bibird.
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Posts posted by bibird.
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December 2020: The Squad
The squad I've inherited is drastically short of options at centre back, with only one player naturally capable in the role, Jan Eklund. Unfortunately, at only 175cms tall and with poor heading and jumping reach, he's not a viable option there. Left back, Jesse Mutikainen will be retrained to play at CB, with his superior height and jumping reach, but it's a position I will definitely have to strengthen urgently.
Ghanaian midfielder, Quincy Osei, stands out as an impressive option in the centre, capable in a variety of roles.
Up top, Joel Paatelainen, son of former Bolton and Wolves striker, Mixu, is the standout option.
A glance at the physical comparison page shows the squad are the quickest in the league, but also the weakest and worst aerially. It does also show we are, not surprisingly, one of the poorest sides technically and mentally. This will feed into my tactical thinking, as we can look to play a higher line and try to attack swiftly with the pace we possess.
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December 2020: The Save
I've always enjoyed reading stories on these forums, notably the saves of @_Ben_ and @Jimbokav1971, as they've greatly influenced my way of playing the game. Something i've wanted to try over 2021 is to write more of my own stuff, to work on refining my technique, so this felt like a good opportunity to do so.
I've dabbled a bit since FM21 came out with a Dafuge style save with Buxton, but for this save I've opted to play as FC Viikingit. Formed in 1965, the team are located in Vuosaari, east Helsinki, just round the corner from where my best mate lives. I've been reliably informed that the pitch is currently being used as an ice rink for the neighbourhood to play ice hockey during winter.
Viikingit's Wikipedia page shows the club have played a sole season in the Finnish Premier Division, in 2007. Aside from that brief stint in the Veikkausliiga, most of the last 30 years have been spent drifting between the second and third tiers of Finnish football.
The Finnish leagues are relatively short, playing through the summer months, with the Finnish Cup seeming to begin in late January. My knowledge of Finnish football is rather limited, so I'll be picking up the nuances of the league system on the fly. It would be nice to look at developing some young talent and grow the club to get some European appearances, but that is a long way away yet.
I've holidayed a few months to December 2020 for Viikingit to gain promotion from the third tier. The second tier appears to be mostly semi-pro teams, with a couple of fully professional clubs and a lone amateur side. The Premier Division is pretty much entirely professional, aside from one semi-pro, so I'd be looking to advance to a fully professional set up after promotion.
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He's great physically, but doesn't have any stand out features technically, aside from crossing and his two footedness. I can't see him changing a game for you in the business end of the Champions League, but he would be a good utility man in a squad. I think his fee would be a bit rich for a utility option though.
He reminds me quite a lot of Michail Antonio.
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Has anyone managed to ever get Velez C.F. promoted in Spain for this challenge? Or does anyone have any knowledge of upploaded databses where they may have been promoted? I've been reloading for most fo the last 24 hours to try and get them up in to the reorganised Spanish system and they never seem to get promoted. Does anyone have any knowledge as to why they won't have been coming up?
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4 hours ago, HUNT3R said:
You can definitely use other 'styles'. I've had lots of success in FM19, 20 and now in 21 without ever using gegenpress (or the counter pressing TI). Have written quite a bit in the various threads about it last year, along with Herne too.
Gegenpress could (and I do mean could) be an easy solution to your issues, but it doesn't mean that others aren't viable. Looking at your previous thread, you seem to have tried gegenpress there and it wasn't overly successful, so it doesn't seem to be the magic solution for you either.
I don't think anyone sets up a perfect tactic straight away. I certainly don't. Set up something, ideally in pre-season and use the friendly matches to see how it performs on the pitch. Whether you're getting the movement you want in transition or in possession and whether your players are able to link up, ie have passing options available.
On the more defensive side of things, there are things to look for as well. Do you have enough cover against quick counters, is your D-line too high or too low, could you do with engaging earlier (LoE) etc?
Personally, analysing the defence is one of my weaker areas, but I have improved over the years. Some, like Cleon and Rashidi are much, much better at spotting D-Line issues etc. To make it easier for myself, I have a rule of thumb and while it doesn't guarantee that my setup is perfect, it helps me to not be over aggressive or far too passive in defence.
If I set up a tactic that's fairly deep with not that much closing down, I make up for it with tackling aggressiveness. Once they get to my third of the pitch, we're hitting them hard. I will be fairly compact, so there are lots of players. We're aggressive in the tackle (which is a bit of a risk) but if I do miss the odd tackle, there should be others to cover.
If I am more aggressive with a high line and pressing (still not necessarily counter-pressing as I haven't used that for the last 3 versions), I'd ask players to stay on their feet. The idea is that we press heavily and try to force mistakes, catching poor first touches, dwelling or misplaced/rushed passes. For that reason, I don't need to jump into risky tackles that could give the opposition a lot of space if they're missed.
Obviously, if I don't do either, then I keep pressing, tackling etc fairly balanced and just tweak DL and LoE mainly.
Maybe that helps, maybe it doesn't. Anyway, think about what you want to set up and how that would translate into FM. Roles, duties etc. Try and keep TIs and PIs to a minimum (IMO) and tweak that as you see your tactic in action over the course of a couple of friendlies. This is what I do at every new club in any version. After 2 or 3 friendlies, I would know that the core of the tactic is solid. I won't stop tweaking because I don't think it's possible to spot everything in such a short time.
Also, remember that the starting tactic is just one (though it's a big one) part of a result. Your tactic could be great for 85mins of a match and have you 1-0 up, when the opposition suddenly switches to a 343 all out attack and gets the equaliser. That's not the fault of the tactic in general - just that you should have probably tightened up more toward the end.
Then there are the players to consider - whether they're Consistent, not afraid of Big Matches, can handle Pressure which are all factors outside of the visible attributes. Your tactic could be great, but then you have a rival match and you field 11 players who dread Big Matches... and things fall apart.
Even then, matches don't always go your way. Maybe you face a plucky team who score a set-piece goal early on. Now they will shut up shop and park every bus they can find. That's a different beast. How does your tactic fare against that? Do you keep doing what you're doing, if you know that you're still good, tactically? Do you know you can get a better advantage if you use your plan B? Do you have a plan B or C?
Something I do, is put a lot of thought into who I start a match with. If I see the opposition DR will likely be slow, then I try and get a fast left winger to play against him. If I see the 2x central defenders are excellent in the air, but weaker in terms of positioning and tackling, I'd swap out my target man type forward for one who is better off the ball and a good dribbler. That sort of thing.
Hopefully that gives you some ideas.
@HUNT3R I just wanted to thank you for the posts you offer on these forums. Solid, actionable advice and well-explained, rather than just telling people they need to consider concepts that they might not fully understand yet. It's well broken down and easy for a novice player to understand too. The effort and generosity you put in to help people is commendable. Thank you.
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On 27/01/2021 at 06:25, Mike_Cardinal said:
Yeah I take your point - I guess the main thing is that it's a FB forming the back three, not a DM.
I would say Cancelo is playing at least as an IWBs, probably even as an IWBa last night - I find the IWBd tucking inside makes them more suited than an FBd to this role, but it would be a case of trial and error with the match engine.
My general principle that I follow with the IWB role is this: on defend duty, they'll slot into the DM band, on support they'll go to CM band and on attack they'll venture forward to the AM band.
This is generally what I've observed when using the IWB on those duties.
The FB on defend will usually sit in the defensive line, occasionally advancing when the situation presents itself. Obviously, it won't tuck in as much, even with sit narrower, but it does keep that chain of three in the back line for build up.
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12 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:
That's true. But the problem occurs - or is at least likely to occur - when the fullback is left to his own devices while covering for "his" attack-minded midfielder. Plus, in this particular case we were talking about a possession-oriented 4231 tactic, which is also a factor that needs to be taken into account.
I'm not sure I follow much of what you've been saying in this thread, @Experienced Defender.
A lot of is it really ambiguous, especially the "when the fullback is left to his own devices" comment. What do you mean by this?
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- Popular Post
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I've been thinking a lot recently about attributes in conjunction with roles and duties and wanted to post some of my thoughts on them.
Reading the thread by@Rashidi on evaluating lower league squads made me realise the importance of certain attributes when building a tactic and style of play, whilst selecting useful roles and duties for the players you have at your disposal. This then led me to consider how to develop contrasting tactics for different scenarios.
I had always wondered about how to play the game in a manner similar to Sir Alex Ferguson at Manchester United. During the late 00s, he would regularly deploy Wayne Rooney, Cristiano Ronaldo, Carlos Tevez, Ryan Giggs and Ji-Sung Park in a variety of different roles on a game by game basis to attack what he considered to be deficiencies in United's oppostion. This is without even going into how he tweaked his use of more defensive minded players - notably once selecting no fewer than seven nominal defenders in a match against the team I support, Arsenal (my adoration of the more dogmatic Arsene Wenger is perhaps a prime reason why I have always just set a tactic for my team at the start of the season and hoped to wipe the floor with all who dare to stand before me).
This week I noticed some posts by @Atarin in a thread about Tottenham's tactics under Mourinho. Their analysis of the different roles and duties used by Mourinho in varying situations really struck something for me.
In the post, Harry Kane was described as having been used in a variety of roles and duties depending on the oppostion or game state. Looking at Kane's attributes, you can see why this is the case:
He's clearly world class in so many technical and mental facets of the game and can overcome his relatively average physicality. While his "best" role/duty is listed as being a DLF(s), he would be just as competent as a AP(s) in the attacking midfield slot - not a position or role most people would associate with Kane. His attributes mean he would be capable to fill a wide variety of roles in different tactics, opening up options to you as the manager.
On the flip side, let's consider how attributes could affect a less rounded player when it comes to role/duty selection:
Granit Xhaka has a couple of world class attributes - his passing, vision and technique are up there with the best of them. However, his limited capabilities when it comes to concentration, positioning and acceleration mean he would struggle to help the team in the defensive transition and defensive phases. While he's classed as "natural" in defensive midfield, I'd be terrified using him there against Premier League attackers. For a player whose "best" role is as DLP(s), he would struggle in some key aspects of his role and, as such, his team would have to carry him far more. If you can strike the right balance in teammates and roles around him his passing ability would cause damage, but it means you're far more stifled in terms of tactical flexibilty.
In the past, I'd always wanted to stick my best players in their "best role" as deigned by the ambiguous star rating and hope that they can thrive in a role and duty that suits them the best, regardless of opposition. Understanding attributes and roles/duties from reading these threads and posts combined made me realise that this simply is not the case and that the game can be played in a way that is far truer to real life.
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On 07/01/2021 at 09:10, frukox said:
This is what you are looking for:
I'd wholeheartedly second this.
I read this thread extensively while setting up my own Dafuge tactic and squad building with Buxton. Admittedly, I'm only two games into my first season and have lost both those matches 1-0 (both really late goals), but reading this extensively means I know where the best points to tinker with my tactic are and how to make informed decisions. I'm less disheartened at this stage than I would have been in the past.
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Interesting piece on the BBC today: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/54737758
Nothing mind-blowing, but a good refresher for a few key aspects of this thread.
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5 hours ago, _Ben_ said:
Geilton: Forward planning
Geilton is a key player for us and has been for the past twelve years or so. However, he turns 30 this year and, given his long career, which stands at 663 games to date, I worry that his legs will go pretty soon, making him unsuitable for the offensive WB(a) that I play but I want him to stay on for as long as he can.
Therefore, I think that he'd be more suitable as a DM(s) on the right hand side of a two. Below is his suitability for that role, based on his key attributes:
His game will rely less on his acceleration/pace and more on his stamina, which, right now, is great. It'll also allow his pretty solid playmaking ability (passing/vision/decisions) to come into play and, when playing along side a ball winner, could even become a bit of a regista type player given his good passing range and intelligence.
He'll start retraining and playing there now, freeing up a spot for Jose Esdras and potentially filling that issue slot that Rodrigo Dinamite currently holds.
EDIT:
A solid start...
I am a huge fan of the Lahm-ification of Geilton.
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Too many years lurking, not enough years posting. I'm starting with the team, I believe, that is closest to me geographically IRL - Basford United
Finances
A quick glance over the squad leads me to believe I shouldn't need too many reinforcements (I'm not a fan of sweeping changes when taking over a club), so I should be able to maintain the board's demand to keep control of wages. I'll definitely be looking to bring in some staff, though, as we're completely barren in that regard.
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4 hours ago, herne79 said:
Roles & duties are just one half of the equation. The players themselves make up the other half. So my BWM-D is a hard tackling midfield destroyer with great positional awareness but is still comfortable on the ball. Think an aggressive ball playing defender but in midfield. The BWM-S is better on the ball and will get forward more in support, but can still tackle. Think an aggressive BBM or RPM. Both have bags of aggression, determination and work rate.
The thinking here is to provide a hard working, tough tackling front line of defence - players who will get in the face of the opposition, break up attacks before they start and recycle the ball back to my lethal front 3. I could have used other roles & duties and adjusted PIs to suit, but if the BWM role is already set up there's no need to bother.
I think there's a general misconception that the BWM is some sort of headless chicken who gets pulled out of position all the time. So I'll go back to my first sentence - the role is just one half of the equation: so use the wrong player and yeh, you'll be asking for trouble.
It doesn’t sound entirely dissimilar from van Gaal‘s 3-5-2 that the Netherlands used in the 2014 WC against Spain. Two hard tackling, grafting, ball winners in the centre of midfield (de Jong and de Guzman), numbers to provide stability in defence and three lethal attackers (Sneijder, Robben and van Persie) allowed to play their natural game.
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1 hour ago, BamBamBam said:
So to get back on topic, is which personality is top and is there a Order of the best. I’m guessing model citizen is top, after that?
I would't say that there is a definitive hierarchy at all, just that there are definitely personalities that are more beneficial than others. Model Professional, Professional and Resolute all seem to crop up often as examples of positive personalities.
@_Ben_ and @Jimbokav1971 both cover personalities extensively in their threads on the FMCU board, so it's worth checking those out for some good ideas regarding them. @That There Phil also has a really good thread on building a squad full of Model Citizens.
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@fmFutbolManager has written a couple of brilliant posts on his blog about how he sets up pre-season training. Not sure what the rules are on posting links, but they’re well worth searching for.
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1 hour ago, rfookes said:
TLDR - my tactic was good last season and isn't too good now, what gives?
So I'm currently managing Barrow in the Vanarama National League, and last season we performed above expectations, finishing in the playoffs (which we then proceeded to lose on penalties, but that's beside the point). We set up for the majority of the season with this assymetric 4-4-2:
Both of our strikers finished in the top 4/5 scorers, we scored a hatful of goals, but we weren't too convincing defensively and were a bit inconsistent which meant that we didn't finish higher. However, it was still better than expected, so I was buzzing to start the next campaign and hopefully improve.
We didn't improve. We're around 12 games into this season and really struggling; we seem to have lost the goalscoring threat we had, scoring barely a goal a game, and still leak them in, all of which has resulted in us floating around the bottom half of the table so far.
Is my tactic flawed? Is the slight lack of quality in the team catching up to us? If anyone could help I'd be super appreciative!
The way I see it is in non-league there are no great players. Anyone who is great will generally leave pretty quickly, so you've always got a pretty even field in terms of competition. This means that anyone really can beat anyone. Therefore, when the AI adapts to your non-league tactic, it'll be easier to beat than if you were a top Premier League side with inherently better players than one fighting relegation.
Your tactic doesn't look too bad and it doesn't have too many TIs to muddy the waters, so that's helpful. I'd look to drop back to a Balanced mentality at least for a couple of games to see if this can tighten up your defence slightly. I'd also ditch the right sided overlap, as your right back is already attacking and will overlap naturally without the increase to his individual mentality the shout causes. I'm not a fan of asymmetric formations as they create gaps in the defensive structure, so I'd consider moving your DM to a CMd (he'll still cover your marauding right back) and see if that helps.
Personally, when I play lower league saves I look to build a rapport with my players as quickly as possible through interactions regarding match and training performances. I nicked this idea (along with many others) from @_Ben_ in this post:
I'd recommend reading his threads if you get a chance, they're all amazing.
Good luck.
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17 hours ago, jonnyboy said:
Good evening everyone, can someone please tell me what the faded player icons mean here? Thank you
@Experienced Defender is correct, they're injured. It could also be that they're on holiday for an extended period at the start of pre-season.
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35 minutes ago, Miek said:
BME?
“Be More Expressive” TI
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On 30/06/2020 at 11:23, crestofadave said:
To give a bit of pre-amble, due to time constraints I am playing FM20 Touch. Started my first game of this year in May. As I usually do, started first game with Man Utd and have had success. Into the fifth season I have two league titles and 3 cup wins (none in Europe). After winning the 2nd league title, I had cash to spare and (inspired by Chelsea paying 200m for Ousmane Dembele) decided to see what happened if I went for Mbappe. In a bit of a surprise, PSG accepted 200m and Mbappe agreed to a contract that was not much more than what Utd were paying Alexis Sanchez who I had just gotten off the books. I was like a kid at Christmas as I expected Mbappe to pretty much tear it up. I knew he wasn't going to average around an 8 like he had at PSG or Messi and Ronaldo do in the game, but I was hoping for a nice 7.5. I never ever play as Real Madrid, PSG or Barca so never own the best player in the game. So yeah, excited.
First half of the first season and Mbappe was doing decent. He scored some goals (was on around 18 before Christmas and finished the season with 25 as a whole) and he played well. Then Qatar happened. Off he went to the World Cup in December and it was like he never came back. Second half of the season he averaged a 6.75 as the title slipped away by two points. I tried playing through it, no luck. Resting him, no improvement. I played him upfront (advanced forward), left wing (inside forward), right wing (winger). All my other attacking players have continued to be good (or at least good spells followed by erratic spells). As we approach the half way stage of my second season with Mbappe he is now averaging about a 6.8. He was in the World Player of the year shortlist which was fairly hilarious as all other players were about 7.5 and above and he was dead last. It seems every game he rounds the whole team only to miss one on one. Last game he finished on a 5.8 without missing a penalty or getting sent off, which is almost impressive.
I have tried everything I can think of and as it is FM Touch, there isn't much more I can do. I intend for this to be my last season with United as I want to move on to a more challenging save however I would really like to finish it with both a Champions League win, and a sense that this transfer was actually worth it! Any ideas would be much appreciated.
I mainly play a Positive 4-2-3-1 (with this being my preferred forward line):
Lautauro M
Rashford J. David Mbappe
A few bits to unpack here. Firstly, Martinez, Mbappe and Rashford are all quick forwards, suited to breaking into space behind opposition defences. None of them have great aerial capabilities or are massively creative. Your choice of Advanced Forward and a left sided Inside Forward does suit your options. You'll want to try to create that space for them by dropping off slightly when the opposition have the ball. Then you can win the ball back in midfield and look to launch passes quickly to get your men in behind.
I'd suggest having a look at the player comparison of Rashford and Mbappe. I had a quick check on one of my saves and their hexagon is almost identically shaped, but with Rashford being inferior in all but aerial attributes. There's no doubting that Rashford is a great player (and a wonderful human being), but Mbappe is simply better at what they both do well. To have a squad option like Rashford is fortunate, as he can fill in a few positions.
For me, Mbappe doesn't make a great winger as his crossing, passing and work rate aren't fantastic. It's not a role that looks to bring the best out of him.
I think you have to pick two from Mbappe, Rashford and Martinez each game and try to avoid shoehorning them into roles that are unsuited. Then I'd have a look at seeing what you can do with the right wing position, perhaps see if you have a creative player who can fire your guys passes and crosses. Having that quality rotation option will be really useful for you throughout the season.
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Is it just me or did there used to be a tab that compared different statistics for each of your formations? I've been looking for it and can't find it now.
It had information there, such as time spent using each formation, shots attempted/conceded and when goals were scored for and against in different time periods of a match.
Can anyone shed any light on where this tab might of gone? I can't find it for love nor money!
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I would image that the theory still applies and it's a case of seeing if any new attributes have been moved around into different categories.
I've checked and some of the attributes have been moved into different categories. The most obvious changes are part of the goalkeeping category split, but there is no longer a category for set pieces and crossing is now a part of the attacking category.
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[FM21] - FC Viikingit
in FM Career Updates
Posted
December 2020: Finnish Cup Draw
As I mentioned in the opening post, my knowledge of Finnish football is limited, but I'm already learning.
The Finnish Cup appears to have a group stage, whereby we face each other team in the group once. The top two progress to the second round, which I presume will go to a straight knockout tournament. There appears to be a Premier Division group stage too, where the top 4 of each group progress. Trialists can play in group stage matches too, so it has a bit of a pre-season vibe about it.