Free kicks?? (deflections {now sans swear words}).

Posted 18 March 2008 02:10 I've picked up 2008 after breaking (WITH MY BARE HANDS ) my original version a while back. Its patched and its ...well its O.K, but my problem is free kicks, free kicks spanked straight at the wall that then bounce into the bottom corner of the goal. In one season I conceded 10 goals from free kicks (direct) and all of them were hit against the wall then deflected in . I'm not going to procastinate: this is stupid. It doesn't happen in real life, its annoying.

Try and recall the last time a MASSIVE deflection off the wall from a free kick went in (I can think of a Frank Lampard free kick last season).

Is this just absurd luck, a bug, or do SI now make their games with the intent of making me angry?

(reworded post because automatically censoring things isn't enough we need to stop people seeing those stars).

Posted 18 March 2008 02:10 I've picked up 2008 after breaking (WITH MY BARE HANDS ) my original version a while back. Its patched and its ...well its O.K, but my problem is free kicks, free kicks spanked straight at the wall that then bounce into the bottom corner of the goal. In one season I conceded 10 goals from free kicks (direct) and all of them were hit against the wall then deflected in . I'm not going to procastinate: this is stupid. It doesn't happen in real life, its annoying.

Try and recall the last time a MASSIVE deflection off the wall from a free kick went in (I can think of a Frank Lampard free kick last season).

Is this just absurd luck, a bug, or do SI now make their games with the intent of making me angry?

(reworded post because automatically censoring things isn't enough we need to stop people seeing those stars).

Much better. It's not the censoring per se, rather the manner in which the argument is constructed. An opening post containing invectives is likely to lead to a thread full of highly emotive content which then leads to fights and warnings.

I would say you were unlucky. Haven't had it happen myself in any of my seasons.

Thanks for the reply, interestingly I just started my 2nd season and have in 5 games conceded 3 goals from free kicks, only one of which my wall and deflected in, it seems just generally speaking free kicks from 20 yards are EXTREMELY dangerous which is a little puzzling because in real life free kicks from TWENTY yards don't often find the net (especially in the lower leagues).

I would suggest you do a search for set piece instructions in T&TT.

To make it easy for you, try the set piece link under the Deisgning Tactics subheading in the OP of this thread.

I reckon I have seen three or four this season in my game split 50/50 for and against so I think you are unlucky.

I score plenty of deflected free kicks and concede very few, I guess that makes me lucky.

I have denfenitely scored a lot more deflections than conceded. But some of the shots that hit the wall actually goes wide, that's easy to forget. But the twenty yarders tend to find their way into the net in one way or the other.

90% of all goals scored against me seem to be deflected free kicks, shots, passes..... all of them have some random element of luck in them. But thats the way it goes sometimes.

I mean christ, I remember about two seasons ago, nearly ever goal Chelsea scored for an entire season would hit two players at least before getting to the back of the net.

Three if lampard hit it.

Well I actually scored from the opps free-kick just outside my penalty area.

The opp kicked it against my wall and one of my players, whilst the ball in mid-flight, managed to hit it on the volley and it flew about 85 yards into the top corner!! So sometimes it does work to your advantage.

There do appear to be a rather large number of deflected freekicks going in, but then I haven't collated any stats nor have I seen any from real life matches so there's no point me commenting on just the odd random biased memory I have of losing to a deflected freekick.

Freekicks just outside the area are extremely dangerous though. Again I have no stats from either game or real life, but generally if I concede a freekick there I shout and swear at my player who gave it away because I know that it is very likely to result in a goal. I don't think changing my defensive freekick instructions is going to help much against that. To be honest I tend to leave them on defaults, but then usually my team leave a player totally unmarked if the opposition choose to use him instead of hitting it direct so putting more men in the wall would only exacerbate that problem and probably not stop me conceding direct freekicks so much.

It's not a huge problem though - I've scored a fairly nice number of freekicks too so it balances out. I'm just like most people in that the ones scored against me stick in my memory and get me irritated whilst the ones I score I cheer at the time and then forget sooner afterwards!

In my experience, virtually ALL free kicks that go in take a deflection on the way. I'd say it was about 80% of scored free-kicks that take a quite hefty (and sometime absolutely huge) deflection.

Thing is, I benefit from it a lot more than I suffer from it. So I tend to just see it as one of those swings-and-roundabouts things. It's annoying when it happens against me, but it's great when it goes for me. And seeing as it goes for me a lot more regularly than it goes against me, I can live with it. Only complaint I would have is that it does seem a bit unrealistic when it happens so often. But I'm not sure what to do about that when some people clearly don't ever see this in their games.

I think that the number of goals scored from direct freekicks is too low and too many of the goals take a defcletion.

In my game after 28 league games in Spain the team statistics for direct freekicks are as follows:

At. Madrid - 5

R. Madrid - 3

Sevilla - 3

8 teams - 2

7 teams - 1

2 teams - 0

One thing I do see is an idiotic number of indirect (I assume, not that it matters) freekicks somewhere out near the touchline that a worldclass player just curls straight into the hands of the opposition 'keeper even though pretty much every other player on the pitch is jostling around for position on the edge of the box. I know players get it wrong in real life, but world class set piece takers don't miss their target by 15+ yards (i.e. finding the goalkeeper instead of the edge of the area) so often as I see in FM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wwfan:

I would suggest you do a search for set piece instructions in T&TT.

To make it easy for you, try the set piece link under the Deisgning Tactics subheading in the OP of this thread. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Who are you ? Never seen or heard of you before... I see how asll the moderators are crawling out of the woodwork in these dark days. Trying to be a hero aye, I respect you for it.

Give it a couple of years I reckon I'll be up to the task or replacing you

O.K half a season in and it seems that free kicks from this area (just outside the box) are at least a 50% goal (for me or against me), thats cool if a bit strange. The problem I have now is that these free kicks are given with no pre-amble (I watch on extended highlight mode), basically the game will be running along then bam free kick, bam goal, surely on extended I should be seeing the highlight of how the free kick was given away or something....

Anyway thanks for the replies

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by count blake:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wwfan:

I would suggest you do a search for set piece instructions in T&TT.

To make it easy for you, try the set piece link under the Deisgning Tactics subheading in the OP of this thread. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Who are you ? Never seen or heard of you before... I see how asll the moderators are crawling out of the woodwork in these dark days. Trying to be a hero aye, I respect you for it.

Give it a couple of years I reckon I'll be up to the task or replacing you </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

wwfan is an unknown trying to be a hero? Dark times. Dark times indeed.

I can't say i've noticed them going against me too many times, but more often than not when my team scores a free kick it's from a deflection.

It could be just me paying more attention to my own team than to theirs.

There's also a possibility I just have crap free kick takers. It's a definate posibility, as it's not something I look for when signing players and I know there's no natural penalty taker in my squad.

Not a complaint, and may not be relevant as I'm playing FM05, but I have noticed it on my game recetly.

It riduculous really this aspect of the game .. I'm getting numpties banging in 35 yarders every two matches .. Yet my "freekick specialist" has managed just one in 38 games ..

Just played a game where i've totally dominated - yet been beat 3-4 at home because their David-Beckham-Play-a-like with his monster 9 free kicks and 11 Long shots has whopped in a hat-trick of 25 to 30 yarders all in the top corner - the third of his world class free kicks coming in the 3rd minute of injury time to win the game for them .. their stats being 5 shots total .. 4 on target .. 3 of them howitzers from this league 1 donkey.

.. And as I say - my "freekick specialist" with his 17 freekicks, 16 longshots has managed 1 all season and under threat of legal action from the fat guy in Row Z for assault - he reckons it must be deliberatey being aimed for, and I tend to agree.

I've conceded 41 goals all season and 25 of them were free-kicks ..

So don't give free kicks away!! Well, I now have my whole team on easy tackling (yeah, thats realistic), yet they still get them and still whollop them in the top corner ..

Despite what anyone says .. nothing can be done about it .. your at the mercy of the AI .. which, of course, doesn't cheat ..

^^ I agree sometimes it seems....convinient that the opposition 'free kick specialist' (6 for free kicks and 8 for long shots) can score from any fre kick with a degree of consistency (against your team). I don't remember a game where I've won because I've scored free kicks but I remember games I've lost because of conceeding.

15 games in (2nd season) I've scored no free kicks (twice a free kick hit the wall and bounced away from the goal) and have conceeded from 5, all from just outside the area, its a big concern because I can't really stop it, I need a new keeper anyway so maybe I can find one who can stop them.

There are various aspects which annoy .. ok, I'm not saying the AI is cheating .. but I'd say 'fudging' things to make sure what happens on the pitch reflects the calculations in the background.

Penalties are my favourite. You can have one of those games, where you know, given the current set up, you not going to score. Your not creating any chances and when you do, your striker misses the 2 yard sitter .. no matter what you change, nothing happens .. then, out of the blue .. you get a penna ..

Maybe its just me - Mystic Thunda - but i know .. KNOW .. its going to be missed. Your current tactical setup vs the AI has decided your not going to score until you move your mentality slider one notch to the left and, silly you, your tempo is slightly too slow .. and would you believe it .. to make the action on screen match this huge tactical oversight, your guy with all the stats in the right places, blazes the spot kick into the duck pond on the other side of your Kop end. Mystic Thunda strikes again.

But there's no feedback .. Got a funny one this season .. my CDef constantly rushes out of the back line to try head the ball when the oppo keeper knocks a shortish goalkick. He misses it, or gets beat to the header and is suddenly 30 yards out of position when my other CDef is left facing 2 on 1 .. simple pass to the right .. shot on goal (more or less each time it results in a goal). After missing the header, this CDef is usually left 5 yards behind my forwards in no mans land with play 20 yards back towards my goal.

Now - unless I'm mistaken - I can't see the slider to tell my Cdef how far to rush out of the back line to tell him to hold his position. His mentality is low, his CF is low, CD is low .. maybe its him? Nothing in preferred moves - was expecting "Charges up the field and get 30 yards out of position going for headers he'll never win", but alas, nothing. Ok - maybe just something in his make-up .. swap the two Cdefs around .. Nope! The other one is doing it now .. Even tho, the two of them have the exact same instructions... its always the right sided CDef regardless who plays there.

So .. I can't do anything about it .. Someone will say "its your tactics" and its symptomatic of a problem in your sliders .. well, ok .. Where?????????????????????? Which slider tells my CDef to let the midfielders sort out and compete for headers when the ball is dropping 20 yards ahead of him and he should stay put? I can't for the life of me work out which it is ..

IMHO this is where the most frustration within FM occurs in all manner of situations .. You give goals away in the match engine and there is nothing you can do to change it without completley butchering your tactic with random slider movements and hope you get lucky when in real life you can just say : "Hey Numpty - hold your position in the line, stop trying to be a hero" .. real life, problem solved .. FM, random slider settings and frustration.

^^ yeh thats pretty much how I feel about the game. I've had similar experiences with a centre back coming for a long ball from their keeps only to misjudge it by about 30 yards and give the opposition a one-on-one, I've also noticed my (new) keeper coming for balls and misjudging them, this is absurd given the graphical representation I'm being shown (all the times he does it, hes under no pressure, if he stood on his line he'd be doing the right thing, the wrong thing is sprinting towards the ball as its 10 feet above his head).

There is a definite disparity between the visual interface we see and the algorithms being done, but ce la vie.

I have since my last post conceeded two goals from free kicks (5 games), one of which took the most absurd deflection of my wall (it was struck from 30 yards), hit my keeper (in the face??) and bounced JUST over the line.

Free kicks .. its your tactics ..

Just had another free kick against me myself .. ok, didn't mean much as I still won easy .. but similar .. crazy deflection, onto the post, and in ..

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by delibey:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by count blake:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wwfan:

I would suggest you do a search for set piece instructions in T&TT.

To make it easy for you, try the set piece link under the Deisgning Tactics subheading in the OP of this thread. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Who are you ? Never seen or heard of you before... I see how asll the moderators are crawling out of the woodwork in these dark days. Trying to be a hero aye, I respect you for it.

Give it a couple of years I reckon I'll be up to the task or replacing you </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

wwfan is an unknown trying to be a hero? Dark times. Dark times indeed. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

To be honest, sometimes I don't know who I am myself. Obviously my time is nearly up

Incidentally, I take it you guys are using the 8.02 patch?

The DFK -> defelection -> goal thing was (in my opinion) definitely an issue with 8.01. I'd speculate that it had something to do with the fact that, in 8.01 beta, the conversion rate from free kicks was ridiculously high (~80%) so the deflection thing was added in at the last minute to supposedly add realism. At any rate, I noticed it alot in the last patch and it was indeed frustrating only scoring/conceding from free kicks via deflections.

But, in 8.02 this looks to me to be fixed. Occasionally I still score/condede from a deflected free kick but not nearly as often as I score directly or blast it over the bar etc. So if you're using 8.01 then there's your problem - if you have the latest update and are still seeing that happen then I'd have to agree that you've just been extremely unlucky.

Unfortunately I think the lasting memory of FM08 will be that a lot of SI's hard work was undermined by set-pieces being a complete mess.

They aren't a complete mess, they just don't model reality quite as accurately as we would like, but nor do many other aspects of the game because it is impossible to get things totally accurate.

So I see a few too many deflected freekicks which irritates the hell out of me, but it could just as easily have been a non-deflected freekick and still a goal.

As for corners, sure it'd be ideal if the whole corner module could be so tightly constrained that it modelled reality really accurately for every conceivable positioning of all players at the set piece, but I'd rather have too many corners scored than what we had in some past versions when it was almost impossible to score from a corner. There are simple ways to tone down how many corners your team scores if you wish to and I've never had much problem with AI teams scoring an insane number against me.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by McTavish:

Incidentally, I take it you guys are using the 8.02 patch?

The DFK -> defelection -> goal thing was (in my opinion) definitely an issue with 8.01. I'd speculate that it had something to do with the fact that, in 8.01 beta, the conversion rate from free kicks was ridiculously high (~80%) so the deflection thing was added in at the last minute to supposedly add realism. At any rate, I noticed it alot in the last patch and it was indeed frustrating only scoring/conceding from free kicks via deflections.

But, in 8.02 this looks to me to be fixed. Occasionally I still score/condede from a deflected free kick but not nearly as often as I score directly or blast it over the bar etc. So if you're using 8.01 then there's your problem - if you have the latest update and are still seeing that happen then I'd have to agree that you've just been extremely unlucky. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's 8.02, I guess I'm just unlucky, well relitively speaking - I'm actually first in League two by 9 points in December so I can't complain with a straight face. Just recently(last 5 or so games) free kicks have been going straight at my keeper (and he saves them !) or just wide, so maybe its over.........

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by delibey:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by count blake:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wwfan:

I would suggest you do a search for set piece instructions in T&TT.

To make it easy for you, try the set piece link under the Deisgning Tactics subheading in the OP of this thread. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Who are you ? Never seen or heard of you before... I see how asll the moderators are crawling out of the woodwork in these dark days. Trying to be a hero aye, I respect you for it.

Give it a couple of years I reckon I'll be up to the task or replacing you </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

wwfan is an unknown trying to be a hero? Dark times. Dark times indeed. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I dont post a lot on these forums, mainly because i am always reading them but the above comments truly made me laugh, i mean wwfan being an unknown....pmsl!!

Perhaps some people on here should concentrate on listening to the advice given by people like wwfan, instead of dismissing it.