Scouts work permit advice?

[MagicHat]

Is there a part of the scout report which tells you if the player will receive a work permit or not (fm18)?

I know in past versions it told you but i can't seem to find it now, unless it's been removed.

[Snorks]

Not sure where it is, but am sure I have seen an 'Unlikely to gain work permit' in a scout report somewhere.

Possibly only shows up if it is going to be an issue.

[MagicHat]

27 minutes ago, Snorks said:

Not sure where it is, but am sure I have seen an 'Unlikely to gain work permit' in a scout report somewhere.

Possibly only shows up if it is going to be an issue.

That's the problem, i've scouted fred and vlodomyr shepelev, both scout reports didn't say anything about work permits. Then i finalised the transfers and they both failed their work permit and appeals  so in future i'd like to know but having looked now at every part of the report i can't see it.

 

thinking on don't we leave the EU in one year on the game and it means everyone can get conditional work permits? i'm in 2020 though

[Snorks]

The Brexit situation is different on every save, so you would have to check that on your own save.

 

Maybe it is a bug, trey raising it in the Bugs forum.

[jaysdailydose]

Yeah, Brexit is always different and I'm thinking it definitely has something to do with that.

I forget, is there one of the Brexit's that does a complete ban on all foreign players?  Because then it definitely would not appear... just spitballing, I haven't come across the issue yet in this year's game as I was a very late purchase.  

[Snorks]

I think there's one where all foreign players need a work permit rather than being completely banned - I don;t know to be honest.

[MagicHat]

23 hours ago, jaysdailydose said:

Yeah, Brexit is always different and I'm thinking it definitely has something to do with that.

I forget, is there one of the Brexit's that does a complete ban on all foreign players?  Because then it definitely would not appear... just spitballing, I haven't come across the issue yet in this year's game as I was a very late purchase.  

if they were banned on my save they wouldn't have gone through appeals would they?

6 hours ago, Snorks said:

I think there's one where all foreign players need a work permit rather than being completely banned - I don;t know to be honest.

every save i can remember, all players got granted conditional work permits. but then again most of my long term games have been LLM where i'd never even attempt to sign foreign players anyway.

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

In real life, Man City signed Douglas Luiz and decided to loan him out, NOT for work permit issues, Daniel Arzani they signed is also on loan, Phillipe Sandler from Zwolle, but I can’t even sign a young european based 17 year old with a valid work permit, this isn’t realistic @FrazT  liverpool signed a colombian earlier in the year, newcastle signed yannick traore... permits are ott on fm

[FrazT]

A work permit application needs to be submitted at the start of every new contract regardless of whether there is an existing one in place. Work permits are also subject to conditions and if these have not been adhered to, then a new permit may not be approved. At that time, when a new application is received it is checked against the rules in force at that time.  These are not FM rules, these are UK government and FA rules.

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

5 minutes ago, FrazT said:

A work permit application needs to be submitted at the start of every new contract regardless of whether there is an existing one in place. Work permits are also subject to conditions and if these have not been adhered to, then a new permit may not be approved. At that time, when a new application is received it is checked against the rules in force at that time.  These are not FM rules, these are UK government and FA rules.

I can’t even sign a Dutch striker who plays every game for his club with a work permit. It’s not normal. Newcatle in real life wanted jorgensen in January, he would of got one with ease.

[FrazT]

Playing for his club is not important- playing full internationals is- again I suggest that you read the full WP rules and you can better understand how this system works as it is not easy to get a handle on them.

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

@FrazT

I’ll read about them later but this regen has 38 caps and still no permit.

[FrazT]

Costa Rica is probably not ranked high enough for these to have as much impact as with higher ranked countries- it is all explained in the rules.

[cris182]

11 hours ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

I can’t even sign a Dutch striker who plays every game for his club with a work permit. It’s not normal. Newcatle in real life wanted jorgensen in January, he would of got one with ease.

He wouldn't have needed a permit though, But in future he might depending on brexit

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

1 hour ago, cris182 said:

He wouldn't have needed a permit though, But in future he might depending on brexit

I’m in 2023, the games planted a brexit which might not happen and changed the game massively.

[cris182]

8 minutes ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

I’m in 2023, the games planted a brexit which might not happen and changed the game massively.

So you can't compare real life January 2018 with a scenario that is in game 5 years ahead

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

2 hours ago, cris182 said:

So you can't compare real life January 2018 with a scenario that is in game 5 years ahead

A fake scenario made up by the game I can though, it’s like me editing a transfer ban randomly for Birmingham one whoever it is in real life that has the ban actually in the game... it’s nonsense

[herne79]

10 minutes ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

A fake scenario made up by the game I can though, it’s like me editing a transfer ban randomly for Birmingham one whoever it is in real life that has the ban actually in the game... it’s nonsense

Brexit has been a feature in FM for the last two iterations.  You also get plenty of in game warning that Brexit is going to happen to help you plan accordingly.  New rules can also take a while to bed in before they come into force.  Is it really the game's fault if you haven't read all of these things, made plans and taken appropriate action?  You've already said you're not reading things:

8 hours ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

I’ll read about them later but this regen has 38 caps and still no permit.

And you wonder why he can't get a permit.

Personally I don't really like having Brexit in game either and in a lot of my saves I'll edit it out, but if I don't edit it out I still know it's a feature and I'll ensure I take appropriate action.

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

@herne79 I took over Reading in 2022 so the Brexit must of already been their. I didn’t no you could edit it out but then isn’t that causing crash dumps by using a custom database?

 

Also I hate starting new games lol

 

Also, surely the Brexit thing should HAVE to be added in the editor as it’s an assumed scenario of what could happen.

[Neotropolis]

29 minutes ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

Also, surely the Brexit thing should HAVE to be added in the editor as it’s an assumed scenario of what could happen.

There are many different proposed Brexit scenarios. You just got unlucky in getting a hard Brexit. It's random which one you'll get but it is determined at the start of the save. I got lucky and my Brexit didn't affect anything.

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

1 hour ago, Neotropolis said:

There are many different proposed Brexit scenarios. You just got unlucky in getting a hard Brexit. It's random which one you'll get but it is determined at the start of the save. I got lucky and my Brexit didn't affect anything.

So what you’re basically saying is the whole brexit thing is randomly generated nonsense in each save... definitely needs removing if everybodys game isn’t equal.

[Neotropolis]

2 minutes ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

 So what you’re basically saying is the whole brexit thing is randomly generated nonsense in each save... definitely needs removing if everybodys game isn’t equal.

Firstly, it definitely doesn't need removing. Secondly, there are several different iterations of it because no-one knows what Brexit deal the UK will get so it covers all bases. If you're that upset about it, set up a save, save it and holiday it for a season or two until Brexit has happened and if you get a Brexit you like, then use that save, if not, then repeat process. 

Third and finally, do you actually do anything else on this forum other than complain about things and refuse to follow the advice you are given?

[herne79]

2 hours ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

@herne79 I took over Reading in 2022 so the Brexit must of already been their.

Brexit may well have been there, it depends on what date you got it in your save.

But this is about Work Permit rules and they are readily available to view in the Rules section of any given league, whether Brexit has happened or not.  All you have to do is look them up and read them before you start buying players to make sure you don't fall foul of the rules, which you are not doing.

And even if you don't read the league's rules, any scout report for any player (assuming you scout transfer targets - if not you should do) will tell you how likely the player is to be able to get a Work Permit.  Or do you not read (or get) scout reports either?

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

@herne79 I read all 5 star potential reports, always say unlikely to get a permit m, everyone of them lol. Not been on FM since this morning so i’ll have a look when I get on it. 

@Neotropolis If nobody knows the effects the Brexit deal will have (If it even happens) then why are people assuming what COULD happen, lets assume PSG will have a transfer ban next summer and put it in FM as an assumption or even relegate them as a 2nd possible assumption.. it’s not one of the best FM features is it.

I complain and moan because that’s why I use forums, try to help the game improve, who signs up to a forum to say the game is fantastic, it needs 0 new features and i’m delighted my players react stupid to certain chats. 

My current save is all about team cohesion this season, win or lose I want respectable performances and see some players develop, so i’m not being sour.

I love FM, but as realistically goes, putting assumptions in is very soft.

[herne79]

1 hour ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

I read all 5 star potential reports, always say unlikely to get a permit m, everyone of them lol.

Yet you are still trying to buy Costa Ricans and then moan it's the game's fault "to try to help the game improve".

C'mon Andrew, the information is there in front of you.  If players are unlikely to get a WP, move on to different ones.  If you aren't sure which players from certain countries may fail WP without scouting them, look at your league's rules.  It's all spelled out for you.

We get you don't like the Brexit feature.  I don't particularly like it either.  But it ain't gonna change until the real Brexit is finalised, so either suck it up, don't play or edit your game using the pre-game editor.  In the mean time, the game tells you what the WP rules are - all you have to do is read them.

[Neotropolis]

10 hours ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

@Neotropolis If nobody knows the effects the Brexit deal will have (If it even happens) then why are people assuming what COULD happen, lets assume PSG will have a transfer ban next summer and put it in FM as an assumption or even relegate them as a 2nd possible assumption.. it’s not one of the best FM features is it.

Those two examples have nothing to do with each other as Brexit is something that will happen, just no-one knows what deal we'll get so the game gives multiple options, whereas PSG's transfer ban is pure speculation.

 

10 hours ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

I complain and moan because that’s why I use forums, try to help the game improve, who signs up to a forum to say the game is fantastic, it needs 0 new features and i’m delighted my players react stupid to certain chats. 

I have nothing against complaining unless you're complaining for complaining's sake, which is more or less what you're doing. The big issue I have is that you whinge and moan about something, are given numerous advice from multiple people and then refuse to act on said advice and wonder why you never get anywhere. This whole WP thing is another example of you doing just that.

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

@Neotropolis @herne79

 

No joke, finally landed all 6 signings on January 1st and all 6 players are playable for me although they failed the permits, anyone ever had this? Players perfectly suitable to my tactics aswell after just 2 weeks, don’t know if that’s normal either

[Neotropolis]

4 hours ago, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

No joke, finally landed all 6 signings on January 1st and all 6 players are playable for me although they failed the permits, anyone ever had this? Players perfectly suitable to my tactics aswell after just 2 weeks, don’t know if that’s normal either

I believe this is a know bug that SI are aware of (I've seen it mentioned a few times) but there's not been any game updates since it was noticed due to working on FM19 so I would've thought they're working on having it fixed for that.

[Andrew_Goats_Gruff]

Dutch strikers debut  game fixing glitch!

[Snorks]

On 25/08/2018 at 02:25, cris182 said:

So you can't compare real life January 2018 with a scenario that is in game 5 years ahead

No, because in-game 2023 Brexit has happened, in real life 2018 noone knows what Brexit will be like.

So you can;t compare real life January 2018, with anything in FM 18 as that alternative reality begins in summer 2017 and follows it's own wonderful path.

[turnip]

People complaining about Brexit being in the game makes me smile every time.

We're a little over 6 months out from it in real life, and it's still not entirely sure that the UK Government has the slightest idea what it wants to happen, let alone what will actually happen.

 

If you're a UK resident - who is old enough to vote - and you don't like the scenarios presented by FM for Brexit, write to your MP and tell them what you want or don't want to happen!

[Snorks]

I remember reading somewhere that while preparing for Brexit in Football Manager, Miles and the team went through as many possible scenarios as possible, as they knew it had to go in the game because it was going to happen in real life, but noone knew what form it would take. 

Apparently, (  I could be wrong, it could just be anecdotal bull) Miles was invited to Downing Street as the SI team had a better idea of the ramifications than the politicians.

[MagicHat]

For future reference i found where the work permit part was, you have to click on the player directly, then down to scout report and it says below "transfer interest" something like "work permit likely" or "work permit unlikely".

On the topic of real life ramifications of work permits, what will most likely happen is all players will be granted work permits providing they have proof of having been offered a job. If it is a no deal brexit, this will apply to everyone no matter if they are say german (EU) or brazilian. If it is a deal brexit, we will most likely be a member of the EEA or we will negotiate a trade deal with the EU and be part of the single market, in both these cases anyone in the EU will require no work permit and anyone outside the EU will require a work permit which will most likely be granted with proof of a job offer.

It is quite complicated i know but basically, in all scenarios, if someone offers a job to anyone outside of the UK, providing the job is some kind of skill or requires a qualification, i would imagine they will be granted a work permit.

 

(of course this is all speculation but it's based on what other none EU countries and other countries from around the world already do)

[JordanMilly]

On 24/08/2018 at 01:59, Andrew_Goats_Gruff said:

In real life, Man City signed Douglas Luiz and decided to loan him out, NOT for work permit issues, Daniel Arzani they signed is also on loan, Phillipe Sandler from Zwolle, but I can’t even sign a young european based 17 year old with a valid work permit, this isn’t realistic @FrazT  liverpool signed a colombian earlier in the year, newcastle signed yannick traore... permits are ott on fm

With the Liverpool signing (Anderson Arroyo), he got the paperwork because he's an accomplished youth international player, both at under 18 and under 20 level. I do think that FM should take youth caps more into account though.