This is why I don't like the newgens

[MBarbaric]

me too

[Guest El Payaso]

Worst one I've faced so far. Of course there is no insurance that this isn't edited any way but this is physically easily the best player ever featured in football by far and probably also one of the smallest players in football.

Would think that with physique like this the player would also be able to jump: he is fast, strong and light but still his jumping reach is only four. For example I'm not a top level athlete but I'm a 170cm volleyball player, well a former volleyball player but my jumping reach at prime would easily have been somewhere between 13-16. With those physicals it makes no sense that this guy's jumping reach is so low. 

[HUNT3R]

9 hours ago, El Payaso said:

Worst one I've faced so far. Of course there is no insurance that this isn't edited any way but this is physically easily the best player ever featured in football by far and probably also one of the smallest players in football.

Would think that with physique like this the player would also be able to jump: he is fast, strong and light but still his jumping reach is only four. For example I'm not a top level athlete but I'm a 170cm volleyball player, well a former volleyball player but my jumping reach at prime would easily have been somewhere between 13-16. With those physicals it makes no sense that this guy's jumping reach is so low. 

His Jumping Reach will be low because as you pointed out - he's short. It's the reach that is the important part to consider, not how well he can jump. Now, tbf, his JR is a little poor compared to his height, but I wouldn't think it's too odd though. It's still within believable range - for his height.

[ferrarinseb]

That sort of Physicals at 22 seems too much and then the Determination. If that sort of player is available in real life teams will surely go over 300M$ like candy to grab him.

I feel some sort of restrictions or procedures should be there in order to restrict how much OP the Physicals for Regens are getting in every area instead of only some areas which determined by Player height and weight. I dont know whether its Possible or not to simulate in Regen creation time as lot of factors might be involved in.  

 

 

 

[Guest]

That player probably does a good job in highlighting the limitations of the current training system, I suspect he has always been trained in a role that does not have JR as an active attribute so CA points were never picked up by th attribute or worse were taken from it to use elsewhere.

 

[Seb Wassell]

3 hours ago, Barside said:

That player probably does a good job in highlighting the limitations of the current training system, I suspect he has always been trained in a role that does not have JR as an active attribute so CA points were never picked up by th attribute or worse were taken from it to use elsewhere.

 

He's 5'6'' or so, whilst I don't disagree that his training may have impacted this he is never going to get anything other than a poor JR attribute.

[Seb Wassell]

14 hours ago, El Payaso said:

Worst one I've faced so far. Of course there is no insurance that this isn't edited any way but this is physically easily the best player ever featured in football by far and probably also one of the smallest players in football.

Would think that with physique like this the player would also be able to jump: he is fast, strong and light but still his jumping reach is only four. For example I'm not a top level athlete but I'm a 170cm volleyball player, well a former volleyball player but my jumping reach at prime would easily have been somewhere between 13-16. With those physicals it makes no sense that this guy's jumping reach is so low. 

I agree he looks odd. This is an issue we have under review, specifically height vs. Strength. We do need to be careful not to simply hold up examples of, and act on, extremes however.

On his Jumping Reach - he is never going to achieve a good Jumping Reach attribute, he is too short. Jumping Reach is height + ability to leap, if the former is very small the sum can never be that large. In an FM context at least, someone who is 170cm is not realistically going to achieve 16 Jumping Reach.

[Cougar2010]

IMO height should never be directly linked to strength, that just sounds wrong.

There are lots of examples IRL of shorter people who are strong - Weightlifters for example and plenty of taller people who are strong.

 

[Seb Wassell]

Just now, Cougar2010 said:

IMO height should never be directly linked to strength, that just sounds wrong.

There are lots of examples IRL of shorter people who are strong - Weightlifters for example and plenty of taller people who are strong.

 

I agree with you. To shamelessly use myself as an example, I am 5'7'' and a powerlifter. However, this is all in a football context, where even the largest of players are actually on the light side for athletes of their size (compare with say Rugby, Basketball, NFL, Athletics and even Cricket).

Therefore, as height is linked to weight and weight is linked to Strength, the two should correlate, (intended) exceptions excluded.

[Guest El Payaso]

I think that in football height is also linked to strength. You can clearly notice a pattern that the players who are close or under 170cm have low strength attribute. Of course you can train for example Messi to be strong and bulky but not with a downside to his other qualities I would say. 

For example Alexis is quite muscular looking and short player but he only has 11 for strength. Also I would still claim that I would reach 13-15 on jumping reach as a 170cm man. 

[enigmatic]

tbf that guy is like the Messi of fullbacks, not sure how he manages to be that strong when he only weights 67kg but I don't see an issue with the odd CA190ish freak being near perfect in speed, agility and balance. The bigger issue is the sheer number of lesser newgen fullbacks that are nearly as capable physically but very limited technically (which do exist, but certainly aren't most top division fullbacks) and relatively small number noted more for their crossing ability than their athleticism

[Seb Wassell]

7 minutes ago, enigmatic said:

The bigger issue is the sheer number of lesser newgen fullbacks that are nearly as capable physically but very limited technically (which do exist, but certainly aren't most top division fullbacks) and relatively small number noted more for their crossing ability than their athleticism

This is a separate also under review issue. Cheers.

[Seb Wassell]

10 minutes ago, El Payaso said:

I think that in football height is also linked to strength. You can clearly notice a pattern that the players who are close or under 170cm have low strength attribute. Of course you can train for example Messi to be strong and bulky but not with a downside to his other qualities I would say. 

For example Alexis is quite muscular looking and short player but he only has 11 for strength. Also I would still claim that I would reach 13-15 on jumping reach as a 170cm man. 

Arguably Messi's is more his Balance rather than Strength that means he can hold the ball away from the opposition in the way that he does. Off the ball he is not strong in the same way.

Might have to agree to disagree on your FM jumping prowess  

[Guest El Payaso]

26 minutes ago, Seb Wassell said:

Might have to agree to disagree on your FM jumping prowess  

Well, I've been a spiker while playing with experienced players who are 30cm taller than I am and I can dunk a basketball... I bet that the newgen I posted with those physicals would also be really good at jumping as he has both superior strength and pace which are required from a good jumper. Also he is light so I see no problem with him also having great jumping skills.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Seb Wassell said:

He's 5'6'' or so, whilst I don't disagree that his training may have impacted this he is never going to get anything other than a poor JR attribute.

The the exact same height as me & when I was playing I would win in the air against players 6" taller then me.

If that height is set to low JR range then the core logic is incorrect.

[Seb Wassell]

3 minutes ago, Barside said:

The the exact same height as me & when I was playing I would win in the air against players 6" taller then me.

If that height is set to low JR range then the core logic is incorrect.

This is specifically the JR attribute and does not take into account the many other variables that will factor into who wins a header in the ME.

Each height has an advised JR range, of which there can be exceptions that fall outside of this range. However, more often than not a taller player will have a higher JR than a shorter player, and logically so.

Comparing ourselves to professional footballers is probably not a reliable method.

[Seb Wassell]

25 minutes ago, El Payaso said:

Well, I've been a spiker while playing with experienced players who are 30cm taller than I am and I can dunk a basketball... I bet that the newgen I posted with those physicals would also be really good at jumping as he has both superior strength and pace which are required from a good jumper. Also he is light so I see no problem with him also having great jumping skills.

We need to be careful comparing ourselves/other sports to football.

Jumping Reach = Height + ability to jump. No matter how good a player is at jumping the final distance that he can reach is going to be capped by his height.

However, I do agree that a player that is both light and strong (high Agility + Balance too) should likely have an above average, if not exceptional, Jumping Reach for his height. As such we will look into this one.

[Guest El Payaso]

@Seb Wassell Have you internally noticed any issues with the newgen personalities when they are created? In my opinion quite a few of those youngsters have great personalities (even model professional) straight from the start. I'm not saying that any of those youngsters shouldn't have a good personality but for me there might be too many with excellent ones from the beginning.

[Guest]

20 hours ago, Seb Wassell said:

This is specifically the JR attribute and does not take into account the many other variables that will factor into who wins a header in the ME.

Each height has an advised JR range, of which there can be exceptions that fall outside of this range. However, more often than not a taller player will have a higher JR than a shorter player, and logically so.

Comparing ourselves to professional footballers is probably not a reliable method.

Just like pace & acceleration JR is not a professional footballer specific attribute, they are simply measures of a specific physical performance & should allow for direct comparisons to any person's measures in those abilities.

That said based on what I've observed in the ME (that's what is actually important) the JR attribute doesn't always matter, I've often seen & reported instances of players appearing to attain significant vertical distance in attacking scenarios even though they have a low single digit JR attribute, personally I only find the attribute to be important for defensive players & wouldn't have any concerns about the player posted being unable to win aerial challenges off a crossing situation,

[renato.]

Can someone explain why regens sometimes get Bravery and Determination so low? That's something that really annoy, cause it influences a lot his peformance.

Determination we can work on by tutoring, but Bravery...

[Seb Wassell]

On 23/09/2017 at 09:45, Barside said:

Just like pace & acceleration JR is not a professional footballer specific attribute, they are simply measures of a specific physical performance & should allow for direct comparisons to any person's measures in those abilities.

Yes they are. All attributes are within a footballing context.

[Guest El Payaso]

@Seb Wassell I have noticed that really many newgens have a great personality such as "professional" or "resolute" straight from the start and I feel that this might be a bit too common especially if you happen to have good HoYD in your team. Is this something that you have internally noticed? And could it be an issue that I/we should keep eye on when FM 2018 is launched?

[isignedupfornorealreason]

On 9/23/2017 at 14:18, renato. said:

Can someone explain why regens sometimes get Bravery and Determination so low? That's something that really annoy, cause it influences a lot his peformance.

Determination we can work on by tutoring, but Bravery...

Well, at that age (imo) you start being a lot more aware of things hurting and being a lot more conscious about avoiding such pain. For every jack the lad willing to stick his head in and get kicked in the face, I reckon a lot of youngsters will back out and rather keep things nice and pristine. 

I do think it should be a trainable attribute though, the higher up you go in the leagues, the more the 'risk' could be mitigated as you're taught to challenge in a safer manner, but if you're not up for it, there's not a lot you can do about it.

[Guest]

Incidentally, I happen to have a brilliant newgen centre-back right now in my youth team. He is set to be a superstar, his stats are exceedingly good, my staff can't speak highly enough of him.

 

But there is this thing... He is midget-sized and his Jumping Reach is currently 3. It was actually 1 when he was created. It'll be interesting to see whether he's ever going to be of any use. But really, he is a superb centre-back, except for that one thing...

[MBarbaric]

1 minute ago, xzar_monty said:

Incidentally, I happen to have a brilliant newgen centre-back right now in my youth team. He is set to be a superstar, his stats are exceedingly good, my staff can't speak highly enough of him.

 

But there is this thing... He is midget-sized and his Jumping Reach is currently 3. It was actually 1 when he was created. It'll be interesting to see whether he's ever going to be of any use. But really, he is a superb centre-back, except for that one thing...

not really, a defender doesn+t need to be tall if he has other attributes to compensate.  Fabio Cannavaro was a world class centerback and only 1,76m

[Guest]

On 9/22/2017 at 13:38, Seb Wassell said:

I agree with you. To shamelessly use myself as an example, I am 5'7'' and a powerlifter. However, this is all in a football context, where even the largest of players are actually on the light side for athletes of their size (compare with say Rugby, Basketball, NFL, Athletics and even Cricket).

 

Slightly off topic, but this has actually been very interesting to watch in the game. And you're absolutely right.

 

I'm in good shape, I'm 183 cm tall and I weigh 85 kilos - I'm a strength athlete like you, specializing in the classics: deadlift, squat, bench. Judging by the numbers in the game, I would be very, very heavy as a footballer. I've been trying to find someone whose measurements are close to mine, and I haven't really found any. I thought Emre Can would be close but no, I'm clearly heavier.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, MBarbaric said:

not really, a defender doesn+t need to be tall if he has other attributes to compensate.  Fabio Cannavaro was a world class centerback and only 1,76m

 

This guy is 11 cm shorter. Let's see how it pans out.

[Guest El Payaso]

2 hours ago, xzar_monty said:

 

Slightly off topic, but this has actually been very interesting to watch in the game. And you're absolutely right.

 

I'm in good shape, I'm 183 cm tall and I weigh 85 kilos - I'm a strength athlete like you, specializing in the classics: deadlift, squat, bench. Judging by the numbers in the game, I would be very, very heavy as a footballer. I've been trying to find someone whose measurements are close to mine, and I haven't really found any. I thought Emre Can would be close but no, I'm clearly heavier.

Sounds like Troy Deeney to me. Read somewhere that he is 183/90 at the moment. And even his physicals:

"only" look like this. Probably every over 165cm newgen with good CA has higher physicals than that.

[isignedupfornorealreason]

18 hours ago, xzar_monty said:

Incidentally, I happen to have a brilliant newgen centre-back right now in my youth team. He is set to be a superstar, his stats are exceedingly good, my staff can't speak highly enough of him.

 

But there is this thing... He is midget-sized and his Jumping Reach is currently 3. It was actually 1 when he was created. It'll be interesting to see whether he's ever going to be of any use. But really, he is a superb centre-back, except for that one thing...

Shift him to midfield? Defensive midfielders are a rare breed, they usually tend to lack in either marking or heading attributes - at least for CM/D. But they don't necessarily need to be good at jumping. Depending on your system of course.

 

One of the great things about the newgens is identifying those players that have excellent attributes for completely different positions and re-training them for that. 

[Guest]

I agree with the last point you made. It's quite delightful.

 

With this guy, he would be a good DM, but I practically never use them. He wouldn't make a particularly good CM - although I could be wrong of course.

[Leander]

There has been a discussion about physical attributes, but the distribution of the attributes of regens is crap as a whole. In game you have a lot of players with world class heading attribute, but with very low JR attribute. How many players like this exist in real life?. There are a lot of players with good dribbling and technique attributes but with low flair attribute. Also a bunch of offensive players with marking and tackling over 10 (how many of them do you have in the original database?). Acceleration and pace attributes develop too much in the game comparing to real life speed of an actual players. I am a football coach and i work with young players, and i can say that the pace of an athlete is something you can develop in a very limited way, but in FM it can grow even by 3 or 4 points which is unrealistic.

[Cougar2010]

58 minutes ago, Leander said:

There has been a discussion about physical attributes, but the distribution of the attributes of regens is crap as a whole. In game you have a lot of players with world class heading attribute, but with very low JR attribute. How many players like this exist in real life?. There are a lot of players with good dribbling and technique attributes but with low flair attribute. Also a bunch of offensive players with marking and tackling over 10 (how many of them do you have in the original database?). Acceleration and pace attributes develop too much in the game comparing to real life speed of an actual players. I am a football coach and i work with young players, and i can say that the pace of an athlete is something you can develop in a very limited way, but in FM it can grow even by 3 or 4 points which is unrealistic.

I think you misunderstand what some of the attributes actually do.

Jumping reach is how high a player can get his head off the ground whereas heading is how well he can head the ball in the direction he wants once he gets his head on it.

Flair is the ability to do the unexpected and whilst it can have a link to dribbling & technique its not a direct link.

[Leander]

I know the role of each attribute in this game as i play it for a very long time. What i wanted to say is that newgens don't have realistic attributes. When you look at the players from original database you will notice there is some kind of pattern in which players attributes are spread. You have two different players playing in the same position and you can see that many attributes have similar value (the difference is usually 3 to 5 points). For example two AMC have good dribbling, passing and first touch skills, they have high flair and vision attributes values, while low heading, tackling, marking and positioning. Some skills are usually combined like Dribbling and flair,  Bravery and Determination, Technique and First touch etc.. Here are some examples of players like this. As you can see their attributes looks very similar:

 

These four midfielders they all have same attributes of a high value and same attributes of a low value. Each of them is good at technique, dribbling, set pieces, flair, passing, creativity (vision), but not so good at tackling, marking, positioning, aggresion, heading etc. Those are typical world class offensive midfielders. There are a lot of players like this in original database and for some reason newgens look very different:

Here is a typical FM newgen. An offensive player with marking, tackling and positioning above 10. World class at Corners, but his crossing abiliy sucks. Good technique and dribbling skills but his flair is average. How many players like this do you have in the database? How many players like this exists in real football?

[tajj7]

On 9/15/2017 at 22:05, El Payaso said:

Spotted these on the tactics forum and these are again good examples. Small players (based on the jumping stat that all these have, these all are small players) should have some physical limitations. These all are physically superior while (maybe) being close to 170cm tall. The one player that comes into mind in this category at the top level and is a 'bulky' one is Alexis Sanchez and he is physically superior and an exception for sure in this category of small wide players but his strength for example is 'only' 11. These though reach close to the physical level that much bigger players like Ronaldo and Bale have. 

The smaller players like this should face difficulties reaching 10 on strength and a relatively high attribute maybe also on stamina and balance. But the only physical weakness these small players have is the jumping. These players for me are far too machine like players instead of looking like realistic footballers and they aren't even rare like @enigmatic already proved in his excellent thread in the bugs forum.

 

And because of cases like this I would so much love to have a training system in the game where you can actually make mistakes. Like for example training the strength too much for a small player and by that ruin some parts of his abilities by losing mobility.

 

I'm only 5' 9" but even with little gym work I am very strong and easily brush much taller players off the ball, I think linking height and strength is a fundamental error.  I am also still much quicker than most taller players. The only physical battles I lose out on are high ones. Also some extremely wiry looking people are still very strong, it's like core strength and again not really related to size. 

Akinfenwa is only 180 and he's is literally the beast. 

 

edit; @Leander That is a good box to box player no? I don't particularly see an issue with it.  Basically a complete player brought up more in the Ajax mould, some very technically astute attacking players do not have flair. 

[Guest El Payaso]

26 minutes ago, tajj7 said:

I'm only 5' 9" but even with little gym work I am very strong and easily brush much taller players off the ball, I think linking height and strength is a fundamental error.  I am also still much quicker than most taller players. The only physical battles I lose out on are high ones. Also some extremely wiry looking people are still very strong, it's like core strength and again not really related to size. 

Look at the existing players in the game and you will notice a clear trend that these small and technical players generally are much weaker physically than they are technically. Especially if you look at Spanish players in the game you will notice this. And I think that this whole 'too physical thing' is now a known issue as @enigmatic posted an excellent thread about this with clear evidence of newgens having too high physical attributes in general. 

The 'bad distribution' of newgen attributes is also a thing that I've also noticed but it's not that evident. Luckily I think that the thread in bugs area also covers this part. There isn't much point arguing on 'known issues'.

[tajj7]

3 minutes ago, El Payaso said:

Look at the existing players in the game and you will notice a clear trend that these small and technical players generally are much weaker physically than they are technically. Especially if you look at Spanish players in the game you will notice this. And I think that this whole 'too physical thing' is now a known issue as @enigmatic posted an excellent thread about this with clear evidence of newgens having too high physical attributes in general. 

The 'bad distribution' of newgen attributes is also a thing that I've also noticed but it's not that evident. Luckily I think that the thread in bugs area also covers this part.

It may well be that newgens start with too good physicals, but IMO it would be wrong to make a general assumption that short = lower strength or other similar assumptions based on height as there are plenty of real world examples that contradict that like Akinfenwa being short and massively strong, Bolt being tall and fast, Crouch being tall but relatively weak etc. 

making those assumptions means we'll end up with a load of Messis, weak ass short guys, when the real world is not like this. Strength has no real relation to height. 

[Guest El Payaso]

20 minutes ago, tajj7 said:

It may well be that newgens start with too good physicals, but IMO it would be wrong to make a general assumption that short = lower strength or other similar assumptions based on height as there are plenty of real world examples that contradict that like Akinfenwa being short and massively strong, Bolt being tall and fast, Crouch being tall but relatively weak etc. 

making those assumptions means we'll end up with a load of Messis, weak ass short guys, when the real world is not like this. Strength has no real relation to height. 

Akinfenwa is not a short guy or anywhere near of an average footballer as he is claimed to be the strongest footballer in the world and he cannot be used as an example that an average 170-175cm footballer should be. Based on my experience the smaller and technical footballers regularly do remind Messi in terms of attribute contribution: they are clearly better technically than they are physically. And even those 'bulkier' short players like Shaqiri and Alexis 'only' look physically like this in terms of attributes:

If you do not see a clear pattern in terms of physical attributes when you look at the players that play in more advanced playmaking roles and out wide or even in attack and are 170-175cm tall then I cannot force you to see it but in my experience this is quite clearly in the game as it should be. 

[HemHat]

Isn't Akinfenwa 5ft 10? So he's not that tall, really. He's the same height as Elokobi who is also a monster. 

 

Just googled it and he's 1.8metres so 5ft 9.

[yezzko]

2 hours ago, HemHat said:

Isn't Akinfenwa 5ft 10? So he's not that tall, really. He's the same height as Elokobi who is also a monster. 

 

Just googled it and he's 1.8metres so 5ft 9.

1.80m is 5'11"

[HemHat]

13 hours ago, yezzko said:

1.80m is 5'11"

Not according to google

To be honest, I thought he was taller than 5ft 9 anyway

[rcirani7]

14 minutes ago, HemHat said:

Not according to google

To be honest, I thought he was taller than 5ft 9 anyway

That's 5.9 feet rather than 5 feet 9 inches. Google doesn't do inches in that measurement. 1.8metres is 5'11".

[HemHat]

8 minutes ago, rcirani7 said:

That's 5.9 feet rather than 5 feet 9 inches. Google doesn't do inches in that measurement. 1.8metres is 5'11".

gotcha, ta.

[Guest El Payaso]

I've not played long enough my save to say anything about newgens but based on this topic the good ones still seem to develop into really good in terms of physical attributes. Some of these have better physicals at the age of 15 than some really good real life players at their prime. Especially if you compare them to players from Spain or to players that play down the flanks. Would expect that at the age of 15 it wouldn't be common to have physical attributes much higher than 10 especially in strength and balance etc. Not really surprised though. 

[Dan-smissen]

On 10/09/2017 at 09:21, herne79 said:

Players don't necessarily stop developing at age 24.  All players have their own development cycles - some may stop at age 18, others won't stop until later in their careers.  Some may develop as late bloomers.  That's just a few examples.

The rate of attribute development may slow once attributes get to a certain level (eg., faster to develop 6-10 than it may be to develop 16-20) but that may not have anything to do with age.

Anyway, re. your main point: if you believe there are issues and you have examples head over to the Bugs Forum and let SI take a look.

Is there a stat at all that helps tell you what type of player it is, I just assumed they would develop to 24.                                         

[Guest El Payaso]

Let's bump this thread up again with an example. I know that many of you will not see any problems here as the player has no super physical attributes but I do see once again here that this player for example has higher physicals than he possibly should have. A relatively small player who is 18 years old and Spanish. As a player he reminds me of maybe Cesc Fabregas or Dani Parejo but the difference is that way before his prime he beats both of them clearly in terms of physical attributes:

I've been reading the threads in team and player guides and I've seen plenty of 160-165cm players having 7-8 for strength already at the age of 15 and for me that makes no sense as something between 2-4 would be more logical. There also should be some limitations on how much the physicals can improve during the developing process as a player who is slow and weak at the age of 15 and will stay short and light throughout his career should not improve that massively in terms of physical attributes. We've seen lots of examples of this in real life as Cesc, Iniesta, Parejo etc. never developed their physicals to high levels. 

Something really needs to change in terms of these attributes as these overly athletic (small sized) players make no sense to me. 

[MBarbaric]

53 minuti fa, El Payaso ha scritto:

a player who is slow and weak at the age of 15 and will stay short and light throughout his career should not improve that massively in terms of physical attributes.

i might be missing the point, but at age of 15 the development might have only started and by the age of around 20 that player might be 20cm taller and 20 kilos heavier. There's no way of telling if he will stay short or grow (well, unless you check his family tree at least). Also, kids of that age can already be strong and developed and you could clearly tell if that is the case. Coaches are thought to recognize these signs (not that it is difficult beard, body hair, the diameter of a thigh...).  That being said, it is maybe one player in a group of 20 so overall numbers in FM do look off. However, it is difficult to judge without any significant data pulled out from the game itself. 

 

[Guest El Payaso]

2 hours ago, MBarbaric said:

i might be missing the point, but at age of 15 the development might have only started and by the age of around 20 that player might be 20cm taller and 20 kilos heavier. There's no way of telling if he will stay short or grow (well, unless you check his family tree at least). Also, kids of that age can already be strong and developed and you could clearly tell if that is the case. Coaches are thought to recognize these signs (not that it is difficult beard, body hair, the diameter of a thigh...).  That being said, it is maybe one player in a group of 20 so overall numbers in FM do look off. However, it is difficult to judge without any significant data pulled out from the game itself. 

 

I know this also but there needs to be a balance and there should be those really good players (like most of more skill-based players) that never reach high physical attributes. On FM many of those high PA players have straight from the beginning physical attributes close to some in their prime good footballers and I doubt that none of the newgens end up having difficulties developing their physical attributes. If you for example look at for example Spanish playmakers/wingers you can see a clear pattern that they are technically gifted and intelligent but majority of them lack on physical attributes such as strength, balance, even stamina and movement. That example above based on height/weight would be ideal to have something similar in terms of attribute as Cesc/Silva/Parejo/Iniesta have but he is far beyond them in terms of physicals.

[Guest El Payaso]

Based on these it's quite clear that the same problems still exist on FM 2018. Even those 5 feet something players are physical beasts. I think that @Makoto Nakamura could upload his save for SI to look at. I think that in future editions of the game there needs to be a change on how physical attributes develop as most wingers and midfield playmakers in real life never develop strong physically. You can for example take a look for Spanish national team midfielders (and even defenders) in the beginning of the game and you will not find these kind of physical attributes on players on their prime. And same applies to any national team but I actually checked Spain myself and the difference is huge. 

 

[ferrarinseb]

14 minutes ago, El Payaso said:

Based on these it's quite clear that the same problems still exist on FM 2018. Even those 5 feet something players are physical beasts. I think that @Makoto Nakamura could upload his save for SI to look at. I think that in future editions of the game there needs to be a change on how physical attributes develop as most wingers and midfield playmakers in real life never develop strong physically. You can for example take a look for Spanish national team midfielders (and even defenders) in the beginning of the game and you will not find these kind of physical attributes on players on their prime. And same applies to any national team but I actually checked Spain myself and the difference is huge. 

 

Messi / Maradona / Ronaldo Reincarnations into single player body

I said this already SI need to balance the Physical attributes with some limit on their height and Weight, no way a heavy player can have high agility as well as short player can have incredible jumping reach. 

Might be some sort of weight and Height Set need to be established like

Height 5-5.5 - Jumping reach at max can be 10-12

5.5-6 - Jumping reach at max can be 13-16

higher than 6.5 he was taller already.

Similar with Weight and its respective attributes , its not easy to be this simple but i hope some sort of mechanism or procedure should be established so that we won't have Super Human players in the Game 

 

Edit : it looks like Physical limit is way over but height is respectable in this version. I remember having (not a Brilliant player) in one save has 5.3 ht but has 20 Jumping reach  

But still the strength is incredible.

 

[Guest El Payaso]

2 minutes ago, ferrarinseb said:

Messi / Maradona / Ronaldo Reincarnations into single player body

Exactly. I think that there should be lot more of those players who are not willing or don't have the 'genes' to develop strong physicals like so many players that play in La Liga do. The list of skillful and intelligent but physically lacking midfielders or wingers is really long in the beginning of the game but the game doesn't seem to produce those kind of players, especially if they have high PA. Physical attributes should be a lot 'harder' to train but currently it seems that they just automatically grow as automatically as other attributes and even some 15-year-old (and small size) players already have quite high ones compared to real life players straight when they appear.