Europa League? where are you?

[CFuller]

I should clarify that the game I've been sacked on is FM16. For some reason, I've never really been able to perform particularly well in the last two FMs.

I'm actually quite good at FM13, as you can probably tell from my Romford and Dagenham stories!

[edtheguy]

Well, guys, I've just been sacked for the first time ever on Football Manager. It's happened to me on Championship Manager before, but not FM. Until now.

On one hand, I'm feeling very depressed because the club that has just sacked me is extremely close to my heart.

On the other, I'm feeling quite excited because it's sure going to make an excellent story! I'll hopefully be able to reveal more over the summer!

Whoa - every good story needs a struggle... right? A new CFuller story in our future? I can't wait to see what happens!

And 10-3 - It definitely isn't the golden age for Minnesota sports at the moment but I can almost understand how you are feeling. I grew up in New England in the 70's and 80's and the only sport I didn't like was basketball. Which was a shame because the only team worth anything was the Celtics, the Red Sox were still cursed, the Patriots were a joke and the Bruins were the Canadien's whipping boys and just good enough to make the playoffs and then lose. The most successful team I had for years was the UMaine baseball team - which routinely made the CWS only to get knocked out in consecutive games (usually by a 21-2 score or so.)

Of course all of that preordained failure meant that anyone following those teams was watching because they actually liked the sport, not just winning.

I still get a kick out of watching all of the idiotic sports fans running around here now who have no idea just how entitled they are.

[Terk]

Well, guys, I've just been sacked for the first time ever on Football Manager. It's happened to me on Championship Manager before, but not FM. Until now.

On one hand, I'm feeling very depressed because the club that has just sacked me is extremely close to my heart.

On the other, I'm feeling quite excited because it's sure going to make an excellent story! I'll hopefully be able to reveal more over the summer!

I got sacked recently, took over a club, drew my first game then lost 11 on the bounce. I've been sacked a lot on both CM and FM. I'm generally quite rubbish with occasional interludes of success.

[edtheguy]

In my 'main' save in FM14 I was sacked 8 times before finally holding onto a job for a few years.... in Slovakia. When I had success in '15 and started getting job offers I wondered if it might be a new feature....

[CFuller]

If I remember correctly, in one of the CM3-era games, I was sacked by Arsenal after losing in the Charity Shield - my first game in charge! Then again, that was about 15 years ago, when I was still a kid, so maybe my memory's playing tricks on me.

As far as FM is concerned, the closest I've come to being sacked before today was probably in the FM16 demo, when I was having all sorts of problems at Fulham. In hindsight, though, we were actually doing quite well compared to the real-life Fulham side!

[BenArsenal]

Lost track of the amount of times I've been sacked on FM. Does that mean I'm not a good player

Nah it just means the teams you manage are rubbish.

I think I've been sacked a few times too. Chelsea notably with fickle Roman, and a few international jobs because I committed the crime of not winning a trophy.

[mark wilson27]

Could someone post Lawros predictions for me please as I'm away from the laptop till Saturday night cheers

[Bagpuss]

Could someone post Lawros predictions for me please as I'm away from the laptop till Saturday night cheers

done note he has no midweek game one currently so you cna figure out when and where it appears

[tenthreeleader]

He's leading. I think we should just forget he made the pick.

[Celtic_1967]

Guys, I need somewhere to unload something. If you don't mind I'm going to leave it here.

I'm in a bit a of a panic tonight. My wife has a cancer screening tomorrow. She found a lump. The doctor say she thinks it's probably not serious (but it's serious enough to get checked). The last time a lump was found the doctor knew straightaway it was just a swollen gland but this time it's a referral to the urgent screening unit.

I'm really scared. I can't stop thinking about what happens if it is cancer or what happens if she doesn't survive. I couldn't mentally cope with her being gone.

So, we're doing this again next week. I hate this sh*t.

I'd much rather it was me than her. She doesn't deserve this stress.

[mark wilson27]

Sorry to hear that Celtic, you know were all here for you if you need to vent

[Terk]

So, we're doing this again next week. I hate this sh*t.

I'd much rather it was me than her. She doesn't deserve this stress.

That's awful, dude. Hope everything goes well.

[copperhorse21]

I'm really sorry to read about your situation. I know there are support groups for family members here in the USA. They have helped a lot of people in your situation. I don't know if they have them where you live. I won't pretend to know what you are enduring right now. The threat of cancer sucks and having a group of people who know exactly how you feel to swap stories and share insights might be helpful to everyone because you might say something that someone else needed to hear and vice versa. Obviously, if you post stuff here, I'll read it and do my best to be supportive. I hope your news is another false alarm.

[Celtic_1967]

Thanks guys.

I've arranged the whole day off work so that I can spend time with my wife regardless of the outcome.

I'm trying to take comfort from the fact that I don't think she is any of the high risk groups etc. but knowing Cancer is basically indiscriminate doesn't help. I'm not sure if there are any support groups in the area but I struggle to address my own mental health issues in any way (medication or talking therapy) so whilst in theory I'd love to speak to someone about it, I know in practice it's very unlikely to happen.

I guess we'll have to cross our fingers and hope for the best.

[tenthreeleader]

Be strong, Mikey. We're here. You and your wife are in my prayers.

[mark wilson27]

Thanks guys.

I've arranged the whole day off work so that I can spend time with my wife regardless of the outcome.

I'm trying to take comfort from the fact that I don't think she is any of the high risk groups etc. but knowing Cancer is basically indiscriminate doesn't help. I'm not sure if there are any support groups in the area but I struggle to address my own mental health issues in any way (medication or talking therapy) so whilst in theory I'd love to speak to someone about it, I know in practice it's very unlikely to happen.

I guess we'll have to cross our fingers and hope for the best.

Well as I've said if you need to vent here or by pm feel free. It might be easier to do that over the internet than face to face mate

[BenArsenal]

I hope everything goes well Mikey. Fingers crossed.

[Terk]

So, that was a game of football...

[salkster2102]

Sods law is that we will go and lose at Bournemouth now

[edtheguy]

Sods law is that we will go and lose at Bournemouth now

Well the team sheet is certainly interesting.....

[salkster2102]

A nice win I thought would have been closer but not complaining. Still gives us a chance of finishing above Man Utd.

Bit of a rant now about referees. How on earth is Johnathan Moss a Premier League official?! Such an inconsistent performance that may end up costing Leicester the title. The Vardy red card I reluctantly agree with though i've seen penalties given for them. The West Ham penalty though I think more penalties need to be given for these incidents, Reid went down rather quickly for the amount of contact there was. The shove by Huth for Leicester's 1st goal was more of a penalty than that. Then if he's going to give a penalty for that then Huth should have had a penalty late in the second half who was being prevented from jumping. The actual penalty was a bit soft but Carroll should never have gone for a shoulder to shoulder challenge there. It's about time video replays were introduced into the game to help give a fairer match out.

[tenthreeleader]

It's about time video replays were introduced into the game to help give a fairer match out.

As we learned last night in our National Hockey League playoff game here in Minnesota, sometimes video replay overturns a correct call made by the match official. Our team stopped a goal-scoring opportunity and the referee correctly waved play dead, yet the opposition was given a goal on video replay that flies in the face of both rule and reason.

I've said it before and I've also said it in print. Replay transfers the capacity for error from the field to the press box. It is not the cure-all you might think. As much as we might not like it, perhaps the best thing is simply to acknowledge that there is going to be human error in all forms of officiating, while we try to eliminate it to the greatest extent that we can.

[BenArsenal]

And Arsenal cocks it up again. It's not even funny anymore.

I fear to say it, but maybe not making the Champions League might be the wake up call we need.

[tenthreeleader]

I fear to say it, but maybe not making the Champions League might be the wake up call we need.

That may not stop United from inertia this summer.

[tenthreeleader]

And couldn't help but smile as Oxford United earned promotion this afternoon.

[Terk]

A good friend of mine is an Oxford fan. Delighted for him.

[BenArsenal]

What a day! Man that was crazy!

[CFuller]

Tottenham came 3rd in a two-horse race!

We're always going to finish above them, aren't we? Even when we mess up, they mess up even more!

[CFuller]

So, what do our resident United fans think of the FA Cup win - and Mourinho becoming your new manager?

This may surprise you, but I was actually quite glad you won. You've got some exciting young talents - Martial, Rashford, Lingard - even though you don't always play exciting football, and it was about time that you won the FA Cup again. That, and Alan Pardew was an unlikeable g*t even before he started his dad-dancing.

Louis van Gaal may have been much-maligned, but he has delivered United a first major cup post-Fergie and deserves at least one night to celebrate his win before he's booted out. I found it utterly classless that, within a couple of hours of the final whistle, the press blurted out that their beloved Mourinho was on his way to Old Trafford.

I really do fear for Manchester United now. Hiring José Mourinho is no surefire way to win the title anymore. This season has shown that while his pragmatism works more often than not, his ego will eventually overinflate and his tyrannical ways may destabilise the team. Just ask Dr Carneiro and Chelsea.

Then there's his infamous reluctance to bring out the kids. For all of King Louis' failings, he at least stuck to the United tradition of blooding youth players like Rashford, Borthwick-Jackson, Fosu-Mensah and others. Mourinho only cares about short-term results as opposed to long-term development, so all that good work could go to waste, and I fear even Rashford may struggle to get into the first-team again while Mourinho's in charge.

That said, it'll be very intriguing to see Guardiola's City play Mourinho's United. I'll be rooting for City all the way, and they'll also be my favourites for the title. Sorry, guys.

[mark wilson27]

The win was good even though Palace were unfortunate in some dire refereeing decisions. All three goals were good and Lingaards was damn fine.

As for the reports about Mourinho I think it was pretty bad timing (probably on purpose) by his agent to release the news to the press just after we had won. I agree with you that the young talent we have got coming through have been the highlight of the reign under LVG however it is a worry that if Mourniho does come in he might screw that all up. Just look at some of the youngsters he overlooked at Chelsea.

In my opinion LVG's time was up even before we won the FA Cup and the story about Mourinho as like a lot of the press have reported a Champions League space is a minimum for the board and club. LVG's play is pretty damn boring and the stats have shown we have scored the lowest goals for our side since the Premier League began. Mourinho might improve that but just don't know which Mourinho will turn up. First stint at Chelsea Mourinho who I liked and thought was a breath of fresh air or the second stint Mourinho who seemed to come in with a chip on his shoulder.

I cant see us putting up a challenge for the title next year and it is probably Man.City's to lose but if next season is anything like this season you never know Liverpool could win it... hahahahaha

[git2thachoppa]

A glaring problem for me with Van Gaal is yeah, he's used the kids, but he's spent 6 figures when it turns out he didn't need to make most of those buys.

He and Moyes before him were supposed to overhaul the squad by cutting the deadwood and bringing in a few players. Instead, Moyes spent £70m or something on two players who play the same position and got rid of no one. Van Gaal came in, got rid of the deadwood, got rid of a few great players, and bought a whole new team! Now the next manager will have to do the same all over again!

Mourinho would've been fine a couple of years ago, but he's turned into something else recently. A headline could come out this year saying Mourinho's been diagnosed with a mental issue and I wouldn't be surprised. If he's as angry at the world now as he was at Chelsea, he can only be a disaster. Every club says they have the best fans in the world who expect entertaining football so I'm not going to say Man Utd should expect that, but complaints about boring football might not exactly improve under Mourinho, plus there's the worry he won't play the youngsters and just by a new team. In fact he just sounds exactly like Van Gaal.

If Van Gaal had finished 4th, maybe he should've had another few months. Mourinho is one of many managers who pop up every year that are top class and available. One year it's Mourinho, another year it's Guardiola, or Klopp, or Ancelotti, or Scolari, or Van Gaal... and they might not even be up to the job. I'm not a fan of the idea of making Giggs manager. He should get experience elsewhere first. It's not like he's going to turn them down and stay at another club if he does a good job.

I mean City have got Guardiola and it's like oh now they'll win a load of titles and do well in Europe, which kind of ignores his (relative) record with Bayern and also is a huge assumption anyway. He doesn't scream assurance to me.

The F. A. Cup alas doesn't mean anything because no one is really trying to win it, so what's the value? It's worth about as much as a pre-season friendly tournament in that sense. A look at the finals of each year for the past decade or so has a running theme. It's not even about going to Wembley because you do that at the semis. The clubs don't care and everyone will forget it by Monday. I can't even name you the winner of last year's cup. Like the League Cup, it's used as a plaster by struggling teams to tell themselves they're coming good. Liverpool did it years ago when they beat Birmingham or someone, everyone made it sound like they were going to "kick on" and win the league now.

So in that respect I wouldn't have minded Crystal Palace winning it, it would've been nice for them. See, that's how bad the cup is - I just want someone else to have a go on it, and it makes me sound very condescending.

[copperhorse21]

You brought up many good points about Jose and his mental state. I don't think he'll be good for man utd, but I don't think man utd are as interested as much in winning as they are in making money. It pains me to write it, but that is what I believe. I got the sense that under Sir Alex and David Gill the football team came first and the economics second. Under Ed Woodward it seems that decisions are done more for commercial brand management and I can't see a way back. Real Madrid is about commerce first. Barcelona less so. Sort of like the philosophy of the playing style is more important than the revenue generated. It has a sense of being driven more by soul. If Man Utd wish to continue in this direction, it can't be stopped. However, they will never restore the glory achieved under Sir Alex and David Gill because the team came first. The same could also be said for Busby and his teams. Jock Stein and his at Celtic. Mou made reference to a dynasty as Sir Alex has done, but he doesn't have the heart for it. Meaning, his ego is ugly and he must win. He can't handle losing and loses badly. Sir Alex lost and hated it, but he didn't seem to be an excuse maker. At least Southampton and Swansea seem to know who they are and where they stand. They find managers to work within that framework and keep the philosophy moving in the same direction. Winning isn't a philosophy, it's an end result. A byproduct of a system. Under Van Gaal the basic system of possession contradicted that of Moyes' defensively cautious attitude. Moyes' also contradicted Sir Alex and the attacking style prevalent before the money dried up to force him out sooner. If Man Utd do choose Mou, they will add another philosophy. Too much fragmentation to remain a stable environment. I liked Man Utd because they weren't like Real Madrid and the Italian teams who change managers constantly. It's harder to remain a supporter when cash is king and I want the spirit of the soul. In the end, it appears an empire while crumble by trying to please too many who don't care about the soul of the game.

[tenthreeleader]

This change needed to happen. Van Gaal's issues, like those of Moyes before him, were tactical. United looked more like a Serie A team at times this season than a Premier League team -- and amazingly, what was arguably the best defensive team in the Premier League still couldn't get a set piece defended at critical moments. Possession-based football has never been United's forte and some of his substitutions seem to defy description (playing Ashley Young forward until extra time, for example). Though he deserves credit for Lingard's addition today, sometimes he just left me shaking my head, and that shouldn't happen since he's supposed to be the expert.

You can also argue, that despite Van Gaal allowing players like BoJack and Fosu Mensah and Rashford to play, that they wouldn't have gotten the opportunity were it not for United's injury issues. The money spent on Martial meant he would play but does anyone seriously think any of those three others would have seen much of the first team without the injuries United had?

The thing of it is, I don't know that Mourinho is necessarily going to be much of a change from Van Gaal in terms of his philosophy, though I do expect a much sharper team tactically and a team that won't beat itself like this team seemed to at times.

And yes, Copper, all teams are businesses. Winning begets money, and with the debt load the Glazers have loaded onto the club, the Champions League is essential to the business plan. Van Gaal didn't make it and that will cost the club. Mourinho is being brought in to be The Special One.

[salkster2102]

Have always disliked Man United with me being a Liverpool fan but this whole ordeal with Van Gaal and Mourinho is very disrespectful and lacking a lot of class. This is a situation that was always going to happen after Fergie retired. With good times there must also come bad times every club experiences it and it will happen to Arsenal when Wenger leaves. Look at the players they have at the moment and ask yourselves how many of them would get into the City, Arsenal and Spurs team? League standing wise they are probably about where they should be with their squad with the exception of Leicester. Even with Fergie they had some average players but that was one of the great things about Fergie being able to make average players look good. As soon as Fergie retired, at a convenient time I might add, they could no longer attract best players. Moyes struggled to attract any good players and had to settle for Fellaini who should be playing the egg chasing sport. Even Van Gaal hasn't set the world alight with a better reputation than Moyes to bring players in.

Is it all going to change under Mourinho? Maybe there's no guarantee he will do much better or bring better players in with them being in the Europa League. I'm actually surprised Mourinho is able to deflate his ego enough to go to a Europa League club. His track record with staying at a club for more than 2 years is pretty poor to say how many trophies he has won. Man United are finding out like Chelsea have that changing the manager constantly does not work. I doubt a Man United under David Gill would have treated Van Gaal this was and for me Ed Woodward has to take some of the blame for all of this. As good as United doing commercially of late, Van Gaal has been given barely any job protection since he has been in the job and I actually feel sorry for him with how he's been treated with the media who as always lack class and respect. I know a lot of United fans who don't want Mourinho. I don't blame them as that club is slowly turning into a club like Chelsea.

[git2thachoppa]

Imagine if Van Gaal managed to sell De Gea. Utd would be midtable, no cups, and he'd be gone early and Mourinho would already know the team. Maybe it would be a blessing in disguise, obviously if De Gea still moves.

Jose might be a disaster, but who knows he might really love Man Utd and mellow out, and I wouldn't be surprised if Utd won the league easily now. I'm not saying I expect that, it just wouldn't be a surprising outcome. It could be the start of something beautiful.

And now it's several Football Managers in a row where Man Utd fans can take charge of their fave team and do a satisfying overhaul job. At least it would be if Man Utd players weren't supermen in the game. And if FM wasn't crap now. *controversy*

[tenthreeleader]

I'm sorry, Salk ... I can't resist.

That said, you're right in at least one regard. Gill wouldn't have done it this way. Woodward is a big reason for the problems United face.

[mark wilson27]

I'm sorry, Salk ... I can't resist.

That said, you're right in at least one regard. Gill wouldn't have done it this way. Woodward is a big reason for the problems United face.

Hahahahaha....seen loads of them and they make me giggle....Just say some of the Scouse fans at my work have been absolutely battered

[Panpardus]

I hope we don't get JM.

Said it before Moyes was appointed last time and I would actually rather him get another shot at it or give it to Gary Neville!

Sarcasm aside, I can't stand him, I don't like the way he plays, even in his first spell at Chelsea, Inter or RM, the guy is just a complete ******! I would rather LVG see out his last year, wait for Klopp to get fed up at Liverpool next season and then swap over!

If JM does come, Mata will go, there's a luxury we wont be able to afford! Is Mata that good? Maybe not but he is the only one that can set anything up in our team at the moment and knowing what JM is like, would you go to United, knowing that he is there?

JM just seems to burn bridges I'd rather they go after someone different, he might get us into the CL next season, but he isn't one thats going to build a dynasty, he just isnt that sort of manager and I would love to be proved wrong, but I just cant see it.

Maybe Simeone from Atletico, but I doubt he would have any intention of going to MU.

Rafael Benitez would be better!

Frank De Boer

Rudi Garcia

I think Giggs needs another couple of years and maybe at another club, a decent one to cut his teeth into, in saying that he has seen how it is done, then seen how you don't do it, will he have the tactical nous to be able to get the team to create and score.

[tenthreeleader]

I think the reason Mourinho sold Mata was that he thought Oscar was a better player. But the problem I see is that Woodward has purchased a stable full of number tens with only one place to play them.

Giggs is a manager of the future, I think. There is too much at stake to hand the club over to him in a year where a second failure to qualify for the Champions League would mean a world of hurt. Manchester United needs a manager who can win now, and of the managers out there, Mourinho is the best at doing that.

[git2thachoppa]

a second failure to qualify for the Champions League would mean a world of hurt.

The winner of the Champions League now gets half the bottom club in the Premier League. If this was next year, Aston Villa would be getting more than Real Madrid.

The Champions League is going to be a nice luxury for the big clubs, but they're not going to mind financially missing out every so often. It's going to go back to being about part of an elite tournament rather than something the club badly needs.

[tenthreeleader]

For the fans, the UCL is about winning. For a club the size of Manchester United, it's about even greater global exposure and image, which leads to sponsorships and multi-level international marketing. Which, in turns leads to (even) more money.

Those stories that came out this winter about sponsors being unimpressed with the football? Those were the things that mattered more to ownership. Failure to reach the biggest stage leads to dissatisfaction, to fewer sponsors and to real issues at board level.

[copperhorse21]

Just saw the headlines and the PR photo coming out of Manchester reminded me of this song nearly immediately. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBecM3CQVD8

Sympathy for the Devil by the Rolling Stones.

[CFuller]

After days of speculation, I'm just glad that

. It feels like United have been

for

(from home). Sadly, this will not be

we see the press conduct a

.

The way United have conducted this appointment has not been

, but I'd be a

about it, so I'll just let them

. I'm looking forward to

's third season, when he makes his

, cries about

, and has his

.

I have a feeling it'll be a case of

and

for United fans at the end of next season, particularly if the

get their way. For fans of the non-Manchester clubs, it'll almost certainly be

.

[copperhorse21]

I bow in honor to you CFuller.

[CFuller]

I'm quite a fan of the Rolling Stones, as you can tell.

I'll admit, though, that I wasn't aware of some of those songs before I looked up the Stones' discography. I had no idea, for instance, that they covered "I Just Want To Make Love To You".

[Offspring8]

Man United are finding out like Chelsea have that changing the manager constantly does not work.

Sorry Salks but that was enough to bring me back from the proverbial FMS graveyard!! That statement could not possibly be further from the truth; you're right about Chelsea constantly changing managers, however Chelsea are the most successful English team of the last decade and have won more major trophies than any other English club. That's not my opinion as a fan of the club and I'm not saying it in an arrogant way, I'm pointing it out because it's a fact (call me Rafa).

Managerial stability is only craved for much the same reason that Chelsea are disliked across the country - because the media say so.

Mourinho will be fantastic for United. If I were a United fan, I wouldn't care about that fact that it could go wrong after 3 or 4 years. He will put them back on the map in terms of realistically challenging for honours and football is primarily about winning games and trophies.

As much as I love the guy, he certainly has his flaws and United fans will begin to see the drawbacks to his style after 2 years or so. That being said, I find it funny that United's rivals' fans are somehow trying to paint this as a bad move for the club. They've made a good decision and he will prove that over time.

On a personal note I now have a begrudging like for Manchester United, which is not something I ever thought would be possible. Having Juan Mata and now Jose Mourinho means that I hope they do well and if I could hand pick a team to finish second behind Chelsea every year, they would probably get the nod!

[tenthreeleader]

I'm quite a fan of the Rolling Stones, as you can tell.

I understand that their next tour will be called "Steel Wheelchairs".

I'll get my coat

[salkster2102]

Sorry Salks but that was enough to bring me back from the proverbial FMS graveyard!! That statement could not possibly be further from the truth; you're right about Chelsea constantly changing managers, however Chelsea are the most successful English team of the last decade and have won more major trophies than any other English club. That's not my opinion as a fan of the club and I'm not saying it in an arrogant way, I'm pointing it out because it's a fact (call me Rafa).

Managerial stability is only craved for much the same reason that Chelsea are disliked across the country - because the media say so.

Mourinho will be fantastic for United. If I were a United fan, I wouldn't care about that fact that it could go wrong after 3 or 4 years. He will put them back on the map in terms of realistically challenging for honours and football is primarily about winning games and trophies.

As much as I love the guy, he certainly has his flaws and United fans will begin to see the drawbacks to his style after 2 years or so. That being said, I find it funny that United's rivals' fans are somehow trying to paint this as a bad move for the club. They've made a good decision and he will prove that over time.

On a personal note I now have a begrudging like for Manchester United, which is not something I ever thought would be possible. Having Juan Mata and now Jose Mourinho means that I hope they do well and if I could hand pick a team to finish second behind Chelsea every year, they would probably get the nod!

Is there success over the past decade because of their constant changing of manager though? Don't get me wrong I respect the amount of trophies they have won over the past decade (and slightly envious of it) but this can't be because of the constant changing of manager. I'd like to see where they would be without Abromovich. Not just because I dislike the club just for curiosity reasons.

Managerial stability is mostly fiction these days. The only reason people crave it is because of the modern examples of Ferguson and Wenger. Chopping and changing manager is part of the culture of the game and happens across many sports. Things like Fergie and Wenger for what they have done for a club are just a flash in the pan like Leicester winning the league. People and the media just build it up because they see it as hope but it happens less and less these days because of money and the building unrealistic expectation that is being built in football.

I wouldn't build hopes up with Mata and Mourinho being reunited at United. He got rid of him for a reason as he doesn't like lazy wingers. I wouldn't be surprised to see Mata leave at the end of the Euros.

On a personal note welcome back to FMS!! Note that my opinion isn't an attack on yours or as a rival fan of Man Utd, just as a football fan in general if you get my drift.

[Offspring8]

I don't think it's because of the constant changing of manager, I don't think the constant changing of manager has harmed it. For that reason, I would say that I disagree with the statement that the constant changing of manager doesn't work. I don't think that matters as much if you have a good back room team running the club and a core of good players, which are both things that I think Chelsea have been very lucky to have (Marina Granovskaia is just about the most vital cog in the Chelsea machine and has rightly earned a reputation as the most powerful woman in the sport).

Although we qualified for the Champions League before Abramovich bought us, I wouldn't be narrow-minded enough to say that things would have been the same even if he hadn't bought the club or even anywhere close. He's as big a legend as anybody to the fans and I still take my hat off to him and think he's done an incredible job with the club. Loads of teams have been bought by rich owners over the past 15 years - Malaga, Monaco, Anzhi, PSG, City - but I would say none of them have done as well as he has, although PSG and City both also have a good set of owners and have obviously also done very well. City's owners stand out for me as particularly brilliant, but hey I'm getting sidetracked.

I agree with your points on stability and also on the Mata/Mou reuniting saga. I think he knew that Oscar was not as good a creator as Mata, however Juan does the worst impression of a defensively aware footballer I've ever seen at the top level and if you don't have the ball, I find he offers little to nothing in terms of spacial awareness, pressing, team shape and turning over possession. Oscar on the other hand has this very odd mix of being an extremely good...defensive...attacking midfielder, if that makes any sense whatsoever.

Haha thanks pal, I still lurk just so that I can spit my dummy out every once in a while - I'd like to think I've known you (in a strange online-forum-sense) long enough to know that your opinion wasn't any kind of personal attack and I didn't see it as such. Hopefully I haven't come across as too much of a baby, I actually quite enjoy a conversation with someone who's opinion is quite different from mine because it makes it so much more interesting - even if it is a little risky because you risk offending someone! I still remember the time I said to Terk that I didn't quite appreciate the skill required by Formula 1 drivers. The scalding I received that day from Mr. Terk still burns just as hot today.

[copperhorse21]

Spent a few hours watching the CL Final to see why Spanish teams win more trophies than any other league. Must say that I was impressed by the teamwork of Simeone's side as well as his tactical adjustments throughout the match including substitutes. I finished watching the match and wondered if they will keep churning out teams that play together with no name, no nonsense players making up the majority of the squad while English teams will pick the best players but struggle with the teamwork that makes up that essential 10% to overcome the superstars.

It seems like Bayern's methods to achieve success are far simpler. Buy the best players of your closest competitors.