[FM22] The Great San Marino Challenge

[TacticalGenius]

Just a quick update - I’m into Serie D, lost 2 games in the season and won the league with 3 games to spare. Struggled financially during the season with wage budget and bringing in players but we’ve rectified that with a big rebuild for the new season. 
 

Different mentality from the board regarding my coaching badges this time though. First attempt, they’d never approve, saying it’d get me poached. This board however keep accepting! I’m doing my National A right now. 

[Giveit2Giroud]

Excited to finally be able to start this journey and my first post-beta save of the year, and what better time to do so than the night our boys had almost the entire world behind them (Anyone know why the main man Berardi wasn't playing? hes carried me for the first few years of this challenge every FM) 

If I can avoid conceding double figures at home to England I will be sending my save off to the Sammarinese FA and demanding the job IRL

On to the formalities

Database:

The database speaks for itself really, just including for proof I disabled any funny business with the editor when I win the world cup in a few posts time 

We shall of course be managing Victor San Marino in the eccellenza along with the national team job from the get-go

Spoiler

 

 

 

The Gaffer:

Andy Selva, named after the legendary record goalscorer of the national team. I've gone with the recommended National A badges along with Sunday league experience. I was tempted to start with no badges at all but the save is going to be hard enough as it is...

As for points allocations I've gone with the "Taskmaster" build, simply because im binge-watching the show of the same name. I dont see it mattering too much in a long-term save like this with coaching courses a high priority

Had a bit of fun with the gaffers look, as a one club/nation save it only felt right

Spoiler

 

Expectations:

Of course, the aim of the save is the same as everyone else. Bring international glory to the minnows of San Marino with a World Cup. However I also wanted to discuss the board expectations at club level - the demands of instant success seem daunting at first although the squad does look surprisingly capable given the level. Also I love the addition of the "sign Sammarinese players" club culture which I'm guessing is Claassen's doing - shout out to the legend himself - which i think really adds to the immersion despite being a minor detail.

Spoiler

Thanks @6499red for running the thread this year, I've always played along at home but this year I hope interacting with the thread will help me push on when it becomes a bit of a slog-fest about 10 years in

Special mentions also to Duesouth, Tactical Genius and Claasen for their contributions already in this thread but also throughout the years of the SM challenge

 

P.S: I swear I better not be the first to not be able to get 3 points against Andorra

[6499red]

32 minutes ago, Giveit2Giroud said:

Excited to finally be able to start this journey and my first post-beta save of the year, and what better time to do so than the night our boys had almost the entire world behind them (Anyone know why the main man Berardi wasn't playing? hes carried me for the first few years of this challenge every FM) 

If I can avoid conceding double figures at home to England I will be sending my save off to the Sammarinese FA and demanding the job IRL

On to the formalities

Database:

The database speaks for itself really, just including for proof I disabled any funny business with the editor when I win the world cup in a few posts time 

We shall of course be managing Victor San Marino in the eccellenza along with the national team job from the get-go

  Hide contents

 

 

 

The Gaffer:

Andy Selva, named after the legendary record goalscorer of the national team. I've gone with the recommended National A badges along with Sunday league experience. I was tempted to start with no badges at all but the save is going to be hard enough as it is...

As for points allocations I've gone with the "Taskmaster" build, simply because im binge-watching the show of the same name. I dont see it mattering too much in a long-term save like this with coaching courses a high priority

Had a bit of fun with the gaffers look, as a one club/nation save it only felt right

  Hide contents

 

Expectations:

Of course, the aim of the save is the same as everyone else. Bring international glory to the minnows of San Marino with a World Cup. However I also wanted to discuss the board expectations at club level - the demands of instant success seem daunting at first although the squad does look surprisingly capable given the level. Also I love the addition of the "sign Sammarinese players" club culture which I'm guessing is Claassen's doing - shout out to the legend himself - which i think really adds to the immersion despite being a minor detail.

  Hide contents

Thanks @6499red for running the thread this year, I've always played along at home but this year I hope interacting with the thread will help me push on when it becomes a bit of a slog-fest about 10 years in

Special mentions also to Duesouth, Tactical Genius and Claasen for their contributions already in this thread but also throughout the years of the SM challenge

 

P.S: I swear I better not be the first to not be able to get 3 points against Andorra

Awesome!

hehe dont worry already lost that game 3-2 earlier this evening and 7-0 to albania but only 4-0 to England ?!?!, safe to say the NT will be on the backburner for a while.

[Handyfernandy]

Hi everyone. I will post my experience with Victor San Marino and San Marino National team

With Victor San Marino i don't have problem. just using tiki-taka 4231 with custom instruction i become champions. only lose 4 times and scoring 54 goal and conceded for 15 (best defence in league) 

Next. In transfer windows i only sign 4 player who 3 player come in with free transfer (Andrea Giogetti a gem from San Marino Academy,  Samuele Mugelli because need strong peolple in my midfielder, Alessio Cargiolli who scoring so much gol for Victor San Marino, and Filippo Fabbri with loan.

Unfortunately, for the San Marino national team it is still difficult to win. The only good result was when they beat Andorra 2-0

For youth intake, I have a player who has a very high star rating, namely Alberto Rinaldi. but if you look at the stats, it's like an ordinary player, nothing special. M1 mean player who had prospect for season 1

Thanks all 

cc @6499red

[deadfncat]

8 hours ago, 6499red said:

Teams only get promoted from the playout if teams from serie C go bankrupt in real life - and only after coming out on top against the winners of the playoffs from the other groups - in real life. As clubs don't stop playing in FM, this would never happen in a game. Is this how it is supposed to happen @claassen?

 

@deadfncat @The Regista @oskumustatuli

 

Edit: so you'd have to win your group to get promoted.

 

have to place first to get promoted is rough! are there that many teams going bankrupt in Serie C to need this? if so, thats wild

[deadfncat]

result!

also im now fluent I guess! Luigi spaghetti!

Edited November 16, 2021 by deadfncat

[Feliks]

Hi just a quick question, is the club at a low enough level that it would be feasible to only sign Sammarinese players for the whole playthrough?

[duesouth]

3 minutes ago, Feliks said:

Hi just a quick question, is the club at a low enough level that it would be feasible to only sign Sammarinese players for the whole playthrough?

I think you would struggle if you went Sammarinese only.  Not only quality, but numbers.  There are a bunch of 15/16 year old new gens created at the start of the save, but you can't sign them as there's a bug with player registration for these - they would have been useful backups.  Even with dynamic youth ratings possibly helping a bit (and we don't yet know how much), you'll also struggle to move beyond Serie C with Sammarinese only.  Doing this with a San Marino League club is a better fit as your youth intakes are more in keeping with the level of the league.  The issue there is the League allows 9 foreign players and most teams take up that allocation - so you'd have to release all of them (easy as it's non-contract so you can do so without financial penalty) and then get signing - but the new gen bug isn't an issue here, so you can at least sign a few as backups.

If you want to have a crack, then go for it - but it would be a very hard way of doing what is a pretty long term and difficult challenge.  Whichever way you go - good luck!

[duesouth]

9 hours ago, Giveit2Giroud said:

Anyone know why the main man Berardi wasn't playing?

He's injured - out 6-9 months with a torn ACL.  He wasn't in the National Pool in my save - had a bit of a panic, but found him!

[6499red]

acheivements updated until this post.

[Handyfernandy]

i found this 3d kits of San Marino National Team

 

maybe make national kits better 

San Marino National Kits.rar

[TacticalGenius]

Can't say we didn't try...

[wkdsoul]

not done this since FM15/16, might boot this up 

[janis]

Anyone already saw an increase in youth rating playing this challange? I do not and I'm doing pretty good going in season 6. Only playing in the sanmarinese league and national team.

[tom100496]

Hi guys, 

 

this is something i really want to do but I have FM22 on Epic Games, not Steam. Is there a way to get these leagues on Epic Games?

 

TY

[6499red]

24 minutes ago, tom100496 said:

Hi guys, 

 

this is something i really want to do but I have FM22 on Epic Games, not Steam. Is there a way to get these leagues on Epic Games?

 

TY

You could use steam workshop downloader with the links maybe?

[tom100496]

6 minutes ago, 6499red said:

You could use steam workshop downloader with the links maybe?

Is that a thing? Will google and try

[LUFCspeni]

Serie D completed! Won the league with ease, lost in the cup semi.

Unfortunately my 2 best players won't sign a new contract, so a major rebuild needed for Serie C!

[duesouth]

16 minutes ago, LUFCspeni said:

Unfortunately my 2 best players won't sign a new contract, so a major rebuild needed for Serie C!

Well played - did you change the team much between Eccellenza and Serie D?  You might get lucky with some loans in Serie C - now you're full time training, Serie A clubs might well be willing to send a player or two your way.

[LUFCspeni]

Just now, duesouth said:

Well played - did you change the team much between Eccellenza and Serie D?  You might get lucky with some loans in Serie C - now you're full time training, Serie A clubs might well be willing to send a player or two your way.

Not really - kept the core of my team together and strengthened with 3 or 4 good signings. Hopefully I can bring some quality in on loan, we have no cash and no quality otherwise! 

 

 

[Sageda]

Best Sanmaranese player on the youth intake and he dosent want to represent the national team  any advice?

[HHUK]

3 hours ago, janis said:

Anyone already saw an increase in youth rating playing this challange? I do not and I'm doing pretty good going in season 6. Only playing in the sanmarinese league and national team.

From my holiday game I'm seeing up to 2 points increase per season, no big success other than my Victor San Marino getting promoted to Serie C and stabilizing around mid table. The international team are losing per usual. I'm gonna hazard a guess that the youth rating is so low it'll naturally creep up by itself for a while. 

 

I feel that pain Sageda.

Sometimes you just can't tempt Sammarinese players to represent the national team, I've had players get 2 international caps and then jump ship to Italy, they sometimes come back a few years down the line once they've not made it into the Italy setup.

[The Regista]

@6499redcan you knock off the Eccellenza Cup for me please?

[TacticalGenius]

1 hour ago, Sageda said:

Best Sanmaranese player on the youth intake and he dosent want to represent the national team  any advice?

If he’s not interested there’s nothing you can do but hope that he realises he won’t get an Italy call-up and eventually reconsiders. Unfortunately it’s something you’ll have to get used to from the better dual-nationality players that see themselves as too good for SM. 

[Handyfernandy]

Great news for San Marino Football Future 

[Handyfernandy]

and all gone with the wind  

[janis]

10 hours ago, HHUK said:

From my holiday game I'm seeing up to 2 points increase per season, no big success other than my Victor San Marino getting promoted to Serie C and stabilizing around mid table. The international team are losing per usual. I'm gonna hazard a guess that the youth rating is so low it'll naturally creep up by itself for a while. 

 

I feel that pain Sageda.

Sometimes you just can't tempt Sammarinese players to represent the national team, I've had players get 2 international caps and then jump ship to Italy, they sometimes come back a few years down the line once they've not made it into the Italy setup.

Thanks for your answer!

Then maybe it goes super slow or it doenst recognize the evolution my sanmarinese team is making.

[duesouth]

4 minutes ago, janis said:

Thanks for your answer!

Then maybe it goes super slow or it doenst recognize the evolution my sanmarinese team is making.

In my long term FM19 save, I tended to be able to get low-level dual talent to play for me - so with your guy, just keep asking him a week or so before each international squad announcement.  He's not getting called up to Italy, so zero chance you'll lose him.  I'd like to think the game AI would see the light - more a case of when not if - but it is a bit of a weakness with FM (and indeed it might be worth raising a bug report as in the real world he would accept your call up).  Sometimes you get the chance of a discussion with a player and you can promise him he'll start etc. which can swing it for you.

In terms of top talent when you get to Serie A - the only thing that changed things for me was qualifying for the World Cup Finals - I had a dual keeper who at the time was with Italy U21 - but I asked before I picked the World Cup squad and he accepted.  He went on to be a world class keeper - so amazing that I got him!  You can try holding back players a bit - but I had a left back who developed really well even without me trying and I lost him - for him to get only 14 Italian caps .

If you have any dual players who accept - play them in a qualifier/Nation's League game sharpish and then they will be locked in.

[janis]

1 hour ago, duesouth said:

In my long term FM19 save, I tended to be able to get low-level dual talent to play for me - so with your guy, just keep asking him a week or so before each international squad announcement.  He's not getting called up to Italy, so zero chance you'll lose him.  I'd like to think the game AI would see the light - more a case of when not if - but it is a bit of a weakness with FM (and indeed it might be worth raising a bug report as in the real world he would accept your call up).  Sometimes you get the chance of a discussion with a player and you can promise him he'll start etc. which can swing it for you.

In terms of top talent when you get to Serie A - the only thing that changed things for me was qualifying for the World Cup Finals - I had a dual keeper who at the time was with Italy U21 - but I asked before I picked the World Cup squad and he accepted.  He went on to be a world class keeper - so amazing that I got him!  You can try holding back players a bit - but I had a left back who developed really well even without me trying and I lost him - for him to get only 14 Italian caps .

If you have any dual players who accept - play them in a qualifier/Nation's League game sharpish and then they will be locked in.

Yeah I know, I meant that the youth rating for the national team hasn't changed although I have really good results with my team in the san marinese league.

[duesouth]

6 minutes ago, janis said:

Yeah I know, I meant that the youth rating for the national team hasn't changed although I have really good results with my team in the san marinese league.

In previous FM's, it wasn't only results that improved the leagues ranking - but facility/stadium upgrades etc.  I would say results in Europe were a help, as your co-efficient improves which helps rep.

The new dynamic youth ratings, I've personally assumed is more linked to the National Team results/world ranking, but I don't know if SI have told us exactly how they work.  I don't know if anyone has tested it - would need a bunch of holidaying way into the future, but with a little user input to ensure clubs and subsequently national teams grow.  I think we'll have to keep an eye on this and figure out what helps.  Tactical Genius seems to be playing the quickest - he's had some success with the NT, so one would assume there would be a slight tick up of the youth rating, but can we see it without the in-game editor?

[duesouth]

@janis I was going to ask in the main forum - but there's already a thread - it's interesting reading:

[janis]

5. Nations without leagues in the game will not see a change in their youth rating.

 

I think this may cause a problem in my save. Because i'm playing in the san marinese league only and the league is not standard in the game. But I will keep informing you guys here.

Thanks for the link you send!

[duesouth]

3 minutes ago, janis said:

5. Nations without leagues in the game will not see a change in their youth rating.

 

I think this may cause a problem in my save. Because i'm playing in the san marinese league only and the league is not standard in the game. But I will keep informing you guys here.

Thanks for the link you send!

I read that as leagues loaded in your save - so would hope we'll be OK.  Hopefully SI will give us some firm feedback - or users will figure it out!

[Sageda]

So i finished 3rd in serie D and i made the playout

I won the playout but next season as started and im at the same level 

 

Does anyone know why?

 

Edited November 17, 2021 by Sageda

[janis]

16 minutes ago, Sageda said:

So i finished 3rd in serie D and i made the playout

I won the playout but next season as started and im at the same level 

 

Does anyone know why?

 

They've talked about that a few posts above you.

[deadfncat]

yeh you need to win the league sadly. Speaking of which

 

gotta win this too i guess

 

 

 

 

This wasnt easy. gotta win a whole other cup after winning the league against all the other winners. what a nightmare

Edited November 17, 2021 by deadfncat

[Rainbowz]

Gonna try this challenge with Victor San Marino. My challenge is that I'm only going to sign Sammarinese players. I've loaded San Marino leagues to give me more of a pool to pull from. I think with San Marino Academy producing better players this year and clubs from Italy occasionally generating San Marino players, this challenge is a lot more doable than it would have been in previous years.

I'm allowing myself to use non-Sammarinese players who come through my youth system and players already at the club for obvious reasons.

2021-22 Season

An excellent start as we made good on our favourites tag and were promoted to Serie D. The season was pretty frustrating, we dominated most teams we played, but got held to a lot of draws. Thankfully we had enough to earn promotion.

Transfers

Denis De Angelis

A bit of a weird one. Solid defensively, but his height rules him out of ever being a defender. His lack of ability going forward means he'll never be a full-back either. His teamwork and work rate are incredible though, and there's definitely a player to be had here. I just need to work out what to do with him.

Nicola Forcellini

The pick of the bunch. 16 years old and already a nailed-on Serie D starter. Pretty poor technically, but those mentals and physicals give me a lot to be excited about. Could be something special, but for now he's already a key player in my team.

Alessandro Della Valle

A promising looking CB. Love the determination and bravery. Nothing standout aside from that, but if he develops he could definitely be a solid CB for the team. 

Pick of the Youths

Mattia Gazzola

My coaches seem really high on Gazzola, reckoning he has a good amount of potential and is likely good enough to be a backup player for us in Serie D. I like his versatility too. I'm tempted to make him a ball-playing defender as I'm fairly stocked in midfield, but time will tell where he ends up

Manager's Thoughts

We're predicted lower-midtable in Serie D, but I think we have enough about us to finish in the top half. I'm going to keep a close eye on the development of my players as I know there has been a lot of debate over whether youths can develop at small clubs in this version of FM. Hopefully with the game time I'm planning on giving some of my more promising players, they can flourish.

 

[deadfncat]

we're going home!

[TacticalGenius]

15 minutes ago, deadfncat said:

we're going home!

Same happened on my original save. Definitely cheaper than a new stadium!

[6499red]

18 minutes ago, deadfncat said:

we're going home!

Lovely to see, and much more realistic than building a new stadium, too

[Handyfernandy]

29 minutes ago, deadfncat said:

we're going home!

Wow very realistic, can't wait to promotion to Serie C 

[LUFCspeni]

Just trying to sort out my Serie C rebuild, and I've got a problem. Due to the board philosophy of signing Sammarinese players, they are blocking me from signing anyone else because they aren't happy!

[duesouth]

Just checking out the Serie D rules on wikipedia and the key note is:

"Winning play-offs doesn't grant promotion to Serie C, but a chance to get admitted in case of vacancies."

"In recent years, one or more teams from the professional leagues have normally failed to meet the regulatory or financial requirements in order to participate. This usually creates vacancies that get announced in the summer rest period as the new season is being organized. As teams move up to fill the void created by these failed teams or teams in the lowest professional division fail, spaces are created in Serie C that need to be filled.

For example, in the 2007–08 season there were nine such failures, and thus, nine Serie C spaces were created. Four of those spaces were filled by calling back teams that had played in Serie C but were relegated to Serie D for the next season. The other five vacancies were filled by Serie D teams that had participated in the Serie D playoffs."

In real life, it looks like additional "vacancies" occur as teams get "excluded" or cease to exist.  That is not going to happen in FM.

So, "Winning play-offs doesn't grant promotion to Serie C, but a chance to get admitted in case of vacancies" in FM = Winning play-offs means nothing as there won't be any "vacancies" caused by clubs breaking the rules or folding.

While I'm in rules mode - trying to understand the Serie C relegation rules - and basically you need a degree in Serie C!!  So, in Serie C last season 3 teams were "Excluded and relegated to Serie D" - and another club was excluded and folded.  In Group C, 1 team was relegated and 2 were in the relegation playoffs.  In Group B, 1 team was relegated and 4 were in the relegation playoffs.  That difference has to do with the number of points you are from the relegation playoff team you would be paired with in any playoff.  So, in Group A - Carrarese on 44 points and Pro Sesto on 43 points were more than 8 points ahead of Pistoiese and Lucchese respectfully (both 31 points) so no relegation playoff was played and therefore Pistoiese and Lucchese went down automatically.  But (turning into Bob Hale) - not for long - as they were re-admitted - no idea why!!

Finally, regarding deadfncat's point that you have to win the Poule Scudetto as well to get promoted.  Pretty sure that's always been a meaningless thing other than getting another trophy.  Can anyone who has won their Serie D division but not the Poule Scudetto as well confirm they still got promoted?

Hopefully then we are all aware of the rules heading into Serie D - and also what to expect if you are at the wrong end of the Serie C table.  @6499red - once clear about the Poule Scudetto point, it might be worth mentioning the Serie D playoffs aren't going to mean promotion in the OP - just to avoid people running around the house in celebration at winning the playoffs only to be faced with another year in Serie D!!

Clear?  No, thought not!!

Edited November 17, 2021 by duesouth

[TacticalGenius]

8 minutes ago, LUFCspeni said:

Just trying to sort out my Serie C rebuild, and I've got a problem. Due to the board philosophy of signing Sammarinese players, they are blocking me from signing anyone else because they aren't happy!

Having the same issue in Serie D. 😩

[duesouth]

7 minutes ago, LUFCspeni said:

Just trying to sort out my Serie C rebuild, and I've got a problem. Due to the board philosophy of signing Sammarinese players, they are blocking me from signing anyone else because they aren't happy!

Can you sign a few youngsters (from San Marino Academy, for example - won't cost you as they are non-contract) and then they'll release the restrictions?  I'm still miles away from the end of season 1 in my save, so will make a note to sign some Sammarinese players to keep the board happy!  Have shortlisted Nanni, Fabbri and a couple of others - but they don't always want to sign for the club.  I also have a scout permanently in San Marino set to find any players under 19 with half decent potential, not sure how many would appear if I was in Serie C though.

[duesouth]

18 minutes ago, TacticalGenius said:

Having the same issue in Serie D. 😩

Next time I get the chance to negotiate the club vision, I'm going to try to get that removed - can't say I've had much success doing that in the past though!!

[TacticalGenius]

30 minutes ago, duesouth said:

Next time I get the chance to negotiate the club vision, I'm going to try to get that removed - can't say I've had much success doing that in the past though!!

It’s not through lack of trying either. I’ve signed up some Sammarinese, anyone that looks like they might have a chance of breaking into the NT or the club first team, but evidently it’s not enough. There’s a couple of players in Serie C I’ve tried to loan, and a newgen winger at AC Milan who’s not interested in a loan either. I don’t want to sign players for the sake of it, but it looks like I’ll have to just to tick boxes. 

[TacticalGenius]

Also, San Marino Academy appear to be playing in an u20 Italian league, and as such seem to have more Italian newgens than Sammarinese…

Edited November 17, 2021 by TacticalGenius

[TacticalGenius]

WE'RE INTO THE TOP 200!

[Giveit2Giroud]

20 minutes ago, TacticalGenius said:

WE'RE INTO THE TOP 200!

Good work. Interested to see if nation ranking is the biggest driving force behind improving the dynamic youth rating