FM13 Video Blog - FM Classic Part 4 (Challenges)

[spankie]

Oh you should have resisted, you have just exposed your blinkered view for what it is. Clearly there are a lot more changes in FMC than you seem to like to believe. Actually, reading between the lines, it seems there are a lot more differences and changes than we have had full access to yet. I have to ask myself, why are so many posters with fixed preconceived negative views about FMC spending so much time in FMC specific vblog threads giving their ill considered opinions?. You dont like the idea of FMC?, fine, no one cares.

Because they are under the misapprehension that development of FMC took development away from the full FM game. They can't see that development of FMC can only lead to better things for the full fat FM as it gives SI the chance to experiment with some things (like instant result and match plans) without impacting on the full game.

It's like when FML came, some of the feature on there came into the full game like shouts.

[Super Bladesman]

seems like SIs trick has worked on you. everything that they have said so far about FMC you can do in the full game. if you dont have enough time you can not look at training at all, get your assistant to do conferences and teamtalks, do a tactic in the tactic creator in 2 minutes, and select just 3 nations at the start and you have got yourself FMC. it just depends on you, i can finish a season in 10 hours or 100 hours. in FMC, they have just restricted your options.

Seems like you should maybe try playing it first before rushing to judge it, eh?

FM DLC? LMFAO! SI's credibility just went in the skip.

By doing what every other dev company in the world are doing? Er, yeah, OK... If you don't want them, you don't have to buy them. They aren't for anything essential, and as someone who knows several of the guys at SI, I'd trust them 100% to keep it that way.

Or simply following a trend that is proving financially successful.

Fair enough if they make a few more quid out of it. Just means more money towards making the main game better.

And they've said from the start that the full game is their main priority and they love the game as much as any fan and only want the main game as perfect as possible.

Additional revenue? Yes.

Better FM's? Yes

Play the FMC if you want. Buy the Addons if you want. Nobody is forcing you.

If it's not successful it will be withdrawn. But it's down to how successful/unsuccessful it is.

Well said.

Because they are under the misapprehension that development of FMC took development away from the full FM game. They can't see that development of FMC can only lead to better things for the full fat FM as it gives SI the chance to experiment with some things (like instant result and match plans) without impacting on the full game.

It's like when FML came, some of the feature on there came into the full game like shouts.

Exactly - even if you never touch FMC (and if you don't - fine, whatever, your choice), it can only benefit the full career experience. I'll likely have two saves ongoing at any one time - a full career game that will last until the next FM comes out, and then quickfire games in FMC that I can play on my lunchbreak at work, on the bus etc.

I know there are plenty of trolls who don't like change, but some of the comments made by the select few have been ridiculous.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Because they are under the misapprehension that development of FMC took development away from the full FM game. They can't see that development of FMC can only lead to better things for the full fat FM as it gives SI the chance to experiment with some things (like instant result and match plans) without impacting on the full game.

It's like when FML came, some of the feature on there came into the full game like shouts.

Good points, SI have debunked the "development time" concern but that seems to get ignored regularly. I would go further and say that FM year on year changes very little, improves of course, but FMC is a large change relatively speaking. Maybe the potential extra sales that FMC promises to the Lite-Football Managers will speed up by funding the sea changes required very soon (AI team building issues & new ME - which I suspect has been in development for a while now). It seems to me that the most noisy (and somewhat irrational complainers) see FMC as a dumbing down of FM that devalues their achievements. eg Johnny Homeboy spends 40 hours per week devoting his life to FM and after 6 months has won the Champions League with Woking - an achievement to be proud of. But now Mr Steve Family Man will be able to play FMC and in a 3 month period playing maybe 1 hr per day has done the same with Luton. Both have used FM for their leisure & enjoyment but Johnny has an issue with Steve's achievements. Too much time worrying about how other people play the game, as always at this time of year. It's just immaturity.

[CaptainPlanet]

I fully blame Dafuge for this feature!

[asdpoo]

tl;dr I'm mad instant result isn't in FM proper.

Oh you should have resisted, you have just exposed your blinkered view for what it is. Clearly there are a lot more changes in FMC than you seem to like to believe. Actually, reading between the lines, it seems there are a lot more differences and changes than we have had full access to yet. I have to ask myself, why are so many posters with fixed preconceived negative views about FMC spending so much time in FMC specific vblog threads giving their ill considered opinions?. You dont like the idea of FMC?, fine, no one cares.

Like what? Do you happen to know something that isn't in the videos? Let's see the blogs.

Video Blog 1

1. Choose up to 3 Nations and no database options, perhaps it is normal. Ground-breaking new feature.
   
2. "There is now no need for individual training as players improve through team training and match experience". Duh. There was never a need for individual training and the AI didn't do it anyway. That is also the way it works in FM 2013. Remember they changed the training and there is only team training?
   
3. Less interaction with media. If for all these years you didn't discover how to do that in FM I can't help you.
   
4. No team talks and opposition instructions. See 2.
   
5. Match is watched in key highlights and the default speed is slightly faster. I don't even know how to comment this FEATURE.
   
6. Instant result. The real feature of FMC.
   
7. Redesigned screens, maybe even UI. While a lot of this can be done with FM skins, I think it is another valid feature.
   

Video Blog 2

1. Better UI. This was mentioned in video blog 1, too. Miles highlights that when viewing a player outside your squad there is a "Make an offer" button. I haven't played FM in months, but I don't think this is something new???
   
2. Less interaction with the Board (they never bothered me), the media (assman!) and backroom staff (you can silence them in FM, too)
   
3. Everything related to your club comes to your inbox, everything else to another screen. Well, it has always been like that in FM, unless you subscribe to a lot of stuff you don't care about. The news screen was always there.
   

Video Blog 3

1. Tactics are the same, no team talks or opposition instructions. This was in video blog 1.
   
2. You can watch the key highlights and there is a panel that can show different things like action zones and formation. This has been the case in FM for years.
   
3. Instant result and match plans. This is great, was in video blog 1.
   

Video Blog 4

1. Top division underdog challenge. Get lower division club promoted in one season.
   
2. Saviour challenge. Start halfway through the season with a club in the relegation zone and avoid relegation.
   
3. Injury crisis challenge. You start halfway through the season with a lot of injured players and have to survive.
   
4. The invincibles challenge. You start halfway through the season and must remain unbeaten.
   
5. Win the season with young players.
   
6. DLCs are coming
   
7. Leaderboards
   

All of the challenges can be done and many people already did them in FM. Some maybe even as a forum game. Well, there is a leaderboard if you find that kind if stuff in a single player game exciting. Not to mention that there is bound to be cheating.

About team talks, opposition instructions and even media interaction. Even if some of these are really disabled in FMC and not just hidden and offloaded to the assman, they could have easily achieved the same, putting on/off checkboxes at the "new game" screen. I happen to do software development for a living and I'm sure it's as easy to have an option as to have a separate game mode.

I hope now you understand. I'm not against it, but I find it pointless. It would have been better to improve FM's UI and add instant result. That way both target groups of players would be happy - everybody has new features and the FMC crowd can play it fast with FM just the same way.

They can't see that development of FMC can only lead to better things for the full fat FM as it gives SI the chance to experiment with some things (like instant result and match plans) without impacting on the full game.

I completely agree and said the same in another thread, but I don't think they had to hold back on instant result. If it's extremely broken people could just skip it without impacting their save.

[CaptainPlanet]

About team talks, opposition instructions and even media interaction. Even if some of these are really disabled in FMC and not just hidden and offloaded to the assman, they could have easily achieved the same, putting on/off checkboxes at the "new game" screen. I happen to do software development for a living and I'm sure it's as easy to have an option as to have a separate game mode.

I hope now you understand. I'm not against it, but I find it pointless. It would have been better to improve FM's UI and add instant result. That way both target groups of players would be happy - everybody has new features and the FMC crowd can play it fast with FM just the same way.

You're under-estimating how important the packaging is. Simply adding more options to customise the game does not appeal to a great deal of people who would be interested in buying FM13 because of FMC. A pre-determined simple/complex mode has been wanted for ages, not the ability to turn features on/off. Even though the end effect might be the same, how it's achieved is important.

[Smurf]

Don't forget this is just the first installment of FMC. I'm sure there's a ton of features they would like to pack into the FMC which just couldn't be implemented for this year.

It's a great start and I look forward to seeing how it develops

[asdpoo]

You're under-estimating how important the packaging is. Simply adding more options to customise the game does not appeal to a great deal of people who would be interested in buying FM13 because of FMC. A pre-determined simple/complex mode has been wanted for ages, not the ability to turn features on/off. Even though the end effect might be the same, how it's achieved is important.

Yeah, that's why I'm mad. I didn't get my coveted feature, only because SI is playing marketing games. Yes, I know that is how for-profits are run, it doesn't make me any less unhappy. At least I'm glad somebody else is seeing it, too.

[pigfacemonkeyman]

I would like it made clear exactly which parts have been "switched off" and which parts have been assigned to staff?

Still cloudy hereabouts, SI!

[CaptainPlanet]

Yeah, that's why I'm mad. I didn't get my coveted feature, because SI is playing marketing games. Yes, I know that is how for-profits are run, it doesn't make me any less unhappy.

It's not marketing games to make more money out of nothing though, it's giving the masses what they want.

I actually agree that Instant Win should be in both FMC and FM Normal. But I think it's harsh to criticise SI for creating FMC with a bunch of packaged options turned off when they had legit reasons for doing so.

[asdpoo]

I'm not really criticising it, I just had to explain to some people why I find it pointless from what the blogs have shown. I wouldn't bother at all if FM had instant result, because I couldn't care less about FMC as long as it has nations limit.

I hope it doesn't earn the Instant Win name

[CaptainPlanet]

By doing what every other dev company in the world are doing?

Every other company does DLC?

Whilst it has been getting more popular, it's still far from the norm and a lot of developers and publishing houses are strongly against it.

I'll admit that I'm surprised and a little disappointed that SI are heading down that route.

[milnerpoint]

DLC is pretty much the norm for games now a days, Halo did it, Cod did it, GTA did it, a huge proportion of Iphone or Android games do it, infact there are very few games that do not release DLC after they release the game and almost all of them charge for it.

[Kenco]

I'm not really criticising it, I just had to explain to some people why I find it pointless from what the blogs have shown. I wouldn't bother at all if FM had instant result, because I couldn't care less about FMC as long as it has nations limit.

I hope it doesn't earn the Instant Win name

If somebody came up to you and said you were pointless and listed reasons why, would you think they were being critical?

[CaptainPlanet]

there are very few games that do not release DLC after they release the game and almost all of them charge for it.

I'm sorry but you're wrong.

[Smurf]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downloadable_content

[7Bestie7]

Video Blog 4

1. Top division underdog challenge. Get lower division club promoted in one season.
   
2. Saviour challenge. Start halfway through the season with a club in the relegation zone and avoid relegation.
   
3. Injury crisis challenge. You start halfway through the season with a lot of injured players and have to survive.
   
4. The invincibles challenge. You start halfway through the season and must remain unbeaten.
   
5. Win the season with young players.
   
6. DLCs are coming
   
7. Leaderboards
   

I agree that most of these challenges are events that a lot of the FM public have already done. For me the most disappointing part about the list is that Miles mentions how one of those challenges have to be bought. Now even though I almost never get DLC I've got nothing wrong with it but I do question the logic of mentioning the challenge that has to be bought right off the bat (and then not telling us which challenge that is).

[Smurf]

It was mentioned before that DLCs unlock themselves after a while. I don't think he says "has to be bought", rather that the 5th one is available to be purchased. And other DLCs will be available depending on how popular these fair.

If you don't the DLCs or the FMC mode then don't buy the DLCs or play the FMC.

I won't be buying, but I will be playing.

[Crispypaul]

DLC is pretty much the norm for games now a days, Halo did it, Cod did it, GTA did it, a huge proportion of Iphone or Android games do it, infact there are very few games that do not release DLC after they release the game and almost all of them charge for it.

Also one developer that has been mentioned here before as being fluffy and not at all interested in anything evil like making a profit is Paradox - however they've been doing DLC ever since HOI3 came out.

I'd like to know a significant mass-market PC game (which FM is too) produced in the last year that doesn't have DLC available at some stage.

[7Bestie7]

There should have been a distinction made before hand "here's four you get to do straight away and we have a fifth that can be purchased if you want with more on the way." I know I'm nitpicking but it was a little too much like a bait n' switch to get the DLC train rolling (not saying that was the plan).

[CaptainPlanet]

I'd like to know a significant mass-market PC game (which FM is too) produced in the last year that doesn't have DLC available at some stage.

Ah but there you're shortening the field considerably. That's then not about what developers or publishers go for DLC options, to just ones that have certain levels of sales figures.

The definition of DLC is a bit iffy too, is an MMO expansion DLC? Or are we just talking micro transactions like map-packs, weapons, cosmetics etc?

[milnerpoint]

DLC means downloadable content, so ANYTHING you add to the game that does not come in the original package is DLC, no matter if its an expansion pack, or cosmetics or anything. I struggle to think of any game out there, of any significance, that does not have DLC, and usually DLC that costs money.

[Crispypaul]

Ah but there you're shortening the field considerably. That's then not about what developers or publishers go for DLC options, to just ones that have certain levels of sales figures.

I think it's only fair when you're talking about games that sell in the millions rather than thousands - FM is definitely in the former camp.

Don't know how accurate this website is, but it says FM 2012 sold 1.32 million copies:

http://www.vgchartz.com/platform/19/personal-computer/

Civilization 5 - which sold slightly fewer has was released the year before - definitely has DLC (map packs, etc), plus there are a few other examples including some that sold less (Fallout:New Vegas, Shogun 2) and these all have DLC also. If anything SI are a bit behind the game, and what they're offering as DLC is hardly anything much compared to some - a handful of challenges and unlockables in FMC. Probably a little better value than £2 for a new sword in THQ's Space Marine (which can only be used in multiplayer!) for a game that sold about a 10th of the copies of FM 2012 according to that list.

The definition of DLC is a bit iffy too, is an MMO expansion DLC? Or are we just talking micro transactions like map-packs, weapons, cosmetics etc?

All of it.

[CaptainPlanet]

Expansions have been around since at least 1991, Lemmings did it with "Oh No! More Lemmings" which was just 100 extra maps that were produced as a result of the original game being so popular. Restricting content from the outset is completely different to paying for more content that's been produced at a later date, I don't think you can compare the two and just label them as DLC.

[Crispypaul]

Expansions have been around since at least 1991, Lemmings did it with "Oh No! More Lemmings" which was just 100 extra maps that were produced as a result of the original game being so popular. Restricting content from the outset is completely different to paying for more content that's been produced at a later date, I don't think you can compare the two and just label them as DLC.

Are FM really restricting content?

The DLC is I believe 2 of the total 6 challenges, plus 3/4 unlockables in FMC which you can get anyway by playing the game and meeting certain criteria. Hardly terrible and nothing at all in the main game.

[N^G]

not impressed with this weeks videos, I think the general direction that things have went this year are pretty grim if this is a sign of things to come for future releases. I think that up/downscaling manager mechanics is something that should have been integrated into the real game as options instead of having an entirely separate functional system. Point of note, the DLC can get stuffed. What's next, pay for the January patch to get the inevitable bugs fixed?

I did like the newspaper view in one of this weeks FM: Mickey Mouse Edition videos however and hope that it replaces the news feed in the game proper.

[7Bestie7]

Expansions have been around since at least 1991, Lemmings did it with "Oh No! More Lemmings" which was just 100 extra maps that were produced as a result of the original game being so popular. Restricting content from the outset is completely different to paying for more content that's been produced at a later date, I don't think you can compare the two and just label them as DLC.

Agreed. Before DLC there were massive amount of Expansion packs that you would see in game stores ("Requires game x to play") and there was nothing wrong with that then and there's nothing wrong with it now, not even if it's SI doing it.

[Crispypaul]

What's next, pay for the January patch to get the inevitable bugs fixed?

Oh christ, not this "argument" again. Name one company that charges for patches - I don't think even EA have the balls to do that.

[spankie]

not impressed with this weeks videos, I think the general direction that things have went this year are pretty grim if this is a sign of things to come for future releases. I think that up/downscaling manager mechanics is something that should have been integrated into the real game as options instead of having an entirely separate functional system. Point of note, the DLC can get stuffed. What's next, pay for the January patch to get the inevitable bugs fixed?

I did like the newspaper view in one of this weeks FM: Mickey Mouse Edition videos however and hope that it replaces the news feed in the game proper.

The problem is that the modules are so interlinked it would be almost impossible to do that. If they tried to do this in the full fat game it would have caused far too many problems and probably would have needed a complete rewrite much like the CM4 fiasco.

At least with FMC they have a stepping stone that they can add to and improve upon so that more and more options are configurable until they release a siongle game mode that everyone can configure how they see fit. But that will take time.

SI have said numerous times that they would never charge for bug fixes. I doubt very much that they would charge for database updates considering that they provide an editor for people to edit their own databases, it just wouldn't make any kind of financial sense.

The other good thing about FMC is that it allows SI to experiment with the UI and the features in the game. When FML was around it enabled SI to work on a few features that eventually made it into the full game.

[CaptainPlanet]

Are FM really restricting content?

The DLC is I believe 2 of the total 6 challenges, plus 3/4 unlockables in FMC which you can get anyway by playing the game and meeting certain criteria. Hardly terrible and nothing at all in the main game.

The size of the content is irrelevant to the point of the discussions which is, yes they are restricting content that is available on release, so it's different to paying for say an expansion pack.

It's also a way in. It starts off with micro-transactions for small things like challenges, but if and when they see a large take-up of people paying for it, other bits start to sneak their way in in future versions.

I'd like to have trust in SI/Sega around how this will be implemented in the future, but I'm afraid past experience with other respected developers and publishers have me only seeing this going in one direction.

It's obviously a profitable business model to have, but I'm still disappointed and surprised that SI are going down that route, however small they are starting out with it.

[Smurf]

Everyone seems to be skipping over the point that DLC that they are charging for eventually become unlocked through normal game play anyway.

If you want to play that locked DLC then you can pay for it - if you don't then play the game as normal and it will unlock itself eventually.

At least that was my understanding from one of the earlier videos.

[CaptainPlanet]

Everyone seems to be skipping over the point that DLC that they are charging for eventually become unlocked through normal game play anyway.

If you want to play that locked DLC then you can pay for it - if you don't then play the game as normal and it will unlock itself eventually.

At least that was my understanding from one of the earlier videos.

I don't get that impression from video #4 - He says "4 of these challenges are free to play, the 5th can be purchased for a small fee"

[Crispypaul]

The size of the content is irrelevant to the point of the discussions which is, yes they are restricting content that is available on release, so it's different to paying for say an expansion pack.

It's also a way in. It starts off with micro-transactions for small things like challenges, but if and when they see a large take-up of people paying for it, other bits start to sneak their way in in future versions.

Which would indicate that there is a market for it. Anyway what would you think they would start doing DLC for - extra leagues? Little point considering there is no plans to remove the editor AFAIK.

I'd like to have trust in SI/Sega around how this will be implemented in the future, but I'm afraid past experience with other respected developers and publishers have me only seeing this going in one direction.

It's obviously a profitable business model to have, but I'm still disappointed and surprised that SI are going down that route, however small they are starting out with it.

It's the way the sector is going i'm afraid, same with using online copy-protection. However I don't think it would be quite as onerous as some examples. As I mentioned earlier have a look at some of the "offerings" for Space Marine!

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

"DLC - are SI ripping us of?"

Say you buy the game for £40

Then you download 5 DLC's at £2.50 each

That's only about £1 per week for a year.

SI ripping us off?...really.....

[Smurf]

You don't have to buy any DLCs. None at all. You don't even have to play FMC.

You are in control. I won't be buying any DLCs.

[CaptainPlanet]

"DLC - are SI ripping us of?"

Say you buy the game for £40

Then you download 5 DLC's at £2.50 each

That's only about £1 per week for a year.

SI ripping us off?...really.....

Paying £52.50 for a game that used to be £30 could be considered quite the price increase.

[jim morrow]

Yes but selling DLCs this year, means that in the future, more things to sell...perhaps they will sell us a better assistant in the classic mode ??? as classic mode is a hidden 'holiday mode' if you resume all the videos....

perhaps, in two years, SI will sell better scout who can make a more complete report than "free" version...I think SI open the door of the pandora box.....

[milnerpoint]

Yeah because games like call of duty now charge you to unlock guns dont they? GTA make you pay before you can steal certain cars dont they? Oh wait, no company has gone down that route, why would SI be the first?

[Smurf]

Yeh but you don't have to buy them.

They get unlocked by themselves over time.

[Federico]

You do realise the thread topic yeah ? what does the thread topic say ? so you saying the youtube play button covers the 4 in the title doesn't come into play here. You would have had to click on the thread title after seeing it to come in here to watch the video.

Good spot mate

so what now?

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Yes but selling DLCs this year, means that in the future, more things to sell...perhaps they will sell us a better assistant in the classic mode ??? as classic mode is a hidden 'holiday mode' if you resume all the videos....

perhaps, in two years, SI will sell better scout who can make a more complete report than "free" version...I think SI open the door of the pandora box.....

Presently the Scouts are useless - one of my main gripes with FM. Frankly if SI offer me a Super Scout for £2.99 I would be happy to purchase it I do understand what you are saying though, but Miles did say that additional DLC would only be available if there is demand. If SI ever drop content and re-introduce at a charge then we would all have reason to complain, knowing SI's methods in this marketplace so far I imagine any directive to do that would not be from SI (maybe Sega would dare to push for suchlike - and if so I suspect SI & SEga would fall out big time).

Something crossed my mind recently, surely an NFL version of FM would be huge in the States (surely there already is such a thing?). If SI really just wanted to make money they would probably neglect FM and diversify the idea elsewhere - not something I wish to see transpire.

[jim morrow]

milnerpoint, I hope that you have no kid...cause it's a good education to say :

as everybody cheat during school exam, you can do it......as everybody make illegal download, you can do it......as every school mate has a iphone 5, I can buy one to you....

[CaptainPlanet]

Yeah because games like call of duty now charge you to unlock guns dont they?

Many games have certain weapons, certain items etc. that you can pay to obtain. Some of them have alternative ways of unlocking, such as challenges (some of which may require a lot of manhours to get) although this alternative route it not always available.

The latest WWE game has moves available as DLC. Micro-transactions on MMO shops have weapons and armour. Freegames like Angry Birds have level skip items that you can purchase.

It's not beyond the realms of possibility that SI could have similar things. "Pay £5 and automatically win your next game", "We'll include England, Spain and Italy for free, if you want other nations you'll need to unlock them by either playing 20 season in England, or by paying £5" etc.

[spankie]

Paying £52.50 for a game that used to be £30 could be considered quite the price increase.

Damn, I paid less then £20

I had better complain to SI/Sega that I'm not paying enough for my game, sort it out SI

DLCs are optional and you are not missing out on anything by not buying them they do not add new features to the game, anyway they are for FMC/Challenge only.

If SI ever produce DLC for the main game that adds optional features then I'd be in the mob outside SI toiwers with a torch and pitchfork. Unless that happens there is no possible reason to complain.

EDIT: Doesn't FT2 charge for some add ons?

[CaptainPlanet]

you are not missing out on anything by not buying them they do not add new features to the game, anyway they are for FMC/Challenge only.

That doesn't make sense, the challenges are a feature. Restricting them by having to pay to unlock them means without paying I am missing out.

Just because you see it as a small feature that doesn't impact how you want to play the game is irrelevant.

[spankie]

Challanges are game modes, not features of the full fat FM game. In fact if you play them you have to play them in FMC as that mode is the only one designed to run challenges

[CaptainPlanet]

Challanges are game modes, not features of the full fat FM game. In fact if you play them you have to play them in FMC as that mode is the only one designed to run challenges

I plan on playing FMC exclusively. It's the only reason I'm likely to buy FM13.

The challenges are a feature of that, and I don't have full access to them all without having to pay extra. As such, I am missing out.

[x42bn6]

Challanges are game modes, not features of the full fat FM game. In fact if you play them you have to play them in FMC as that mode is the only one designed to run challenges

It doesn't really matter if it's a "game mode"/"feature"/"skin"/"gameplay experience" - something is missing - i.e. something is being missed out.

[spankie]

Before now I've brought games that have lots of different DLC depending on where you pre-order it, for example Sleeping Dogs, Mass Effect, RDR, LA Noire and so on. Sometimes those extra DLC gets released at a later date as chargeable DLC.

The only difference between those and this is that this is an optional game mode that has zero effect on FM or FMC gameplay. Unless you were specifically looking to play that challenge scenario you are not missing out. Those other games did have things missing that had an effect on gameplay, this doesn't.

If you're really against chargeable DLC why don't you complain to Rockstar, Bioware and Square Enix and all the other companies that actually have removed a gameplay feature out of the game in order to charge for it later as a DLC?

[jim morrow]

Spankie, if you compare FM to Mass Effect, LA NOIRE etc.....I can not do nothing for you....sorry. and if we don't complain now.....next year or in 2014 it will be too late, when SI will ask to pay more to have a complete main game.....

They began with steam platform....now they introduce DLCs on a new FM mode, it's only a test to know how people react....so if you don't want to see more "payment option", it's time to complain, tomorrow it will be too late....