Steaton's 'Invincible' 4-2-3-1 - Consistency - Balanced - 14.3.0 - Plug and Play

[Spaletti]

im sufering too many goals... I always start winning my games and in the second half I always end up drawing or even loosing

[francicampione]

Totti AMC did for me in 2 caps plus 9 from the bench (1 time at 72', 5 times at 80', 3 times at 85') 11 goals

When I finish the season I will post my results!

[Spaletti]

defensively speaking this tactic is awful... I was winning 5-2 and i granted 3 goals from 80'min till the end, and this wasnt the first time. I will wait till the tweaked version to be uploaded bcuz i did what he saied above and that didnt work for me...

[katkiller]

defensively speaking this tactic is awful... I was winning 5-2 and i granted 3 goals from 80'min till the end, and this wasnt the first time. I will wait till the tweaked version to be uploaded bcuz i did what he saied above and that didnt work for me...

That's totally true but, you have to know that the ai changes it's way of playing in the last 15 min, from minute 65 ai starts attacking with all they have so if you are two or three goals ahead the machine will grant a few goals to itself, funny yeah but true, to avoid this you have to change your tactic:

Try this, switch mentality to ¨Contain¨ have in mind that your defenders cannot be very tired, if a defender is less 69% then make a substitution.

I will also recommend changing your CWBs role to Full backs and set them to defend (CWBs cannot defend properly) after minute 65 so you have a better solid defence.

P.S: I have posted my feedback like 3 or 4 days ago but still not show up here in the thread

[davo80]

defensively speaking this tactic is awful... I was winning 5-2 and i granted 3 goals from 80'min till the end, and this wasnt the first time. I will wait till the tweaked version to be uploaded bcuz i did what he saied above and that didnt work for me...

I tend to disagree. The game had a lot to do with team talks training etc.

[Spaletti]

can you be more specific?

[Spaletti]

http://s28.postimg.org/g9pxza6sd/Sem_T_tulo.png

story of my current save...

[deblauda]

Hi,

I have employed the tweak to the 2 CD. I use also the team option : play narrower. I rarely concede a goal since.

[ivanoykane]

Hello,

Just began coaching sixth season of my Chelsea story. Won three league titles and a couple of CL trophies with MR. Houghs latest tactic. Didnt like the amount of offense the tactic created though and switched to yours, with some good effect though didnt achieve anything major trophy wise.

This season began fine with your untweaked tactic, but after tweaking the CDs all fell apart. Creating equal amount of chances against minor sides, and being rammed by the bigger ones. Other than the CD tweak its all original.

[furq]

I'm finding this tweaked tactic very hit and miss,(Cardiff City, first season) sometimes it's brilliant. like beating Man City 5-1 at home and Chelsea 5-0, but other times it's awful, losing to Hull 4-1 and West Brom 3-0. In short, it's been horribly inconsistent, but I'll keep trying until the end of the season and then contemplate some tweaks.

One highlight has been my big signing, Gylfi Sigurðsson, who has been a revelation in the Advanced Playmaker role.

[GazzP]

I'm finding I still have problems with centre backs going walkabout, here's a recent example using the plug the hole version with the hold position CD tweaks.

Coloccini is way out of position, unnecessarily shadowing the full back (26), leaving my DLP (4) to plug the gap in defence left by Colo, which is a mismatch against the attacker, who eventually gets between the DLP and my other CB (13) when the cross comes in and scores.

Colo's player instructions, the other CB, Yanga-Mbiwa is identical.

Tactical setup. I'd just subbed Dier on for Colo. Straight swap.

What I did notice though was that Colo has the 'Mark tightly' PPM, so I'm wondering if this is what is causing him to get pulled out of position as you were finding with CB's before the tweaks. Yanga-Mbiwa also has the same PPM but I don't think it's as detrimental to him as he was superior pace to Colo so can regain position quicker.

Thoughts?

[nickbirdspain]

Have to say this tactic is ridiculous - currently in first season with Newcastle, no signings and i am currently top of the league in February with only two losses, one draw and a clear 16 points ahead of second! Not sure if its down to blind luck or this literally is the greatest thing since sliced bread but i've never experienced a tactic perform so dominantly in a first season. One issue i do have though is the strikers are largely dogsh*te - i'm rotating between Cisse & DeJong and neither has managed more than four all season. What's everyone else's experience with the striker? Are they largely redundant in this formation or are Cisse and DeJong actually that rubbish? I'm keen to bring Lukaku in at the end of the season and don't want to waste the pennies if he's not going to be effective.

[katkiller]

Have to say this tactic is ridiculous - currently in first season with Newcastle, no signings and i am currently top of the league in February with only two losses, one draw and a clear 16 points ahead of second! Not sure if its down to blind luck or this literally is the greatest thing since sliced bread but i've never experienced a tactic perform so dominantly in a first season. One issue i do have though is the strikers are largely dogsh*te - i'm rotating between Cisse & DeJong and neither has managed more than four all season. What's everyone else's experience with the striker? Are they largely redundant in this formation or are Cisse and DeJong actually that rubbish? I'm keen to bring Lukaku in at the end of the season and don't want to waste the pennies if he's not going to be effective.

Buenas tardes. My striker, Marvin sordell, has played 26 matches and has 24 goals. He is a 4 stars poacher.

[MegaAlbin_88]

Hi! So what post is the tweak everyone is talking about? Sorry for asking, you have probably answered this to many times!

I wanna test this tweak with my FC United save in first season

[Spaletti]

Tokelo Rantie, 11 goals in 15 games so far with Nottm Forest in BPL

[katkiller]

I tend to disagree. The game had a lot to do with team talks training etc.

If you follow the creator's training and tactic you will notice that the more fluid the tactic is the worse it is.

i.e: the rival has scored 3 golas in just 10 minutes after minute 65, so defence tactic is really bad.

P.S: Of course is the best tactic by far, you will win the league with it despite its defence problems ´cos in the end you will score and win more matches than the machine xD

[enigma6969]

I have to say that this is amazing tactic, tried with few different teams, leagues...always first...many thanks Steaton!

[davo80]

If you follow the creator's training and tactic you will notice that the more fluid the tactic is the worse it is.

i.e: the rival has scored 3 golas in just 10 minutes after minute 65, so defence tactic is really bad.

P.S: Of course is the best tactic by far, you will win the league with it despite its defence problems ´cos in the end you will score and win more matches than the machine xD

The tactic is fully fluid now I and I have not noticed any difference. I took the advice on another thread on team talks, if your not at least 3-0 up and half time aggressively tell them it's not good enough, your second half of the game always put the other team to bed. My first season is almost up I have had some amazing results I will post them once the season is finished. I also used the set pieces set up on fm base again I will post them later on I still score from fun from set pieces. This is the best tactic ever but it's far from plug and play you have to have training, team talks, set pieces etc

[Steaton]

Hello everyone - if you are using the defensive tweak I think this tactic is not as good you know, yes it's still great and you wont leak as many goals but overall not as dominant - this tactic tens to score 2 goals in second half and can let one in early. So be patient have trust and you will get the promised consistency. If you really don't trust the tactic without the defensive tweak use - Hold position on DCs with Cover, short passing AND TIGHT MARKING, it was a mistake to remove tight marking as the defenders do not make as many great anticipated interceptions that create goals.

As for plug and play - I do think it really is as long as you play in a normal sort of way - I mean don't use OI especially not on strikers but no it doesn't work good i this tactic its too sensitive to disrutption from minor changes - also try to get the full consistency you need to have faith and play it most of the time otherwise your players dont gel into it in the same way and consistency can reduce - strange tip for team talks I would think team may get pissed for bad team talks but I have noticed that it could give advantage to do this - this advice is nothing tactic related though but is general to the game and probably is reputation related and related to the pre match expectations.

[Steaton]

You know I find it hard to just play one tactic and not change to counter on a per game basis - I get great results by countering in a single mattch - as I know how to counter other playing styles - BUT I don't start matches dominating as much and not needing to counter in the first place - for the best results you need to be very consistent in tactics and only change when really need to e.g. if the opposition pass a lot and run at you creating chances through the middle remove hassle opponents and it will sort it out - thats the biggest tip I can give you as it really does work.

[Steaton]

I'm finding this tweaked tactic very hit and miss,(Cardiff City, first season) sometimes it's brilliant. like beating Man City 5-1 at home and Chelsea 5-0, but other times it's awful, losing to Hull 4-1 and West Brom 3-0. In short, it's been horribly inconsistent, but I'll keep trying until the end of the season and then contemplate some tweaks.

One highlight has been my big signing, Gylfi Sigurðsson, who has been a revelation in the Advanced Playmaker role.

I agree don't tweak trust vanilla and get results - that my advice - and thats why I havent posted a tweaked version.

[furq]

I made a few changes that have seen my form improve a lot, won 7 straight and got Manager of the month for December (second season with Cardiff)

I switched to "Play narrow" as someone suggested above, I changed the Poacher to a False 9 (which removes the move into channels) and I also added "Hold up ball" for my Advanced Playmaker, in the hope that it would give the Inside Forwards time to run into the channels and exploit the space created by the False 9 dropping deeper. That's the idea anyway, not sure if that's what's happening, (Steaton does need to be applauded for his analysis) But I'm finding I'm creating lots more chances and as a result, scoring more goals.

Again, Gylfi Sigurðsson is superb in the Advance Playmaker role, 14 goals in 15 games so far this season.

[ShortSharpShock]

Solid tactic, so far so good...

I'm playing as Chelsea and using the original 'Vanilla' tactic.

The 'Plugged Hole' version was disappointing so I tweaked the 'Vanilla' to use as a second tactic. I use it when we have a comfortable lead or are playing tough away games (Manchester United & Bayern Munich in the attached screenshot).

I switched the mentality to 'Control' and changed the 'Wing Back' (Attack) to 'Full Back' (Support). I Also changed the 'Sweeper Keeper' to 'Goalkeeper' (Defend).

[deblauda]

The defense is also beter when you remove the option "thight marking" from the wing backs and change the way off play to fluid.

[Steaton]

The defense is also beter when you remove the option "thight marking" from the wing backs and change the way off play to fluid.

Link me your version both you guys please. I am betting it seems better but then doesn't do as well if you are a one tactic for every game type. But hey thats because I have done all of wehat you guys both said and somehow it effect the goal scoring ability against certain other tactics so its not quite as good/consistent overall. I could be wrong so please link but I feel like I've tried every combination and in particular the ones you mentoon since cause I'm not actually happy with the way invincible works there are things I hate about it - but I think that whilst the tweaks may seem to do better - vanilla doesnt look good on pitch - in the end they dont do it as well after time you realise. - Love to be proved wrong but we had a ridiculous testing session recently with versions I truely beleived were better and had been using more regular and you know what was fantastic for a while then didnt have the same umpf overall you could tell but only after a lot of testing and a lot of games - felt like stup-endous number of hours were wasted when we finally realised they werent better after all - broke me.

Just try a range of tough or esay games and replay them over and over using this tac and using another just make 5 or 6 saves during your season to go back and do the testing on and then you will eventually get the same results we have - so I come to the conclusion that is it better get your bonus for tactical consistency by using it almost all of the time as is (though if players are running at you defo remove hassle opponents) rather than swapping every game which is great at beating that one game but not overall becuase you lose something longer term by having a tactic that is not as able to cope with as many opposing tactics - familiarity type stuff that add that extra little umpf combined with the ability to cope with almost all other tactics played agianst you. Try the bogey teams, man c, arsenal, stoke, southhampton, FCP and there was another I forget will update when I remember.

For instance changing the FBs or using up hold ball or using a F9 doesnt stand the test of time likewise neither do changing densive lne or tempo or fluidity or mentality - they may play better in many games but wont win as frequently - though I hate the fact that the poacher does **** all and is basically there to hold back the defensive line most of the time thats all he does gtets goals against some tactics but most of the time wasted - can't find a way to make better use of the striker though that works as well for all games over time. Don't get me wrong I just tried TFF_Cross_V8 and it is better! It can destroy teams that invincible wont do so well - but in long term testing it still didnt manage to win overall - and that tactic is simply great - it wont win head to head though either. Still if I was to say which is better TFF's is better but you want plug and play with the only tweak you should do being to remove hassle opponents if they are fludily attacking runnig and passing their way through your defence then invincible to the best of my knowledge right now is it - iand I'm still not happy with it.

[Steaton]

I'm getting mixed results. Playing fantastic football, win most of my games by big margins, but lose one in five, six games, regardless who I play. Seems not a tactic for top teams.

Yes well this is may be due to other reasons - I've been tweaking for each game and then I was getting similar problems - I've hope I finally learned (again) to have faith and I'm now once again reaping rewards but sometimes I never learn I always want to make it better - but you can't just switch back to vanilla when you been trying another tactic or something and expect it to save my arse, its not an arse saving tactic - you must play it all the way through the match, it is a second half performer by the way - dont get me wrong tactic will work straight off the but for full consistency you need to take care of the other parts to this game. What I beleieve is that once you do that this tactic is the best one to get you an invinciable achievement (though TFF_Cross_v8 - really looks great so that may be a better tactic as much as I hate to admit it - it very nice - feels like cheating when you play it - proper 'diablo' tactic - so well done TFF - havent proven consistency with that one yet but my god its great on the pitch - it did lose to vanilla in a repeated versus tournaments with a bunch of other highly rated tactics in the mix - but thats human v human tactics which is a bit different).

[Steaton]

The defense is also beter when you remove the option "thight marking" from the wing backs and change the way off play to fluid.

Yes true for opponents that pass it, fluid and run at you and have a spare AMC that moves to the flank behind the FB that is marking the winger. Removeing hassle opponenets will help removing tight marking will too - but this is a rarely used tactic that has to haver top quality players to work that can come from wings go through centre and spread out behind you FB is the hardest one to beat ironically it tends to be the same formation e.g. most common team to and most difficult to beat is Man City and its a bitch to beat em - I personally have a Man C counter tactic and an FCP counter tactic (who play ball to feet direct low tempo) - but hey thats cause they are the bogey teams for this tactic. But like I said if you remove hassle opponents then this will make a big difference.

Here is an example game where I use an FCP like tactic to counter the Man C tactic - if I'd used vanilla I'b get annihilated but their team is in a different class combined with it being a counter for invincibles.

http://www.mediafire.com/download/96v91fo53cm5nrr/Man_City_v_Portsmouth_new_Direct_Tactic.pkm

And the tactic:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/b6h90xjoya97ofk/Steaton's_Invincible_4-2-3-1_Man_C_Direct_Counter_Gen.tac

[tom4s]

@Steaton Just curious to know. Have you ever experimented with shifting the DLP(D) back one position to a cdm slot? If so what were the results?

I mean like this:

-----ST

AML AMC AMR

---MCL

------DMR

LB CB CB RB

[jacky33]

What is the best version of this tactic please ???

[Jorgen]

I believe it still is the Vanilla version

[jacky33]

I believe it still is the Vanilla version

Where I can upload this version ?

[Jorgen]

First post, first download link

[FilipW13]

DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME ON THIS TACTIC! I've tried all tweaks and followed all advice given by Steaton, who pompously promises "invincibility"... Nothing worked. And no, this is not because I don't know how to play this game - I've won the league with Cardiff without making a single transfer before. This is by far the most inconsistent tactic I've encountered since FM 13. The defense is absolutely rubbish, no matter if you put them on cover and remove tight marking or just stick to the original. Sometimes you'll get a lot of goals, yes, and you have a lot of possession (if you're at home), but that must be about the only thing positive about this tactic.

SOUTHAMPTON:

- GW 1: 2-2 against Fulham, 2-0 up at half time but because Steaton claims this tactic is plug-and-play and doesn't need changing at the break, I've lost this lead in minutes.

- GW 2: 0-2 at Sunderland, which was more due to my opponent's weakness than anything else.

- GW 3: 5-2 against Liverpool: completely absurd game in which I went 5-0 up before half time, great, but in the second halve I got completely battered and it could've easily been 5-5 if it wasn't for Artur Boruc's incredible performance.

GW 4: 3-1 loss at West Ham: went up 0-1 but because Steaton's plug-and-play claim again I didn't change a thing - 1-1 five minutes later and after that I got annihilated completely, could've easily been 6 or 7!

GW 5: 3-3 at home against Hull: 2-0 up at half time, lost this lead after the break (as always), then with some luck I regained it (first goal in five games after the break - what do you mean this tactic is a "second half performer"?????), but, of course, I lost it again.

And yes, this is only 5 weeks and the tactic isn't yet completely fluid (which according to you shouldn't make that big a difference), but I'm not gonna waste my time again like I did with your tweaked version and the version without the defensive tweak - which you now again claim is the best. My advice to the tactic creator: have some humility, stop claiming invincibility with an at best very mediocre tactic and learn a thing or two about the game from true FM geniuses like Jassar from fm-base.co.uk ( http://www.fm-base.co.uk/forum/share-download-fm-14-tactics/145625-***football-manager-14-tactical-thread***********************jassar*******.html ). THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS PLUG-AND-PLAY ANYMORE - every tactic needs changing (1) depending on your opponent - do you really believe you can play the same way at home against Crystal Palace as you would away at Man City or Chelsea? (2) at the break, (3) after 65 minutes depending on who's winning! Stop making false claims, that way peoples' time isn't completely wasted!

[parsdaft1982]

DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME ON THIS TACTIC! I've tried all tweaks and followed all advice given by Steaton, who pompously promises "invincibility"... Nothing worked. And no, this is not because I don't know how to play this game - I've won the league with Cardiff without making a single transfer before. This is by far the most inconsistent tactic I've encountered since FM 13. The defense is absolutely rubbish, no matter if you put them on cover and remove tight marking or just stick to the original. Sometimes you'll get a lot of goals, yes, and you have a lot of possession (if you're at home), but that must be about the only thing positive about this tactic.

SOUTHAMPTON:

- GW 1: 2-2 against Fulham, 2-0 up at half time but because Steaton claims this tactic is plug-and-play and doesn't need changing at the break, I've lost this lead in minutes.

- GW 2: 0-2 at Sunderland, which was more due to my opponent's weakness than anything else.

- GW 3: 5-2 against Liverpool: completely absurd game in which I went 5-0 up before half time, great, but in the second halve I got completely battered and it could've easily been 5-5 if it wasn't for Artur Boruc's incredible performance.

GW 4: 3-1 loss at West Ham: went up 0-1 but because Steaton's plug-and-play claim again I didn't change a thing - 1-1 five minutes later and after that I got annihilated completely, could've easily been 6 or 7!

GW 5: 3-3 at home against Hull: 2-0 up at half time, lost this lead after the break (as always), then with some luck I regained it (first goal in five games after the break - what do you mean this tactic is a "second half performer"?????), but, of course, I lost it again.

And yes, this is only 5 weeks and the tactic isn't yet completely fluid (which according to you shouldn't make that big a difference), but I'm not gonna waste my time again like I did with your tweaked version and the version without the defensive tweak - which you now again claim is the best. My advice to the tactic creator: have some humility, stop claiming invincibility with an at best very mediocre tactic and learn a thing or two about the game from true FM geniuses like Jassar from fm-base.co.uk ( http://www.fm-base.co.uk/forum/share-download-fm-14-tactics/145625-***football-manager-14-tactical-thread***********************jassar*******.html ). THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS PLUG-AND-PLAY ANYMORE - every tactic needs changing (1) depending on your opponent - do you really believe you can play the same way at home against Crystal Palace as you would away at Man City or Chelsea? (2) at the break, (3) after 65 minutes depending on who's winning! Stop making false claims, that way peoples' time isn't completely wasted!

I am now into my 5th season in game, I have won league 1, JPT, championship, came 4th in prem, won carling cup, semi finals of the champions league, then came 2nd in prem, yes in that order, all with this tactic. I have not used any tweaks, just this tactic. So it is safe to say I disagree with you. Yes there are times When you may go on a losing run but that happens in real life. I have used Jassers tactics, and they are not as good as steatons, but I dont go posting that on his threads. At least have a bit of respect before making a post like that! Different tactics work differently for different people, Just because it didnt work for you there is no need to say to everyone not to use it!

Rant over

[Steaton]

@Steaton Just curious to know. Have you ever experimented with shifting the DLP(D) back one position to a cdm slot? If so what were the results?

I mean like this:

-----ST

AML AMC AMR

---MCL

------DMR

LB CB CB RB

I tried it very briefly but the DC and the DMC were often standing on top of each other, I do know however that using a HB in the DMC central position makes for a very solid defence, if you want to experiment this is worth a shot - I think one of the wingers can be spared for a HB in a pinch perhaps with a stopper in defence not sure.

Also the striker isnt doing enough for my taste but still makes overall team perform better on poacher so guess I'm stuck with it, and i've tried everything else on him and on the inside forwards so unless you change something else to match changing them on their own wont work.

Tried a lot of stuff on the full backs havent made it work dont know why because they seem better positioned with other settings and we get better stats (maybe needs more testing) but team do not do as well long term overall - I think the number of real key chances (not the key chances stat which isnt reliable but shots from the scoring zone or passes from the scoring zone to an unmarked striker who is then tapping it in with the GK out of position - these are the most effective ways to score reliably). Key chances on the edge or outside the area aren't worth nearly as much nor are penalty spot / central key chances.

Some simple counter tactics that are proven to work though use sparingly for best results, so as to keep you tactical consistency bonus high:

- If you are seeing many drribbles and fluid passes getting past you turn off Hassle Opponents, not every time you go a goal down in first half - in that case have faith - but when you see as described

- If opposition has no wingers you can remove stay wider and tight marking on the FBs. Watch out though because often the AI will switch to use wingers and may score before you realise

- If they are getting through in the middle either with through balls or by beating offside trap push up the defensive line to very high (or high) and play offside trap, this means that when they do get through they are forced to take a shot from longer distance and in the centre, your GK will most probably save or your defenders will get back in time to tackle - risk of penalty/red card seems minimal surprisingly (in this is the case do not remove drop deeper without pushing up this means thier shots are much more likely to be from the danger zone after dribbling or passing past you - as with drop deeper they end up shooting from too tight an angle having knocked the ball a bit too far forward) - you should probably have already removed hassle opponents as your first attempt to counter. This makes you vulnerable on the wing.

[Steaton]

DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME ON THIS TACTIC! I've tried all tweaks and followed all advice given by Steaton, who pompously promises "invincibility"... Nothing worked. And no, this is not because I don't know how to play this game - I've won the league with Cardiff without making a single transfer before. This is by far the most inconsistent tactic I've encountered since FM 13. The defense is absolutely rubbish, no matter if you put them on cover and remove tight marking or just stick to the original. Sometimes you'll get a lot of goals, yes, and you have a lot of possession (if you're at home), but that must be about the only thing positive about this tactic.

SOUTHAMPTON:

- GW 1: 2-2 against Fulham, 2-0 up at half time but because Steaton claims this tactic is plug-and-play and doesn't need changing at the break, I've lost this lead in minutes.

- GW 2: 0-2 at Sunderland, which was more due to my opponent's weakness than anything else.

- GW 3: 5-2 against Liverpool: completely absurd game in which I went 5-0 up before half time, great, but in the second halve I got completely battered and it could've easily been 5-5 if it wasn't for Artur Boruc's incredible performance.

GW 4: 3-1 loss at West Ham: went up 0-1 but because Steaton's plug-and-play claim again I didn't change a thing - 1-1 five minutes later and after that I got annihilated completely, could've easily been 6 or 7!

GW 5: 3-3 at home against Hull: 2-0 up at half time, lost this lead after the break (as always), then with some luck I regained it (first goal in five games after the break - what do you mean this tactic is a "second half performer"?????), but, of course, I lost it again.

And yes, this is only 5 weeks and the tactic isn't yet completely fluid (which according to you shouldn't make that big a difference), but I'm not gonna waste my time again like I did with your tweaked version and the version without the defensive tweak - which you now again claim is the best. My advice to the tactic creator: have some humility, stop claiming invincibility with an at best very mediocre tactic and learn a thing or two about the game from true FM geniuses like Jassar from fm-base.co.uk ( http://www.fm-base.co.uk/forum/share-download-fm-14-tactics/145625-***football-manager-14-tactical-thread***********************jassar*******.html ). THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS PLUG-AND-PLAY ANYMORE - every tactic needs changing (1) depending on your opponent - do you really believe you can play the same way at home against Crystal Palace as you would away at Man City or Chelsea? (2) at the break, (3) after 65 minutes depending on who's winning! Stop making false claims, that way peoples' time isn't completely wasted!

I appreciate your comments (though something tangible like a save game file, a saved team or and/or a saved match) would really help us - am sure it didnt work for you on this occasion would be interesting to see your save game - I myself have had similar experiences before testing other tactics and I wouldnt try them again either but in this instance theres a lot of evidence to suggest that this may just be one of those things that happens in FM or something you do differently than me

p.s. I got the impression you were changing too much too often from the descrip0tion and my advice is not to use any tweaks at all but just use vanilla as is - over time I've found all tweaks to be ineffective.

p.s. If you have just bought and sold many players then this post is complete nonesense - please look back at the early posts?

EDIT: Oh and losing the lead is very uncommon never happens for me most goals against are scored first half - what team talks are you using - not passionate I hope and you should be asking them to improve. Very strange results that don't match any experience I've seen - why always second half? An explanation for that is definately needed.

[Steaton]

Where I can upload this version ?

Upload - you want to upload a version of the tactic you have tweaked - yes please - just use mediafire very quick to setup an account and very drag and drop easy to use.

[Steaton]

With regards to playing same tactic all the time my friend does it in our multiplayer games and he has got an invincibles going entire season with only 3 draws and his consistency is not in question > 100 points every time - maybe not first season but with any team after the first season.

This has worked with all kind of different teams - he often beats me in the league becuase I'm always tweaking to try and find a better tactic. And I know I have a better tactic than him but only a bit better - the main reason for this is without doubt his tactical consistency. Now don't get me wrong if I'm totally honest I think you should tweak to get that little bit extra, I tweak too much and I know I suffer for it but if I didnt I wouldn't be able to create a better tactic.

And for me developing my yougsters and creating a better tactic whilst being extremely smart on the transfer mariket is what I play for - I tend to win the cups including champs leeague more often and I tend to win our games against each other but then have the odd losing streak.

But then I don't always follow my own advice here is some of it:

- which is to buy sparingly and wisely

- know how to avoid ******* off your players but demonstrate high expectations always and dont be afraid to criticise blips in training or form - this can actually improve morale (be extra careful with new players though)

- wait for the opportunity to pick up the best players in the world

- offering new contracts can boost you in danger months such as January or before the champions league cup final

- be consistent with your tactics as much as you can but understand your opposition

- never get involved with the media most often it is more damaging

- buy at end of season before the budget is announced to beat your rivals to key signings

- give maximum settling time before season starts by not buying last minute (if you can)

- only buy the absolute bollocks dont buy any backup players

- run a tight squad with no more than 25 players so you can rotate enough but so everyone plays (maybe for great yougsters you can have an extra player or two like 17 or 18 years old though)

- try to rest a player for 3 matches at a time - play yougsters for 3 consecutive matches if you can - both typically result in a training / develpoment boost

- keep your squad status on your players correct and as low as possible

- never ever buy any players who are inconsistent have injury proneness or important matches weaknesses

- don't use passionate or aggressive as a new manager or on new players (you look like a dick - and the game knows it)

- try to find the right time to throw in the don't get complacent team talk

- and my lastest bit of advice is that PPMs are fantastic the difference between good and great - get em and get the right ones

- dont over train a medium medium level of trianing works slower but better overall - heavy training gets results sometimes briefly - use the highest medium you can get some times but not in winter when the weather is bad - don't use heavy too many injuries and reduces performance - except perhaps on very young players who are fine athletes and rarely get injured - you can go a bit higher on players that arent getting a game for a while (e.g. during thier 3 match rest).

- Never use team talks that show a low level of expectation though pressure off is an exception and should be used with cautious at the right time better pre-match than at half time

This is how I play but any one else has some tips to share that may be better than what im doing then please list em - I saw one claiming aggressive not good enough every game at half time unless you are winning by a large margin works really well - and indeed this tactic does perform way better in the second half than the first.

[rune_star]

DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME ON THIS TACTIC! I've tried all tweaks and followed all advice given by Steaton, who pompously promises "invincibility"... Nothing worked. And no, this is not because I don't know how to play this game - I've won the league with Cardiff without making a single transfer before. This is by far the most inconsistent tactic I've encountered since FM 13. The defense is absolutely rubbish, no matter if you put them on cover and remove tight marking or just stick to the original. Sometimes you'll get a lot of goals, yes, and you have a lot of possession (if you're at home), but that must be about the only thing positive about this tactic.

SOUTHAMPTON:

- GW 1: 2-2 against Fulham, 2-0 up at half time but because Steaton claims this tactic is plug-and-play and doesn't need changing at the break, I've lost this lead in minutes.

- GW 2: 0-2 at Sunderland, which was more due to my opponent's weakness than anything else.

- GW 3: 5-2 against Liverpool: completely absurd game in which I went 5-0 up before half time, great, but in the second halve I got completely battered and it could've easily been 5-5 if it wasn't for Artur Boruc's incredible performance.

GW 4: 3-1 loss at West Ham: went up 0-1 but because Steaton's plug-and-play claim again I didn't change a thing - 1-1 five minutes later and after that I got annihilated completely, could've easily been 6 or 7!

GW 5: 3-3 at home against Hull: 2-0 up at half time, lost this lead after the break (as always), then with some luck I regained it (first goal in five games after the break - what do you mean this tactic is a "second half performer"?????), but, of course, I lost it again.

And yes, this is only 5 weeks and the tactic isn't yet completely fluid (which according to you shouldn't make that big a difference), but I'm not gonna waste my time again like I did with your tweaked version and the version without the defensive tweak - which you now again claim is the best. My advice to the tactic creator: have some humility, stop claiming invincibility with an at best very mediocre tactic and learn a thing or two about the game from true FM geniuses like Jassar from fm-base.co.uk ( http://www.fm-base.co.uk/forum/share-download-fm-14-tactics/145625-***football-manager-14-tactical-thread***********************jassar*******.html ). THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS PLUG-AND-PLAY ANYMORE - every tactic needs changing (1) depending on your opponent - do you really believe you can play the same way at home against Crystal Palace as you would away at Man City or Chelsea? (2) at the break, (3) after 65 minutes depending on who's winning! Stop making false claims, that way peoples' time isn't completely wasted!

HAHA, that's hilarious... At first I wondered if it was an aprils fools prank or something

Imagine the efforts put into writing that rant, about a tactic in a computer game!

"Have some humility..." Have you even read the thread? Steaton is being VERY humble in his descriptions and analyzis, which also describes the use of the "plug 'n play" term in FM14. It seems like you want your money back or something... Didn't you download this tactic yourself, or did someone force it on you? Have you ever made a tactic by yourself, and if so, why didn't you just ditch this one if it didn't work out for you? What's with the 'constructive' critiscism in that post? Absolutely impossible to tell what went wrong for you. Do you have any idea about how the tactic is supposed to work? What kind of football and chances are expected by playing this tactic? And if so, have you analyzed why this didn't happen in your case?

Can't believe that someone are using so much time and effort on such a meaningless, somewhat personal rant, about a completely self-chosen downloadable tactic made by someone else, when they're not even trying to help others as well as themselves finding solutions to a possible problem...

[Jorgen]

Steaton, thanks for your explanation on how you play. Do you have any more specific tips about team talks and training?

[sheeshy]

I'll give this a test, with Palace, no signings made.

[djsatu]

Won Serie A with my boys Internazionale in year 2 only losing 4, but drawing 12. Didn't concede many, and averaged 2-3 goals a game. My team is being built on youth, and can't wait to play season 3. Good job and best tactic thus far!

[Guest]

Hey Steaton.

Thanks for all your hard work so far. I have a sense that you enjoy this part of the game, and take pride in it too.

Now. I've used your Vanilla for a whole season with Southampton, did not purchase any players, and ended 3rd. I was VERY pleased.

I started up another save with Fulham to test the "defensive tweak" about setting both central defenders to cover.

My Fulham team ended 5th, but looking through the matches and the season stats, it seems both tactics played very similar, with only the odd goals by AI in later stages of the games.

Could you possibly clarify on which of the defensive modes you prefer?

I'd say that I've read about 90% of all the posts in this thread, and I am sorry to say that I do not find any specific answers by you on the IF's.

Do you really not have a preference to preferred foot by the IF's? Have you not seen any difference in testing at all?

And I might be missing something, or totally blonde. But reading through all the posts there are several versions, and you've added some notes that can easily be mistaken.

Could you please clarify if you've made changes to the Vanilla version?

A little side-question.

If possible, could you add something about PPM's, if you have some favorites for specific positions in the tactic, so we know if we need to aim for some in training thanks.

Lastly, thank you so much for a great tactic - keep up the good work.

I'll keep following this thread for a long time to come.

(info added)

I've found that the Team instruction - "Allow Wide Players to Swap" seems to increases chances, don't know if its because you get different kind of IF's doing moves/crosses, or because the AI's backs get confused, but it seems to add a few chances per match, and a goal once in a while.

[furq]

Hi Steaton. I know I was a bit critical of your tactic to start with, but that was down to errors on my part. Even though I've tweaked the tactic, I am enjoying the game probably for the first time since the latest patch. I've not won anything yet ( third season with Cardiff) But I'm very competitive and starting to realise the importance of team talks.

I do find that having my striker as a False nine and having the Advance Playmaker hold up the ball creates more chances for both. In my second season Both Sigurðsson (AP) and Vagner Love(F9) have 20+ goals. \i'm still conceding way too many, but I'm sure that's due to my tweaks.

Thanks for giving me the foundation to enjoy the game again.

[Guest]

I've re-read some of the posts, and to me it seems there are some information regarding this tactic in the lower leagues missing.

So I took it upon myself to do a test with Relegation contenders "Dorchester" that are favored to end 22th in the league.

1st season so far has been with vanilla tactic ( though added the Defender Cover tweak ).

No purchases, only one player brought in on free transfer, and one on loan.

The results I am getting just in the early season is staggering!!

If I didnt see the proofs for myself, I would'nt even have believed it.

So for your enjoyment, I'll add a screenie.

I'll post again at the end of my season.

[RicardoW]

Although I got titles and results managing in 14.3 with U Roslers tactics, I never was sure of a championship starting the season, regardless of the club I was managing. With this, I got titles with River Plate (7th in season before), Barcelona (2nd in season before) and Roda JC (13th in season before). Great tactic, the Vanilla one. Plug and play as it's meant to be!

[underkiller]

Is the tactic in first post the "best" one? or do i have to make change on the tactic by myself?

[Jorgen]

I believe the Vanilla version is still the best, though there is one with some defensive tweaks.

[oldHolborn]

what are the changes made to the defense?

[rune_star]

Both DC's set to cover duty. Add 'hold position' and remove 'tight marking' from their personal instructions ;-)