FM21 Alternative Youth Rating + Game Importance and others v.1.1 by Daveincid (Updated 24.12.2020*Screenshots added*)

[Daveincid]

I started this project for myself because I never understood the values from the national youth rating in fm. So I decided to do some research and set new values which are important in my opinion.

I was really pleased with the result during long-term saves in FM19 and FM20.

The feedback for the file in FM20 was quite good and I enjoyed the work on it to try to make FM even more realistic (IMO)
Maybe some of you have as much fun as I do with the file!
 

What can you expect from the file:

• Newly set National Youth Ratings
• Some Game Importance adjustments
• State of development adjusted according to DAC-List

The combination of the new settings will lead to:

• Less newgens with worldclass talent
• More worldwide diversification of talent
• Easier to improve smaller nations where football is popular in longterm-saves
• Fight about the biggest talents, so the AI tries to keep their talents at the club, because there are less of them

My ratings is based among other things:
 

• HDI (Human Development Index)
• Population of a Country
• How popular football is in the country
• Worldwide success national team
• Continental success national team
• Success U-natioal team
• Which Confederation they are in (ex. UEFA, CONCACAF)
• Value National Team
• Record attendance National Team
• Average league attendance from top league (as far as I could find them)

Please keep in mind that the whole rating system is very complex, so it's not really worth to discuss why Nation A has a much lower rating as Nation B. It took me about 300 hours of adjusting, testing, research and comparing.  My goal was, replicate the current situation as good as possible, with some little speculation into the future, which I took from analyzing my personal excel-db-file.

 

Test results:

I made several longterm-saves, thanks to @maaartio and @jg1995 for running tests.

With default settings you will have CA over 170 in year 2035. Start db has 36 players:

 

With this file the numbers are much closer to the start db: 

The ratings are very complex. it was a huge task to keep the balance also for low CA players aswell, so it doesn't matter on which level you play, the ratings are much more accurate IMO.

The numbers are still higher than default, you can bring this down further more with using the Injuries-File from @majesticeternity, this will slow down player development a bit.

 

 

HOW TO INSTALL:
Place the file in:
Documents/Sports Interactive/Football Manager 2021/editor data


NEW SAVEGAME IS REQUIRED


Feel free to support my work

Patreon PayPal

Cheers

Daveincid

 

Alternative Youth Ranking + Game Importance and others v.1.1 by Daveincid.fmf

Edited December 24, 2020 by Daveincid
Screenshots added

[BadAss88]

Having a quick look at the ratings..and they are some odd numbers which I can't connect with the criteria you base your ratings on..

Gibraltar that high?
The difference between Brazil and the rest?
Ukraine below Bosnia, Bulgaria, Romania, ...
 

[Daveincid]

vor 1 Minute schrieb BadAss88:

Having a quick look at the ratings..and they are some odd numbers which I can't connect with the criteria you base your ratings on..

Gibraltar that high?
The difference between Brazil and the rest?
Ukraine below Bosnia, Bulgaria, Romania, ...
 

Like I said, it's not only the youth rating value which inflluences the quality of newgens.

Gibraltar: Football is less important in Gibraltar, so this lowers high PA newgens. Gibraltar is a rich country and has a strong connection to Spain and England.

Brazil: Brazil is indeed a special case, their talent-pool is almost limitless, which is represented in this file. They have so many Pro-Footballers around the globe. Keep in mind, YR generally influences not only the level of high quality players, it's more about the average quantity.

Ukraine: Is in a difficult enviroment IRL.  

 

Cheers

Daveincid

[anitamui]

Why USA have 88 only???

[Daveincid]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb anitamui:

Why USA have 88 only???

Because that's the value they get in comparison wth all other Nations to hold the balance as good as possible

[Daveincid]

Update v.1.1

[nkunku]

58 minutes ago, Daveincid said:

Update v.1.1

Ha @Daveincid, i am a big fan of your realism work for FM.

What is the update about? Is it worth to start a save game over again with this update?

[Daveincid]

vor 1 Minute schrieb nkunku:

Ha @Daveincid, i am a big fan of your realism work for FM.

What is the update about? Is it worth to start a save game over again with this update?

Thanks! Well sorry mate, I would definetly start a new save

It's a huge update with much lower rankings in combination with some Game Importance-changes and develop status of Nations aswell. The whole system is very complex, so I spent a lot of time running tests to lower the inflation of good and very good players without messing up the low quality players. 

I have tested different setup's several times, and now it finally gives me the level of realism I was aiming for

 

Cheers

 

Daveincid

[Timo61]

VEry good Job, i take it every years <3 Thanks

[Daveincid]

Gerade eben schrieb Timo61:

VEry good Job, i take it every years <3 Thanks

Thank you! Same thing for your megapack! It's just mind blowing! 

[Jervaj]

First, thanks for your work! I have to start a new save due to problem with bugs and I thought that I may as well try your mod. Seems promising keeping the rating a bit more stable.

 

I do have a question though, having seen the developpers reactions and discussion related to this topic that has been brought up here in the forum (sometimes the discussion was precisely with you), they seem to think that the problem its more one of development side, with many players exploting their whole potential, rather than of newgens having too high PA. Yet from the description your mod seem to tackle more the PA precisely.

 

Do you think that PA is indeed problematic, instead of development, or is this just a solution you found that gives better results with the current situation? I assume you havent touched development/CA from the description.

[Daveincid]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Jervaj:

First, thanks for your work! I have to start a new save due to problem with bugs and I thought that I may as well try your mod. Seems promising keeping the rating a bit more stable.

 

I do have a question though, having seen the developpers reactions and discussion related to this topic that has been brought up here in the forum (sometimes the discussion was precisely with you), they seem to think that the problem its more one of development side, with many players exploting their whole potential, rather than of newgens having too high PA. Yet from the description your mod seem to tackle more the PA precisely.

 

Do you think that PA is indeed problematic, instead of development, or is this just a solution you found that gives better results with the current situation? I assume you havent touched development/CA from the description.

Thank you!

The problem is connected together. CA, PA and development.

CA: As far as I know, there is no way to lower CA of newgens when they appear. 

PA: the mod helps indirectly, lower high PA in average = less high CA-players, because they are limited by the PA.

Development: The only way I see to reduce this, is adding the more injuries mod. More/longer injuries = less development. 

Summary: this mod and injuries-mod (you have to set leagues simulating in full detail) will give you the best possible solution available.

I also released a file which brings league reputation a bit closer together, this might help a bit too, but this hasn't been prooved yet.

 

Cheers

Daveincid

 

[Jervaj]

2 minutes ago, Daveincid said:

Thank you!

The problem is connected together. CA, PA and development.

CA: As far as I know, there is no way to lower CA of newgens when they appear. 

PA: the mod helps indirectly, lower high PA in average = less high CA-players, because they are limited by the PA.

Development: The only way I see to reduce this, is adding the more injuries mod. More/longer injuries = less development. 

Summary: this mod and injuries-mod (you have to set leagues simulating in full detail) will give you the best possible solution available.

I also released a file which brings league reputation a bit closer together, this might help a bit too, but this hasn't been prooved yet.

 

Cheers

Daveincid

 

Umm. Given your answer about the injuries it may be true then that players just develop too well even without ideal conditions (or start too strong). Because the most success seems to come from the hard cap you introduce/modify with PA, and then injuries is kind of random hard cap too. Simply hitting players more with stops or even regressions of development of some players. All likely contributes, but SI may have a point. For players to reach their full potential, specially when that ptoential is high, maybe the other factors involved should weigh more (personality, facilities, coaches, game time and performance...)

 

I wonder, from your answer, with your mod applied, do you feel like players cap very quickly?

 

And thanks for the swift and kind answer

[Daveincid]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Jervaj:

Umm. Given your answer about the injuries it may be true then that players just develop too well even without ideal conditions (or start too strong). Because the most success seems to come from the hard cap you introduce/modify with PA, and then injuries is kind of random hard cap too. Simply hitting players more with stops or even regressions of development of some players. All likely contributes, but SI may have a point. For players to reach their full potential, specially when that ptoential is high, maybe the other factors involved should weigh more (personality, facilities, coaches, game time and performance...)

 

I wonder, from your answer, with your mod applied, do you feel like players cap very quickly?

 

And thanks for the swift and kind answer

Not everyone is reaching his cap, this is also down to your setup at the start, his starting CA, the league he's playing, as you said personality, staff, facilities and much more.  I mostly check the bigger picture only, so I analyze from all players with a PA + 180. When do they reach it, if not, why not?  The problem I see is, that more than half already hit it in their early 20's.  So yes, they cap too quickly IMO

[Jervaj]

Thanks for your answer.

Yeah then indeed, development its at least part of the problem. If that is adressed maybe we can see more spread out CA, and you need to revert some changes. Still, as I said plan to use your mod meanwhile. Thanks!

[Daveincid]

Gerade eben schrieb Jervaj:

Thanks for your answer.

Yeah then indeed, development its at least part of the problem. If that is adressed maybe we can see more spread out CA, and you need to revert some changes. Still, as I said plan to use your mod meanwhile. Thanks!

I don't think that SI will change that. There was a majority in the past who complained about too many injuries, so SI reduced it (less realism). So I don't think that SI will take the fun away, with not having so many wonderkids by default anymore. The spreadout of CA isn't a problem, only the quick development is.

It's great from SI to offer the editor to mods, as they can change the game in a direction they think is better. 

 

[freddieos]

well done @Daveincidon this mod - been oogling it for a while but your latest buffed out description changed my mind. I'll now use this in my next save and look forward to not having a 300% increase in God-tier players.

Edited December 15, 2020 by freddieos

[Gee_Simpson]

Would you guys recommend this file? Considering using it for my long term Man Utd save but just a little unsure.

[Daveincid]

vor 5 Minuten schrieb Gee_Simpson:

Would you guys recommend this file? Considering using it for my long term Man Utd save but just a little unsure.

unsure about what exactly? Maybe I can help you a bit better then

[majesticeternity]

5 minutes ago, Gee_Simpson said:

Would you guys recommend this file? Considering using it for my long term Man Utd save but just a little unsure.

If you love a ton of wonderkids everywhere, then no.

if you love realism, logic, a good spread of nationalities, the rare messi(as in real life), and more difficulty in finding where the next messi does come from, then 500% I recommend it!!

[Gee_Simpson]

2 minutes ago, Daveincid said:

unsure about what exactly? Maybe I can help you a bit better then

Just if it will enhance my game, if there are any obvious bugs etc that will ruin my save etc

[Daveincid]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Gee_Simpson:

Just if it will enhance my game, if there are any obvious bugs etc that will ruin my save etc

There was an update which included newgens spread and stuff, so it might need some tweaking again. But it is generally bugfree.

It needs testing again, but I will have test results tomorrow.

But as @majesticeternity said, it is also down to your personal way of play

[Gee_Simpson]

17 minutes ago, Daveincid said:

There was an update which included newgens spread and stuff, so it might need some tweaking again. But it is generally bugfree.

It needs testing again, but I will have test results tomorrow.

But as @majesticeternity said, it is also down to your personal way of play

Thanks to you both 

Edited December 18, 2020 by Gee_Simpson

[dillonbarrett1997]

18 hours ago, Daveincid said:

There was an update which included newgens spread and stuff, so it might need some tweaking again. But it is generally bugfree.

It needs testing again, but I will have test results tomorrow.

But as @majesticeternity said, it is also down to your personal way of play

In the same boat, worried of any bugs 

[karanhsingh]

You are saying that with the default database in 15 years you have thrice as many quality players knocking about? That's insane! 

[Daveincid]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb karanhsingh:

You are saying that with the default database in 15 years you have thrice as many quality players knocking about? That's insane! 

yup. Tested in all diferent kind of setups. 

[maciasso]

@DaveincidHi, have you already tested this with a new update? Just wanted to start a long term career with this file and curious if this will work properly.

[Daveincid]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb maciasso:

@DaveincidHi, have you already tested this with a new update? Just wanted to start a long term career with this file and curious if this will work properly.

I have just finished this test, it works properly, so it can be used without any issues

[maciasso]

1 hour ago, Daveincid said:

I have just finished this test, it works properly, so it can be used without any issues

That's cool. Thank you very much.

[calvg]

I've noticed after a few years the prem intakes are down to 2-3 players 

is this an expectation or something else I might have added? @Daveincid

[Daveincid]

Gerade eben schrieb calvg:

I've noticed after a few years the prem intakes are down to 2-3 players 

is this an expectation or something else I might have added? @Daveincid

this is a known bug and has nothing to do with my file. 

Take a look here:

 

[calvg]

Prem is an active league for me as is germany but does not seem newgen limited like england

seems i need more testing to work it out

[Jimbokav1971]

On 30/11/2020 at 17:08, Daveincid said:

Gibraltar: Football is less important in Gibraltar, so this lowers high PA newgens. Gibraltar is a rich country and has a strong connection to Spain and England.

I'm not sure I would agree with you there @Daveincid Do you mind if I ask what you are basing that on? 

 

[Daveincid]

vor 8 Stunden schrieb Jimbokav1971:

I'm not sure I would agree with you there @Daveincid Do you mind if I ask what you are basing that on? 

 

Maybe it's a bit missleading. Popularity in terms of their national league and national team. India loves the Premier League, but they don't care much for their own league. Gibraltar is similar, even if it's not that extreme. The importance is still the same as default, there is no reason IMO to push this even higher.

 

Edit:  Theese are some of the parameters which influeces youth rating and game importance. 

• HDI (Human Development Index)
• Population of a Country
• How popular football is in the country
• Worldwide success national team
• Continental success national team
• Success U-natioal team
• Which Confederation they are in (ex. UEFA, CONCACAF)
• Value National Team
• Record attendance National Team
• Average league attendance from top league (as far as I could find them)

Cheers

Daveincid 

Edited December 23, 2020 by Daveincid

[Xavier Lukhas]

Le 26/11/2020 à 18:28, Daveincid a dit :

With this file the numbers are much closer to the start db: 38% more CA160-169, 38% more CA170-179,  40% more CA180-189, 190-200 is equal, so there where only two "Messi's" in 15 years. 

Hello, just for quick confirmation... When you say there were only two Messi, I guess you refer only to CA (and not PA)? Because I find having two to four Ronaldos or Messis at the time is not far fetched, but it's not the same thing as there not being a good handful of potential Messis or Ronaldos who just don't pan out because of bad luck, poor career choices, poor personality or whatever.  I'm wonder how many players with a PA of over 190 were generated since there are 5 of them in the db (Ronaldo, Messi, Neuer, Neymar and Mbappé) plus one potential one (Camavinga). I'm just being curious really. Thank you in advance.

[Daveincid]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb Xavier Lukhas:

Hello, just for quick confirmation... When you say there were only two Messi, I guess you refer only to CA (and not PA)? Because I find having two to four Ronaldos or Messis at the time is not far fetched, but it's not the same thing as there not being a good handful of potential Messis or Ronaldos who just don't pan out because of bad luck, poor career choices, poor personality or whatever.  I'm wonder how many players with a PA of over 190 were generated since there are 5 of them in the db (Ronaldo, Messi, Neuer, Neymar and Mbappé) plus one potential one (Camavinga). I'm just being curious really. Thank you in advance.

both. There can't be too many godlike players if the PA by default isn't too high. too high PA and easy development results in high CA and PA. I hope it's clear. You are right that there can be 2-5 players with same CA/PA as the two guys IRL. But by default there are like 10.

 

 

Cheers

Daveincid

 

Edited December 24, 2020 by Daveincid

[Daveincid]

It's even worse when filtering with PA over 170. After one year there are 28 players generated. At the beginning of your save there are around 130. Theese 130 contains players known as "forgotten talents who never reached their potencial", so this makes it even more extreme. This will lead in the long-run to a much higher average CA and more world-beaters. I generally don't see a problem when the niveau of football still improves over the years or decades, but not that extreme.

Newgen PA over 170 after one year: (no player over 190 is rarely, so this is even a lower example as in some other test-runs) 

 

Cheers

Daveincid

[Daveincid]

This is a 1:1 comparison from default vs my rating from players with a CA over 170 in year 2035:

default:

 

With my file:

 

Cheers

Daveincid

[Xavier Lukhas]

@Daveincid Thank you for taking the time to write such throughout replies.

[Daveincid]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Xavier Lukhas:

@Daveincid Thank you for taking the time to write such throughout replies.

You are welcome! Merry xmas!

[anitamui]

Why update?

What has changed??

[Daveincid]

vor 12 Minuten schrieb anitamui:

Why update?

What has changed??

only test results updated, that people get a better idea what the benefit of this file is. The file itself will get updated after the next patch from SI.

Cheers

Daveincid

[byang08]

Thanks for creating this project. On the topic of newgens, I was wondering what your thoughts are on random personality/mental stats of newgens and whether you have any motivation to address it. I feel that for some hidden/mental attributes like "important match" or "pressure", it's much more realistic to have them gravitate towards a mean than be randomly generated. I do not know for sure that they are completely random but it feels that way. I know that other attributes like professionalism/ambition are influenced by HOYD and staff.

Since hidden stats are difficult to mold, and that in reality, most successful first team players have fairly conservative, or at least, playable mental attributes, it seems to make sense to give precocious newgens that have high progression rate either more balanced or higher hidden attributes as well. Again, I don't know that this isn't the case now, I just know that it feels like there are too many weird personalities with random low attributes for otherwise desirable newgens.

As for PA/CA variation, I'm currently in the 7th season of a Deportivo La Coruna save that started with the most recent patch, and while it seems that most top clubs have been able to successfully find top regens to replace aging stars, there is a lack of middling/squad player level replacements, so roughly 140-160 CA/PA. I will try your file and see if it improves. Thanks.

[Daveincid]

vor 27 Minuten schrieb byang08:

Thanks for creating this project. On the topic of newgens, I was wondering what your thoughts are on random personality/mental stats of newgens and whether you have any motivation to address it. I feel that for some hidden/mental attributes like "important match" or "pressure", it's much more realistic to have them gravitate towards a mean than be randomly generated. I do not know for sure that they are completely random but it feels that way. I know that other attributes like professionalism/ambition are influenced by HOYD and staff.

Since hidden stats are difficult to mold, and that in reality, most successful first team players have fairly conservative, or at least, playable mental attributes, it seems to make sense to give precocious newgens that have high progression rate either more balanced or higher hidden attributes as well. Again, I don't know that this isn't the case now, I just know that it feels like there are too many weird personalities with random low attributes for otherwise desirable newgens.

As for PA/CA variation, I'm currently in the 7th season of a Deportivo La Coruna save that started with the most recent patch, and while it seems that most top clubs have been able to successfully find top regens to replace aging stars, there is a lack of middling/squad player level replacements, so roughly 140-160 CA/PA. I will try your file and see if it improves. Thanks.

You are welcome! 

The mental attributes aren't completely random, as you said it's influenced by staff members sometimes. So there is no need of changing the mechanism at all IMO, because it works fine. Having high PA players with bad hidden attributes are perfect for players who fall into the category "lost wonderkids", so no need of change again,  You are always able to improve players personality in several ways ingame: player-talks, team-personality, good leaders in the team and so on. 

140-160 CA/PA is actually not "middle", this is already the start of top-players, so I have made just exactly the opposite experience as you. The mid-range (120-140) stays pretty solid, but everything above is overpowered later ingame. This is what this file reduces. So if you want more high PA players I don't recommend using my file, it does the exact opposite above 140 PA.

 

Cheers

Daveincid

[byang08]

Ah ok, thanks for the response. To clarify what I mean, I see cases like this too often with newgens:

Of course, this is rather extreme, but this player should never have reached the highest level with those unbalanced stats. The AI should not pursue him. It would make sense for a low professionalism/determination, but high consistency/important match player to fail to reach their potential, but not the other way around. It's not a big issue overall but I really dislike seeing these "ruined" newgen wonderkids that the AI evaluates improperly.

I was curious and looked at the talent distribution in my own save:

 

There are 43 players with >170 CA in December 2026 including regens. I did not realize the trend existed until I read this thread. I also don't know what a reasonable distribution would be but 12/43 seems unreasonably high.

 

Edited January 4, 2021 by byang08

[Daveincid]

vor 24 Minuten schrieb byang08:

Ah ok, thanks for the response. To clarify what I mean, I see cases like this too often with newgens:

Of course, this is rather extreme, but this player should never have reached the highest level with those unbalanced stats. The AI should not pursue him. It would make sense for a low professionalism/determination, but high consistency/important match player to fail to reach their potential, but not the other way around. It's not a big issue overall but I really dislike seeing these "ruined" newgen wonderkids that the AI evaluates improperly.

I was curious and looked at the talent distribution in my own save:

There are 43 players with >170 CA in December 2026 including regens. I did not realize the trend existed until I read this thread. I also don't know what a reasonable distribution would be but 12/43 seems unreasonably high.

 

the player you mentioned is very determinded and very professional. No wonder he hit his PA early. His consisteny is bad, so he won't show his talent that often under normal circumstances. So I don't see a problem in his career-path. He has good stats, so why wouldn't liverpool buy him? They bought a inconsistent, but very talented player. 

 

Yup that's why I created the file, because there are too many good and very good players in the future. 

Edit: please hide the CA PA screenshot from FMSE, it's not "allowed" to show the values of existing players, thanks!

 

Cheers

Daveincid

Edited January 4, 2021 by Daveincid

[Daveincid]

Topic can be closed due it's part of the megapack which can be found here:

https://community.sigames.com/forums/topic/545609-fm21-increase-realism-megapack-by-daveincid

Cheers

Daveincid