FM24 | A Sporting Heritage | The Guajes of Gijón

Shrewnaldo · February 28

Tactics Schmactics - Part Dos

A Sporting Heritage - The Guajes of Gijón

Ok, so I found this useful - apologies if it's not a great read as I spam out a few random thoughts during the match, but I find this sort of process really helps me sort out my thoughts about the tactics so I'm doing it again. This time away at Real Betis. In-between the Real Sociedad win, I played Getafe at home and won 3-0 in a relatively impressive scoreline if not performance. Some concerns remained, not least that my striker didn't manage a single tactic. So I'm going to play out the next match with all in-possession instructions removed. Thus:

Betis, meanwhile, are starting with a 5-3-2 (using a DM). They've won both home games so far but have lost their two away matches 5-1 and 8-1... So let's play it out and tweak as I go.

So the first thing is pretty simple - we've developed play out of defence from the left, crossed midfield with the left winger coming inside and the got the right wingback free to make a cross. We getting decent numbers in the box but I wouldn't say we're flooding it. More importantly, the four players getting into the box are 5'9" Molinas, 5'7" Gaspar, 5'9" Diego López and 5'11" Aguirre. The floated cross which Rosas puts in just isn't it. Indeed crosses aren't really a forté for us at all, so I've added a PI to Rosas as CWB(A) to cross less often and added a TI for low crosses so those we do make are better suited to our attackers.

It's also made me wonder whether a winger is the right choice for the left - with their hard-coded 'cross more often' option. But there are no other roles which would keep the player wide in the way I want. Something to keep an eye on when the winger gets the ball in advanced areas. For the moment, he's just coming inside all the time as I'm using right-footed Gaspar on the left wing.

After 18 minutes, we've scored.

The ball is played out of defence on the left, Gaspar at left wing has played the ball inside to our DM who then plays it forward to Aguirre. This is the Trequartista at 9 who has dropped off deep, takes the ball on the turn and the plays a great through ball for inside forward Diego López from AMR to run through and score.

I really like this goal - a lot happens that I want to happen. From the left-winger drawing the press and pulling the right wingback high, to the treq dropping into space, to the inside forward and CM(A) both threatening in behind. Very pleasing. If I'm being picky then I'd really like the left-winger, circled in red, to have played the pass and then looked to run the line for a potential return ball so I'm wondering whether he needs to be switched to an Attack duty or perhaps just a PI to get further forward. Another one just to keep an eye on.

I've seen this a few times so just highlighting one example of many. With the treq dropping off the line like this, it encourages a high press from the defensive line and clearly Betis are playing very high here. We've played the ball through Escribano at DM and Molinas at CM(A) to Aguirre at 9. Diego López as the inside forward on the right is threatening in behind and I'd like Aguirre to make the pass into the space. Instead he chooses to play it to López's feet at his back shoulder.

It may be because Aguirre isn't entirely suited to Treq thanks to his Passing and Vision, but I'm going to implement the Passes into Space TI for the rest of the half and see if it makes a difference.

2-0 just before half-time as we get a wide free-kick in line with the 18 yard line, swing it to the back post and centre-back Orozco Chiquete knocks it down for his partner Gragera to knock it in from close range. Also lovely.

Half-time and I'll take that so far. I'd like to be more dominant in terms of possession and feel like we've given away too many final third passes, implying too much established possession for Betis. But then they are the home side and predicted to finish two places above us so let's not get too worried about it.

Second half to follow later as I'm running out of image space.

Shrewnaldo · February 28

Tactics Schmactics Part Two continued...

So for the second half I've decided to give the left-winger a PI to get further forward. I like that he drops off to offer an option out of defence and hopefully draw the press from the opposition right-back but I do want him to then push forward and look to get the ball back in behind. So we'll see if this makes a difference.

Pretty uneventful 20 minutes or so but, after 64 minutes it is noticeable how knackered my four advanced midfielders are. A relatively high pressing, attacking system will do that to you I guess - recorded at about 75% or 'high' intensity on the tactics screen. So I guess it's either substitutions or reducing the intensity. Given we're 2-0 up, a bit of both makes sense so I start with the two in the middle. Guaje Hugo Quiñones comes on for Varane as the B2B and Roberto López replaces Molinas at CM(A). I've also reduced the tempo in the TIs and removed the Pass Into Space TI which appears to have done nothing whatsoever. Finally, I've pulled us back to a mid-block but kept the trigger press at mid-high.

After 70 minutes, there's still little of note occurring but Gaspar at AML is injured and comes off for Javi. The latter is left-footed so it'll be interesting to see how he performs differently to the right-footed Gaspar. I also take the opportunity to sub off Rosas, knackered at CWB, and bring on Francisco Moreno.

Incidentally, I've been keeping an eye on how Betis are playing and they haven't really changed much yet. Rodri, their best player, looks to be getting further forward from centre mid but I'm still comfortable with the cover we have from the 3 centre-backs and Escribano as a sitting DM.

10 minutes to go and Betis have definitely started throwing players forward more. I'm not worried about the flanks where we're 2v1 but I've decided to change the B2B to a CM(D), just holding his position more to provide protection. Polo comes on for López at AMR.

Ok, really quiet second half sees us leave Seville with a solid 2-0 win against a very handy Betis side. Some thoughts:

Defensively we were once again brilliant. Betis had only 4 shots for 0.39xG and failed to hit the target. Whilst they had more possession with 54%, you can see from their 'passes received map' below that they've had very few successful passes into dangerous areas and a lot of their possession comes from passing it between their back 3 and wingbacks.

We've had 12 shots for 1.34xG and put 5 on target. So that's ok but we haven't created many really good chances at all. Gragera's goal (left corner of the 6-yard box) has come from a knocked-down set-piece. This makes me doubt the repeatability of the result, despite a good win (shot map below).

I really like how using the treq gets my 9 more involved in the game, dropping off the line and encouraging a pass through the lines into advanced areas. However, the trade-off seems to be less involvement for the two central midfielders, receiving only 19 and 34 passes before being subbed off in the 66th minute. Once again, I'm annoyed that the match analysis doesn't show 'Progressive Passes' as a match event because I'd really like to see which players have made most from which positions. But it doesn't. Because reasons.
Whilst I liked the treq dropping off to get involved in play, he only took one shot in this match - from the second phase after a corner. This isn't ideal for your striker - it'd be fine if a couple of other players were getting 3-4 shots per game. But they're not. My left-winger had 4 shots but only 1 from 'proper' open play.
It's possible that we'd create more if our treq had more suited attributes. Aguirre got one assist from a lovely through ball to the inside forward but his Passing and Vision aren't yet anywhere near good enough to play as a treq. Part of my problem is that he, along with my other strikers, are far more suited to playing high and looking to get in behind. So perhaps Aguirre as the inside forward would be a better long-term option. I really want to get something other than an AF working coherently and this role is probably the lynchpin in getting that whole chance creation thing ticking.
The other option is to put Aguirre back in as a Poacher or perhaps a Complete Forward and change the B2B role into the playmaker. An experiment for another match perhaps.

I'd welcome any thoughts anyone has based on the screenshots and meandering rubbish I've spouted so far. Always keen for others to prompt ideas in my little head.

Edited February 29 by Shrewnaldo

keeper#1 · February 29

Are the "whiteboard" screencaps from the 2D game engine?

Shrewnaldo · February 29

10 minutes ago, keeper#1 said:

Are the "whiteboard" screencaps from the 2D game engine?

You mean like this one?

If so, yes. Although I've obviously annotated it with the lines etc using the SnagIt

I often find myself reverting to the 2d when I'm doing tactics analysis stuff

keeper#1 · February 29

Thanks for the info. Never used Snagit.

SixPointer · February 29

The treq conundrum seems to be something that happens to me very often. I really want to make a role work but, I either don’t have the player or the players around it to suit the roles needed.

This year for me it’s been the libero I’ve had limited success building around it, first off I never had a player capable now I have that I can’t get the balance of the rest of the side correct.

A CF(a) could be a good alternative if you don’t want a plain AF, at least he should drop and link play, F9 you would most likely have the same issue as with Treq but could be worth a trial to see if it gets into the box after linking playing. My thinking is the F9 isn’t as flamboyant as the treq so you could potentially get the link play but still have some punch in the box from late runs?

Shrewnaldo · February 29

Brief bit on the squad

A Sporting Heritage - The Guajes of Gijón

Conscious that I've prattled on about tactical nonsense for a few posts, I just wanted to give a brief update on the status of the squad and recruitment over the summer.

A couple of the deals were pretty straightforward with much maligned Cuban goalkeeper CJ Sánchez finally exhausting my patience with his xGP underperformance. He was replaced by Gaizka Ayesa from Bodø/Glimt. The Sociedad academy player moved to Molde in 2024 before moving even further north in 2026 for £3m. He was the best performing Spanish goalkeeper in terms of xGP and I really like some of his base goalkeeping attributes such as Reflexes and Handling. Whilst I'd prefer his Positioning in particular to be better, he is also really handy at playing out from the back. So far, a step up on Sánchez.

I could have continued with Mareo-graduate Carlos Gil, the undoubted Great Asturian Hope for in goals, but I decided that he'd be better off with at least a season in LaLiga2 and Ayesa's arrival meant Gil move to Ferrol on loan without having to accept Sánchez's lettuce wrists. At 27, Ayesa should offer solid re-sale potential in a season or two when Gil is ready for the first team. Really pleased with these moves.

Less pleasing was Manuel Navarro's departure to Spurs. I'd just promoted the guaje to the first team and was going to give him 12-18 games in a combination of centre back and inverted full back from the left. I went to offer him a new contract in order to increase his minimum release clause but he turned down our advances, citing the interest from big clubs... and Tottenham duly provided the £8.5m to take him to North London. Where he will no doubt sit on the bench allowing me to re-sign a wasted talent in two seasons.

Gutting because Navarro was one of my favourite prospects in defence, second only to fifth intake star Mouriño. With Lucas Ferreras falling short of lofty expectations and the likes of Welton needing another season on loan or in the B-team to develop, I decided to recruit some defensive strength - but twinned with some ballplaying ability.

Ladislav Krejčí certainly meets that remit - turning in some exceptional numbers in aerial ability, tackling and progressive passes whilst starring for Sparta Prague since the save began. A left-footer, he can partner Gragera at centre-back meaning he becomes the central of the back three in possession and allows me to use Mexican pair Jesús Orozco Chiquete and Alejandro Gómez as options to cover both centre back and left back.

I should also mention Manu Garcíá who I signed on a free from Aris. A Mareo graduate, García moved to Man City in 2014 before loan spells with Alavés, NAC Breda and Toulouse. Never quite making it, he moved to Greece in 2022 and has done pretty well out there - convincing me to bring him back for some homegrown creativity. Sadly, two weeks after finalising his pre-contract, he did his cruciate and it has absolutely killed his physicals. I'm not sure how he'll recover at 30.

The guaje (newgen) count in the first-team is now up to 6 with Domingo Escribano, Javi, Hugo Quiñones and Carlos Rojas all promoted full-time to join Polo and Aguirre. It would be 7 but Gil is out on loan.

He's not the only one either as I've looked to take advantage of the loan market with two primary reasons in mind:

for some it's their last chance to prove they have some potential - Welton, Jaime Luis and Ochoa key on this list
for others, it's about making sure they get 25-30 games this season when they'd likely be usurped by stronger prospects already in the B-team and under-19s - Seydou Diawara and José Antonio Vaquero standing out here

Speaking of the B-team, they're still in the Primera having finished 3rd last season but failed in the playoffs. Meanwhile my unde-19s won 28 of 30 league games last term, scoring 94 goals whilst they were at it. Sadly, they too fell at the playoffs - beaten 2-1 over two legs by Barcelona's youth team.

Lastly, we've had our first full international from the Mareo newgen graduates, with Romanian holding midfielder Florin Chiripuş winning senior caps following his loan move to Cluj.

I'd always preferred other options to Chiripus - prioritising the development of Escribano and Rojas in central midfield - but he's clearly a very handy player and will be another one that will be in first-team contention next season if he continues to improve at this rate.

Shrewnaldo · February 29

2 hours ago, SixPointer said:

The treq conundrum seems to be something that happens to me very often. I really want to make a role work but, I either don’t have the player or the players around it to suit the roles needed.

This year for me it’s been the libero I’ve had limited success building around it, first off I never had a player capable now I have that I can’t get the balance of the rest of the side correct.

A CF(a) could be a good alternative if you don’t want a plain AF, at least he should drop and link play, F9 you would most likely have the same issue as with Treq but could be worth a trial to see if it gets into the box after linking playing. My thinking is the F9 isn’t as flamboyant as the treq so you could potentially get the link play but still have some punch in the box from late runs?

I think my issue with the treq dropping deep is that I always think that runners from deep should be more advanced in FM. It's coming with time but the CM(A) and IF(A) don't consistently make that darting movement I'd expect them to.

As such, I wonder if it's more about moulding the players around the treq than switching away from the role? The CF(A) is certainly one I've been thinking about and I had a brief experiment in a recent 1-0 loss to Girona. Something didn't quite click for me - again, I think more about how the other roles reacted rather than the CF(A) itself but we didn't get the ball into the final third nearly as much as with the treq. I'd switched the B2B to an AP(S) to reintroduce some creativity so maybe it was just that the ball got pulled a bit deeper by the playmaker effect. I'll keep experimenting.

SixPointer · March 1

4 hours ago, Shrewnaldo said:

I think my issue with the treq dropping deep is that I always think that runners from deep should be more advanced in FM. It's coming with time but the CM(A) and IF(A) don't consistently make that darting movement I'd expect them to.

As such, I wonder if it's more about moulding the players around the treq than switching away from the role? The CF(A) is certainly one I've been thinking about and I had a brief experiment in a recent 1-0 loss to Girona. Something didn't quite click for me - again, I think more about how the other roles reacted rather than the CF(A) itself but we didn't get the ball into the final third nearly as much as with the treq. I'd switched the B2B to an AP(S) to reintroduce some creativity so maybe it was just that the ball got pulled a bit deeper by the playmaker effect. I'll keep experimenting.

What about some traits? Training the players to get forward more? Or gets into opposition box could useful if you have long term players in the roles.

fmaddict4ever · March 1

Just caught up with this thread now. Amazing what you’ve already achieved with so many of your own talent. Keep up the good work - really a delightfull read @Shrewnaldo!

I’m been trying to do something similar with Hertha in Germany, but the intakes keep dissapointing. Where have you gotten the inspiration to handle the youth department/recruitment the way you do? Or is it just experience and trial/error. Also, are you using the Editor or anything else to see CA/PA and hidden attributes?

_Ben_ · March 1

It's really interesting to see you deal with tactical issues that I also feel that I'm having to deal with. Despite our slight change in tactical ideology, I'm able to take a lot from your thought process! I do agree with Six Pointer though that trait development might be the way to develop roles into your own.

Shrewnaldo · March 2

On 01/03/2024 at 03:30, SixPointer said:

What about some traits? Training the players to get forward more? Or gets into opposition box could useful if you have long term players in the roles.

Definitely keen on exploiting the right traits. I already have one midfielder with some useful stuff likes "gets into opposition area" but it's his lack of pace which is holding him back.

But it looks like the treq is dead. Just fell off a cliff after a few games and I've shifted back to the DLF(A) which is, thus far, proving a way letter combination with a playmaker at MC

On 01/03/2024 at 06:09, fmaddict4ever said:

Just caught up with this thread now. Amazing what you’ve already achieved with so many of your own talent. Keep up the good work - really a delightfull read @Shrewnaldo!

I’m been trying to do something similar with Hertha in Germany, but the intakes keep dissapointing. Where have you gotten the inspiration to handle the youth department/recruitment the way you do? Or is it just experience and trial/error. Also, are you using the Editor or anything else to see CA/PA and hidden attributes?

Thanks very much!

No I don't look at CA/PA it hidden attributes. I did use the editor for the youth training issue I was having but that's it.

In terms of inspiration, I just haven't played this way for a while so it was partly a case of brushing off the old play style and partly picking up on others' success. I can specifically recommend the Evidence Based FM videos on intakes and what influences their quality and progression

12 hours ago, _Ben_ said:

It's really interesting to see you deal with tactical issues that I also feel that I'm having to deal with. Despite our slight change in tactical ideology, I'm able to take a lot from your thought process! I do agree with Six Pointer though that trait development might be the way to develop roles into your own.

At this point, I'm just a little wary of building towards some traits that become unsuitable if/when I switch the system a bit. But there are some things I see being perennial necessities - a midfield runner, for example. So that's an easy start.

One thing I find really interesting is the coaches' feedback if they think a trait is unsuitable for a player. "This trait suits players who can do x and that isn't true of this player" when I hadn't intuitively associated that trait with x at all.

El Payaso · March 2

Inspiring stuff once again. A big reason why I am so hooked on my own Betis career. I think we also struggle with lots of same things in terms of tactics.

roganp · March 2

I've been lurking in this thread since it was started up and I have to say what an enjoyable read it has been so far. Especially loving the focus on Mareo products.

It's been a while since I did a save in Spain, but this save is defintely inspiring me to head there once again. Keep up the brilliant work!

Shrewnaldo · March 2

11 hours ago, Litmanen 10 said:

Inspiring stuff once again. A big reason why I am so hooked on my own Betis career. I think we also struggle with lots of same things in terms of tactics.

6 hours ago, roganp said:

I've been lurking in this thread since it was started up and I have to say what an enjoyable read it has been so far. Especially loving the focus on Mareo products.

It's been a while since I did a save in Spain, but this save is defintely inspiring me to head there once again. Keep up the brilliant work!

Thanks both, I always appreciate these little bits of feedback from people who don't regularly post or lurk a bit. Always nice to read.

Shrewnaldo · March 2

No Europe, No Problem

A Sporting Heritage - The Guajes of Gijón

Without the demands of continental football, and perhaps with a little bit of tactical pragmatism, we have absolutely flourished so far this season. We've settled on the 4-3-3, albeit with some changes to the meandering posts above, and have landed on a system which suits most of our strongest players.

At the halfway point we are sitting fourth having only lost four games (home to Atlético and Girona, away at Real and Valencia), with three draws (Barca and Valladolid at home, Espanyol away). Last season we scored 43 goals all year, this term we're already at 38 whilst we're conceding at less than a goal a game. All-in-all I couldn't really be any more pleased with that.

I've even got Diego López scoring.

The Mareo graduate returned to Spain from Brentford for £16.5m in January 2027 and made an instant impact, scoring 12 in 11 before hitting a barren spell that was to last into the 2027/28 season when he managed only 5 goals. This season, López has been moved to the inside forward role wide on the right and has started to flourish again - utilising his pace, his finishing ability and his Likes to Try to Beat Offside Trap trait. And traits are now on the forefront of my thoughts throughout the squad.

The trequartista at 9 has given way to a deep-lying forward with an attack duty - giving us more of a central presence to play off that the treq who, whilst creative and plain fun, did have a tendency to vacate the area a bit too much. The playmaker has then moved into midfield, replacing the B2B who had been acting as a link player. All very straightforward stuff really.

Within this system, I've started making a list of traits that I think would suit each of the profiles and considering when to ask the newgens to learn them:

Right centre-back and inverted full-back: as these guys will become the outside players in the back 3 during possession, their role will automatically switch to Wide Centre Back and they do have a tendency to push forward if the flank is vacated. I've also noticed they are often left with clear space in front of them and I'd love to teach them the Brings Ball Out of Defence trait. I'm also considering some passing based traits such as Tries long range passes but I'm wondering if this might be more suited to the DM(D).
Defensive midfielder: often the primary focal point for recycling the ball, the DM(D) is the one midfielder who most often receives a pass with the combination of players in front of him AND him facing the opposition goal. So it makes sense to me that something like Switches Ball to the Flanks and Tries Long Range Passes would suit him.
Playmaker: pretty straightforward and you be sensing a theme here. Anyway, my current playmaker Molinas already has these traits

CM(A): again straightforward stuff like Gets Into Opposition Area is going to be really helpful as this is the guy who will try to break beyond the deep-lying forward. I really think this sort of stuff should be do-able without traits but what would I know. Tries to get forward whenever possible would be good and I'd also really like to try out Tries one-twos as this should work really well as a combination with the DLF or the AP. Lastly, dribbles through the centre of the pitch could be devastating with the right combination of dribbling, pace and agility and is one of the reasons I've considered switching Javi from the wing to the centre.
On the left wing, I'd also like Gets into Opposition Area to encourage the winger to burst forward from his deeper position and get into the back-post when the ball is on the right flank. The left-winger is also often isolated against the fullback and, pace permitting, I think would be a good candidate for Tries to Knock the Ball Past Opponent when taking him on due to the space available.
For the inside forward, I really like that López already has Likes to Try to Beat the Offside Trap and would be keen for another one-twos experiment.
And lastly the DLF: to help with the creativity, I'd like Tries Killer Balls Often but I'm not sure what else. Likes the Ball Into Feet could be an option but I don't think the role needs a trait for him to drop deep, do any dribbling or specific movement and the finishing stuff I'd say is player specific.

That gives me a good basis to work from - not just for teaching the newgens but also for targetting recruitment to fill the gaps. Speaking of gaps, I'll probably need to sign at least a defender in January.

(purple indicates out on loan)

With their contracts expiring at the end of the season, I took the opportunity to sell Jorge Meré (£800k to Almería), Lucas Ferreras (£725k to Espanyol) and Diego Sánchez (£100k to Burnley). All three were defensive options who just weren't getting any gametime - Ferreras a particular disappointment - with 56 first-team games across 2026/7 and 2027/8 he just never kicked on into a proper LaLiga level defender. So that leaves me a little short should one of Gragera, Krejčí or Chiquete get injured or attract big club attention.

Given the lack of European football and a relatively straightforward 19 leagues games but a few rounds in the cup to go, it's altogether possible that we won't need any cover but the step off from the first-team options to the likes of Puigdollers and Taibo is significant. So perhaps a loan deal or a short-term option with a good mentoring personality will do it.

The other problem I'm having is injuries. Specifically, injuries to Carlos Rojas and Ander Aguirre.

Two of my best prospects, their squad numbers indicate that they were selected to be first-choice at the start of the season. But, because of stuff like the below, they just haven't had a run in the team.

Rojas has managed just 2 starts and 4 sub appearances; Aguirre 5 starts and 10 subs. The latter is also suffering a goal drought which stretches back to last season and just needs to find a bit of confidence to kick on a bit. Clearly both are exceptionally talented and should be forming a major part of my plans going forward but these injuries are threatening to derail that.

Aguirre is also the one major victim of the new system. He's not ideally suited to being a deep-lying forward given his weak passing, teamwork and... well... weakness. I've brought him on as an inside forward on the right a couple of times but he isn't comfortable there at all. Which is another reason why I'm looking at the potential to put Javi in as the CM(A), vacating the wing slot for Aguirre and leaving Polo up top where he's flourished this season.

It's a nice problem to have, to be honest, and it's only going to become more nicely problematic with more of the talent coming through the system. Two in particular, Mario Martínez and Jonathan Mouriño, look special and have been accelerated to the B-team for the rest of 2028/9. If they perform well, I'm even considering putting them in the senior squad next season. And then I have this intake to look forward to in March.

Positive times. ¡Siempre Sporting!

OYTNANAK · March 3

Hey Shrew, I just started a new save with Deportivo La Coruna. And I noticed that my B team isn't exactly playing the same tactic as my first team. Unlike the B team, the U-19s team is actually playing like my first team. The result is every one of my B team player doesn't develop their tactical familiarity. Is this the same case as you with Sporting Gijon? Sorry if this issue has been addressed before in this thread. Thanks!

First photo is my first team, second photo is the responsibility regarding the training, third photo is my U-19s, and the fourth is my B team.

Shrewnaldo · March 3

4 hours ago, OYTNANAK said:

Hey Shrew, I just started a new save with Deportivo La Coruna. And I noticed that my B team isn't exactly playing the same tactic as my first team. Unlike the B team, the U-19s team is actually playing like my first team. The result is every one of my B team player doesn't develop their tactical familiarity. Is this the same case as you with Sporting Gijon? Sorry if this issue has been addressed before in this thread. Thanks!

First photo is my first team, second photo is the responsibility regarding the training, third photo is my U-19s, and the fourth is my B team.

Yeah there's all sorts of little bugs like this with the B-team. Keep an eye out for the staff responsibilities randomly being delegated back, and the board appointing B-team managers over your head even when you have selected the option. Also, the B-team manager seems to be able to completely alter your transfer and wage budget balances for some reason.

As for the tactics thing, it does happen randomly to me too. Make sure that you've set your chosen tactic to the 'Primary Trained Tactic' in the first-team Training screen, the B-team training screen and the under-19 training screen. You'll notice that the B-team dropdown option doesn't let you choose the tactic name (if you've saved a custom name), it's just a generic description of 'Balanced Custom 4-2-3-1 DM'. Sometimes you just need to delegate training back to the B-team manager, use the option in the Development Centre to select their tactic and then take training back.

Always fun. Just loads of bugs.

_Ben_ · March 3

Great start, Shrew! Looks like a year without mid-week fixtures is a blessing for you.

Really interested to see that front line - 19 and 17 years old. How does Polo look now, because he was originally a wide man, wasn't he? Is is Soriano I picked from your first intake as someone I liked? I forget! How does he look?

Shrewnaldo · March 3

25 minutes ago, _Ben_ said:

Great start, Shrew! Looks like a year without mid-week fixtures is a blessing for you.

Really interested to see that front line - 19 and 17 years old. How does Polo look now, because he was originally a wide man, wasn't he? Is is Soriano I picked from your first intake as someone I liked? I forget! How does he look?

Polo is an interesting one.

I'd always liked him but, as the intakes came and went, he seemed to be a bit below the primary prospects of Aguirre, Javi, Martínez et al. So whilst he started as an AML/AMC/ST I also trained him at AMR in order to fill the gap on that flank. I was seeing him as being the utility man to work around the others. This season, he came in as the DLF when Aguirre was injured and he's been outstanding. Yes, he's lacking a bit of physicality but ideal as a DLF apart from that and still has a bit of developing to do.

The number of times I see him take the ball to feet and - no doubt thanks to his First Touch, Technique, Agility and Balance - be able to turn defenders and play a simple pass to create space... so good. I'm teaching him the tries killer balls often trait and I think the next one will be likes ball played into feet. With a bit of strength training after that, I think he's great.

Sadly, Soriano has suffered from repeated ankle injuries - breaking it once and twisting it repeatedly.

That's left him behind a bit, to be honest, and he's struggled to hold down a place in the B-team. Unfortunately, I just don't see him ever breaking into the senior squad. Good memory though!

You have highlighted, however, that I haven't updated the ages on the squad planner. Polo and Aguirre are now 20 and 18 respectively - although still not exactly veterans.

_Ben_ · March 3

5 hours ago, Shrewnaldo said:

The number of times I see him take the ball to feet and - no doubt thanks to his First Touch, Technique, Agility and Balance - be able to turn defenders and play a simple pass to create space... so good. I'm teaching him the tries killer balls often trait and I think the next one will be likes ball played into feet. With a bit of strength training after that, I think he's great.

Yeah - I rate him. Not quite at that elite level in some areas but certainly good enough for now. Do you feel like you're going to outgrow him or, given the constraints upon you, reckon you'll just work really hard to continuously get the best from him?

I feel for Soriano but I've had a couple - even one touted as the best player - who have gone on to do nothing: it's the luck of the draw! I do really like Mourino still, though.

Shrewnaldo · March 3

The Sixth Intake

A Sporting Heritage - The Guajes of Gijón

Our favourite time of year as we take the annual look through this...

Turning into this...

And hold the freaking phone... 2.5* current ability left back. Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy. This one could be good.

(as an aside, two Brazilians... because reasons... but still no Mexicans which is really disappointing)

Elite Talents

Sergio Lozano - Left-back

Oh my, that's a newgen. Fairly Professional personality and holy heck that's a newgen. Look at those physicals already and bleedin' nora that's a newgen. I'm pretty sure he's going straight into the first-team.

Currently I play with an inverted fullback on the left which would just be a waste of Lozano. If I end up flipping the tactic to go with a left wingback that'd have a number of knock-on effects. First up, the right back would become the inverted fullback, secondly the AML would become the inside forward and it would mean putting Javi into central midfield as the CM(A)... Does that solve our Aguirre problem? Being a right-footed inside forward on the right hasn't held Diego López back this season, so no reason it would be a problem for Aguirre on the opposite flank.

Anyway, back to Lozano. Yes. What a newgen.

The other option is to 'do a Bale'. Maybe he isn't a left-back after all. Maybe he's... well, what would you play him as?

Raphael - Brazilian 10

Hmm... it's always going to be difficult being the one after Lozano but... hmmm... ok, positives - Passing, Technique, Flair, Decisions, Bravery. Some good attributes in areas which are hard to improve with time or training. Negatives: well, I don't currently play a 10 and he lacks the work rate and teamwork to play at centre mid, and lacks the physicality to play as a deep-lying forward. A 'wait and see' I think.

Fernando - Spanish 10

Absolutely shocking physicals but there's a lot else to like about Fernando. Good personality, two-footed with outstanding Teamwork and Work Rate, he's already a natural finisher and has an eye for a pass. I like Fernando a lot. Those physicals should improve with time (although perhaps not enough) and I think he'd make a very handy deep-lying forward. Very handy indeed.

Top Talents

Brais Manzano - Goalkeeper

Decent, I guess. His lack of Determination could be an issue and his Positioning is starting a lot lower than I'd like for a goalkeeper. Another 'wait and see'.

Francisco José Martin - DLP

That squint likely accounts for his poor Vision, which is an issue for playmakers. I really can't see Martín turning into a player - he's got too far to go in his Mentals. Yes, Decisions and Determination are excellent but no Flair, poor movement, lack of composure, teamwork and work rate. Not for me.

Pablo Peña - Ball-winner

Better starting physicals, two-footed and a good personality - he's one off double figures for Passing, Bravery, Positioning, Teamwork and Vision. If those tick over then his eye-test starts to look a lot better. Potential for sure - and he's a young 15, born in March, so definitely has extra time to catch up on some of those attributes. One for the possible column.

Antonio Cueto - Left wing

Personality is a big yikes but good physicals and has decent enough technicals for a winger. A lot of gaps in the mentals though and is already 16 so with less time to develop than some of the others. Promise but with a healthy dose of scepticism.

By the way, did you see that guy Lozano? What a newgen.

Andrew Uche - right wing

See entry for Cueto. Rinse and repeat.

-----------------------------------

We also got 6 Good Talents and 3 Decent Talents, all of whom have about as much potential of being a professional footballer as I do.

Comparing back to the preview news item, where is my centre back?! I was really hoping for a strong, physical centre back and an inside forward for AMR so it's a little disappointing that I missed out on both. On the other hand, Lozano.

And conceivably, Lozano as an inside forward has some merit. Wherever he ends up playing, it's clearly not a dud of an intake as he's an absolutely phenomenal prospect. And then there's Fernando who definitely has some promise but the rest of the intake is a bit meh.

Our Head of Youth Development, Feliu Márquez, is out of contact come the end of the season. Is it time for a refresh?

I had hoped for more of a correlation between his personality and those of the intakes but the impact isn't as marked as I'd expected. I only use job adverts to find new staff and I can't advertise for Felix's role until he's left so I have no idea what sort of replacement might be available to me. What do you think? Replace him? If so, obviously the personality is the primary consideration but what else do you think about when picking a HOYD?

And should I fire Felix after he's just brought Lozano through? Feels a bit harsh.

Shrewnaldo · March 3

13 minutes ago, _Ben_ said:

Yeah - I rate him. Not quite at that elite level in some areas but certainly good enough for now. Do you feel like you're going to outgrow him or, given the constraints upon you, reckon you'll just work really hard to continuously get the best from him?

I feel for Soriano but I've had a couple - even one touted as the best player - who have gone on to do nothing: it's the luck of the draw! I do really like Mourino still, though.

I have a couple of forwards coming through the system that I think should overtake Polo.

My coaches want me to put Álex in the senior squad already whilst Villanueva is out on loan in the Primera to guarantee game time. Both have the height and should develop the physicality that Polo is lacking but neither have Polo's mental attributes which I think are where he's getting his performances from.

The good thing about Polo is that no-one is interested in signing him - the game just doesn't rate him and so he should stick around even if he isn't first-choice for any of the front three roles. He's just one of those players where you know he isn't necessarily the best but he just brings it.

El Payaso · March 3

I'm really starting to like the looks that the newgens tend to have in this version. I used to hate them in the previous versions as physical attributes always tended to be way too high since the beginning. Now these look way more balanced.

This version has many features that actually make me want to have a long term save for the first time in many many years.

By the way: how long does it take for you to finish a season in general? And what highlights type do you use during games?

roganp · March 3

Wow, Lozano looks absolutely sensational. With his finishing, off the ball and physicals already being so good he could make a brilliant inside forward on the right. I personally would probably try to find a way to accommodate him as wing back, he's got the tools to become one of the world's best in that position

_Ben_ · March 3

2 hours ago, Shrewnaldo said:

Oh my, that's a newgen. Fairly Professional personality and holy heck that's a newgen. Look at those physicals already and bleedin' nora that's a newgen. I'm pretty sure he's going straight into the first-team.

Currently I play with an inverted fullback on the left which would just be a waste of Lozano. If I end up flipping the tactic to go with a left wingback that'd have a number of knock-on effects. First up, the right back would become the inverted fullback, secondly the AML would become the inside forward and it would mean putting Javi into central midfield as the CM(A)... Does that solve our Aguirre problem? Being a right-footed inside forward on the right hasn't held Diego López back this season, so no reason it would be a problem for Aguirre on the opposite flank.

Anyway, back to Lozano. Yes. What a newgen.

The other option is to 'do a Bale'. Maybe he isn't a left-back after all. Maybe he's... well, what would you play him as?

Left back, left winger, right inverted winger, even a Pressing forward - he’s got the potential to be anything!

Shrewnaldo · March 4

On 03/03/2024 at 20:20, Litmanen 10 said:

I'm really starting to like the looks that the newgens tend to have in this version. I used to hate them in the previous versions as physical attributes always tended to be way too high since the beginning. Now these look way more balanced.

This version has many features that actually make me want to have a long term save for the first time in many many years.

By the way: how long does it take for you to finish a season in general? And what highlights type do you use during games?

Typically it'll take me a week to a week and a half to complete a season but I seem to be playing faster these days. I think a lot of that is down to playing on Extensive highlights now. I'm typically a Comprehensive player with a few full matches when I'm trying to sort tactics out - but I'm keen to make sure the save doesn't burn out before the newgens are fully developed so have switched to Extensive to aid the focus of the save.

On 03/03/2024 at 20:24, roganp said:

Wow, Lozano looks absolutely sensational. With his finishing, off the ball and physicals already being so good he could make a brilliant inside forward on the right. I personally would probably try to find a way to accommodate him as wing back, he's got the tools to become one of the world's best in that position

On 03/03/2024 at 22:13, _Ben_ said:

Left back, left winger, right inverted winger, even a Pressing forward - he’s got the potential to be anything!

I agree with you both. I just think that level of talent has to be exploited and I'm looking to push him further forward. Physically he's clearly already phenomenal, mentally he's strongest offensively and technically his starting strength is Finishing. Whilst all his attributes will increase over time, I think it makes sense to look at where he's already strong and just take it from there. So I've brought him off the bench in the last couple of games as an inside forward on the right. Sadly he didn't score this but really, really promising.

I have the Copa del Rey final next... I wonder if he fancies scoring a winner.

Lestri · March 5

3 hours ago, Shrewnaldo said:

Typically it'll take me a week to a week and a half to complete a season but I seem to be playing faster these days. I think a lot of that is down to playing on Extensive highlights now. I'm typically a Comprehensive player with a few full matches when I'm trying to sort tactics out - but I'm keen to make sure the save doesn't burn out before the newgens are fully developed so have switched to Extensive to aid the focus of the save.

I agree with you both. I just think that level of talent has to be exploited and I'm looking to push him further forward. Physically he's clearly already phenomenal, mentally he's strongest offensively and technically his starting strength is Finishing. Whilst all his attributes will increase over time, I think it makes sense to look at where he's already strong and just take it from there. So I've brought him off the bench in the last couple of games as an inside forward on the right. Sadly he didn't score this but really, really promising.

I have the Copa del Rey final next... I wonder if he fancies scoring a winner.

I'm one of those players who uses an attribute calculator that breaks down their best roles by their attributes as part of my arsenal, so take it with the usual caveats (e.g. unknown PA, personality, adaptability etc), but his best roles currently are:

PF(A), W(S) and W(A) - 64%
AF(A) and CWB(S) - 63%
TRQ(A), IF(A), RMD(A) and CWB(A) - 62%
PF(D), PF(S), FN(S), SS(A), IF(S), WP(A), IW(A), MEZ(A) and AP(A) - 61%
ENG(S), IW(S) and MEZ(S) - 60%

Looking at your formation above, W(S) and IF(A) seems to be the best ones, but if I was to pick a role to train him, I'd say the CF-(S) or CWB(A) role for a more rounded approach.

Edited March 5 by Lestri

Shrewnaldo · March 5

10 hours ago, Lestri said:

I'm one of those players who uses an attribute calculator that breaks down their best roles by their attributes as part of my arsenal, so take it with the usual caveats (e.g. unknown PA, personality, adaptability etc), but his best roles currently are:

PF(A), W(S) and W(A) - 64%

AF(A) and CWB(S) - 63%

TRQ(A), IF(A), RMD(A) and CWB(A) - 62%

PF(D), PF(S), FN(S), SS(A), IF(S), WP(A), IW(A), MEZ(A) and AP(A) - 61%

ENG(S), IW(S) and MEZ(S) - 60%

Looking at your formation above, W(S) and IF(A) seems to be the best ones, but if I was to pick a role to train him, I'd say the CF-(S) or CWB(A) role for a more rounded approach.

Thanks. Not something I do but interesting that the results for such a diverse set of roles are so close. Like Ben says, he pretty much has the ability to be anything.

I'm also conscious that he's unlikely to be with us that long. Surely a big club will come along soon enough and throw money at him.

So I'm thinking short-term we could probably use him most at AMR as an inside forward or raumdeuter - somewhere his starting attributes are best suited and don't require a couple of years' improvement.

With Champions League football next season, he should get plenty of game time rotating with Diego López, who is also attracting significant interest from Benfica and Rennes

Shrewnaldo · March 5

Chokers

A Sporting Heritage - The Guajes of Gijón

Ok, so some simple stuff first:

Champions League football at the Quini next season but that cup final loss to Real Madrid was part of an end of season collapse which is becoming the norm at Sporting. Here are the April and May results since I joined

2023/24: Played 9; Won 3; Drawn 2; Lost 4
2024/25: Played 9; Won 7; Drawn 0; Lost 2
2025/26: Played 7; Won 1; Drawn 2; Lost 4 (and we lost 3 from 4 in March)
2026/27: Played 8; Won 3; Drawn 1; Lost 4 (didn't win any of the last 5 games)
2027/28: Played 12; Won 2; Drawn 5; Lost 5
2028/29: Played 10; Won 3; Drawn 1; Lost 6

In all but our promotion season (2024/5), we've utterly collapsed in the last two months of the season. Why? Fatigue? We've just completed the final 90 minutes of the season and not a single player is above 'low' in Fatigue levels, and only 10 of the 26 senior squad are rated as 'low' at all. So is it down to mentality?

Whilst I've made sure our captain Rosas enjoys big matches, we have four players who definitely don't - including the guy who got sent off in the Copa del Rey Final after 20 minutes. Lesson learned right there. But only two of those tend to play, is that enough to create a seeming crisis in confidence? Is it down to the young squad and lack of experience to get us over the line? That could perhaps be true these days but certainly not earlier in the save when I had the likes of Lemina or Ziyech bringing the experienced heads.

It's a concern because whatever 'clutch' is, we are the opposite of that. We bottled it in the final - the aforementioned red card killing any hope we had of beating Real. If we're looking to push on to the next level against next season then we'll definitely need to figure out how to avoid these end of season collapses.

Selling Varane and Chiquete, with their lack of big game energy, could be an option. Both have been excellent throughout and, cup final dismissal excepted, haven't shown any indication of bottling it any worse than the rest of the squad. Varane regularly attracts Saudi interest and I'm sure Chiquete would bring some bids in. Both also have potential replacements amongst the guajes and are, clearly, not from the Mareo academy themselves.

I am, however, keen to avoid the mistakes of last season when insufficient squad depth clearly meant the continental adventure came at the expense of our league form. Additional depth is required and depth with quality. We already have £25m transfer budget to play with so I have no need to sell. I've also already confirmed a £3.5m (potentially rising to £6m) deal for 6'6" Mexican centre back Rafael González who will bring the sheer size that we're currently lacking in the defensive newgens.

In other news, our B-team have been promoted at the fourth time of asking having made steady progress through the Primera. Next season they'll compete in LaLiga2 meaning higher reputation games for the second string. This is great news so long as they don't take a beating every week and lose morale.

And the success doesn't end there:

Our under-19s took home the junior double: winning both the Under19 Division 1 title and the Under-19s Cup. A remarkable achievement as I kept stealing their best players to bring into the B-team and then senior team. Driven by Álex's 37 goals and 13 assists in 31(1) games, there was no stopping them. No such clutch issues for the junior teams.

All very promising.

warlock · March 6

2 hours ago, Shrewnaldo said:

we've utterly collapsed in the last two months of the season

I feel your pain! I've pondered all the possible reasons you have, but playing in the Premier League I think it really is fatigue - both mental and physical. We've played an average of two games a week from November to March and even with full rotation and days off training for all of the match starters, it's impossible to put out an eleven in reasonable shape and sharpness. The fact that I'm running a young squad that's long on talent and short on experience probably doesn't help.

Ultimately, I think what the big transfers and high wages of the top clubs buys you is that combination of ability, experience and mental toughness. I mean spending £4m or £5m a week on wages has to buy you something, right?

SixPointer · March 6

B and youth teams doing the business, securing the future of your plans Shrew. Some of your exceptional recruitment style mixed in and it’s not going to be long before the chokers come out on top!

Shrewnaldo · March 7

On 06/03/2024 at 01:39, warlock said:

I feel your pain! I've pondered all the possible reasons you have, but playing in the Premier League I think it really is fatigue - both mental and physical. We've played an average of two games a week from November to March and even with full rotation and days off training for all of the match starters, it's impossible to put out an eleven in reasonable shape and sharpness. The fact that I'm running a young squad that's long on talent and short on experience probably doesn't help.

Ultimately, I think what the big transfers and high wages of the top clubs buys you is that combination of ability, experience and mental toughness. I mean spending £4m or £5m a week on wages has to buy you something, right?

We haven't faced that level of fixture congestion so I'm thinking it's not that for us. I think for us it's that big players aren't keen on big matches - I've discovered another one in midfield. I hadn't realised that the game would consider the end of season fixtures as 'big games', but it looks like there's a switch once you get into the final 2 months or last 10 games.

On 06/03/2024 at 04:51, SixPointer said:

B and youth teams doing the business, securing the future of your plans Shrew. Some of your exceptional recruitment style mixed in and it’s not going to be long before the chokers come out on top!

Both are going to be thoroughly plundered for first-team options this year.

-----------------------------

A dilemma then. I've already sold centre back Jesús Orozco Chiquete to Saudi football for £18.5m, solely because he didn't like big matches and I'm looking to dispatch with the end-of-season chokers.

The dilemma comes when I've discovered that two key players in midfield also suffer from the big game jitters.

Varane has been our first-choice 6/8 for a while now, however he is better suited to the 6 role. Meanwhile Molinas is our first-choice playmaker and has performed really well at both 10 and CM, including 13 assists last term.

Both, though, are 'not comfortable playing in big matches' and so I'm seriously considering moving both on. Some pertinent points:

Varane is much better-suited to 6 than 8. At DM, we have any number of guaje options with the most obvious being injury-prone Carlos Rojas closely followed by Domingo Escribano and Florian Chiripus and Iván Elvira coming next. All three are first-team ready but not quite as good as Varane - plus we lose the obvious experience of the 27 year-old. Varane is wanted by Nantes and Al-Ahli but that's been the case for quite some time and no-one ever seems to make an offer.
Molinas is clearly a playmaker and I have a couple of guaje options which are just making their way in the senior squad. Mario Martínez should, summer slump excepted, become very very good and is first-choice replacement, whilst Hugo Quiñones is preferred as the CM(A) but could definitely do a job as a playmaker. I also have Manu García, originally from the Mareo academy, and Roberto Lopez as experienced playmaking options - even if they aren't of the quality of Molinas. No-one is currently interested in Molinas.
Neither are listed as favoured personnel but Molinas is a Team Leader and Varane is a Highly Influential PLayer.

To sell either, I think I'd need to force through a move which would risk upsetting the squad and curtail the value I get for them. The latter is, in truth, not important. I already have a £50m transfer budget and plan to use pretty much none of it. This is just about tailoring the squad towards a more resilient set of personalities that doesn't wilt every April.

So should I sell one, or both? What do you think?

Lestri · March 8

I'd cull personally - those are pretty significant positions and I find the midfield is often more than not the ones to drag teams over the line, solely from vibes rather than any analysis.

CameronFM · March 8

Spent some time over last night and this morning catching up on the thread in full.

I love your work and the constraints placed upon yourself when creating the save idea. The statistical analysis within each post is a complete eye opener, it’s impressive to see your eye for detail being transferred into thoughts, and certainly food for thought going forward.

There was a comment made back on either page 3 or 4 that I was going to refer back to and query upon, but there’s been that much information to absorb, the point now escapes me. It’ll no doubt come back to me at some ungodly hour tonight and I’ll bring it back to the fore!

Shrewnaldo · March 9

On 08/03/2024 at 01:48, Lestri said:

I'd cull personally - those are pretty significant positions and I find the midfield is often more than not the ones to drag teams over the line, solely from vibes rather than any analysis.

I decided to sell Varane (£42.5m +20% next sale) but the initial offer for Molinas was only £12m and, whilst I don't need the money, I couldn't accept that

21 hours ago, CameronFM said:

Spent some time over last night and this morning catching up on the thread in full.

I love your work and the constraints placed upon yourself when creating the save idea. The statistical analysis within each post is a complete eye opener, it’s impressive to see your eye for detail being transferred into thoughts, and certainly food for thought going forward.

There was a comment made back on either page 3 or 4 that I was going to refer back to and query upon, but there’s been that much information to absorb, the point now escapes me. It’ll no doubt come back to me at some ungodly hour tonight and I’ll bring it back to the fore!

Thanks very much, always appreciated.

I hope you remember the query some time

Shrewnaldo · March 11

More outs than ins

A Sporting Heritage - The Guajes of Gijón

Some relatively significant departures from El Molinón as I pushed out three players who I think were costing us those big games.

Jesús Orozco Chiquete, whose red card after 20 minutes cost us any chance at the Copa del Rey final, went to Saudi for £18.5m and was followed by Jonathan Varane - Raphael's little brother bringing in the princely sum of £42.5m and 20% of his next fee. Between them, winger Gaspar left for Greek football for a surprising fee of up to £14.5m. Gaspar is a guaje and I did consider keeping him around but that lack of big game mentality just forced my hand - besides, there's plenty of newgen options for his position now.

With over £100m burning a hole in my pocket I only brought in two players - both Mexican centre backs.

Rafael González joins the first-team as a direct replacement for Chiquete - combining aerial dominance with an ability to play out from the back. Solano joins the B-team to supplement for a general lack of guaje centre backs that have come through and gone on to prove their worth. At just £6m and £1.9m respectively, I still have quite the funding available to me should I have decided to use it.

Instead, I'm once again just sticking the youth into the first team - Champions League and all. The senior squad now has 19 players classed as 'trained at club' and they continue to demand >50% of the side's game minutes. Indeed, these numbers are skewed somewhat by Manu Garcia and Dego López who are Asturians that started their careers at Sporting but not for long enough to be classed as 'trained at the club'.

I've also brought in a few more newgen guajes to the senior squad, so that we now have the following. I've linked the posts with the intakes themselves, on the off-chance you want to go back and compare the players to when they spawned:

First intake:
- Welton - Centre back
- Domingo Escribano - DM
- Florin Chirpus - DM
- Francesc Polo - DLF
Second intake:
- Raimundo Montiel - inverted leftback
- Carlos Rojas - DM
- Hugo Quiñones - centre mid
Third intake:
- Ander Aguirre - left-winger / 9
- Javi - left-winger / midfield runner
- Carlos Gil - goalkeeper
Fourth intake:
- Álex - DLF
- Mario Martínez - midfield playmaker
Fifth intake:
- Jonathan Mouriño - centre back
Sixth intake:
- Sergio Lozano - golden boy

Whilst a couple of them might be borderline not good enough, 14 newgen academy players from each of the six intakes so far is a healthy return. And there's plenty coming through to add to that. With the B-team now in LaLiga2, I'm really giving the best prospects free rein to develop at the higher level in second team rather than go out on loan - and so far they're holding their own with a solid mid-table position.

There are a couple of noticeable gaps - right back primarily, and centre back where Mouriño is clearly excellent but a lot of the other options tend to tail off about 19/20 and never kick on. This led me to almost splash £12m and bring Manuel Navarro back from Spurs but his technical weaknesses put me off and I've left him there in the hope he'll develop himself a bit better.

With all that cash, I probably "should" have invested in some real talent and started challenging the three big clubs at the top of the table but, truth be told, I'm quite happy to play out a couple of seasons to establish ourselves as the fourth force in Spanish football and perhaps pick up a cup - as we can so close to doing last season.

Besides, the planner is already rammed full of talent just needing consistent game time and I really don't like relinquishing control of the best players through loans. The one position I very nearly bought-in for was CM(A). Javi and Quiñones are not the finished article by any means and I was very, very tempted to bring in Mexican wonderkid Saúl González for his £8.6m release fee.

Playing for affiliate Club América, González is clearly quality but isn't really a CM(A) - the position I was looking to fill. I figured I could bring him in, play him there for a season and he'd do pretty well - well enough that he'd get me a pretty chunky profit come the end of the campaign. I could then let Javi go on loan and get game time elsewhere.

In the end I decided against it - we have plenty of our own prospects for DM, where González is best suited, and I just preferred giving Mareo graduates the nod over the all-too-standard 'sign a bunch of foreign wonderkids' route. Yes, it's sort of within the premise of the save to look at the Mexican market but I prefer to make things hard for myself really.

So into the Champions League we go, with the average age of the squad now just a smidge under 23. Our annual salary is still only 16th in the league, too - like I say, I like to make it unnecessarily difficult. I'll probably need to figure out what to spend all that money on. A new stadium maybe?

¡Siempre Sporting!

CameronFM · March 12

9 hours ago, Shrewnaldo said:

First intake:

Welton - Centre back

Domingo Escribano - DM

Florin Chirpus - DM

Francesc Polo - DLF

Second intake:

Raimundo Montiel - inverted leftback

Carlos Rojas - DM

Hugo Quiñones - centre mid

Third intake:

Ander Aguirre - left-winger / 9

Javi - left-winger / midfield runner

Carlos Gil - goalkeeper

Fourth intake:

Álex - DLF

Mario Martínez - midfield playmaker

Fifth intake:

Jonathan Mouriño - centre back

Sixth intake:

Sergio Lozano - golden boy

Particularly pleasing seeing some of the early boys blossom into handy players to have around the senior squad. Ok, they aren't world-beaters by any stretch of the imagination, but given the advancements in club infrastructure since intakes 1 & 2, the progression has been lovely to see.

_Ben_ · March 17

How are you finding giving youth players minutes now that you’re a ‘bigger team?’ I’ve always been able to develop and prioritise youth in smaller leagues but, now that I’m at the top end of Bundesliga, I feel that they are noticeably out of their depth and aren’t playing well enough to develop. Is your ‘B’ team the bridge that I am maybe missing?

Shrewnaldo · March 18

The Seventh Intake

A Sporting Heritage - The Guajes of Gijón

It's that time of year again, as we turn this...

...into this...

And there's even a Mexican newgen hiding in there for the first time.

Elite Talents

Guillem Corominas - Goalkeeper

That's a really solid start. Really solid. At 15, he has double figures for everything that I want in a 'keeper bar One-on-Ones and Agility, both of which should tick over pretty soon. The Aerial Reach should increase quickly with his physical development and let's assume he gets 3-5 attribute point on the rest of the Technicals and Mentals... he's a winner. The only question will be if the save lasts long enough to see him into the first team. As a 'keeper, we're talking another 5-6 seasons realistically...

Antonio - Winger?

All tattoos are terrible but neck tattoos are particularly terrible. We'll forgive the newgan picture development that though. Potential, for sure. His clear strength is in his Physicals and Technique, with good Flair and Teamwork. I can see why the game has put him as a winger despite being natural up top. If he wasn't identified as an Elite Talent then I'd probably put him in the 'decent' pile with a hope of developing, rather than expectation.

Top Talents

Melvyn Jarry - French

Rather stereotyping with the terrible moustache there but Jarry seems to have washed up in Gijón after a heavy night out in Clohars-Carnoët over there on the south coast of Brittany. And I can't say I am terribly impressed. Physicals are fine and will develop, his technicals are ok for a midfielder I guess but those mentals are shockingly bad. Very much a meh, for me.

Carlos - Centre back

I really wanted centre-backs so this is a welcome one. Carlos looks decent and I'm really pleased to see that his starting technicals are already really solid for a centre back. I've struggled to get Heading, in particular, to increase for my newgens so far - with one or two points on the key three technicals then we should be on to a winner. The physicals should shoot up over the next two years and the mentals are fine, if unspectacular. My coaches also think he's already consistent - a massive boost for a defender. Really pleased with this one.

Ivan Jiménez - Wide Targetman

Don't mind a 6'4" winger at all, not one bit. On the other hand, Strength of 4 isn't ideal. And Off the Ball of just 6, Composure of just 4, Passing of just 6... there's some red flags there for sure. I really like the Work Rate and the Teamwork but his low Bravery, not to mention that Strength, is going to limit his effectiveness as an aerial threat. I think he'll dominate the youth leagues but struggle to kick on once he gets to senior football but we'll see.

Pablo Castillo - Beard

Quite the beard for a 15 year-old. Best personality so far and it's nice to see the Bravery that is so lacking in Jimémez but there are gaps galore with Castillo. If that personality helps him kick-on early and boost Heading, Marking, Positioning, Jumping Reach and Strength by 3 a-piece then perhaps he'll make the squads but... I'm not holding my breath.

Good Talents

There are 8 of them and they're all terrible. None more so than our first Mexican newgen...

Juan Javier Jaramillo - Meh

Triple J has a shocking personality and is poor physically, but perhaps has the Technicals to do something... in the b-team... maybe? Not really - I'm clutching at straws massively here. He can control the ball really well and he can probably dribble, really slowly, quite nicely and put in a half decent cross... but that's about it.

--------------------

2 Elite Talents, 4 Top Talents, 8 Good Talents and 2 Decent Talents. Of that I think Corominas is the big dub here, whilst Carlos is probably going to end up first-team material. Then there's maybe Antonio and... not a lot else? That probably makes this our worst intake yet - but the most disappointing aspect is undoubtedly the personalities of those 16 newgens:

Balanced - 7
Fairly Loyal - 2
Unambitious - 2
Low Self Belief - 1
Fairly Professional - 1
Light-hearted - 2
Fickle - 1

My HoYD is Professional, so where's the pull through? I think a shake-up to refresh it all would do nicely so I'm going to sack Feliu Márquez and go on the hunt for a new HoYD.

EDIT - in other news...

Aguirre is the second-best wonderkid in the world and Jonathan Mouriño is fifth. Meanwhile, Saul González at affiliate Club América is this year's winner... and is joining Sporting Gijón in the summer for £8.6m.

Edited March 18 by Shrewnaldo

Shrewnaldo · March 18

On 12/03/2024 at 08:46, CameronFM said:

Particularly pleasing seeing some of the early boys blossom into handy players to have around the senior squad. Ok, they aren't world-beaters by any stretch of the imagination, but given the advancements in club infrastructure since intakes 1 & 2, the progression has been lovely to see.

indeed, some of them are just personal favourites too. Polo is now our top scorer even though he can be a bit streaky and Escribano is a really solid option in the middle.

On 17/03/2024 at 12:49, _Ben_ said:

How are you finding giving youth players minutes now that you’re a ‘bigger team?’ I’ve always been able to develop and prioritise youth in smaller leagues but, now that I’m at the top end of Bundesliga, I feel that they are noticeably out of their depth and aren’t playing well enough to develop. Is your ‘B’ team the bridge that I am maybe missing?

So far, I'm finding it no different. The board have no great expectations and so I'm willing to take the risk that we miss out on Champions League football by just playing them. We don't really need the money and I'm liking the slow burn rather than just bounding straight to the top.

The only one who is causing me any concern is Lozano - the wonderkid from the last intake. He's actually regressed since spawning and I'm wondering whether I should have left him in the unders for a bit longer. I know there's 'official' feedback about players developing better if they play unders until 18 and whilst that obviously isn't always the case it certainly seems to have been with Lozano. One year in the under-19s might have been best. Or the b-team.

Now that they've made it to LaLiga2, I've noticed a big difference in the development players are getting from their game time - so it's definitely a really important bridge for my side. At 3rd and 4th tier level... it was useful but no doubt that the step up to tier 2 is hugely beneficial. Leverkusen have a B-team?

majorbriggs · March 21

Fantastic read Shew. Haven't been around the FM scene for a quite a while but I used to read your website, and a lot of career posts back on the Dugout (remember DavidBR?). Thinking of starting a save as Zaragoza.
Do you have Fog of War turned on? Maybe its because I often played as lower leagues or nations but it really slowed down progress and I found it unrealistic in places.

I was going to say well done for resisting Gonzalez, I wouldn't have been able to do it. And then you signed him! He looks properly world-class.

_Ben_ · March 21

On 18/03/2024 at 22:47, Shrewnaldo said:

So far, I'm finding it no different. The board have no great expectations and so I'm willing to take the risk that we miss out on Champions League football by just playing them. We don't really need the money and I'm liking the slow burn rather than just bounding straight to the top.

The only one who is causing me any concern is Lozano - the wonderkid from the last intake. He's actually regressed since spawning and I'm wondering whether I should have left him in the unders for a bit longer. I know there's 'official' feedback about players developing better if they play unders until 18 and whilst that obviously isn't always the case it certainly seems to have been with Lozano. One year in the under-19s might have been best. Or the b-team.

Now that they've made it to LaLiga2, I've noticed a big difference in the development players are getting from their game time - so it's definitely a really important bridge for my side. At 3rd and 4th tier level... it was useful but no doubt that the step up to tier 2 is hugely beneficial. Leverkusen have a B-team?

That's interesting and really good to hear, to be honest. Similarly, my board are expecting quite a slow rate of progress so maybe I should just seek to give out more youth minutes.

What is Lozano's personality? How has he been rating? I'm finding that so much is linked to performance at the moment for the development of my youngsters. I had a couple of players at Bochum who were playing poorly one season and barely progressed but came on leaps and bounds in the following year, when we went up. Obviously, there is more to it than that - age, suitability for the first team, better coaches, tactical adjustments etc etc but it was something I noted.

We don't have a B-team, no, but - at the end of each season - I get asked if I want to form one. The issue is that, unlike your B squad, they'd start in the fourth or fifth tier and would take ages to reach a level that was of any use to me, with them not being able to play above the third tier anyway. I have an affiliate - Duisburg - in the 2.Liga and I think that they're a solid choice to send my youngsters to, whilst giving the rest opportunities - sporadically - in the first team until they are able to hold down a place at a decent level.

EDIT:

On your youth intake. To you, does it feel a little underwhelming? I think that, looking at Aguirre, Mourino and Lozano and then back at that crop, there feels far less top end talent but - also - the players don't quite feel as well-rounded as previous intakes. Maybe that's just me and I know you're the right person to address that if it is an issue for you, too!

Edited March 21 by _Ben_

sammad50 · March 21

That Saul Gonzalez from Club America looks very, very good. Great signing.

Work rate at 11 not ideal but otherwise he looks top notch and obviously professional personality as well.

Shrewnaldo · March 21

19 hours ago, majorbriggs said:

Fantastic read Shew. Haven't been around the FM scene for a quite a while but I used to read your website, and a lot of career posts back on the Dugout (remember DavidBR?). Thinking of starting a save as Zaragoza.
Do you have Fog of War turned on? Maybe its because I often played as lower leagues or nations but it really slowed down progress and I found it unrealistic in places.

I was going to say well done for resisting Gonzalez, I wouldn't have been able to do it. And then you signed him! He looks properly world-class.

I do remember the name. Didn't you used to post stories on TD?

I do have 'fog of war' or attribute masking on. I find it a little odd the way the game treats it but I much prefer to playing without it. I think if you go to watch a game yourself then you should reveal attributes in the same way as sending scouts - or even when you play against other teams, but for some reason it doesn't work like that which I find very annoying.

I think on Gonzalez, I've just accepted that I'm going to have ~75% of my players from our academy with the other ~25% either other Spanish players or Mexicans. And he is properly good so I couldn't pass him up two years on the bounce.

13 hours ago, _Ben_ said:

That's interesting and really good to hear, to be honest. Similarly, my board are expecting quite a slow rate of progress so maybe I should just seek to give out more youth minutes.

What is Lozano's personality? How has he been rating? I'm finding that so much is linked to performance at the moment for the development of my youngsters. I had a couple of players at Bochum who were playing poorly one season and barely progressed but came on leaps and bounds in the following year, when we went up. Obviously, there is more to it than that - age, suitability for the first team, better coaches, tactical adjustments etc etc but it was something I noted.

We don't have a B-team, no, but - at the end of each season - I get asked if I want to form one. The issue is that, unlike your B squad, they'd start in the fourth or fifth tier and would take ages to reach a level that was of any use to me, with them not being able to play above the third tier anyway. I have an affiliate - Duisburg - in the 2.Liga and I think that they're a solid choice to send my youngsters to, whilst giving the rest opportunities - sporadically - in the first team until they are able to hold down a place at a decent level.

EDIT:

On your youth intake. To you, does it feel a little underwhelming? I think that, looking at Aguirre, Mourino and Lozano and then back at that crop, there feels far less top end talent but - also - the players don't quite feel as well-rounded as previous intakes. Maybe that's just me and I know you're the right person to address that if it is an issue for you, too!

Lozano is still listed as 'Fairly Professional' which is another reason for my disappointment in his development so far. He's had nearly 1000 first-team minutes this season but seems to be in a similar position to your players - he isn't playing that well so his morale is relatively low and therefore he doesn't develop?

How long are you planning on sticking at Leverkusen? If the non-active promotions are based on reputation then you could get into 3.Liga within 3 seasons? Not sure how much the B-team would cost you but worth a shot?

But I'd definitely agree that Bundesliga2 games with Duisburg will be much better - the only downside there is that you can't control the system they'd be playing in, or influence the game time the same way you can with a B-team.

I'm absolutely with you on this intake. Underwhelming is definitely the word I'd choose. I do like Corominas a lot and I think Carlos is pretty decent but it's way behind all of our other intakes in terms of excitement factor. I ended up sacking our HoYD and bringing in Thomas Caers.

Little bit of an experiment this one but I wanted the personality more than the attributes or the nationality. I have no idea if his lack of scouting knowledge in Spain will affect the intake at all. I don't think it does and I don't recall seeing anything in Evidence Based FM's videos about it, but it's always possible.

Hopefully Caers can help us back into a better intake next year AND see some pull-through with the personality.

8 hours ago, sammad50 said:

That Saul Gonzalez from Club America looks very, very good. Great signing.

Work rate at 11 not ideal but otherwise he looks top notch and obviously professional personality as well.

Agree, I really like him. I'm just not sure what role is best suited for him - which is weird for me because I never sign a player unless I'm absolutely sure where he'll fit into the planned system.

majorbriggs · March 21

3 hours ago, Shrewnaldo said:

I do remember the name. Didn't you used to post stories on TD?

Not me, but I used to follow his stories at the time. Brilliant writer, sadly he passed away.

Shrewnaldo · March 22

29 minutes ago, majorbriggs said:

Not me, but I used to follow his stories at the time. Brilliant writer, sadly he passed away.

Ah bloody hell. I assume "BR" was "briggs". I had no idea. What a shame.

Shrewnaldo · March 23

Best of the Rest?

A Sporting Heritage - The Guajes of Gijón

A successful season as we managed to negotiate continental football and retain our fourth spot to get back-to-back campaigns.

The biggest disappointment of the campaign was the Copa del Rey semi-final defeat to Betis. Having beat them 2-1 in the first leg, I was left with that awkward position where I'm never sure whether to play aggressive and try to put the game out of sight early-doors - or go conservative and try to hold onto the one goal lead. And then, in typical FM style, I could tell from kick-off that we were destined to lose and a 2-0 reverse put us out.

In the Champions League, we started with a hilarious game in Czechia when three of the goals were complete farces ...

...and yet took the win to combine with later victories over Olympiakos, Gladbach and Arsenal. A draw with Liverpool came between losses to Nice and Porto, before we finished off the campaign with a home defeat to Bayern. That was, surprisingly, enough for us to finish 11th but we came up against Enzo Maresca's Spurs in the playoffs where a 3-2 aggregate defeat flattered us.

In the league, 6 fewer goals scored and 4 fewer conceded brought us four more points than last season - three defeats becoming three draws.

Meanwhile, the B-team's first campaign in LaLiga2 was super successful - finishing 7th and one place outside of the playoffs they couldn't qualify for anyway. And the under-19s retained both their Under-19 Cup, defeating local rivals Oviedo 4-0 in the final, and the U-19 division - scoring 114 goals in the league phase and then knocking 7, 6 and 6 past their knock-out phase opponents. Dominance.

Pleasingly, we did all this whilst boosting both the squad proportion and game time given to Mareo graduates. Gragera and Diego López, real life guajes, and newgens Francesc Polo, Ander Aguirre and Javi all saw >3000 minutes - whilst Mario Martínez, Jonathan Mouriño and Carlos Rojas all got between 2000 and 3000 minutes.

The foreign contingent is made up of Czech centre back Ladislav Krejčí, Argentine playmaker Aarón Molinas and two Mexican defenders - Alejandro Gómez and Rafael González. The latter has been particularly good and will be joined in the summer by wonderkid Saúl González.

González's arrival will mean that we have three of the world's top five wonderkids according to the NxGn award and has prompted me to consider the next stage of the squad's evolution - selling Krejčí and Molinas to make the squad entirely Spanish and Mexican, with the domestic contingent consisting of 9 Mareo graduates to every one bought in.

This wasn't part of the original plan but the game has slowly been creeping in as I've subconsciously overprioritised the guajes and Mexicans. Ideally, I'd like it so the Mexican players only fill gaps in the guaje production - something which is definitely the case with Alejandro Gómez at left back and Rafael González at centre back. But Saúl is the sort of signing I never make - just a really good player in a position that I don't really need.

That, together with some general dissatisfaction with the 4-4-2, prompted me into some tactical experimentation over the latter half of the season.

The main impetus for the experimentation was my desire to get the most out of Ander Aguirre.

The winger/striker was the undoubted star of the third intake and has developed into a hugely promising player in the four years since. He scored on his debut and in his first senior season he scored 10 in 16(9). Then in 2027/8, he scored only 5 all campaign - completely unsuited to the DLF role up top and struggling as a left winger.

But I really want to fit Aguirre, Javi and Polo into the same side. Javi's technicals mean that he can only really be a winger, whilst Polo has been moulded into the link player that Aguirre isn't. The obvious option is to put Aguirre on the right as the inside forward but that slot is intended for golden boy Sergio Lozano in the long-term and is currently occupied by Diego López. So the 4-2-3-1 seemed like an obvious choice - allowing Polo to link from AM and Aguirre to play a striker role to which he is more suited.

It hasn't really worked out though - results have been fine but the 9 doesn't get enough shots to make his lack of general involvement worthwhile. It also comes without the defensive shape that I prefer (4-1-4-1 / 4-3-3). So the 4-3-3 seems like it'll be back as the primary option and I have a choice to make on Aguirre versus López for right wing.

Indeed, there are quite a number of choices to make as the newgens from intakes four, five and six start to challenge for places. Selling Krejci and Molinas will free up a couple of spaces, whilst Welton (22, newgen), Dani Quiepo (28) and Manu Garcia (32) are also surplus to requirements; and Romanian Florin Chiripus is the first decent newgen I've allowed to leave - sold to Cluj for £2.2m.

---------------

Apologies, partial post but interrupted by family stuff and don't want to lose what I've typed so far.

Captain_T · March 23

Hello

Very cool story and development. Very interesting to read!

Maybe I missed it, but: where did you get the newgen faces?

Edited March 23 by Captain_T

Shrewnaldo · March 23

20 minutes ago, Captain_T said:

Hello

Very cool story and development. Very interesting to read!

Maybe I missed it, but: where did you get the newgen faces?

Cheers

I use this pack from Susi with the newgan manager thing https://sortitoutsi.net/graphics/style/33/ultra-realistic-newgan-faces-megapack

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FM24 | A Sporting Heritage | The Guajes of Gijón

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