DLP suggestions ? and why their low grade?

Hi, Can someone post some suggestions of promising young players that could succeed in the MC DLP role? (Not Samper )

I have tried some different players but no standouts. Even if they are good they simply cant get a good grade in that role (unless they score or assist which of course doesnt happen to often)

Is there a bug that im not aware of that makes DLP´s have lower grade than the rest of the team or is the players i have tried not good enough for that role?

I now have Kimmich in that role and he is brilliant i think but still very seldom gets over a 6.8 grade.

Hi, Can someone post some suggestions of promising young players that could succeed in the MC DLP role? (Not Samper )

I have tried some different players but no standouts. Even if they are good they simply cant get a good grade in that role (unless they score or assist which of course doesnt happen to often)

Is there a bug that im not aware of that makes DLP´s have lower grade than the rest of the team or is the players i have tried not good enough for that role?

I now have Kimmich in that role and he is brilliant i think but still very seldom gets over a 6.8 grade.

If you think he's brilliant then why worry about average rating?

What a DLP does is generally unsexy & not conducive to big ratings.

High ratings come from assists, goals, key passes, not from just being great at retaining possession. It's been like this forever.

Just check what he should be doing for you, (making passes, the odd tackle, the odd header, the off interception) & that he's doing a high percentage job in those areas and be happy. If he's not doing that stuff well then look elsewhere.

Because then something is wrong with the grades, if brilliant players do everything that requires of them for that role and doing it well and only get a 6.8 rating mostly. Are this common knowledge? i find it frustrating when its not in line when rest of the teams grades. Show me a great DLP and il show you some miserable grades

Julian Wiegel (Dortmund) is a great DLP at either DMC or CM. Very young with great scope for potential.

Thanks mate! ill have a look

Because then something is wrong with the grades, if brilliant players do everything that requires of them for that role and doing it well and only get a 6.8 rating mostly. Are this common knowledge? i find it frustrating when its not in line when rest of the teams grades. Show me a great DLP and il show you some miserable grades

Fairly sure it's common knowledge. It's been like this as I can remember.

It's also like this IRL. At my club, Spurs, we've had two awesome DLPs in recent years, Carrick & Modric. Both of them were totally underrated by the vast majority of Spurs fans because they don't do the flashy stuff. If you weren't there at every game live it was impossible to appreciate their value. Even tv doesn't do them justice.

It was only when they've left that people notice the gaping hole where they used to be, doing the simple things that knitted it all together.

I think many people, like you, get hung up on average ratings, my attitude is if the player is performing to my expectations for their role then I couldn't care less what number is attributed to them at the end of a game.

I can't think of many people that underrated Modric

But you are absolutely right, the ME (and real life) give no love to the players that do the dirty work.

I can't think of many people that underrated Modric

But you are absolutely right, the ME (and real life) give no love to the players that do the dirty work.

You have no idea how many people underrated Modric. And still do outside of Madrid & Croatia.

I can't think of many people that underrated Modric

But you are absolutely right, the ME (and real life) give no love to the players that do the dirty work.

Bar Dier! He is a tank!

A well-functioning DLP doesn't seem like the kind of role to gain strong ratings. I'm not sure they do in real football, either. If they aren't getting an assist, multiple key passes, dribbling runs, or key defensive interceptions, then its mainly just passing. Being the deep midfield possession fulcrum can be a key role, but its fundamentally just being tidy in possession and having a pass completion ratio, without necessarily much range to the passing. That's not typically going to get you a 7.5 or an 8.0 rating, in the game or the real game.

Regarding Modric...astonishing , as he was widley thought of as the most important player on the team.

Why wouldent a DLP who does what a DLP should do and do it well not get good ratings? im talking about in real life, of course he do.

This is just something in game that you seem so used to that you hink its normal in real life too. as an example when Carrick (as mentioned as an example)was ace, he was talked about in the same breath as Gerrard, im sorry you are gameatised

We should protest, the match engine should calculate interceptions, play out of trouble etc differently. up on the barricades for arguably the most important role in football

Thanks Dos Santos, will check him out too

I'm not gameatised. I've argued the point over the years on here.

And IRL both Modric & Carrick at Spurs were under appreciated. I'm not making that up. It's fact. If you've always appreciated them then well done you obviously understand how football works but believe me the majority brought up on modern football don't.

IRL even when those guys were playing out of their skin I guarantee they weren't getting superb ratings in newspaper match reports. What they do goes under the radar to much of an extent.

I'm not disagreeing with you but on the whole in terms of FM I've accepted it because it hasn't changed despite many protests. I've adapted my thinking with regards to average rating & use all the extra stats to derive good performances from my players, especially in certain roles.

By all means go to GD or the bugs forum & raise it, I'll support that. But it's been how it is so long that only a complete overhaul of the ratings system can change it.

Well, if the player has interceptions, key passes, and the like, then yes. Above a 7 seems more legit. Completing 80% or better of your passes is nice, but if none of those passes are penetrative or long, how much credit do a series of short passes earn a player if there isn't anything else done as well?

Looking a Modric on WhoScored.com (it seems to be a respected place for match ratings):

Betis 1 : 1 Madrid - 111 touches - 93.6 pass completion - 2 key passes - 1 shot - 2 interceptions - 9 long passes - 7.61 rating

Madrid 3 : 1 Sociedad - 68 touches - 91.2% passing accuracy - 0 key passes - 1 shot - 1 interception - 4 long passes - 6.60 rating

Madrid 5 : 1 Sporting Gijon - 137 touches - 95.1% passing accuracy - 0 key passes - 3 shots - 1 interception - 7 long passes - 6.91 rating

Madrid 5 : 0 Deportivo - 90 touches - 91% passing accuracy - 1 key pass - 0 shots - 2 tackles & 3 interceptions - 5 long passes - 7.69 rating

It looks to me like simply having a lot of touches and high pass completion doesn't equate to a high match grade by itself. In truth, there are other factors that come into play and not everything can be put into pure stats. The overall defensive position, the off the ball movement, the quality of a defensive interception, and so on.

Whoscored like FM (& pretty much everyone else) overvalue goals, assists & key passes.

I rotate Tielemans and Renato Sanches in MC DLP roles and they have average ratings between 7.75 and 7.9 over the course of a season, excellent players who you can get quite cheaply early in the game.

After seeing some ratings of my players in my Man City save from the DLP position average at best, I took a closer look at them during matches and found that they were actually playing quite well. Since then, I haven't really paid too much attention to the ratings themselves, and have since just kept an eye out for what is going on during matches.

I would say that FM really isn't representing creativity well in this (or few previous ones) engine. I would expect creative players with good passing ability to get about 10 assists per season in league if these attributes were well represented. The deep lying playmakers have time and space to do it and defending against through balls isn't that great so that should combine better. Sadly most of the through balls are hit short or timed really badly. Definitely a thing to be changed in future as IRL players like Pirlo, Alonso etc always have purpose on those long balls they play and it is more satisfying to see results also in terms of assists. In first season I got one assist from Gareth Barry in this role and in second season Ledson is the same. Lukaku is always giving them options to play profitable long balls.

James Ward-Prowse, been great for me and gets a 7+ in most games, with a fair few 8+. Don't think he's had many, if any, sub 7 scores for me. In fact, IIRC his current average rating is above 8 so a DLP can be a star performer in the right team.

James Ward-Prowse, been great for me and gets a 7+ in most games, with a fair few 8+. Don't think he's had many, if any, sub 7 scores for me. In fact, IIRC his current average rating is above 8 so a DLP can be a star performer in the right team.

Interested to know the following:

A) is he a DMC or MC

B) is he the only playmaker in the side?

C) does he take set pieces

D) if so do the majority of his assists come from set pieces

Josh vela has been fantastic for me as a cm DLP support. His average ratings must be 7.5 is can't check right now. His stats aren't world class either but he's dominant in the premier league in my Aston villa save.

He has ppms

Dictates tempo

Likes to switch ball to other flank.

Dlp is one of my favourite roles in game

edgar555; i resign to the fact that you are correct, didnt know the issue had been raised.

Mike1987; That sound remarkable, sanches does look good in my game but not that good in comparison too what i have already tried.

Bigpapa; yes i understand that short passing out of trouble or slow down tempo isnt everything, it was just an example that i mentioned in order find some common ground for a better more fair grade for MC DLP

Interested to know the following:

A) is he a DMC or MC

B) is he the only playmaker in the side?

C) does he take set pieces

D) if so do the majority of his assists come from set pieces

Callamity & Mike1987 can you answer these questions please?

And anyone else who's DLP gets consistently high ratings.

Ok i have a look at him. Yes for PPM´s it feel like DLP should have dictates tempo. I wonder what makes Vela perform so he gets a 7.5 rating. Do you play with 2 MC´s and a DM?

Interested to know the following:

A) is he a DMC or MC

B) is he the only playmaker in the side?

C) does he take set pieces

D) if so do the majority of his assists come from set pieces

A) MC

B) Yes

C) Some, not all.

D) Same as above, combination of through balls and corners. I'm guessing mostly from open play as he's not first choice on set pieces.

In his last 19 games, he's managed a total of 110 "key passes" including 10 V Watford and 11 V Middlesbrough. Average of over 5 key passes per game. In those games he's also managed 2 goals and 7 assists with an average rating of 8.24 - high of 9.1 and low of 6.9. In only 3 of the games was he below 7, and 8 or above in 13 of them, 5 of which were 9+

A) MC

B) Yes

C) Some, not all.

D) Same as above, combination of through balls and corners. I'm guessing mostly from open play as he's not first choice on set pieces.

In his last 19 games, he's managed a total of 110 "key passes" including 10 V Watford and 11 V Middlesbrough. Average of over 5 key passes per game. In those games he's also managed 2 goals and 7 assists with an average rating of 8.24 - high of 9.1 and low of 6.9. In only 3 of the games was he below 7, and 8 or above in 13 of them, 5 of which were 9+

Thanks

I'll be interested to see what others come back with.

But my thinking is that B is the crucial one here. My set up has a DLP/D alongside an AP/A, therefore the DLP is sitting deep, feeding the AP/A who gets to play all the killer balls.

Obviously taking set pieces and getting assists from there will help massively on the rating front.

I should have asked but I'm guessing your guy is on Support duty?

Aaron Kuhl

Thanks

I'll be interested to see what others come back with.

But my thinking is that B is the crucial one here. My set up has a DLP/D alongside an AP/A, therefore the DLP is sitting deep, feeding the AP/A who gets to play all the killer balls.

Obviously taking set pieces and getting assists from there will help massively on the rating front.

I should have asked but I'm guessing your guy is on Support duty?

Yeah, in a 4-2-3-1 alongside a CM-D.

edgar555; i resign to the fact that you are correct, didnt know the issue had been raised.

Mike1987; That sound remarkable, sanches does look good in my game but not that good in comparison too what i have already tried.

Bigpapa; yes i understand that short passing out of trouble or slow down tempo isnt everything, it was just an example that i mentioned in order find some common ground for a better more fair grade for MC DLP

Im into the start of my 5th season and Sanches has amazing stats now plus ive taught him preferred moves that suit the DLP role which should help, as for Tielemans hes even better as his technical stats are perfect for the role. all id say is buy someone talented and young and develop them both with games and training over a sustained period in that role. tbh reading the replies to this thread im surprised because ive not had an issue getting high ratings from my DLP whoever i play there, maybe its also how you set up your team to play?

Callamity & Mike1987 can you answer these questions please?

And anyone else who's DLP gets consistently high ratings.

Sure no worries:

I play Tielemans or Sanches whoevers fit/in better form at MC DLP.

No i play with an advanced playmaker in the AMC role.

Neither of them take set pieces as i have other players with higher ratings in those areas.

No.

Ill post a screenshot of both of them for you to see their ratings if you like?

Sure no worries:

I play Tielemans or Sanches whoevers fit/in better form at MC DLP.

No i play with an advanced playmaker in the AMC role.

Neither of them take set pieces as i have other players with higher ratings in those areas.

No.

Ill post a screenshot of both of them for you to see their ratings if you like?

SS aren't essential (would be nice though) ,Im not doubting what you say & I'm more trying to figure out what the differences are between various systems that see such a rating difference.

Does your DLP have a Support duty?

As you can see Tielemans over the course of the season in all comps has an average rating over 7.7 and thats with not a huge amount of assists 12 in all comps all from open play and in the season before that just the 7 but again with an average rating over 7.7.

And theres Renato Sanches, again not many assists at all but an rating of 7,7 in all competitions over the season, so its not as if their stats are being exaggerated by goals/assists.

And thats where and how i use them.

I have a DLP (S) which sits next to an AP (S) that averages 7.07.

One of three play makers in the side and doesn't take any set pieces.

He actually only has 3 assists in 24 matches. What I'm happy with is the 93% pass completion, 87% tackle ratio with 5.51 tackles made per game.

Thanks Mike & Norfolk.

Obviously working from small sample sizes but I'm leaning towards thinking that the strata in which the playmakers sit influences their impact on games and therefore ratings.

Mike has his AP ahead of the DLP in the AM strata whilst Norfolk & I have DLPs sitting alongside APs in the MC strata. My ratings are similar to Norfolk whilst Mike is getting much better ratings from his guys. This is something I'm going to put some time into & see if I can figure it all out.

SS aren't essential (would be nice though) ,Im not doubting what you say & I'm more trying to figure out what the differences are between various systems that see such a rating difference.

Does your DLP have a Support duty?

Yes i understand mate and yes always on support duty unless im ahead in-game in the last 10-15 minutes then ill drop them back on a defend duty.

Thanks Mike & Norfolk.

Obviously working from small sample sizes but I'm leaning towards thinking that the strata in which the playmakers sit influences their impact on games and therefore ratings.

Mike has his AP ahead of the DLP in the AM strata whilst Norfolk & I have DLPs sitting alongside APs in the MC strata. My ratings are similar to Norfolk whilst Mike is getting much better ratings from his guys. This is something I'm going to put some time into & see if I can figure it all out.

Another thing ill say as mentioned above is i did invest the time in teaching both players preferred moves which i thought suited that DLP role, in this case 'come deep to get ball' and 'dictates tempo' were the first 2 then 'attempts long range passes', whether that makes any difference in game i have no idea but that and simply train and play them there is all i have done. Maybe as you say give it a try playing them in different stratas and see if it makes a difference, quality of team mates id imagine will also play a part as will how you set your team up to play, for instance if you favour a very direct back to front approach your DLP wont be making a huge amount of passes and ive found a number of times the reason for high ratings is the key passes stat.

Another thing ill say as mentioned above is i did invest the time in teaching both players preferred moves which i thought suited that DLP role, in this case 'come deep to get ball' and 'dictates tempo' were the first 2 then 'attempts long range passes', whether that makes any difference in game i have no idea but that and simply train and play them there is all i have done. Maybe as you say give it a try playing them in different stratas and see if it makes a difference, quality of team mates id imagine will also play a part as will how you set your team up to play, for instance if you favour a very direct back to front approach your DLP wont be making a huge amount of passes and ive found a number of times the reason for high ratings is the key passes stat.

My team are top drawer. My DLPs are world class. I play possession football. I reckon the strata thing along with my guys having defend duty is a big factor in these differences.

I'll be honest I'm extremely happy with my DLPs performances and the job they do, just intrigued to see how I could get those ratings from them. I don't think my set up allows for that.

Josh vela is a cm. Plays dpl support.

He has an advanced playmaker attack in front of him. His switches ball ppm has him play key passes to the wide men and his range of passing in games is great. He does score maybe 8 goals a season usually a long shot.

He does not take set pieces and plays alongside a cm defend in a 4231.

I was playing Barry Bannan in a DLP role in centre mid, and he was getting some of my team's best ratings in the Championship, despite rarely troubling the scorers. So maybe you can have a fiddle with it tatctically and see your playmaker used more?

I'll echo the comments that it's down to how you use the role within your system.

I've had Kristoffer Ajer as a DLP for 5 seasons now, as many on here probably do too. For most of those seasons I played him as a DLP-Def at MC as I played quite cautiously while developing my Premier League squad after promotion. He'd break up play well but always sit very deep and thus not get assists, though he would pass to a more advanced player who would then assist the scorer, and his only goals came from occasional corners when his height came into play. We played well, he did his job without being flashy and averaged 6.80, 6.83, 7.00, 7.04 the first 4 seasons.

This season my team is rated high enough that I've had to adjust tactics to attack more, and as part of that I changed Ajer from DLP-Def to DLP-Sup, still at the MC position. While his instructions remain the same (hold position, shoot less) the higher mentality he gets from the support duty sees him sit a bit higher up, and though he still doesn't make forward runs he's now started providing assists as his proximity to the box allows him to thread through balls to the attackers himself, rather than passing to someone else to do that. He's also scored a couple of goals from open play as the ball has been cleared to him sitting just outside the area to shoot before defenders have time to close the gap. Half way through this season with the new Support duty and his average is up to 7.64 with 3 goals already.

So it depends on what you want the player to do. With a defence duty they'll sit deeper to focus on breaking up play, collecting the ball from defenders and distributing it to more advanced players. The average might be 6.8 - 7.0 but that doesn't mean they're playing badly. Just more of a distributor than a creator. Changed to support they'll still hold position but do so a bit higher up the pitch. That sacrifices a bit of defensive positioning as it might leave a little gap behind but gets them more involved with attacking play and able to create openings themselves, with higher average ratings likely as a result.

And of course just because one person uses a DLP a certain way it doesn't mean it'll work for someone else's system. It's all down to how they link with the rest of the team.