players that just don't get the hint, surely not right?

Normally I can cope with most of the things the game throws at you, injuries, morale, form, coach poaching and the like. I am usually able to justify how or why certain things may be occurring.

Some can be quite logical,..

"its your tactics"... uuh, ok.. ta

Others just frustrating, sayyy..International Managers crocking your players for a friendly,

Me(assertively): Well, this is the THIRD time now!

International Manager : Aye, yoo're reit Ah ken Ah ken. Errr, an' Ah am real sorry abit ye laddie loch.(hmm Scottish apparently , pray do go on)

Th' doc did feel 'at th' hammy was mebbe a tooch techt. An' tae be fair th' lad wasnae sure he shoods play, an' mebbe jist rest up fur a bit. Sae ye cannae lay th' blam oan th' loon, it is aw mah fualt. (My that IS comforting, and remind me, HOW LONG, IS IT, before he can play)

But Ah will stain by mah decision tae play heem as it was a important friendly, ye dornt gie tae play th' Faroe Islands everyday noo dae ye. (Apparently,.... now again, out for.... give me a date, or which year even)

Aye,. . yoo're reit, he was a wee bit knackered loch. BUT,.. AH WILLNAE stain fur havin' a big jessie oan mah team Ah teel ye.

Sae oan ye gang laddie Ah says, dae yer coontry prood. (Bloody Hell)

Sae oan he went. Faroe islands kicked aff an' took th' baa intae uir half, a stoat cross an' their striker took a swipe an' th' baa whizzed pest th' far post.....Jesus wept an' weel he micht,...mah heed was in mah hans Ah teel ye...

Ah hae tae admit, it hud me woriat, but...., Ah looked athwart,... an' thaur was yer laddie, lookin' at me, a swatch ay steel in his yak, straecht backed an' determined.

Ah am nae ashamed tae admit it , but it brooght a tear tae mah yak, an' mah chest it did sweel.(Ahhh huh)

Gang oan lads gie at them, Ah yelled.

Uir winger got th' baa an' he was aff movin' loch th' win',...ye coods nae tooch heem Ah teel ye. . He looks up an' spies yer laddie an' wallop lays a cracker ay a cross fur heem tae rin ontae. Ye shoods hae seen it, a reit stoater. (Hmm, do tell)

Ah see ye laddie, watchin' th' flecht readyin' heeself. . th' timin' ay th' rin is important i'll hae ye ken. . (You don't say)

Bang he was aff, bang he was doon, och...hammy. Curled heem up loch a w'rm oan a fishin' hook. He lay thaur rollin' abit in pain, Ah did feel sorry fur th' laddie.

Ah cannae help but say thocht, it was a disappointment loch, ye see if th' lads hammy hud held he woods hae scored, there's nae doobt in mah min'.(Is that right)

But th' laddie cannae be ashamed, he gae a guid accoont ay himself an' did his coontry an' th' shirt prood.

( WHAT!!, in SEVEN minutes, oh for ****s sake, right, that's me done I am out of here)

So yeah, International injuries can be frustrating for your league campaign, besides hehe, what's the worst that can happen, relegation, fired, no matter one can always find another job.... maybe.

Then there is the joy of the "Team Meeting"

Excerpt from Everton FC Team Meeting October 2, 2012; Everton are on a five match losing streak the most notable a 6 - 0 loss to Manchester United, your Assistant Manager has requested you hold a team meeting to address the current form. Your Assistant Manager feels you should look to encourage the team and get them back to their winning ways

Me(Calmly, addressing Everton): We've been doing okay lately but I know we can do better, let's kick on and give the fans something to shout about.

14 people demotivated

Me(addressing Phil Neville): Have you got anything to say Phil?

Neville( Reluctantly addressing me): I actually think we've been doing as well as we can,....... you're just being unrealistic.

Me(addressing Phil Neville): Did you just puff out your chest then Phil?

Neville( addressing me): Eerrrmm...No..

Me(addressing Assistant): Did you just see Phil puff his chest out?

Neville( addressing me): Okay, Okay, I did, b bbut...

Me(addressing Phil Neville): Look Phil, we have lost five on the go, got pants by Fergies lads, have dropped from 5th to 17th, AND, are just six points clear of the relegation zone.

Now are you seriously suggesting that you are doing the best you can?(Quizzically)

Neville( addressing me): You're just being unrealistic.(more chest puffing)

Me(Assertively, addressing Everton): I have to say I am disappointed with that reaction

Meeting End

Ok, it's annoying, yes and frustrating, but hey maybe my man-management skills are not as good as I think they are. Kind of like the t-shirt "I am not as think as you drunk I am", meaning I kind of get it, just arse about face that's all. Stick a pin in it, I'll work on it.

But this, this is an entirely different matter and the whole point of the thread. That player that just won't get the hint. Now I am not afraid to name names here, and the person in question is Victor Anichebe.

(Disclaimer: What follows is based on in game events and is no way a reflection on the player in real life, as, depending upon whom you are talking to, Victor could be a good, great or cracking player to which end I am sure he gives his all for his Club whenever given the opportunity. However in my game it just happens that he is sh*te)

So Victor, Victor..Victor..Victor, why oh why don't you just get the point. Why are you clinging on in the hopes that something may change. Even in the event of absolute disaster (that being all my strikers and midfield players get crocked), you would still be hard pressed to get a start.

As you can probably tell Victor is on the transfer list. Not only on it, but been on it now for almost a year. His total appearances in the 2012-13 season amount to, two starts and one sub.

Now I can assure all, that it is always with a heavy heart (mostly anyway, well more often than not at least) that I place someone on the transfer list. In all versions of FM it has always been my biggest struggle "letting go of the deadwood". I tend to hang on, in the vain hope that these players will suddenly turn a corner and then be superstars. Invariably it has to be said, I end up disappointed, cursing myself for being weak, soft of heart... these are not my children I rant, they are here to do a job and my job also relies on them doing their job. I have expectations to meet from the board to the fans and even the players themselves. You are not doing anyone any favours by keeping them here.(possible slight over exaggeration there)

So by steeling myself I placed Victor on the transfer list, now it has to be said I liked the guy. He is an ok player, has some flashes of brilliance, but hey, he is never going to rock the world on a continual basis. New faces in the Club mean he cannot get a start, now his value is still quite good, and I could definitely use the £20K I am paying him back in the kitty.

The first conversation didn't go well at all. I explained to Victor that there were other players coming in to benefit the team and so consequently, it was time for him to move on. Victor responded by saying he didn't want to leave and still had something to offer, which in fairness is understandable. He then played his ace, something he knew that would play havoc with me, family, "I don't want to leave, my family are settled and I enjoy playing for the Club".

That hurt, now not only am I am responsible for the expectations of the Club, fans & players, now I am responsible for the well-being of Victors family (a cruel addition by SI I must say). I held my nerve, though it was a little shaky, and responded by saying that unfortunately he has no choice in the matter, and he needs to accept that this is going to happen. Then as in all traumatic events the rage sets in, and what followed was to be expected, the you're not being fair etc, I let him rant and then meeting was done. Victor was then offered to other Clubs, but there was no real interest.

A month or so later Victor popped in for a chat, apparently he had been speaking to some of the other lads about me supposedly trying to force him out of the Club. Now I kind of took offence to that, as I felt that I had acted quite professionally and at least broke the news to him face to face, rather than him reading about it in the Sun, or worse on twitter. So I was rather blunt and just told him there was no future here at the Club for him. He did put up further arguing, not going to drop this, you're being unfair. Again bluntly, I informed him I am in charge and I make the decisions, thankfully he acknowledged that, but was apparently desperate to change my mind. In the end he realised it was futile, and finished of saying he would have to go, but was not happy about it.

Now again, I was a bit distressed and feeling rather poorly, it didn't sit too well that Victor was making me feel responsible for his family and his entire world. For as I said earlier I did like the guy. I then just sat and reflected upon the situation and weighed up my original decision. I then realised I am not taking away his livliehood, just his right to earn a living at this particular club. There was still time on his contract, so he was drawing a salary and as such able to provide for his family. I on the other hand was offering the guy out every other week, thereby doing two things, one get a return on the investment made into Victor which I think is fair, and two enable Victor to leave this Club in the knowledge that he can a: still earn a living as a professional footballer and b: continue to provide for his family.

This little revelation then changed my attitude, and to say the least I was quite annoyed. Yes Victor is disappointed not to be in my plans going forward, but it is me that is trying to ensure that he has somewhere to go to, not him, he is just siphoning money from me on a weekly basis. The end result, I am quite happy with my decision.

So the season ends and we are in the off period, the team are on holidays, and I am working my way through mountains of reports and assessing the direction the Club/ Team are heading. Victor along with a number of others are offered out to other Clubs and this time there are some bites, and surprisingly quite a number. Two Premier League Clubs put in offers at face value and several Clubs throughout Europe all at face value.

My thinking then is that there will be a speedy resolution and I have a little warm glow for Victor, as there are some decent Clubs that want his services. What happened next and has continued to happen right through the transfer period I find mind boggling, and truthfully bordering on sheer insanity.

Victor rejected all offers from approximately five Clubs. He has continued to reject all offers since, though he does make you wait a few weeks, possibly he likes the drama of it all.

So brass tacks, to date, and that date is very nearly the end of the transfer period, Ol' mate Victor (who is now very much on my bad side) has rejected offers from Wigan, Birmingham, Bayern, FC twente, PSV, Roma, Toulouse and Parma(there could be a couple of others I can't remember).

The figures are pretty straight forward, face value is £3.8M offered and all accepted. Painfull was PSV a loan deal worth £7.8m which Victor rejected not just once but no less than four times. All offers when being accepted by the Club respond with player no longer wanted, so surely at some point in the negotiation there has to be a bright spark somewhere that is informing Victor of this point also, just in case it slipped his mind.

So hey I understand the guy doesn't want to go, but this is just foolish. The process with which Victor was placed on the transfer list was correct and yes, whilst the guy may not want to leave, he did acknowledge that it would have to be. Now I am not one to shout b ba bu, see can't even say the word, however this behaviour I find extremely odd. Taking into consideration the rejected loan offer(s) from PSV, it pretty much means Victor is a dead stick. I can't sell him and I can't loan him. Come the end of the transfer window (about two weeks), if he has not changed his mind and accepts an offer I will have no alternative but to terminate the remainder of his contract.

I suppose the most annoying aspect of Victors little saga, is that I have no way of interacting with him to say, oi mate pick a club or you will be out on your arse with nothing (future addition SI please )

The thing is I would find it very difficult to believe a player would not accept a move somewhere. Yes some Clubs are better than others, but I felt there were some reasonable Clubs on offer, as such I just don't get it and frankly defies the logic of being a footballer unless not ever playing is logical

The last few paragraphs are the important bits and is really really quite annoying, so wouldn't mind some opinions if anyone could. The rest errr not sure it kind of just evolved and just a bit of fun

I just read all that. Do I win a prize?

haha, yes my heartfelt thanks .. congratulations

In terms of player interactions, I think you've gone into a lot of depth to describe something that is clearly broken and illogical.

Great story! Interesting that his low "adaptability" (I assume) and love for the club (also assumed) will make the player want to forego possibly first team opportunities with bigger clubs in Europe (by which I mean Bayern and PSV, not Birmimgham). Well look at how long it took for Fergie to get Gibson to understand he was no longer wanted (though granted he does speak the kind of undecipherable Scottish you tried to render in the earlier parts of your story so may be Gibson did not get the point straight away).

Can we get a version without all the accent nonsense and not 100 lines long?

Yes some footballers are complete ******* in this game AND in real life.

Can we get a version without all the accent nonsense and not 100 lines long?

100 lines long... well bugger me. Oh here you go

player won't go, what gives SI..... short enough for ya son

That was hilarious! Massively enjoyed reading it, even if I have no input at all

Took me an age to read the Scottish stuff, not complaining it kept me away from work for a bit! At the end of it all you make a great point, highlighting an issue I've run into countless times.

Although many times clubs won't offer, so I reduce the asking price... still no offers... reduce again... still no offers... fine, have them for FREE! Still no offers.

This can be just as frustrating.

How about an option to tell players they're free to leave and find another club -- seems to happen a lot in real life, and the player's agent ends up soliciting interest from new teams rather than the old manager

Although many times clubs won't offer' date=' so I reduce the asking price... still no offers... reduce again... still no offers... fine, have them for FREE! Still no offers.

This can be just as frustrating.[/quote']

This is very annoying, as is the point made in the initial post. Of course irl teams end up with players they can't rid of, but they're often players earning more money than they're worth. I can't even get rid of players who don't earn too much, and could do a good job for a lot of teams in my country, even when they're being offered out for free.

With regards to the OP, the worst situation is when you have a player who is "hoping to gain first team experience from going on loan", only for them to reject every loan offer they get. That area has long needed reworking.

Well look at how long it took for Fergie to get Gibson to understand he was no longer wanted (though granted he does speak the kind of undecipherable Scottish you tried to render in the earlier parts of your story so may be Gibson did not get the point straight away).

I have seen a couple of things with Gibson and he does not look at happy camper at all. Even in his post match interview after scoring his first goal, the guy seriously looks like he does not want to be at Everton, and maybe Fergie did tell him in no uncertain terms that he is out and thats that

Took me an age to read the Scottish stuff' date=' not complaining it kept me away from work for a bit! At the end of it all you make a great point, highlighting an issue I've run into countless times.

Although many times clubs won't offer, so I reduce the asking price... still no offers... reduce again... still no offers... fine, have them for FREE! Still no offers.

This can be just as frustrating.[/quote']

Try writing it ...

The issue isn't so much about reducing asking prices on players and no offers, though I have a couple of those in the squad still. Even that whilst it is frustrating I can live with it. The player might just be carp, and his reputation so low that, hey no one is really interested. I have found the value on these types of players to be very low and so do not get overly concerned. Still I have to agree that when you offer face value for a player it does sometimes feel unreasonable that you have no takers.

How about an option to tell players they're free to leave and find another club -- seems to happen a lot in real life, and the player's agent ends up soliciting interest from new teams rather than the old manager

Now that I like , make the bastards earn their money, rather than just leach from all the time

This is very annoying, as is the point made in the initial post. Of course irl teams end up with players they can't rid of, but they're often players earning more money than they're worth. I can't even get rid of players who don't earn too much, and could do a good job for a lot of teams in my country, even when they're being offered out for free.

With regards to the OP, the worst situation is when you have a player who is "hoping to gain first team experience from going on loan", only for them to reject every loan offer they get. That area has long needed reworking.

Look at Wayne Bridge, the only example that springs immediately to mind. Media report quite fervently that he was just sitting back at City and taking home a healthy pay packet each week. It took the player himself to come out and say, that he was frozen out, made to train with kids and wants to play etc. Even he went to Sunderland on a loan deal. So I really think that the only players that may really baulk at a move of any sort are those very much in the twilight of their career.

Even Tevez who it appears is the most recalcitrant player in the premier league at the moment, agreed to personal terms with AC Milan, yet it was the Club that stopped it over valuation issues.

So my personal opinion is that in real life, there are really no players that refuse to move once they are placed on the transfer list.

In the game removing a limpet, yes can be quite difficult and that I can accept, players demanding money to move and the like. However there has to come a point when the behaviour is unreasonable, and this is where the game does not give you any options. There is enough player power in the game (agents and fees) without the likes of the saga that is Victor Anichebe

So there you have it, last day of the transfer window, and yep good ol' Victor doesn't fail to disappoint.

With all the rubbish over the transfer window less and less Clubs were interested. Got to hand it to PSV, they obviously were keen and did keep up the chase.

But the genius that is Victor once again decides to reject a very good loan offer, which was worth about £5M straight into the coffers and another potential £1.8M should they buy him.

I then had a chat and told him that as is behaviour is unprofessional, that he should accept a contract termination, and bugger me if he doesn't come back with "I can't believe you are trying to get me to agree to this, it's not happening"

For christ's sake, what is with the shock and awe, carrying on like this is something new. The guy has been on the transfer list for twelve months, it has been made friggin' crystal clear that he is no longer, a: required, b: needed or c: wanted by the Club. He has been provided with numerous opportunities to be able to continue a career. Yet has decided in his own wisdom to reject all aforementioned opportunities.

This constitutes unprofessional behaviour, as all due process has been followed from the outset regarding his transfer listing, and, the Club has maintained a duty of care, i.e income, continued training and development, access to physios when required, and whilst not part of the first team, is eligible and playing in the reserves.

The Board then scuppers me by blocking his release as they feel he is too valuable a player. Yes I can understand, dropping £1.9M is going to hurt, but now I have to pay wages to this muppet for what, not a god damned thing. Victor now gets to sit back and draw an income until his contract expires,... happy days.

To cap a glorious day.. on the training ground, as Victor went jogging past, he turned and gave me that bloody big grin of his and then says

"Nice day for it ..eh Boss"

...barstad...

players that just don't get the hint, surely not right?

Shirley, it is. It's just SI's way of modeling one of the great axioms of human interaction: never expect people to be reasonable all the time. Also, while I didn't read every word of the novella, Victor is not exhibiting unprofessional behavior simply by refusing to move on. He is entitled to play out his contract, an agreement that the club presumably signed in good faith. The fact that his failure to go quietly causes a problem for the club is irrelevant. Nevertheless, I feel your pain as I manage in the lower leagues and am often forced to carry a lot of expensive deadwood for years at a time on a limited budget. Grrr.

"I'm concerned I'm not in your first team plans, I think I'm good enough and may need to move on"

"Okay, I'll let you go at the end of the season"

"I can't wait that long"

"Okay, well I think terminating your contract would be best. We save your $5 per week in lower league wages, and you can find a team prepared to give you the first team football you're obviously craving"

"I'm shocked to be honest, I can't believe you would even ask me to do that"

"But you just sai....."

"I think I should leave now, I'm sure you'll want me for something else soon"

-----

Sorry....what?

I find it incredibly hard to believe that the player interaction/private chats "feature" has been properly tested and passed as acceptable. On FM11 it was youngsters constantly refusing to be tutored (and giving ridiculous attitude in doing so), this year they will whinge and whinge about wanting to leave the club, yet will get offended if you try to negotiate a contract termination.

players that just don't get the hint, surely not right?

Shirley, it is. It's just SI's way of modeling one of the great axioms of human interaction: never expect people to be reasonable all the time. Also, while I didn't read every word of the novella, Victor is not exhibiting unprofessional behavior simply by refusing to move on. He is entitled to play out his contract, an agreement that the club presumably signed in good faith. The fact that his failure to go quietly causes a problem for the club is irrelevant. Nevertheless, I feel your pain as I manage in the lower leagues and am often forced to carry a lot of expensive deadwood for years at a time on a limited budget. Grrr.

I think there's a bit of an issue if he's also refusing moves to clubs like PSV, Roma and Bayern Effin' Munich. I highly doubt it's a Winston Bogarde situation in that he's on a lot of money at Everton that he wouldn't recoup elsewhere.

Some players are unambitious. Others fear the big time; they're afraid they're not up to it, so they're willing to forego the big money and remain a more comfortable fish in a smaller pond.

Some players are unambitious. Others fear the big time; they're afraid they're not up to it, so they're willing to forego the big money and remain a more comfortable fish in a smaller pond.

Then go to Birmingham, Parma or Touluse...

Big fish in a small pond attitude is fine, but somewhere along the line when being repeatedly told that their services aren't required a player should move along. If he doesn't fancy playing football at all then at least he shouldn't get in a huff over a mention of mutual termination.

I think there are lots of things that are not in FM but happens often in real life, so I don't see why things like these that happens really really rarely in real life are programmed to happen once in a while in the game. Surely it would be better to just leave it out and focus time and effort on making the game reflect the more normal range of real life events in football?

A case in point is when a player attempts to play the ball off an opponent for a throw-in... and failing... in such a way that he passes the ball to him. I have truly never seen this happen in real life, but it happens several times every match in the game. Why not replace this with the slightly less rare interception of a pass in the midfield?

Edit: to the OP: just continue to propose mutual termination to make him unhappy. Eventually he will give you a reason to fine him (failing to show up for training etc) and in the end he will accept.

players that just don't get the hint, surely not right?

Shirley, it is. It's just SI's way of modeling one of the great axioms of human interaction: never expect people to be reasonable all the time. Also, while I didn't read every word of the novella, Victor is not exhibiting unprofessional behavior simply by refusing to move on. He is entitled to play out his contract, an agreement that the club presumably signed in good faith. The fact that his failure to go quietly causes a problem for the club is irrelevant. Nevertheless, I feel your pain as I manage in the lower leagues and am often forced to carry a lot of expensive deadwood for years at a time on a limited budget. Grrr.

Well first you missed out on a great read.. hahaha , and...

yes in part I may have to agree with you, good ol' Vic ( barstad), is entitled to play out his contract. We, the Club offered an agreement and he accepted, so yes fair play.

However a footballers contract is not so cut and dry as that. They are brought in, and, negotiate an agreement for their services over a period of time, yes, correct. But they are then owned by the Club and, are aware that at any point throughout the life of that contract the Club are entitled to sell them should they deem it so. And that is whether they like it or not.

Out of interest, I checked his stats in the official editor last night. He has 0 in adaptability (so random), 10 in loyalty and 60 for the club as his favourite (which is quite high): still to paraphrase Obiwan, "I've never seen such devotion in a droid before"... I'm afraid you'll just have to learn to love him and cherish this special relationship for years to come

With a bit of luck, one of his sons (if he has any) may join the club as a rookie when his dad retires...

Look at Wayne Bridge, the only example that springs immediately to mind. Media report quite fervently that he was just sitting back at City and taking home a healthy pay packet each week. It took the player himself to come out and say, that he was frozen out, made to train with kids and wants to play etc. Even he went to Sunderland on a loan deal. So I really think that the only players that may really baulk at a move of any sort are those very much in the twilight of their career.

Even Tevez who it appears is the most recalcitrant player in the premier league at the moment, agreed to personal terms with AC Milan, yet it was the Club that stopped it over valuation issues.

So my personal opinion is that in real life, there are really no players that refuse to move once they are placed on the transfer list.

No that doesn't conclude that this happens in "real life" - just that it happens at Man City, a club that even in real life are so far from reality it's unreal, where the single key factor in both Bridge and Tevez's case without doubt is player wages!

In the game this issue happens at any club. For example, at Fulham, offering Steve Sidwell out for nothing - no takers whatsoever. Really? There are a billion examples but this would detract from your issue in the OP to my gripe, which to be honest would be better off in it's own thread.

So anyway, back to your gripe - the Victor saga... I love how you're going into every day detail! The "Nice day for it ..eh Boss" comment as he jogged past on the training ground was beautiful.

I find it interesting that when a player wants out of a contract early he is slammed for being disloyal/mercenary, etc. When it's the club that wants out of the contract and the player wishes to see it out, it's the player that is once again slammed for refusing to budge.

There will always be exceptions; disruptive players, AWOLs, etc, but if they're turning up for training and working hard, why should they be forced to leave?

Another transfer related problem. I have a player who asked me last season to sell him as he wasn't playing much. I was happy to do that as he's nothing more than back up, and the money saved could go elsewhere. So I got to the summer, transfer listed him, and offered him out. Eventually I was offering him out for nothing, and I did this a few times, but no one bid. Then when the summer transfer window shut he was moaning in my office saying "Why didn't you sell me?!? You broke your promise".

He then requested to go on the transfer list, which I accepted. I'll try again in the new year, but I don't expect anyone to bite.

There is also the very realistic factor that he doesn't want to leave and is waiting for a new manager who may make him a part of the squad again.

I don't know if SI codes this in the game but maybe if you get your job status to very secure he may realize he isn't winning this stare down and will leave. I'd be mighty impressed with SI if this does happen though

There will always be exceptions; disruptive players, AWOLs, etc, but if they're turning up for training and working hard, why should they be forced to leave?

My Assistant can collect the training cones, I don't need to pay a player £20k per week to do that

Good man my Assistant, German, hard as nails.. just errm don't mention the war, Fellaini scares him though, but then he scares most. The lad has a few anger issues, we're working through them... these things take time

Im sorry, what?

Have to say, great post, enjoyed it and the effort you put in to humanize one of the annoying features of the game. For me it's been the 14 year old refusing tutoring from the team captain because he sees no benefit to it. Really? Idiotic. Anyhow, we all live with the foibles and frustrations, but prop to you telV7 for the entertaining presentation

Haha, but show me a 14 year old that doesn't think they know everything

Im sorry, what?

Well..I will have a single cone,... Assistant, you?

Assistant (Passionately) Yaa, I vould like a schingle, und zee choklat schtik.

Oh right.. he'll have a single with a flake sticking out, Marouane?

Fellaini(Aggressively) YOU WANTED SOMETHING!?

Jesus son, you're standing next to me,.... do you want one?

Fellaini(Aggressively) YES!... I WANT SPRINKLES, CAN I GET ONE WITH SPRINKLES!!?

Yes, okay, single or a double Marouane?

Fellaini(Aggressively) DOUBLE!

Right... and he'll have a double , err with sprinkles.

As I said, anger issues...

"We, the Club offered an agreement and he accepted", that was so funny

"We, the Club offered an agreement and he accepted", that was so funny

I had something going on in my head there, didn't quite come out right. An edit of course, could fix it, but then that takes away from your post taking the mickey out of me

Well good ol' Victor( barstad), almost got the last laugh......

and, given the current state of affairs....

skin of my teeth seems appropriate.