dheathcote Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Hi, I was looking for some advice on the best way to develop my 18 to 21 year olds especially the ones ive bought to the club and want to keep at the club to gain homegrown status if possible. How many games should they be playing? Does being on the bench mean anything to them etc Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purefun Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Best for GD. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dheathcote Posted November 21, 2012 Author Share Posted November 21, 2012 Best for GD. yer was unsure on that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mixmkz Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I found that even if you play them a lot their rate of growth doesn't speed up accordingly, so for youth I just have them trained to 18 and if their stats are really good I usually loan them to a domestic club or put them on my first team. In my first team I let them have a go in the early cup rounds, stick them on as last 10 min subs when I am winning easily or losing terribly. After doing this through most of my season the youths usually reach 2.5 or 3 stars by 20 ~ 21 years old. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tajj 7 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 From my experience just play them as much as you can. First team football is better than reserve team football. Don't give them 2 minutes though at the end of the game, give them at least 20 minutes as a sub, get them into lower cup games, start them against teams you are expected to win easily against, start them in games where you have already progrssed (like remaining champions league group games or end of season league games where you have already won the league etc). Also get them a tutor. For example I have James Ward-Prowse in my Southampton save, he starts the game 17 is only rated 1 star CA. He probably had about 5-6 starts and dozen or so sub appearances first season. Next two seasons about double that. By my fifth season he was a first team regular at 21 and was 4 star rated CA with some more potential to go. Now at 23 he's close to looking like Iniesta and is worth over £20 million. Games, Games and more Games and a good tutor to get their determination up and get a more professional personality. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricey Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I seem to remeber a thread from a year or two back that went into great detail on how youth develop. Some things I remeber are .... A player needs to been given a match rating at the end of a match to actually get anything out of the experience. Therefore, if you bring a lad on with two minutes to go, he is unlikely to get a match rating and it would be a wasted exercise. I dont know how long a player must be on the field to get a match rating but it cant be hard to find out. For a player to develop, he needs game time at the best level appropriate. He also needs to have decent match ratings. So if a player at say Liverpool goes on loan to a club in the Blue Square North and gets poor rmatch ratings there, it will be unlikely that he will gain much. In the same vein, if you bring a youngster on as a Liverpool sub in the prem and he gets a 5.5 rating, he wont gain much. Also, training is important as far as where you want him to improve is concerned. When we had sliders for individual aspects of training before, it was possible to up a playerrs tactics training for example and see his relevant stats go up. This meant you could specifically steer stat increases into specific sets of attributes. Knowing this, and being able to use it, would mean that you could prevent a player using valueable CA points in the wrong attributes that would be useless to him considering his best position/roll. Its a bit more complicated than that obviously but its a very important part of development and should be researched in the tactis/training forums. Im not sure how this works now considering the changes to training, as Ive not had time to look into it. Player development is hugely affected by certain attributes, some of them hidden. Its commonly thought that determination is very important. Some said work rate is important, high work rate= high effort in training etc, although I'm not sure about that. The hiiden stat ambition is also considered important. Some people tend to get bogged down with all this CA/PA stuff. I have experience in previous FM's where a player with moderate PA/CA played way above himself consistantly because he has stats in the right attributes. I had a CB in FM11 who for years was the best CB in the premiership despite having a very average CA for the level. He had excellent hidden stats (As I found out on the forums) which made him very professional, loyal and dedicated. So when trying to develop a player, consider tutoring carefully to raise the hidden stats and research how to force any rises in CA points into the right attributes. Also give them roll's in the team that suit them. Its also relevant to remember that some players are so good, they will develop fast without too much interference from managers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dheathcote Posted November 21, 2012 Author Share Posted November 21, 2012 Awesome advice guys, got all my 18 to 21 year olds who show potential being tutored and the ones who currently look closest to the 1st team in terms of ability and age are all playing 1 in 4 games roughly which is a good count considering my team has about 70 fixtures a year if I stay in cups Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackter Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Find one with high potential and play them whenever you can. The higher their determination, the better they'll develop.* If their determination is rubbish, tutor them until it's not. *not strictly true as other attributes matter as well, but as they're hidden attributes, determination is all you have to go on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipknot67 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Find one with high potential and play them whenever you can.The higher their determination, the better they'll develop.* If their determination is rubbish, tutor them until it's not. *not strictly true as other attributes matter as well, but as they're hidden attributes, determination is all you have to go on. Not entirely, there was a thread around a while back that went into a lot of detail about information you could get from a players media handling style coupled with his personality. Was quite an eye opener as to how much info can be learned from these two pieces of info and how they can be used to good effect in shaping the hidden attributes of your young players. If I come across the thread again I'll link it here but I found it by complete accident in the first place. Edit.. Managed to find it again, here it is. http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/307808-The-Ultimate-Personality-Media-Handling-Guide Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackter Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 While true, that's so much more bother than I can every be bothered going to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipknot67 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 While true, that's so much more bother than I can every be bothered going to. I know what you mean, I had a go at using it and achieved little more than a severe headache.:o Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackter Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Only crazy people look into that much detail. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dheathcote Posted November 21, 2012 Author Share Posted November 21, 2012 1 Year after signing them I just had 2 regens picked for the england team at the 2016 European Championships, They are aged 19 and 18 and before this they had 0 Caps between them and only 16 caps at U21 level. 18yr Old MC/DM played 16 games for me in the season, 6 were starts, 1 goal 2 assists, average rating 6.98 I was very surprised at him getting the call. 19yr Old AMC/MC/ST 18 games, 9 starts 3 goals and 3 assists average rating 7.06. Both have CA of 1 and a half stars. This is while at Man Utd so I assume it is down to them playing for the Prem Champions but would like to think its the england manager putting his faith in them as they have some amazing attributes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siven Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Is there a difference between the 2 tutoring options for determination increase? Had Hargreaves (great tutor IMO) tutor Adryan using the bottom option (under your wing and mentor him off the field) but his determination never increased? Does only the top option increase determination? Had same happen with Gerrard and Sterling......bottom option as i didnt want sterling to learn shoot often from range etc and his determination didnt increase, yet when i used the top tutor option (improve his game) when having Carra tutor Coates and Wilson they both had their determination increase. Am i seeing the right thing happen or is it just random? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Determination and work rate has nothing to do with development of youngsters. It is affected by hidden attributes professionalism and ambition. The difference between the tutoring options is that 1st option (improve his game) teaches PPMs while the other (take him under your wings) only affects the personality of the youngster.I am sure it is more detailed than that but i think this is the main idea. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dking Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Determination and work rate has nothing to do with development of youngsters. It is affected by hidden attributes professionalism and ambition. The difference between the tutoring options is that 1st option (improve his game) teaches PPMs while the other (take him under your wings) only affects the personality of the youngster.I am sure it is more detailed than that but i think this is the main idea. Where did you get that information from? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 http://www.thedugout.net/community/showthread.php?t=67502 The research here suggest that it has nothing to the with player's development. Also descriptions of said attributes in the official manual only mentions their affects on the pitch. The higher the determination and work rate the harder a player will work on the pitch. You need high levels of professionalism and ambition for him to work hard off the pitch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipknot67 Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Determination and work rate has nothing to do with development of youngsters. It is affected by hidden attributes professionalism and ambition. The difference between the tutoring options is that 1st option (improve his game) teaches PPMs while the other (take him under your wings) only affects the personality of the youngster.I am sure it is more detailed than that but i think this is the main idea. Determination and work rate whilst not important in regards to the potential outcome of tutoring I can assure you are very important attributes to try to make your young players have as high as possible. A 200pa 20 determination 20 work rate youngster is far more likely to reach his pa than a 200 pa 5 determination 5 work rate young player due to the way it impacts their attitude both during matches and in training. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al_Pacino Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 In my first team I let them have a go in the early cup rounds, stick them on as last 10 min subs when I am winning easily or losing terribly. This is pretty much what I do, plus get them tutored by a senior/key player with excellent mental attributes... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipknot67 Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 http://www.thedugout.net/community/showthread.php?t=67502The research here suggest that it has nothing to the with player's development. Also descriptions of said attributes in the official manual only mentions their affects on the pitch. The higher the determination and work rate the harder a player will work on the pitch. You need high levels of professionalism and ambition for him to work hard off the pitch. I posted my last reply before this post had showed on the page for me. There are too many factors involved for anything conclusive to be taken from that experiment in regards to the importance of one attribute to player development, the fact that (as the poster of the experiment mentions himself) the players are at clubs with fairly basic training facilities for one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 I have searched the internet and read many guides on the subject and I haven't found anything neither in those articles nor in my own experience that suggest determination and work rate has other afffects other than those that are mentioned in the manual. Both are very important attributes but I don't think they have any affect off the pitch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipknot67 Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 I have searched the internet and read many guides on the subject and I haven't found anything neither in those articles nor in my own experience that suggest determination and work rate has other afffects other than those that are mentioned in the manual. Both are very important attributes but I don't think they have any affect off the pitch. The amount of attribute increases seen in training are decided by a players rating when playing, so a more determined player with a higher work rate getting higher ratings on the pitch is going to be more likely to improve as a player then a low determination low work rate player who doesn't perform to the best of his ability in games. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Yes of course but same can be said about attributes like finishing, passing, tackling etc. as they affect player's performance. What I am saying is that those 2 attributes do not have a direct affect on level of training. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipknot67 Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Yes of course but same can be said about attributes like finishing, passing, tackling etc. as they affect player's performae. What I am saying is that those 2 attributes do not have a direct affect on level of trainingnc. Well to be fair what you said initially was that they have no effect on how a young player develops at all which is entirely different to saying they have no effect on his actual training. Determination and work rate has nothing to do with development of youngsters Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Yeah, wording was technically wrong What I meant was they don't have any direct affect off the pitch that will make youngsters develop faster. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.