Fm11 Worst version ever??

[cruiseylee]

Cruiseylee,

oh well, no need to buy it, no need to be on the boards, time for you to go play Tetris

Erm as a paying member for 20 years I think Im free to my views. So why dont you go away if you dont like opinions. Im here to listen to other peoples views and feelings on it. That is allowed!

[Matt ex SEGA]

In fairness - you've probably annoyed most people with your title of "FM11 worst version ever".

Given that the average player of FM plays for 240 hours, to have determined that after less than 48 hours of the demo is slightly controversial. You've hidden your more balanced views behind a tabloid headline. You've earned a right to your views, but others have earned a right to disregard sensationalism. It's a shame because your more considered views make a lot of sense.

[Brisvegas]

Erm as a paying member for 20 years I think Im free to my views. So why dont you go away if you dont like opinions. Im here to listen to other peoples views and feelings on it. That is allowed!

And I am expressing my view that you should go play Tetris.

I don't give a rats that you have been a paying member for 20yrs, comments like that make you sound like a bit of a tool.

You are nit picking a some what minor details in the whole spectrum of things, classic can't see the forest for the trees scenario.

All I can see is that you are trying to be sensationalist.

[FM_player]

You're calling this one the worst version ever BASED in a DEMO????

shame on you

[SCIAG]

Keep it civil, please.

[FM_player]

surre, sorry that one

Anyone can say that this is the worst version ever whitout play a all season.

Let's wait for the original

[cruiseylee]

In fairness - you've probably annoyed most people with your title of "FM11 worst version ever".

Given that the average player of FM plays for 240 hours, to have determined that after less than 48 hours of the demo is slightly controversial. You've hidden your more balanced views behind a tabloid headline. You've earned a right to your views, but others have earned a right to disregard sensationalism. It's a shame because your more considered views make a lot of sense.

Thanks Matt.

I suppose my own frustration at the game having something that made it unplayable for me was upsetting. "edit" I have been playing fm longer than anyone"edit" To ( I have been playing Fm from the very 1st day). I was playing management games b4 CM and when this came along its been the only game for me. My headline was just to get some views I suppose. once people read my thead I was hoping for some feedback and nice comments. I havnt been nasty to anyone and just want this game to be the best. I just feel player interaction awful. thats all. the rest of my comments were just about FM in general compared to prev versions thats all. Ofcourse it is nto the worst Version. But 100% its the worst feature. and for me that does ruin the whole game so I was kinda in 2 minds what to put as my title.

Im sure I will still play the game. Im sure I will buy it. And I will just have to get around the player interaction as best i can.

[cruiseylee]

You're calling this one the worst version ever BASED in a DEMO????

shame on you

Yes because its set in stone! If you read what I said its not going to change! Player interaction is going to be the same when the game is out. its a new feature that is so basic it makes the whole game feel wrong for me.

[Brisvegas]

Thanks Matt.

I suppose my own frustration at the game having something that made it unplayable for me was upsetting. I have been playing fm longer than anyone. I was playing management games b4 CM and when this came along its been the only game for me. My headline was just to get some views I suppose. once people read my thead I was hoping for some feedback and nice comments. I havnt been nasty to anyone and just want this game to be the best. I just feel player interaction awful. thats all. the rest of my comments were just about FM in general compared to prev versions thats all. Ofcourse it is nto the worst Version. But 100% its the worst feature. and for me that does ruin the whole game so I was kinda in 2 minds what to put as my title.

Im sure I will still play the game. Im sure I will buy it. And I will just have to get around the player interaction as best i can.

So player interaction is awful, compared to what??

[Mitsunari]

I have to agree with the comments made about player interaction. Every conversation seems to end in the same way. Been messing around as Montrose in the Scottish 3rd division. Anyway had some conversation with players suggested some tutoring and such. Out of all the 13 players i made suggestion to only 1 accepted the suggestions i made as manager to improve there game. At first i though the players didn't respect my suggestion due to manager reputation.

I reloaded and tested this with my reputation set as International Player, again with Montrose. The result was the same only one player took the suggestion,it doesn't matter if its perfered moves or tutoring. Now with Montrose being a part time team. I cant see them being able to dismiss the advice of an former International Player so easily.

The only conversation i could get my players to agree on that didn't in. "I am going to leave before i say something i regret" was talking about players performance in the same match. Every time that also just came back to me with the same comment "I will do better next time". There seems to be a lack of response in the conversation and players seem to stubborn to accept the advice you give them to.

[cruiseylee]

And I am expressing my view that you should go play Tetris.

I don't give a rats that you have been a paying member for 20yrs, comments like that make you sound like a bit of a tool.

You are nit picking a some what minor details in the whole spectrum of things, classic can't see the forest for the trees scenario.

All I can see is that you are trying to be sensationalist.

No I was giving my views underneath that main title. I was hoping for it to get some interest but I was also hoping people would see my views. See i love the game in general and just have bones with this one feature. I also wanted ot get some views on some things that are not in fm anymore and some were my fav things in the game. I mean also ehat happend to the 2nd 11 in scout report?? now its just 1 line up and your youth one. I really loved seeing my 2nd 11 and who is progressing into the 2nd 11

[cruiseylee]

So player interaction is awful, compared to what??

compared to it being how it was in all other versions. in fm10 for instance. I would rather somethign not be in Fm than it be in at 10% working. It destroyed the feeling of the whole game as you cant keep out of your head all players are saying the same thing and not wanting to improve or listen to you. I mean I saw someone say They was Chelsea as an ex international as there rep. he asked one of the promising u21 players to learn from Lamps and he stormed out of the office before he said somethign hed regret lol/ as I have said. Its so basic and immature how it is. I hope to god they can take it out of the main game or alteast have an option on start up to play without it.

[Brisvegas]

compared to it being how it was in all other versions. in fm10 for instance. I would rather somethign not be in Fm than it be in at 10% working. It destroyed the feeling of the whole game as you cant keep out of your head all players are saying the same thing and not wanting to improve or listen to you. I mean I saw someone say They was Chelsea as an ex international as there rep. he asked one of the promising u21 players to learn from Lamps and he stormed out of the office before he said somethign hed regret lol/ as I have said. Its so basic and immature how it is. I hope to god they can take it out of the main game or alteast have an option on start up to play without it.

For sure there are always things that aren't perfect in FM, EVERY edition has a bug bear, I think the interactions in this game are a whole lot better than FM2010. As mentioned not perfect but I would think they are able to be perfected a little bit more via a patch.

A better title for this thread could of been.

Hey Guys here are my issues with Player Interactions

[BrightLad5]

So far for me this is the best version of FM since FM07, which is arguable the best ever. I will resever my judgment for when the full game comes out but I think this will be better than FM10, it will be better than FM09, it is definately a lot better than FM08 and it could just get ahead of FM07

[cruiseylee]

For sure there are always things that aren't perfect in FM, EVERY edition has a bug bear, I think the interactions in this game are a whole lot better than FM2010. As mentioned not perfect but I would think they are able to be perfected a little bit more via a patch.

A better title for this thread could of been.

Hey Guys here are my issues with Player Interactions

I agree I should have changed title but thats how passionate I was about it. I have just got into fm10 and was really looking forward to this one only to find this barrier which I could not believe. I also wanted lots of people to click on my post and see my other views and opinions on some other things. I may make another thread another day with the same info but diff title. Alot of the other things havnt got much of a mention like i was hoping. the 1-7 ideas and things that got left out from prev versions.

[Brian Shanahan]

@Cruiseylee: Why should I bother respond to you when your only response to anyone who doesn't agree with everything you say is "you didn't read my post you're evil". Frankly I ripped your points to shreds, your most legitimate one amounting to an extra thirty seconds of work. And yes everything you're saying is tucked away out of sight completely is actually available in an absolute maximum of 5 clicks. Yes that is really a lot of work to do, I'm sorry!

I still stand by my original assertion that your OP is just a childish reaction to SI taking away the auto-win button which was in earlier versions of FM. IF you don't like that then I would suggest severley modifying your posting style on these forums to include thinking ideas through and consideration for others when they point out the flaws in your strawmen arguements.

[Twellman24]

I think cruise makes several valid points, and we should encourage this type of criticism--the kind that actually helps. And even more if it comes from a customer from 20 years.

I agree with most of your points like i said; but as others replied, the title takes lost away from more people simply debating this and not just being annoyed about it.

Cheers cruise.

[Kickballz]

FM11 is clearly the worst version if you still want to be playing Championship Manager 2 (which I suspect is the problem for many critics)

The game has changed - if you don't like it then there is nothing stopping you playing CM2.

[fuzzrab]

Thanks Matt.

I suppose my own frustration at the game having something that made it unplayable for me was upsetting. I have been playing fm longer than anyone. I was playing management games b4 CM and when this came along its been the only game for me. My headline was just to get some views I suppose. once people read my thead I was hoping for some feedback and nice comments. I havnt been nasty to anyone and just want this game to be the best. I just feel player interaction awful. thats all. the rest of my comments were just about FM in general compared to prev versions thats all. Ofcourse it is nto the worst Version. But 100% its the worst feature. and for me that does ruin the whole game so I was kinda in 2 minds what to put as my title.

Im sure I will still play the game. Im sure I will buy it. And I will just have to get around the player interaction as best i can.

I think statements like this are the reason some people are being a touch harsh. You have not been playing FM/CM longer than anyone you have been playing it AS long as some people. I myself have been playing CM/FM since it's very first incarnation and yes i was even playing management games before that way back on the Spectrum and other machines older than i care to admit.

I think if you toned down the sensationalist comments like this one and other comments like it you may have an easier time getting a fruitful debate started.

I can't really comment on the player interaction as i haven't downloaded the demo yet (trying to but my library computer time is about to run out with the demo only 66% complete :-( ) but like others have said it is a brand new feature and will take a couple of versions to get right. I know thats not ideal but i think i will be able to live with it. If it ruins your game then fair enough don't buy the full version and wait till it is fixed to your liking.

[cruiseylee]

@Cruiseylee: Why should I bother respond to you when your only response to anyone who doesn't agree with everything you say is "you didn't read my post you're evil". Frankly I ripped your points to shreds, your most legitimate one amounting to an extra thirty seconds of work. And yes everything you're saying is tucked away out of sight completely is actually available in an absolute maximum of 5 clicks. Yes that is really a lot of work to do, I'm sorry!

I still stand by my original assertion that your OP is just a childish reaction to SI taking away the auto-win button which was in earlier versions of FM. IF you don't like that then I would suggest severley modifying your posting style on these forums to include thinking ideas through and consideration for others when they point out the flaws in your strawmen arguements.

You did not rip one thing to shreads lol? Your post was actually sad and funny at the same time. Everything I mentioned for me was brill in prev games! Thats my opinion and not yours so how you can rip my opinions on what makes the game good for me is brilliant lol. Its like saying blue is my fav colour and you coming back with dont be silly red is the best lol. I told it from my view and from experience. Many people have agreed with me and even 2 SI people said my points were valid and I had some good ideas. hmm now what does that make your points now? I have seen post after post about the player interaction being awful. So we are all wrong and you are right yea, hmm ok. And when did I say anything about people being evil? Im totally lost there.

My posts are based on facts and my opinion. You cant argue agaisnt that. I know what I like and I know how the game feels to me. The taking out of many of the features I mentioned made thr game less than what it could be, thats all. Its still brill and fm 10 I have really got into but my fav always has been fm 06. And to make sure I didnt win easy on that game I took over barnet! I editted them into the conference! I made a system to follow which made the game hard to win! by never signing any players or players that have ever played pro football! Is that someone who wants an auto win button? If you win easy without any hard work or time and effort it makes it un-enjoybale. I also only signed ex Barnet players and free players under 17 with rep below 2000 to make sure barnets youth system was realistic. I worked hard my yts players and Reserves and took time and effort to blood them in and bring them thru. so your claims I want to win is so false it makes your posts a joke.

I even once took on Leyton and eddited them into the conf south. I started with no players and no staff or anything. And I had to work my way up. I kept a system I knew would really make it tought to do well and it took me till my 3rd season to get promoted. I loved the losing as was still seeing my club progress slowly. Anyway I dont wish to answer any of your posts again I have learned anyone so negative and nasty and sarcy isnt worth the time.

thanks for the support and nice constructive comments from most of you ;-)

[cruiseylee]

I think statements like this are the reason some people are being a touch harsh. You have not been playing FM/CM longer than anyone you have been playing it AS long as some people. I myself have been playing CM/FM since it's very first incarnation and yes i was even playing management games before that way back on the Spectrum and other machines older than i care to admit.

I think if you toned down the sensationalist comments like this one and other comments like it you may have an easier time getting a fruitful debate started.

I can't really comment on the player interaction as i haven't downloaded the demo yet (trying to but my library computer time is about to run out with the demo only 66% complete :-( ) but like others have said it is a brand new feature and will take a couple of versions to get right. I know thats not ideal but i think i will be able to live with it. If it ruins your game then fair enough don't buy the full version and wait till it is fixed to your liking.

Fuzz if peope are taking everything say 100% word for word then that is a problem I cant help. Not one person has mentioned that yet and by that all I meant was from the very start. I was in the store the day it was put on the shelves. By luck in Virgin lol. I remember seeing the red box and thinking originally it was bobby robson as he was my hero after England had nearly got to italia 90 final. I didnt think for a second that would upset people. And seriously I played that game every day till the next one came out, morning till rise lol. So I kinda felt by saying that it was true.

anyway if people still cant have a constructive argument without getting nasty or personal then that doesnt really bother me. There not the people i want to talk to anyway. I have had enought support in this forum in just a few hours to know I have some decent points. the greatest idea ever would be to actually be able to make the interface and design how you want it. I am sure this is not far off as the choose your tabs secion and make them etc is amazing and I only realised how you can edit your own lists and things to view all at once. Brill feature!! Well done SI on that.

[TheMister]

I have been playing fm longer than anyone.

I can't take you seriously any more.

[toon army 06]

Now I have been playing cm/fm for 20 years. Since i was 12/13 years old and I was one of the people who bought it on the release day. I have been one of its biggest fans. This game put me on the road to managment in which IRL I became the youngest coach/manager in the country when at 16 I took over from a manager who had given the team up. I had been helping out there as goalkeeper coach from age of 15 and became the youngest manager in the country. The team was u12s and I was only 4 years older than the players. I was in local and national press so I owe alot to this game although even from the age of 11 I was showing signs of becoming a manager by playing PBMs(play by mail management games) And even won league in 1st season aged 11 v adults lol

Anyway my past not that important but I just wanted people to know how much I think of this game and how my views I feel are valid and hopefully something is done to save my fav game.

In recent versions I have felt the game to over complicate things and feel so different regarding the display and interface. Also things have been brought in that I feel ruin it.

Well fm 11 has lost it now. I took over Barnet on the demo last night and normally manage them. Anyway I think SI have left the game ideas/features in the baby creche section.

I tranfer listed 4 players. All with different personalties. I did it as Barnet need money and these guys were either on high wages or of high value. All came to see me with the same question. why am I forcing them out. Then I was given the same possible answers for each players same question. I answered the same way. That the club needed the money etc. All said I am disrespecting them lol? Then I gave same answer and I got the same answer to all of them. Then there final answer was they better leave before they say something they regret? All repeating eachother word for word. Within 20 mins of playing the game I had come across something that for me makes the game unplayable.

Some people prob wouldnt mind this sillyness and repetitive feature but for me it makes it feel like you have taken over the under 5 local team. The answers the players give is so immature and stupid it just makes me go erm... I feel embarrassed. player interaction to this level should never of been allowed into the game untill it was perfect. This is just silly.

Now on the tactics section if you dont like the new set up on fm10 you can change it back to the set up you liked before. (Brill Feature) Anything with options and things that give you choice is awesome. But there is no option to go back to the prev feature. Not just that but the continuous and repetitive way you speak with players is annoying just after speaking with 2/3 I felt embarrassed I only had the same options to let the player know the meeting was over. Now Im not saying SI should of brought in 20/30 different ways to say bye or end of meeting. Im saying the game doesnt suite this interaction yet.

In every case the players said they dont want to play for me anymore just cos I said they was being unprofessional. The club pays there wages and I told them the club needs to sell them for funds. Nothing personal on them. I am sure there will be many other things like this in the game and for me anyway its just too immature.

For me its back to fm 06(the best version) and fm 10 is just playable and currently giving that a try.

i would like to hear other peoples views of the restricitve and repetitive player interactions. and if theres anything else they should have kept the same or atleast given us the option ot go back to how it was before.

Also if people have time or wish to answer these following features I cant believe were taken out from old fms or features I still cant believe are not in fm yet.

Answer in numbered answers.

1. Last match view!

Was 1st on fm over 15 years ago! Just a little tab to check your last game. I used to use this all the time to remind myself if I had saved the game and just came back to it what had just happened and who played and also to see ratings/form etc. Now I have to click on club,fixtures,and then the match I want to see.

2. Scout your own club.

This feature was awesome. First brought in about 10 years ago. You could scout your own club and on the report you would see all the players picked for games. There rating in the last 10 games and also if the team won/lost/drawed/goals/conceded. If a player played in the reserves it also showed that and also had the same stats. It also showed when that players last game was and you could click(1 click) on that tab and see which players at a glance played most recent and which ones have not played for a while. Now to a point the game still has this feature but its tucked away and harder to view and you cant do it as simple as you could like this option. You also cant team view it on your whole club like you could back then.

3. Position your own players!

I think this feature was also brought in 10 years ago. I think on the 00/01 version. Then it dissapeared forever? For some of you who didnt play that version this was one of the best features ever.

You could tell all 10 of your outfield players where you wanted them to be when the other team had the ball in certain areas. You could also place all 10 of your players where you want them when your team had the ball in certain areas. Making the game have a feel of great realism and making you feel you have done shadow training with your players. (for some who dont know this its what many coaches/managers do on the training pitch to let the players know where there wanted at certain times positional wise and also to gain the shape the manager is after)

If you got this wrong like tell your players to push up and drop back to much from certain area squares they could lose fitness and condition. brill feature this was. Not just that but you could tell that speedy striker to stay on that last defender and never get what you get now of your speedy striker taking up wrong positions or your slow striker being the man looking to run in behind.

4. Set instructions in matches given to players! (This is a feature that I cant believe has never appeared in cm/fm)

ok so lets say its half time in a friendly and you are making 11 changes at half time. Now if you want to play the game properly and have your players having all the correct instructions this is going to take ages! Especially if most of them are new or trialists. You have to weigh up the game/away or home/attack or defend and it will take some time.

Why oh why has nobody brought in a tab that has each player have set instructions they have when they play or when they come on as a sub. You could even have a tab of away or home instructions that you give that player and ofcourse you can edit if you change your mind on any of this. Would be best feature they could currently bring in.

5. Seeing tactics/player instructions from prev games and your AM. (something also taken out from earler versions)

I have seen alot in the forums complaining about not being able to set your reserve/u18 team tactics to how you want them to play. The only current option is use current match tactics.(which means copy 1st team) Not use tactics you set in the res/u18 tactics screen as some people think. In older version 00/01 and 01/02 you could look back at your reserve games and see what the AM did. You could also see what instructions he gave to each player which was awesome. As when you then bring that player into the 1st team you knew what he had been playing with in the reserves and he would hit the ground running as he would be playing the same way as he did in the reserves. It seems mad you cant now tell your AM how you want them to play and have to rely on what he wants (which you cant see now) or you have to ask your res/u18 to play same as the last 1st team match which could be completely the wrong tactics for the res/u18s next game. Also does copy 1st team mean copy all the player instructions also? I have never found this out yet.

Now to a few minor things

6. Pens taken and scored. On older versions you could see on a players stats how many of hes goals have come from pens and how many he had taken! Brill little feature. Ofcourse you can go to the league pens info but I want to see on hes profile page like before.

7. Player Celebrations.

Not sure if other people find every player celebrating the same way every time annoying but I do. On the older versions ofcourse you had no 3d. I suppose the development of the game this was always going to be tough to please people. For me the 2d was brill. Alot of the celebrations/goals was in your imagination. And for one this for me is better than watching better graphics of players doing silly things. now I know i dont have to watch in 3d but there is alot of things on the 3d I love. Also when you know something is there its hard to resist. just a shame the players dont celebrate more when they score in last minute compared to pulling a goal back. I mean having a players giving it the finger and punching air when 4-0 down??

Im sure I have missed some things out but those are some things that has been on my mind and which I can think of now. Would be very interesting to see peoples views on all of this ;-)

its easy to see why the players had a moan when you said your selling them in reallife a few would be upset to that like out of a squad of over like 20 players hes 1 of the 1s that get sold.and well that other feature is just new its no big deal they all say the samed thing it will be better next year but it does not make this the worst 1 yet.

[fuzzrab]

Fuzz if peope are taking everything say 100% word for word then that is a problem I cant help. Not one person has mentioned that yet and by that all I meant was from the very start. I was in the store the day it was put on the shelves. By luck in Virgin lol. I remember seeing the red box and thinking originally it was bobby robson as he was my hero after England had nearly got to italia 90 final. I didnt think for a second that would upset people. And seriously I played that game every day till the next one came out, morning till rise lol. So I kinda felt by saying that it was true.

anyway if people still cant have a constructive argument without getting nasty or personal then that doesnt really bother me. There not the people i want to talk to anyway. I have had enought support in this forum in just a few hours to know I have some decent points. the greatest idea ever would be to actually be able to make the interface and design how you want it. I am sure this is not far off as the choose your tabs secion and make them etc is amazing and I only realised how you can edit your own lists and things to view all at once. Brill feature!! Well done SI on that.

That is the problem with internet forums, people do take everything you say 100% word for word. I am not saying it will upset people, though it probably will, only that most people will read to that comment or comments like that and dismiss the rest of your argument wether it is valid or not.

I do believe you make some valid points on some things and given a chance you could probably have a constructive debate, rather than the tit for tat argument you are having with Brian S, with some of the more knowledgeable people on this forum. I will have to get back to you on wether the player interaction is repetitve or a game breaker as i still have'nt downloaded the demo yet.

[HoroHoro]

Lets all go take a drink in the balcony and calm ourselves down before we type something that we regret.

[Kickballz]

It's always a bad idea to start a post with 'i've been playing CM since 1770'

Just tell us the point. We wouldn't be here if we haven't played the game so most of us assume you have as well.

[Giangosini]

Bloody hell... airs and graces!! FM is the BEST game in the WHOLE WORLD!!! GO, GO FM TEAM!!!

[higgins]

At the moment player interactions is a pointless and annoying feature, I really doubt that a computer game could simulate well such a thing, too repetitive for me.

[Wiitastic]

the funny thing is, the demo has been out for 2 days and someone is already claiming it to be the worst game ever. Infact I think the exact opposite. A rejig of the setup of the looks, with a few tweaks of fm2010 items and a couple of new items such as youtube and twitter. How on earth could that be a bad thing ?

Also player agents makes it better also and more realistic. If Football Manager was like real life football, none of us would ever be manager of Liverpool or any other major European clubs in FM 2011. So all in all I think eventually FM 2011 will be better than FM 2010 and FM 2010 was awesome

[HarryMills]

My ass man told me he thought a player would improve if he came deep for the ball.

So I spoke to the player about this, he refused and now hates me.

In what world if you said to a player I want you to try and be on the ball more (presumably because you think he's good and effective) would he refuse and then even more bizarrely hate you?

And the whole I'd better leave before i say something i regret!!! wow, is this the most girly phrase ever written into a computer game let alone a FOOTBALL game? And over something so innocuous.

The game does definitely feel more babyish now imo to those great days of stats, more stats and no speech bubbles.

[yadda]

Im affraid your wrong.

The player interactions are here to stay! And no way of removing them. And this repetitive player interations is how its going to be in the game. The same convo, the same questions, the same answers with every player in the world. Didnt SI see any prob with this? For me kills the game. I can take almost anything else but your chats with players has to happen in this version as far as i can see to be successful or keep morale etc up. And that means having to deal with players in this repetitve way.

No mate, I'm not wrong. Player interaction, with all parts of FM, is steadily improving. At least there is player interaction in the game now. Had you read my post, properly, you might realise why it is repetitive. This is a game. There are limitations to how realistic you can make a management simulation, still make it a game and retail at a reasonable price. Again, it's the demo, you don't like it, stop telling people they are wrong.

[higgins]

No mate, I'm not wrong. Player interaction, with all parts of FM, is steadily improving. At least there is player interaction in the game now. Had you read my post, properly, you might realise why it is repetitive. This is a game. There are limitations to how realistic you can make a management simulation, still make it a game and retail at a reasonable price. Again, it's the demo, you don't like it, stop telling people they are wrong.

I think that the question should be another one.

Is it so important to have player interaction in the game?

Or it would be better to improve other areas of it?

[Kazza]

For FM to be a good simulation, in my opinion, it must have player interaction along with the other additions, otherwise you could just strip it bear to match day. I like all the added aspects of the game makes the game feel more immersive.

I am finding that player interaction is an excellent part of the game but and it's qualified but - it appears to be flawed.

I have been experimenting with the interaction and it feels limited in some aspects. You can revisit and get a different reaction or even a half apology but there's still a lot of over reaction.

It could be that you need to be in post for awhile before the players start to respond positively, regardless of your rep. Anyway I will continue to play around with it and see how it devlopes. I am sure if it is a flaw then a little bit of recoding to tone down the players "over excited" comments will be made.

K

[stonegate]

Player and media interaction seems to be a bit convoluted at the moment.

If you need to experiment with answers then there is something wrong with the way the responses are worded at the very least.

[Guest aaron70]

I have to agree. After playing the demo for a few hours it is back to FM10 for me. Player interactions are frankly embarrassing. I seriously just can't face that repetitive baby talk over and over again. I guess I will see how it all turns out after the game has been patched fully and how people are reacting to it.

I applaud SI for trying, but this really does not seem to work. The rest of the game looks great to me, but PI is a real killer. FM10 is worth another year anyway

Example:

Best Striker: I want to leave

Me: I want you to stay, so we can win things,

BS: I can't wait that long.

Me: I will look at it at the end of the season.

BS: I can't believe how much you are disrespecting me. I can't work with you.

Me: K. Lets talk about this later.

BS: I better leave before I say something I regret.

*Sigh*

[stonegate]

I have to agree. After playing the demo for a few hours it is back to FM10 for me. Player interactions are frankly embarrassing. I seriously just can't face that repetitive baby talk over and over again. I guess I will see how it all turns out after the game has been patched fully and how people are reacting to it.

I applaud SI for trying, but this really does not seem to work. The rest of the game looks great to me, but PI is a real killer. FM10 is worth another year anyway

Example:

Best Striker: I want to leave

Me: I want you to stay, so we can win things,

BS: I can't wait that long.

Me: I will look at it at the end of the season.

BS: I can't believe how much you are disrespecting me. I can't work with you.

Me: K. Lets talk about this later.

BS: I better leave before I say something I regret.

*Sigh*

Pretty much my feeling.

With all the good sim/role playing games out there maybe SI should ask for some outside help for interactions

[crouchaldinho]

On the same page of GD, we have one thread saying FM11 is the worst ever, and another saying it is the best version yet!

[cruiseylee]

No mate, I'm not wrong. Player interaction, with all parts of FM, is steadily improving. At least there is player interaction in the game now. Had you read my post, properly, you might realise why it is repetitive. This is a game. There are limitations to how realistic you can make a management simulation, still make it a game and retail at a reasonable price. Again, it's the demo, you don't like it, stop telling people they are wrong.

Well Its just my opinion you are wrong then. CM/FM has been fine without player interaction to this detail for nearly 20 years. And I also believe you are wrong as SI themselves have said many times they will not bring features in till they are happy with it. But Im affraid they have this very wrong. Its way to limited as some have agreed with me. Not just that but me T listing players and then them storming out befor they say somethign they regret also happens if yoiu ask them nicely to work on a move or work with an experienced player within your squad. And for some of the negative childish comments this game is perfect for you guys ;-)

[cruiseylee]

On the same page of GD, we have one thread saying FM11 is the worst ever, and another saying it is the best version yet!

I did take that back Crouch if you read earlier on lol. Its defo the worst feature I changed it to. Altho to me this feature is so bad it does ruin the whole game.

[panther123]

I have played Champ/football manager for a very long time, not always the new game every year but get my monies worth. I have usually got to grips with the features pretty much straight away. This game however like the original poster says "worst version"

Its repetetive, childish and not very convincing with the interaction. The whole front page is blocky and confusing. There is a lot of rubbish to sift through before getting to the game. Took over at Forest and had some strange results beat Charlton 8-1 (eight) with second string players, beat Northampton 1-0 and lost to someone lower 4-1

I know its only a demo but Im afraid things dont look as though Im gonna part with my coffers on this one

I think its a case of over complicating things

cheers

[dazbowski]

Whilst I agree it's too early to call it the wort version ever, it's certainly very frustrating and annoying. I asked my winger to try a few one two's, he said he doesn't think it'll help, i say just give it a try and he says he's going before he says something he regrets. Now he wants a transfer and has a poor opinion of me. I then chat to him again to calm him down. I'm polite all the way, he basically now hates me and has put in a transfer request and 3 other players hate me. It's a joke and IS a game breaker.

Did this not get game tested very well, or was the testers comments ignored? As it's clearly nowhere near ready.

[wally13]

Whilst I agree it's too early to call it the wort version ever, it's certainly very frustrating and annoying. I asked my winger to try a few one two's, he said he doesn't think it'll help, i say just give it a try and he says he's going before he says something he regrets. Now he wants a transfer and has a poor opinion of me. I then chat to him again to calm him down. I'm polite all the way, he basically now hates me and has put in a transfer request and 3 other players hate me. It's a joke and IS a game breaker.

I think the si guys know some of the interaction needs tweaking

[Smeemi2009]

Theres no fun factor what so ever in this game anymore. It's just so dull and boring.

[dazbowski]

I think the si guys know some of the interaction needs tweaking

I think it's more than tweaking tbh, it just doesn't work at the mo. Most situations you find yourself in that require talking to the player end up with problems. Which in turn then leads to the game becoming unstable due to the knock on effects with other players!

[dazbowski]

Theres no fun factor what so ever in this game anymore. It's just so dull and boring.

There is something in that, it does seem year on year it becomes more technical and spreadsheetish (is that a word?) seems more mechanical and not free flowing. Yes lots of "new" features (which the set-piece creator is most certainly not one, but i'll moan about that elsewhere) but less feel and joy.

[Pidge]

I think the si guys know some of the interaction needs tweaking

Then why wasn't it? These last two years SI have outdone themselves in terms of finding new and interesting ways to add depth to the game, but they have let themselves down in not testing these innovations enough. Then we are told that it's a "step in the right direction". Well which year are you planning on reaching your destination? Maybe you should call us when you have a finished game SI.

[MerseysideRed1]

anyway if people still cant have a constructive argument without getting nasty or personal then that doesnt really bother me.

Alright let this be the constructive argument. I've spent... a long time reading the thread -.- although not everything...

Now I have been playing cm/fm for 20 years. Since i was 12/13 years old and I was one of the people who bought it on the release day. I have been one of its biggest fans. This game put me on the road to managment in which IRL I became the youngest coach/manager in the country when at 16 I took over from a manager who had given the team up. I had been helping out there as goalkeeper coach from age of 15 and became the youngest manager in the country. The team was u12s and I was only 4 years older than the players. I was in local and national press so I owe alot to this game although even from the age of 11 I was showing signs of becoming a manager by playing PBMs(play by mail management games) And even won league in 1st season aged 11 v adults lol

Congratulations, then.

Anyway my past not that important but I just wanted people to know how much I think of this game and how my views I feel are valid and hopefully something is done to save my fav game.

I... don't think it needs saving, but I'll get to that.

In recent versions I have felt the game to over complicate things and feel so different regarding the display and interface. Also things have been brought in that I feel ruin it.

Well fm 11 has lost it now. I took over Barnet on the demo last night and normally manage them. Anyway I think SI have left the game ideas/features in the baby creche section.

I tranfer listed 4 players. All with different personalties. I did it as Barnet need money and these guys were either on high wages or of high value. All came to see me with the same question. why am I forcing them out. Then I was given the same possible answers for each players same question. I answered the same way. That the club needed the money etc. All said I am disrespecting them lol? Then I gave same answer and I got the same answer to all of them. Then there final answer was they better leave before they say something they regret? All repeating eachother word for word. Within 20 mins of playing the game I had come across something that for me makes the game unplayable.

I... doubt that your inability to produce a satisfactory result in your player interaction means that the game is unplayable. That's the first real step, I'd think. I mean, you could easily bypass it by not responding to it, or just accepting it. Besides, why are you bothered that they are unhappy since you're shipping them out anyway?

So you told them the club needed money. You do realise that even if they have different personalities, they all will probably be selfish enough to put themselves first. So logically speaking, they will say you're disrespecting them, because to them, they believe they are good enough to stay at the club, and by forcing them out you're disrespecting their abilities, by selling them just for the club, since there are a lot of other players you could sell instead. Get the idea?

The final answer bit is normal, understood, it happens all the time in most conversations. However there of course, is a limit to the difference. Besides, it's a new feature. They probably can't code a million different responses that mean the same thing? I think we have to be fair here. But to be fair I think they'll probably do that anyway. Covering their own behinds.

Some people prob wouldnt mind this sillyness and repetitive feature but for me it makes it feel like you have taken over the under 5 local team. The answers the players give is so immature and stupid it just makes me go erm... I feel embarrassed. player interaction to this level should never of been allowed into the game untill it was perfect. This is just silly.

Under 5 local team? I think... that's a bit exaggerated, to be perfectly honest.

Immaturity... I mean, let's be fair, a lot of them think for themselves rather than club, to be honest, so the natural response is that you're trying to disrespect them, as they've mentioned.

And I think the idea firstly is to release it in one version and gather responses. It's a risk and reward system, this market. They take the risk of putting it in this version, and if it gets a favourable response then they'll improve on it for the next game. What's the point of putting all your hard work into something that everyone'll eventually hate, regardless whether at 100% or 5%?

Now on the tactics section if you dont like the new set up on fm10 you can change it back to the set up you liked before. (Brill Feature) Anything with options and things that give you choice is awesome. But there is no option to go back to the prev feature. Not just that but the continuous and repetitive way you speak with players is annoying just after speaking with 2/3 I felt embarrassed I only had the same options to let the player know the meeting was over. Now Im not saying SI should of brought in 20/30 different ways to say bye or end of meeting. Im saying the game doesnt suite this interaction yet.

Like I said, it's a new initiative (For lack of a better term). They aren't going to spend 3 weeks coding a thousand different ways to say bye. Considering most of it is just, alright that's all I really have to speak to you about today. So yeah.

In every case the players said they dont want to play for me anymore just cos I said they was being unprofessional. The club pays there wages and I told them the club needs to sell them for funds. Nothing personal on them. I am sure there will be many other things like this in the game and for me anyway its just too immature.

Well again, understand the player. We live in a world where everyone puts themselves first. So obviously they believe that you're being personal to them, in the sense where you're disrespecting them. And disrespecting people is the most plain way anyone can figure out if a person is unprofessional or not. Because as a manager, you technically should respect every player, no?

For me its back to fm 06(the best version) and fm 10 is just playable and currently giving that a try.

Never played the version, so... no comment. apologies.

1. Last match view!

Was 1st on fm over 15 years ago! Just a little tab to check your last game. I used to use this all the time to remind myself if I had saved the game and just came back to it what had just happened and who played and also to see ratings/form etc. Now I have to click on club,fixtures,and then the match I want to see.

Fair enough point. Although I doubt....umm... okay put it this way, to me, it's not very major. Gives you the option to both see your last game, and if you lost that, the last game you won. Like Liverpool can first watch their 2-0 loss to Everton, and then the 1-0 win over West Brom and decide what changed and how to fix the problem.

2. Scout your own club.

This feature was awesome. First brought in about 10 years ago. You could scout your own club and on the report you would see all the players picked for games. There rating in the last 10 games and also if the team won/lost/drawed/goals/conceded. If a player played in the reserves it also showed that and also had the same stats. It also showed when that players last game was and you could click(1 click) on that tab and see which players at a glance played most recent and which ones have not played for a while. Now to a point the game still has this feature but its tucked away and harder to view and you cant do it as simple as you could like this option. You also cant team view it on your whole club like you could back then.

I think fine, it'll be sensible for it on the reserve team. For the first team, you kinda should know who you picked for most games, eh?

(sorry if this sounds blunt but to me it's kinda like you're being a bit reminiscent )

3. Position your own players!

I think this feature was also brought in 10 years ago. I think on the 00/01 version. Then it dissapeared forever? For some of you who didnt play that version this was one of the best features ever.

You could tell all 10 of your outfield players where you wanted them to be when the other team had the ball in certain areas. You could also place all 10 of your players where you want them when your team had the ball in certain areas. Making the game have a feel of great realism and making you feel you have done shadow training with your players. (for some who dont know this its what many coaches/managers do on the training pitch to let the players know where there wanted at certain times positional wise and also to gain the shape the manager is after)

If you got this wrong like tell your players to push up and drop back to much from certain area squares they could lose fitness and condition. brill feature this was. Not just that but you could tell that speedy striker to stay on that last defender and never get what you get now of your speedy striker taking up wrong positions or your slow striker being the man looking to run in behind.

Have you been playing CM2010 by any chance? This feature is there. Useful but sometimes I think for people not used to the feature it does get a bit confusing...

4. Set instructions in matches given to players! (This is a feature that I cant believe has never appeared in cm/fm)

ok so lets say its half time in a friendly and you are making 11 changes at half time. Now if you want to play the game properly and have your players having all the correct instructions this is going to take ages! Especially if most of them are new or trialists. You have to weigh up the game/away or home/attack or defend and it will take some time.

Why oh why has nobody brought in a tab that has each player have set instructions they have when they play or when they come on as a sub. You could even have a tab of away or home instructions that you give that player and ofcourse you can edit if you change your mind on any of this. Would be best feature they could currently bring in.

I'd imagine this'll take a whole load of coding to solve the problem? Maybe one for a future but I think at the end of the day it'll ultimately differ in each match, in terms of what you tell different players. The idea is that as a manager you would be telling each player what you expect them to do in a game, rather than going "same as last time".

5. Seeing tactics/player instructions from prev games and your AM. (something also taken out from earler versions)

I have seen alot in the forums complaining about not being able to set your reserve/u18 team tactics to how you want them to play. The only current option is use current match tactics.(which means copy 1st team) Not use tactics you set in the res/u18 tactics screen as some people think. In older version 00/01 and 01/02 you could look back at your reserve games and see what the AM did. You could also see what instructions he gave to each player which was awesome. As when you then bring that player into the 1st team you knew what he had been playing with in the reserves and he would hit the ground running as he would be playing the same way as he did in the reserves. It seems mad you cant now tell your AM how you want them to play and have to rely on what he wants (which you cant see now) or you have to ask your res/u18 to play same as the last 1st team match which could be completely the wrong tactics for the res/u18s next game. Also does copy 1st team mean copy all the player instructions also? I have never found this out yet.

I thought you would be able to watch your reserve team matches whenever the news items come up? I'm sorry I don't really know too much about this (particularly because I don't really use it......)

Now to a few minor things

6. Pens taken and scored. On older versions you could see on a players stats how many of hes goals have come from pens and how many he had taken! Brill little feature. Ofcourse you can go to the league pens info but I want to see on hes profile page like before.

I guess that's what the penalty taking attribute is for? To help you decide who to pick? And maybe backroom advice too?

7. Player Celebrations.

Not sure if other people find every player celebrating the same way every time annoying but I do. On the older versions ofcourse you had no 3d. I suppose the development of the game this was always going to be tough to please people. For me the 2d was brill. Alot of the celebrations/goals was in your imagination. And for one this for me is better than watching better graphics of players doing silly things. now I know i dont have to watch in 3d but there is alot of things on the 3d I love. Also when you know something is there its hard to resist. just a shame the players dont celebrate more when they score in last minute compared to pulling a goal back. I mean having a players giving it the finger and punching air when 4-0 down??

This... will definitely take ages on coding. I mean, they are definitely trying but unfortunately on this kind of game it's going to take a long time to but everything together. Because each action is one code, including even the smallest of actions... even giving the finger for example. It could run up to 100 lines of coding for one small action that you may not really see...

Im sure I have missed some things out but those are some things that has been on my mind and which I can think of now. Would be very interesting to see peoples views on all of this ;-)

That... sure was a lot of things you can think of right now....

[dazbowski]

Then why wasn't it? These last two years SI have outdone themselves in terms of finding new and interesting ways to add depth to the game, but they have let themselves down in not testing these innovations enough. Then we are told that it's a "step in the right direction". Well which year are you planning on reaching your destination? Maybe you should call us when you have a finished game SI.

Slightly harsh but a good point nonetheless, if each year a new feature is put in as a "work in progress" then the year after it starts to get better, but in the meantime another new feature is added and that's a "work in progress" and the year after gets better. Add this *20 for every set of new features and you have a never ending circle each year with lots of unfinished features.

Hence why the game never seems finished these days IMO

[stonegate]

I do think that in the next version there should be some way of delegating more to other members of staff. Yes I know you can do so now on the likes of press conference etc.. but often this is detrimental to your managerial skills. I.e when your ass man tells your players that they are not good enough at half time when you are 4 - 0 up.

The pace of the game is too slow for many people who especially those who have played the cm versions. Adding repetitive features doesn't help. Lets not forget that a managers job is primarily to select players, chose formations and oversee training. ( at big clubs the manager often doesn't get fully involved in training and lets the coaches do their job)

[Pidge]

Slightly harsh but a good point nonetheless, if each year a new feature is put in as a "work in progress" then the year after it starts to get better, but in the meantime another new feature is added and that's a "work in progress" and the year after gets better. Add this *20 for every set of new features and you have a never ending circle each year with lots of unfinished features.

Hence why the game never seems finished these days IMO

It's the attitude more than the practise that annoys me. It suggests that they actually approach new developments with the opinion that it doesn't matter if they aren't as good as they can be. It wouldn't be so bad if these new developments weren't a cornerstone of the game's marketing. If you're advertising the fact that there's a new player interaction system ( a great idea) then test it to destruction with people removed from the development enough to give you an end-user's perspective. It feels like SI rely on the end-user to test their game for them. As I've said, the ideas are good and as I've said in other threads, the game is overall another step up in terms of quality. But the "step in the right direction" mentality, irritates me beyond belief.