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FMS Community Thread / Episode III / When Liverpool Attacks


tenthreeleader

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Creative do rock Terk, my PC sound system (which is from which I listen to all my music) is all creative, from the soundcard to the 5.1 speakers. If you do go for the ipod touch, please, please, please throw away the atrociously crap earphones it comes with and buy a proper set, one's that do not leak sound, and produce a much better quality sound.

Sennheiser noise cancelling earphones are what i have (not for an Ipod, for my HTC Touch HD) and I can watch movies on the tube (central line) and have it on the lowest sound setting and still hear everything clearly.

Get these babies

That goes for everyone with an iPod btw

Can I just say thank you Wegason. They are the kind of earphones I've been looking for seeing as how I don't like the standard Ipod earphones which scream MUG ME at people. I did vow never to use play again but found them through one of the traders on there. so cheers:thup:

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France and Germany have held their relative positions though (compare those sides to the Italian, Spanish, Dutch, English, Brazilian and Argentine side of the day, and then do the same with the current teams), Scotland hasn't.

Yes, there is variation, but it's still a worrying time for Scottish football.

I wouldn't say they've held their position, ten years after winning the World Cup France are in a play off to see if they can qualify, that's quite a fall (15 years ago they didn't even qualify). Germany have waddled through tournaments with awful teams, thanks to good management. Italy went through 8 tournaments making it out of the group stage once, Holland didn't qualify for 82 or 86 with Van Basten and Gullit in the side.

As for Scotland, with Souness etc they qualified and then dropped at the group stage. It would be nice to qualify, but it's not as if they're massively underachieving. Also, they've missed three world cups, last time that happened was 62-70, a period which saw an all Scottish team win the European Cup, so it happens and afaic it's not a big deal.

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I won't say weaker. Just different.

Perhaps in the past, players were more robust and could therefore focus on being skillful. Nowadays its very much a tactical and fitness game ahead of outright flair and individual skill.

But I wasn't born then, so I probably know nothing. :p

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I'm not really talking about performances, but individual quality. Germany have had some exceptional players this decade (Kahn, Ballack, Klose), the Dutch likewise (VDS, Cocu, RVN) and the current French side are still quality (Lloris/Mandana, Diarra, Ribery, Benzema). Scotland's team has a spine of Gordon, Caldwell, Fletcher and McFadden on a good day. Can that compare to Alder, Mertesacker, Ballack and Klose? Or even James, Ferdinand, Gerrard and Rooney?

It may be down to nostalgia, but world football seems to be a lot weaker than twenty years ago. How England could use Barnes, Waddle and Lineker right now...

I definitely agree with that part, it's a lot weaker now, but, imo, prtly because of the mercenary nature that players now have, back then their seemed to be pride in winning a cap and keeping a cap. Perhaps the amount of caps handed out to very average players has caused people to take their place for granted.

It's unfair to judge Scotland on a goldon era though, it goes back to the Ivory Coast thing I mentioned earlier, ten years ago nobody knew a single Ivory Coast international, now they are household names. Back in the 50's Hungary were the best in the world, now they are whipping boys. Even take Northern Ireland as an example, not so long ago we were going 13 games without scoring, the next minute we had the top scorer in Euro qualification in our team.

It's swings and roundabouts, Scotland will come back, Ivory Coast will fall from grace and Hungary will probably do it again one day. Actually, Hungary came third in the 2022 championship ;) Put your bets on now.

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How sad is it that I'm deriving almost as much pleasure from trying to create a 1024-team set of superleagues (its 3 leagues - Europe, Americas and Rest of the World) as I have done from actually playing the game?

I've been doing it nearly 3 days and I've only just finalised the 20 teams which make up European Division 1 (although I know the nationality make-up of all 50 divisions, and have placed 224 teams so far)

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I wouldn't say they've held their position, ten years after winning the World Cup France are in a play off to see if they can qualify, that's quite a fall (15 years ago they didn't even qualify). Germany have waddled through tournaments with awful teams, thanks to good management. Italy went through 8 tournaments making it out of the group stage once, Holland didn't qualify for 82 or 86 with Van Basten and Gullit in the side.

As for Scotland, with Souness etc they qualified and then dropped at the group stage. It would be nice to qualify, but it's not as if they're massively underachieving. Also, they've missed three world cups, last time that happened was 62-70, a period which saw an all Scottish team win the European Cup, so it happens and afaic it's not a big deal.

We had a much much better team in the 60-70's than we have now, they're almost lightyears apart. Scottish club sides were actually competing in Europe and being - relatively - successful. In those days a Scottish team could go to say Sweden or Norway and win five and six nil, today it's the other way around. There is so much wrong in the Scottish game today, coupled with the fact nations that were once considered smaller have improved, that it very much is a big deal and there is no easy and fast solution.

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How sad is it that I'm deriving almost as much pleasure from trying to create a 1024-team set of superleagues (its 3 leagues - Europe, Americas and Rest of the World) as I have done from actually playing the game?

I've been doing it nearly 3 days and I've only just finalised the 20 teams which make up European Division 1 (although I know the nationality make-up of all 50 divisions, and have placed 224 teams so far)

It's not as sad as creating your own country with sides you made up as a kid when playing subbutteo ;)

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Here's an interesting debate I've been having. My friend has been asking me for the best sports headline I've ever seen, on a back-page. For me, there was only one winner (it's due to the Sun running a 4oth birthday thing, etc etc)

Super Cally Go Ballistic, Celtic are Atriocious

I just thought it was wonderfully ingenious, and it had me in a fit of laughter for days afterwards :)

Anybody else got an opinion?

You utter utter b...

That headline still haunts me to this day.

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Celtic_1967

I do apologise, but I just thought it was a magnificent piece of journalism - nothing against your lot at all

Am I right in thinking it was a Cup game at Parkhead? It earnt John Barnes the sack?

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Can I just say thank you Wegason. They are the kind of earphones I've been looking for seeing as how I don't like the standard Ipod earphones which scream MUG ME at people. I did vow never to use play again but found them through one of the traders on there. so cheers:thup:

Hey dude, no problem at all. Its not just that IPod earphones scream mug me (though thats less true nowadays as everyone has them) it is that they are poor quality and leak sound atrociously, people on the train using them ensure that the person next to them hears it as clearly as they do (which isn't that clear :p)

Those Sennheiser's are amazing.

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Those Sennheiser's are amazing.

Seconded. I've been using them for the last few months and I'm a fan.

Worse than leaking earphones, though, are the people who use speakers to listen to music on the train/bus/metro/street/wherever, alienating anyone at a 10 m. distance. What makes it worse is the horrid quality of both the sound and the "music" that generally provokes it (reaggeton, anyone?). I've been tempted to throw both phone, speakers and listener out of a wagon more than once. :mad:

On a totally unrelated note, I've just lost a FM game with 69% possession and 12 shots at goal to none, thanks to a penalty kick in the 95' (with only three minutes of stoppage time given by the ref). Somebody please find me a phone with speakers to smash to smithereens...

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Were the opposition managed by Alex Ferguson?

Would be a bit out of his depth I'm afraid :D. Although I think I saw one of the sprites move from the bench towards the linesman just before the penalty, as if having a chat with him. Hm, maybe Sir Alex is selling DVDs with managing lessons and someone learned a bit too much from them...

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Celtic_1967

I do apologise, but I just thought it was a magnificent piece of journalism - nothing against your lot at all

Am I right in thinking it was a Cup game at Parkhead? It earnt John Barnes the sack?

Thats correct, what made it worse is that I'm fairly sure Caley were a Division one team at the time. Kudos to the headline writer though. I've often wondered if he made that headline earlier in the week and then prayed for an upset!

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That is my idea of paradise. I'd probably buy FM10 just for the editor.

Well, I've got 374 of the 642 European teams placed now, including all the top 2 levels:

Division 1

1 Manchester Utd

2 Chelsea

3 Liverpool

4 Arsenal

5 Real Madrid

6 Barcelona

7 Seville

8 Villareal

9 Lyon

10 Bordeaux

11 FC Bayern

12 VfB Stuttgart

13 Schalke 04

14 Internazionale

15 AC Milan

16 Juventus

17 PSV Eindhoven

18 FC Porto

19 Rubin Kazan

20 Dinamo Kyiv

Division 2A

1 Standard Liege

2 Everton

3 Olympique Marseilles

4 Rennes

5 VfL Wolfburg

6 Werder Bremen

7 AEK Athens

8 FC Zurich

9 AS Roma

10 Udinese Calcio

11 AZ Alkmaar

12 Sporting Lisbon

13 Dinamo Bucharest

14 CSKA Moscow

15 Spartak Moscow

16 Rangers

17 Atletico Madrid

18 Mallorca

19 Fenerbahce

20 Shakhtar Donetsk

Division 2B

1 Anderlecht

2 Aston Villa

3 Tottenham

4 Lille OSC

5 Toulouse

6 Hamburger SV

7 Hertha Berlin

8 Olympiakos

9 Fiorentina

10 Palermo

11 Ajax

12 FC Twente

13 Benfica

14 CFR Cluj

15 Zenit St Petersburg

16 Celtic

17 Valencia

18 Deportivo

19 Besiktas

20 Galatasaray

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Oh, and some incomplete examples of the other levels:

Division 3A (1 of 3 divisions)

1 Club Brugge

2 BUL1

3 CRO2

4 CZE1

5 DEN2

6 Portsmouth

7 West Ham

8 AS Monaco

9 Nice

10 Hannover 96

11 VfL Bochum

12 Maccabi Haifa

13 Lazio

14 Cagliari

15 Heerenveen

16 Nacional

17 Unirea Urziceni

18 FC Moscow

19 Saturn Mosk Oblast

20 Racing Santander

21 Trabzonspor

22 Dnipro Dnipropetrovsk

Division 4A (1 of 5)

1 AUT3

2 Westerlo

3 BLR2

4 CRO3

5 CYP3

6 CZE3

7 Bolton

8 FIN3

9 Nancy

10 Borussia Moenchengladbach

11 Panionos

12 HUN2

13 Napoli

14 NOR2

15 POL2

16 Maritimo

17 Gloria

18 Krylya Sovetov

19 Aberdeen

20 Osasuna

21 Xerez

22 SWE4

23 Bursaspor

24 Tavriya Simferopol

Division 5A (1 of 8)

1 AZE2

2 Germinal Beerschot

3 BIH3

4 BLR4

6 BUL6

6 CZE7

7 DEN8

8 Sheffield United

9 Recreativo Huelva

10 FIN5

11 OFI Crete

12 IRE2

13 KAZ1

14 Roda JC

16 NOR6

16 Terek Groznyi

17 SVK5

18 SWE5

Division 6A (1 of 14)

1 ARM3

2 AUT10

3 CYP5

4 CZE13

6 Cardiff City

6 Rayo

7 Metz

8 Oberhausen

9 Asteras Tripolis

10 Brescia

11 LIT2

12 MTN6

13 Volendam

14 NOR13

16 POL10

16 Uniao de Leiria

17 SER11

18 SVN10

I've done the 16 of the top nations now in Europe, there's 37 to go, but the last 25 have 8 or less teams I think so they won't take much time at all

The nation distribution is done vaguely based on FM club reputations and a small amount of artistic licence, and a lot of randomisation. The clubs are ranked on a formula based on 5 years league results (scaling down over time), although I decided to fiddle a bit with them in places - the two main places being Leeds being included, and upping Juve from their 5th placed ranking to 3rd so they got into Division 1. I'm contemplating switching Shakhtar and Dinamo Kiev too

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Celtic_1967

I do apologise, but I just thought it was a magnificent piece of journalism - nothing against your lot at all

Am I right in thinking it was a Cup game at Parkhead? It earnt John Barnes the sack?

2000 Scottish Cup. Celtic 1-3 Caley at Parkhead. Didn't do Barnes any favors.

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2000 Scottish Cup. Celtic 1-3 Caley at Parkhead. Didn't do Barnes any favors.

Best headline ever - there simply isnt a debate on that one, and probably the best result in Celtic's history purely for getting rid of Barnes.

Ex Liverpool players used to make great managers....now we look to Staunton and Barnes and laugh :(

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Brian that sounds like

a) a staggering ******** of work

and

b) absolutely brilliant

It is a lot of work, but I can do a nation of around 14-18 teams in about half an hour now (the big-5 nations took a fair bit longer)

I decided to include 14 clubs in scotland for instance....2 in D2, 2 in D4, 3 in D5 and 7 in D6.

Aberdeen and Hearts got into D4, Hibs, Dundee U and Motherwell in D5 and Kilmarnock, ICT, Hamilton, Falkirk, St Mirren, St Johnstone and Dunfermline are in the bottom division.

I think there's two more countries with 16 teams, then they gradually get smaller

The problem I've got is everything I've done so far is in Excel....I can work that....I'm not sure about the editor, and i don't know how much I can do with regard to playoffs and cups in it yet.

Yes, seriously, I've spent 3 days creating a **** off giant spreadsheet with football teams on it

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Have you done anything with the clubs nationalities Brian or left them all as is? Because it may cause problems if you change them and the good thing is, from what I've seen by creating a much smaller international club league, is that for instance I had Rangers and Celtic in a Euro league and even with the SPL running, they both still qualified for Europe at the end of the season.

You can have play offs, but they are as far as I know not very workable particularly if you are thinking of having like a play off the divisional winners/runners up etc I don't think that will work, eg how it works in Spain. Cups are fairly easy to create really, but you might want to manually set dates for those.

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Have you done anything with the clubs nationalities Brian or left them all as is? Because it may cause problems if you change them and the good thing is, from what I've seen by creating a much smaller international club league, is that for instance I had Rangers and Celtic in a Euro league and even with the SPL running, they both still qualified for Europe at the end of the season.

You can have play offs, but they are as far as I know not very workable particularly if you are thinking of having like a play off the divisional winners/runners up etc I don't think that will work, eg how it works in Spain. Cups are fairly easy to create really, but you might want to manually set dates for those.

I've not done anything in the editor yet.

My thinking was to leave nationalities as they were, and just move the clubs to the (renamed) Wallis and Futuna Islands, which I hoped would mean no international competitions.

From what I've seen on the Editors form, thats the only nation that doesn't play internationals and can be used for this, which is slightly annoying as I'd rather have 3seperate nations for each super league, as I think I'm going to have to set the "levels" as follows - I've also added promotion/relegation ideas:

European D1 (20 teams, 4 down)

European D2 (2 x 20 teams, 2 x 2 up, 4 x 2 down)

European D3 (3 x 22 teams, 3 x 2 up + 2 playoffs, 3 x 5 down)

European D4 (5 x 24 teams, 5 x 2 up + 5 playoffs, 5 x 6 down)

European D5 (8 x 18 teams, 8 x 3 up + 6 playoffs, 8 x 4 down)

European D6 (14 x 18 teams, 14 x 2 up + 4 playoffs, 0 down)

Americas D1 (20 teams, 4 down)

Americas D2 (2 x 22 teams, 2 x 2 up, 4 x 2 down)

Americas D3 (3 x 24 teams, 3 x 2 up + 2 playoffs, 0 down)

Rest of the World D1 (20 teams, 4 down)

Rest of the World D2 (2 x 20 teams, 2 x 2 up, 4 x 2 down)

Rest of the World D3 (3 x 22 teams, 3 x 2 up + 2 playoffs, 3 x 5 down)

Rest of the World D4 (5 x 24 teams, 5 x 2 up + 5 playoffs, 0 down)

Which will mean you have to play all the European leagues to get any Americas leagues etc...

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No you can't use extinct nations it seems. Not sure about Pays Basque or GB haven't looked at them. The one thing you have to be careful of is that in the first season some teams are hard coded (I think) into Euro competition. Best thing is probably to do it a little bit at a time and test it out. See you in a 100 years ;)

But yeah leaving the nations as is actually works and doesn't seem to have any side affects.

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I assume you can't remove leagues using the league editor? If you could...just remove the Contintental competitions and the unused leagues?

You can remove leagues, thats what I did in the Faroes for the FMS game, and replaced them with something else. You can't edit the continental competitions at all though, which is a shame because that would be ace being able to bring the back the Cup Winners Cup and stuff.

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You can remove leagues, thats what I did in the Faroes for the FMS game, and replaced them with something else. You can't edit the continental competitions at all though, which is a shame because that would be ace being able to bring the back the Cup Winners Cup and stuff.

That is a real shame - the continental competitions are certainly going to be weak as hell with the kind of league Brian has planned.

Though if Brian's leagues weren't a part of a continental competiton, there wouldn't be too much of a problem - given that most people would only load the leagues that encompass the whole pyramid. The only competition that would stick around would be the Club World Championship - and surely you could just reduce the reputation of that to 1 so its of little importance?

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That is a real shame - the continental competitions are certainly going to be weak as hell with the kind of league Brian has planned.

Though if Brian's leagues weren't a part of a continental competiton, there wouldn't be too much of a problem - given that most people would only load the leagues that encompass the whole pyramid. The only competition that would stick around would be the Club World Championship - and surely you could just reduce the reputation of that to 1 so its of little importance?

Well no because if he doesn't change the nations then the sides will still qualify for the Champions League/Europa league based on their league positions. Of course as you say if he hasn't loaded a European league it is irrelevant for that part.

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Well no because if he doesn't change the nations then the sides will still qualify for the Champions League/Europa league based on their league positions. Of course as you say if he hasn't loaded a European league it is irrelevant for that part.

The question is - is it possible to have a league that doesn't involve a continental competition?

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SI have said you should be able to use extinct nations. I'm guessing with the others, I know people "activated" both national teams in FM09 so I presume it's possible with FM10.

Well at the moment it's not possible in the editor - although apparantly there was a way round it posted on the editors forum pre-patch. But certainly, you can't add a continent for extinct nations and they aren't playable. Same goes for Great Britain, I just checked ;)

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We had a much much better team in the 60-70's than we have now, they're almost lightyears apart. Scottish club sides were actually competing in Europe and being - relatively - successful. In those days a Scottish team could go to say Sweden or Norway and win five and six nil, today it's the other way around. There is so much wrong in the Scottish game today, coupled with the fact nations that were once considered smaller have improved, that it very much is a big deal and there is no easy and fast solution.

That was my point. Other than pump a hell of a lot of money into the domestic game, there isn't much you can do. Management, imo, won't make that big a difference, Burlye or not they probably wouldn't have qualified and probably won't qualify for the next tournament. Yes it's a big deal, but it's not a big deal because nobody can, realistically, do anything about it.

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The question is - is it possible to have a league that doesn't involve a continental competition?

That was, I thought, the beauty of using the Wallis and Futuna Islands, though the OFC champions league (O-league) is in the game (I have no idea how the hell you'd get to it without the editor though)

I've fiddled around, and moved the top-20 european clubs into a European D1, and got the game to load with them in. No Europeans cups, just the O-League mentioned above. I'm not sure what that will do...I don't think the W&F Islands actually compete in it, but I don't know. It might take my NZ teams, which would be a bit annoying but I could live with that....as long as it doesn't swipe Barcelona and Man Utd to play a tournament against the finest Fiji and Vanuatu have to offer...

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