What's your take on Liverpool?

[alerosso]

Hi guys, I'm not really asking for help here but I'm just curious about how would you set Liverpool up if you were to manage them in the game?

I know most of you will straight-away say that Liverpool is easy to win with as it's one - if not the - best teams in the game but still what will your tactics, roles, duties etc look like? A classic 433/4231 or maybe something completely different? 3 at the back? Bear in mind I'm not asking for a real-life Liverpool recreation so it's everything completely up to you.

A couple things I'd really like to hear your take on are:

1. How would you set the flanks up? Would you play both Salah and Mané as IF or would you still want to offer more flank variety? Or maybe you wouldn't play them out wide at all...

2. Would you like to see someone in a different role than the one they play irl? For instance, I believe both TAA and Firmino could be moved to the midfield and be world-class in pretty much every role there too. Is that something you will think about?

Lastly, what players will you be looking to bring in? Where do you think the team can be strenghtened the most?

Edited September 14, 2021 by alerosso

[Justified]

9 hours ago, alerosso said:

Hi guys, I'm not really asking for help here but I'm just curious about how would you set Liverpool up if you were to manage them in the game?

I know most of you will straight-away say that Liverpool is easy to win with as it's one - if not the - best teams in the game but still what will your tactics, roles, duties etc look like? A classic 433/4231 or maybe something completely different? 3 at the back? Bear in mind I'm not asking for a real-life Liverpool recreation so it's everything completely up to you.

A couple things I'd really like to hear your take on are:

1. How would you set the flanks up? Would you play both Salah and Mané as IF or would you still want to offer more flank variety? Or maybe you wouldn't play them out wide at all...

2. Would you like to see someone in a different role than the one they play irl? For instance, I believe both TAA and Firmino could be moved to the midfield and be world-class in pretty much every role there too. Is that something you will think about?

Lastly, what players will you be looking to bring in? Where do you think the team can be strenghtened the most?

If you read my thread then it's exactly how I set them up. They're ridiculously good in game and I can play quite comfortably on Positive mentality in most games. 

1 -> I had Salah as IFat (easily one of the best in the game) and Mane as IWsu. IRL I'd say that Mane is IFsu on average but in FM i find it a bit too one-dimensional having both wingers as the same role.

2 -> TAA could play IWB very well as he has the quality to come in and effect games centrally if you wanted to play him in that role. However, as IRL, if Salah (or Elliott) doesn't hold the width it doesn't work terribly well (Like against Chelsea). You could easily play Firmino in the AMC slot behind Jota. Liverpool have actually done that in game from time to time when needing to score.

After season 1 I won CL and PL and actually sold all the deadwood (Shaqiri, Origi, Minamino, Ojo, Grujic, Ox, Woodburn etc) + Firmino (he wanted an outrageous contract to which I said stick it). I brought in Martinez, Son, Aouer and Koopmeiners and still had money to burn but was happy with that. I signed Koopmeiners as a squad player for Fabinho but as a backup centreback as well as I promoted Rhys Williams who'd played well for the Development squad. I was debating a right back but Neco played well season one so was fine going into the 2nd season with him as backup. Martinez took Firmino's place, Son was a welcome squad player who could play on either flank and Aouer was a different beast in an attacking central midfield role. I'd personally say DMC and a squad winger is the positions I targeted first after season 1 as I needed more depth there.

[Johnny Ace]

I wouldn't try a 3 at the back system with Liverpool to be honest with how flimsy the choices are 

Yeah, I'd go IF's for Mane & Salah, Salah on Attack. Bobby's perfect for a DLF or F9

You'd have to rock a DM & let Trent & Robbo off the leash, could easy use them as a pair of CWBs  

 

[zabyl]

3-4-1-2. Especially for playing Virgil as Libero.

Salah as AF, Mane as DLFa, Jota/Firmino as AMs with roam & risks, Andy as WMa, Trent as WMs, Henderson as RPMs on RCM, a DLPs on LCM...

 

I haven't managed Liverpool since Gerrard's retirement. If I decide to manage them, I would try to replicate this first:

[alerosso]

@Justified @Johnny Ace @zabyl thanks for the replies guys!

 

I already did multiple saves with Liverpool - yeah, I love them, especially on FM - but was wondering how others would play them.

I tried different formations but the one I like the most and I had the best and most consistents results with must be the gool old 4231 in which I mostly played Salah and Mané both as IFa. I sometimes felt the need to switch them to Wa to open up the more stubborn defences.

I used a narrow 433 with both the midfield and the attack in line. 2 MEZs/CAR + CMd and 3 AFa with stay wider on the two on the sides. Sometimes it scoares loads of goals, others it's pretty stale.

I also played with a 3 at the back but not for long so I'm not entirely sure if I like it or not.

 

Nice to hear what other players will do

[krisdonna]

I use a 433 with one WB on support and one CWB on support, BPD and a normal CD as stopper. Midfield i use a DM on support(i am still tweaking with that position), AP and a MEZ on support.

Mane is an IW on support but  i let him roam a  lot, Salah as IF on attack and Firmino as a F9.

I play a short passing high tempo game with narrow width.

[Overmars]

I think their real life tactic is ideal for the talent on the team. The only improvement I would make is finding a faster/bigger presence for the central forward role who could get on the end of crosses when other teams park the bus. Jota is pretty good at it, but he's not the CF/facilitator I would want when teaming up with Mane/Salah. He doesn't really pass at all. And I wouldn't want Firmino in game because his lack of speed would be glaring in the match engine.

[Djecker]

Firmino is your classic F9 or DLF(s), surely?

[Luizinho]

Surprised to hear that people don't feel Mane has an Attack duty. He's so direct with his play that a support duty doesn't make sense IMO.

For me it's a 4-3-3 shape with a DLF (S) up top flanked by two Inside Forwards on Attack.

[alerosso]

I really like the 433 DM on paper but I never quite like how it performs in the game and I simply get way better results by just using a 4231.

I also notice that most of the times AI teams who play a 4231 get better results than those - or maybe even the same team, but with a different manager - who use a 433. For instance, in pretty much all of my saves Man Utd does way better than Man City. To me, it looks like some kind of ME limitation which simply favors the use of an AMC over a DMC. Does anyone else experience the same?

It may sound weird, but I feel like having a DM - even if not in a HB role - just makes your 2 CBs split a bit more and concede way more goals through the middle even when using the narrow defending TI. As soon as I switch to a non-DM formation this happens much less and I am much more solid defensively.

 

@Luizinho I actually do. I know in theory having more flank variety should be better, but playing Mané as an IWs feels like too much of a waste to me.

Edited September 15, 2021 by alerosso

[zabyl]

39 dakika önce, alerosso said:

It may sound weird, but I feel like having a DM - even if not in a HB role - just makes your 2 CBs split a bit more and concede way more goals through the middle even when using the narrow defending TI. As soon as I switch to a non-DM formation this happens much less and I am much more solid defensively.

Do you use OIs for opposition striker?

[alerosso]

36 minuti fa, zabyl ha scritto:

Do you use OIs for opposition striker?

Nope

[zabyl]

12 dakika önce, alerosso said:

Nope

OIs are a powerful tool to shut opposition's options.

Edited September 15, 2021 by zabyl

[alerosso]

3 minuti fa, zabyl ha scritto:

OIs are a powerful tool to shut opposition's options.

Ok but that should have nothing to do with having a DM and being more leaky than not having one, am I wrong?

[Justified]

2 hours ago, Luizinho said:

Surprised to hear that people don't feel Mane has an Attack duty. He's so direct with his play that a support duty doesn't make sense IMO.

For me it's a 4-3-3 shape with a DLF (S) up top flanked by two Inside Forwards on Attack.

Tbh he has the PPM's that get him into the box anyways. I think playing him on support is a good hybrid way of getting him to support the defence as well as attack. But I get your point, he is a lethal attacker on attack.

Edited September 15, 2021 by Justified

[zabyl]

2 saat önce, alerosso said:

Ok but that should have nothing to do with having a DM and being more leaky than not having one, am I wrong?

You can force players' defensive movements with OIs like tight marking & closing down for giving less space to opposition player. I didn't have any defensive problems about defensive positioning when using a DM. "CB"s can spread to sides when using a defensive DM. This is for better field spread. Maybe your problem is on another area, where you lack players to defend opposition's another attacker and this can trigger one of your players to close down extra attacker. In epitome; AI can create overloads too.

[alerosso]

3 ore fa, zabyl ha scritto:

You can force players' defensive movements with OIs like tight marking & closing down for giving less space to opposition player. I didn't have any defensive problems about defensive positioning when using a DM. "CB"s can spread to sides when using a defensive DM. This is for better field spread. Maybe your problem is on another area, where you lack players to defend opposition's another attacker and this can trigger one of your players to close down extra attacker. In epitome; AI can create overloads too.

I will maybe tinker a bit with it the next time I'll try a 433DM. Oddly enough I'm currently playing with the narrow 433 (no DM) I talked about previously and again I'm not seeing this problem just like I don't see it when using 4231 or other formations with no DM. Can't get why having a player in the DMC spot suddenly f**** up my defence but that seems definitely the case for me even if I don't use any particular TI/PI/OI when using it to the point I was thinking it was a "common issue". Nevermind lol

Edited September 15, 2021 by alerosso

[Riziger]

4231 or 433 can both work very easily.

Bog standard 433 - Mane as the IWs, Salah IFa, Bobby F9/DLFs/a/TQ. Mez+Car or Mez+B2B or CMa+B2B etc all can work in the midfield pairing.

Can also try Salah as the Wa with TAA as the IWB behind. He will still behave like a second striker. MEZ/BWM/REG midfield trio.

 

This FM I tried the 4231 with middle block and AF up top or CF up top and it worked well. Could do a Ws (Mane), SS (Jota), IFa (Salah), DLFs/a (Bobby) front 4 also

Edited September 16, 2021 by Riziger