FM10: Official Liverpool thread - Home of El Niño

[Staf9]

What are all you plans for when the proper game comes out next friday, have you thought about signings yet? the best tactics?

hard to really get a good idea of who to buy with the demo. using it more to see about tactics. will be alot easier to sort out signings on the full game with a larger database to choose from.

really i think we need a right full to compete/cover for johnson and someone on the right wing and partner/cover for Torres will be priority for me anyway. after buying De Maria from benfica i may get him in again on the full game especially for the 2.5m he cost, bargain buy as you can sell a couple of fringe and youths to bring him in and it allows you to maybe sell Babel or Reira. Dossena is a defo goner along with Voronin, Degen and Plessis.

i'll prob keep Yossi as he's doing well for me on the demo and give cover all over the middle at least for the first season.

[aschack]

Right, going to post what's probably going to be a semi-long recap of my first 5 days with the demo. If you're not into long reads, I think you should probably skip this one...

I intend this to be both a showcase of how things can be done with relatively little reorganisation as well as a talking point about how to make the most out of the players we have available. Feedback more than welcome.

Starting the first game I decided to spend a lot of time cleaning up the reserve squad and getting a few players for the senior squad, but most of all just doing all the nitty-gritty stuff with finding the right coaches (which can be a handful without a proper coaching quality calculator) and scouts, which took the usual couple of hours.

That game was eventually abandoned sometime in late august/early september as it turned out that a) my tactics didn't work in anything but friendly games and b) my laptop's graphics card kept overheating and I had to replay the same game 4 times which bored me.

So game 2, which is now the proper game. I'm upto mid October and I spent quite some time fiddling with tactics - and it's still being refined and adjusted on a game-per-game basis, but at least I'm fairly happy with it now.

Players:

From the get-go I decided I was going to mimic the 4-4-1-1 formation we're playing with Gerrard hanging behind Torres. That means a flat four at the back, a defensive minded midfielder, a holding midfielder, two wingers (who in more defensive formations can help at the back), an offensive midfielder and a striker were needed.

Fortunately these are all in the club, but there are of course some issues.

1) Aquilani is out for a long time and the only cover is Lucas and I'm not convinced he's good enough.

I recruited van der Vaart on loan for 1.1m + 6.25m future fee for this position. He has not been a success no matter if I play him as a flat MC, a withdrawn playmaker or an advanced playmaker (all with Support). Aquilani's getting back though and I'll see if it's just van der Vaart being poor or the position and role being an issue. Perhaps van der Vaart as CM with AM/support role?

2) There's no proper cover for Torres. Kuyt really isn't what you're looking for there and while Voronin does fit the description, he's not good enough.

I recruited Artem Milevskyi from Dinamo Kiev for 7m, and while he's mainly been used as a substitute, he's been amazing. 5 goals in his first 5 games and now 6 in 9. He seems most capable of scoring on the break, running onto a through ball from the middle and calmly slotting it home, though he has scored a few good efforts inside the area. A very good substitute indeed.

I've recruited Marco Boriello for 6m as well for a simple test even though his wages and appearance fees and signon bonus are astronomic. But he has something the other two lack - incredible aerial play with reasonable supporting stats, kinda like a better Heskey. I've yet to try him out and my first choice would be in a proper 4-4-2 formation, but the alternative is as a target man when trying to hold on to a lead.

3) Wingers can be an issue. With Riera fixed on the left but being slightly inconsistent, Babel being more of an inside forward and utterly refusing to cross the ball, Kuyt lacking dribbling and pace and Benayoun being too much of a jack-of-all-trades, there are no really, really good proper wingers.

So I recruited Giovanni dos Santos for 12m, but I must say he's been largely disappointing and I should've probably checked his stats before. Nonetheless, having all these people provide for some great versatility and you can mix and match based on opponent and form.

Outs:

Ryan Babel - 11.5m

Andrea Dossena - 9.5m

Andriy Voronin - 600k loan fee + 3.7m future fee

Daniel Pacheco - 2.2m

Philipp Degen - 2.5m

Lauri Dalla Valle - 1.6m

Tactics:

As mentioned I play a 4-4-1-1. In anything but attacking formations, the MCd is dropped down to DMC on the left spot and the AMC is also in the left spot because I feel it helps me keep the width and my AMC can cut in and shoot if needed. Subsequently the striker is also in the central right position.

LB: Fabio Aurelio - Full Back/Automatic

RB: Glen Johnson - Full Back/Automatic

DCr: Jamie Carragher - Defender/Defend

DCl: Martin Skrtl - Defender/Defend. Note: Was going to play Agger here as Ball Playing Defender/Defend, but Skrtel has been outstanding, so not yet.

DMCl: Javier Mascherano - DM/Defend

MCr: Rafael van der Vaart - Deep Lying Playmaker/Support. Note: Aquilani will take this from next game on.

MR: Dirk Kuyt - Winger/Attack

ML: Albert Riera - Winger/Attack

AMCl: Steven Gerrard - AM/Support

FCr: Fernando Torres - Poacher/Attack

About the tactic, I've experimented a lot with roles and duties for everyone but the defensive line to make the most out of everyone. This is probably what will interest most people.

To start off with the dynamic duo in charge of bagging the goals, I've tried Gerrard both as Attacking Midfielder and Trequartista and with both Attack and Support duties, but I've found AM/Support to be by far the better for a number of reasons. With Trequartista you're basically telling him to not work for the team, which is a huge waste. Granted, there's no need for him to back to his own area, tackle a striker and rush with it up to the other end, but he's proven very valuable in breaking down opposition play around the middle or on their side. With Attack duty he gets a bit too cocky and selfish as well and usually ends up with 10+ shots per game, pretty much all from outside the area and pretty much all high and wide. He's got a good shot, but not that good. And even with Support duty I've found myself setting the specific instruction of Long Shots - Rarely which really works well. He'll still do it, now he'll just look for Torres before shooting.

About Torres, I've tried him with most roles and both with Attack and Support duties (Support when Gerrad had Attack). There's no doubt that he's better off with Attack duty and Gerrard with Support, but you can keep discussing roles. I think he can pretty much fulfill all of them, which means you should try and make him fit into what you want to do. If you give him Complete Forward he will frequently wander off in order to receive the ball outside the area, and with just one striker that's not what I want. So Poacher's good; he'll hang on the shoulder of the last defender, ready to break away, which is especially good when you're not playing very attacking football but find yourself getting a few counters. Advanced Forward works too, but for me it's something I use when playing a more attacking formation where I hold the ball a lot outside the area, basically making him play on more than just pace, dribbling and finishing.

For the midfield, I'm pretty much sticking to Winger/Attack for my wingers even though Kuyt isn't the best breakthrough player. He's generally clever enough to not try to one-on-one with a significantly better DL for some reason.

My MCr is an achilles heel. With both Lucas and van der Vaart having occupied it, both have only really played well a few times. It seems like no matter if you play them as MC, Adv. PM or Deep PM, they sit around in midfield and just pass the ball to the DMl. I fear Aquilani will be much the same. Rarely will he take the ball forward and go for a shot (which is always blocked because he's too slow), and even more rarely will he play a proper through pass. It really is just passing to Mascherano or occassionally the MR. Perhaps an AM/Support instruction will solve it?

The DMCl is a bit soso at times too. Mascherano's an absolute class player and should win a lot of balls in midfield, but most of the time doesn't. I think it's because the opposition simply play the ball past him. This may be a weakness in having my midfield staggered like it is.

Variations:

I've got a lot of variations of the tactic in terms of both philosphy, mentality and positions. A more attacking variation sees the DMCl moved up to MCl with Ball Winning/Defend. A very attacking variation sees the wingers pushed up to AML/AMR positions still with Winger/Attack and a very defensive version sees the MCr moved down to DMCr with DM/Defend and the wingers being Defensive Wingers/Attack.

I've got Torres set as Target Man supplied To Feet, which has really changed my game for the better.

Conclusion:

Results so far have been primarily positive. After drawing 1-1 against both Aston Villa and Man. City (both scored from set pieces), I've gone on to win five of the next six matches, only drawing 1-1 with Wigan at home after being silly and wanting to try two strikers. Of note I beat Arsenal 1-0 away in the league in a lousy game which I was very fortunate. They had a lot of chances but failed to convert them. Came back three days later to play them away again in the League Cup, but with the more defensive strategy described above and absolutely dominated them and was unlucky to only win 1-0.

Just beat SCUM 2-1 at home. I should've kept a clean sheet but neglected packing up at the back towards the end. They really were only dangerous as they hurled long balls in the last 15 minutes, I controlled the rest of the game easily. For all three games it should be mentioned that I scored all four goals on the counter despite not playing counter football. Rather playing defensively against the Arses and with a standard mentality against SCUM.

But I've seen a fair share of counter attacking goals and chances. I'm not sure why, but it's obvious we move the ball very, very fast after breaking up their attack. Pretty much the five most attacking players move it between themselves very fluidly and very, very fast ending with either the FC (mostly), the AMC or the MC getting the through-ball.

Oh, and it should be noted I just lost 3-0 at home to Atletico Madrid because I wanted to try my super attacking formation. That's a really, really, really bad idea when you've got injuries and your DCs are called Kyriakos and Skrtel and your RB Carragher, your defensive line is located somewhere around the middle while facing Aguero and Forlan...

Ok sorry. This turned out to be an essay of epic proportions. That's what I get for discussing tactics and strategies with myself on the way to work every morning...

[Siven]

I came to the same conclusion baout the AM postition as you Aschack, AM or Advanced playmaker with support role is fantastic. Im playing 4-2-3-1 and Gerrard or Hamsik when i rest Gerrard are immense there, spreading the ball to the 2 inside forwards and Torres upfront while still getting in great positions when the ball is crossed in. Long shots to rarely is needed too.

I play Torres as an advanced forward and hes been fantastic. Hes also very good as targetman with ball to feet. I find aslong as the lone striker has support on the form of an AM he will do very well.

Signing wise i'll be selling Babel, Voronin, Degen, Dossena and Cavalieri along with multiple reserves (may even release some reserves to save ££). unsure about Kuyt atm, hes a capable backup for me at present as ive not really found another good backup Forward.

I will be bringing in Loach as cheap backup Keeper(English too for homegrown), GK Muggleton (future),GK Areola(future), Jovetic (Great young AML/FC), Hamsik (Backup to Gerrard and great MCa for games i need a more offensive Midfield). Been impressed with Krivets as a backup AMR too.

Lucas is a good general midfielder so i may keep him. Hes certainly done well for me when Masch has been out and im a support MC role. But its possible i may sell him if i decide on a good replacement.

[lfc7]

What are all you plans for when the proper game comes out next friday, have you thought about signings yet? the best tactics?

Am on nights so wont have much game time:(

After a couple of years only reading the Liverpool threads, I guess it's time for me to come back to my Reds for the first time since '06. Only realised how much I've missed 'em 5 minutes into the demo. Interesting this year too, not to mention challenging.

I've tried to sort the squad out as I would have with a full save, and use the demo as practice for tactics and selection. Must......resist...transfers....spread.....over......48....months....

Out:

Voronin - £4m (Sunderland) - No brainer. He's rubbish, and I plan on playing one up front anyway, so I don't need a great deal of back-up.

Babel - £9m (City) - Riera's going to start, so to strengthen other areas I needed to shift him and bring in someone cheaper.

Lucas - £7m (City) - This one had more to do with real life than FM. Still, I couldn't see him ever developing enough to take over from Masch, or to play as a creative midfielder.

Dossena - £5.75m (City) - Fans saddened?! Three left backs, so the one I hate gets the shove.

Cavalieri - £4m (Wolves) - He's solid, but to boost my cash I sold him to bring in a cheaper reserve.

Degen - £2.5m (Wigan) - Same as above, though I can't believe someone paid that amount for him.

Pacheco - £1.5m (Villa) - I plan to try and keep him when my real save starts, but I needed that little bit of extra cash.

In:

Andrade - Free - With Agger and Skrtel injured at the start, I felt I needed some extra cover. His wages were fairly low, and if he doesn't get injured too often, he might turn out to be a useful squad player.

Van der Vaart - Loan fee £1.1m (Real) - Creativity in the middle. Much needed, especially with AA injured for most of the demo. Future fee is £7m, not that it matters over six months.

Vicente - Loan fee £1.2m (Valencia) - Back-up for Riera, and still has something to offer, I hope. Future feee of £5m.

Loach - £2.5m (Watford) - Looks good for a 2nd choice, and £1.5m freed up to spend on other areas by changing Reina's back-up.

Vargas - £10m (Fiorentina) - Insua doesn't look quite good enough yet, and I felt that I wanted an attacking full-back down the left too.

Contra - £500k (Getafe) - Able, if old, back-up for Johnson. I still feel a little sad about the chasing he got in Dortmund all those years ago, so there's a sentimental side to the deal too.

Arda - £11.5m (Galatasaray) - Half of the fee is spread out, but I felt I needed some real quality on the right, and he was a fantastic performer on my first demo save with Milan.

Ninis - Loan fee £425k (Panathinaikos) - I wanted a little extra cover in attacking areas, and he was the only viable young option left.

Sissoko - £10m (Toulouse) - Cover for Masch, and one of my favourite players from '09.

Pretty much broke even, and although I wanted better cover than Kuyt for Torres, and a real top class centre-back, I just couldn't afford either. Lots of players left on loan too.

I'd decided on playing a Rafa-style formation even before starting, although I want to be a bit more adventurous.

GK - Reina/Loach/Martin

DR - Johnson/Contra

DL - Vargas/Aurelio/Insua

DC - Carra/Skrtel/Andrade

DC - Agger/Krgyiakos

MC - Mascherano/Sissoko

MC - Van der Vaart/Aquilani

AML - Riera/Vicente

AMR - Arda/Ninis

AMC - Gerrard/Benayoun

FC - Torres/Kuyt/N'Gog

Not as strong as I'd have hoped, but in better shape than we start, I reckon.

Just got through the friendlies largely unscathed. We seem to be playing well, with 17 scored, and only one conceded. Not the greatest opposition though, it must be said. VdV did score an absolute screamer against Genk though. Hopefully he'll keep that sort of thing up when the real matches come around.

Some nice ins and outs

A brave manager who brings old horseface to Anfield.

Haha

[rbnrbn]

Playing a simple 4-4-2 which seems to be working fantastically. Just beat Hertha 6-0 in the CL Group Stages with Torres scoring all 6!

[aschack]

What wingers are you using and how are you playing them? I find everyone but Riera to be really bad.

Also, who are you playing alongside Torres and how are you feeding them?

[stevie_G_32201]

arrrgh i missed the thread starting trying hard to resist the demo. havnt downloaded it yet. i WILL hold out until the full game...or at least i hope i will.

[Dan13L]

Do you think it'll still be as easy to sell players in the full game after the patch?

I remember in a previous demo people were selling players for crazy money and then SI patched it and it made it harder. I for one, would be delighted to be able to get 8-9 million for Voronin and Dossena in the full game and to be able to shift Babel, Degen so easily for decent money....

(but in reality they're a load of tosh and not worth that as we found out when we couldn;t even shift vorinin for 4 million to Hertha!!)

[Dan13L]

Right, going to post what's probably going to be a semi-long recap of my first 5 days with the demo. If you're not into long reads, I think you should probably skip this one...

I intend this to be both a showcase of how things can be done with relatively little reorganisation as well as a talking point about how to make the most out of the players we have available. Feedback more than welcome.

Starting the first game I decided to spend a lot of time cleaning up the reserve squad and getting a few players for the senior squad, but most of all just doing all the nitty-gritty stuff with finding the right coaches (which can be a handful without a proper coaching quality calculator) and scouts, which took the usual couple of hours.

That game was eventually abandoned sometime in late august/early september as it turned out that a) my tactics didn't work in anything but friendly games and b) my laptop's graphics card kept overheating and I had to replay the same game 4 times which bored me.

So game 2, which is now the proper game. I'm upto mid October and I spent quite some time fiddling with tactics - and it's still being refined and adjusted on a game-per-game basis, but at least I'm fairly happy with it now.

Players:

From the get-go I decided I was going to mimic the 4-4-1-1 formation we're playing with Gerrard hanging behind Torres. That means a flat four at the back, a defensive minded midfielder, a holding midfielder, two wingers (who in more defensive formations can help at the back), an offensive midfielder and a striker were needed.

Fortunately these are all in the club, but there are of course some issues.

1) Aquilani is out for a long time and the only cover is Lucas and I'm not convinced he's good enough.

I recruited van der Vaart on loan for 1.1m + 6.25m future fee for this position. He has not been a success no matter if I play him as a flat MC, a withdrawn playmaker or an advanced playmaker (all with Support). Aquilani's getting back though and I'll see if it's just van der Vaart being poor or the position and role being an issue. Perhaps van der Vaart as CM with AM/support role?

2) There's no proper cover for Torres. Kuyt really isn't what you're looking for there and while Voronin does fit the description, he's not good enough.

I recruited Artem Milevskyi from Dinamo Kiev for 7m, and while he's mainly been used as a substitute, he's been amazing. 5 goals in his first 5 games and now 6 in 9. He seems most capable of scoring on the break, running onto a through ball from the middle and calmly slotting it home, though he has scored a few good efforts inside the area. A very good substitute indeed.

I've recruited Marco Boriello for 6m as well for a simple test even though his wages and appearance fees and signon bonus are astronomic. But he has something the other two lack - incredible aerial play with reasonable supporting stats, kinda like a better Heskey. I've yet to try him out and my first choice would be in a proper 4-4-2 formation, but the alternative is as a target man when trying to hold on to a lead.

3) Wingers can be an issue. With Riera fixed on the left but being slightly inconsistent, Babel being more of an inside forward and utterly refusing to cross the ball, Kuyt lacking dribbling and pace and Benayoun being too much of a jack-of-all-trades, there are no really, really good proper wingers.

So I recruited Giovanni dos Santos for 12m, but I must say he's been largely disappointing and I should've probably checked his stats before. Nonetheless, having all these people provide for some great versatility and you can mix and match based on opponent and form.

Outs:

Ryan Babel - 11.5m

Andrea Dossena - 9.5m

Andriy Voronin - 600k loan fee + 3.7m future fee

Daniel Pacheco - 2.2m

Philipp Degen - 2.5m

Lauri Dalla Valle - 1.6m

Tactics:

As mentioned I play a 4-4-1-1. In anything but attacking formations, the MCd is dropped down to DMC on the left spot and the AMC is also in the left spot because I feel it helps me keep the width and my AMC can cut in and shoot if needed. Subsequently the striker is also in the central right position.

LB: Fabio Aurelio - Full Back/Automatic

RB: Glen Johnson - Full Back/Automatic

DCr: Jamie Carragher - Defender/Defend

DCl: Martin Skrtl - Defender/Defend. Note: Was going to play Agger here as Ball Playing Defender/Defend, but Skrtel has been outstanding, so not yet.

DMCl: Javier Mascherano - DM/Defend

MCr: Rafael van der Vaart - Deep Lying Playmaker/Support. Note: Aquilani will take this from next game on.

MR: Dirk Kuyt - Winger/Attack

ML: Albert Riera - Winger/Attack

AMCl: Steven Gerrard - AM/Support

FCr: Fernando Torres - Poacher/Attack

About the tactic, I've experimented a lot with roles and duties for everyone but the defensive line to make the most out of everyone. This is probably what will interest most people.

To start off with the dynamic duo in charge of bagging the goals, I've tried Gerrard both as Attacking Midfielder and Trequartista and with both Attack and Support duties, but I've found AM/Support to be by far the better for a number of reasons. With Trequartista you're basically telling him to not work for the team, which is a huge waste. Granted, there's no need for him to back to his own area, tackle a striker and rush with it up to the other end, but he's proven very valuable in breaking down opposition play around the middle or on their side. With Attack duty he gets a bit too cocky and selfish as well and usually ends up with 10+ shots per game, pretty much all from outside the area and pretty much all high and wide. He's got a good shot, but not that good. And even with Support duty I've found myself setting the specific instruction of Long Shots - Rarely which really works well. He'll still do it, now he'll just look for Torres before shooting.

About Torres, I've tried him with most roles and both with Attack and Support duties (Support when Gerrad had Attack). There's no doubt that he's better off with Attack duty and Gerrard with Support, but you can keep discussing roles. I think he can pretty much fulfill all of them, which means you should try and make him fit into what you want to do. If you give him Complete Forward he will frequently wander off in order to receive the ball outside the area, and with just one striker that's not what I want. So Poacher's good; he'll hang on the shoulder of the last defender, ready to break away, which is especially good when you're not playing very attacking football but find yourself getting a few counters. Advanced Forward works too, but for me it's something I use when playing a more attacking formation where I hold the ball a lot outside the area, basically making him play on more than just pace, dribbling and finishing.

For the midfield, I'm pretty much sticking to Winger/Attack for my wingers even though Kuyt isn't the best breakthrough player. He's generally clever enough to not try to one-on-one with a significantly better DL for some reason.

My MCr is an achilles heel. With both Lucas and van der Vaart having occupied it, both have only really played well a few times. It seems like no matter if you play them as MC, Adv. PM or Deep PM, they sit around in midfield and just pass the ball to the DMl. I fear Aquilani will be much the same. Rarely will he take the ball forward and go for a shot (which is always blocked because he's too slow), and even more rarely will he play a proper through pass. It really is just passing to Mascherano or occassionally the MR. Perhaps an AM/Support instruction will solve it?

The DMCl is a bit soso at times too. Mascherano's an absolute class player and should win a lot of balls in midfield, but most of the time doesn't. I think it's because the opposition simply play the ball past him. This may be a weakness in having my midfield staggered like it is.

Variations:

I've got a lot of variations of the tactic in terms of both philosphy, mentality and positions. A more attacking variation sees the DMCl moved up to MCl with Ball Winning/Defend. A very attacking variation sees the wingers pushed up to AML/AMR positions still with Winger/Attack and a very defensive version sees the MCr moved down to DMCr with DM/Defend and the wingers being Defensive Wingers/Attack.

I've got Torres set as Target Man supplied To Feet, which has really changed my game for the better.

Conclusion:

Results so far have been primarily positive. After drawing 1-1 against both Aston Villa and Man. City (both scored from set pieces), I've gone on to win five of the next six matches, only drawing 1-1 with Wigan at home after being silly and wanting to try two strikers. Of note I beat Arsenal 1-0 away in the league in a lousy game which I was very fortunate. They had a lot of chances but failed to convert them. Came back three days later to play them away again in the League Cup, but with the more defensive strategy described above and absolutely dominated them and was unlucky to only win 1-0.

Just beat SCUM 2-1 at home. I should've kept a clean sheet but neglected packing up at the back towards the end. They really were only dangerous as they hurled long balls in the last 15 minutes, I controlled the rest of the game easily. For all three games it should be mentioned that I scored all four goals on the counter despite not playing counter football. Rather playing defensively against the Arses and with a standard mentality against SCUM.

But I've seen a fair share of counter attacking goals and chances. I'm not sure why, but it's obvious we move the ball very, very fast after breaking up their attack. Pretty much the five most attacking players move it between themselves very fluidly and very, very fast ending with either the FC (mostly), the AMC or the MC getting the through-ball.

Oh, and it should be noted I just lost 3-0 at home to Atletico Madrid because I wanted to try my super attacking formation. That's a really, really, really bad idea when you've got injuries and your DCs are called Kyriakos and Skrtel and your RB Carragher, your defensive line is located somewhere around the middle while facing Aguero and Forlan...

Ok sorry. This turned out to be an essay of epic proportions. That's what I get for discussing tactics and strategies with myself on the way to work every morning...

Very interesting, good read. Kept me very entertained at work :-)

[aschack]

I was wondering what formations people have considered and used.

As I see it, we obviously have two world class players in Gerrard and Torres, and the way I plan my formations is having in mind that I want the most out of these two. But we also have two players who are just a notch below them in Mascherano and Aquilani (if he turns out to be as good as promised) in my opinion, and having them fit into your formation would be for me nigh on mandatory.

Also, with the advent of the tactics wizard with roles and duties, you can fit in specific players more easily than ever before while maintaining backup players or alternatives that may not play exactly the same way.

Torres is of course easy. He can play alone or with a partner at the top and can fulfill virtually every role you give him. Also you don't have others in the same position you have to cater to.

Gerrard on the other hand is to me the one that could cause a headache. To really benefit the most from him he has to play that AMC position. You can play him in MC and you can play him as (A)MR too if you want, but at the end of the day you have a £30m player running around doing the job of a £12m player if you do that.

Similarly you have Mascherano and Aquilani and while the former can play both DMC and MC, the latter can only play MC, so no matter how I twist and turn it, I end up with a whole lot of central midfielders.

That's why I decided to test out the 4-4-1-1, but I can see formations such as 4-1-2-1-2, 4-3-2-1 (christmas tree) or 4-2-3-1 (with inside or outside wings) being just as good, if not better since we're short on proper wingers.

So right now I'm considering playing a 4-1-2-1-1 or 4-3-2-1 for my next run through the demo.

What are you playing around with?

[lfc7]

Am using my own 4-2-3-1 doing alright but not setting the world alight i have Torres as advanced forward and Gerrard as advanced playmaker in the AMC slot

[Indi75]

Never mind selling Riera, I've had him playing as AML in Winger/Attack role and he's supplied 8 curling crosses for Gerrard (AMC/Treq/Attack) and Torres (ST/Adv/Att) in 3 games... and I've 45 mins to go.

I'm not sure there's gonna be so many instant success tactics in this version, since I find roles and duties are specific to starting lineup and subsequent subs or positional changes.

[LostinSpain]

Right, going to post what's probably going to be a semi-long recap of my first 5 days with the demo. If you're not into long reads, I think you should probably skip this one...

I intend this to be both a showcase of how things can be done with relatively little reorganisation as well as a talking point about how to make the most out of the players we have available. Feedback more than welcome.

Starting the first game I decided to spend a lot of time cleaning up the reserve squad and getting a few players for the senior squad, but most of all just doing all the nitty-gritty stuff with finding the right coaches (which can be a handful without a proper coaching quality calculator) and scouts, which took the usual couple of hours.

That game was eventually abandoned sometime in late august/early september as it turned out that a) my tactics didn't work in anything but friendly games and b) my laptop's graphics card kept overheating and I had to replay the same game 4 times which bored me.

So game 2, which is now the proper game. I'm upto mid October and I spent quite some time fiddling with tactics - and it's still being refined and adjusted on a game-per-game basis, but at least I'm fairly happy with it now.

Players:

From the get-go I decided I was going to mimic the 4-4-1-1 formation we're playing with Gerrard hanging behind Torres. That means a flat four at the back, a defensive minded midfielder, a holding midfielder, two wingers (who in more defensive formations can help at the back), an offensive midfielder and a striker were needed.

Fortunately these are all in the club, but there are of course some issues.

1) Aquilani is out for a long time and the only cover is Lucas and I'm not convinced he's good enough.

I recruited van der Vaart on loan for 1.1m + 6.25m future fee for this position. He has not been a success no matter if I play him as a flat MC, a withdrawn playmaker or an advanced playmaker (all with Support). Aquilani's getting back though and I'll see if it's just van der Vaart being poor or the position and role being an issue. Perhaps van der Vaart as CM with AM/support role?

2) There's no proper cover for Torres. Kuyt really isn't what you're looking for there and while Voronin does fit the description, he's not good enough.

I recruited Artem Milevskyi from Dinamo Kiev for 7m, and while he's mainly been used as a substitute, he's been amazing. 5 goals in his first 5 games and now 6 in 9. He seems most capable of scoring on the break, running onto a through ball from the middle and calmly slotting it home, though he has scored a few good efforts inside the area. A very good substitute indeed.

I've recruited Marco Boriello for 6m as well for a simple test even though his wages and appearance fees and signon bonus are astronomic. But he has something the other two lack - incredible aerial play with reasonable supporting stats, kinda like a better Heskey. I've yet to try him out and my first choice would be in a proper 4-4-2 formation, but the alternative is as a target man when trying to hold on to a lead.

3) Wingers can be an issue. With Riera fixed on the left but being slightly inconsistent, Babel being more of an inside forward and utterly refusing to cross the ball, Kuyt lacking dribbling and pace and Benayoun being too much of a jack-of-all-trades, there are no really, really good proper wingers.

So I recruited Giovanni dos Santos for 12m, but I must say he's been largely disappointing and I should've probably checked his stats before. Nonetheless, having all these people provide for some great versatility and you can mix and match based on opponent and form.

Outs:

Ryan Babel - 11.5m

Andrea Dossena - 9.5m

Andriy Voronin - 600k loan fee + 3.7m future fee

Daniel Pacheco - 2.2m

Philipp Degen - 2.5m

Lauri Dalla Valle - 1.6m

Tactics:

As mentioned I play a 4-4-1-1. In anything but attacking formations, the MCd is dropped down to DMC on the left spot and the AMC is also in the left spot because I feel it helps me keep the width and my AMC can cut in and shoot if needed. Subsequently the striker is also in the central right position.

LB: Fabio Aurelio - Full Back/Automatic

RB: Glen Johnson - Full Back/Automatic

DCr: Jamie Carragher - Defender/Defend

DCl: Martin Skrtl - Defender/Defend. Note: Was going to play Agger here as Ball Playing Defender/Defend, but Skrtel has been outstanding, so not yet.

DMCl: Javier Mascherano - DM/Defend

MCr: Rafael van der Vaart - Deep Lying Playmaker/Support. Note: Aquilani will take this from next game on.

MR: Dirk Kuyt - Winger/Attack

ML: Albert Riera - Winger/Attack

AMCl: Steven Gerrard - AM/Support

FCr: Fernando Torres - Poacher/Attack

About the tactic, I've experimented a lot with roles and duties for everyone but the defensive line to make the most out of everyone. This is probably what will interest most people.

To start off with the dynamic duo in charge of bagging the goals, I've tried Gerrard both as Attacking Midfielder and Trequartista and with both Attack and Support duties, but I've found AM/Support to be by far the better for a number of reasons. With Trequartista you're basically telling him to not work for the team, which is a huge waste. Granted, there's no need for him to back to his own area, tackle a striker and rush with it up to the other end, but he's proven very valuable in breaking down opposition play around the middle or on their side. With Attack duty he gets a bit too cocky and selfish as well and usually ends up with 10+ shots per game, pretty much all from outside the area and pretty much all high and wide. He's got a good shot, but not that good. And even with Support duty I've found myself setting the specific instruction of Long Shots - Rarely which really works well. He'll still do it, now he'll just look for Torres before shooting.

About Torres, I've tried him with most roles and both with Attack and Support duties (Support when Gerrad had Attack). There's no doubt that he's better off with Attack duty and Gerrard with Support, but you can keep discussing roles. I think he can pretty much fulfill all of them, which means you should try and make him fit into what you want to do. If you give him Complete Forward he will frequently wander off in order to receive the ball outside the area, and with just one striker that's not what I want. So Poacher's good; he'll hang on the shoulder of the last defender, ready to break away, which is especially good when you're not playing very attacking football but find yourself getting a few counters. Advanced Forward works too, but for me it's something I use when playing a more attacking formation where I hold the ball a lot outside the area, basically making him play on more than just pace, dribbling and finishing.

For the midfield, I'm pretty much sticking to Winger/Attack for my wingers even though Kuyt isn't the best breakthrough player. He's generally clever enough to not try to one-on-one with a significantly better DL for some reason.

My MCr is an achilles heel. With both Lucas and van der Vaart having occupied it, both have only really played well a few times. It seems like no matter if you play them as MC, Adv. PM or Deep PM, they sit around in midfield and just pass the ball to the DMl. I fear Aquilani will be much the same. Rarely will he take the ball forward and go for a shot (which is always blocked because he's too slow), and even more rarely will he play a proper through pass. It really is just passing to Mascherano or occassionally the MR. Perhaps an AM/Support instruction will solve it?

The DMCl is a bit soso at times too. Mascherano's an absolute class player and should win a lot of balls in midfield, but most of the time doesn't. I think it's because the opposition simply play the ball past him. This may be a weakness in having my midfield staggered like it is.

Variations:

I've got a lot of variations of the tactic in terms of both philosphy, mentality and positions. A more attacking variation sees the DMCl moved up to MCl with Ball Winning/Defend. A very attacking variation sees the wingers pushed up to AML/AMR positions still with Winger/Attack and a very defensive version sees the MCr moved down to DMCr with DM/Defend and the wingers being Defensive Wingers/Attack.

I've got Torres set as Target Man supplied To Feet, which has really changed my game for the better.

Conclusion:

Results so far have been primarily positive. After drawing 1-1 against both Aston Villa and Man. City (both scored from set pieces), I've gone on to win five of the next six matches, only drawing 1-1 with Wigan at home after being silly and wanting to try two strikers. Of note I beat Arsenal 1-0 away in the league in a lousy game which I was very fortunate. They had a lot of chances but failed to convert them. Came back three days later to play them away again in the League Cup, but with the more defensive strategy described above and absolutely dominated them and was unlucky to only win 1-0.

Just beat SCUM 2-1 at home. I should've kept a clean sheet but neglected packing up at the back towards the end. They really were only dangerous as they hurled long balls in the last 15 minutes, I controlled the rest of the game easily. For all three games it should be mentioned that I scored all four goals on the counter despite not playing counter football. Rather playing defensively against the Arses and with a standard mentality against SCUM.

But I've seen a fair share of counter attacking goals and chances. I'm not sure why, but it's obvious we move the ball very, very fast after breaking up their attack. Pretty much the five most attacking players move it between themselves very fluidly and very, very fast ending with either the FC (mostly), the AMC or the MC getting the through-ball.

Oh, and it should be noted I just lost 3-0 at home to Atletico Madrid because I wanted to try my super attacking formation. That's a really, really, really bad idea when you've got injuries and your DCs are called Kyriakos and Skrtel and your RB Carragher, your defensive line is located somewhere around the middle while facing Aguero and Forlan...

Ok sorry. This turned out to be an essay of epic proportions. That's what I get for discussing tactics and strategies with myself on the way to work every morning...

Good stuff, mate.

VdV has been very solid for me. I'm playing him alongside Mascherano in an advanced playmaker/support role, and, if anything, he's being too offensive (especially where shooting from range is concerned). Maybe try moving Masch into a ball-winning MC role, giving VdV closer support, and more freedom to influence the game? Mascherano's been one of the best performers in my squad with that role.

My problem's with Torres. Yes, I know it's laughable, but there it is. I've tried him as a complete forward, and an advanced forward, but he's not been as effective as I'd hoped. He's being given the chances by Arda (who's going to be my "must buy" on my full save), Gerrard, and Riera, getting his shots on target, but not scoring. He's played 5 games, had 23 shots, 17 on target, but only 2 goals. Recommendations, anyone, for the love of all that's holy!

[Staf9]

Would asking Torres to place his shots help???

[LostinSpain]

I hope so, I've got him learning that move already. At the moment, goals from Gerrard and Arda are bailing me out a bit so I've got to get Fernando firing. Anyone who's trained Torres to place his shots any idea when I can expect the move to be learnt (or not)? He started on the opening day of the demo.

[aschack]

You should probably take a look at how many clear cut chances you have.

I've abandoned my 4-4-1-1 game since I just didn't have the wingers in an effort to test out how 4-3-1-2 and 4-1-2-1-2 work out while getting some central midfielders (van der Vaart and Hamsik) and a strike partner for Torres (Milevskyi fits the bill really well for cheap money), but the complete lack of width with these formations mean I don't get many clear cut chances which in turn means that my strikers don't score.

I end up with nothing but long shots. Drawing 1-1 with Doncaster (!) Torres scored from the only clear cut chance he got - a header inside the area. That was supplemented by 14 long shots. Try and look at your match stats and go to the Analysis tab and see where your shots are from. If you get a ball to Torres inside the area, he will score on a lot of them, make no mistake.

Basically, if you want Torres to score, you have to feed him. He's good at moving into positions to receive the ball, but if you don't play the ball to where he is, then it doesn't matter much.

Back to my own issues of lack of width with nothing but central midfielders (no matter if they play support or attack duties), my full backs move up and sit on the same line as my midfielders and so can't be brought into play when you're stagnant in the center and need the width - they'll just pass the ball back to the CMs. I'm gonna try doing an overlap shout next game and see how it works.

Edit: Looking over my other training matches (all won 3-0), there's been two clear cut chances in each, both which have been for my forwards and both have been scored on. Again followed by 15-20 long shots, one which went in. It's obvious I need to do something here....

Edit 2: Talk about instant hit! Setting the more offensive MCs to support and using the overlap shout, my full backs are now brought into the game and having an instant impact. Not only are they providing numerous quality crosses, the mere fact they're up there tears the opposition defense apart and stretches it a lot. This may yet have some potential. Still have to use "Work ball into box" shout to set all Long Shots to rarely or van der Vaart and Gerrard will do nothing but punt the ball into orbit from 30yds even with excellent passing opportunities...

[rbnrbn]

Would asking Torres to place his shots help???

Yes it does!

[Maverik]

Jordan Rhodes from Huddersfield is good backup for Torres. English and cost less than 1m

[lfc7]

Gutted barley played fm due to work am on nights 2 more 12hr shifts to go

[jack0923]

Really am struggling with tactics so far in the demo. I want to replicate the 4-2-3-1 we implement in real life. Just not working. Played 5 in the league, won 1, drawn 2, lost 2. although I have just been to the bernabeu in the cl and was 3-0 up at half time. I somehow managed to draw 3-3 in the end though! I had 7 clear cut chances. I changed my tactic to a 4-4-1-1 for the bernabeu game and played on the counter. I'm hoping I'm onto something! Anybody had good successes implementing a 4-2-3-1?

[Torres_Is_God]

Really am struggling with tactics so far in the demo. I want to replicate the 4-2-3-1 we implement in real life. Just not working. Played 5 in the league, won 1, drawn 2, lost 2. although I have just been to the bernabeu in the cl and was 3-0 up at half time. I somehow managed to draw 3-3 in the end though! I had 7 clear cut chances. I changed my tactic to a 4-4-1-1 for the bernabeu game and played on the counter. I'm hoping I'm onto something! Anybody had good successes implementing a 4-2-3-1?

What individual player tactics are you using?

[sugary88]

Just took over Liverpool. To be honest, I'm seriously appalled at the lack of quality at the club. It seems like the good players are simply world-class, while the bad players look just plain pathetic. I really wonder what Benitez is thinking in real life. The defence and wings look especially

Will post my transfers soon. Probably gotta work hard in the loan market.

[lfc7]

Just took over Liverpool. To be honest, I'm seriously appalled at the lack of quality at the club. It seems like the good players are simply world-class, while the bad players look just plain pathetic. I really wonder what Benitez is thinking in real life. The defence and wings look especially

Will post my transfers soon. Probably gotta work hard in the loan market.

In Rafa we trust

[Hog]

Really am struggling with tactics so far in the demo. I want to replicate the 4-2-3-1 we implement in real life. Just not working. Played 5 in the league, won 1, drawn 2, lost 2. although I have just been to the bernabeu in the cl and was 3-0 up at half time. I somehow managed to draw 3-3 in the end though! I had 7 clear cut chances. I changed my tactic to a 4-4-1-1 for the bernabeu game and played on the counter. I'm hoping I'm onto something! Anybody had good successes implementing a 4-2-3-1?

Well it's not working irl either so you're replicating it well.

Try playing gerrard as trequartista and torres as advanced striker. Who do you have on the wings.

[sugary88]

Well it's not working irl either so you're replicating it well.

Try playing gerrard as trequartista and torres as advanced striker. Who do you have on the wings.

I LOL'd at that. Anyone knows if Silva would join Pool? I read that some of you managed to sign him. But my chief scout says he doesn't want to come over. Don't wanna bank my hopes on him.

[kopsy101]

ah feckers i have no money so wont get the game till christmas i reckon :O

shocking as it looks fantastic this year

[LostinSpain]

Well, just over half of the demo gone, so I suppose I better post an update.

The good news is that toward the back end of September, Torres kicked into gear, scoring 9 in 5 games, including 4 at poor old Wigan. It's been the key to some impressive wins. I copied Aschack, and changed him to a target man, with supply to feet. It's worked wonders, so thanks very much. The tactics seemt o be working well, with the team dominating possession, and creating clear chances in all the games so far.

There is no bad news. I'm still unbeaten, have no new major injuries, and both AA and Agger are back in training, and should be ready in a matter of weeks. I'm leaking money, just like everyone else, I expect, but that's not really something I'm going to worry about until a full save. Conceding goals is a minor worry, but we've only looked a bit shakey when Skrtel wasn't fit.

Results so far:

Villa(h) - Prem - W3-0

City(a) - Prem - D2-2

Everton(h) - Prem - D2-2

Sunderland(a) - Prem - W1-0

Wolves(h) - Prem - W1-0

AZ(h) - ECC - W4-1

Wigan(a) - LC - W2-0

Blackburn(h) - Prem - W3-1

At. madrid(a) - ECC - W5-1

Wigan(a) - Prem - W4-2

The win against Atletico was something special. Okay, so they can't defend, but we scored four in the first half, adn even though we had a man sent off in the second half, we were still cutting them to shreds.

Top preformers have been, shockingly, Gerrard, Torres, Kuyt, and Arda. Stevie has 8 goals in 10 games, Torres 11 in 10, and Kuyt and Arda have managed 2 each, with 3 and four assists respectively. VdV would have been on there too, but for his red against Atletico and an awful showing against City.

Some tougher games coming up though. Arsenal and Utd next, with Chelsea, Atletico, and Spurs crammed into a six day period before christmas.

[LostinSpain]

Jordan Rhodes from Huddersfield is good backup for Torres. English and cost less than 1m

Looks like a decent find for the full game. Physical stats need some work though.

[Torres_Is_God]

Something for you all to chuckle at.. Voronin, yes Voronin! has the highest average rating in the EPl so far in my demo!!! I'm only 5 games in though, so I wont hold my breath...

[aschack]

Good to see you got Torres and Gerrard firing on all cylinders. What formation are you using?

Was it a 4-2-3-1 with three AMCs, two being inside forwards?

I've spent all day playing around with wingless tactics and two strikers, but can't quite get it to work. I've eventually managed to get the width I need with special settings for my fullbacks (cross sometimes, run from deep sometimes) and setting the team width higher, but there are too many unresolved issues, so I'm giving up.

When playing 4-3-1-2 it gets too cramped into a small space around the center, and pulling up my fullbacks more than I already do will leave me exposed at the back. Gerrard's ace at popping up in the box though.

Switching to a 4-1-3-2 was slightly better with Mascerano to provide cover for the missing full backs, but the three central midfielders tend to run straight into some tight marking no matter if I play Doncaster or Man City. What gives? That generally leads to a lot of stray passes, sadly. And Mascherano with 60 passes per match...

For both of them, only one striker will be good, which is what really saddens me. No matter if I try to have them link up or both I ask them both to focus on scoring, they'll only really be played in if they're set as target man, and that means the person that has target man will score all the goals (and Milevskyi will interestingly enough score as many as Torres).

And generally, I just don't play football that's a joy to watch, and you gotta play pretty football. And my 4-4-1-1 formation actually played lovely football when I didn't mess up my tactics (*cough*) and I think I can make it work if I restart and get some good wingers. Any suggestions?

Before I give up entirely on wingless play I'm going to give the christmas tree 4-3-2-1 a go now that I've acquired Juan Manuel Mata for the bargain price of £32m. He should make an excellent partner for Gerrard in the AMC roles.

Oh, and one big, big question that's really bugging me: How are people using the team instruction Closing Down? I'd like to use it against slightly weaker teams, but they keep just playing around it, it's really annoying they have such apparently good passers who don't mind being under pressure...

[sugary88]

I'm playing a conventional 4-4-1-1. Both wingers set to Attack. Mascherano and Lucas set to Ball-Winning (Defend). Torres set to Complete Forward (Attack).

The question is, what should I play Gerrard as? I'm trying to mimic real life by using him as an Inside Forward (Attack), behind Torres. And do you guys set the team's Target Man and Playmaker to Torres and Gerrard respectively?

Anyone with experience willing to provide some feedback?

[aschack]

In my 4-4-1-1 formation I have Torres as Target Man with Pass to Feet. That's a pretty important part of a lone striker seemingly.

I do play Gerrard as Advanced Playmaker sometimes, and sometimes as plain Attacking Midfielder (Support still). I still haven't entirely found what works best. There's some merit to having him set as Playmaker in the team options, but they don't make a massive difference to me anyways. I manually restrict his long shots though, or he'll do nothing but play American Football.

That works really well for me. Key part in it for me at least is that Torres is set as Poacher. If you use other roles with a single forward, I'd probably say turn off Roaming on the advanced page or you'll find yourself with a team pumping balls into an empty penalty area.

[Indi75]

Well this is fun so far, exhilarating at times, stressful at others. Surprisingly I'm doing well, but then so are Everton and West Ham?!?!

Here's a few screenies of my campaign so far...

RESULTS:

FORMATION

TEAM INSTRUCTIONS

LEAGUE TABLE

continued....

[Indi75]

TEAM SELECTION STATS

PLAYERS IN

PLAYERS OUT

On the whole, the Tactic is based around the squad with a 442 seemingly not viable owing to the lack of strike partners for Torres. Equally, 4 across the middle is weak as only Riera is a natural midfielder, so I've gone for a formation akin to that of Rafa himself, and simply kept the passing short whilst pushing up and pressing.

The prematch task is then to pick squad based on fitness and form, followed by Role and Duty which is specific to every player even when bringing on Subs.

Example, Acquilani and Hamsik both start as AdPl/Supp until such time as I improve their defensive attributes, but Veloso can be played as B2BM, DLPM, DM or even AdPM owing to his all round ability. Tough away games tend ot involve Masch and Veloso holding the midfield as Anchor Man/Defend and DLPM/Defend respectively. A decent home game see's Veloso or Hamsik, and now Acquilani playing in a more attacking role suited to thier individual attributes.

Torres plays as and AF with Gerrard as Treq/Att at home, but away Gerrard becomes AdPM, or sometimes even AM/Supp if I need him to help defend more.

The results against Arsenal and Utd were largely down to careful role selection and well timed touchline shouts.

Example, Arsenal I went with Hassle, Play Narrower, and Clear to Flanks from the start which allowed me to close down, cramp style, and release pressure easily. At 1-0 up I went from standard to counter and opted to get ball forward/pump ball into area and bagged a second.

Similar with Utd who frankly couldn't cope second half as Torres, Di Maria, and Kuyt ran riot on the breaks.

I'm enjoying, but the squad is small, lacks depth, and I can't wait to get into the full game with 30 leagues and a large database as that will allow for much better sales and squad building.

I'm off to bed.

[Mike-UK]

Indi75: Doing very well mate considering the squad is very average when you first take over..

Would be interested to know though do you assign individual instructions to any of your players..? (i.e Closing-Down, Creative Freedom, Passing etc..)

Cheers pal keep up the good work

[aschack]

That's a really good read. I like the formation, it adds a lot of width while avoiding some of the issues of a flat 4-4-2 (the distinct lack of proper wingers that need to dribble and cross).

The way you change roles based on encounter makes a lot of sense too.

One thing that puzzles me is this: You play with some very advanced and offensive wingers, yet nearly all your assists come from the central players. How do you score your goals?

And would you be too vulnerable to through balls and counter attacks if you asked your backs to get up further and overlap? I could see a lot of goals being set up on the flanks if they took part in the buildup.

On a different note: I can't put words on how good Juan Manuel Mata is as an AMC or a left winger. He's simply outstanding and will create goals from nothing. Absolutely amazing. And for the bargain price of £34m!

Edit: Mike, I'm pretty certain this is all being done with roles and duties which is quite impressive.

[Staf9]

Loving the demo and feel like FM10 will be great for a long term save. just find myself starting off new games on it to try out a few different players for buying on the new game. more so buying wingers and attacking mid's to see who will fit. haven't settled on a formation yet either. rally want to get my 41221 formation from FM09 to work. DM, 2 cm & 1 wide AMRL (actual wingers are very hard to find in the game) De maria seems like a must but havent got to use a striker i got om FM09 as he's injured for most of the demo. Walter, Brazilian striker turns into a beast and can play with Torres or instead of in as the 1 upfront

[lfc7]

ah feckers i have no money so wont get the game till christmas i reckon :O

shocking as it looks fantastic this year

You can get it on Zavvi for £17.95

I'm playing a conventional 4-4-1-1. Both wingers set to Attack. Mascherano and Lucas set to Ball-Winning (Defend). Torres set to Complete Forward (Attack).

The question is, what should I play Gerrard as? I'm trying to mimic real life by using him as an Inside Forward (Attack), behind Torres. And do you guys set the team's Target Man and Playmaker to Torres and Gerrard respectively?

Anyone with experience willing to provide some feedback?

I play a 4-2-3-1 with Torres as an advanced forward (attack role) set as target man with ball to feet and Gerrard as AMC as advanced playmaker on attack role

Both have been injured on my second demo save but on the 1st both played great and there avr e.t.c are further up the page

[antg1985]

Hi Guy's for some reason I have been thinking about FM all day at work, going to start a new demo game to night and try this out.

I need opinions on players and roles.

Formation that I want to try but need the right players

----------GK----------

----CB----CB----CB---

WB----DM---DM----WB

-----------------------

----------AM----------

----ST-------ST-------

What do you all think?

[sugary88]

I think it's a god-damn waste of Glen Johnson!

[LostinSpain]

I'm playing a conventional 4-4-1-1. Both wingers set to Attack. Mascherano and Lucas set to Ball-Winning (Defend). Torres set to Complete Forward (Attack).

The question is, what should I play Gerrard as? I'm trying to mimic real life by using him as an Inside Forward (Attack), behind Torres. And do you guys set the team's Target Man and Playmaker to Torres and Gerrard respectively?

Anyone with experience willing to provide some feedback?

I don't know what's going to work in that formation, as I'm playing witht he same set-up as Indi, but I've got Gerrard set to trequartista. I started with that, and it seems to be getting the best out of him, so I haven't tried anything else.

[LostinSpain]

Good to see you got Torres and Gerrard firing on all cylinders. What formation are you using?

Was it a 4-2-3-1 with three AMCs, two being inside forwards?

I've spent all day playing around with wingless tactics and two strikers, but can't quite get it to work. I've eventually managed to get the width I need with special settings for my fullbacks (cross sometimes, run from deep sometimes) and setting the team width higher, but there are too many unresolved issues, so I'm giving up.

When playing 4-3-1-2 it gets too cramped into a small space around the center, and pulling up my fullbacks more than I already do will leave me exposed at the back. Gerrard's ace at popping up in the box though.

Switching to a 4-1-3-2 was slightly better with Mascerano to provide cover for the missing full backs, but the three central midfielders tend to run straight into some tight marking no matter if I play Doncaster or Man City. What gives? That generally leads to a lot of stray passes, sadly. And Mascherano with 60 passes per match...

For both of them, only one striker will be good, which is what really saddens me. No matter if I try to have them link up or both I ask them both to focus on scoring, they'll only really be played in if they're set as target man, and that means the person that has target man will score all the goals (and Milevskyi will interestingly enough score as many as Torres).

And generally, I just don't play football that's a joy to watch, and you gotta play pretty football. And my 4-4-1-1 formation actually played lovely football when I didn't mess up my tactics (*cough*) and I think I can make it work if I restart and get some good wingers. Any suggestions?

Before I give up entirely on wingless play I'm going to give the christmas tree 4-3-2-1 a go now that I've acquired Juan Manuel Mata for the bargain price of £32m. He should make an excellent partner for Gerrard in the AMC roles.

Oh, and one big, big question that's really bugging me: How are people using the team instruction Closing Down? I'd like to use it against slightly weaker teams, but they keep just playing around it, it's really annoying they have such apparently good passers who don't mind being under pressure...

I'm using the same formation as Indi, but varying team instrucions based on opposition. Player roles are staying pretty static, but I have been changing the wingers from attack to support roles for tougher games. Seems to be working okay too. I've just had very positive results at Arsenal and at home to Utd. 55% possession at the Emirates!

Mata's going to be a fantastic signing for you, I think. I've played as valencia on the demo, and he's a good performer in either a wide left role, or playing just behind Villa.

[sugary88]

I hope this helps you guys.

I had a tough start to my Liverpool reign. My players were unhappy with my team talks (I expressed my disappointment for drawing with Westerloo) and almost started a mini revolt. The fans were giving me stick too, for my team's poor performances.

Up front, I was playing Torres as an complete forward with Gerrard supporting him as a inside forward. But I just can't get the best outta both of them. Torres either went missing in games or looked too lonely up front. Gerrard was trying too hard, shooting from long range like a desperate virgin.

Things only changed after my season opening loss to Villa. I decided that Torres wasn't as complete a forward as I thought. From then on, I set Torres to advanced forward, and it worked wonderfully! Torres started being more of a threat to the defence. Gerrard too started to flourish in his role more as he now has a focal point of attack in Torres.

This is my first team line-up and tactics:

I've been quite active in the transfer market so far. Trying to balance the books though, as I wanna think for the future of the club. Getting rid of the deadwood in the club and making some considered buys. Tell me what you think.

[dan99]

Good price for Babel, although I kept him and he has been quite useful.

I'll get some screenies up later, but I only lost one game on the demo (last game, against Chelsea ), and I'm top of the league. Really pleased with the tactics creator, I think its brilliant.

[Staf9]

Think babel may be sold by alot of people as he can raise decent funds for other positions especially as Angel Di Maria can be brought in for 2.5m. altho i think babel can be retrained for the right wing easily enough, depends on whether you can get someone better in for cheaper

[lfc7]

Think babel may be sold by alot of people as he can raise decent funds for other positions especially as Angel Di Maria can be brought in for 2.5m. altho i think babel can be retrained for the right wing easily enough, depends on whether you can get someone better in for cheaper

Get rid of Babel load of poop

[sugary88]

Vargas for Babel is a good deal, I reckon. Riera is gonna be in the 1st team anyway.

[lfc7]

After being stuck in work for the last 4 nights ive got all wkend to play fm:D

Just worried next week i wont get the full game on time due to the posties

[Staf9]

can't wait for the full game to come out. Demo is doing my nut in as i just want to get a long term save going. GF wants to arrange to do stuff over the wknds(shopping for house stuff) so trying to bunch everything into this wknd so i can have next wknd free to start my game

And yes Babel is poop! but he's decent on the game

[Indi75]

I've had problems trying to get Babel to develop in the game for 3 years.

To the point that once I'd played FM09 to death I downloaded FMRTE (A sin at any other time than waiting for FM10 in my eyes) and cloned Babel with someone elses attributes, CA & PA. As expected, the stats dropped ridiculously despite cloning him to a higher CA and PA.

He's cursed I tell you.