"The new DRM will ruin the game!"

[philly_flyer10]

You've gotten your shorts all shattied up over something that in reality will not be seen as anything other than part of the install, and the very people who instigated all the protest against Spore were the people who will have cracked it anyway.

Nowhere is the cry more full than in the houses of those trying to breach the very security about which you complain.

Online activation annoys the pirates, it's not as easy as hacking an exe and they've done a damn good job of panicking people into thinking it's bad on merit, when in reality it is not.

Yeah so Spore and Bioshock has issues with activation, but those issues were despite all the anit-DRM fuss made MONTHS before launch and they both sold incredibly well which somewhat negates your point.

completely wrong, it was the people who bought the game that were affected, the people who pirated it got a clean copy.

Online activation takes no longer to crack than a cd check so youre wrong there again. Pirates will be more relaxed than anyone because they know they will get a clean copy, only the people who bought the game will be affect, this is why people hate DRM but that seems to go straight over your head.

[Interloper]

Online activation annoys the pirates, it's not as easy as hacking an exe and they've done a damn good job of panicking people into thinking it's bad on merit, when in reality it is not.

It doesnt annoy the pirates but whoever sits at home cracking game in their moms basements, they dont have a life anyway so taking a hour more away from them cracking the online activation doesnt mean anything... Spore for example the most newly released game that had you activating online ( I think ? ) just skipped the step where it told you to activate online... Yes the pirated version didnt even have it it.

Activation online is a pain in the ass but what is more is the limit of installs i keep hearing about, i sure hope that isnt true because then i wont even think about buying it, limiting my installs are probably legal but it ****es me off enough for me not to buy it, not going to call to SI and beg for more installs not to mention they probably dont even have a support line here in this country so i would have to pay a big ****ing phone bill to call them.

[AJ1]

I didn't report you because another member agreed with you...if someone agrees with you then great! I reported you because I was suspicious that another member agreed with you and he joined today and I suspected that to be you, its got nothing to do with anything about someone agreeing with your post.

He lowered the tone, not me. Thanks for agreeing with me.

You are in the wrong because you have been presumptious enough to assume that we care.

You've gotten your shorts all shattied up over something that in reality will not be seen as anything other than part of the install, and the very people who instigated all the protest against Spore were the people who will have cracked it anyway.

Nowhere is the cry more full than in the houses of those trying to breach the very security about which you complain.

Online activation annoys the pirates, it's not as easy as hacking an exe and they've done a damn good job of panicking people into thinking it's bad on merit, when in reality it is not.

Yeah so Spore and Bioshock has issues with activation, but those issues were despite all the anit-DRM fuss made MONTHS before launch and they both sold incredibly well which somewhat negates your point.

Yeah people who download the cracked versions will have a much easier time than they will, the very measures that SI/SEGA are introducing stop us playing the game, stop us from making a backup, stop us from installing as many times as we would like.

Its not going to do a damn thing to piracy, I for one will not buy it, nor will others, they will simply download it without the DRM.

The fundamental choice is this, do you want to support a company in giving them your money, and in return them restricting how, when, where you can play your game?

I certainly dont, thats why im not buying it, hundreds of thousands did the same with spore they downloaded it, Im very sorry to say that many will be downloading the DRM Free version of Football Manager 2009 - Just to prove a point.

They wont even come here and protest it, knowing they cant really facilitate change in the ranks of the power hungry SI Towers/SEGA Monolith, so they will simply and quietly download the game and enjoy the DRM free bliss.

[Navie]

completely wrong, it was the people who bought the game that were affected, the people who pirated it got a clean copy.

Online activation takes no longer to crack than a cd check so youre wrong there again. Pirates will be more relaxed than anyone because they know they will get a clean copy, only the people who bought the game will be affect, this is why people hate DRM but that seems to go straight over your head.

So just because someone has armour piercing bullets means you won't wear any armour?

[AJ1]

^^ Report him, that is clearly jod in disguise

I Agree +1 for Report!

[ross21soccer]

It would be nice to have some constructive posts guys. I think a dedicated thread like this (and the few others) is a great way to defend your points. But getting into personal arguments will get this thread closed.

I for one want SI/SEGA to see threads like this and think about how there choices affect the legitimate customer. I have decided to cancel my preorder of the game. Although if the price dropped or my Tesco clubcard vouchers come through (LMAO) then i'll buy it for the knocked down price.

I stick by my guns when it seems that we would be getting a poorer game than the pirates would (sounding like a parrot now - apologies)

[kennhyl]

forgive my ignorance but what exactly is DRM??

[AJ1]

Football Manager 2009 "DRM" Edition - £29.99

Football Manager 2009 "DRM-FREE" Edition - £00.00

Number of people stopped playing DRM Edition - Lots

Number of people stopped playing DRM-FREE edition - None

DRM-Free Edition Wins!

[Navie]

I Agree +1 for Report!

Now you are being...silly.

[Navie]

forgive my ignorance but what exactly is DRM??

'Digital Rights Management' if i'm correct

[AJ1]

forgive my ignorance but what exactly is DRM??

DRM = Digital Rights Management

It installs "secret" software on your PC to manage and control how and when you play the game.

If you buy FM09 you have to "activate" it with Sports Interactive over the internet before you can play it.

If you install the game more than 5 times, you have to ring Sports Interactive and BEG for a CD Key to reinstall the game - so keep your receipt! (you've been warned)

[jod123]

I Agree +1 for Report!

What are you on about? :confused: Will you please stop this nonsense?

[philly_flyer10]

So just because someone has armour piercing bullets means you won't wear any armour?

Not comparable at all armour protects the person using it while DRM restricts the person using it.

[kennhyl]

cheers. so when i buy the game on friday, will i have to activate it myself online or will it be activated automatically once i put the cd in?

[Indi75]

To begin with your posts were good even though I might not have agreed but now it is different.

To be fair that bottom part of your post above applies to you. If he made a mistake fair enough, but you are the one that is acting immature.

Well said, couldn't agree more

Motion seconded. Defence rest m'lud.

[jod123]

It would be nice to have some constructive posts guys. I think a dedicated thread like this (and the few others) is a great way to defend your points. But getting into personal arguments will get this thread closed.

I for one want SI/SEGA to see threads like this and think about how there choices affect the legitimate customer. I have decided to cancel my preorder of the game. Although if the price dropped or my Tesco clubcard vouchers come through (LMAO) then i'll buy it for the knocked down price.

I stick by my guns when it seems that we would be getting a poorer game than the pirates would (sounding like a parrot now - apologies)

Spot on with your first paragraph.

[ross21soccer]

Yes Navie, you are correct http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_rights_management

[AJ1]

DRM = Rusty Armour

[AJ1]

cheers. so when i buy the game on friday, will i have to activate it myself online or will it be activated automatically once i put the cd in?

Activate Yourself

Remember your 5 Installs

[ross21soccer]

cheers. so when i buy the game on friday, will i have to activate it myself online or will it be activated automatically once i put the cd in?

You will have to activate your game via online or over the phone.

[Navie]

Not comparable at all armour protects the person using it while DRM restricts the person using it.

DRM restricts the person using it? So if I buy FM I can't use it at all (play FM)?

[Come Clarity]

Activate Yourself

Remember your 5 Installs

Did you have a bad experience with DRM as a young child or something?

I've purchased a couple of games with far stricter DRM - eLicense.

Tell you what, I've never had a problem with it...

[AJ1]

You will have to activate your game via online or over the phone.

I hope SEGA/SI have taken on more staff otherwise there will be a Queue.

SEGA/SI "Please hold while we connect you to DRM Headquarters"

SEGA/SI "Please Enter The CD Key of the Game"

SEGA/SI "Im Sorry But I Didnt Recognise That Key, Please Hold While We Connect You To A DRM Agent Who Can Make Your Problem Harder To Resolve"

Customer "Hi Im Trying To Activate My Game Please, Ive Just Purchased It"

SEGA/SI"Im Sorry Sir But We Dont Believe You Purchased The Game, Good Bye"

[Navie]

Yes Navie, you are correct http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_rights_management

Thanks for that

[Come Clarity]

I hope SEGA/SI have taken on more staff otherwise there will be a Queue.

SEGA/SI "Please hold while we connect you to DRM Headquarters"

SEGA/SI "Please Enter The CD Key of the Game"

SEGA/SI "Im Sorry But I Didnt Recognise That Key, Please Hold While We Connect You To A DRM Agent Who Can Make Your Problem Harder To Resolve"

Customer "Hi Im Trying To Activate My Game Please, Ive Just Purchased It"

SEGA/SI"Im Sorry Sir But We Dont Believe You Purchased The Game, Good Bye"

I've read some crap posted on the forums in my time, but wow - just wow.

[Interloper]

Did you have a bad experience with DRM as a young child or something?

I've purchased a couple of games with far stricter DRM - eLicense.

Tell you what, I've never had a problem with it...

Well i think i can speak for AJ1 as he is my own split personality so no i did... I did only a month ago and many times before that with :

Spore

Half life 2

Bioshock

Where they wouldnt activate at release date because servers were busy, other than that i had problems with securom and its rollercoaster tycoon security that for some reason refused to let me play it because i installed another game with a newer copy of securom that for some reason made rollercoaster tycoon expansion now work anymore.

If you can activate the game over phone and not actually have to download a file i doubt it wont be cracked before release anyway.

[AJ1]

Did you have a bad experience with DRM as a young child or something?

No i just hate it!

Its the principal of it all.

Im not going to financially support a company that wants to ruin my game experience.

[Indi75]

Did you have a bad experience with DRM as a young child or something?

I've purchased a couple of games with far stricter DRM - eLicense.

Tell you what, I've never had a problem with it...

Exactly the reality, albeit some would rather the forum break out into hysteria.

There's a pile of stuff due to come out next year that's got much heavier duty DRM, and guess what? Most people won't notice.

[Navie]

I hope SEGA/SI have taken on more staff otherwise there will be a Queue.

SEGA/SI "Please hold while we connect you to DRM Headquarters"

SEGA/SI "Please Enter The CD Key of the Game"

SEGA/SI "Im Sorry But I Didnt Recognise That Key, Please Hold While We Connect You To A DRM Agent Who Can Make Your Problem Harder To Resolve"

Customer "Hi Im Trying To Activate My Game Please, Ive Just Purchased It"

SEGA/SI"Im Sorry Sir But We Dont Believe You Purchased The Game, Good Bye"

Your trolling in my opinion, you should really stop this.

[philly_flyer10]

DRM restricts the person using it? So if I buy FM I can't use it at all (play FM)?

So you think theres no restrictions at all with DRM?

[AJ1]

Exactly the reality, albeit some would rather the forum break out into hysteria.

There's a pile of stuff due to come out next year that's got much heavier duty DRM, and guess what? Most people won't notice.

Guess what else?

They wont sell very well.

[ross21soccer]

DRM restricts the person using it? So if I buy FM I can't use it at all (play FM)?

Probably not. Maybe 1000's of people will have trouble free gaming. But what about the few who exceed the 5 installs and have to bend over backwards to sort it out, and the few who have problems directly linked to the DRM. It will happen and we may not care as long as we are ok but what if one of those users were me or you?

[philly_flyer10]

I've read some crap posted on the forums in my time, but wow - just wow.

Ive read about other companies not believing someone has bought the game or theyve reached the limit of activations and were refused any more leaving them with a game they cannot play. Its not that far off whats happened to some people.

[Interloper]

Exactly the reality, albeit some would rather the forum break out into hysteria.

There's a pile of stuff due to come out next year that's got much heavier duty DRM, and guess what? Most people won't notice.

Try looking up spore on amazon and see the user reviews... People reading reviews/buying on online shops with user reviews will notice... Spore has a average of 1.something because of the drm.

Ive read about other companies not believing someone has bought the game or theyve reached the limit of activations and were refused any more leaving them with a game they cannot play. Its not that far off whats happened to some people.

Yup EA you have to beg for mercy on your legally owned copy to get more installs.

[Come Clarity]

So having to wait 24 hours longer to play a game is worth throwing a strop about...

Again, wow.

[Come Clarity]

Spore has a average of 1.something because of the drm.

Sensationalist pre-adolescents with far too much time on their hands.

[jod123]

Probably not. Maybe 1000's of people will have trouble free gaming. But what about the few who exceed the 5 installs and have to bend over backwards to sort it out, and the few who have problems directly linked to the DRM. It will happen and we may not care as long as we are ok but what if one of those users were me or you?

But as I already said it the vast majority of people (probably almost all) will not be affected by this. How many people will have their computer go bust 5 times. I think that is highly unlikely.

[AJ1]

Its entirely up to each individual, do they want DRM in their gaming life or not?

I personally dont, therefore i wont be purchasing the game, i will not financially support any organisation that wants to implement DRM into their games in this manner. Im all for them protecting their content, but not like this.

CD Keys did just fine thankyou very much, did they stop piracy? No! - Will this new DRM stop piracy? No it will make it worse, and force people to look for the DRM Free Version of the Game, I know which one ill be installing on launch day.

DRM should really stand for Digital Reckless Management

Its approved at the highest level, by goons who havent got a clue, who think that oh look we haz activiationz now so the internets will fold to our willz and buy our gamez lotz yes!

Clearly not.

Piracy is here, Football Manager 2009 is going to be released DRM Free - Thank God!

[Navie]

So you think theres no restrictions at all with DRM?

To me there ain't because I know 5 installs are enough, 3 would be enough for me and for the activation thing...i'll do it via Steam, I appreciate the whole DRM thing because piracy is criminal.

[Interloper]

So having to wait 24 hours longer to play a game is worth throwing a strop about...

Again, wow.

It is worth being angry over but you also somehow didnt respond to my other part of the post (i guess why...) with only 5 installs, i change computer hardware often, format my harddrive often and what should i do when i install fm09 for the 6 time ? I already installed fm08 atleast 5 times on my laptop when i went to the us and once again when i formatted it and on my normal computer i sit with now atleast sometimes too.

To me there ain't because I know 5 installs are enough, 3 would be enough for me and for the activation thing...i'll do it via Steam, I appreciate the whole DRM thing because piracy is criminal.

Thing is the pirates dont even have that page of the installation where it says activate your product.

[Navie]

Its entirely up to each individual, do they want DRM in their gaming life or not?

I personally dont, therefore i wont be purchasing the game, i will not financially support any organisation that wants to implement DRM into their games in this manner. Im all for them protecting their content, but not like this.

CD Keys did just fine thankyou very much, did they stop piracy? No! - Will this new DRM stop piracy? No it will make it worse, and force people to look for the DRM Free Version of the Game, I know which one ill be installing on launch day.

DRM should really stand for Digital Reckless Management

Its approved at the highest level, by goons who havent got a clue, who think that oh look we haz activiationz now so the internets will fold to our willz and buy our gamez lotz yes!

Clearly not.

Piracy is here, Football Manager 2009 is going to be released DRM Free - Thank God!

And do you plan on getting your hands on one of them pirate copies?

[philly_flyer10]

Sensationalist pre-adolescents with far too much time on their hands.

I cant tell you havent read them, they are well thought out arguments, certainly much better than your post.

[saulty2805]

Its entirely up to each individual, do they want DRM in their gaming life or not?

I personally dont, therefore i wont be purchasing the game, i will not financially support any organisation that wants to implement DRM into their games in this manner. Im all for them protecting their content, but not like this.

CD Keys did just fine thankyou very much, did they stop piracy? No! - Will this new DRM stop piracy? No it will make it worse, and force people to look for the DRM Free Version of the Game, I know which one ill be installing on launch day.

DRM should really stand for Digital Reckless Management

Its approved at the highest level, by goons who havent got a clue, who think that oh look we haz activiationz now so the internets will fold to our willz and buy our gamez lotz yes!

Clearly not.

Piracy is here, Football Manager 2009 is going to be released DRM Free - Thank God!

I must say, im far from an expert on anything, or have i taken much notice to anything you have said .. but i feel your little plee for a DRM free game touched me in places i don't want to be touched .. Quite Pathetic tbf, if your not going to buy the game because of the DRM then don't buy it, personally idc what you do

[ross21soccer]

But as I already said it the vast majority of people (probably almost all) will not be affected by this. How many people will have their computer go bust 5 times. I think that is highly unlikely.

Well as said before if your PC busts and you need to unistall you will still have your number of installs back. BUT....even if its a few paying customers who have the problems then sureley that would be a few too many?

So I do agree that the vast majority may not have any problems, I still do not like parting with my money for a product that is limited.

[Indi75]

Try looking up spore on amazon and see the user reviews... People reading reviews/buying on online shops with user reviews will notice... Spore has a average of 1.something because of the drm.

Yup EA you have to beg for mercy on your legally owned copy to get more installs.

Amazon's Bestsellers updated hourly

Spore still in the top 10 sellers, argument null and void. Thanks for trying tho.

Oh, and look, there's FM too? Shocker considering noones buying it according to you lot.

[Come Clarity]

Its entirely up to each individual, do they want DRM in their gaming life or not?

I personally dont, therefore i wont be purchasing the game, i will not financially support any organisation that wants to implement DRM into their games in this manner. Im all for them protecting their content, but not like this.

CD Keys did just fine thankyou very much, did they stop piracy? No! - Will this new DRM stop piracy? No it will make it worse, and force people to look for the DRM Free Version of the Game, I know which one ill be installing on launch day.

DRM should really stand for Digital Reckless Management

Its approved at the highest level, by goons who havent got a clue, who think that oh look we haz activiationz now so the internets will fold to our willz and buy our gamez lotz yes!

Clearly not.

Piracy is here, Football Manager 2009 is going to be released DRM Free - Thank God!

In the days before broadband, anyone with an ounce of logic will have been able to see how for 99% of the population, CD-Key and Disk checks would have been effective.

So the industry had to diversify.

You have to remember, 99% of SIs customer base will have no idea what a torrent is, or a no-CD patch. It won't affect them - it'll be another hoop that they may have been increasingly used to jumping through in recent years. Most will be happy to do as they're told and not complain.

I won't be purchasing FM09, at release anyway. However it doesn't mean I find the need to spout sensationalist crap over the internet.

[jod123]

It is worth being angry over but you also somehow didnt respond to my other part of the post (i guess why...) with only 5 installs, i change computer hardware often, format my harddrive often and what should i do when i install fm09 for the 6 time ? I already installed fm08 atleast 5 times on my laptop when i went to the us and once again when i formatted it and on my normal computer i sit with now atleast sometimes too.

Thing is the pirates dont even have that page of the installation where it says activate your product.

When you uninstall the game you get an uninstall back. I would go as far as say the average gamer will have no need to install the game 5 times. The only way I can see you will possibly be limited if you want to install the game on 5 PC's for whatever reason.

[AJ1]

To me there ain't because I know 5 installs are enough, 3 would be enough for me and for the activation thing...i'll do it via Steam, I appreciate the whole DRM thing because piracy is criminal.

it doesnt mean its enough for everybody else though does it!!

Just because it works for you doesnt mean its a pain in the ass for the rest of us.

We actually reinstall our operating system/change hardware/lose HD's/Upgrade HD's/Install Driver Updates

All of these things can wipe out our PC without giving us the chance to "Uninstall" the game first you *** **** ****!

Youre really irritating me, "oh but it works for me so its fine" you clearly have no intellectual ability to comprehend any aspect of the argument we are putting across.

We dont want DRM in the damn game at all! I dont care if the thing gives me 100 installs and a chocolate bar - I Do Not Want It In A Game Im Paying Money For!!

I Buy It - I Want To Play It When I Want - Not When SI/SEGA Say I Can!

Take DRM Out of the Game and everyone is happy.

Leave DRM in the game, customers become annoyed, dont buy the game, and download it without the DRM.

So who wins?

The customer.

They do what they want to do.

If it means not buying the game and downloading it, to get it without the DRM, then i think many people will.

[Indi75]

Its entirely up to each individual, do they want DRM in their gaming life or not?

I personally dont, therefore i wont be purchasing the game, i will not financially support any organisation that wants to implement DRM into their games in this manner. Im all for them protecting their content, but not like this.

CD Keys did just fine thankyou very much, did they stop piracy? No! - Will this new DRM stop piracy? No it will make it worse, and force people to look for the DRM Free Version of the Game, I know which one ill be installing on launch day.

DRM should really stand for Digital Reckless Management

Its approved at the highest level, by goons who havent got a clue, who think that oh look we haz activiationz now so the internets will fold to our willz and buy our gamez lotz yes!

Clearly not.

Piracy is here, Football Manager 2009 is going to be released DRM Free - Thank God!

That'sthe second time in this thread you've advocated piracy. Time you were banned I think.

*reported for breach of forum rules.

[philly_flyer10]

To me there ain't because I know 5 installs are enough, 3 would be enough for me and for the activation thing...i'll do it via Steam, I appreciate the whole DRM thing because piracy is criminal.

and the other thing they are bringing in via drm (not SI though) is a forum ban = lose access to all your games. Are you happy with that? Would you accept that if a smaller brother or sister used your account to get you banned?