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FM 19- Oh When The Spurs.. (Tottenham Hotspur)


Dwells2015

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History:

Founded in 1882, Tottenham won the FA Cup for the first time in 1901, the only non-League club to do so since the formation of the Football League in 1888. Tottenham were the first club in the 20th century to achieve the League and FA Cup Double, winning both competitions in the 1960–61 season. After successfully defending the FA Cup in 1962, in 1963 they became the first British club to win a UEFA club competition – the European Cup Winners' Cup. They were also the inaugural winners of the UEFA Cup in 1972, becoming the first British club to win two different major European trophies. They have collected at least one major trophy in each of the six decades from the 1950s to 2000s – an achievement only matched by Manchester United. In total, Spurs have won two league titles, eight FA Cups, four League Cups, seven FA Community Shields, one European Cup Winners' Cup and two UEFA Cups. The club has a long-standing rivalry with nearby club Arsenal (The Scum), with head-to-head fixtures known as the North London derby. 

In Recent History, under the reign of Mauricio Pochettino, Spurs have become perennial Champions League and League Title threats. The trouble though is that Tottenham have not won a trophy since 2008. This reality hangs heavy over the fans, the manager and the players. 

 

The Squad 

DEF:

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Great collection of players. Truly one of the strongest aspects of the team. Some challenges/tips that will need to be addressed:

Finding a backup GK for Lloris (selling Vorm for around 6 million pounds helps).

Toby starts the game uninterested in re-signing with the club. Will you sell early or wait and try. 

Vertonghen has an extension clause in his contract which gives you another year at 90k a week. It's a must in my opinion.

 

MID:

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This bunch is full a quality but short on quantity. Good spine options with Wanyama and Dier. Just about every other position lacks quality depth though. Challenges/Tips:

- Finding quality backups for Son and Lucas on your wings. Alli and Lamela can play out there but aren't naturals in the same positions Son and Lucas are.

- An option for that is to bring in Lookman on loan from everton, solid player for cheap wages.

- Deciding what to do with the Mous(s)a's. Dembele's contract expires and he is getting old so do you renew or sell? Sissoko is on 80k a week wages, is he worth it? 

- Developing the young guys. Spurs have Winks, Skipp and Oakley-Booth who are full of potential in this part of the pitch. How will you develop them?

- MC depth is lacking in general.

 

STR:

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This is where our most talented player plays... and not much else. Llorente's deal is expiring and you are probably better off selling than having him as your back-up. Challenges/Tips:

- You must buy depth here!! Technically, Son and Lucas can fill in here, but who is going to fill in for them out wide?

An option is to bring in Origi on loan, and while he is there his deal may run out with Liverpool giving you the chance to sample a player you can get for free next summer.

 

Challenges/Expectations:

This is the first FM where Spurs base expectation is to make the champions league. This is hard given the quality of the top 6. It's especially hard given the Spurs brought in no reinforcements in the summer IRL, and are only given 27m pounds to spend here. With the wage budget being a bit narrow too, it makes this year's Spurs a much bigger challenge than in years past. Will you take them to Glory? Who are you buying?

 

I'd love to learn from you guys!

 

 

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Going to restart my beta save since didn’t even finish 1st season. A couple of observations so far.

Transfer budget is low, but you can sell or loan out every single unwanted player so it’s pretty easy to raise some cash. Llorente, Vorm, GNK, Gazzaniga all go for value or more. Sissoko and Lamela don’t get any bids worth accepting, but there’s plenty of loan interest to get them off your wage bill. I also sold Aurier so I can give Walker-Peters the game time he needs.

But most importantly, the bank balance is healthy so you can get your budget to go a long way by paying 35% of the fee upfront and the rest in yearly installments.

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Have any of you had luck selling players in the full game release??? 

I’ve tried all my old tricks (offering for unspecified, transfer listing) no luck.

Only player I can sell is Toby to Real, and I don’t love the idea of that.

 

 

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6 hours ago, Dwells2015 said:

Have any of you had luck selling players in the full game release??? 

I’ve tried all my old tricks (offering for unspecified, transfer listing) no luck.

Only player I can sell is Toby to Real, and I don’t love the idea of that.

 

 

Lloriente - although you have to pay part of wages.

Vorm, Gazanigga, GKN all close to asking price.

Aurier, albeit for a lower price - If i'd have watied, i'd have gotten more.

All from offer, addding to Transfer list.

It's still hard to sell players, Maybe it's a case of being patient till Jan window? In the beta, Wanyama, Lamela both got taken in Jan for overall £35-40m

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11 hours ago, Dwells2015 said:

Have any of you had luck selling players in the full game release??? 

I’ve tried all my old tricks (offering for unspecified, transfer listing) no luck.

Only player I can sell is Toby to Real, and I don’t love the idea of that.

 

 

There is a weird side-effect of the reduced transfer activity during the first window that causes zero interest in players who start the game on holiday. I raised the issue during beta and eventually SI put it under review, but they must not have had the time to fix it for final release. You won't be able to move those players even if you offer them for 0 fee and full wage contribution. The only exception is when there is pre-existing interest, like it is the case for Toby and Dier.

Luckily, none of the usual candidates for the transfer list played in the WC, so you can move them as usual, but if you are looking to made sweeping changes to your squad those will have to wait until the winter window.

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6 hours ago, plcarlos said:

Lloriente - although you have to pay part of wages.

Vorm, Gazanigga, GKN all close to asking price.

Aurier, albeit for a lower price - If i'd have watied, i'd have gotten more.

All from offer, addding to Transfer list.

It's still hard to sell players, Maybe it's a case of being patient till Jan window? In the beta, Wanyama, Lamela both got taken in Jan for overall £35-40m

Who are you selling these guys to??

 

only offer I get is for Gazz and it’s 3.1 from Torino.

 

maybe I have too many leagues loaded, what size is your database?

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6 hours ago, Dwells2015 said:

Who are you selling these guys to??

 

only offer I get is for Gazz and it’s 3.1 from Torino.

 

maybe I have too many leagues loaded, what size is your database?

Edit: Got a bit ahead of myself, much of the below it's no longer possible on a fresh save created on the full release database. With this is mind, anyone doing a fresh start is probably better off by turning off 1st window transfers altogether. The last part still holds true, it's not something particular to Spurs, just proper transfer strategy.

City usually goes for Vorm and you can get about 6m for him.

Newcastle goes for Llorente, but like @plcarlos mentioned, you will need to contribute about 25k p/w to his wages.

GKN usually goes to Championship for 7.5m, but again, you will have to chip in to his wages.

In Beta, I managed to sell Aurier to Barcelona for 17.5m and 5m after 20 int caps(which he is almost guaranteed to achieve).

I could not get any decent transfer bids for Sissoko and Lamela, but you can easily find them loan moves for full wages plus a small monthly fee.

The money from these couple of transfers, along with the wage budget freed up, gives you about 60m to work with. Like I mentioned earlier this thread, Spurs bank balance is more than healthy and that allows you to pay just a third of the fee upfront and the rest in installments, so you can easily bring quality players.

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5 hours ago, Dwells2015 said:

Anyone bought a backup for Kane yet? I’m almost to the deadline, trying to find a good option. 

Take a look at Valere Germain from OM. Not a world beater but he’s a good backup in his prime, well rounded attributes and Model Citizen to boot. Got him in beta for 2.5m upfront rest in installments and 40k wages.

That, or just ask Levy to bring in Asensio, back in beta he used to agree always.

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6 hours ago, iainb said:

Is anyone else having trouble getting Dele to play well? I've tried him as a shadow striker and att mid (attacking) behind Kane as both DLF and adv f, but his form is generally poor.

I’m playing him as Att mid with Eriksen playing as a DLP behind him. He is ripping up the league right now for me. 

 

Im struggling to get Kane going though.

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Back in FM18 it used to feel so bad to offload FM Trippier all while RL Trippier was in the best form if his life. This year it seems I’m in for a repeat of that feeling, but with Lamela and Foyth.

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1 hour ago, SD said:

Back in FM18 it used to feel so bad to offload FM Trippier all while RL Trippier was in the best form if his life. This year it seems I’m in for a repeat of that feeling, but with Lamela and Foyth.

I think you are good now, what a shambles.

On a further note, looking forward to hearing all your stories about Spurs. I think Davinson Sanchez has been criminally underrated for this version.

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5 minutes ago, Micks112 said:

I think you are good now, what a shambles.

On a further note, looking forward to hearing all your stories about Spurs. I think Davinson Sanchez has been criminally underrated for this version.

I still think Foyth played decent, those two penalties aside, but yeah, the 2-3 stars he’s got in my save seem deserved now.

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6 hours ago, Micks112 said:

On a further note, looking forward to hearing all your stories about Spurs.

Pro tip of the day: Ask Levy to sign you Marco Asensio.

Spoiler

:eek:He will :eek:

 

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12 minutes ago, Dwells2015 said:

 

 

SERIOUSLY!!! What price and what window??

1st window, right off the bat.

The price is 88m, the board goes to set your budget to 0 and takes care of the transfer for you.

Asensio.thumb.jpg.c747cdf375b777f19eed4b24f412064f.jpg

And then, a few days later.

489515250_Asensio2.thumb.jpg.0db80aae776b36e7c6f96c35fb7ce34c.jpg

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On 03/11/2018 at 02:08, Dwells2015 said:

Anyone bought a backup for Kane yet? I’m almost to the deadline, trying to find a good option. 

On the BETA I brought in Giovanni Simeone for just under £30m who was decent without being spectacular. Only played the 1 season though! Stats looks decent enough.

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Struggling to get the best out of our squad. 

Playing a Tiki-Taka 4-2-3-1. Winning a lot of games 1-0. Not pretty football.

I’ve played around with a 4231 gegenpress as well, don’t love it either.

 

what are you playing and how are you lining up??

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I’m not gonna lie, I’m finding Tottenham a challenge in the full game. The heightened expectations with low resources is a unique challenge...

 

how are you guys getting on? Any tactic system you find is working better than others

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I've been using a 4-4-2 diamond with wingbacks. I want to overload central areas and play quick passing football given the technical quality that the team has while also pressing relentlessly given the work rate that the squad has. I haven't been failing spectacularly but I'm also not looking like a team that's going to win the league. Halfway into the season, Kane has only 9 goals and Alli has 5 or 6... not ideal. Lucas Moura is my top scorer from a pressing forward role next to Kane.

 

zkce8VN.png

 

I'm happy to keep most of the squad around for the long-term, they are generally hard-working, technical players with good personalities (even Lloris is a model citizen). But there are a few I'm getting rid of: Sissoko, Wanyama, GKN, Llorente and Janssen. (Maybe Lamela too)

 

Signed up 3 players who joined on January 1st...

Cfii1K5.png

I use Dier at DM and Foyth isn't/never will be first team quality, which meant I had 3 central defenders, so I dropped 30m on the best young defender in the world to be the fourth. My squad didn't have anyone under the age of 22 anyway, and Vertonghen is old.

mMY9aJ9.png

My main complaint when looking at the Spurs squad is that it lacks speed. Eriksen, Alli, and Kane train sprints every day and I'll make them do that until they retire. For 15m, Almiron provides a different profile to the players I already have. He's only replacing Sissoko, I'm not planning to use him every match, but I think he will prove useful.

PNnFswi.png

I've been using Lucas and Son at striker, and both have gotten the job done more or less, but I thought it would make sense to bring in a player that could offer a long term solution in an area where I'm using stop-gaps. 20m may seem like a bargain in a couple years.

 

These players just joined a week ago, I can keep updating as I progress and hopefully move up the table. Don't ask me what position I'm in right now. I prefer not to speak. If I speak I am in big trouble.

 

 

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@Cupjake I spend a lot of time on the tactical forums and I can see two issues with the roles setup in your tactic.

First off, the three up top are way too offensive. Kane does well as CF alongside a partner, but try a support duty instead so that he also drops deep sometimes, like he does IRL.

Dele's role is completely unsuitable for him due to his attributes and PPMs. The attacking duty coupled with his Gets Forward trait will have him positioned too advanced, almost like a 3rd striker. Thing is, the further you go up the pitch, the less time and space a player has and that the AP role is what they call a ball magnet, it has a hidden modifier that gets teammates to look to play him more. With his high anticipation and off the ball Dele won't have a problem receiving the ball, but his passing and vision are only decent while his first touch and decisions are too low to be effective. And then there's the increased dribbling of AP(A) that further exacerbates his Runs with ball trait - despite his lack of pace, he's a decent dribbler due to his high dribbling, agility, flair and technique, but it's definitely not one of his strengths.

There's also an issue with your midfield. The Mezzala even on support duty is a very offensive role and while the BBM is fine, couple that with the HB dropping deep he's pretty much your only midfielder, and even him will find sometimes find himself making runs. You need a sitting, restrained yet not defensive midfielder here and a DLP(S) is perfect for that - a role that Eriksen actually played IRL vs PSV, although you need to get rid of Moves into Channels if you want to play him there long term.

Setup aside, narrow formations seem to underperform this version of FM, at least compared to their wide counterparts. I didn't play in the full release yet, hopefully I will start that save today, but in beta I had reasonable success playing 4231 and 4123.

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@SD I appreciate the input, I'm not up to date on which tactics are overpowered/underpowered on this version.

I have been using Dele in just about every role in the AMC slot, I started off using AM - support and tweaked a lot with individual instructions, maybe that was the correct way to play. I have been training him to lose the "dwells on ball" PPM as he has been improving his decision-making, if that succeeds I think he will fit more naturally into my tactical setup.

I actually use Winks as a DLP pretty often, I took that screenshot before an easy home fixture. I often have multiple variations of player roles in a tactic to get the best out of each individual XI, and Dembele - Eriksen is definitely  an attacking setup. Sometimes I can trust my back 3 and the wingbacks to defend on their own

 

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6 minutes ago, Cupjake said:

@SD I appreciate the input, I'm not up to date on which tactics are overpowered/underpowered on this version.

I have been using Dele in just about every role in the AMC slot, I started off using AM - support and tweaked a lot with individual instructions, maybe that was the correct way to play. I have been training him to lose the "dwells on ball" PPM as he has been improving his decision-making, if that succeeds I think he will fit more naturally into my tactical setup.

I actually use Winks as a DLP pretty often, I took that screenshot before an easy home fixture. I often have multiple variations of player roles in a tactic to get the best out of each individual XI, and Dembele - Eriksen is definitely  an attacking setup. Sometimes I can trust my back 3 and the wingbacks to defend on their own

 

It's not so much about underpowered/overpowered or we'd just load up a 3 striker tactic and call it a day, just that narrow formations are harder and less forgiving to set up. And it's not even the crossing that some people swear it's overpowered, it's just the width that cannot be replicated in a narrow formation even if you instruct central players to stay wide and run wide with the ball.

But yeah, Dele is tricky to get the best out of him and I actually congratulated the Spurs researcher for the good job he's done portraying IRL Dele in FM. :)

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@SD On 18 I had a lot of success with the 4-4-2 using inverted wingers and attacking fullbacks. It had super effective wing play and I could very consistently break down defenses. I tried using it again on the 19 beta with Bournemouth and it felt equally good, I was close to challenging for the title. I didn't find that rewarding so I'm trying to do something totally different

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Just now, Cupjake said:

@SD On 18 I had a lot of success with the 4-4-2 using inverted wingers and attacking fullbacks. It had super effective wing play and I could very consistently break down defenses. I tried using it again on the 19 beta with Bournemouth and it felt equally good, I was close to challenging for the title. I didn't find that rewarding so I'm trying to do something totally different

I played Spurs almost exclusively on 18, I can tell you beforehand that wouldn't work unless you plan on replacing Eriksen, Dele and Kane. Once a player is past 18-19 it becomes increasingly harder to train pace.

Spurs squad is far better suited for a patient, possession based approach, tiki-taka or vertical tiki-taka in FM terms.

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@Cupjake @Dwells2015 All this talk and your accounts that Spurs is pretty challenging in FM19 made me start that full release Spurs save I kept putting off. I have the rest of the week off, although between training and player search it will probably take me a whole day before I press continue for the first time :)

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@SD 

On this version I've had reasonable success training pace, those 3 mentioned have gotten slightly faster in 6 months. Same with Toby, aged 29. I also had trouble attempting this in past versions.

 

I have been playing something more similar to the vertical tiki-taka than anything else

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1 minute ago, Cupjake said:

@SD 

On this version I've had reasonable success training pace, those 3 mentioned have gotten slightly faster in 6 months. Same with Toby, aged 29. I also had trouble attempting this in past versions.

 

I have been playing something more similar to the vertical tiki-taka than anything else

Interesting, must be due to the new training system. I find Kane and Eriksen fine as they are, but Dele could use a couple of points in pace and accel.

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Just now, lblanc said:

As an Irishman I'm keen to know what Spurs fan think of Troy Parrott ?

Has anyone used him in game yet?

IRL he could be a real talent perhaps our next Robbie Keane

I'm only in my first season, so for me, he's still in the U18's. Has variable potential, but I've got him at the higher end of that.

I'll post an image tonight - 16 dribbling stands out off the top of my head, but he needs to work on his movement.

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Just now, plcarlos said:

I'm only in my first season, so for me, he's still in the U18's. Has variable potential, but I've got him at the higher end of that.

I'll post an image tonight - 16 dribbling stands out off the top of my head, but he needs to work on his movement.

The one thing I'm surprised is that his penalty stat is quite low,

Kid is scoring panenka after panenka balls of steal has the lad

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@lblanc @plcarlos

In-game Troy Parrott will be tough to turn into a quality player due to his attribute spread. This is what he looks like in the save I've just started and most of the values appear to be fixed.

Spoiler

2054024593_TroyParrott.thumb.jpg.eac4ed77d9651179cf7346370edc579f.jpg

His he has good dribbling and decent technique on the one hand, but on the other his acceleration and flair are below average, while his agility is terrible.

He has good heading but at 178cm it's unlikely he'll develop the jumping to use it.

His passing and vision are decent, but his decisions and anticipation are poor even for a player his age.

He has good finishing and composure, but poor off the ball and anticipation mean he's not suited to be a poacher.

I don't know much about the player IRL, but in-game he'll turn into a Championship player at best, unless in the hands of a human player, and even then at 4 stars potential I reckon some people are not going to put the effort into developing him.

It appears that Oliver Skipp is still our best prospect this year.

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1 hour ago, SD said:

@lblanc @plcarlos

In-game Troy Parrott will be tough to turn into a quality player due to his attribute spread. This is what he looks like in the save I've just started and most of the values appear to be fixed.

  Reveal hidden contents

2054024593_TroyParrott.thumb.jpg.eac4ed77d9651179cf7346370edc579f.jpg

His he has good dribbling and decent technique on the one hand, but on the other his acceleration and flair are below average, while his agility is terrible.

He has good heading but at 178cm it's unlikely he'll develop the jumping to use it.

His passing and vision are decent, but his decisions and anticipation are poor even for a player his age.

He has good finishing and composure, but poor off the ball and anticipation mean he's not suited to be a poacher.

I don't know much about the player IRL, but in-game he'll turn into a Championship player at best, unless in the hands of a human player, and even then at 4 stars potential I reckon some people are not going to put the effort into developing him.

It appears that Oliver Skipp is still our best prospect this year.

Spoiler

image.thumb.png.d2920f8d36b4261a891dcce973f8b9ff.png

 

I asked the lad posting 5 years in the future of what he is like, as you say championship level without human player interaction. His Physicals improved a good bit especially his agility

 

could perhaps do something if developed carefully though

 

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Started my annual Tottenham save and as expected two hours in I'm yet to hit continue.

From a squad point of view, a first season Spurs manager faces a couple of dilemmas.

- cash in on Alderweireld or extend his contract. In FM18 the decision was a no-brainer as he was our best defender and one of the defenders in the game. In FM19 his attributes have been reduced in key areas while his injury proneness was increased to Very High. At 29 he's still in his prime but he's not getting any younger. Sanchez has potential but is not yet on Toby's level, and even so, just him and Vertonghen will not cut it.

Possible targets: Pavard, Manolas, Skriniar

- backup for Kane. This is something that's plaguing Spurs IRL as well so we need to find a way to break our over-reliance on Harry Kane.  Llorente a sub-par option, on huge wages and moody to boot, ideally we want to sell him as soon as possible.This FM both Lucas and Son are natural at ST position, but they're far better when used on the flanks. Plus, unless you're okay with changing your tactic every time you play them at ST, you need strikers built on Harry's mould, that are capable of both scoring an creating. Last, any good backup will expect starts and not just game time off the bench, so personally I prefer a player who's accomplished in at least another position so I can rotate him easier.

Possible targets: Fekir, Schick, El Shaarawy, Dabur

- 2nd keeper. Lloris is our captain and easily our first choice, but with Vorm's declining quickly and having one year of contract left, we need to secure a solid backup to keep up with the other title contenders. Gazzaniga is only a last resort, but he's nowhere near Spurs standard(which is a shame, because IRL it seems he is)

Possible targets: Areola, Horn, Onana

Those were the short term issues that require immediate attention, medium and long term there are a couple of other areas that require an answer.

Attack: a world class AML/AMR on par with Kane, Eriksen or Alli. Son and Moura are both excellent players, but they're unlikely to be that world class player we need to to compete with the likes of City or Liverpool.

Midfield: Dembele's contract has one year left, but unlike Toby there aren't any affordable targets on the market that are also on the same level. Wannyama is a bit one-dimensional but a solid option nonetheless, however between his injury proneness and discipline problems we should expect him to be out quite a few games. Winks is a versatile and has room to grow, but it's unlikely he'll ever be more than a squad player, with some fitness problems to boot.

Defence: similarly to our attack, we have solid options in Rose, Davies, Trippier and Aurier(to an extent), but if we are to bring this club to the next level and start winning silverware then we are going to need world class fullbacks(think Marcelo, Carvajal, Dani Alves in his prime)

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On 04/11/2018 at 20:42, Dwells2015 said:

Struggling to get the best out of our squad. 

Playing a Tiki-Taka 4-2-3-1. Winning a lot of games 1-0. Not pretty football.

I’ve played around with a 4231 gegenpress as well, don’t love it either.

 

what are you playing and how are you lining up??

Try to play control football. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
12 hours ago, reece1973 said:

Anyone trying to replicate the formation and tactic that Poch used to perfection last night against Chelsea.

 

WOW what a performance. As a team effort this was just 1st class and what we have been missing.

Games like that are why being a Spurs Fan is the best. 

I think the really hard thing to replicate is Alli’s impact. You can’t get the best out of him and Eriksen both playing .

 

well maybe you can... I haven’t haha

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11 hours ago, Dwells2015 said:

Games like that are why being a Spurs Fan is the best. 

I think the really hard thing to replicate is Alli’s impact. You can’t get the best out of him and Eriksen both playing .

 

well maybe you can... I haven’t haha

I'm really struggling to decide who plays where midfield wise.
I guess as a 1st choice it would have to be the same as Poch chose against Chelsea. Meaning Moura and Lamela are on the bench.
But then a formation chance if either come on.

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I think I'd struggle with Sissoko making him work.  More likely a reflection of FM Sissoko getting a bad rep from RL Sissoko - The article below summed up a lot of my thoughts on Sissoko:

 

(I put link in spoiler just to limit chat on matches, and try and keep to FM)

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After the terrific performance on Saturday I finally found the drive to start that Spurs save I kept putting off.

I swear, I wasn't planning to make sweeping changes, but a bargain here, an upgrade there, and before I knew it I kind of went just a tiny bit overboard. :)

Most of the transfers were made with just a third of the nominal amount paid upfront and the rest in installments. Asensio was signed through the board's generosity.

Transfers.thumb.jpg.95e11397e5578701315abffcb14a06cf.jpg

Going into 1st season the squad looks world class, definitely on par with City or Liverpool, at least on paper. I still expect to struggle until the second half of the season, though, due to poor dynamics and most key players having no pre-season.

Squad.thumb.jpg.47fe3de54e180b87ef918935ec84a14e.jpg

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23 hours ago, SD said:

After the terrific performance on Saturday I finally found the drive to start that Spurs save I kept putting off.

I swear, I wasn't planning to make sweeping changes, but a bargain here, an upgrade there, and before I knew it I kind of went just a tiny bit overboard. :)

Most of the transfers were made with just a third of the nominal amount paid upfront and the rest in installments. Asensio was signed through the board's generosity.

Transfers.thumb.jpg.95e11397e5578701315abffcb14a06cf.jpg

Going into 1st season the squad looks world class, definitely on par with City or Liverpool, at least on paper. I still expect to struggle until the second half of the season, though, due to poor dynamics and most key players having no pre-season.

Squad.thumb.jpg.47fe3de54e180b87ef918935ec84a14e.jpg

Holy Cow!!!!!! How did you get the board to give you that much more money???

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