jc577

I've got my Poacher learning the ppm 'stays in the opposition area' is this a good idea? I want him to remain central and not get involved in build-up too much so it seems like a good idea but i'm unsure.

@Rashidi This is the tactic i've come up with, it correlates to point 2, with the BBM looking to provide extra penetration and go beyond the f9 when he drops deep. I think the balance of duties is good, with 3 players (Poacher, Wingback & the AM) looking to get in behind, with the f9 and DLP tasked with creating and good support from the BBM and the BWM. Another tactic I'm working on relating to point 6 also added posted.

That's precisely the issue i'm having; defensively we're solid (only conceded 3 goals in 10 matches) but going forward is where we have struggled. The front three at times have linked up well and showed some nice combinations, but not often enough. I've got a few questions: 2. Do you mean give a player an attack duty who is middle of the three cm's? For example, you could have a ball-winner on the side of the attacking wingback, a CMa in the middle and a DLP on the side where you have a supporting full-back? 5. Are you referring to dropping the d-line to set d-line traps? I can imagine this being lethal with three forwards ready and waiting for the counter. 6. This is the one that i'm really not sure about. The majority of roles in the AM strata won't provide that much width, and the main striker roles which provide width are the F9 and the AF (and the Poacher at a push). I guess in theory a WB could push beyond the f9, but what about the other side where you could have an AF for example who won't be dropping deeper?

@herne79 Thanks for clearing that up. If i were to play with two FBa, then would the two outer cm's have to be a generic cm/bwm support?

Is it feasible to have both full-backs on attack in a 4-3-1-2? The only thing i'm concerned about is the potential lack of attacking variation, but both my 1st choice full-backs have the PPM 'Gets Further Forward' so am I wrong in thinking that a WBd with this PPM will override his duty?

How crucial is it that my SS learns the ppm 'comes deep to get ball'? i'm thinking seen as Dybala already does this, it could be worth changing his role to an F9 (as dropping into midfield is a pre-requisite of the role anyway), and then making turning the SS into an AMa so he focuses more on just getting into he box.. thoughts?

I'd change the FBa to a FBs/WBs as I feel this better replicates Wes Brown's role, and would also give your DLP a better passing option.

Keep us updated, love a defensively-solid tactic!

I think you missed the crucial part of the TC's definition of a fluid team shape, being 'however, each player is expected to contribute to the transition phase when the opportunity arises' or words to that affect. I don't believe this to be true of the United side, only the front three were really allowed creative freedom, and this can be done through pi's and selecting the right roles/duties. You can negate the space in a 442 by pushing the d-line up, or adding retain possession. Out of interest, what roles do you mostly use for the front 4?

Do you use shorter passing/and or lower tempo? Yeah I agree re width, in many of my games the IWB ended up playing as an ordinary WB as there was no one else providing any real width. As long as your happy with the roles, duties and how the tactic plays out that's all that matters. You actually create systems that a very potent going forward on lower mentalities, as long as roles and duties have been set up correctly. I too prefer certain individuals taking risk as opposed to the whole team. My thoughts exactly! The most frustrating PPM is 'Comes deep to get the ball' and this is affecting the balance of my front three, particularly as my SS also has the same PPM. Not quite sure if there's anything I can do..? I think because two of the forward players like to come deep, Pogba making attacking runs from deep is creates some nice interplay and penetration that way may not have otherwise. Having said that, there have been times when we win the ball fairly deep in our half, Pogba is making a penetrative run and we lack a link to the forwards, so maybe BBM could be the way to go. I think a WBs + BBMs is better balanced than WBd + CMa.. what do you think?

I get what you mean, Cleon in his 'The Art of Counter Attacking' did reference the important of having an anchor type player to protect the defence when the rest of the team go surging forward. The style i'm trying to create is controlled and measured, not really looking to attack the opposition quickly but rather create fewer, better quality chances. I've found the only real way to do this is to play on lower mentalities, as otherwise play is somewhat rushed and i'm fed up of constant long-shots. Thanks for clearing that up, makes a lot of sense. The fact that the AF is marking the opposition FB will scare him from making forward runs, so in reality there could be games where the AF doesn't even need to track back that much and the threat will be reduced relatively early in the game. In regards to your SS, what ppms does he have/what do you think are ideal ppms? I think 'Comes deep to get the ball' is an obvious one, but can't think of many others.

As you can see Dybala is just ridiculous.. I had him in fm15 and think he did have "Likes to beat offside trap" but seems to be a more creative striker now. I don't particularly like the idea of both strikers on attack duties, I feel it would suffer from a lack of movement and would be a bit one-dimensional. I've analysed my squad and come up with a new tactic, and managed to incorporate a CM-a which i'm very happy about . I've gone without a playmaker in the AM slot as you suggested. I may come up with another tactic where I flip the formation and have a simple DM-d in the DM-strata, and an AP-a above. My only concern is the potential lack of width on the left.. i'm tempted to add 'moves into channels' and 'roam from position' to the CM-a to try and encourage more lateral movement, and could be worth teaching him (Pogba) 'Runs wide with ball' so that he becomes a central winger. How often will a poacher drift out wide and lend support? Would an AF be better at this?

In this case I'd tell your DLF to move into channels and maybe roam from position, as he could be quite static otherwise and not create space for your CMa to attack. I know a WBd will still provide with, but I feel a FBs will be a bit more attacking whilst not overcommitting, and you still have the security of the three CB's.

In the last example, there's two things I've noticed: 1. Your CMa hasn't got up to support the attack quickly enough, and is actually directly behind your DLFs. He may provide a better passing option if positioned to the left, behind the AF. 2. Your DLFs could benefit from an attacking wingback down that side, as his only real passing option is his striker partner. The WBd will more than likely be positioned too far away, and the CMa will be positioned slightly behind him as opposed to providing a horiztonal passing option, which means he will have to hold up the ball and is likely to be under pressure from the opposition CB so will end up taking a long shot. You stated in the OP that your wing-back on the left doesn't have the required attributes to become a threat, but perhaps you could make him a FBs which (i think) will provide more width than a WBd. Alternatively you could add some PI's to your CM-a to get him roaming and moving into channels, and perhaps a few PPMs so he acts a central winger.

I see, the thing is that the player I'm using in the right striker position is Dybala who has the PPM 'Moves Into Channels' anyway, which is annoying as even if I want to use him as a DLFs and just hold his position, he's still going to roam around regardless. I may try to get him to unlearn this PPM and give me more flexibility. An AM-s behind him could work, especially with a few pi's to get him roaming around and play riskier passes. Ideally I want both strikers to be prominent goal-scorers. Creating clear-cut chances is something I have struggled with, especially seen as i'm playing with United a lot of teams are happy to come away with a point. Last season although we won the league, we drew 7 games 0-0 which just isn't good enough.. are you playing on a lower mentality (standard, counter)? I too love the CM/a role, if used it in a lot of other saves. How does he interact with the WBs on the same side? I'd be tempted to use a WBd or even FBs and ask the CMa to roam from position and move into channels, or even use a DLFs on that side and ask him to move into channels so that you still get some width. I do like the idea of an SS as a hybrid goal-scorer/creator, I can see him causing havoc against a 4-4-2 or 4-2-3-1 as he basically a spare man as you said and with roaming can be hard to pick up. When you instruct your AF to man-mark their full-back, isn't there the possibility that he's too deep and it becomes more difficult to counter? I'd be tempted to ask the SS to do this, so if you win back possession he's deep enough to pick up the ball and pick out your two strikers who could potentially be left 2 on 2 with the opposition CB's. I've got a lot to think about