Tony Pulis and his Stoke Long Ball Anti Footballers.

[johnnyyakuza78]

This is my tactic as it is currently and has been last season. The TIs are usually:

Route one

Play Narrower

Be More disciplined.

Get Stuck in.

PIs include:

DL: More direct

DR: More direct

WMR: Cut inside, Sit Narrower.

I tend to fiddle with it a bit depending on the opposition. I usually have one fullback which is more attacking, the left or the right, with the opposite one on defend. Then I also drop the mentality a bit if I'm winning and turn off 'Get stuck in'.

Its doing ok, I'm now 3rd in the prem after 5 games and came 10th last year. Kind of average results, but steadily getting better as I get in the players I want for the system.

The unfortunate bit is that its not quite the Pulis system I've been trying to create, everytime I get it to be as close to how I want it, it doesn't quite seem to work.. I think having 4 central defenders as fullbacks basically means you are too predictable and its quite hard to ever overload the opposition. And also I'm not really scoring enough from set pieces despite what I think is a decent set up.

[johnnyyakuza78]

Anyone else got any thoughts on this? Would still love to hear from Rashidi.

[johnnyyakuza78]

Well after going through a bit of a rough patch with my Leeds side, I thought I would take a break and try something different. So set up a quick game as Aberdeen, trying to get them to play in the exact opposite way. A bit like a low level scottish Barca. The football is so much better to watch and seemingly players are able to pull off moves that my more expensive Leeds side could never have considered. Plus, everything is suddenly so much easier!

I'd still love for one of the experts to set up a Route One game. I'm transfixed by the idea of winning the champions league with a bunch of journeymen cloggers, playing a form of football thats functional and ugly. A bit like a club side run like the Greek National football side.

So again, if Cleon, Rashidi, WWFan or Jambo or anyone fancies that challenge, I'd love to see it.

[smp20]

I'm tempted to give this a try using something similar to what i mentioned earlier in this thread.

[johnnyyakuza78]

I'm tempted to give this a try using something similar to what i mentioned earlier in this thread.

Please do! I'd love to get more takes on this idea.

[smp20]

I'm trying to think of which team to start this with. A team with a powerful forward is essential, or at least some dosh to but 2/3 players that will compliment the tactic.

Everton? West Ham? Villa? Stoke themselves?

[johnnyyakuza78]

If you can keep Andy Carroll fit then yeah West Ham. They also have Downing and Nolan. Big Sam loves some Route One Football. Burnley would also be an interesting challenge

[Jean0987654321]

Anyone else got any thoughts on this? Would still love to hear from Rashidi.

I've kinda changed my tune to this.

GK

FB(d)-CB (s)-CB (s)-FB(d)

WM(s)-CM (d)-CM (s)-WM(a)

AF-TM(s)

GK - Distribute to TM, Take Long Kicks

WM - Get Further Foward, Sit Narrower, Cut Inside With Ball, Cross Aim TM

TM - More Direct, Hold Position, Mark the DM (or if one is not present, Mark one of the CM)

AF - Roam From Position, Close Down Much Less

FB - Close Down Much Less, Cross Aim TM

I think we can allow the CMs to do their own thing. They will send it out wide for the Wide men to cross it in to the TM

And then everybody on Tackle Harder

Counter/Very Rigid

Go Route One

Pass Into Space

Much Higher Tempo

Exploit the Flanks

Play Narrower

Get Stuck In

Of course, Mama Sidibe would need some pace to get back to his normal position, but I think everything else is fine

[johnnyyakuza78]

Yes, I like that. Lately I've moved from a 4411 to a more 442 with a AF, he picks up the knockdowns in more dangerous areas.

The only things I'd change would be maybe not exploit the flanks, as I want my WMs to be coming inside near the TM, and also don't want my FBs coming forward more than necessary.

And maybe not Pass into space, unless I have a good DLC or good passing fullbacks, as its basically going to be too much crazy passing.

Btw, have you tried it out?

[Jean0987654321]

Yes, I like that. Lately I've moved from a 4411 to a more 442 with a AF, he picks up the knockdowns in more dangerous areas.

The only things I'd change would be maybe not exploit the flanks, as I want my WMs to be coming inside near the TM, and also don't want my FBs coming forward more than necessary.

And maybe not Pass into space, unless I have a good DLC or good passing fullbacks, as its basically going to be too much crazy passing.

Btw, have you tried it out?

Not yet, I hope I can start a test save with me tactic when I get home. However, Exploit the Flanks is a Tony Pulis-esque TI. You have to do that anyways if you want to cross it

[johnnyyakuza78]

ha, surely just having playing on the side of the pitch would mean you'd cross it at some point.

[Jean0987654321]

Well, here it is.

I played a friendly against River. I am Norwich and I have yet to make a transfer. Cameron Jerome marked Kranevitter, their DM, that negated some of their attack and made the shape to a 4-4-1-1 in defense. Seems to work better than the Targetganche. Crosses are all aimed at Jerome to knock down to a CM or in the wings or up to Lewis Grabban. Won 3-2

[Falahk]

This is how I lined up on fm13, the most recent time I tried to play in this manner, the only tweaks beyond what can be seen in this picture is that I encouraged the fullbacks to play more through balls (more risky passes in fm15 terms) and do more crossing, lowered long shoots on the strikers and wingers and made the gk roll it short to the defenders, who could then boot it forward (since I had no confidence in my gk's ability to do accurate long kicks).

I never really got around watching Stoke play before Peter Crouch arrived, as such I molded the roles of my forwards after how I pictured Stoke to play while he was in the team and I also looked at how Caparrós played Llorrente and Toquero......this type of setup will harm link up play, but also make sure that there is at the very least two tall lads to aim for once the ball gets lobbed into the box.

right now im very tempted to rebuild my newly promoted Sheffield United team to play a bit like this again, but this time play 4-4-1-1 using a front two more similar to Sidibe and Fuller in order to see how that works out

[shaunwwfc]

This is how I lined up on fm13, the most recent time I tried to play in this manner, the only tweaks beyond what can be seen in this picture is that I encouraged the fullbacks to play more through balls (more risky passes in fm15 terms) and do more crossing, lowered long shoots on the strikers and wingers and made the gk roll it short to the defenders, who could then boot it forward (since I had no confidence in my gk's ability to do accurate long kicks).

I never really got around watching Stoke play before Peter Crouch arrived, as such I molded the roles of my forwards after how I pictured Stoke to play while he was in the team and I also looked at how Caparrós played Llorrente and Toquero......this type of setup will harm link up play, but also make sure that there is at the very least two tall lads to aim for once the ball gets lobbed into the box.

right now im very tempted to rebuild my newly promoted Sheffield United team to play a bit like this again, but this time play 4-4-1-1 using a front two more similar to Sidibe and Fuller in order to see how that works out

You probably remember me Falahk, but I was a huge endorser of this tactic and got much fun from using it.

I would be interested to see how you tweak this for FM15 - very interested in fact, please keep me updated!

[johnnyyakuza78]

Very nice Falahk! What sort of results did you get with that tactic?

[Falahk]

Very nice Falahk! What sort of results did you get with that tactic?

I was one game away from winning the league in the first season, finishing 3rd on 71pts, this was done with the original squad (I only sold a couple of players I did not need).

in the secound season my league form is going similar, but city are playing much better then the year before so the league title is probably out of my reach...but since I reinforced and added depth to the squad over the summer im performing much better in the cups

and thats more or less how far I got into the save before I got distracted by other things

[johnnyyakuza78]

I'm going to try something similar. My head says it cant possibly work, with 6 defend roles and 4 attack.. and no support roles.. but clearly it does.. its like the epitimy of a broken team.

[shaunwwfc]

I'm going to try something similar. My head says it cant possibly work, with 6 defend roles and 4 attack.. and no support roles.. but clearly it does.. its like the epitimy of a broken team.

If the focus of the play is completely down the flanks though it is somewhat different.

[johnnyyakuza78]

Yeah, Walters is a pretty rubbish winger though, I've bought him a couple of times and thats really not his skillset (might be different in FM13). So a winger starting deep in a counter would need pace and dribbling and off the ball skills to really take advantage of the situation? Might it not work better placing them in the AML/R places?

[shaunwwfc]

Yeah, Walters is a pretty rubbish winger though, I've bought him a couple of times and thats really not his skillset (might be different in FM13). So a winger starting deep in a counter would need pace and dribbling and off the ball skills to really take advantage of the situation? Might it not work better placing them in the AML/R places?

Big no no for me. Especially in a structured setup. It would essentially be a front four that would be left completely isolated.

[johnnyyakuza78]

How can you have an isolated front 4 if you are lumping it up to them anyway?

[Jean0987654321]

They would be isolated because of that space behind them. Flat four in midfield for me. I have already tinkered enough with my system. Hoof ball works as I proved and defending is just as good as Stoke's

[shaunwwfc]

They would be isolated because of that space behind them. Flat four in midfield for me. I have already tinkered enough with my system. Hoof ball works as I proved and defending is just as good as Stoke's

So where exactly are you at with it Jean? Could you upload your tactic?

[Jean0987654321]

So where exactly are you at with it Jean? Could you upload your tactic?

Read me earlier posts. It is there

[shaunwwfc]

Read me earlier posts. It is there

What results have you had? Is it over a long period of time as previously you only mention one friendly?

[johnnyyakuza78]

Getting back to this. Would anyone say that Pulis Stoke were a high pressing side or more a stand off, keep discipline kind of side?

[dngrs]

WM - Support ( Cut inside, Sit narrower, Get Further Forward)

why get FF on a support player?

[rninejr]

Very nice thread

I'm planning to try the so called anti football after get bored playing possession-based tactic for the last 3 FM editions

But I wanna use a Wide TM rather than a TM. Is there any suggestion of any player suited for the role? Aside of CR7 ofc

[Der General]

But I wanna use a Wide TM rather than a TM. Is there any suggestion of any player suited for the role? Aside of CR7 ofc

Georgios Samaras is like the definition of WTM. Lukaku as a WTM is an interesting option, too.

[santy001]

Getting back to this. Would anyone say that Pulis Stoke were a high pressing side or more a stand off, keep discipline kind of side?

It's a difficult question to answer, there would usually be 1 player tasked with closing down the opposition where possible (the use of Richard Creswell, Mamady Sidibe and Jon Walters) which could have been in the ML/MR position or the DLF/AM position.

The rest of the team would sit back more until opponents got into Stokes half and then around 30 yards out the midfield would press as a unit with the back 4 compressed in behind.

I think its a limitation of FM at the moment that it can't quite emulate that style of play, its so passive and stand off in its approach until a team hits that certain point on the pitch that we have no real way of indicating on FM.

To look at the team at its best you probably have to look at the season Stoke reached the FA cup final as there was a 3-4 month period there where the football was at its most effective and had the right personnel in the right condition.

[johnnyyakuza78]

It's a difficult question to answer, there would usually be 1 player tasked with closing down the opposition where possible (the use of Richard Creswell, Mamady Sidibe and Jon Walters) which could have been in the ML/MR position or the DLF/AM position.

The rest of the team would sit back more until opponents got into Stokes half and then around 30 yards out the midfield would press as a unit with the back 4 compressed in behind.

I think its a limitation of FM at the moment that it can't quite emulate that style of play, its so passive and stand off in its approach until a team hits that certain point on the pitch that we have no real way of indicating on FM.

To look at the team at its best you probably have to look at the season Stoke reached the FA cup final as there was a 3-4 month period there where the football was at its most effective and had the right personnel in the right condition.

At the moment I feel like I have to agree with you. I asked the question because it seems that Pulis sets out most of his teams in a similar fashion:

A flat back 4, 4 hard working midfielders, a target man and a more mobile forward player. He tends to sit back and soak up pressure, closing down in his own half. Then launches counter attacks to score goals or win set pieces. There seems to be a bit of a difference between say his Stoke side and his Palace side, as Palace had a number of tricky pacey players that meant he didn't just lump it up to the target man.

But Ive also seen a few people mention that Stoke were often a lot more aggressive and got into other teams faces, suggesting they were a 'close down much more' team at times. I guess it would depend on the opposition.

If im honest, after this entire thread I really haven't been able to get this style of football happening and make it successful. As I've stated before sitting back and keeping shape, and hitting people on the counter, whilst at the same attempting to play a more direct form of football, seems to just end up with giving the ball away constantly and the opposition team easily being able to cope with any threat you pose. I'm still desperately trying a few things, but usually its the same results. Also difficult when you don't have the best quality players.

[santy001]

There's a formation on the forums that defends as close to how I've seen it in FM. The Apex Predator formation by Rosler defends in the most similar fashion to what I've seen. With a lot of similar principles in its set-up in that the fullbacks don't really push forward too much.

[johnnyyakuza78]

Hmm if it's the Apex tactic I just googled then that seems to be a massively heavy pressing tactic. Not quite what I was thinking

[kingjericho]

Let me post one of my favourite threads on this forum here: http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/356150-Perfecting-English-Old-Fashioned-Wideplay?highlight=barcelona+interpretation

on post 13, wwfan layered a simple template for a direct, old-school 4-4-2 that does exactly what you wish it would.

With some small role changes I think this can be replicated to the Pulis' style, which was awesome btw

[johnnyyakuza78]

Let me post one of my favourite threads on this forum here: http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/356150-Perfecting-English-Old-Fashioned-Wideplay?highlight=barcelona+interpretation

on post 13, wwfan layered a simple template for a direct, old-school 4-4-2 that does exactly what you wish it would.

With some small role changes I think this can be replicated to the Pulis' style, which was awesome btw

Oh wow I seem to remember that thread actually. Very close to what I want. Does anybody know why he picked an attacking mentality however?

[kingjericho]

Direct passing and high tempo go better with more attacking mentalities, and vice versa.

For example, if you were to create a Barcelona-like tactic, you should opt for a more defensive mentality.

In this case, direct passing, high defensive line, width from the wingers, all the things that are characteristic of the direct 4-4-2 fit an attacking mentality. Because going for a defensive or control mentality with a 4-4-2 formation that has no DM and wide, attacking wingers wouldn't be exactly what we expect from a 'defensive' tactic, right?

[johnnyyakuza78]

Direct passing and high tempo go better with more attacking mentalities, and vice versa.

For example, if you were to create a Barcelona-like tactic, you should opt for a more defensive mentality.

In this case, direct passing, high defensive line, width from the wingers, all the things that are characteristic of the direct 4-4-2 fit an attacking mentality. Because going for a defensive or control mentality with a 4-4-2 formation that has no DM and wide, attacking wingers wouldn't be exactly what we expect from a 'defensive' tactic, right?

Well I agree.. except that the point of this thread was to recreate Tony Pulis' style. And I don't think anyone would describe him as an attacking coach. He plays with a direct style, often with wingers, and tends to have a sit off and keep formation, defensive style of play. So if Tony can do it, surely I could do it too. Would I really be forced into a heavy pressing attacking game just to make it work?

[kingjericho]

If I were to recreate Pulis' setup I'd consider using the midfield pairing as 2 DMs instead of 2 CMs, just to keep things a bit more crowded in front of the defense.

Sometimes really weird setups produce decent results, but I prefer using logic into the tactics. Maybe a 2DM, 2wingers, 1AM and 1ST formation wouldn't be a bad option for what you are trying to do. But it comes down to experimenting.

I still maintain that, to me, a flat 4-4-2, or even a 4-4-1-1 does not offer enough protection at the back to be a tactic that soaks up pressure. Especially with wingers on the flanks who are more focused on running to the byline and will be caught offguard in many situations.

[johnnyyakuza78]

If I were to recreate Pulis' setup I'd consider using the midfield pairing as 2 DMs instead of 2 CMs, just to keep things a bit more crowded in front of the defense.

Sometimes really weird setups produce decent results, but I prefer using logic into the tactics. Maybe a 2DM, 2wingers, 1AM and 1ST formation wouldn't be a bad option for what you are trying to do. But it comes down to experimenting.

I still maintain that, to me, a flat 4-4-2, or even a 4-4-1-1 does not offer enough protection at the back to be a tactic that soaks up pressure. Especially with wingers on the flanks who are more focused on running to the byline and will be caught offguard in many situations.

Initially I would agree with that statement, a 442 should be overrun in midfield and not be the best at sitting back and defending. I do think there are plenty of defensive unambitious teams who line up in 442s.. or at the very least a 4411. I'd count Atletico Madrid as one for instance although can't really compare them to Pulis, except that they tend to neglect possession in favour of direct counters and keeping shape. I also am a sort of fan of Hodgsons Fulham side who lined up as a defensive 4411 with inverted wingers, when he almost won the uefa cup.

I think the trick with those systems is that the wide players come inside and make sure the centre is very difficult to play through. I've found that almost impossible to achieve with a regular flat 442/4411.

[JD nawrat]

Well I agree.. except that the point of this thread was to recreate Tony Pulis' style. And I don't think anyone would describe him as an attacking coach. He plays with a direct style, often with wingers, and tends to have a sit off and keep formation, defensive style of play. So if Tony can do it, surely I could do it too. Would I really be forced into a heavy pressing attacking game just to make it work?

The mistake you're making here is that an Attacking mentality does not mean you are attacking in play; the names given to mentalities are very plastic.

The majority of attacking tactics created are likely to use Counter or Defensive, I would wager.

[RorysRocketThrow]

Great to see this thread bumped back. Take a look at his new WBA side. There is a touch of the Stoke City's going on, and it won't be far off I guess when the Transfer Window closes.

3 of his back 4 are centre backs (James Chester who he recently signed for 8M made his debut at right back!) Darren Fletcher and Yacob are sitting in midfield (The cage) and by the time the window closes I reckon Berahino will be sold and his front two will be Lambert (False 10) and Rondon (Free role advanced forward a la Fuller). Craig Gardner is playing out wide in the old Liam Lawrence role and James McClean is the new Matty Etherington, playing as a wide left midfielder/winger. The one change I expect there is someone like Matt Phillips being brought in on the right into the old Pennant role.

Chris Brunt is an excellent dead ball player, and is obviously being shoe-horned into the side at left back simply for that reason.

[Southern Buddie]

4-4-2 - counter - structured

More direct passes, hard tackling

GK(S)

FB(S)

CD(D)

CD(D)

FB(S)

W(A)

DLP(D)

CM(S)

W(A)

DLF(S)

AF(S)

When Lawrence/Gardner type player playing WM(S) with FB(A) behind him. When playing 4-4-1-1 DLF(S) and AP(A).

[johnnyyakuza78]

Great to see this thread bumped back. Take a look at his new WBA side. There is a touch of the Stoke City's going on, and it won't be far off I guess when the Transfer Window closes.

3 of his back 4 are centre backs (James Chester who he recently signed for 8M made his debut at right back!) Darren Fletcher and Yacob are sitting in midfield (The cage) and by the time the window closes I reckon Berahino will be sold and his front two will be Lambert (False 10) and Rondon (Free role advanced forward a la Fuller). Craig Gardner is playing out wide in the old Liam Lawrence role and James McClean is the new Matty Etherington, playing as a wide left midfielder/winger. The one change I expect there is someone like Matt Phillips being brought in on the right into the old Pennant role.

Chris Brunt is an excellent dead ball player, and is obviously being shoe-horned into the side at left back simply for that reason.

Yes I've noticed West Brom have reverted to Pulis style quite a lot more this season. I did read an article on his changes somewhere but I can't seem to find it. I did pull out one on the changes he made to the Palace side:

http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/news/features/talking-tactics-how-tony-pulis-plotted-crystal-palace-barclays-premier-league-survival.html

Again reverting to a solid 2 lines of 4 and a target man and a more mobile forward behind him. His wingers at palace were really pacey and tricky however which maybe makes a little bit of a difference but the basic concept was the same. I think at WB this year he possibly has a more workman like midfield, occasionally playing Morrison. McClean is clearly the flair player there. Is Lambert starting every game?

As a side note in the game (FM14) Pulis is listed as playing 4231-Long, Balanced. His Palace side in that game is set up in a 4-2DM-3-1 formation with an obvious target man and inside forwards I think. Its actually a formation I've always found very hard to play against.

[johnnyyakuza78]

The mistake you're making here is that an Attacking mentality does not mean you are attacking in play; the names given to mentalities are very plastic.

The majority of attacking tactics created are likely to use Counter or Defensive, I would wager.

The thing is, Attacking mentality still brings out a lot of things I don't want selected in this tactic. It relies on high pressing and a high line, and no matter what anyone says every time I've played attacking mentality my side plays like an attacking side. Now I could of course make the relevant shouts to crowbar that mentality back to something more defensive.. stand off, drop much deeper, more discipline, low tempo.. but at that point what is even the point of selecting an attacking mentality? Surely by then its the same as a standard/counter mentality anyway.

[RorysRocketThrow]

Yes I've noticed West Brom have reverted to Pulis style quite a lot more this season. I did read an article on his changes somewhere but I can't seem to find it. I did pull out one on the changes he made to the Palace side:

http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/news/features/talking-tactics-how-tony-pulis-plotted-crystal-palace-barclays-premier-league-survival.html

Again reverting to a solid 2 lines of 4 and a target man and a more mobile forward behind him. His wingers at palace were really pacey and tricky however which maybe makes a little bit of a difference but the basic concept was the same. I think at WB this year he possibly has a more workman like midfield, occasionally playing Morrison. McClean is clearly the flair player there. Is Lambert starting every game?

As a side note in the game (FM14) Pulis is listed as playing 4231-Long, Balanced. His Palace side in that game is set up in a 4-2DM-3-1 formation with an obvious target man and inside forwards I think. Its actually a formation I've always found very hard to play against.

That's not right at all. He's very much a 4-4-1-1 man. His wingers start off a lot deeper than that of a 4-2-3-1, often sitting right on top of the full back when not in possession.

[johnnyyakuza78]

That's not right at all. He's very much a 4-4-1-1 man. His wingers start off a lot deeper than that of a 4-2-3-1, often sitting right on top of the full back when not in possession.

Maybe, but thats how hes listed in the game. Maybe there is a reason for that.

[johnnyyakuza78]

Funnily enough I've started a save as AFC Wimbledon and set up a Route One 4411 tactic, much like the one just mentioned, with attacking mentality and it works really well. I'm seeing some fantastic lower league style football, its amazing how open the field is in the lower leagues, my target man has plenty of time.

Maybe the issue is simply that once you get into the premier league this style of football becomes easy to beat, which I always suspected, but hoped wasn't the case. Mostly what happens when I get promoted with Leeds and try and get the Pulis to work is that the Target man is crowded out and passes go massively astray.

Am I right in thinking this?

[kingjericho]

Just as an experiment I tried the attacking 4-4-2 with my 8-time PL champions Dulwich Hamlet, and we won 3 games by 3-0, 3-1 and 5-4 so I'd guess it still works.

The key to this tactic really comes down to having the right players for it. If you go for it using Xavi and Busquets in the middle, and Benzema and Diego Costa up front you may struggle a bit because these guys don't exactly fit the type of player this style demands.

[johnnyyakuza78]

Ok so after a brief hiatus from the game and also me getting distracted by a Doncaster Rovers save where I got bogged down in actually trying to buy players without money, I've decided to go back to beginning and create a proper Pulis save with my Leeds side. I think I've created a tactic I'm actually really happy with. Its very solid defensively, incredibly boring to watch, utterly uninspiring and pretty one dimensional. Which is exactly what I wanted it to be:

TIs:

Route 1

Disciplined

Stand off opponents

Higher Tempo

Optional TIs:

Wider / Narrower

Stay on feet.

Most tactics I see posted up these days emulate the great pressing sides, but I think there is something to be said for teams that manage to keep their shape through thick and thin. What I've observed with this side is that the amount of interceptions my team make is beautiful. I'm so used to seeing my players having to run around like mad, chasing people down, running after lost balls. But this side it never happens. There is usually always someone in the right place at the right time.

The big changes from my previous tactics are the two DMC's instead of playing a flat 442. This made sense as we were playing so deep and conceding possession so often I needed to shield the defence a lot more than usual. The creativity needs to come from the wings and any long balls up to the target man (who isn't a target man but a DLF, as TM just ended up with him too isolated and with nobody to support him when balls were hit to him constantly), so at home I usually play with CWB and WB combination in the fullback position, just to get them more involved, they still defend well. Up against better sides I drop them back to fullbacks.

Here is my last game against Burnley, played a bit wider to make sure I countered their wingers.

They had hundreds of shots against me but all outside the area and nothing I was scared of. I was quite proud of that.

Unfortunately the flip side of this is that I barely create anything. Without any exceptional players to pull something magical out of the hat it can be a challenge to score goals whilst at the same time maintaining that level of solidity.

But I always think "WWTD" (What would Tony Do), and what he would do is not change anything and try and be happy that they havent conceded and have maintained that shape. I don't want to compromise on my principals just for the sake of trying to score goals! I mean its not like goals are important is it!

However, I would ask if anyone has any ideas on how I might improve this, to make it a little more creative.. and I mean a little, or to find away to produce more chances, without fundamentally losing whats so great about its negativity... then please chip in.

[jjw0509]

Thanks for the thread. I used for a lower league save in which I started with Harrogate Town and I am trying to get to the premier. I couldn't really implement it like the Pulis fans have described until I got to league 2. 

Below league 2

Structured, Much Deeper Line, Stuck in, Float crosses, Counter, Hit Early crosses, higher tempo, more direct or route 1

LFB,                     LD-D,       LD-D,   LFB

AML Winger-A, BWM-D, BWM-S, MR D-Winger-S

                            AF-A       TM-S

This worked but the BWM-S didn't really get caged and the LFB seem to come past the line too much. The LD's did as well. 

In League 2 I found that the players could perform better roles it is easier to find good D midfielders there. 

Flexible (so DF-S works right), Much deeper line, Stuck in, Counter, more direct or route 1, clear ball to flanks, GK distributes to FBs or flanks. LFB sit narrower, DF holds up ball, AML crosses near post, MR crosses deep far post

LFB                           LD-D                LD-D                LFB

AML Winger -A      Anchorman      Anchorman      MR Winger-S

                                     AF                 DF-S

This really is working. Possession time is amazing for a long ball tactic without a blazing AF-A and wingers I am not sure this works well though. My AF has speed of 15 and is burning LG 2 up despite the scout saying he is a conference striker. The DF-S really raised possession time. The Anchorman really cages the MF unlike the BMW. Still playing around with this one but is working better. My team survived regulation first year in League 2 with few improvements and I have a couple of good for LG 2 LDs, One LFB is decent to good for LG 2, and the other is servicable but good for Conference. I find the limited Ds and LFBs seem to stay back more under flexible than structured. I think it is due to the description that roles and duties mean more. Despite supposedly being more defensive under structured I find my LDs and LFBs coming past the line. 

If I can find the players I want to try a wide target man in the AML or AMR position and a wide midfielder in the opposition. Those seem to be hard for me to find even in LG 2 though.