forameuss

To be fair, none of what you said is at all impossible with the way things currently are. That's kind of my point. Your main issue seems to be collision of IDs, which isn't going to be a huge issue for your average user. I'm pretty sure there's already something in the way the editor chooses IDs that means they aren't sequential (and every object seems to have several different IDs, probably to dilute the issue further). What they have now is often awkward, not the best to use for very large edits, but it's definitely good enough to make extremely detailed league edits, and skins, and "realism" mods.

I guess the idea is to make it as robust as possible. Allowing you to change the IDs probably brings a lot of risk of things just getting completely broken up, but then given the amount of risk any edit already has, and how little they seem to care about making the editor itself much better, does seem like a weird one. I guess, ultimately, the vast majority of uses of the editor have no concern over the IDs for the most part, so I can see why the attitude of "it just works" is fine here. So if I'm understanding it right, you want SI to portion parts of the database out ID-wise to every single person who wants to make an editor file so that there are no collisions? Given they don't seem that interested in just making the editor easier to use for individual users, I doubt they'd be interested in putting in extra complexity just to satisfy a very small number of those users. As said earlier, the vast majority of use cases don't care about IDs apart from collisions. And you can't really expect those collisions to be the responsibility of the owner of the editor file

I've been doing some work into this kind of stuff and found that you can kind of avoid any of the editor specific IDs entirely. Kind of. How I did it was to create a huge number of new objects in the editor, export all that, then pull out all the unique IDs that the editor itself created. Then use them as the unique IDs I use. Then I think what you say is largely correct, and any other IDs the editor creates (because hoooooo boy, does it leave creating multiple IDs that mean nothing to anything else) just stay internal.

People that don't use the editor, but really want the editor files themselves need to realise that the Editor itself can be absolutely awful to use, and, at best, is not at all set up to be able to efficiently create large edits. Like, not at all. As a tool for being able to basically crack open the guts of the game and change anything, it's great, but using it is a pain, and I take my hats off to those that make these files that have not just thousands of changes, but also delve into the advanced rules. Because it's incredibly painful.

I said earlier that interactions were the one remaining big issue with the game, and it seems like in some situations they're just as bad as they've ever been. End of season chat, team just promoted to the top flight and will almost certainly be one of the favourites to go down. On opening the conversation, one of the players says how there's no reason why we can't have a strong season. I tell them we can avoid relegation, even if that's via the relegation playoff. Can anyone guess how well they took that? If you guessed "Offended", congratulations! My insistence that "here, guys, I don't think you're all completely useless, my opinion is that you can not be the 12th worst team in a league already full of a lot of rubbish", sure changed their minds. Now instead of being offended, a few of them are insulted instead. waaaaay. EDIT: And more highlights from the same conversation. I tell them I'm going to give youth a chance, and the only specific comment is one of my players reacting "expressionless" with "I can't say I'm too bothered". Like someone replying on reddit with "This" or something. Why is that response picked out over the ones that are actually positive with the promise? And of course, once I say "that's it" for promises (because the available list got massively cut down on the 2nd go around), the same person who didn't care about my first one now moans that he expected to see more. Next comment, along the lines of the board aims. I tell them we've done well to adapt to our new style of play. We've exceeded expectations, although admittedly not by much, and won the league. We were a bit awkward at times, but near enough the best defence, best forward line, surely that's not a controversial thing to say? Most agree. Except one. And his reply gives me pretty much nothing to work with beyond him being a moany dick (which he is in real life, to be fair). I'm not convinced players are coded to be at all human in these conversations. I'm sure it's a really difficult thing to get right given so many agents all interacting with each other, but when the game is probably in the greatest state it's ever been in, it's really galling that interactions are still so nonsensical.

Off topic, but it's kind of sad that this kind of match is never going to be a thing again. In any other well-marketed league, if you've got two bitter rivals essentially in a title playoff situation in the closing stages of the season, that gets dressed up massively with full, overblown coverage. Like last year with Arsenal and Man City. Here the approach is to avoid the match at all costs out of fear (from both sides, mind, let's not pretend like there would've been best behaviour had venues and result been switched). Plus, obviously the coin to Dallas is not good at all (some shot though), but if the SPFL continue to do their level best to not market us at all, it'd be nice if there was at least some sizzle put back into the one (supposed) bright spot in the league.

I think a lot of people struggle with FM being a vehicle for imagination rather than a substitute for it. It's still pretty sterile in my view, but it's definitely possible to go off on complete tangents in this kind of gameworld and make your own story. I'd embrace the mad stuff too, it would be far worse without it. But then this is the game where people continue to use the now cliched "immersion breaking" phrase because they've noticed there's no queue at the hotdog stand, so can't expect much.

I'll say it quietly, as it usually lasts just long enough for the game to realise I'm truly dreadful at it, but I think this may be my favourite edition in a long time. I haven't seen anything noticeably buggy yet, and all the little things added are making for a pretty enjoyable game. The match engine in particular is looking very, very good. It's never looked as "real" as it does now. In a way it's a shame that this is the end of an ME that's been continuously upgraded for over two decades now, but it's as good a tribute to the work that's been put in as you could probably get. It's not perfect by any means though. I don't really have a playstyle that gets down into the weeds too often, but interaction is still pretty poor. I've not seen any of the really wild switches that I was getting in 23, but there's still come pretty odd looking results.

FM is one of those games where it's not about the individual new features, but about how everything combines to add up to the entire product. One amazing new feature might be received very well, but if your day-to-day interactions with the game are still a depressing grind, it's not going to mean much. If they added no major new features, but a million little quality of life improvements that do the opposite, that's going to hit a lot more. It's why the marketing for this game - and to a lesser extent, any title - is becoming less and less relevant as time goes on. It'd be an interesting hypothetical experiment for them to release a product with pretty much no hype or marketing and leave the users to form their own opinions. I think it would end up far more positive generally to be honest.

You mean a party whose livelihood depends on a product is initially positive about the product? I'm shocked to my very core. No-one's opinion, regardless of how long that person spends on the product, is going to be a match for your own.

No well designed laptop will ever let itself get so hot that it would cause actual damage. They're designed to switch themselves off before it ever gets to that. The game is processor-heavy, far more so than Spotify and Web Browsers, so it's always going to get hotter. I doubt it's going to get bad enough to cause any damage.

...yeah, think I'll stand by my original post. For the record, I don't particularly seek out women's sports to watch. I caught a few of the World Cup games if I was in work at the time as background noise. My own team's women's team are doing alright, and I could get regular free tickets to another team in the city through connections, but I don't. I don't particularly enjoy watching Thistle a lot of the time, let alone dropping into what is basically a different sport. But you see the difference? I don't write long diatribes trying to point out how poor it is and how little people are interested in it. That's, at best, someone playing out their unconscious bias. And at worst...well, you know. Still interested in it from an FM perspective though, and not just because it's going to make a lot of people pathetically fizz. It's probably the only thing left the game could add that actually adds something noticeably different to the game.

I don't want to sign up for FMFC, but I'd do it a thousand times before I watched FM content on YouTube to be fair.

... It's sad in a way. If these kinds of machines are people, they're relatively smart but hopelessly naive, and they can't say no. There was that Microsoft bot they unleashed on Twitter a while back, and they had to switch it off in less than 24 hours because it started parroting some really horrendous stuff (some of which was just imitating people, but other cases of it coming up with very questionable stuff of its own accord). There's also the case of the German artist who managed to completely invalidate Google Maps by wheeling around a trolley with 99 GPS-enabled phones, tricking the system into thinking there was this incredible traffic jam. And the fact that Amazon brought those delivery robots in in several towns, and people kept turning them onto their backs and generally mucking about with them. Point is, for every cool piece of tech, there's going to be a lot of people who just want to see it burn to the ground so they can laugh at the embers. And while you can argue that the Google Maps and Amazon examples aren't really too harmful, when it comes to something like AI, the consequences of it going off the rails are a little more serious, and only going to get more serious as they get more powerful. But that's going off on a wild tangent, of course.

Yeah, I don't want to take it down a privacy route, because I find that argument a bit overblown whenever it's thrown out for something so flippant, for me it's more that you're presumably putting this out to create hype for the new product, yet you lock it behind something you have to opt-in to. I know it's free, and I know it's no risk whatsoever, but it's similar to that era where they refused to do anything but social media and video content. Surely it's better to reach as many people as possible, rather than using it as bait to try and get people to sign up for something that's seemed largely pointless up to now. But hey, they can do what they like of course, not like I'm missing much I imagine.

So they're limiting marketing hype now behind a (admittedly free) subscription wall? Seems an odd decision.

It's still massively weakened by the dataset itself. When it was first flavour of the month, it's getting certain fairly simple mathematical concepts spot on, and that has since drifted to returning stuff that is completely wrong. Also wouldn't be entirely surprised if for every person there is out there making the service more reliable, there will be at least a couple working to undermine it, either for nefarious purposes, or just because it's funny to them.

Which is basically what GPT is. It's going out and assimilating all the information it can find and putting together an answer, exactly the same as any human person would do, but "quicker". Only it doesn't have that extra layer of "wait, is this bs?", so is well capable of parroting back popular but ultimately wrong information. It was cool tech, and it's probably going to be a basis of some even cooler stuff in future, but if we're still talking about it's relevance relating to FM, nothing has changed since this thread was started. It's still not doing anything particularly groundbreaking or useful.

I'd say that it's a mystery why people are so desperate to show off how little they care, but...well, it's not is it? Being personally uninterested in it I can understand. Being so desperate to extrapolate that out into saying how uninterested everyone else will be seems like you're just, as they say, telling on yourself. But as a result, I hope they spend all their time on it given the tizzy some will get in over it.

I'm probably going to try and return here for FM24, but with something that seems a whole lot different. I've always been quite curious in turning FM into more of a story generator, rather than necessarily relying on how I'm playing it. So kind of using playing the game (or even just monitoring it) as the means of getting the broad brush strokes, then surrounding it with the other nonsense that can make threads so much more entertaining. So for months now I've been working on something in the background that makes the editor less eye-bleedingly tedious to use, with the aim of being able to make large-scale edits/creations of players, clubs, everything in the world. This is ultimately going to be about creating a completely new world (which I've dabbled with in the past) but as a test, I'm going to be making a much smaller edit that puts some completely fictional clubs into the Scottish pyramid, with hand-crafted custom players and associated "extreme" personalities. Then use that world to play through and generate a story or thread off the back of it. Almost like a combination of something from this forum, the experiments forum, and the full-on FM stories one. As a taster of the idea (the current one at least), it would be the story of a fictional Scottish phoenix club that rose from the ashes of a Gretna-like club that ended up going bust. At the same time, the "old" dead club would have been revived, creating a ready-made rivalry. The players on the phoenix club would have specific traits - the forward who is absolutely massive but technically awful, the psychopathic midfield general, the hilariously tiny goalkeeper - that would see things be a little more interesting. I often talk a good game, so this may well never get off the ground, but hoping it can be something a bit different if people are interested.

I think the original point was whether a save would be good rather than a specific editor file. You're right that the files themselves need updated, because they'll potentially be working over the top of an updated database. A save wouldn't have this problem, as the database would be constant. Of course, that's just for one edition, the above would obviously not be at all true going from 23 to 24. I'm guessing the game will do something similar to the reverification process behind the scenes to align things, but really it's anyone's guess how it's going to go with edited files.

The database is essentially part of the save (probably the vast majority of it to be honest). You can test yourself by starting a save with an editor file and then completely removing said editor file, your save will still work. So if you're talking FM23 to FM23, you'll be fine with edited databases. As for FM24, all that's been said as far as I know is that it should work. I assume that wording means that it'll be expected to be OK, but if it doesn't then you're unlikely to get a huge amount of support from SI. Some things might not work perfectly, or at all. Remains to be seen.

Usually much older and less attractive than their respective partner, whilst also significantly richer tbh.

There's absolutely zero chance that SI are going to put features into the game that only affect levels of the game they don't themselves support. That would be an incredible waste of resources.

None of any of these blogs is going to mean much until it's actually observed in practice. They could completely underwhelm with promotion but the game be a joy to play, and they could knock it out the park with hype and the game itself is a complete dud. What they've said sounds promising, but it doesn't really mean a whole lot just yet.