1 striker formations with this engine

[big daddy]

I have been testing tactics and formations last few days, What is it with this me engine that makes 1 striker formations so much worse than 2 man.

seems like wide players cutting in are not working as well as they should.

wingers do better, but this is not fm 1995.

and before you ask for pictures of my tactic , I have tested every variation possible

I have been able to make a few 4231 ones work fine, but 433dm formations are struggling big time.

Then I put in a simple 442 and watch my strikers kill the game with easy hattricks.

so to put it simply 442 =op, 4231 doing okish and 433 is underperforming in 21.3

Just me ?

[prysiu]

I'm doing quite well with 4-1-3-1-1. It's not a game breaker, but thanks to that the game isn't boring. I have hands full of work with all non-tactic manager responsibilities to squeez the best performance from my team.

[Johnny Ace]

I just ran a sim & Rob Lewandowski scored 53 goals, Gnabry 20 with 18 assists as an IF outscoring Coman as a winger 

Next sim & he's 12 in 4 so strikers & wide players can score no worries

I could try a 4-4-2 to see if he'd scored more 

[Experienced Defender]

2 hours ago, big daddy said:

and before you ask for pictures of my tactic , I have tested every variation possible

With a wrong tactical approach, any tactic/variation will be wrong. 

If you are going to blame the ME while refusing to post a screenshot of your tactic(s), then I fear I'll have no choice but to lock this topic. 

Because this is the tactical section of the forum and is therefore meant for tactical help and advice, rather than moaning about the ME (or anything to that effect).

If you don't want to post the screenshot but are still insisting that something is wrong with the ME, then please create a topic in the relevant section of the Bugs forum and report whatever "bugs" you believe the ME has.

Thank you.

[sporadicsmiles]

I have had wonderful success with a tactic based around a 433, and played some lovely football at the same time. So I think the idea that one striker formations are worse than two striker formations is just false. 

However, it is entirely possible you are just not them up correctly. Which is not a dig at you. Everyone has a set of formations and tactics they just get. For me it is a 433 (with a lone striker) with a split press and fast transitions. I feel intuitively what to do, and have used it so much I understand exactly what everyone needs to be doing within it. On the flipside, I am really crap with any formation that has an AMC. I do not know what to do with him, I do not have the same intuitive feel for how to create space and move players into that space. The space I like to use is where the AMC goes. So I never can set up a tactic with an AMC that works for me. Thus AMC tactics are broken? Nope, I am just not good at setting them up. I do not have the feel for them. 

Lone striker formations are tricky, because you have to really think about how the front 3 or 4 are interacting with each other. Who is making space? Who is using that space? Who is providing assists? how are they assisting? Who is scoring? How are they scoring? 

The real question is that if you are good at setting up a 442 that feels OP, why do you want to set up a 4231 or a 433?

[Big Yellow]

no problems here with my sole striker

 

 

[denen123]

18 hours ago, big daddy said:

I have been testing tactics and formations last few days, What is it with this me engine that makes 1 striker formations so much worse than 2 man.

seems like wide players cutting in are not working as well as they should.

wingers do better, but this is not fm 1995.

and before you ask for pictures of my tactic , I have tested every variation possible

I have been able to make a few 4231 ones work fine, but 433dm formations are struggling big time.

Then I put in a simple 442 and watch my strikers kill the game with easy hattricks.

so to put it simply 442 =op, 4231 doing okish and 433 is underperforming in 21.3

Just me ?

Not just you. 

However, much of it is tactical, to be fair. Rest is the potency of a 4-3-3, overall. 

[Ronnieekelund]

21 hours ago, big daddy said:

I have been testing tactics and formations last few days, What is it with this me engine that makes 1 striker formations so much worse than 2 man.

seems like wide players cutting in are not working as well as they should.

wingers do better, but this is not fm 1995.

and before you ask for pictures of my tactic , I have tested every variation possible

I have been able to make a few 4231 ones work fine, but 433dm formations are struggling big time.

Then I put in a simple 442 and watch my strikers kill the game with easy hattricks.

so to put it simply 442 =op, 4231 doing okish and 433 is underperforming in 21.3

Just me ?

Spot on I've played a 442 pfa and cfs since the start of fm 21. Any other tactic I put together just isn't as potent and I always end up going back to the 442. In real life top teams don't often play with 2 strikers as you lose control of midfield. In fm seems to be the opposite and is extremely OP.

[Guest]

Its just not true at all....people are having massive success with 1 striker formations and strikerless formations too.

Just on the front page of this forum are three threads with lone striker formations where people are having a lot of success.

[nully29]

4231 gegenpress dominates out-of-the-box. No need for any tweaks.

[pheelf]

I can't say that I agree with the conclusion that the 4-4-2 is inherently better than any other formation in this ME.

The formation is just a representation of how your team will seek to position themselves when they don't have the ball, nothing more, nothing less.

Provided you have a good understanding of how to create and utilize space when attacking then I don't see any reason why you can't make any formation you choose work.

Thinking of a striker as a 'lone' player is perhaps where the problem lies. You aren't going to get a striker to score goals consistently without thinking about how the team as a whole attacks.

Taking a scatter gun approach and throwing together different combinations in your front 3 and hoping to stumble upon one which works isn't really going to help you.

Simply put, some strikers aren't cut out to lead the line alone. Maybe being in a pair enables them to focus on their strengths whereas being upfront on their own exposes their weaknesses.

I feel a player in that position needs to either be a very strong Target Man type that can hold up the ball when he is outnumbered and feed players around him or an intelligent runner who can with their movement drag defenders out of position for their team mates to exploit (False 9 type). Either way, you are only going to get the best out of them if you get players around them that help them fulfill their role within the tactic. Even in a flat 5-4-1 I'd want a strike partnership somewhere within the tactic and to tailor my tactical instructions so that they could regularly linkup.

Best Regards

[Domus Clamantium]

IMO it's a tactical issue. Post a tactic, but I know you haven't stuck with one in a while because you're desperately scrambling to find something that works even mid-season.

Think anew, clean slate. Have a solid tactical plan, make something you think should work then post it on here, Play a different save while you wait for this discussion to dissect and bear fruit.

[Orion_]

I disagree with OP.

I had great success with 4-2-3-1 formation with classic wingers, not inverted wingers or inside forwards, just simply 2 wingers.

Now I'm playing 4-4-1-1 which is technically formation with 1 striker and doing pretty well. I could play it as 4-4-2 but I like that one striker being dropped as SS since I think he's more contributing without the ball defensively and with the ball he can either connect the play or come to the box being almost like second striker. One thing worth mentioning in my 4-4-1-1 is that my AM and ST are not aligned in pitch vertical axis but are positioned like two central forwards but one is dropped to AM spot. I find it working better in my tactic than putting them one behind another.

[Reedy_1988]

11 hours ago, nully29 said:

4231 gegenpress dominates out-of-the-box. No need for any tweaks.

I tend to agree, I've chopped and changed formations in my current save now as I've struggled to find consistency. My current tactic is set up from using the default gegenpress 4231-wide but I've toned it down ever so slightly and modified 2-3 roles just to try make it a little less aggressive.

My pressing forward - attack. Is currently a goal machine. Something quite satisfying seeing my £150k transfer listed signing (Sam Surridge) rip up the championship.

[Pelz]

16 hours ago, Orion_ said:

I disagree with OP.

I had great success with 4-2-3-1 formation with classic wingers, not inverted wingers or inside forwards, just simply 2 wingers.

Now I'm playing 4-4-1-1 which is technically formation with 1 striker and doing pretty well. I could play it as 4-4-2 but I like that one striker being dropped as SS since I think he's more contributing without the ball defensively and with the ball he can either connect the play or come to the box being almost like second striker. One thing worth mentioning in my 4-4-1-1 is that my AM and ST are not aligned in pitch vertical axis but are positioned like two central forwards but one is dropped to AM spot. I find it working better in my tactic than putting them one behind another.

Also been using a 4411, with a target man up top, winger on the left, attacking mid on the right and my CAM fulfilling all sorts of duties... works really well. Variety in attacks and goals scored is really pleasing to watch, 

Common mistake with single striker formations, and I’ve been guilty of it in the past, is not setting up the support around them properly. That and focusing most on pace and getting in behind rather than the physicality required to hold the ball up and give players in support the time needed to contribute effectively in the final third. 

[Orion_]

2 hours ago, Pelz said:

rather than the physicality required to hold the ball up

If I'd have to give one general advice for getting good striker. Get very physical one. If he has very good physical the rest is just an addition. I had great success with purely physical strikers in my lower league saves. Finishing is overrated by a lot. For real finishing is one of the last attributes I'm looking at on strikers.

[Domus Clamantium]

58 minutes ago, Orion_ said:

If I'd have to give one general advice for getting good striker. Get very physical one. If he has very good physical the rest is just an addition. I had great success with purely physical strikers in my lower league saves. Finishing is overrated by a lot. For real finishing is one of the last attributes I'm looking at on strikers.

agreed

strength agility and balance are really important whatever type of striker you have. i normally filter those to be high for the league i'm in when i'm scouting for a new striker, like 14 for example strength and balance in EFL1 makes it really difficult for defenders to take the ball off him which is why Cristian Garcia did so well for me since FM18 at that level. only 12/13 pace and acceleration but any save i did and signed him he'd score more than 20 a season and get loads of assists but others in my team that had similar finishing off the ball anticipation but not those physicals didn't do nearly as well.