The best way to hold a lead??? OVERLOAD

[cfcx]

I have noticed in my last few games that abandoning drop deep, retain, play narrow etc to hold strong leads after half time, the best way seems to be to switch to an Overload strategy with attacking shouts.

Has anybody else noticed this? I should point out i am chelsea with an in FORM TORRES!! plus hazard mata and co so i am lucky in the attacking department so i am not so sure this would be beneficial for smaller sides?

In my last game for example away to WBA i was 3-0 up at half time and they scored a soft goal very quickly, so i changed things to be a little more conservative and went 4-1 up then soon after they get another and i could see the same old pattern emerging with us stuck in our half and im just waiting for the epic comeback!!!!!

So i switched up to overload with my offensive shouts with 20min left and we were excellent they didnt get another sniif and ended 6-2

This has happened a few occasions now and i would like to hear from others if they adopt a similar approach, and also to those posting threads about conceding late etc even when using ultra defensive ideas to perhaps give this a go

[darragh1981]

In fairness I do see that from time to time. I have often gone slightly more conservative after getting a few goals up only to be pegged back by late goals and either drawing or loosing the game. I think the issue here was doing this too early and like in real life I am inviting pressure onto me, giving the opposition more of the ball and so more chances.

What seemed to work was having individual players take on more defensive roles (As opposed to team orders) and targeting the opposition subs, swapping out a more creative midfielder for a ball winner and even putting a DR or DL on the wings and setting them to defensive duties. The last step to close out the game is in the last 5 minutes or so go defensive, retain possession and Rigid. This usually finishes off the game and I havent been conseeding late goals as often.

Going Overload seems to work if you are a better team than the other, if they are chasing the game they are all out attack and you can pick them off on the counter and constantly forcing them onto the back foot. Bear in mind that they can do the same as well. I have been lazy on occasion and stayed overload after scoring a couple of goals to take the lead only to get counter attached to death and either drawing or loosing.

[magicmastermind124]

Keep Calm and Go Overload, someone better make it a meme.

[cfcx]

i never go defensive or contain until last 5 too, my starting strategy is always counter as it suits my players and also just seems to work well on this fm version. i usually change the approach solely with shouts. like retain, narrow, deep etc if i am leading by couple of goals just to kill game and starve them of the ball (thats the theory anyway) i just like the idea of being like the sides who when they go 1 or 2 up there is no way back as they tend to be so solid defensively. Italian mentality i seem to of picked up somewhere!!

just im finding it very tough to implement without conceding so i guess the point im getting at is perhaps others need not look at defend/contain = i will not concede now im 1,2,3 up but instead pinning them back with a balanced attacking outlook and as you pointed out correct roles/duties is the best form of defense

[cfcx]

Keep Calm and Go Overload, someone better make it a meme.

Great shout!!

[isignedupfornorealreason]

Defensive is amazing for causing huge upsets.

Contain I only use as a last five minute thing though.

[TSH]

It's a well known fact in football that all teams who want to keep a lead go on full attack.

Oh wait...

[Cougar2010]

It's a well known fact in football that all teams who want to keep a lead go on full attack.

Oh wait...

TSH proving as clueless as usual I see

There is certainly a case for overload working as a way of defending a lead, especially if you are the better side. It will cause high pressure/closing down when you lose the ball leading to you pushing the opposition back and hopefully winning possession high up the field. When you do get possession you'll look to get the ball forward quickly at a time when the opposition are pushing forward and leaving gaps. The downside is you will be open to counter attacks yourself but the opposition need to be good enough to make them work.

[cfcx]

TSH proving as clueless as usual I see

There is certainly a case for overload working as a way of defending a lead, especially if you are the better side. It will cause high pressure/closing down when you lose the ball leading to you pushing the opposition back and hopefully winning possession high up the field. When you do get possession you'll look to get the ball forward quickly at a time when the opposition are pushing forward and leaving gaps. The downside is you will be open to counter attacks yourself but the opposition need to be good enough to make them work.

Agreed. Not sure il use this approach against Utd's and Barce's of this world:D

[Tactic Master]

It's becoming common knowledge that offence is the best defence.

[scott MUFC]

only because overload your players pass back to the keeper anyway

might have to try overload away from home might get the players tacking and doing what they do at home.

[realzealman]

It's becoming common knowledge that offence is the best defence.

Completely wrong. The best managers acknowledge that defence is the best offence.

[Tactic Master]

Completely wrong. The best managers acknowledge that defence is the best offence.

I have absolutely no idea why you just said that because it has absolutely nothing to do with this thread or the statement I made, we are talking about defending a lead, not trying to increase it. If your trying to hold onto a lead and put yourself into defensive mode, your inviting pressure onto your own team and this can go horribly wrong a lot of the time. This means that pushing them back with an offensive style could be the better option and has often worked for me personally and other people that know a lot more about tactics than me have also said this.

You obviously have no idea what your talking about if you use the term 'Completely Wrong', because although using an offensive approach has it's faults, so does a defensive approach, which means it's down to personal opinion.

[jujigatame]

It might be my imagination (or some sort of confirmation bias) but it does seem like I blow leads when I tell my team to play more defensively. I had a Europa League final against Ajax where I went up 2-0 and switched from standard to counter. They roared back and tied it 2-2, so I switched back to standard, and went up 3-2, then back to counter, they tied it 3-3, then back to standard, I won 4-3.

[Motherlover]

Without meaning to be an ass to a lot of posters here, if you are struggling to hold leads when playing defensively then that indicates a flaw with your defensive tactics. Defending to a high standard is very easy in FM if you know what you're doing.

For what it's worth, that definitely means ignoring the defensive presets from SI. They're not fit for purpose.

[cfcx]

Without meaning to be an ass to a lot of posters here, if you are struggling to hold leads when playing defensively then that indicates a flaw with your defensive tactics. Defending to a high standard is very easy in FM if you know what you're doing.

For what it's worth, that definitely means ignoring the defensive presets from SI. They're not fit for purpose.

So do you use shouts? or playing around with sliders? would you care to enlighten :confused:

[Tactic Master]

It might be my imagination (or some sort of confirmation bias) but it does seem like I blow leads when I tell my team to play more defensively. I had a Europa League final against Ajax where I went up 2-0 and switched from standard to counter. They roared back and tied it 2-2, so I switched back to standard, and went up 3-2, then back to counter, they tied it 3-3, then back to standard, I won 4-3.

Point proven

[RobertPage]

Hmm, i don't know about this. would be interested to see what happens in a game which you are leading by 1 goal and the other team is on the front foot. If you go yo overload then i would imagine you would get picked apart, i think when you're on top of a game it would be more beneficial but in tight games when your on the back foot against good teams i don't think it would work. There is a reason why top teams only overload when desperate for a goal, because the other team will find it easier to counter attack and find holes in the defense. Technically this shouldn't work, if it does then i think it's wrong and needs to be looked at

[Cougar2010]

Without meaning to be an ass to a lot of posters here, if you are struggling to hold leads when playing defensively then that indicates a flaw with your defensive tactics. Defending to a high standard is very easy in FM if you know what you're doing.

For what it's worth, that definitely means ignoring the defensive presets from SI. They're not fit for purpose.

Total rubbish.

Just using the tactics creator (which is what I presume you mean by presets) and rarely altering anything, even in the advanced tactics I tend to have one of the best defensive records in the league I'm playing in.

[cfcx]

Hmm, i don't know about this. would be interested to see what happens in a game which you are leading by 1 goal and the other team is on the front foot. If you go yo overload then i would imagine you would get picked apart, i think when you're on top of a game it would be more beneficial but in tight games when your on the back foot against good teams i don't think it would work. There is a reason why top teams only overload when desperate for a goal, because the other team will find it easier to counter attack and find holes in the defense. Technically this shouldn't work, if it does then i think it's wrong and needs to be looked at

I have only noticed its strength when i have used it after being at least 2,3 up and can see the dreaded super comeback that has enraged me so many times!! at half time have used many different combo's of team talks to be sure the players keep their performance level only to see my side gradually losing control of the game and i can see that the lead will slip, even though my standard starting approach is counter which keeps things fairly tight anyway and i would expect a great strategy for when im winning and teams try to hit me back creating space for me to exploit. IN THEORY

i tend to use simple shouts for killing a game off like keeping ball, stay on feet and clear to flanks etc but teams often start to overwhelm me (lesser teams i should add, and this is ALWAYS) for which i now just switch up to purely attempting to out gun them

[dannyxx20]

Total rubbish.

Just using the tactics creator (which is what I presume you mean by presets) and rarely altering anything, even in the advanced tactics I tend to have one of the best defensive records in the league I'm playing in.

Same here, I have a average goalie too but he still manages to get in the top 5 for clean sheets over a season.

[WizbaII]

I use a Standard mentality, which lets me basically keep possession of the ball without taking risks but also prevents my team from defending too deep when I don't have the ball (which would result in giving up corners, rash clearances, and potential penalties, and being susceptible to too many crosses). As Motherlover said, a good tactic with a Balanced mentality can protect leads consistently. I think a good defensive tactic with a Control mentality would be actually be more effective for keeping a lead than using SI presets with a Defensive or Contain mentality. When I speak of a good defensive tactic, I mean a tactic where you've carefully calculated how to account for each player on the opposing team and whether they should be Man Marked or not, whether they need to be tightly marked, how much you will allow opposing fullbacks to move forward before you must close them down, how you will make sure to track players who unexpectedly make runs from deep without losing your shape, and how you position your players to make sure the opposing team cannot take any good long shots.

But I certainly don't think using Overload is the answer. You can get lucky using it, particularly when you have the superior squad with better stamina, but tactically it is an unorthodox decision to make, especially when time is almost out.

[fm_champ99]

varies, i've been winning a game comfortably and switched to defensive to see it out to then continue to score goals, i rarely use overload but i may try it. typically i just stick with standard unless something needs changing. I never use shout, don't understand them enough to care

[realzealman]

I have absolutely no idea why you just said that because it has absolutely nothing to do with this thread or the statement I made, we are talking about defending a lead, not trying to increase it. If your trying to hold onto a lead and put yourself into defensive mode, your inviting pressure onto your own team and this can go horribly wrong a lot of the time. This means that pushing them back with an offensive style could be the better option and has often worked for me personally and other people that know a lot more about tactics than me have also said this.

You obviously have no idea what your talking about if you use the term 'Completely Wrong', because although using an offensive approach has it's faults, so does a defensive approach, which means it's down to personal opinion.

The irony of saying that I have no idea of what I'm talking about, by using a blanket statement yourself? Top work

You seem to miss my (rather obvious?) point. You made a blanket statement - ironically your only contribution to this thread - that holds little semblance with real-world tactics. With very (very!) few exceptions, managers acknowledge that a well organised defence, followed by a "sucker punch" counter attack, can kill a game after holding a one goal lead.

There are very few teams/managers that, after taking a lead, decide to go gung-ho in attack. Most (intelligent) managers appreciate that teams are most vulnerable when attacking. Man U & Man City, even a "beautiful" side like Arsenal, will play a defensive, counter attacking possession style. Barcelona are a more extreme version of this.

Also - think before you type next time. I didn't claim that favouring attacking football when leading was completely wrong - I simply stated that your sweepingly generalist quote - that it's "common knowledge that offence is the best defence" (yuck!!!) - was completely wrong, because, as you so humorously reminded us, it's really up to personal opinion.

[Takamaru]

TSH proving as clueless as usual I see

There is certainly a case for overload working as a way of defending a lead, especially if you are the better side. It will cause high pressure/closing down when you lose the ball leading to you pushing the opposition back and hopefully winning possession high up the field. When you do get possession you'll look to get the ball forward quickly at a time when the opposition are pushing forward and leaving gaps. The downside is you will be open to counter attacks yourself but the opposition need to be good enough to make them work.

I'm playing with Sparta in the Netherlands. Just got promoted to the eredivisie having only just managed to get in the end-season playoffs for promotion from the 1st division (having finished as 9th!). So you couldn't call my team "better" than pretty much any team in the eredivisie by a long shot... sadly. Still, I'm playing on "attacking" always, and since i'm dong quite decently in the eredivisie lying 6th mid-season with absolutely inferior players attacking does seem to be the way to go. Don't think it has anything to do with the quality of players.

Though I've noticed this for the past few editions of FM actually. I think the last time a defensive tactic worked for me has been in FM 04 or something. Needless to say, going to "retain" and counter or defend when I am ahead in a game does nothing except help me loose a 3-0 lead. I'm going ahead and call myself an Overload Devotee.