[FM21][Skin] Non-numeric attributes [★] *updated August 29th*

[Guest]

Fritzle I love the skin a lot so thank you but what are the chances of something a bit more in depth for the wagon wheel like this one?

[sebastian_starttrbts]

7 hours ago, thiagoanjo said:

I forgot we could adjust that in-game, but 11-15 is a huge gap, I mean, it is a difference from poor player to a start player, at some levels (Brasil 1st div, for instance). I will run some tests and give a feedback about how I feel it, great job anyways, congrats!

Thank you  I'm really looking forward to your feedback.

But isn't it a good thing to make it harder to distinguish between a (former) poor and star player by just considering their attributes? In this case their performance on the pitch (and in training) is way more important and you may tend to trust in players you haven't considered because of their attributes before.

[sebastian_starttrbts]

2 hours ago, Crazy_Ivan said:

Fritzle I love the skin a lot so thank you but what are the chances of something a bit more in depth for the wagon wheel like this one?

Thank you for your feedback

I've seen that graphic before and it seems to be a very impressive approach Dani_Dots developed for his DD2021 realism mod. Some kind of graphical representation of the attributes may be an option in the future of course, but at the moment there are some other things I'm working on first. And I am not sure whether I am able to create something like that at all, what makes Danis work even more impressive. But we'll see

[thiagoanjo]

7 horas atrás, Fritzle_1893 disse:

Thank you  I'm really looking forward to your feedback.

But isn't it a good thing to make it harder to distinguish between a (former) poor and star player by just considering their attributes? In this case their performance on the pitch (and in training) is way more important and you may tend to trust in players you haven't considered because of their attributes before.

You cant evaluate attributes through training on FM (the rating is for general training) and that is the main way a manager choose and compares their players, also some attributes are hard to distinguish on the pitch on FM. The mental ones, for instance, by the way FM shows you the match, how you can you tell how much good is a player on Teamwork, Leadership, Flair, Concentration, for example?  Also you would need so many matches, even watching the whole game, to evaluated attributes through performance that wouldnt make sense considering it because it is a incomplete simulator game.

To sum up: my point is that 5 points is a huge difference to put into the same range, since the game lacks of tools to evaluate players attributes besides that numbers.

See: How to distinguish who is best at crossing Messi or Raí (Moto Club - Brazilian 4rd Division), if you cant see them practicing ? So the attributes is a way to the game says "you saw the training (and other stuff that the game doesnt show or show poorly)" and you noticed that this guy has X on crossing and this one has Y. So, you should be able to see the difference between Messi and a 4rd Div player crossing balls, the attributes is a way to the game give you this.

[sebastian_starttrbts]

8 hours ago, thiagoanjo said:

You cant evaluate attributes through training on FM (the rating is for general training) and that is the main way a manager choose and compares their players, also some attributes are hard to distinguish on the pitch on FM. The mental ones, for instance, by the way FM shows you the match, how you can you tell how much good is a player on Teamwork, Leadership, Flair, Concentration, for example?  Also you would need so many matches, even watching the whole game, to evaluated attributes through performance that wouldnt make sense considering it because it is a incomplete simulator game.

To sum up: my point is that 5 points is a huge difference to put into the same range, since the game lacks of tools to evaluate players attributes besides that numbers.

See: How to distinguish who is best at crossing Messi or Raí (Moto Club - Brazilian 4rd Division), if you cant see them practicing ? So the attributes is a way to the game says "you saw the training (and other stuff that the game doesnt show or show poorly)" and you noticed that this guy has X on crossing and this one has Y. So, you should be able to see the difference between Messi and a 4rd Div player crossing balls, the attributes is a way to the game give you this.

Looking at a player's profile with the attributes' classification in poor, average, good and excellent and our coache's report, we are indeed able to get an idea about our player's strenghts and weaknesses. In my opinion, there is not need to know whether this player has 11 or 14 passing, because his performance on the pitch is driven by the combination of many attributes. His success in passing may be affected by his ability to pass (passing), his vision, his decisions, his bravery ... To evaluate his performance we can have a look at his stats, i.e. his pass completion ratio, clear cut chances created or key passes. If these stats aren't as good as expected, the next step might be to investigate whether his poor performance is due to issues in our tactical style or if the player just isn't good enough. Even if a player has 20 passing, 20 vision, 20 decisions, it doesn't mater when his passes only succeed in 50%. And concerning the training performance: I don't feel like training supports us in evaluating the players' attributes. My idea was to reward somebody who delivers in training with more playing time -> chances to show his ability on the pitch, compared to someone who may have similar ability, but does not train well. 

I don't feel like comparing a Brasilian 4th division player with Messi is a reasonable example. But I think we should be able to see that Messi's combination of stats, considered important for crossing should be way above Raí's:

Although Raí's and Messi's Crossing are both considered good, Messi is way stronger concerning technical, passing and corner taking ability as well as in decisions, vision, (flair). Therefore I would assume that (even without looking at the Coach/Scout report) Messi should be able to deliver better crosses.

 

Nevertheless, we aren't able to introduce more than four star colours yet. Therefore, trying to personally adjust the ranges in the best way possible is the only thing we can do. Maybe reducing the starting point for excellent attributes might be an option for you, but in my opinion smaller ranges would reduce the amount of uncertainty that is crucial to this playing style. 

[GIMN]

@thiagoanjo - I understand your point, and know personally I'd prefer a 5th to allow an even distribution around the mid-point, but sadly we are limited to 4.  One possible solution is to increase the upper bound of for the Average Attribute Threshold and then distribute evenly.  A suggestion below:

• 1-8 Poor
• 9-12 Average
• 13-16 Good
• 17+ Excellent

This obviously makes it harder to assess youth prospects, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.  In fact, you could argue that such an approach enhances realism, considering the success rate of youth prospects IRL.

An alternative approach is to think of the attributes in terms of what you personally consider as minimum acceptable values for certain measures.  A possible example for Premier League

• 1-6 Poor
• 7-10 Average
• 11-14 Good
• 15+ Excellent

You might want first team players to have minimum 15 for key attributes (e.g passing for a midfielder), and 11 for supplementary attributes (e.g. marking for a midfielder).  And for youth players, you might want that to be 11 and 7 respectively, allowing you to assess players who may have enough about them to develop to a reasonable level.

[thiagoanjo]

3 horas atrás, Geoff Newman disse:

@thiagoanjo - I understand your point, and know personally I'd prefer a 5th to allow an even distribution around the mid-point, but sadly we are limited to 4.  One possible solution is to increase the upper bound of for the Average Attribute Threshold and then distribute evenly.  A suggestion below:

• 1-8 Poor
• 9-12 Average
• 13-16 Good
• 17+ Excellent

This obviously makes it harder to assess youth prospects, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.  In fact, you could argue that such an approach enhances realism, considering the success rate of youth prospects IRL.

An alternative approach is to think of the attributes in terms of what you personally consider as minimum acceptable values for certain measures.  A possible example for Premier League

• 1-6 Poor
• 7-10 Average
• 11-14 Good
• 15+ Excellent

You might want first team players to have minimum 15 for key attributes (e.g passing for a midfielder), and 11 for supplementary attributes (e.g. marking for a midfielder).  And for youth players, you might want that to be 11 and 7 respectively, allowing you to assess players who may have enough about them to develop to a reasonable level.

At moment I am testing tactics so I can notice what change on FM21 strats, but ill definitely explore this skins and ur suggestion is really good. With only 4 ranges I will have to change the threshold according the team/tournament I am

[thiagoanjo]

Em 05/03/2021 em 06:40, Fritzle_1893 disse:

Looking at a player's profile with the attributes' classification in poor, average, good and excellent and our coache's report, we are indeed able to get an idea about our player's strenghts and weaknesses. In my opinion, there is not need to know whether this player has 11 or 14 passing, because his performance on the pitch is driven by the combination of many attributes. His success in passing may be affected by his ability to pass (passing), his vision, his decisions, his bravery ... To evaluate his performance we can have a look at his stats, i.e. his pass completion ratio, clear cut chances created or key passes. If these stats aren't as good as expected, the next step might be to investigate whether his poor performance is due to issues in our tactical style or if the player just isn't good enough. Even if a player has 20 passing, 20 vision, 20 decisions, it doesn't mater when his passes only succeed in 50%. And concerning the training performance: I don't feel like training supports us in evaluating the players' attributes. My idea was to reward somebody who delivers in training with more playing time -> chances to show his ability on the pitch, compared to someone who may have similar ability, but does not train well. 

I don't feel like comparing a Brasilian 4th division player with Messi is a reasonable example. But I think we should be able to see that Messi's combination of stats, considered important for crossing should be way above Raí's:

Although Raí's and Messi's Crossing are both considered good, Messi is way stronger concerning technical, passing and corner taking ability as well as in decisions, vision, (flair). Therefore I would assume that (even without looking at the Coach/Scout report) Messi should be able to deliver better crosses.

 

Nevertheless, we aren't able to introduce more than four star colours yet. Therefore, trying to personally adjust the ranges in the best way possible is the only thing we can do. Maybe reducing the starting point for excellent attributes might be an option for you, but in my opinion smaller ranges would reduce the amount of uncertainty that is crucial to this playing style. 

That example was just to spot the problem. The reality is you will get way more same range combos in your team, I will try to play with the numbers.

 

[janitor]

Hey!

Very good job on the skin. I love it!

Although, i tried going back to the vanilla one and everything seemed normal until I went looking for staff members - all of the attributes were missing. Like total blanks, no numbers, no stars, no nothing.

How can this be fixed, except for reinstalling the game ?

[sebastian_starttrbts]

24 minutes ago, janitor said:

Hey!

Very good job on the skin. I love it!

Although, i tried going back to the vanilla one and everything seemed normal until I went looking for staff members - all of the attributes were missing. Like total blanks, no numbers, no stars, no nothing.

How can this be fixed, except for reinstalling the game ?

This is due to the person properties.xml. You'll have to choose the default skin and then restart Football Manager and everything should be fine. 

[janitor]

5 hours ago, sebastian_starttrbts said:

This is due to the person properties.xml. You'll have to choose the default skin and then restart Football Manager and everything should be fine. 

Thanks man..

Simple restart.... I feel dumb for being hasty and not actually thinking before posting..

Cheers!

[sebastian_starttrbts]

*updated March 13th*

Changelog:

• fully removed attributes (and column headers) in Staff/Responsibilities/Advise and Reports
• added information on nation trained in and club trained at to the player profile
• replaced letters with club badges in match score panel
• enabled to access the graphical representation of general performance and stats related to defending, pressing, creativity et cetera directly from the player profile:

 

IMPORTANT:

How to make it work after Downloading:

• Put "StarAttributes" in your skin-folder
• open Football Manager, go to Preferences, choose "StarAttributes" and reload skin -> now player and staff profiles show stars, while the different views still show numeric attributes
• exit Football Manager and reopen for person properties.xml to load
• finally custom views as well as specific player role views show non-numeric attributes

Edited March 12, 2021 by sebastian_starttrbts

[balldoktor81]

Great Work!!! But have your links on the first page been updated? Can't see the changes like in the pics you posted...

 

Update: everything works fine!!! I used Flut's Skin 9.0 so far... it would be fantastic if i could get a mix of both...now i'm missing the Stadiums and City pics....well one can't have everything...

 

Nice Job!

Edited March 13, 2021 by balldoktor81

[sebastian_starttrbts]

11 minutes ago, balldoktor81 said:

Great Work!!! But have your links on the first page been updated? Can't see the changes like in the pics you posted...

They should have been updated. Are you playing in [1920*1080]? On the default laptop view the panels next to the attributes-section aren't visible unless you try to adjust the text and image size.

[balldoktor81]

Gerade eben schrieb sebastian_starttrbts:

They should have been updated. Are you playing in [1920*1080]? On the default laptop view the panels next to the attributes-section aren't visible unless you try to adjust the text and image size.

works fine now  i'm only missing the stadium and city pics, and some other nice things which can be found in Flut's Skin, but now i have to choose between more realism or nice details...well...

[rorizpedro]

guys, hello!! are you guys facing any trouble trying to download the files? it keeps saying that the content is not available to me.

[sebastian_starttrbts]

28 minutes ago, rorizpedro said:

guys, hello!! are you guys facing any trouble trying to download the files? it keeps saying that the content is not available to me.

Hey there, I double-checked and the download should work directly from the top post in this thread, as long as you are signed in. Otherwise there is an option to download it via Google Drive as well. 

And don't forget to follow the instruction on how to make it work properly after downloading, so you can enjoy StarAttributes all the way.

Edited March 14, 2021 by sebastian_starttrbts

[Marinho]

Quick suggestion re: Rating range. Shouldn't it be possible to link it to the "change attribute colour" menu where you, on 'normal' skins can change what constitutes excellent, good, average, poor ? Meaning everybody can chose themselves what values are preferred (and change it when getting promoted for example).

 

EDIT: NVW, you can already. Must have misinterpreted the discussion above

 

Interesting skin, will definitely give it a go on my next save.

Edited March 15, 2021 by Marinho

[sebastian_starttrbts]

24 minutes ago, Marinho said:

Quick suggestion re: Rating range. Shouldn't it be possible to link it to the "change attribute colour" menu where you, on 'normal' skins can change what constitutes excellent, good, average, poor ? Meaning everybody can chose themselves what values are preferred (and change it when getting promoted for example).

 

EDIT: NVW, you can already. Must have misinterpreted the discussion above

 

Interesting skin, will definitely give it a go on my next save.

Thank you for your suggestion concerning this topic.  Yes, you are able to adjust the thresholds in the custom skin-colour section without any problem in-game. So you can define the areas covering an excellent, good, average or low attribute on your personal preferences. But it is not possible to add a fifth section for example in between average and good. 

Feel free to come back and share your thoughts on the StarAttributes-experience anytime. This will help me to improve the skin even more to create the best possible version of it.

Edited March 15, 2021 by sebastian_starttrbts

[thiagoanjo]

Those stars colour are right or it is a bug? 



Btw, I did play a few weeks and a really liked the skin. In order to solve the 5th rating range, I did what @Geoff Newman said, I'm adjusting according with division, if 13 is an excellent number, I put that like the threshold.

[sebastian_starttrbts]

21 minutes ago, thiagoanjo said:

Those stars colour are right or it is a bug? 

Btw, I did play a few weeks and a really liked the skin. In order to solve the 5th rating range, I did what @Geoff Newman said, I'm adjusting according with division, if 13 is an excellent number, I put that like the threshold.

Unfortunately, FM does not consider the attribute ranges in this screen and so far I had to choose between showing the numeric value, removing the number while keeping the column header or showing a red star. But with the last update I was able to fully remove these attributes as well as the column headers, so if you download the new version in the thread's top post, these red stars will disappear.

I'm happy to hear that you enjoyed using the StarAttributes-skin so far and that you found some kind of work-around concerning the rating ranges to create the best possible experience.

Edited March 18, 2021 by sebastian_starttrbts

[thiagoanjo]

2 minutos atrás, sebastian_starttrbts disse:

Unfortunately, FM does not consider the attribute ranges in this screen and until the last update I had to choose between showing the numeric value, removing the number while keeping the column header or showing a red star. But with the last update I was able to fully remove these attributes as well as the column headers, so if you download the new version in the thread's top post, they'll disappear.

I'm happy to hear that you enjoyed using the StarAttributes-skin so far and that you found some kind of work-around concerning the rating ranges to create the best possible experience.

Can I suggest somethings to add to the skin?

1) In order to gain space, you can get rid of the bench list on tactics screen:



Like this:

2) In order to make it more practical, display on player profile Estimated Cost, Estimated Wage, Transf Interest and Loan Interest, also add another (a 3rd) row:



Like I did here:


  

[sebastian_starttrbts]

9 hours ago, thiagoanjo said:

Can I suggest somethings to add to the skin?

1) In order to gain space, you can get rid of the bench list on tactics screen:

2) In order to make it more practical, display on player profile Estimated Cost, Estimated Wage, Transf Interest and Loan Interest, also add another (a 3rd) row:

There's alway room for suggestions, but I'll do my best to stick as close to the default skin as possible, while only removing elements that affect the non-numeric attributes experience like the attribute octagon for example. 

Concerning 1):

Although we'll see the bench players in the team list on the right as well, I don't feel like the bench visualisation is irrelevant. It makes picking your squad way more comfortable and in addition it creates a nice symmetry with the team instructions on the left. So i like it in this place. Removing the information on league table, the club's position etc. might create some space, but there is nothing I could think of replacing it with, so it'll only be a loss of information while not gaining anything (besides space) in my opinion. I guess it is all about removing information that restricts the StarAttributes experience, while not removing any information a player could miss. Keeping it as close to the default skin as possible maintains the opportunity for everybody to adjust it regarding their personal preferences.

 

Concerning 2):

Having information on estimated cost, estimated wage, transfer interest and loan interest available directly on the player profile was something I was thinking about as well. But while trying I only managed to display it on every player profile, while it only adds value on the opponents' player profiles. So we don't need that information for our own players. In addition I considered the pros and cons from the coach/scout reports way more important and thus decided to include them instead. Looking at the player profile, I removed the second row with four small panels on purpose, since it adds some more space I used to increase the player personal details panel (with the player picture) and the attribute section as well. In my opinion this creates a well-arranged player profile.

Edited March 19, 2021 by sebastian_starttrbts

[thiagoanjo]

Spoiler

9 horas atrás, sebastian_starttrbts disse:

There's alway room for suggestions, but I'll do my best to stick as close to the default skin as possible, while only removing elements that affect the non-numeric attributes experience like the attribute octagon for example. 

Concerning 1):

Although we'll see the bench players in the team list on the right as well, I don't feel like the bench visualisation is irrelevant. It makes picking your squad way more comfortable and in addition it creates a nice symmetry with the team instructions on the left. So i like it in this place. Removing the information on league table, the club's position etc. might create some space, but there is nothing I could think of replacing it with, so it'll only be a loss of information while not gaining anything (besides space) in my opinion. I guess it is all about removing information that restricts the StarAttributes experience, while not removing any information a player could miss. Keeping it as close to the default skin as possible maintains the opportunity for everybody to adjust it regarding their personal preferences.

 

Concerning 2):

Having information on estimated cost, estimated wage, transfer interest and loan interest available directly on the player profile was something I was thinking about as well. But while trying I only managed to display it on every player profile, while it only adds value on the opponents' player profiles. So we don't need that information for our own players. In addition I considered the pros and cons from the coach/scout reports way more important and thus decided to include them instead. Looking at the player profile, I removed the second row with four small panels on purpose, since it adds some more space I used to increase the player personal details panel (with the player picture) and the attribute section as well. In my opinion this creates a well-arranged player profile.

 

Oh, I see, at least could you help me adapt it for me?

I just need this:
1) Call Estimated Wage there
2) Decrease the width of Positions panel
3) Decrease the height of Personal details

 

[sebastian_starttrbts]

24 minutes ago, thiagoanjo said:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Oh, I see, at least could you help me adapt it for me?

I just need this:
1) Call Estimated Wage there
2) Decrease the width of Positions panel
3) Decrease the height of Personal details

Yes, I can try:

To display estimated wage and cost, you'll need to insert this into the player personal details panel.xml, but I guess it depends on the container it is located in whether its value really appears:

<!-- Estimated cost -->
	<container id="ecco" width="150" priority="4">
		<layout class="arrange_vertical_attachment" alignment="fill" gap="0" offset="0" />
		<layout class="stick_to_sides_attachment" alignment="horizontal" inset="0" apply_to_children="true" />

		<widget class="label" alignment="left,bottom" font="label" >
			<translation id="text" translation_id="335037" type="use" value="Estimated Cost[COMMENT: scout report panel label]" />
		</widget>
		<widget class="label" id="esco" alignment="left,top" style="semi_bold" />
	</container>

<!-- Wage demands -->
	<container id="wdco" width="150" priority="5">
		<layout class="arrange_vertical_attachment" alignment="fill" gap="0" offset="0" />
		<layout class="stick_to_sides_attachment" alignment="horizontal" inset="0" apply_to_children="true" />

		<widget class="label" alignment="left,bottom" font="label" >
			<translation id="text" translation_id="335516" type="use" value="Wage Demands[COMMENT: scout report panel label]" />
		</widget>
		<widget class="label" id="wade" alignment="left,top" style="semi_bold" />
	</container>

Otherwise you could replace mine with the player personal details panel.xml from the default skin if you don't need the pros and cons that much. -> player personal details panel.xml

 

Concerning 2) and 3) you'll need to adjust these values in the player overview panel, if I remember correctly:

Edited March 19, 2021 by sebastian_starttrbts

[thiagoanjo]

12 horas atrás, sebastian_starttrbts disse:

Concerning 1):

Although we'll see the bench players in the team list on the right as well, I don't feel like the bench visualisation is irrelevant.

I mean, that part is irrelevant (on the pitch) since you can change using the bench on the list at right of the screen. Also Im not trying to remove info below that scree, I just wanna make the list on the right bigger:


 

[thiagoanjo]

And Im having a issue here, the game isnt showing correctly the info from scout report, every time I reload the save, it says the player doesnt have report, but he has, I have to click on report and then back, in order to load the report on overview:



Also it isnt saving my changes on small panels, every time I reload it rolls back, do you know what can I do? I found that id="zzzz"> on small panel container on overview, why did you add this id?

 

[sebastian_starttrbts]

10 hours ago, thiagoanjo said:

I mean, that part is irrelevant (on the pitch) since you can change using the bench on the list at right of the screen. Also Im not trying to remove info below that scree, I just wanna make the list on the right bigger:

 

Quote

Although we'll see the bench players in the team list on the right as well, I don't feel like the bench visualisation is irrelevant. It makes picking your squad way more comfortable and in addition it creates a nice symmetry with the team instructions on the left. So i like it in this place.

Of course it might be an option to increase the width of the list on the right, but I don't feel like we gain that much while giving up the nice symmetry and comfort in picking our match squad. 

 

8 hours ago, thiagoanjo said:

And Im having a issue here, the game isnt showing correctly the info from scout report, every time I reload the save, it says the player doesnt have report, but he has, I have to click on report and then back, in order to load the report on overview:

To be honest, I haven't heard of this problem before and I haven't discovered it while using the skin so far. But I'll keep an eye out for it. It might be due to some configuration in this preference section?

 

8 hours ago, thiagoanjo said:

Also it isnt saving my changes on small panels, every time I reload it rolls back, do you know what can I do? I found that id="zzzz"> on small panel container on overview, why did you add this id?

The id="zzzz" isn't something I added to the panel. Even the default player overview panel you'll get by extracting via the Resource Archiver shows this section:

<!-- Smaller panels -->
	<container class="vertical_adaptive_container" offset="0" inset="0" mode="distribute_equally" draw_horizontal_dividers="true" id="zzzz">
	<global id="gap" name="ui.main_box_gap_vertical"/>
          
	<!-- 4 small panels -->
		(...)

I tried to change the panels in-game as well, saved the game and after reloading everything was the way I adjusted it. So I'm not able to reproduce the issue you described at the moment. 

[thiagoanjo]

Spoiler

18 horas atrás, sebastian_starttrbts disse:

 

Of course it might be an option to increase the width of the list on the right, but I don't feel like we gain that much while giving up the nice symmetry and comfort in picking our match squad. 

 

To be honest, I haven't heard of this problem before and I haven't discovered it while using the skin so far. But I'll keep an eye out for it. It might be due to some configuration in this preference section?

 

The id="zzzz" isn't something I added to the panel. Even the default player overview panel you'll get by extracting via the Resource Archiver shows this section:

<!-- Smaller panels -->
	<container class="vertical_adaptive_container" offset="0" inset="0" mode="distribute_equally" draw_horizontal_dividers="true" id="zzzz">
	<global id="gap" name="ui.main_box_gap_vertical"/>
          
	<!-- 4 small panels -->
		(...)

I tried to change the panels in-game as well, saved the game and after reloading everything was the way I adjusted it. So I'm not able to reproduce the issue you described at the moment. 

 

About Reports I guess is a game bug, It is not saving the report info of free agent players, I have to go to "scout reports", then go back to overview and now it is there the whole info, so weird.

One last question (maybe, lol): can I replace the starts for this? 


 

[sebastian_starttrbts]

6 hours ago, thiagoanjo said:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

About Reports I guess is a game bug, It is not saving the report info of free agent players, I have to go to "scout reports", then go back to overview and now it is there the whole info, so weird.

One last question (maybe, lol): can I replace the starts for this? 

Having the information that it was about free agents, I was able to reproduce the issue you described concerning Scout reports. I tried again using the default FM skin and it happened there as well, therefore I would assume that it might be a FM-issue and no skin-issue I could affect.

 

Using this skin, you can only replace the stars by one (similar) object, changing its colour depending on a certain threshold. So different objects (like these arrows in different angles) for different ranges is not possible as far as I discovered. 

[thiagoanjo]

40 minutos atrás, sebastian_starttrbts disse:

Having the information that it was about free agents, I was able to reproduce the issue you described concerning Scout reports. I tried again using the default FM skin and it happened there as well, therefore I would assume that it might be a FM-issue and no skin-issue I could affect.

 

Using this skin, you can only replace the stars by one (similar) object, changing its colour depending on a certain threshold. So different objects (like these arrows in different angles) for different ranges is not possible as far as I discovered. 

I suspected that, thank you again!

Edit: could we change the colour here? I wish the Leading star background was lighter 


 

Edited March 21, 2021 by thiagoanjo

[Issy]

Hi @sebastian_starttrbts,

Can you tell me what files I need to copy for having the graphical diagram analyse in the TCS skin.

I managed to integrate the stars but not the diagram.

(Of course it is only for personal use)

Thanks.

[sebastian_starttrbts]

8 hours ago, Issy said:

Hi @sebastian_starttrbts,

Can you tell me what files I need to copy for having the graphical diagram analyse in the TCS skin.

I managed to integrate the stars but not the diagram.

(Of course it is only for personal use)

Thanks.

Hey @Issy,

to enable access to the graphical representation of general performance and stats related to defending, pressing, creativity et cetera directly from the player profile, I edited the

- player overview big selector panel.xml (located in panels/player) and the

- data analyst visualisation profile.xml (located in panels/widgets).

After transferring these xml-files (clear cache and reload skin)  you should be able to access the graphical representation in the TCS skin as well, I guess.

[begbarros]

On 19/03/2021 at 16:46, sebastian_starttrbts said:

Yes, I can try:

To display estimated wage and cost, you'll need to insert this into the player personal details panel.xml, but I guess it depends on the container it is located in whether its value really appears:

<!-- Estimated cost -->
	<container id="ecco" width="150" priority="4">
		<layout class="arrange_vertical_attachment" alignment="fill" gap="0" offset="0" />
		<layout class="stick_to_sides_attachment" alignment="horizontal" inset="0" apply_to_children="true" />

		<widget class="label" alignment="left,bottom" font="label" >
			<translation id="text" translation_id="335037" type="use" value="Estimated Cost[COMMENT: scout report panel label]" />
		</widget>
		<widget class="label" id="esco" alignment="left,top" style="semi_bold" />
	</container>

<!-- Wage demands -->
	<container id="wdco" width="150" priority="5">
		<layout class="arrange_vertical_attachment" alignment="fill" gap="0" offset="0" />
		<layout class="stick_to_sides_attachment" alignment="horizontal" inset="0" apply_to_children="true" />

		<widget class="label" alignment="left,bottom" font="label" >
			<translation id="text" translation_id="335516" type="use" value="Wage Demands[COMMENT: scout report panel label]" />
		</widget>
		<widget class="label" id="wade" alignment="left,top" style="semi_bold" />
	</container>

Otherwise you could replace mine with the player personal details panel.xml from the default skin if you don't need the pros and cons that much. -> player personal details panel.xml

 

Concerning 2) and 3) you'll need to adjust these values in the player overview panel, if I remember correctly:

Hi,

it may sound off-topic, but can you explain to me what that bit of code does?

<record id="object_property" get_property="objt" set_property="objt" />

I see it all around but I have no clue about what it means.

Tks

[sebastian_starttrbts]

On 08/04/2021 at 03:46, begbarros said:

Hi,

it may sound off-topic, but can you explain to me what that bit of code does?

<record id="object_property" get_property="objt" set_property="objt" />

I see it all around but I have no clue about what it means.

Tks

Hey @begbarros,

since I am relatively new to skinning I had to play a bit around with that command, trying to identify its impact, but at the moment I honestly don't know what it exactly does. My skin developed mostly via trial and error, so I am anything but an advanced editor.

It has been in the .xml-files I extracted with the Resource Archiver and I did not change anything in these lines, if I remember correctly. So if you're really interested in their impact, you might ask in a more general thread or open an own topic to reach someone more experienced. 

[Richard Bell]

On 13/03/2021 at 15:06, balldoktor81 said:

works fine now  i'm only missing the stadium and city pics, and some other nice things which can be found in Flut's Skin, but now i have to choose between more realism or nice details...well...

i have been working on a project for myself, combining star attributes with flut skins.  I cannot do without backgrounds etc and now also this more realistic way of playing the game.  I couldn't get it to work in all areas but perhaps either flut or the creator of these stars could work on something together because it would make FM epic!!!

I'm working on trying to merge flut 12 skin now with stars, it wrecks my brain as i'm not great at this coding malarkey

[sebastian_starttrbts]

1 hour ago, Richard Bell said:

i have been working on a project for myself, combining star attributes with flut skins.  I cannot do without backgrounds etc and now also this more realistic way of playing the game.  I couldn't get it to work in all areas but perhaps either flut or the creator of these stars could work on something together because it would make FM epic!!!

I'm working on trying to merge flut 12 skin now with stars, it wrecks my brain as i'm not great at this coding malarkey

Trying to transfer StarAttributes into another skin might become a little bit difficult once the "other" skin offers some kind of layout, that deviates from the default one. Most of the attributes are replaced via the person properties.xml, but on some panels I had to manually replace them as well as to move them into the right spot to make them visible. Given there's another layout, my stars might appear behind some panels the editor created and therefore the stars won't be visible. In this situation you would need to edit the other skin's xml-files, trying to manually replace the attribute values in there. 

 

48 minutes ago, Richard Bell said:

where is the download link for the update from march 13th?

You can download the newest version from the thread's top post. I always update the download links in there, so there is only the updated version available. 

[Richard Bell]

5 minutes ago, sebastian_starttrbts said:

Trying to transfer StarAttributes into another skin might become a little bit difficult once the "other" skin offers some kind of layout, that deviates from the default one. Most of the attributes are replaced via the person properties.xml, but on some panels I had to manually replace them as well as to move them into the right spot to make them visible. Given there's another layout, my stars might appear behind some panels the editor created and therefore the stars won't be visible. In this situation you would need to edit the other skin's xml-files, trying to manually replace the attribute values in there. 

 

You can download the newest version from the thread's top post. I always update the download links in there, so there is only the updated version available. 

i thought it would be the case of having to do it manually, thats what i did for flut 9.0 and your stars attributes.  I got it to work in most places with a couple of exceptions.

Why don't you and flut look at a collaboration?  I'd pay you both for it as i'm pretty sure any die hard FM fans who want the game more realistic.  Honestly the results i had were/are epic, but it would be much better done by experts like yourself and flut that is for sure!!

[sebastian_starttrbts]

53 minutes ago, Richard Bell said:

i thought it would be the case of having to do it manually, thats what i did for flut 9.0 and your stars attributes.  I got it to work in most places with a couple of exceptions.

Why don't you and flut look at a collaboration?  I'd pay you both for it as i'm pretty sure any die hard FM fans who want the game more realistic.  Honestly the results i had were/are epic, but it would be much better done by experts like yourself and flut that is for sure!!

For now, there are no plans on doing a collaboration with another skin. Of course there might be some "graphical adjustments" in the future, but at the moment I am focussing on my first real FM21-save, trying to identify any potential room for improvement in this attribute-less concept. Until the last update, I only "enjoyed" FM21 while simulating my save to create StarAttributes. 

In the creation process I decided to stay as close to the default skin as possible and tried to integrate some additions I considered useful for this playing-style, like the graphical representation on the player profile for example. Backgrounds, stadium pictures etc. on the other hand are more or less some kind of personal preferences or a "nice to have", but in my opinion they don't really contribute to the attribute-less experience. In addition, we should always be aware that (almost) all skin editors aren't full-time professionals, doing this for a living and therefore simply do not have the time to start serving any kind of personal preferences. I feel like the effort of merging two totally different skins could be compared to the effort of creating a whole new skin from scratch with lots of trial and error. So I hope you'll be able to relate to my thoughts.

[crazyanimals]

3 hours ago, sebastian_starttrbts said:

For now, there are no plans on doing a collaboration with another skin. Of course there might be some "graphical adjustments" in the future, but at the moment I am focussing on my first real FM21-save, trying to identify any potential room for improvement in this attribute-less concept. Until the last update, I only "enjoyed" FM21 while simulating my save to create StarAttributes. 

In the creation process I decided to stay as close to the default skin as possible and tried to integrate some additions I considered useful for this playing-style, like the graphical representation on the player profile for example. Backgrounds, stadium pictures etc. on the other hand are more or less some kind of personal preferences or a "nice to have", but in my opinion they don't really contribute to the attribute-less experience. In addition, we should always be aware that (almost) all skin editors aren't full-time professionals, doing this for a living and therefore simply do not have the time to start serving any kind of personal preferences. I feel like the effort of merging two totally different skins could be compared to the effort of creating a whole new skin from scratch with lots of trial and error. So I hope you'll be able to relate to my thoughts.

Of course I fully understand where you are coming from. 
I shall just continue to try merge the two creations the best I can. 
Enjoy your save and once again thank you for your stars attribute idea. It is soooo much better than seeing precise numbers. 

[begbarros]

10 hours ago, Richard Bell said:

i have been working on a project for myself, combining star attributes with flut skins.  I cannot do without backgrounds etc and now also this more realistic way of playing the game.  I couldn't get it to work in all areas but perhaps either flut or the creator of these stars could work on something together because it would make FM epic!!!

I'm working on trying to merge flut 12 skin now with stars, it wrecks my brain as i'm not great at this coding malarkey

Yes..I did it as well. I managed to do it.. I also implemented preferred moves views in squad view, removed comparison (mental,physical,...) among competition's teams, removed advanced search (in which we could filter players through numerical attributes in scouting centre, added some statistics panels in flut card (player attributes panel), and some other minor but important adjustments

Edited April 14, 2021 by begbarros

[Richard Bell]

9 hours ago, begbarros said:

Yes..I did it as well. I managed to do it.. I also implemented preferred moves views in squad view, removed comparison (mental,physical,...) among competition's teams, removed advanced search (in which we could filter players through numerical attributes in scouting centre, added some statistics panels in flut card (player attributes panel), and some other minor but important adjustments

Oh wow how on earth did you manage to remove the advanced search? did you manage to replace attribute numbers in favour of the stars in tactics where we choose our set piece takers? So far i think thats the only area i cannot replace the numbers.  I am still yet to test what i have managed to copy over from star attributes into the flut skin

 

[sebastian_starttrbts]

13 minutes ago, Richard Bell said:

Oh wow how on earth did you manage to remove the advanced search? did you manage to replace attribute numbers in favour of the stars in tactics where we choose our set piece takers? So far i think thats the only area i cannot replace the numbers.  I am still yet to test what i have managed to copy over from star attributes into the flut skin

 

Is this the screen you are looking to replace the attribute values in?

This is controlled via the person properties.xml and all the numeric values should be replaced once you properly transfer and load the person properties.xml.

 

And to remove the advanced player/staff search-button you'll have to edit the person search dialog.xml, person search dialog staff.xml and the person search dialog nation.xml-file. At least I used these files to switch the position of advanced and quick search, so via deleting the section you should be able to fully remove the advanced search.

[crazyanimals]

Yeah that’s the set piece section. I’ll take a look in a minute and get back to you. 
I think I’ve done something wrong because when I last did this for Flut skin 9.0 it worked in players and staff. But this time I’m still seeing numbers on staff profile page and also when you go into staff team page and change the drop down box from contact to either mental or physical attributes. I still see numbers there. 
would all this be because of the person properties xml file?

Thank you so so much for taking your time to help and advise. 

[sebastian_starttrbts]

7 minutes ago, crazyanimals said:

Yeah that’s the set piece section. I’ll take a look in a minute and get back to you. 
I think I’ve done something wrong because when I last did this for Flut skin 9.0 it worked in players and staff. But this time I’m still seeing numbers on staff profile page and also when you go into staff team page and change the drop down box from contact to either mental or physical attributes. I still see numbers there. 
would all this be because of the person properties xml file?

Thank you so so much for taking your time to help and advise. 

I would recommend you to transfer the properties folder with the person properties.xml first, chose your skin as the active one and then restart Football Manager, so the person properties.xml is able to show its effect. Then you should have a look and take notes, in which areas the numbers are replaced, and in which areas there is still some adjustment needed. This way it might be easier to tackle the respective section and if needed formulate the right question in the general section of the Skinning Hideout. If I remember correctly there are still some panels left, you'll need to manually replace the attribute values and/or you'll have to adjust the stars position to make them fully visible. 

Afterwards you could try to transfer the data I edited, while taking notes whether there are any xml-files already edited by the creator of the other skin. To not destroy the other skin's layout you would have to manually transfer the relevant information from my xml-file to the other skin's xml-file. That's what I meant by describing the process as "creating a whole new skin". It's a lot of trial and error.

[Richard Bell]

17 minutes ago, sebastian_starttrbts said:

I would recommend you to transfer the properties folder with the person properties.xml first, chose your skin as the active one and then restart Football Manager, so the person properties.xml is able to show its effect. Then you should have a look and take notes, in which areas the numbers are replaced, and in which areas there is still some adjustment needed. This way it might be easier to tackle the respective section and if needed formulate the right question in the general section of the Skinning Hideout. If I remember correctly there are still some panels left, you'll need to manually replace the attribute values and/or you'll have to adjust the stars position to make them fully visible. 

Afterwards you could try to transfer the data I edited, while taking notes whether there are any xml-files already edited by the creator of the other skin. To not destroy the other skin's layout you would have to manually transfer the relevant information from my xml-file to the other skin's xml-file. That's what I meant by describing the process as "creating a whole new skin". It's a lot of trial and error.

that is awesome, it has worked.  However i cannot find the  person search dialog.xml, person search dialog staff.xml and the person search dialog nation.xml-files you mentioned.

 

[Tyburn]

They’ll be in the “stars” skin person folder.

[Richard Bell]

1 hour ago, Tyburn said:

They’ll be in the “stars” skin person folder.

all i have in the downloaded stars file under person is in the image below.  Am i missing something? 

[sebastian_starttrbts]

52 minutes ago, Richard Bell said:

all i have in the downloaded stars file under person is in the image below.  Am i missing something? 

They should be located in the panels/dialogs-folder.

[Richard Bell]

3 hours ago, sebastian_starttrbts said:

They should be located in the panels/dialogs-folder.

sweet mate that has worked a treat!

only place i have found no stars showing is in the image below, not sure why it is displaying 1's?

 

Player pop up attribute numbers are still showing, i'm not sure what coding to change and what to enter for stars to show.  I think the xml file is player overview popup panel

inbox assistant managers player training report appears to be displaying numbers, puzzled what this could be.

Edited April 14, 2021 by Richard Bell
more info and image added