Jonny B Gods Posted November 7, 2022 Share Posted November 7, 2022 Some players in this Beta version are too much overrated and some kids are just underrated dispite being showing much much potencial in the begining of this season...Just share what you think... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonny B Gods Posted November 7, 2022 Author Share Posted November 7, 2022 Crysencio Summerville - needs an update Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nico_france Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 Maguire may be a bit overrated 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoarau Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 I'll be honest and I think SI have bought into the hyperbole of Haaland. What he is doing on peoples saves isn't "normal". We've had FM's with Cristiano Ronaldo, Messi, Lewandowski, Mbappe & Neymar.... never putting up the numbers like he is doing. Even when he was at Dortmund in FM this wasn't occurring. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welshace Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 4 minutes ago, Hoarau said: I'll be honest and I think SI have bought into the hyperbole of Haaland. What he is doing on peoples saves isn't "normal". We've had FM's with Cristiano Ronaldo, Messi, Lewandowski, Mbappe & Neymar.... never putting up the numbers like he is doing. Even when he was at Dortmund in FM this wasn't occurring. I mean, he's scored something like 18 goals in 11 games? or 21 goal contributions in 11 games? ... that's pretty ridiculous... the numbers he puts in in terms of runs made, shots on target etc are unheard of too ... I don't really think Haaland would be the one I would single out as being unrealistic in the game really, especially given the attributes some of his teammates have in game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoarau Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 45 minutes ago, Welshace said: I mean, he's scored something like 18 goals in 11 games? or 21 goal contributions in 11 games? ... that's pretty ridiculous... the numbers he puts in in terms of runs made, shots on target etc are unheard of too ... I don't really think Haaland would be the one I would single out as being unrealistic in the game really, especially given the attributes some of his teammates have in game. Seen this on another site, it's just one example of course but I'm seeing similar elsewhere... First 4 seasons with Man City in all competitions: Season 1: 195 (Haaland 97) Season 2: over 250 (Haaland 138) Season 3: over 250 (Haaland 129) Season 4: 344 goals (Haaland 194) I'm not saying the game is broken or anything of the sort, it just seems his combination of face stats, physical stats, hidden stats & the mechanic of the match engine are very well suited to each other. More so than players in pervious FM's like those I mentioned. Perhaps it's just me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eye-switcher Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 Yes that goes for Lewandowski and Mbappe too in that case. my first season with PSG ,Mbappe scored 75 all competions, i thought that was crazy, then i tried Barca and Lewandowski scored 85 all competions, 58 in the league. So yeah i think you can put up crazy numbers across the board with this ME Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
V3ntricity Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 Alot of english players are always overrated in FM. I can understand the bias, being an english game, and I think it is difficult for them to see the outside perspective. Reece James, Rice, Sterling, Arnold (most Liverpool players too), Saka, Kane, Bellingham, Mount, Sancho, etc - all these are some of the very best players in the game. You would think England are by far the best national team in the world. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welshace Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 Just now, V3ntricity said: Alot of english players are always overrated in FM. I can understand the bias, being an english game, and I think it is difficult for them to see the outside perspective. Reece James, Rice, Sterling, Arnold (most Liverpool players too), Saka, Kane, Bellingham, Mount, Sancho, etc - all these are some of the very best players in the game. You would think England are by far the best national team in the world. I'm not English so believe me when I say i have no bias in their favour here, quite the opposite could be said to be true in most cases in fact... But most of those players you listed are either the top, or close to the top performing players in the best league in the world... the others not in that catagory i would argue aren't, in fact, some of the very best players in the game.... Lets look at this objectively... lets take Bellingham... can you honestly name many better performing young midfielders in the world right now? or Kane.. how many strikers are better than him in the world at the moment and howare they reflected in game? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThanatosAFC Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 Son still underrated for me, he is top 5 player on his postion. Should get a slight higher CA & PA. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
V3ntricity Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Welshace said: Lets look at this objectively... lets take Bellingham... can you honestly name many better performing young midfielders in the world right now? or Kane.. how many strikers are better than him in the world at the moment and howare they reflected in game? I have seen plenty of both Bellingham and Kane. I just don't see it with Bellingham, where are his insane numbers? Kane is slow and lumbering. He is technically gifted and tall, which makes him a perfect premier league player. He scores consistently because he is a focal point for a good football team, where he takes all the penalties. I equate him with other reliable goal-machines for even lesser teams in the past like Kevin Philips, Vardy and Defoe. They are alll very good players, I just think it's unrealistic that there are so many world class english players in the game (when in reality England isn't that good). Is it a fame issue? Meaning, english players gets more press within the english media, so people naturally think they must be the only ones out there. You dare me to name better young midfielders than Bellingham, but I suspect you actually don't know of any because all you read is english media. Gavi won recently some best young player award, to the surprise of Arsenal fans who meant Saka should have placed higher than 7th. 7th is good. Take Son, who just recently has been upgraded to reflect his ability compared to Kane. In reality his numbers are just as good, and that is without the penalties. For the last 4-5 seasons Son has been incredibly underrated comparatively to the likes of Kane. I mean, Dele Ali was world class for many seasons in FM, and still is kinda good. Edited November 9, 2022 by V3ntricity 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welshace Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 (edited) 37 minutes ago, V3ntricity said: You dare me to name better young midfielders than Bellingham, but I suspect you actually don't know of any because all you read is english media Did you miss the whole section where I explained i'm not english? don't read english media and have no interest in english media? And you didn't answer any of my questions i see... Son has been incredibly underrated? in game there are only a handful of players with a higher CA than him... only 8 that could be classed as players in his position... in the whole game... he is classed as an elite player in game... and it was almost identical to the last games story. From the 19 players with CA the same or higher than Son .. there is only 1 english player To compare, in those 19 player, there are 2 frenchmen, 3 germans, 4 brazilians, 2 belgians, 2 portuguese.... and i could go on... but only 1 english player.. Gavi and Bellingham? you asked for numbers? Gavi has played 14 matches this season with 0 goals and 1 assist Bellingham ....... 14 matches with 3 goals and 1 assist. Harry kane has something like 194 goals in less than 300 matches in the premier league, I can't see how anyone could call him overrated in any sense.. slow and lumbering? is Lewandowski overrated because he's slow and lumbering? I think the obvious issue here isn't that English players are overrated in the game... it's that your bias against them is clear. Edited November 9, 2022 by Welshace 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnigMattic1 Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 3 hours ago, V3ntricity said: Alot of english players are always overrated in FM. I can understand the bias, being an english game, and I think it is difficult for them to see the outside perspective. Reece James, Rice, Sterling, Arnold (most Liverpool players too), Saka, Kane, Bellingham, Mount, Sancho, etc - all these are some of the very best players in the game. You would think England are by far the best national team in the world. You do realise that it isn't SI who set the attributes for all players, but the head and assistant researchers, most of whom are volunteers? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesterfan_Cambiasso Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 1 hour ago, EnigMattic1 said: You do realise that it isn't SI who set the attributes for all players, but the head and assistant researchers, most of whom are volunteers? how do the researchers actually put a value on the attributes? ive often wondered that. Essentially, how good a team is on the game is decided by the opinion of a researcher? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThanatosAFC Posted November 9, 2022 Share Posted November 9, 2022 Was wrong about Son, thought he was lower But what about Nkunku? Player of the year in Germany, should be way higher tho specialy PA wise? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnigMattic1 Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 12 hours ago, Lesterfan_Cambiasso said: how do the researchers actually put a value on the attributes? ive often wondered that. Essentially, how good a team is on the game is decided by the opinion of a researcher? Obviously, SI set the parameters (I think that's the right word) in that 20 is the max and 1 is the minimum. The thing is, not all attributes can be judged easily (mentals for example) and that is where '0' comes into play giving a random attribute based on the known attributes. I guess you could say that the way a researcher judges a player isn't all that different to how a scout would assess a player in real life, only the researchers need to put a value on things. I wouldn't say how good a team is comes down to the opinion of a researcher as you don't need scouting experience to know certain players are good. It is the youth players that are harder to predict. There will always be a "benchmark" type of player that is used for comparison. Messi and Ronaldo in terms of flair and technique, that sort of thing. I should also add, and I may be wrong in this, but if a player moves to another club, Darwin Nunez for example, for his first season at Liverpool, his attributes will reflect the Benfica researchers judgement and not the Liverpool researcher. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesterfan_Cambiasso Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 1 hour ago, EnigMattic1 said: Obviously, SI set the parameters (I think that's the right word) in that 20 is the max and 1 is the minimum. The thing is, not all attributes can be judged easily (mentals for example) and that is where '0' comes into play giving a random attribute based on the known attributes. I guess you could say that the way a researcher judges a player isn't all that different to how a scout would assess a player in real life, only the researchers need to put a value on things. I wouldn't say how good a team is comes down to the opinion of a researcher as you don't need scouting experience to know certain players are good. It is the youth players that are harder to predict. There will always be a "benchmark" type of player that is used for comparison. Messi and Ronaldo in terms of flair and technique, that sort of thing. I should also add, and I may be wrong in this, but if a player moves to another club, Darwin Nunez for example, for his first season at Liverpool, his attributes will reflect the Benfica researchers judgement and not the Liverpool researcher. Is it fair to say a wonderkid that comes out of a country like Portugal then is going to look worse than he really is? You see someone with Darwin's attributes and you see 15s so by Premier League standards, bang average, but they must programme a huge scope for improvement into him? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnigMattic1 Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 49 minutes ago, Lesterfan_Cambiasso said: Is it fair to say a wonderkid that comes out of a country like Portugal then is going to look worse than he really is? You see someone with Darwin's attributes and you see 15s so by Premier League standards, bang average, but they must programme a huge scope for improvement into him? Not necessarily. Some countries have a record of producing wonderkids (Brazil, Argentina). The hardest part is the (hidden) mental attributes. I mean, Ronaldo for example, was tipped for big things and was mentally strong enough to reach those heights. Someone like Renato Sanches, whilst still a decent player, struggled to reach the promise he showed at a young age which, I personally believe, was down to the early move abroad thus indicating he wasn't (at the time) as mentally strong as someone like Ronaldo. Was Renato Sanches a wonderkid? Once upon a time in FM, yes. Could he have been in real life? possibly. Does that mean the researchers are right or wrong? What would reflect potential ability would be attributes like adaptability, ambition and such. Someone like Darwin who left Uruguay for Spain in his late teens and then went to Portugal a year later would indicate a decent level of ambition given the step up in playing quality. Also, the fact he had 2 cruciate ligament ops at a young age and bounced back to a decent start to his career abroad shows determination. Now, part of that last paragraph leans towards how a player is scouted. You need to look at a players background and, believe it or not, their home life. I am not saying researchers go into that sort of depth, but a scout is required to in order to get a better picture of the player and his potential. I still believe that a lot of a players development is down to how a manager handles the player in question and the relationship between the two. Going back to Ronaldo, he will publicly say that a lot of his development was down to Sir Alex Ferguson who he views as a father figure. But, that is irrelevant to your question. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welshace Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 15 hours ago, Lesterfan_Cambiasso said: how do the researchers actually put a value on the attributes? ive often wondered that. Essentially, how good a team is on the game is decided by the opinion of a researcher? To an extent.. but each researcher has certain rules that they have to abide by.... these days, changes can't be drastic unless properly reviewed by those higher up... you can, as an example. change certain attributes by one or two , and change a players CA overrall by a certain amount.... any more than that would need substantial evidence to support the change etc.. So no researcher can drastically change anything really Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnigMattic1 Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 4 minutes ago, Welshace said: To an extent.. but each researcher has certain rules that they have to abide by.... these days, changes can't be drastic unless properly reviewed by those higher up... you can, as an example. change certain attributes by one or two , and change a players CA overrall by a certain amount.... any more than that would need substantial evidence to support the change etc.. So no researcher can drastically change anything really Yeah, basically. Every change that is made by an assistant researcher is also checked by the appropriate head researcher. Why I didn't put that originally, I'll never know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
V3ntricity Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 22 hours ago, Welshace said: Son has been incredibly underrated? in game there are only a handful of players with a higher CA than him... Harry kane has something like 194 goals in less than 300 matches in the premier league, I can't see how anyone could call him overrated in any sense.. slow and lumbering? is Lewandowski overrated because he's slow and lumbering? I think the obvious issue here isn't that English players are overrated in the game... it's that your bias against them is clear. I'm not saying Son is underrated in FM23. I'm saying he has been incredibly underrated for years in FM untill now, while players like Kane has been world class for years in game. I'm not saying Kane and Bellingham and many other english players aren't good. I question the realism in that so many english players are world class (in my opinion Lewandowski has much quicker reaction time than Kane, which is why he is actually world class). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welshace Posted November 10, 2022 Share Posted November 10, 2022 Just now, V3ntricity said: I'm not saying Son is underrated in FM23. I'm saying he has been incredibly underrated for years in FM untill now, while players like Kane has been world class for years in game. I'm not saying Kane and Bellingham and many other english players aren't good. I question the realism in that so many english players are world class (in my opinion Lewandowski has much quicker reaction time than Kane, which is why he is actually world class). Have you actually looked at the numbers on that statement? (that so many english players are world class in game) ... would you like to know how many english players are in the top say 50 players in the game? (compared to other nations?) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tummyowl Posted November 11, 2022 Share Posted November 11, 2022 In news to absolutely nobody that managers Manchester United; Martinez is really underrated on here. Usual bloat of English players slightly better than they actually are. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentwars Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 (edited) Brandon Thomas-Asante (West Brom) looks like a non league player with good physicals. @richard.cheeseman Edited November 14, 2022 by silentwars Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentwars Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, silentwars said: Brandon Thomas-Asante (West Brom) looks like a non league player with good physicals. No way his technique should be listed as low as 8 @richard.cheeseman Edited November 14, 2022 by silentwars Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welshace Posted November 15, 2022 Share Posted November 15, 2022 23 hours ago, silentwars said: No way his technique should be listed as low as 8 @richard.cheeseman Are you judging that on one goal or on his performances as a whole over a period of time? because i'm not really seeing it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentwars Posted November 15, 2022 Share Posted November 15, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, Welshace said: Are you judging that on one goal or on his performances as a whole over a period of time? because i'm not really seeing it. Based on the fact his technical and mental stats have hardly improved since FM22 despite securing a move to a big Championship club. Got double figures last season and has scored 7 goals in 12 starts this season for Salford/WBA. With his current attributes, I doubt the WBA AI will give him much, if any game time despite him being a regular first team player since he's joined IRL. Edited November 15, 2022 by silentwars 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welshace Posted November 16, 2022 Share Posted November 16, 2022 20 hours ago, silentwars said: Based on the fact his technical and mental stats have hardly improved since FM22 despite securing a move to a big Championship club. Got double figures last season and has scored 7 goals in 12 starts this season for Salford/WBA. With his current attributes, I doubt the WBA AI will give him much, if any game time despite him being a regular first team player since he's joined IRL. Sounds fair enough... anything i have seen of him this and last season, and admittedly, that isn't much, he hasn't really impressed at all... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now