The FM 2023 and 2024 .. I guess.. 4-2-3-1 DM Thread

[Johnny Ace]

For the tougher Champions League games at Bayern, I have a slightly different approach, nothing major really. We drop the "crush" gegen pressing style and adopt a bit more of a midblock. This is for the teams that aren't going to sit back against us, the teams that are going to push up and leave us same space in behind their defensive line, so we aim to take advantage 

The roles don't change much at all, I pretty much just drop the playmaker and invert both wide forwards. The TI's is where it takes more of a twist. We still play our own game on the ball but of possession we let them play out from the back and look to hit them on the counter 

 

Man City, Chelsea, Liverpool and Spurs(?!) are all major threats in Europe, the PL is the best league in the World so they're always a challenge, I was most proud of the boys for this effort just recently 

 

[BnadnerB]

@Johnny Ace do you have any recommendations on where to even start with tactics? I see so much conflicting information everywhere its difficult to know what to stick to as guidelines etc!

[Johnny Ace]

5 minutes ago, BnadnerB said:

@Johnny Ace do you have any recommendations on where to even start with tactics? I see so much conflicting information everywhere its difficult to know what to stick to as guidelines etc!

Keep it simple! Don't try and reinvent the tactical wheel 

Don't worry about Liberos, Mezzala's and False 9's to start out with, use the bog standard roles 

Start out with your favoured shape, try and cover as many channels as you can in attack and defence. So in a 4-2-3-1, two Wingbacks, two Inverted Wingers and an out and out goal scoring role should have you covered. Try and cover the most offensive Wingback with a suitable DM role like a DM(D), A(D), DLP(D/S). The better your team is, generally the more you can get away with regarding roles and TIs   

Watch how your team attacks and defends and adjust as necessary. See how different players play the same role differently, two different players will play at say DM(S) different from one another, two different AM(S)'s will play completely different, so get yourself invested in Attributes and Traits and have fun   

A good resource I'd recommend to start out with is @llama3's Pairs and Combinations 

 

[sonnevillejr]

Good job!

I noticed in this thread and in the 433 one that you pay more attention to the PI related to a role than the duty. 
For exemple, you seem to consider an inside forward on support as an attack duty player due to the « get further forward » instruction, same thing with the DLP on support with the « hold position » instruction. 

Personally, I pay more attention to the duty so even if I have an inside forward on support, I’ll have an attack duty player on the other side. 
 

Regarding the DLP on support, I didn’t play with this role this year but even with his instruction, I don’t see him as a defensive player so I would always pair him with a DM or a BWM, with the most attacking wing back opposite to the DLP. 

Edited August 13, 2023 by sonnevillejr

[Johnny Ace]

2 hours ago, sonnevillejr said:

Good job!

I noticed in this thread and in the 433 one that you pay more attention to the PI related to a role than the duty. 
For exemple, you seem to consider an inside forward on support as an attack duty player due to the « get further forward » instruction, same thing with the DLP on support with the « hold position » instruction. 

Personally, I pay more attention to the duty so even if I have an inside forward on support, I’ll have an attack duty player on the other side. 
 

Regarding the DLP on support, I didn’t play with this role this year but even with his instruction, I don’t see him as a defensive player so I would always pair him with a DM or a BWM, with the most attacking wing back opposite to the DLP. 

Comes Deep and Back to goal are things I consider too, as traits they can have quite an impact on roles/ players  

[zigaliro]

Im a noob at creating tactics and i made a 4-2-3-1 with PSG. I have striker as CF(atk) and AM as attacking midfielder also on attack duty. We are doing well, 9 matches unbeaten and also unbeaten in ucl group stages so far but i mean its PSG and we havent played against any great european top teams. Is having both players on atk mentality an overkill? I like what im seeing from them, am often entering the box but im afraid against top teams they could easily score on the counter. Would dropping attacking midfielder to support duty make my tactics more balanced?

Edited August 14, 2023 by zigaliro

[Johnny Ace]

1 hour ago, zigaliro said:

Im a noob at creating tactics and i made a 4-2-3-1 with PSG. I have striker as CF(atk) and AM as attacking midfielder also on attack duty. We are doing well, 9 matches unbeaten and also unbeaten in ucl group stages so far but i mean its PSG and we havent played against any great european top teams. Is having both players on atk mentality an overkill? I like what im seeing from them, am often entering the box but im afraid against top teams they could easily score on the counter. Would dropping attacking midfielder to support duty make my tactics more balanced?

CF(A) and AM(A) is a fine combo, the CF will be roaming/in the channels/ dropping off so having the AM "fill in" from time to time is a good idea. And yes, having the AM on (S) is a good idea against tougher competition 

[CityAndColour]

Gotta say, despite playing with a higher tempo and a cautious mentality, we are consistently creating some really good chances. The combination of a winger (a) and an inside forward (a) is lethal, as when one gets in behind the defence, the other is generally rushing in at the far post for a tap in. We're consistently getting 2+ xG per game, and the computer is generally around the 0.6-0.8 mark.

Our record since switching to this formation is now 10-4-4, with two of those losses after using the "instant result" button. This includes 6-2, 5-0 and 4-1 wins.

Edited August 14, 2023 by CityAndColour

[Johnny Ace]

51 minutes ago, CityAndColour said:

Our record since switching to this formation is now 10-4-4, with two of those losses after using the "instant result" button. This includes 6-2, 5-0 and 4-1 wins.

Crikey!! It's getting some goals then!! 

[Johnny Ace]

Trying to come up with a 2019 to 2020 ish Man U 4-2-3-1 DM under Ole, I just remember it was around lockdown as there were no crowds. I just remember them being really fast with Rashford, James and Mr G and being really fluid. This is my starting point. Ignore the names, I'm using the fake names 

 

Not sure on the Volante, but Wan Bissaka wasn't so much a Wingback, maybe two DMs here on Support or a D/S DM pairing for the Matic/Fred roles but it might be a bit meh down the right hand side. Really not sure on what Martial did upfront F9 maybe, I dunno, I'll have to see if I can some highlights on YouTube 

v2?

I think the In Transition and In Possession TI's look about right, the Out of Possession would have to change depending on who they played 

Trying a v3 with a DLF(A), I think the U-18s just used it and scored a couple of goals with the patterns I was aiming for:

Rashford role - Robinson at IF(A) finishing a counter

DLF getting the assist 

I think the Volante helps cover the Pogba role (when he was fit)

[HanziZoloman]

Could it really be magic (?) I got a possession 4231 running with Billaricay and it works impressive. I'm not sure I just tinkered a bit with tactics at the end of season but I managed wins against the top teams in the league. I am insecure if it's just luck or a real good shape. Can you guys please comment tell your thoughts about it. Thank you!

Spoiler

 

 

[Johnny Ace]

Looks fine @HanziZoloman, it doesn't look possession friendly to me but it looks sound all round, do you have any PI's on the AMC? With the Poacher not looking to move about so much he could be a candidate to Move into Channels or even Roam 

[Johnny Ace]

I tweaked the BCFC 23/24 4-2-3-1 DM, and look at this for an assist .....

[bosque]

33 minutes ago, Johnny Ace said:

I tweaked the BCFC 23/24 4-2-3-1 DM, and look at this for an assist .....

Nice! I think the drop of mentality, tempo and passing gave your players more time and space in general. More space for the striker to attack and for the amc to receive between lines. And for the entire team to not skip the amc.

[Aoyao]

2 hours ago, bosque said:

Nice! I think the drop of mentality, tempo and passing gave your players more time and space in general. More space for the striker to attack and for the amc to receive between lines. And for the entire team to not skip the amc.

When to set the tempo slower?

Is the passing directness  the range of passing?

[HanziZoloman]

vor 9 Stunden schrieb Johnny Ace:

Looks fine @HanziZoloman, it doesn't look possession friendly to me but it looks sound all round, do you have any PI's on the AMC? With the Poacher not looking to move about so much he could be a candidate to Move into Channels or even Roam 

He got the ‚roam‘ with his good off the ball

The tweaked one you posted looks very close to the one I am using. Thanks for the feedback. 
ah and how do you guys create those nice GIFs (?) would like to do one meself.

Edited August 16, 2023 by HanziZoloman

[Johnny Ace]

8 hours ago, bosque said:

Nice! I think the drop of mentality, tempo and passing gave your players more time and space in general. More space for the striker to attack and for the amc to receive between lines. And for the entire team to not skip the amc.

Maybe so yeah, it was a really nice CM to AM to STR move 

2 hours ago, HanziZoloman said:

He got the ‚roam‘ with his good off the ball

2 hours ago, HanziZoloman said:

The tweaked one you posted looks very close to the one I am using. Thanks for the feedback. 

It's not a million miles away is it?

2 hours ago, HanziZoloman said:

ah and how do you guys create those nice GIFs (?) would like to do one meself.

I use a programme called ScreentoGIF

 

[Skywalk3r83]

16 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

I tweaked the BCFC 23/24 4-2-3-1 DM, and look at this for an assist .....

 Nice setup, going to try it with my Dortmund save. I’m in my first season and the Bundesliga is almost ours with 8 points ahead of Bayern😎. Do you think a DLP(d) can work too? Instead of the DM(d). 

[Johnny Ace]

4 minutes ago, Skywalk3r83 said:

 Nice setup, going to try it with my Dortmund save. I’m in my first season and the Bundesliga is almost ours with 8 points ahead of Bayern😎. Do you think a DLP(d) can work too? Instead of the DM(d). 

Yeah, absolutely! I was using this with Birmingham though, predicted to finish 22nd and I was trying to match up match stats to real life so I'd change the TIs to suit Dortmund 

[Skywalk3r83]

1 hour ago, Johnny Ace said:

Yeah, absolutely! I was using this with Birmingham though, predicted to finish 22nd and I was trying to match up match stats to real life so I'd change the TIs to suit Dortmund 

Recommend TI’s?🤔

[Johnny Ace]

Just now, Skywalk3r83 said:

Recommend TI’s?🤔

Be more aggressive!  Higher lines, higher triggers etc 

[HanziZoloman]

I am getting FMed after ten games xG 7th true position 15th. My players are hitting woodwork opponents their freekicks, late equaliser or other stupid goals. Well I‘m not too much concerned because we really get good chances even against top clubs of the league and give everyone a tough fight. People have all around 7.00 ratings it‘s all well except for results. 
On the other hand what can I do better? 

Edited August 16, 2023 by HanziZoloman

[CityAndColour]

On 17/08/2023 at 05:29, HanziZoloman said:

I am getting FMed after ten games xG 7th true position 15th. My players are hitting woodwork opponents their freekicks, late equaliser or other stupid goals. Well I‘m not too much concerned because we really get good chances even against top clubs of the league and give everyone a tough fight. People have all around 7.00 ratings it‘s all well except for results. 
On the other hand what can I do better? 

 

Analysing the types of goals you concede is the key - the AI is remarkably good at being clinical on the counter, so if you create a tactic in which you have a lot of possession and play a high line, you'll often find the AI scores a high percentage of their chances as they'll just wait until you lose possession and break. Lowering your tempo and your D line is often a good circuit-breaker.

Other times it's just picking the right players. I recently had a four match run where I absolutely dominated the AI, created chance after chance after chance, allowed almost no chances at the other end aside from the odd long range shot or DFK, and I lost three of them. I was actually laughing by the end of one of them because of how ridiculous my finishing was. Turned out the antidote was just changing my 'keeper and striker.

Above all else, sometimes you just get screwed.

Edited August 22, 2023 by CityAndColour

[Johnny Ace]

10 minutes ago, CityAndColour said:

Above all else, sometimes you just get screwed.

That's what I like to say to myself when I get beat out of blue 

[wazzaflow10]

General question... On FM 21 playing as Man Utd and recently switched from a 4-3-3 that was getting good xG numbers but low conversion to a 4-2-3-1 and started plastering the AI with 4,5,6 goals per game. 

I'm currently employing a Poacher-AMC Trequartista combination for central attack. Not sure why but the game has a cohesion line between my ST (Haaland) and AMC (Fernandes) but has a note that says while they've created a good partnership, the pair of roles are unsuitable together. Am i missing something? I know they're kind of extreme roles in the scorer-creator realm but I think given the two players I have that's kind of ideal. I feel like putting a AF/CF/PF role with a treq would result in no one being central to finish chances since they all have a tendency to move into channels. 

I'm not overly concerned since I've been completely overwhelming the opposition. Just curious what the issue is with the message. I can post a screenshot of it later if needed.

 

 

[Johnny Ace]

2 hours ago, wazzaflow10 said:

Not sure why but the game has a cohesion line between my ST (Haaland) and AMC (Fernandes) but has a note that says while they've created a good partnership, the pair of roles are unsuitable together. Am i missing something?

Same, would think a Poacher/Treq would be a fine combo, one roaming about and creating while the other focused on the goal scoring 

[HanziZoloman]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb CityAndColour:

 

Analysing the types of goals you concede is the key - the AI is remarkably good at being clinical on the counter, so if you create a tactic in which you have a lot of possession and play a high line, you'll often find the AI scores a high percentage of their chances as they'll just wait until you lose possession and break. Lowering your tempo and your D line is often a good circuit-breaker.

Other times it's just picking the right players. I recently had a four match run where I absolutely dominated the AI, created chance after chance after chance, allowed almost no chances at the other end aside from the odd long range shot or DFK, and I lost three of them. I was actually laughing by the end of one of them because of how ridiculous my finishing was. Turned out the antidote was just changing my 'keeper and striker.

Above all else, sometimes you just get screwed.

Thanks for your notes. All good food for thoughts. 
I play with a deep back line because my defenders aren’t human, they‘re snails. Turns out we were screwed last season a lot of times, ridiculous. This year we perform better. Still, we are overwhelming relegation candidates and are overperforming but looking at the xG underperformance we are below five places. Woodwork and penalties. I believe it’s the players they are not good at things but I‘ll take the positive the overperforming part and we are top five in almost all relevant team stats like possession, final third entries and things. That’s very satisfying. Just in case you know things like that and how to fix it, like talking the striker or the defenders or other hacks to get the engine running on best performance. 

 

Edited August 22, 2023 by HanziZoloman

[wazzaflow10]

14 minutes ago, Johnny Ace said:

Same, would think a Poacher/Treq would be a fine combo, one roaming about and creating while the other focused on the goal scoring 

The only thing I can think of is the lack of applying defensive pressure up top since neither really work hard to defend... but I don't really want to apply defensive pressure that high up the pitch since teams are sitting deep already. It might not be viable against another big team but it'd be very unlike the game to give you that sort of detail until you get stomped 7-0 in Europe away from home and only have 30% possession.

If you're stumped i'll just ignore it/label it a bug and carry on. I did try the enganche role with Fernandes and the note disappeared. He had a storming game (8.9) with that role (after a few tweaks for the CMs behind him to clear space for him to drop into). Only won 2-0 but Haaland had a poor day at the office or it could/should have been more. 

[Johnny Ace]

6 minutes ago, wazzaflow10 said:

The only thing I can think of is the lack of applying defensive pressure up top since neither really work hard to defend...

Must be I suppose, the game should give a reasoning really 

7 minutes ago, wazzaflow10 said:

If you're stumped i'll just ignore it/label it a bug and carry on. 

Yeah, I never check those things to be honest 

FM21 was a fine ME, would be interested to see your setup 

[Johnny Ace]

The through ball of all through balls  the Trequartista, Nganga drops off and the AM(A), Bjorn, makes his run forward, Nganga plays the ball through along the deck to break the DM and CD line 

 

 

 

[bosque]

2 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

The through ball of all through balls  the Trequartista, Nganga drops off and the AM(A), Bjorn, makes his run forward, Ngana plays the ball through along the deck to break the DM and CD line 

 

 

 

I love how your AM(a) positions himself in the blind side of the right CB.

[wazzaflow10]

3 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

Must be I suppose, the game should give a reasoning really 

Yeah, I never check those things to be honest 

FM21 was a fine ME, would be interested to see your setup 

I've been enjoying 21 much more than the latest 23 update. Too many unrealistic events/bugs. I thought the release version of 23 was very good not sure what happened after.

If you recall in a separate post i was asking for help with a 4-2-3-1 and afterwards went to a 4-3-3 after some input from you and some others here. Had some really good success with it. In the first iteration of this I would swap Fernandes to the RCM position and have him play as a RPM and put a CMa on the left. Did really well and won the league 2 years in a row. I didn't really have a CMa though as Pogba didn't fill the role well/didn't like playing it plus is now 30 so time to start transitioning imo. This season started off with a lot of frustrating draws against teams parking the bus. I think the main difference was swapping martial for haaland and him always looking to play off the shoulder of the CBs. Rashford's goal return has suffered a bit as well. But it was hard to turn down 120M for Martial to Real Madrid and 80M for Haaland. 

AWB is my normal right back but he fractured his ankle and was out for 4 months. Telles is a monster in this game and is my normal LB as well but he pulled a muscle and is out for a few weeks. 

Greenwood has more direct passes and roam from position

Rice has more direct passes 

Games become tougher imo to break teams down. So I decided to switch back to a 4-2-3-1 to in an attempt to get the team going again. I've dropped the LOE and upped the directness. I've found that's really helped getting Haaland the space he needs to get in behind. 

Luis generally has hold position on. Greenwood still with roam from position. And I'll often tick on focus down the left. Additionally Shaw and Sancho have cross to far post. Usually results in a good chance for greenwood.

Defensively I generally have luis mark the AMCR/AMC position (not player) with Fernandes marking the DM/DMCR/MCR and Rice marking the MCL. How I set it up depends on the opponent and which of their midfielders is responsible for carrying the ball out of defense and I might switch Luis and Rice to get more favorable positioning. Oddly though most teams have the right sided CM as the #6.

blue line and below are my results with the 4-2-3-1. I wasn't doing poorly but games were a slog. The Villa match I got 'super keepered' by Emiliano Martinez. Liverpool was leading the league this year by about 4 points when we played them and have been crushing teams so far. That's a tough match regardless of tactic.

Anyway, as you can see more of my goals are coming early in the first half. Reading was the only rough match up but that was the 3rd game in 6 days and I probably pushed my starting lineup too hard but knew they'd get a rest for a week+ after that. 

[HanziZoloman]

vor 9 Stunden schrieb Johnny Ace:

The through ball of all through balls  the Trequartista, Nganga drops off and the AM(A), Bjorn, makes his run forward, Ngana plays the ball through along the deck to break the DM and CD line 

 

 

 

The 4231 has so much to offer. Great play! Lovely movement. Looks like Ricay in read  

we are so close this year to the promotion spots and playing great football. I need to get GIFs running. 

[CityAndColour]

21 hours ago, HanziZoloman said:

Thanks for your notes. All good food for thoughts. 
I play with a deep back line because my defenders aren’t human, they‘re snails. Turns out we were screwed last season a lot of times, ridiculous. This year we perform better. Still, we are overwhelming relegation candidates and are overperforming but looking at the xG underperformance we are below five places. Woodwork and penalties. I believe it’s the players they are not good at things but I‘ll take the positive the overperforming part and we are top five in almost all relevant team stats like possession, final third entries and things. That’s very satisfying. Just in case you know things like that and how to fix it, like talking the striker or the defenders or other hacks to get the engine running on best performance. 

 

One other thing I'd say (and apologies for slightly taking the thread off topic) is I don't think the 3D representation always does a great job when it comes to problems with your set-up/team. Sometimes you may have issues (either tactical or morale/confidence) but the 3D will still show you seemingly creating a lot of chances in the box, it's just the finishing is poor. So you can easily fall into the trap of thinking your set-up is fine and you're just unlucky.

It's always worth watching the odd game on full highlights too, if you have the time.

[HanziZoloman]

vor einer Stunde schrieb CityAndColour:

One other thing I'd say (and apologies for slightly taking the thread off topic) is I don't think the 3D representation always does a great job when it comes to problems with your set-up/team. Sometimes you may have issues (either tactical or morale/confidence) but the 3D will still show you seemingly creating a lot of chances in the box, it's just the finishing is poor. So you can easily fall into the trap of thinking your set-up is fine and you're just unlucky.

It's always worth watching the odd game on full highlights too, if you have the time.

I‘m not sure if I understand you, can you explain that again please?

[CityAndColour]

22 hours ago, HanziZoloman said:

I‘m not sure if I understand you, can you explain that again please?

I just meant that I'm not sure the 3D highlights are always a great indicator (eg - if you start hitting the post a lot or missing a lot of chances, often it means something needs to be tweaked/managed rather than just being unlucky, which is what it can feel like).

Anyway, back on topic...

Spoiler

My 4-2-3-1 with an inverted wingback, DLF and a DLP/BWM as the pivots continues to perform really strongly. After switching to it a third of the way through our first season in tier seven (and on a seven game winless run), we went 16-6-6 to make the playoffs, where Hayes & Yeading were too strong for us. I struggled to really improve the squad in the offseason but did manage to retain most of our key players, and after a patchy start to the current season, we've won six of eight to be only three points off top spot with a game in hand.

Offensively, we are 3rd in xG, 1st in cross completion and cross completion %, 2nd in chances created, 3rd in shots per game and 2nd in final third passes completed. Defensively, we are 1st in goals conceded, 1st in xG against, 1st in shots against, 1st in shots on target against and 2nd in opposition completed final third passes. So in short, we create a lot and are very difficult to create chances against, which is a good combination!

A lot of our attacks will start with either the DLF or AF receiving the ball in a central area from the DLP, and then immediately looking to move the ball to the flanks. The right hand side has been particularly fruitful - my WB is my best player and leads the team in assists, but my IF is dual-footed so sometimes he'll cut inside and allow the overlap, but other times he'll chase a ball over the top to the byline and cross.

My IWB hasn't impacted as much as I'd like, but he provides a point of difference in terms of crossing, as he will often cross right-footed from around the corner of the box so it curls towards the far post, which is a difficult angle to defend.

[gunnerfan]

On 04/08/2023 at 12:38, Johnny Ace said:

 

The top half is the four advanced players, I use a Complete Forward on Attack because I'm pushing up high and this guy drops off and roams, so he's hard to mark and isn't constantly squeezing up field. The guy's a machine...

I've used an IF on the flanks and I wasn't keen, I prefer IW's with the top heavy shape, they feel less goal keen to me and generally better team players. I sometimes use dual IW's but my main setup is the Inverted Winger and Winger. The double "Wing" roles on the right spark my OCD a little but it's not a bad thing, having two players high and wide means there's more space in the middle.

 

This is interesting stuff. I haven't used a CF, because every iteration of the 4-2-3-1 I've played (going back to FM21) I've used an AF. At the AM strata, I use an IW/A, an AP/S, and an IF/S. But recently I've found that sometimes, my AF (and I have two great ones) seems to get frozen out of the action. As a remedy, I've tried changing the AMC to a SS/A, which does sometimes open up the offense, but it doesn't do much for my invisible AF. I've also tried replacing the AMC with a second striker, as a DLF or F9, or sliding AMC off center and using him as a T. All of these moves are effective to varying degrees in stimulating the offense, but they never do much for the AF/A. In the beginning, I tried subbing the AF/A out for another striker, but the sub never fared much better (e.g. a 6.4 replacing a 6.3). That's what tipped me off to the fact that, yes, it was probably my tactics.

At the DM strata, I use a BWM on the right and an RPM, VOL, or RGA on the left, depending on the player and the tactical situation. Across the back, I use two WBs, a BPD and a CD. I had been using two BPDs in the middle, but this season I acquired a new goalie with a low tendency to rush out and he gave up a few goals early on that he should have smothered. So, I changed one of the backs to a CD (thanks to a suggestion here on the forum).

[Johnny Ace]

7 minutes ago, gunnerfan said:

This is interesting stuff. I haven't used a CF, because every iteration of the 4-2-3-1 I've played (going back to FM21) I've used an AF.

Give it a try, it's probably my favourite striker role. My plan was to use it with another A duty at AMC/L/R but with how the players and tactic combined together, I never felt the need to 

How do you find your AP(A) does? I've not been a fan on them this year and nearly always default to an AM(S) with PI's, I've used the Enganche a bit this year too 

[EEddie4]

Hi guys. This is my 4-2-3-1 tactic that’s not working. Any help or advice would be highly appreciated

 

[gunnerfan]

1 hour ago, Johnny Ace said:

How do you find your AP(A) does? I've not been a fan on them this year and nearly always default to an AM(S) with PI's, I've used the Enganche a bit this year too 

The only attacking AMC I use in this tactic is the shadow striker, which sometimes perks up the attack but doesn't do anything to open things up for the AF. I haven't used the AP/A at all. 

[nick1408]

On 05/08/2023 at 02:38, Johnny Ace said:

The top half is the four advanced players, I use a Complete Forward on Attack because I'm pushing up high and this guy drops off and roams, so he's hard to mark and isn't constantly squeezing up field. The guy's a machine.

  Hide contents

The AMC is a straight up Attacking Midfielder(Support) I do use PIs on these guys to match their strengths, Bjorn has Take More Risks, Dribble More and Roam From Position and gets double digit goals and assists a season. His Traits include Comes Deep so he links everything up nicely. He's 30 and he'll cost me 4 transfer window budgets to replace so he might have to be an Enganche for a couple of seasons when he slows down and a couple of youngsters get up to standard  

  Hide contents

  Hide contents

I've got a question about your team instructions rather than the roles themselves. Why have you chosen low crosses with a 194cm striker? Is it due to your 172cm AMC and what I assume is a short inverted winger or are the crossing players (wingbacks and winger) doing something funky with their player instructions where low crossing is preferable?

By the way; thanks for leaving the team instructions in the picture. It helps make sense of the roles chosen overall.

[Johnny Ace]

16 hours ago, gunnerfan said:

The only attacking AMC I use in this tactic is the shadow striker, which sometimes perks up the attack but doesn't do anything to open things up for the AF. I haven't used the AP/A at all. 

Typo sorry, I meant your AP(S)

16 hours ago, EEddie4 said:

Hi guys. This is my 4-2-3-1 tactic that’s not working. Any help or advice would be highly appreciated

Not working how, you're 1st? Big issue for me is your DMs, the HB on the left could easily be a DM(S), just something a little less defensive 

10 hours ago, nick1408 said:

I've got a question about your team instructions rather than the roles themselves. Why have you chosen low crosses with a 194cm striker? Is it due to your 172cm AMC and what I assume is a short inverted winger or are the crossing players (wingbacks and winger) doing something funky with their player instructions where low crossing is preferable?

By the way; thanks for leaving the team instructions in the picture. It helps make sense of the roles chosen overall.

The striker is the only tall player, with the narrowness and roaming I just prefer the low crosses. There's no PIs on the wide players or anything 

[nick1408]

18 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

The striker is the only tall player, with the narrowness and roaming I just prefer the low crosses. There's no PIs on the wide players or anything 

Makes sense - the crosses become like a pseudo through ball rather than an actual cross.

[mikcheck]

@Johnny Ace433 and 4231 are the formations you use the most? I'd like to see your take in a 442 too!

[Johnny Ace]

1 hour ago, mikcheck said:

@Johnny Ace433 and 4231 are the formations you use the most? I'd like to see your take in a 442 too!

Yeah, easily those two, I'm sure you've already seen my 4-4-2 

 

[HanziZoloman]

If you had a superb IF(S) and he‘s your best player, two other talented incutting wingers a capable striker (strong finishing and an eye for a pass) and a mobile AMC how would you chose the roles upfront?

Or same question differently posed: How to create a simple but effective movement pattern with the four up front? 

[ejleal]

 @Johnny Ace Running this right now in a save I have with chivas. Selected control possession preset and 4-2-3-1 with roles as suggested by the assman. Only thing i removed was lower tempo. 

[Johnny Ace]

How's it playing out @ejleal?

[Rooney1010]

So I’m struggling against the big teams away from home. 
 

as you can see I’m AC Milan so it’s not as if I’m terrible however these are the performance we constantly produce away from home. 
 

Background on tactic it’s usually a DLF(A) with either a IF(A) or IW (A) with wingbacks however in the bigger I’ve experimented.

 

sometimes I play with wingbacks and others FB as I assume it would make me more solid defensively however it doesn’t seem to be the case. 
 

Pivot is usually DM(S) x2 however no tweak I make is working and I also remove play out of defence. 
 

What are your guys suggestions for dealing with tough away days

 

Thanks  

[ejleal]

11 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

How's it playing out @ejleal?

So far so good. I've only played 5 games but we've been superior in all of them, except in the last one where we had to raise the line of engagement to rescue a draw. Also most of my short are inside the box which is good. What you think about the set-up in terms of roles??

Edited August 30, 2023 by ejleal