on and on. All these were "star" players for their former clubs.

That covers a few of those, not sure on the exact circumstances of the other deals, also IIRC SI never said the price of players was part of the new code

[Nicolai87]

Well, Sakho wanted out when he heard I wanted him. Same goes for Mandanda, Zapata, Gignac, etc. They still demand loads (£20m+). £18m for Carvalho seems very cheap compared to what I have to pay for worse players on FM09.

For real, though. Let's say Arsenal wants to buy Mandanda or Riou or whoever as replacement Almunia in real life. What do you think they'd have to pay? I'd say about £5m-£8m. Try that in FM.

If I'm not mistaken, SI said they would improve the transfersystem to better reflect real life. Good job.

[Klimowicz]

Ideally, to try and get the player to request a transfer from his club to mine would involve the player refusing to train until he's allowed to hold talks, or sitting on the bench like Berbatov. It would hold his current club at ransom, and they'd have little choice but to lower their demands. That's not in fm09 as far as i've seen.

I sold £9M rated Trezeguet for £16M, purely because he was unhappy that I was rejecting bids and raising the asking price. At least it seems that you can raise the asking price for players on fm09. That's a good thing.

[Neil Brock]

It's understandable teams aren't going to sell players except for high fees - would you want your club to sell your best player without putting up a fight?

Essentially when they ask for so much they're saying, he's not for sale except for a ridiculous price if you want to pay it - see Robbie Keane's move to Liverpool

[Nicolai87]

Okay so the conclusion is to spend my whole transferbudget (£28m) on a goalkeeper from Marseille or Auxerre.

[slappy_bag]

@VMX - nicely said, well done on bringing some sense to the topic.

[Rickinho88]

I couldn't agree more. This is terrible. Its not a question of star player. Its a question of realistic finance.

In real life theres only a few 30m moves a year. Whilst theres a lot of highly regarded players realistically Aguero and Benzema are the closest thing to a 20/30m valued player in that list.

I myself sold Benayoun for 17m and Pennant for 15m. I mean come off it

[Nicolai87]

@VMX - nicely said, well done on bringing some sense to the topic.

So you're happy with the transfer system? Come on.

Quote - "I myself sold Benayoun for 17m and Pennant for 15m. I mean come off it".

Like I said, guess I'll have to spend £28m on Mandanda or whoever, but I still need a central defender and maybe a striker. Guess I'll have to find some gems for £200k. Haha.

[Rickinho88]

It only goes back to the old argument of what is the point in having a value. If PSG value Sakho at 38m, then surely he should be top of the list next time i do a player search. I know thats being pedantic, but there needs to be some realistic implemented system by which we can judge and agree

[Nicolai87]

No, he's valued at 8m. They want 28m

[Rickinho88]

Exactly, his value is 8m....to who though. Becuse obviously his value isnt 8m if they demnad 28

[Butts]

They're just putting these prices because they dont want to sell although with a massive price they would whats wrong with that its better than outright rejecting it?

[Nicolai87]

***** knows :]

[crafty bison]

Regardless of whether you're bidding on their star players or not, its unrealistic to expect anyone in France to be sold for more than £20-30million, be they Lyon, Marseille, PSG or Auxerre.

I guarentee you if Man Utd bid £30mill for Benzema from Lyon in the January window, it'll be accepted as quick as a flash. FM has always been unrealistic regarding transfer fees as far back as i can remember.

Actually, Lyon's chairman has a well known reputation for not letting anyone go cheap, hence the Essien price. That's why I think the Lloris 'issue' is entirely realistic. It does seem like SI have hard-coded some over-high fees for some of the big stars of 08 to stop us snapping up known world-beaters only, but in a way that's equivalent to disabling cheating so to some extent I say fair enough.

[Rickinho88]

Surely the occasional outright rejection is plausible though. Instead of leading us on and then complaining about stupid transfer prices. After all we complain about getting ****ed off about clubs constantly bidding when the player is not for sale.

[Rickinho88]

This debate will only rage on and on!

Im gonna cary on with the game and complain to those sitting in my proximity even if they don't care about it, I don't care if your doing dissertation love, Lucas just captained my youngsters to the carling cup