Getting Newgens on Youth Intake Day from other clubs

[Snorks]

OK, so I am rarely ever in the top flights but here  I am, at AC Milan and with one of the top youth training set-ups in Europe. I have never really done much on intakes, usually being in lower reaches of football without facilities, just accepting what I got and doing what I could with them, then watching out for higher clubs releases and trying to snap them up.

 

Now, I would like to create an u18s squad at Milan that wins stuff, we are not far off at the moment, and my recent intake has produced three or four really good potential first-teamers for the future, but there are still four or five gaps to fill in the team for them to truly challenge for youth football honours.

I have watched and read so much about getting newgens and how to play the Intake Day game, I have spreadsheets with all the major nations intake dates but I am not sure how to get these kids to switch clubs. I have shortlisted a number of high potential kids, but the ones above four star potential the club wont talk to me (understandable) and those at 4 star potential the club will accept compensation, but the player refuses to sign. 

Am I misunderstanding the videos and articles I read, or am I missing something?

So, how do you do it?

[Welshace]

For a start, bare in mind for a top team like AC Milan, a 4 star potential 15 year old is exceptional and should be rare...

I'm not surprised talents like that are hard to poach... 

 

If a player doesn't want to come, there isn't much you can do other than play the long game and unrest him and poach him if he changes his stance.

[Snorks]

Figured that was the way forward and yeah, probably me being greedy wanting the youth silverware as well!

Is there a way of getting them for free? Or is it a case of wait for the release days and trawl. Some of the 'tutorials' seem to make it out it can be done. Only way I see is to offer them a contract 'blind' on the day and hope they choose you over the host club before they are offered contracts there.

[JordanMilly]

You're pretty much always going to need to at least pay compensation. However, the reason they won't sign for you on intake day is because they've just literally signed a new contract, and they're not interested in moving right after doing that. I usually just scout them all following intake day, and go in for trying to bring them to my team in the next transfer window.

[Snorks]

Don;t mind paying for them, even above compensation.  I guess it's a case of 'just keep an eye on them' - thanks for your help though.

 

 

[michaeltmurrayuk]

If you want to sign the regens around the intake date then you'd need to make them offer before they confirm terms with their existing club, (though you'd still need to pay compensation) otherwise you'd need to wait until around the start of the new season when the new contract happiness has worn off, the other option is to get a transfer bid accepted if the player won't accept your compensation offer as if they have a bid accepted they are more likely to leave.

It's also generally easier to snatch players from smaller teams, or from teams in smaller countries (though non-EU based players can only move once they turn 18).

[alanschu14]

At Wolfsburg I filled out my team by buying 16 and 17 year olds from around the EU so they could quickly join my team.  Some of them I even dropped €5m on because they had good potential and it turned out quite well for me in a few seasons. I ended up with a decent amalgamation of Portuguese, Dutch, Norwegian, Swedish, and Eastern European players supplementing some of my stars.

I also found it typically important to have a player, even if they don't have longer term potential, at each of the positions of your formation you use. Even weaker 1-2 stars that probably won't threaten for first team can help contribute to success in youth/reserve team leagues and that success means happier players and better development. Especially if it's just a youth contract which honestly won't impact your bottom line at a club like Milan.

Most of my U19 team at the moment is well below 100 CA, but I have a full roster of players (many improving) and I'm now back to back German Youth Cup/League champions and this season they are like 20-1-1 or some ridiculous number. Having a couple talented players can really make a big difference and a solid supporting cast of youth players around those quality players is easy enough to keep going year in and year out. Many of the fringe players get good enough to support my reserve team, helping ensure there's success (and good morale) there as well. If I'm lucky, I can sell them for some decent profits to second and third division teams, as well as make some profit on some loans.

It's my first real time focusing on the academy and I'm considering some level of academy only going forward with my next game. Have some top propsects for sure (you'll probably get at least one a year, and probably typically 3-4) for sure, but not all the youth players need to be potential first team players for your club.

[Snorks]

Thats what I am trying to achieve alanscu.  I usually play a 'career save' so rarely at a club long enough to really see youth coming through, but the game picked AC Milan for me at the start, and board offered a new contract end of season one but wouldn't accept less then three years so I am here now for a while.

Was hoping to gt some decent youth in young enough to become trained-at-club by the time they challenge for first-team matches, so with that in mind looking at building a 'squad' of u18s with two players to cover each position as I do in the first team. That way, as they develop, they will evolve into a 'squad' of 25 u20s from which I can draw some extra backup for first team when needed.

[alanschu14]

1 hour ago, Snorks said:

Thats what I am trying to achieve alanscu.  I usually play a 'career save' so rarely at a club long enough to really see youth coming through, but the game picked AC Milan for me at the start, and board offered a new contract end of season one but wouldn't accept less then three years so I am here now for a while. 

Was hoping to gt some decent youth in young enough to become trained-at-club by the time they challenge for first-team matches, so with that in mind looking at building a 'squad' of u18s with two players to cover each position as I do in the first team. That way, as they develop, they will evolve into a 'squad' of 25 u20s from which I can draw some extra backup for first team when needed. 

Yup that's what I like to do. Even for "roleplay" reasons I like the idea of success at all levels for the club. I'm now defending champion for my U19 team, 3. Liga, and Bundesliga. Important to remember that for a steady intake you only need a few keepers every intake.

For the purposes of U19, my few stellar blue chippers and mix of "probably can have a career at lower levels" can make up for any "ehhh, you're here because I need the spot filled" types. IMO always better to have a proper player than a grey one!

The cream of the crop start to manifest around 17 to 18 years old and they may get time on reserve club (especially if still under 18) since my facilities are aces. Once they are older than 18 (and def 19), I look for loans. If First League teams can give first team minutes I'll loan, otherwise I'll just keep them on my Reserve club.

I go case by case whether or not to loan to Second Division or Third Division (the league my reserve team plays in) based on how much depth my reserve team has. So a few times I have loaned a player out to another 3. Liga team because he was #3 on my U23 depth chart, and the place also had good training facilities. Same goes with 2. Bundesliga loans.  It has been working pretty well this game.

I can get longer term contracts by having decent % pay increase (as a top tier club, the wages are still inconsequential most of the time) and appearance bonuses while getting 3 year club contract extensions to let me keep them around. If they are a reserve player not really threatening first team and their contract is coming up, I'll see how much they want for an extension. Often it's expensive (since I'm a top club in Europe) but sometimes it isn't. If not I'll keep them along as a reserve team if they're good. If they are asking for too much, I'll now look to sell. Prefer to sell to clubs he'll get minutes for and get percent of future sale if possible, but most of the time I'm happy with almost anything.

[alanschu14]

Just to supplement, here's the performance of my U19 team this past season. They just secured the league with 6 games to spare.

 

Here's the at a glance roster with CA/PA stars

 

At a glance there's really only maybe 6 players or so that I think will have a serious chance of pushing for First Team minutes, but I have a handful of decent depth players that will continue to contribute in 3. Liga. You can see I have two players on Professional contracts that are probably not good enough for even reserve minutes which is a mea culpa, but most are still on youth contracts (must be on one until 17) and don't cost much but haven't had much issue getting to 1 gold star which seems pretty good for the league!

For more specifics, it looks like most of my players have around 60-70 CA, with my best players having 80-100 (Luca is very good with 125 but cannot play on pro teams yet).  PAs are typically around 100.  Some are lower, a few standouts that are higher than 140. Luca again is really good haha. But for 3 straight years I've had excellent GK prospects. I have a 17 year old on my reserve that is also very good so I'll likely have to start loans just due to depth. In that sense, i've been unlucky.

I did just bring an excellent 17 year old straight onto my first team and he's probably my #2 DC now. A few others of his "class" are tearing up Wolfsburg II as they lead 3. Liga.

[Snorks]

UPDATE:

My u18s (AC Milan) are in their playoff final. I did c'cheat' a little as I went through the u20 squad and 'demoted' anyone under the age of 18 back to the u18 squad! With no u20s fixtures left, I figured it would be good for their development lol.

[Neotropolis]

16 minutes ago, Snorks said:

UPDATE:

My u18s (AC Milan) are in their playoff final. I did c'cheat' a little as I went through the u20 squad and 'demoted' anyone under the age of 18 back to the u18 squad! With no u20s fixtures left, I figured it would be good for their development lol.

It's hardly cheating if your just making the most of the resources you have. If they're eligible to play then why not allow them to play

[alanschu14]

Yup. I have sometimes brought players from my U23 squad back down to my U19 squad if I'm hoping to make an impressive push in say, Youth Champions League.

[Snorks]

If they win, it's the only silverware of the year.

[phnompenhandy]

Bear in mind there's usually a few regens who appear on intake day unattached to any club. You have to be quick if they're any good though!

[alanschu14]

4 hours ago, phnompenhandy said:

Bear in mind there's usually a few regens who appear on intake day unattached to any club. You have to be quick if they're any good though!

Huh I didn't realize this. That said, I am probably too lazy to aggressively follow up XD

[Snorks]

13 hours ago, phnompenhandy said:

Bear in mind there's usually a few regens who appear on intake day unattached to any club. You have to be quick if they're any good though!

Where do you find those?

[phnompenhandy]

2 minutes ago, Snorks said:

Where do you find those?

Well, I use *cough* GenieScout  

[Snorks]

Do you anywhere in the game u can see them? Or even in *cough* FMRTE? (Don't have Genie Scout, I use FMRTE to *cough* search players sometimes though)

*cough*

Damn must be a bug going round

[enigmatic]

You can see them in multiple places with the official in game editor (and I think in some skins even without it)

 

On 01/06/2018 at 16:19, phnompenhandy said:

Bear in mind there's usually a few regens who appear on intake day unattached to any club. You have to be quick if they're any good though!

There's also (at least in some countries) the ones who are attached to a club but haven't signed a contract yet. They tend to be very reluctant to move and want silly money though, and you won't get time to properly scout them 

[Snorks]

5 hours ago, enigmatic said:

You can see them in multiple places with the official in game editor (and I think in some skins even without it)

Where do you look? All the ones  I see are attached

[turnip]

I very occasionally have had them turn up in general scouting reports (going back a couple of years/versions).

I've also seen them turn up in U19/U21 squads, mostly at smaller nations.

[enigmatic]

9 hours ago, Snorks said:

Where do you look? All the ones  I see are attached

There's the ability to find lists of all youth intakes accessible from a menu at the top, per this link https://www.passion4fm.com/how-to-find-the-best-wonderkids-and-newgens/

They will show as appearing at a club, but sometimes you'll be able to "approach to sign" them without agreeing a transfer with their club and (rarely) you won't owe the club any compensation. That's normally the case for only a few days after the youth for that particular nation have come through

 

Less like cheating and more useful for small clubs is Youth Departures available on the same submenu, which (after they've been released) will give you a list of everyone released from Youth Contracts without ever signing a pro contract, grouped by club, so you can look at 18 and 19 year olds that weren't good enough for the biggest clubs in the country who might well be good enough for you.

 

[Snorks]

On 03/06/2018 at 23:27, enigmatic said:

There's the ability to find lists of all youth intakes accessible from a menu at the top, per this link https://www.passion4fm.com/how-to-find-the-best-wonderkids-and-newgens/

They will show as appearing at a club, but sometimes you'll be able to "approach to sign" them without agreeing a transfer with their club and (rarely) you won't owe the club any compensation. That's normally the case for only a few days after the youth for that particular nation have come through

 

Less like cheating and more useful for small clubs is Youth Departures available on the same submenu, which (after they've been released) will give you a list of everyone released from Youth Contracts without ever signing a pro contract, grouped by club, so you can look at 18 and 19 year olds that weren't good enough for the biggest clubs in the country who might well be good enough for you.

 

Yeah, the 'Approach to Sign' works pretty well if you are a big club, but I am wary of ending up with a barrel load of Newgens with little chance of making it as you are essentially signing them blind with no scouting knowledge. Essentially, grabbing them before the club has had chance to trial and offer a contract (like Utd did with Giggs when he turned 16 or so legend has it)

In lower league saves I use the Departures lists, and also the 'Trial Days' at start of seasons, but at AC Milan there are few that would make the grade in this save for me.

So far, my own intake, plus those already in the squad have achieved the u18 Double in the first season. I have just reviewed the squad and strengthened a bit paying compensation for 4- 4.5* players in the weaker positions during summer, and come February there's another intake, so the start of a promising conveyor belt.

Hopefully I'll generate a bit of income as the club is in so much debt at the moment, with future commitments keeping transfer budgets crazy low for a club supposed to be challenging for top honours, as well as providing some players for the first team to keep wage spends down a bit.

With the youth already there though, I just had to register Serie A squad for the season, and because of the 'U21' clause, I just managed to drum up the minimum 14 players to register!

Whoever was there before me did a pretty good job, with Cutorne, Locatelli, Kessie et al already established in the first team. I also brought in Tierney from Celtic - who also comes in under 21 but already a first-teamer.

My method so far has been to trawl the Intake Day players and get scouting reports on all of the players at the clubs with top 50 facilities/recruitment. Those with PA of 4* and above get shortlisted and scouted further. Then, end of season a review of the u18 squad to see where any holes are in terms of potential and then I shop around for players to fill the gaps. Those who the scouts tell me are 'Don;t want to sell' I offer to - three times their value, picked up a 5* PA defender for 900K - should be worth 20 mil by the time he is 20.

[phnompenhandy]

On 03/06/2018 at 03:57, enigmatic said:

You can see them in multiple places with the official in game editor (and I think in some skins even without it)

 

There's also (at least in some countries) the ones who are attached to a club but haven't signed a contract yet. They tend to be very reluctant to move and want silly money though, and you won't get time to properly scout them 

Yeah, that's much the same with the ones I spot using GS. As A lower league club, if I approach the ones who are decent, they won't be interested in joining a club with my rep, so I can only get in the ones who are at my level anyway, which therefore isn't much of a "cheat".

[r0x0r]

One "trick" I've found is that a kid who won't even talk about signing for you will happily sign up if you get him on trial. So when I find a gem out there, I bring them in on a 1 week trial and sign them up while they consider themselves to be "at" my club.

[Snorks]

Might give that a go. Also have seen it suggested that you request to Loan a youngster for a month or so, cuts down on scouting costs but maybe they become more open to signing for you as well. 

[Snorks]

My plan seems to be working - taking over the world....Muahahahaha

[Ryan Ebejer]

Hi. So for those newgens that doesn't even want to talk about a contract because they've only just joined their club or want to continue to develop at their own club i can loan them or offer a trial instead and hope they sign with me?

[enigmatic]

6 minutes ago, Ryan Ebejer said:

Hi. So for those newgens that doesn't even want to talk about a contract because they've only just joined their club or want to continue to develop at their own club i can loan them or offer a trial instead and hope they sign with me?

You might get a trial, but they won't consider signing for you for a while. Which normally is fine anyway, the AI doesn't tend to sign players until later on. A lot of newgens are too young to loan, especially if they're overseas.

 

Easiest newgens to sign apart from your own remain the players that get generated without a club but get called up for their national U19/20/21 team anyway because that country doesn't have many players. A lot of these players are rubbish anyway, but sometimes you get some seriously promising ones.

[ajt]

AI generally don't bother trying to sign good regens from what I have seen. often there are some regens with man utd/liverpool/psg etc interested in them but i've rarely seen them actually make bids. in a way I wish they would compete for them, but I guess I shouldn't complain. they are extremely protective of their own regens though, I find it impossible to try to buy regens off the big clubs. in my player search I disable england completely due to the excessive transfer fees.

this season I have bought ten 16 year olds for a total of 29 million upfront (i make sure to include as many clauses as possible and any time I am signing a young player I add the "percentage of profit from next sale" and then click on remove and exclude). I only sign them if they have 1 1/2 star CA and 3 1/2 star PA (according to my scouts, who are all at least 19 PA scouts) - unless they have great starting attribute distribution or are very cheap (i like buying players from colombia and czech republic for this reason). I sign any of my youth intake that are predicted to be 2 1/2 stars or above.

the most important thing I do is to keep the players at the club until they are 19. my youth coaches are all at least 4 stars with high working with youngsters so there is little point in loaning them out at 18. once they turn 19 I start offering them out on loan for fees, I have a look at potential teams squads to make sure they will get games, and almost all of my players I have loaned out this season are getting significant playing time. I offer them out for 100% wages (most of them are on max 10k p/w) and 250k per month loan fee.

this season I will earn 42 million from the loan fees, and will save the money I would have paid out on wages. I'm loaning out 2 star CA players to mainly Bundesliga 2/dutch teams for 250k per month. it's easy to see this can be very lucrative. I find this is much more profitable than simply selling the players, because from my (1200 hour experience ) the AI always under pays for transfers but will happily pay over the odds on loan fees. I play with a small database and still find it very difficult to sell players.

now don't get me wrong I have bought a few incredible players for big fees in my first few seasons at bayern (such as him), but this is only to make sure that I walk the league. the most challenging thing about playing the regen game is making sure you can actually stay in the job long enough for any of them to progress to the first team (I am in my 4th season at bayern after being sacked by milan and I now have a couple of them on the subs bench).

make sure to start applying for affiliates that will send young players to train at your team. the best ones I've had so far have been chivas, defensor sporting and velez. sadly milan sacked me just after I got defensor on this save. right now I have sparta (well established), panathinaikos (extensive), hajduk (established) and viitorul (extensive). my dream is to get partizan, red star belgrade or dinamo zagreb as an affiliate, but I haven't succeeded thus far, due to their reputation being too high.

here are a few of the players I have got so far, max price of 5 million. bertrand - girard - benelli - hamzic

these ones at least have a genuine chance at being top players in the future. hamzic cost 1.2 mil from kaiserslauten, and funnily enough it was my director of football who randomly signed him out of nowhere 

so yeah, anyway...