More success= More Debt:- MASSIVE financial problem.

I'm managing Birmingham City in 2016 and after 3 seasons of challenging, we have finally won the premier league. This was made possible at a Yo-Yo team like Birmingham due to a massive annual chairman loan of £55m year on year for the last five seasons. Two seasons ago the club finished sixth and had reached an all time-high of £105m Value. Since then its become clear that the 4-5 chairman loans have given me incredible spending power (net spend of about -£100m in my 4 seasons at the club) allowing me to bring in around £180m worth of players which is nearly Manchester city level, the debt created by these loans however has led to the clubs value lowering by £38m to £67m.

However now that the club owes no less then 5 loans to its chairmen, the soonest to be paid off in 12 years (2028) It's become clear to me that this is an unsustainable financial model, yet i have no control over what the chairman does. He will not doubt give me another £60m to spend at the start of next season despite the fact that we would definitely challenge for the league again with far less.

How can I stop my insane chairman from putting the club into far more debt then it can afford?! At this rate we're headed to administration.

Interesting situation, personally I would try not to spend too much of the Transfer budget and concentrate on farming out good youth players that can be sold for a profit whilst at a minimum qualifying for the Champions League every season, just for the TV money.

Just don't spend the money if you feel you don't need new signings. That the club has budgeted for a bunch of transfers doesn't mean any need to be arranged, after all.

I'm managing Birmingham City in 2016 and after 3 seasons of challenging, we have finally won the premier league. This was made possible at a Yo-Yo team like Birmingham due to a massive annual chairman loan of £55m year on year for the last five seasons. Two seasons ago the club finished sixth and had reached an all time-high of £105m Value. Since then its become clear that the 4-5 chairman loans have given me incredible spending power (net spend of about -£100m in my 4 seasons at the club) allowing me to bring in around £180m worth of players which is nearly Manchester city level, the debt created by these loans however has led to the clubs value lowering by £38m to £67m.

However now that the club owes no less then 5 loans to its chairmen, the soonest to be paid off in 12 years (2028) It's become clear to me that this is an unsustainable financial model, yet i have no control over what the chairman does. He will not doubt give me another £60m to spend at the start of next season despite the fact that we would definitely challenge for the league again with far less.

How can I stop my insane chairman from putting the club into far more debt then it can afford?! At this rate we're headed to administration.

Simple. Dont spend the money. Just because he's giving it to you doesnt mean you have to spend it. I take it from what you have already spent, you have a decent enough team that can challenge for a few years. Also Champions League money will help a lot. Try and get your stadium capacity increased to generate more income and keep the wages down.

Simple. Dont spend the money. Just because he's giving it to you doesnt mean you have to spend it. I take it from what you have already spent, you have a decent enough team that can challenge for a few years. Also Champions League money will help a lot. Try and get your stadium capacity increased to generate more income and keep the wages down.

This. Chairmen are well known to hand out unrealistic budgets when it's obvious to us that it will result in finacial disaster if spent. Fortunately you have access to all the financial records, so can judge for yourself whether to spend or not. You clearly already have a team capable of winning, so maybe you can sell on some of the lesser used squad players and replace them with Bosman's or youth players, that's a good way forward for the next few seasons.

As has been said, why spend at all? Surely you can only get players who are "as good" as your current ones, those who are better you would have already if you could have had them, yes? Selling fringe/youth is a good way of generating cash too, again already suggested, which helps to balance the books in the long run.

Another thing to consider is transferring it all into the wage budget... you apparently earn more interest on it than if it is in your transfer fund (essentially frozen) or so I'm led to believe. Sticking to your wage budget (before you transfer your transfer budget) is also a good way to keep the club financially stable, don't be afraid to haggle hard with players on contracts, they will often take far less than their initial request - a tip here is to haggle 3 times with the player/agent but instead of offering/walk away use the back button and continue the game as normal, next time you go to negotiate you already know his starting position and his lowest demands (or close to them) and you now have three more goes at haggling... lol!

It does seem to me that the financial model you've described is very much dependant on continued EPL and ECL success and the related prize/tv money which puts pressure on you to produce the goods... I doubt an AI manager could though, which has to be a problem in the long run, as you said in your OP "At this rate we're headed to administration." Are there many clubs in the same state or is it just Saudi rich City? If there's a lot then SI needs to address it, IMO, but if it's just City maybe it's the Chairman? Maybe a change of board would bring a more thrifty approach?

Thanks i'll try and stick with the squad I've got. I've tried asking for a stadium expansion/ increased youth facilities and recruitment, but despite his willingness to pump in £50m a season apparently "we don't have the funds" for those projects.

If I were you, I'd try and recoup some on current players, starting now. If you don't, you'll just end up like Leeds.

If I were you, I'd try and recoup some on current players, starting now. If you don't, you'll just end up like Leeds.

What? Hated by everybody?

That is a pretty bizarre situation, although I guess it isn't all that uncommon IRL. Too bad you can't easily acquire assets in this situation so that your debt is proportionally less than it is. Merchandising Feeder clubs will help. Long term, I suppose you should build a stadium and upgrade all infrastructure, but short term I'd take the above advice and perhaps go a bit further:

Turn your club into a Youth Academy for non-English teams:

Up your scouting of youth prospects and buy only the best, perhaps 4-8 per season with the intention of selling them on. Follow SFraser's method of "Developing Players" and then give them a year or so of 1st team appearances to increase their value. Sell when ripe and repeat.

With thorough scouting you should be able to offset all but the worst debts through talent farming.

I've had a transfer budget of £100 million+ for past about 7 years, £150 million in the bank and yet I still regularly recoup far more than I do spend. Just buying young players, developing them and trusting them aged 18-20 to produce in the first team, selling players for £20+ million, buying for £2-4 million.

You have the power to use the money or not use it....which is obvious you shouldn't.

That sucks!

The best solution would be to stop spending the money and look to youth, whether that be your own or looking for good young players. Young players are good in that they usually don't ask for much and you'll be able to keep their wages down if they are with you from early in their careers. If you already have a good squad now might be the time to try that. If you keep at what you're doing now you'll run the risk of administration.

Also, please don't use "More success= More Debt" or in fact "A = B". Why, because it applies the opposite, and has transitive properties. That is you're implying more debt is more success and at the same time anything that is more success is in fact more debt. That is, if you are more successful at your job in real life that implies that you'll be more in debt because of that etc.

My side is quite the opposite to this due to the use of youth, we're swimming in money... I've got £650 mil just sitting in the bank at last count!

There is no need to spend that much when you have already rid yourself of the useless squad you started with. Since the AI teams won't improve (rather the opposite) you are already at the top now, and remaining there requires little effort.

If you are like me (in regards of FM), now's when the fun starts. Find young talents, tutor them, play them or loan them - rince repeat. Eventually, spending very little money you will rule the footballing world supreme. Youth development is a part of the game that is really worth the time spent to master (after 9 seasons in my Las Palmas game I have still much to learn regarding this - finding out the intricasies of tutoring, personalities, training is quite challenging). I also really like the feeling of having created it all by myself. Like mr. Some Guy above, I have also a few hundred millions in the club's bank account and it grows with 3+ millions per month!

However, if that is not your cup of tea I suggest either starting a new game or go career mode and switch clubs.

Invest in youth players, start selling older players on high wages. Repeat at least every 3 seasons.

Sounds to me like you've done a Redknapp: the chairman has given you enough rope to hang yourself and you've done so, so to avoid the tightening noose you can either do an 'Arry and jump ship, or, as others have said, sign prospects to replace your stars. Have said stars tutor the prospects and keep the ship afloat by selling one aging star per season.

If you slash your transfer spending, will you turn a profit before player trading?

That sucks!

The best solution would be to stop spending the money and look to youth, whether that be your own or looking for good young players. Young players are good in that they usually don't ask for much and you'll be able to keep their wages down if they are with you from early in their careers. If you already have a good squad now might be the time to try that. If you keep at what you're doing now you'll run the risk of administration.

Also, please don't use "More success= More Debt" or in fact "A = B". Why, because it applies the opposite, and has transitive properties. That is you're implying more debt is more success and at the same time anything that is more success is in fact more debt. That is, if you are more successful at your job in real life that implies that you'll be more in debt because of that etc.

My side is quite the opposite to this due to the use of youth, we're swimming in money... I've got £650 mil just sitting in the bank at last count!

In actual fact in my current situation, at my current team, on my current football manager game, more debt is and fact equally increasing as my success does. It's not a comment on the world as a whole, just a single football manager game (AS POSTING IT IN A GENERAL DISCUSSION FORUM ON THE FOOTBALL MANAGER FORUMS WOULD WOULD IMPLY)

I've had a transfer budget of £100 million+ for past about 7 years, £150 million in the bank and yet I still regularly recoup far more than I do spend. Just buying young players, developing them and trusting them aged 18-20 to produce in the first team, selling players for £20+ million, buying for £2-4 million.

You have the power to use the money or not use it....which is obvious you shouldn't.

I agree. You obviously shouldn't be given that money, so you can't blame the chairman for possibly ruining your club as you were the culprit. Now you have a chance to fix it though, by doing what most players do, buy young and develop them. You should make yourself a challenge over the next few seasons to slash spending over what you bring in. At the end of the day your outs should greatly exceed your ins in order to make the club stable and a financial powerhouse.

In actual fact in my current situation, at my current team, on my current football manager game, more debt is and fact equally increasing as my success does. It's not a comment on the world as a whole, just a single football manager game (AS POSTING IT IN A GENERAL DISCUSSION FORUM ON THE FOOTBALL MANAGER FORUMS WOULD WOULD IMPLY)

That's odd. Im finiding that my debt lowers as I become more successful. I no longer have to sell my best players to keep my neck above water. Infact, I make a monthly profit which is enabling me to improve all my facilities and tweak my squad. Some of my best signings for the prem have only cost me upto £1m.

It is easy to get into the habit of once you get more money to spend it. End of each season you generally get an influx of cash, then a bumper budget from this and most clubs of the ilk of Birmingham, Stoke, Wolves etc are clubs who are in the bracket of that bumper revenue in the summer having to cover the season. At Stoke I had a few issues with money as I was getting bigger because naturally you're paying higher wages and I prefer to use established players than cherrypicking the finest youngsters because theres too much temptation to do that with these forums lol. Ultimately I spent big on a few players for key positions who'd come in and perform immediately, and there was a scary season where I finished 4th, but Man Utd won the CL so they got my spot. I had already spent having forgotten completely about this and had factored in guaranteed CL revenues for next year.

I cancelled as many transfers as I could to save money that I didn't need to spend, as well as selling some fringe players but I lost about £30m. I managed to get through the season and secure another top 4 finish and it was alright, but had I sold a key player or two to try and cover that £30m loss I may have missed out and the financial outlook would have deteriorated for a side who were still a top 6 team. The gulf in revenues between finishing 5th and 4th are enormous it is a careful line to tread until sponsorship revenues bump up, merchandising goes up and your ticket prices gradually increase as well. Once you become an established member of the elite for 10 years or so all of these will be much larger portions of income and probably cover up to £100m in revenue or more depending on how successful you are.