malleria Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 Hi all, Arrows! At first i didn't think i missed them that much, and thought they had accustomed for the stripping of arrows somehwere else in the game. But then came, along with getting older, an understanding for the game, and then my passion for 'total football', and therefore, barcelona in recent times. With this i wanted to recreate their tactic in FM, to cut a long story short, part of the formation is to have xavi LCM, and Buesquets RDM, so he moves alonnside xavi when attacking, as in real life, BUT, and here comes the anger, and dissapointment for no arrows, as IRL busquets (or anyone who plays as the holder) moves into CD, mainly when valdes has the ball, but when they have it in defence aswell, he does this because the two CB's spread wide, about 3/4 quarters into the FB positions. BUT NO, i can't do this! Because i can't have an arrow moving busquets from RDM/CDM, into CB with an arrow, COS THERE AREN'T ANY! Really annoying and dissapointing cos it prevents me from doing what i want and creating the 'perfect' tactic, they can have these as well as player roles etc! What do you think of the lack of arrows? I think a developed version of the fifa aroows on 'attack' and 'defence' would be excellent. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TH21 Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 I agree with you 100% I really miss the arrows and think the game would be better with them Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lankylars Posted April 11, 2010 Share Posted April 11, 2010 I believe that the actual game mechanics are unchanged; player roles or the (oft maligned) sliders control the same thing, there just isn't a graphical representation on the tactics page. Check TTF '10 though, because I'm no expert. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedore Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 I do agree as well, could be looked at soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xennaz Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 Classic tactics? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vangelis21 Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 the arrows are not missing. they are there. you decide to use them or not.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aderow Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 Hi all,Arrows! At first i didn't think i missed them that much, and thought they had accustomed for the stripping of arrows somehwere else in the game. But then came, along with getting older, an understanding for the game, and then my passion for 'total football', and therefore, barcelona in recent times. With this i wanted to recreate their tactic in FM, to cut a long story short, part of the formation is to have xavi LCM, and Buesquets RDM, so he moves alonnside xavi when attacking, as in real life, BUT, and here comes the anger, and dissapointment for no arrows, as IRL busquets (or anyone who plays as the holder) moves into CD, mainly when valdes has the ball, but when they have it in defence aswell, he does this because the two CB's spread wide, about 3/4 quarters into the FB positions. BUT NO, i can't do this! Because i can't have an arrow moving busquets from RDM/CDM, into CB with an arrow, COS THERE AREN'T ANY! Really annoying and dissapointing cos it prevents me from doing what i want and creating the 'perfect' tactic, they can have these as well as player roles etc! What do you think of the lack of arrows? I think a developed version of the fifa aroows on 'attack' and 'defence' would be excellent. Are you talking about the arrows from FM 08 and earlier? Like these ones? Or are you talking about the arrows that represent runs from deep in FM 09 and FM 10? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lam Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 Arrows, as known in the old version of the game, were removed. They caused to much conflict in the game when also coupled with 'FWR'. Basically they were the fundamental downfall that led to so many Diabalo tactics. They have been replaced with the following: Run from Deep: Rare: Back Arrow Mixed: No Arrow Often: Forward Arrow If you want lateral movement then you need to look at 'roam from position'. To my knowledge the game mechanics were unchanged, however, the old use of the arrows were removed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vangelis21 Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 ok, let me say it once more! the arrows are NOT missing from fm10! aderow's pic is from an older version but they wxist in fm10 too! why to say things that are incorrect? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malleria Posted April 12, 2010 Author Share Posted April 12, 2010 Yes but if you then go to classic tactics you don't have all the new things, i want the new and the arrows. As for Iam, thanks but surely runs from position rare just mean stay where u r, and diagonal etc isn't FULLY covered by roam from position etc. I know what u mean but it still isn't perfect enough, it should be EASY for me to say tight, yaya toure i want you, when we have the ball in defence to go and cover at CB, and i want pique & puyol to split 3/4 into FB posiitons, yet i can't! Even fifa can do that! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vangelis21 Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 If you choose the new settings then you can exploit the arrows without them being actually there. For example a full back with an arrow one position forth is now a full back with attacking attitude. you can't have both. simply because it is pretty much the same Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeeman27bob Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 The arrows helped make tactics which exploited the match engine, which is why they were removed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malleria Posted April 12, 2010 Author Share Posted April 12, 2010 How do you go sideways then, or diagonal? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vangelis21 Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 for example any winger with the "inside forward" setting, goes towards the center Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malleria Posted April 12, 2010 Author Share Posted April 12, 2010 how do you get your b's to go sideway, and your cdm to go diagonally backwards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vangelis21 Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 But you didn't get it. You cannot do the same things but you can have the same results by changing your setting a little. Even in real life the DB stay in the center, they don't roam left and right Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malleria Posted April 12, 2010 Author Share Posted April 12, 2010 but busquets moves into the CB position, & the 2 CB's spread, so how do i emulate that in the game? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roykela Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 The arrows helped make tactics which exploited the match engine, which is why they were removed. I think they should remove corners as well, as there is a way to exploit it so you can score way more often than normal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
weeeman27bob Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 I think they should remove corners as well, as there is a way to exploit it so you can score way more often than normal Might as well get rid of the Editor too. You don't want anyone giving themselves an advantage at the start Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roykela Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 Might as well get rid of the Editor too. You don't want anyone giving themselves an advantage at the start Ah yeah. That shouldn't definitely be left out I'll stop with that. Don't want the thread to go waaaaaaay off topic Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSGTroyer Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 but busquets moves into the CB position, & the 2 CB's spread, so how do i emulate that in the game? An Attacking Libero comes quite close... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malleria Posted April 12, 2010 Author Share Posted April 12, 2010 ehats that ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Shanahan Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 ehats that ? A libero is a free player who sits either just in front of your backs or just behind. An attacking one would play a la Beckenbauer, i.e. he will initiate the attacks, and will often look to get forward into the midfield (an Attacking Libero). The other kind is the classical catenaccio libero who sits behind the defense and kicks everything that moves (if it's not moving he just kicks it until it does). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Death. Posted April 12, 2010 Share Posted April 12, 2010 I wouldn't say that playing with a Libero comes close. I've just experimented a bit and the best i can get is for the DC's to occasionally come to the level of the DM, but they barely at all move wide. In real life they would move into the space left by the wing-backs, which doesn't happen despite the fact they have Roam From Position. I did try giving them Move Into Channels which helped ever so slightly. There is a clear issue if something like this isn't achievable. If anyone has managed to get their DC's moving laterally then by all means enlighten us. I think there is still an issue with movement but that SI felt this way was preferable, if not ideal, to people being able to make diablo tactics with the previous system of arrows. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malleria Posted April 12, 2010 Author Share Posted April 12, 2010 110% AGREE. imean, even of f*****ng fifa ffs i got the shape absolutely perfect, n FM shuld be 100 times more in dpeth and better than them Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
x42bn6 Posted April 13, 2010 Share Posted April 13, 2010 While I understand the point of removing the arrows as it can be counter-intuitive (does mentality 20 make sense for a striker with one big long backwards arrow to sweeper?), I do miss sideways arrows. For example, a 4-3-1-2 with two sideways arrows on the wide central midfielders makes more tactical sense for teams like Milan where Gattuso and Ambrosini can spend quite a bit of time on the flanks but as much as a pure winger. Being able to set width per player is probably a better system of course. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serdar Posted April 13, 2010 Share Posted April 13, 2010 I think this is a very legit debate and hopefully SI will work on the issue, evaluate ups and downs. For casual players these may not matter but for hardcore fans who wants to challenge everything, this sound familiar? , they will be happy to have more depth and options. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayahr Posted April 13, 2010 Share Posted April 13, 2010 Yes but if you then go to classic tactics you don't have all the new things, i want the new and the arrows. As for Iam, thanks but surely runs from position rare just mean stay where u r, and diagonal etc isn't FULLY covered by roam from position etc. I know what u mean but it still isn't perfect enough, it should be EASY for me to say tight, yaya toure i want you, when we have the ball in defence to go and cover at CB, and i want pique & puyol to split 3/4 into FB posiitons, yet i can't! Even fifa can do that! Classic tactics include the new stuff as well. The new tactics wizard just allows you to make multiple corresponding settings which make sense more easily and at once. The core beneath hasn't changed at all. The arrows are shown in classic tactics but what they do is there with the wizard as well. So nothing has changed, but for the graphical representation as long as you use the wizard. If people fail to recreate the way Barcelona are playing then this might be a limitation of the ME, but that's another story. You might try the clubs forum and see if there is a solution available in the Barcelona thread Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malleria Posted April 13, 2010 Author Share Posted April 13, 2010 The main problem is side arrows, that is just laughable that you cant even get side arrows! I mean, i have even recreated the bacra shape perfectly on fifa ffs! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayahr Posted April 13, 2010 Share Posted April 13, 2010 Agreed. Lateral movement has been difficult, but FM10 has already seen a remarkable improvement on FM09 in that respect. Check the wide play options in the tactics instructions Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malleria Posted April 13, 2010 Author Share Posted April 13, 2010 Might start a new thread to get a reaction from SI, as i might just be missing something or see if they are looking into it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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