Such a Lack of Talent in FM10

Now, I love the database in Football Manager. It's the main reason why I buy FM over Fifa or PES, because it's so realistic.

However, this years database has a huge lack of talent in my opinion. The vast majority of stats just seem to be down to reputation or nation.

For instance, the fact that only about 8 or 9 players (out of like 400,000+) have -10 potential. Africa is bloody ridiculous. Ghana seems to be the only country that can produce talent. I was looking through the editor and found some African countries have as little as 12 players in the whole database.

English talent is very much hierarchy based. Things like Ashley Young going from Watford to Aston Villa could never happen if it was up to the FM10 database. If you're playing in the BSP, you can get players from Reunion who are 3 times as good as English players of the same level and half the price. Go lower than the top clubs in League One, and potential just doesn't seem to exist.

Brazil, on the other hand, is a totally different story. There is talent in all levels of Brazillian football and consistency has been used in the way it should be. Some players have great stats but there consistency is so low that they shine for a couple of matches and then disappear. The way it is in real life and the way it should be. Youth players show up every year in football who seem to be great prospects but they aren't consistant enough to become wonderkids (Maceda anyone?)

maybe try a larger database, you might have it set at small or meduim when you started the game.

also they are there, even if your on large, you can load players from any country manually.

SI probs dont set all players loaded as default as most PCs wouldnt be able to handle it.

maybe try a larger database, you might have it set at small or meduim when you started the game.

also they are there, even if your on large, you can load players from any country manually.

SI probs dont set all players loaded as default as most PCs wouldnt be able to handle it.

I'm not talking about in-game. I've been looking through the editor for the last few weeks, and thats were I've noticed this.

Honestly i understand what you mean. There is a serious lack of talent in africa and thats no joke. I do getyoung signings from ghana though caus they produce decent players i also created a ghanian league so i can send scouts there to watch young youths play. Yeah and the talent in brazil is incerdible i always go there to sign players. There's only certain countries which are send my scouts to to scout young players which are Ghana,Brazil,england,spain,potugal,germany,france,chine or south korea and italy because of a serious lack of talent. I really think this is a subject SI need to pick up on.

well, I would say Africa is largely unexplored irl, thus also same in FM.

SI has the tendency to be conservative rather than exaggerating.

You find a good researcher for each club out there then and I am sure SI will utilise them

Africa is not unexplored.. look at all the african players in the various leagues around the world..

Africa is not unexplored.. look at all the african players in the various leagues around the world..

depends on whether those african players started their footballing career in an african country or not i would think. for example, i think , alot of ivory coast players start in the french leagues in real life.

When you talk "talents" you mainly mean "players that will play in Premier League/La Liga" or whatever. With a large database loaded, all players from Africa, I've noticed that countries like Mali, Guinea, Togo, Nigeria and Cameroon consistently produces players that will be very good players for any semi-big league in Europe (e.g. Czech, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Belgium, Holland and so on). The fact that there's not very many that seem to have the potential to breach into PL/LL sides isn't all that unrealistic. Most african players with anything close to potential usually generates in French clubs.

None of the Ivory Coast's World Cup squad in 2006 were playing in the domestic league. Furthermore, who had heard of Drogba, Essien or Toure before they arrived in France?

There are problems researching the African nations. As far as I'm aware, Blue Lou is doing most of them almost single handedly, and doing a good job.

depends on whether those african players started their footballing career in an african country or not i would think. for example, i think , alot of ivory coast players start in the french leagues in real life.

Yes, but obviously these players were born in Africa and played football in Africa underage teams. so they must have been "explored" by the French clubs.

There must be sources of research around the place, just look at the fan made databases that have been made throughout the years.

I imagine it is hard to research good african prospects, a right back from the Nigeria U 17 is a nice prospect in the Bosingwa mould but he played for a church side

or maybe those "African" players playing in Europe actually spent their childhood in Europe? Not all, but a lot of them.

Also i think some of these african players move with their families when there are young to get a better life as well in France. I think this be hard to incorporate into the game.

True, but the African thing wasn't my thing and I think most people have misunderstood me. I'm not saying there should be piles and piles of wonderkids pouring out of Africa. Just that there should be more decent players around the world. I mean, there is hidden talent all around the world that you won't realise unless you look for it.

Ecuador, Iran, Mexico, Mali, Israel, Serbia, Croatia, Turkey, China etc. At the moment, there are loads of players playing in these countries who are capable of improving into the 130-160 CA range.

Consistency isn't being used right in my opinion either. Another football fan once said to me that a Sunday League player can make a pass like Xavi, the only difference between him and Xavi is that Xavi can do it consistantly

True, but the African thing wasn't my thing and I think most people have misunderstood me. I'm not saying there should be piles and piles of wonderkids pouring out of Africa. Just that there should be more decent players around the world. I mean, there is hidden talent all around the world that you won't realise unless you look for it.

Ecuador, Iran, Mexico, Mali, Israel, Serbia, Croatia, Turkey, China etc. At the moment, there are loads of players playing in these countries who are capable of improving into the 130-160 CA range.

Consistency isn't being used right in my opinion either. Another football fan once said to me that a Sunday League player can make a pass like Xavi, the only difference between him and Xavi is that Xavi can do it consistantly

Actually there are decent players around the world but you have to load many leagues and that slows down the game a lot,that's something SI need to improve even more.And a Sunday league player cant make a pass like Xavi or dribble like Ronaldinho.If you ever see one let me know

Poland is kinda screwed up as well. They overrate and underrate us at the same time! =P

You are a bit misled, at the start of the game yes there isn't a great amount of lower league talent around, but there isn't irl. Jermaine Beckford is the only one making a few noises in the lower leagues and possibly Alex Smithies as to interest at higher levels. Those are both, at much lower clubs (in the hierarchy) than the then recently relegated Watford. But Beckford is unproven whereas Young wasn't, and Leeds are pricing him out of the market. Add in the fact, that no one above the championship actually rates him, and even then there's only a few outside of Leeds that do.

It's incredibly hard to incorporate global politics into FM though, a lot of families have moved from some african countries in the late 80's/90's when these players were kids to countries such as France (historically, several African nations were part of their empire if memory servers) so language was less of an issue. Hence, they were picked up by French clubs.

I think a "premiership" player is a CA of 120 or above, possibly as low as 115. Obviously, not the major clubs but the lesser clubs will have fringe players and even a couple of first teamers around this level. The fact is, you can get players this good as low as league 2 and due to mental stats and stats such as consistency.

I struggle to see whether this is a problem you see with regens as well as the default database, but the simple matter of fact is, -9 or PA's up to 190 are for world class players. When you think about it, -10 players in real life as youngsters would have had to be Pele, Maradonna, Gordon Banks, Lev Yashin, George Best, Ronaldo, Zinedine Zidane, Beckenbauer, Stanley Matthews... Are you honestly going to suggest there is that many players to be mentioned in the same breath as them.

Messi and Ronaldo may be added to those names in years to come, or they may prove to only be at the top for a short period of their career. Simple matter of fact is, Gerrard, Lampard, Kaka, Terry, Shearer, Del Piero, Giggs, Xavi, Iniesta, Casillas, Buffon - they would have been -9 players in my own opinion on the database (as youngsters), and they are that in reality in most cases.

Yes, but obviously these players were born in Africa and played football in Africa underage teams. so they must have been "explored" by the French clubs.

There must be sources of research around the place, just look at the fan made databases that have been made throughout the years.

And the solution to that in FM was that 15-16yo African players get generated in French clubs. Simple as that. Many of those African players did IRL move to France at age 7-14 anyways, so...

Actually there are decent players around the world but you have to load many leagues and that slows down the game a lot,that's something SI need to improve even more.And a Sunday league player cant make a pass like Xavi or dribble like Ronaldinho.If you ever see one let me know

Why can't they? Whats the difference between a 40 yard pass straight to someone's chest from a Sunday League football and a 40 yard pass straight to someone's chest from Xavi?

You are a bit misled, at the start of the game yes there isn't a great amount of lower league talent around, but there isn't irl. Jermaine Beckford is the only one making a few noises in the lower leagues and possibly Alex Smithies as to interest at higher levels. Those are both, at much lower clubs (in the hierarchy) than the then recently relegated Watford. But Beckford is unproven whereas Young wasn't, and Leeds are pricing him out of the market. Add in the fact, that no one above the championship actually rates him, and even then there's only a few outside of Leeds that do.

It's incredibly hard to incorporate global politics into FM though, a lot of families have moved from some african countries in the late 80's/90's when these players were kids to countries such as France (historically, several African nations were part of their empire if memory servers) so language was less of an issue. Hence, they were picked up by French clubs.

I think a "premiership" player is a CA of 120 or above, possibly as low as 115. Obviously, not the major clubs but the lesser clubs will have fringe players and even a couple of first teamers around this level. The fact is, you can get players this good as low as league 2 and due to mental stats and stats such as consistency.

I struggle to see whether this is a problem you see with regens as well as the default database, but the simple matter of fact is, -9 or PA's up to 190 are for world class players. When you think about it, -10 players in real life as youngsters would have had to be Pele, Maradonna, Gordon Banks, Lev Yashin, George Best, Ronaldo, Zinedine Zidane, Beckenbauer, Stanley Matthews... Are you honestly going to suggest there is that many players to be mentioned in the same breath as them.

Messi and Ronaldo may be added to those names in years to come, or they may prove to only be at the top for a short period of their career. Simple matter of fact is, Gerrard, Lampard, Kaka, Terry, Shearer, Del Piero, Giggs, Xavi, Iniesta, Casillas, Buffon - they would have been -9 players in my own opinion on the database (as youngsters), and they are that in reality in most cases.

Bloody hell, thats one good post. Not really sure how to respond to it. I still feel that there should be more talent around the world. If you ever played Asterix FM2009 Complete Overhaul, then maybe you might be able to understand what I mean, but other than that I don't know how to word my post to respond.

Why can't they? Whats the difference between a 40 yard pass straight to someone's chest from a Sunday League football and a 40 yard pass straight to someone's chest from Xavi?

Xavi can probably do it consistently and has proven he can do it at a much higher level.

Bloody hell, thats one good post. Not really sure how to respond to it. I still feel that there should be more talent around the world. If you ever played Asterix FM2009 Complete Overhaul, then maybe you might be able to understand what I mean, but other than that I don't know how to word my post to respond.

Researchers can only rate the talents that are there though. "Only" 8 or 9 -10 players is realistic, -10 guarantees world class potential, and the possibility of the player becoming the best player ever.

There are plenty of -9s and -8s around, and -7s can still become good Premier League players.

As for Africa, it's not easy to find researchers and there's a lot less information around on African football.

Your Ashley Young example - why not? If there are many potential 160 CA+ players in the Championship, they'll be rated that way. In reality though, there aren't that many players in the lower leagues with that sort of potential.

Actually there are decent players around the world but you have to load many leagues and that slows down the game a lot,that's something SI need to improve even more.And a Sunday league player cant make a pass like Xavi or dribble like Ronaldinho.If you ever see one let me know

I've made the kind of tackles that Stuart Pearce in his pomp would be proud of. The difference, as a few have already pointed out, is that Psycho would do it consistently, whereas I pull of tackles like that once a season, and the rest of the time I'm wondering around aimlessly generally being rubbish and whinging at the ref. So I do agree that the difference is consistency.

When I start a new game, I have to get the players on my pre-loaded shortlist. I feel that if I dont get them and they move to other teams, that particular career is as good as dead.

Xavi can probably do it consistently and has proven he can do it at a much higher level.

Exactly that was my point

Researchers can only rate the talents that are there though. "Only" 8 or 9 -10 players is realistic, -10 guarantees world class potential, and the possibility of the player becoming the best player ever.

There are plenty of -9s and -8s around, and -7s can still become good Premier League players.

Aye, I'm starting to realise that, my point about too few -10 players is wrong, I can see that now.

Again though, I can't really put it into words. There is just more chance of talent at all levels in Asterix Update, and thats what I hoped to see.

My point about consistency still stands though

I've made the kind of tackles that Stuart Pearce in his pomp would be proud of. The difference, as a few have already pointed out, is that Psycho would do it consistently, whereas I pull of tackles like that once a season, and the rest of the time I'm wondering around aimlessly generally being rubbish and whinging at the ref. So I do agree that the difference is consistency.

I disagree. For me, the consistency attribute relates to one thing and one thing only - and that is how consistently they put in their best performances.

With regards to making a tackle like Pearce or passing like Xavi, yes a lot of us could do it every now and again, whereas Pearce or Xavi would do it more consistently. This for me is portrayed in the actual rating of each attribute.

So because Pearce can make that brilliant tackle more often than me, he might have got an 18 for tackling, whereas I may get a 4.

Xavi can pull off that brilliant pass more often than me so he gets a 20 and I get a 1.

For me the rating of the attribute shows how consistently they successfully pull off these tackles, passes, shots, dribbles, etc. The actual consistency attribute doesn't relate directly to them doing it.