Work Permit Prepostrerousness

Just signed Leandro Damiao for Newcastle in January 2016 for £30m, and has not been granted a work permit.

I'm stuck with him on my wage bill earning £93k a week, with no way of playing him due to him not receiving a work permit. It was a deadline day signing, although I don't think this should have anything to do with it? He's 26 now and a regular in the Brazil side now; so I just don't understand why he hasn't been granted citizenship. I have brought players over from South America before, and farmed them out to sides across Europe for them to gain their work-permits, but it just seems complete loonacy that such an established player should have to go and play in the Bulgarian leagues for god knows how long - not that he would even contemplate doing so anyway.

Currently Leandro still has 1813 days to complete before he will be granted UK citizenship, is there anyway that a permit will be granted before that? I can foresee suggestions of using FMRTE to solve the problem, but that is a personal non-starter.

I don't particularly want to fund this guys retirement fund for near on 5 years waiting for him to gain citizenship, by which time he will have a year left on his contract and the wrong side of 30. Surely the more International caps he receives, it should only be a matter of time before a permit is considered; or does it not work like that, and permits are only granted when the player is singed to the club. An idea I've had is that an extension to his contract may force the issue, but that will not be a viable option just yet as I've not had the player a month, and anyway I doubt him and his agent will be willing to sign a contract extension at a club where he is playing in the reserves.

Any foresight to this issue will be appreciated; just highly frustrated that he was allowed to join me in the first place, I'd have been more accommodating if the permit was refused before I ended up buying him.

Work permits are a minefield all depends on the criteria used. In the editor there are different options for work permits when creating competitions if they are the same then it could be one of these: Percentage of International Appearances in the Last 16 Matches, Weekly Wage, Potential Ability, Percentage of First Team Games. Now which SI has programmed in for England is anyone's guess.

Because he has joined you without a work permit means you have an affiliate (they have their advantages and dis-advantages), Some people have said that there is or was a bug that if you shipped a player of to an affiliate to gain a work permit after the first season when he comes back he no longer needs to be sent out. You maybe in luck and it hasn't been fixed and you can just ship him off for a year. But other than that I think it will have to be FMTRE

Just done a quick search and on the FA site it states the following criteria has to be met.

Criteria for PlayersTo be eligible for a Governing Body Endorsement under PBS:

1. The applicant club must be in membership of the Premier League or Football League. During the period of endorsement, the player may only play for clubs in membership of those leagues (i.e. the player may not be loaned to a club below the Football League);

2. The player must have participated in at least 75% of his home country’s senior competitive international matches where he was available for selection during the two years preceding the date of the application;

3. The player’s National Association must be at or above 70th place in the official FIFA World

Rankings when averaged over the two years preceding the date of the application.

http://www.thefa.com/TheFA/RulesandRegulations/~/media/Files/PDF/TheFA/Work%20Permits/2011/Player%20Criteria%202011-12%20GN.ashx/Player%20Criteria%202011-12%20GN.pdf

Now if SI has implemented it that way it has to be his international appearances that stopped him.

Just done a quick search and on the FA site it states the following criteria has to be met.

http://www.thefa.com/TheFA/RulesandRegulations/~/media/Files/PDF/TheFA/Work%20Permits/2011/Player%20Criteria%202011-12%20GN.ashx/Player%20Criteria%202011-12%20GN.pdf

Now if SI has implemented it that way it has to be his international appearances that stopped him.

I thought SI had always programmed permits on that basis since they were properly introduced to the game (many years ago)?

Can you appeal the decision in FM12 (last FM I played was 07)? Not that this helps, but I know in real life you can appeal in the case of those that are viewed to be great talents (I think Milan Baros got a permit on that basis for Liverpool - look how that worked out!)

You can appeal but what happens in most case where a team has an affiliate that is for sending player to obtain work permits, if the powers at be decide that the player to miles off the criteria and an appeal would not be successful they will basically tell you yes you can sign the player but you will have to loan him out until he can play for you.

@The Welsh Lad

Thanks for the reply, the FA literature makes for interesting reading. Regarding the first proposition of trying to work a possible bug, I don't think that will be the case here due to the lack of cooperation I would have in Damiao agreeing to be shipped off to deepest, darkest Sofia for a year; plus I've had players return from Bulgaria after a year, only for them to return again.

Just investigated a bit further into the possibility that Damiao hasn't featured enough Internationally to warrant a work-permit; on the basis of the 'The player must have participated in at least 75% on his home country's senior competitive international matches where he was available for selection during the two years preceding..'.

This is what I've found; two years preceding the date I signed him Brazil have played 13 competitive International games, in which Damiao has featured in only 4 that I can trace; of which have come in the most recent World Cup qualifiers. He may have played in the 2014 WC, but hard to tell due to the match records not being available, plus Brazil went out in group stages, so would have only featured a maximum of 3 games; 2016 Copa America he wasn't even selected in the squad.

So by the looks of it I'm in the sticky brown stuff! I've got to hope that he is still selected for the squads and impresses in those games to maintain his place so that he can hopefully gain the quoted 75% mark; of which should take him another 18months, all whilst playing in my reserves, or hopefully out on loan somewhere in a country that will let him in.

Not to clued up on my Visa and Immigration legislation, but it wouldn't seem that I would be able to pay him a wage of £93k, for him to therefore pay his contributions on that wage all whilst maintaining employment within the UK, albeit turning out in the reserves, without a visa and the nice people at the Border Agency smelling a rat. Surely if this was the real world, I would have been able to offer him a sort of pre-contract that would come into play when he was cleared a visa to work in the country. Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure Customs & Immigrations must set these prerequisite for Visas, not the F.A. Therefore on that basis, a player that is now under contract and can be registered in my Premier League 25 shouldn't even be allowed to work in the country due to visa issues; therefore he would be unable to sign said contract, and therefore would be unable to play reserve team football. Forgive any ramblings here, just it seems there to be no clarity at all.

Edit; As you mentioned being able to appeal the decsion, how exactly would I appeal or send another request for a visa when I think he will be illegible for one. I'm pretty sure he will/should gain the magical 75% mark of International games in a shorter number of days than it would take him to gain a EU visa whilst in Bulgaria, let alone in the UK.

I'd try to offer him a new contract and see if you can get a work permit awarded that way. As it was a deadline day signing, you lost the right of appeal in order to push the transfer through.

I'd try to offer him a new contract and see if you can get a work permit awarded that way. As it was a deadline day signing, you lost the right of appeal in order to push the transfer through.

I thought of this, think I mentioned it in the OP. I shall keep plugging away at this idea, but can't see it happening due to unwillingness of him to sign a new contract when he has yet to play a first team game; and seeing the AI player and agent has no understanding of the situation I doubt this will work. Just hope he doesn't start pestering me for first team football. I guess he can become golf buddies with all the stars sat in Man City's reserves not playing.

Appealing refused work permit applications usually works for me. Not all the time, but I have found on many occassions that an appeal will actually result in him being granted one.

Use FMRTE to give him a 2nd nationality that is European.

yeah usually players are denied on the first go but your really good players who havent broken into argentina or brazil can win the appeal. also the reputation of your club is important in the appeal. for eample on one occasion i left my newly promoted side and went to chelsea. signed a killer brazilian striker and he was granted permit on appeal. decided that moving teams was a mistake and reloaded an older save and went to try and sign the same guy to help keep me up. totally denied.

By the way, what did your scout say in his report? Normally he will either say that the WP will be declined but has a good chance of being overturned on appeal or that you can sign him and loan him out. I don't think my scouts have ever been wrong about this, but I have very good scouts (in Judging Ability and Potential, not sure what category covers predicting WP appeals). Your performance may vary, I guess.

By the way, what did your scout say in his report? Normally he will either say that the WP will be declined but has a good chance of being overturned on appeal or that you can sign him and loan him out. I don't think my scouts have ever been wrong about this, but I have very good scouts (in Judging Ability and Potential, not sure what category covers predicting WP appeals). Your performance may vary, I guess.

Can't remember to be honest, now that I've signed him they are not able to be seen. Don't think I even scouted him over the January window before I signed him; although I had been keeping tabs on him since the game started, so mostly likely the scouts would have highlighted something.

My scouts were regularly wrong on this in my QPR save. I signed Ricardo Olivieira even though my scout said he wouldnt get a work permit and it would be rejected on appeal but it all came through fine. I also signed Paulo Assuncao the same thing happened.

Use FMRTE to give him a 2nd nationality that is European.

I second that, just add a second EU nationality for him (Italy, Portugal, Germany, Spain)

or if you want the hard way you could loan him to a Spanish side, in Spain he will get the nationality in 2 years