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4-1-4-1...v2...great back and front


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Originally posted by Millsinho:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by www2:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Millsinho:

Hi www2,

Well done for creating another great tactic, and thanks for sharing it! After using your 4-4-3/4-5-1 Posession tactic on 8.0.1, and now this one on 8.0.2, it seems that you have a knack for creating really solid consistent tactics. Personally, that's exactly what I want too - nice and tight at the back whilst giving your team good enough results to overperform a bit and make the game fun to play.

Anyway, they say that flattery gets you everywhere, so I thought I'd get that bit out of the way first before making a request!Could you post the top, say 5, attributes you look for when selecting / buying players to fit this tactic please? I know the defenders are pretty obvious (although I'd still be interested in your opinion on them), but I'm particularly interested in the MR and, to a lesser extent, the two MCs as well.

Thanks again icon14.gif

Thanks and happy to help.

Gonna post those attributes later on today, as I dont have the time now </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks mate,

Much appreciated icon14.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

First of all I have to say that in my opinion the most important attribute in this years edition of FM are without a doubt physical attribute mainly acceleration, pace and strenght.

One more thing I have to say is that I will post the attributes I am looking when playing a club which can afford big players.

All grades should be marked as no less than...

The red ones are a must...

These are just on top of my head, but are the most important ones. Also note that I highly rate workrate, determination and teamwork.....after a quick look I just saw that from my first 11 only 3 have determination less than 15, 5 have teamwork less than 15, and only 2 have workrate less than 15.

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Originally posted by roblovesleeds:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jinli:

This is how the tactic should look when tweaked and work wonder for me.

Home Tactic

Home.jpg

Away Tactic Team Instruction

AwayTeamInstructions.jpg

Are you tweaking the instructions for the home tactic? and are you altering the shape of the away tactic? or is it as the original should be? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

away just use the original tactic but with the change instruction

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Originally posted by na3c0:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by www2:

Finally 14 years since I took them over.....now onto the CL icon_biggrin.gif

Just out of curiosity, why was Man.Utd deducted 9pts in your game in 2021? Match fixing? icon_wink.gificon_biggrin.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Administration

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this tactic has turned into Rafa Benitez,

I am battering people in cups, I won the UEFA cup two years ago and reached the final last year, I just hammered Celtic 5-2 away in the champions league but my league record this season is W2 D5 L1,

I beat Celtic 5-2 but struggle to get a 1-1 draw with Derby C.

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Originally posted by Helmerzinho:

How is it going? im a Norwegian team (RBK)and are looking for a decent tactic for 8.0.2 patch. The croats seems to have lost some of its edge, and i need european success.

Is this a solution?

i can download and try iticon_smile.gif

justy tried it and i won 3-0 against a team in the division belowe me. had 12/8 in shots, 52%pos and only let them get 2 chances.

next match i played a team in the div belowe to, at home i managed a 2-2 draw, but it all slipped from 2-0 when i substituted one of my DC. guess this is crutial for gameplay in 8.0.2...

had 13/6 shots and 50%pos. They had 10/5 shots, but most after 75min when i did the changes in my defence..

gonna try it a bit more, the league is about to start, so im looking forward to battle for gold!

thanx m8, be back with more...

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Thought I'd leave some feedback on this tactic with Cambridge in Conference.

First 4 games with the tactic, I won with ease then for the rest of the season was losing more games than winning finishing 17th.

Maybe my age is catching up with me but this is the first FM (or CM from the old days) where no tactic I try has any success whatsoever icon_frown.gif

Is this a feature of FM these days ? Any advice welcomed ! icon_biggrin.gificon_smile.gif

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Just a couple of observations about this tactic, if they all are fair observations or criticisms will be for you to decide.

Used with Celta Vigo and also my friend using Real Soceidad in the Spainish 2nd Division. Got us both promoted with a 1/2 finish - As Celta Vigo I noticed that the games which were played in extremely wet conditions I struggled with and I would get very few chances. Probably partly due to me not having as good a striker as a AML/FC - but my left sided striker scored far more and had a far bigger impact on the game than anyone else. In tougher games, my striker would disappear out of the game completely.

The strangest thing about this tactic - intentional or not - is the amount of 20-25 yard strikes I was getting with it. If this is the 8.0.2 engine or the general design of the tactic I dont know, but after getting promoted it has led to wild inconsistency. I have seen 3 or 4 25 yarders a match regularly, but I have also gone on terrible runs when my squad has little condfidence - in these situations this tactic is not really 'grind out results friendly' - I have had numerous games where my shots on goal were in excess of 15 to the computers 5 or so, and been beaten by 3+ goals. Its more streak based than Ive ever seen a tactic be - if your morale is low you get slaughtered.

I should at this point say that I have reassessed the long range shooting sliders to make sure players I dont want to are shooting - most the shots are comming from the AMC, AML and Striker with the MR having more attempts if I am dominating the game.

In trying to deal with faster attacks I have tried lowering the defensive line, but I find that when I do this attacking options seem to be severely diminished. Again - seems that this tactic requires a high level of confidence as you need your whole team pushed up to work the ball around for openings. Your front three seem to be rarely involved in the game till the ball is just on the edge of your opponents box - the defence seem to be required in most buildups.

Im considering trying to go a bit more narrow/defensive in mentality all round/drop the defensive line slightly to solve these problems - as on a bad day Ive been shipping goals like crazy to some sides - but I fear this will wreck any attacking options. With this tactic, you seem to be prone to collapsing if you dont make significant changes to this tactic when your opponent is on top = I havent actually managed to make changes that have really changed the game yet if Im honest, and Ive tried a lot of things. Other than the half time hairdryer treatment anyway...

For success with this tactic, you need to develop your own far more conservatice tactic based off it I think. Any suggestions for what changes to make?

With Celta I finished 2nd to get promoted, then 14th and it looks like Im on course for another 14th as Im in a monster streak of not winning in the league. This is after a positive 6 game start that included beating Valencia.

Essay over.

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How's everybody getting on with away games. I find the tactic is spot on in home games and I regularly beat the big teams convincingly at home (I'm Liverpool btw).

However, I do seem to struggle a bit away - has anybody got any ideas. I've tried the tips about making it more of a counter attacking tactic away from home but still doesn't seem as effective.

Any ideas?

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Started using this tactic in my Cambridge Utd game in season 2. First season (in BSP) i used your previous traingle tac with a tweak (moved one MC up to an SC to play 2 up). Got promoted fairly easily, having probably strongest squad in division.

This tactic arrived just in time for 2nd season and i liked the shape so decided to give it a go. Luckily i was able to get in an AML/SC who turned out to be the best player in my squad, and probably the best in league 2. Again my squad should have been the best in the division, but had that before and still failed miserably! This time however, success. Promotion with 106pts for the season, gd of +57 (93 scored, 36 conceded).

Also seemed a great cup tactic, in the league cup i beat Plymouth, middlesborough, Cardiff & Birminghan before Arsenal knocked me out in ET in the QF (devestating, leading 2 v 1 into 4th minute of injury time, and their LB Traore scores a screamer!). Also put out Charlton in the FA cup.

In the early part of the season, only problem i had was poor return from my SC. Was only averaging around a goal every 4 or 5 games, and was getting low average rating (bizzarely, almost always worse in the first half, always a 6 at HT, usually a 7 at FT??). This may have been down to the players i had their, i was buying youth and although my main stiker was Lindado who has great potential, his current stats were not great, not particular quick or strong. Right at the end of the Jan transfer window i was able to bring in a better striker, Christian Nazarith and that seemed to fix the problem, he stuck away 14 goals in 15 games after signing icon_biggrin.gif

Planning to stick with it in League 1, and in 1st pre-season game the U's only went out and did this.....

camb1if2.th.jpg

icon_biggrin.gificon_biggrin.gif

Great work on the Tactic, much appreciated!

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Originally posted by HydeFantics:

this tactic is very convincing ....

i use Jinli tweaking for home and away ...

i hammered chelsea with 2-0 away .... nice !!

I used the Jili tweaking also and went 2-0 up vs Middleborough but the lost 3-2 icon_mad.gif

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Just won 24 games in a row in the league with Liverpool using this - really seems to be working well now - the only bad thing was it was Everton who ended my run icon_mad.gif

I use Jinli's tweaks for home (which I think WWW2 used as well) but just leave the tactic as it is away and seems to be working really well. Worked OK last season but just seems to be gelling more this season - that may have alot to do with the fact that I've bought Micah Richards, Zapata and Akinfeev though so am just not conceding many goals but am scoring alot.

Thanks WWW2 - this is definitely the most balanced tactic I've tried.

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Just thought id add my view -

Have been searching for a tactic that 'Works' for so long...tried this and Wala! the normal tactic is very good for home games, for a whole season away I struggled slightly to win, but if you simply tick counter attack , and notch the mentality bar down 3 clicks, and defensive line also Ive noticed a massice difference. Now uunbeaten in 32 premier Leauge games - P 26 W 18 D 8 L 0 F-60 A 14

and my away record is better than my home! and only conceded 7 goals away in 13 games! Class tactic! oh btw im with newcastle.

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ill just give a quick reply...

It took me a lot of games (12-15) to get used to the formation, but after that not a loss....

the last loss was against Bloodrivals BRANN and i had a comfy 3-0 at half time only to see them bang 4 behind my goalie in second half... It was an awaygame, and half time teamtalk was (pleased).

never using that again...

next mach up is against Lazio, away, third round qualify for Champions league...

i hope for a draw away, and/or score a goal...

ill post sm screenies later on..

any more development with tactics??

this tactic seems realistic as i have a decent run in the premiership in norway, but not unrealistic..

Just sold Marek Sappara to Lille for 50mill and used them on:

Sherman Cardenas, Koudelka (Brno), Torje (Steaua Bu.), toto tamoz and Vincent Enyeama(GK).

Enyeama was fantastic in 8.0.1 so i placed 20mill on the table for him. Hes twice the GK my 1st choice was before he arrived...

also got cardenas as he used to be good...not to shore now....

Torje 12mill looks pretty average....

Koudelka AMR looks awesome, i got him for 10mill from Brno, even when city and Besiktas was discusing contract with him he came to meicon_smile.gificon_smile.gif

might have something to do with me paying him three times what he wanted... Also worth saying is that to get Enyeama who said he had no intention to come to my club i payed him so much he npw earns three time the amount my second best player does... Hope it payes in the long run..

Only shitty thing is that i can only use 3Fgn players in each matchsquad, and ive got 10 now... guess i have to load out some of them..

Cheers

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@www2:I'm about to do an extensive tactic-test for your tactic (looking forward to that), but I was wondering about the MC's... I read somewhere in this thread that you said we should use a AMC/FC for the MCR-slot and a AMC (or MC) for the MCL-slot...is this really true?!

This would probably mean that your MCR isn't a natural in the MC-position, since there aren't too many MC/AMC/FC-players around...? So do you really use a player there who has no green dot (in the positions-screen) at MC?

Personally, I only use players who have a bright green dot for their positions (don't even accept a dark green dot), but your MCR will probably have an orange dot at best?

Before I start testing, I would like to know that I understand which players to use, otherwise the whole test is pretty useless...

Thank you!!

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One more question for www2: Jinli has uploaded a screen in which he says he has implemented your tweaks for playing at home or chasing a lead, but the DMC has a farrow that ends right between the MC's...

I believe you said that farrow should end right behind the MCR... Which one is right?

And finally, is it right that the only tweak you make at home is changing the team mentality two notches up? And that those farrows only come into play when chasing a game? Or am I mistaken and is it like Jinli says: both the changed team mentality AND the farrows at home?

Again, I better ask now and do a decent test, than having to start over the test halfway through...

Thank you!!

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Originally posted by WillemII@Tilburg:

@www2:I'm about to do an extensive tactic-test for your tactic (looking forward to that), but I was wondering about the MC's... I read somewhere in this thread that you said we should use a AMC/FC for the MCR-slot and a AMC (or MC) for the MCL-slot...is this really true?!

This would probably mean that your MCR isn't a natural in the MC-position, since there aren't too many MC/AMC/FC-players around...? So do you really use a player there who has no green dot (in the positions-screen) at MC?

Personally, I only use players who have a bright green dot for their positions (don't even accept a dark green dot), but your MCR will probably have an orange dot at best?

Before I start testing, I would like to know that I understand which players to use, otherwise the whole test is pretty useless...

Thank you!!

The player called Damir Males is playing my right MC and he doesnt have any description whatsoever for MC (nor green or even orange) just has natural positions for AMC and FC, and you can look at his stats.....

Of course that doesnt mean that someone else with natural MC position wouldnt be better (infact he surelly would) but why change it when hes doing great icon_wink.gif

On the left MC position i am playing almost every type of midfielder (DMC, MC, AMC) but most of the time its MC

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Originally posted by WillemII@Tilburg:

One more question for www2: Jinli has uploaded a screen in which he says he has implemented your tweaks for playing at home or chasing a lead, but the DMC has a farrow that ends right between the MC's...

I believe you said that farrow should end right behind the MCR... Which one is right?

And finally, is it right that the only tweak you make at home is changing the team mentality two notches up? And that those farrows only come into play when chasing a game? Or am I mistaken and is it like Jinli says: both the changed team mentality AND the farrows at home?

Again, I better ask now and do a decent test, than having to start over the test halfway through...

Thank you!!

The tactic as it is when you download it is what I use for all the games, just for home games as you said I put it two notches up (or even more, depending on the opponent).

There are people here who are saying that they have problems with the away games but I really dont have any issues with it home or away.

Maybe try to check the counter atack and lower the mentallity to under 10 with direct passing......

About the farrow on the DMC its like you said, it should go behing the right MC

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Hi www2.

Just thought I'd let you know that I'm in my first season with West Ham on the 8.02 patch and at the moemnt your tactic has saved my season. I was in 16th and I've used your tactic with the folowing results.

Wigan H 3-0

Derby A 4-4

Ports H 3-1

Chelsea H 3-0

Arsenal A 1-3

Liv H 3-0

Gren in goal, Neil and Pineda at FB and Samba and Upson at CB

Edu as the DM Noble as CM VDV as mental atttacking midfielder Ljungberg on the right.

Etherington left am and Ashton up front.

Having trouble with the formation away but at home no one can touch me.

Its turned Etherington into a monster player so I just wanted to make sure this wasn't a cheat as I don't normally download tactics??

Also if its not do you have an away tips?

Other than that thanks!

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Originally posted by www2:

They went to administration and the skin is flex

I love it when you get into a game (10 plus seasnons) and it throws up stuff like that.

Tried the tactic a couple of times and the AML always pops up with a critical goal for me.

Again, well done!

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heya guys havent been on here in a while, i thought id try this tactic as im in the second half of my 2nd season with bristol city an we lie in 16th place, and have gone 11 without a win, this tactic gave me my first win at charlton in the fa cup 1-0, but i lost to villa 4-3 when i had more shots, any help i took the advice on jinli and did a home and away tac, but what am i doing wrong?? cityhmmaj3.th.png villa defeat

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irealy struggle agains big teams...

played the game away against lazio 5 times to see what my team could do with variouse instructions and the best resoult was 4-1 to lazio... (im not cheating, have made a save so i can replay that game..) In norwegian league its working pretty well, but i get devestated agains bigger teams. Also my AML showes nothing! NADA! i got sherman Cardenas and Iversen playing AML every other game, but non of them score or get to many chances...

This does not seem to work the way its suposed to for me... i have 8.0.2 and are winning the league, but next season i think ill try another tac if nobody got any great ideas....

also my DC scores 4 in 15 matches on corner..not to goos even though hes strong and got 17 on jumping and 16 on heading..

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i've been trying to implent jinli's away tweeks to my game but i can't seem but get it working although i'm doing fantastic i'm middlesbrough in first season 4th at the moment could you please say exactly how many notches you tweak it

i feel stupid but it's quite hard to read

thanks guys

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Well, I have started my test with Dutch club Feyenoord and allthough it's still very much early days, things are looking good:

feyenoordxd0.th.jpg

I'm especially very happy about the amount of goals conceded!

However, one thing does bug me: the three games I drew, were all against (very) small teams (VVV, Excelsior and Sparta). I should have beaten them with ease and did dominate the games, but couldn't find the net (except once against VVV). I switched to the variant with all the farrows around the 60th minute in the hope to force a goal, but that didn't help...

www2, does this sound familiar or not? And if so, what's the cure? It could be that my striker is not fast enough (Roy Makaay), allthough he averages one goal per game...

Other than that: great tactic! I'm still unbeaten as you can see and just beat PSV at home.

I will report once the season is finished and if things went well, I will test it with a smaller team so we really know where we stand with this tactic of yours.

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I have not tried the tactic yet but I thought that a mirrored version might come in handy as there are easier to find great AMR/SC than AML/SC so here it is:

http://www.eatlime.com/download.lc?sid=11886C27-827D-D3F9-C62E-4AC551C71813

I simpy copied the player instructions so the DCR/DCL changed instruktions, same goes with the MCR/MCL and of course the AML is now AMR and the other way around.

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Right I’ve just started playing this, completed one season, and have used this formation which I do like a lot – despite the fact that’s its not symmetrical and that conflicts with my OCD as well.

I’m playing as Aberdeen and at home its great, I think I’d a 10-6-3 record overall. But away from home I’m really struggling. Think I picked up 15 points from my 19 away games, only winning 3 times away from home.

So have you got any tips for me as to how I should tweak it for playing away from home?

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I have just finished my first season with Feyenoord and despite winning the league, I'm not as impressed as maybe I should be...

First things first, here is the table:

tableai5.th.jpg[/url]

I think everybody will agree that 74 points are no guarantee for the title AT ALL. If the other top teams would have performed like they should have done, I wouldn't have won the league. My biggest criticism is that I lost too many points against teams which I should have destroyed easily: I drew against Excelsior (H), Heracles (A), VVV (A), Groningen (H) and lost against Excelsior (A), NEC (A)!! Those should ALL have been wins...

I also lost a bunch of points from games, which I could live with: I drew against Twente (A), NAC (A), Ajax (H) and Groningen (A) and lost against AZ (A), Ajax (A). Those results are naturally not great, but not strange.

Some statistics:

18 league goals scored from corners

16 league goals scored from indirect free kicks

So, what are the major issues of this tactic (in my humble opinion)? Let's take a look at the player stats after 34 league games:

statsbe7.th.jpg[/url]

I feel the MR should have contributed FAR more. His rating is through the roof, but 3 goals and 3 assists is too little. The ST should score FAR more goals...especially when I tell you that he got a hattrick once, which means he only scored 2 goals in the other 14 games... My ST has the ability to set the Dutch Premier Division on fire, so he can't be the problem.

Is it all that bad?

No way. The AML did AMAZING! So did the MCR. I was also very pleased with the contribution of the DMC (despite his relative low ratings) and I think 9 assists from the DR is pretty good as well.

I really feel this tactic could become very, very good with a few modifications. I will try to make those modifications myself and report back here.

Anyway, I thank www2 for his hard work and am really hoping he wil share his views on my season/stats.

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ok. I'm on here to stick up for www2 and say what a damn good tactic this is. I was 16th in the prem season 1 on 8.02 by mid December I finished 3rd ahead of Chelsea. I beat Arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool 3-0 at home. For the guy that has problems with strikers I bought a guy called Liedson who's awesome, got 19 goals in 18 games for me. I didn't have anyone awesome on the left either.

For the away tactic I've also had problems but just keep playing around with it. I beat Chelsea away just by dropping a few bars down a bit! Morale plays a big part.

I've just started my second season and I'm fifth after 5 games, having won all my games at home including 4-0 against Liverpool losing 1 away 3-4 to Man U and draing 1. Midd equalising in the last minute. I've also qualified for Champions League group stage after destroying Galatasary.

So cheers mate.

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WWW2 another great tactic. This one is one of the best I have used. I have used it on my Stoke team with great success. 6 games for 6 wins scoring over 3 goals in each game.

The only problem I can see so far with this tactic is that it has made FM 08 boring as I cant stop winning and am not even being challenged by strong opposition. I must say I am in season 2018 and have built a world class team which must alos be a factor.

The only changes I have made is I play counter, drop d-line and more direct when I am winning by to shut the game out or when I am playing a strong team away.

Great tactic well done.

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I'm Plymouth in the first season and I'm really struggling away from home.

Home: 5-2-1

Away: 1-2-5

I tried some tweaks mentioned in the thread but to no avail. In the last match I tried a diffrent approach with farrows on the FB and DMC and managed to secure the first away victory against QPR in the dying seconds of the match. Hopefully this will help my players "realize" that we CAN win away from home...

Oh, my striker, MacLean (?) gets awesome ratings but only scores on pks, maby 2 or 3 "play"-goals.

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Thank you guys for all the good words....and bad ones too.

I am at that period when I just lose interest in FM. Not trying to brag but it seems that if I take atleast half an hour to create a new tactic I am going to crush the opponents.....I am having serious second thoughts about 8.0.2.....the amount of goals is cr@p.....I mean which ever tactic I create I am scoring for fun.

As it says under my sign I am in a whole new world right now (a better one????? icon_confused.gif...maybe).......... Guybrush Threepwood rules...... icon_wink.gif

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I must say, I am loving this.

As some of you may know, to test tactics I start a new game as Sunderland.

I believe this will REALLY seperate the "Good" tactics from the "Good with Barcelona" tactics.

First off, I signed Palacio, Ponzio and Buanannotte, bolstering my midfield and attack.

After a few games the results were poor but I was playing well, and I especially loved the swift passing in the final third.

I decided to tinker a bit to suit my players more.

I played Andy Reid in the AML position with Keiran Richardson in the middle, and selected them to swap positions.

I also set the right MC to have a farrow right into the box, and shortened the AMR farrow by one step.

I then placed a short farrow on the DL.

Aside from this, I merely altered the marking to tight but zonal for my DCs (with man marking they are dragged out of position too often) and set my DMC to hard tackling.

Basically, not a lot of tweaking, so I have virtually kept the same instructions.

This worked wonders.

I thumped Liverpool 3-0, Boro 4-1 and led Arsenal 2-0 before being pegged back to 2-2, and still should have won it.

Superb tactic so far.

This one works away as well as home.

I'll keep you posted as to the rest of my season, but any tactic that can have those sorts of results immediately with Sunderland deserves respect.

Kudos.

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Originally posted by HydeFantics:

ur quitting FM ??? icon_frown.gif

Probablly not.....well no not at all, but I dont think I will be playing any more of 2008, atleast not 8.0.2.

Just have to decide what I hate more:

8.0.1....with shoats to goal ratio issue

or

8.0.2.....with goals galore issue

.......gona have to wait for 2009.....but who knows maybe I am just in a faze, maybe it's those days in the month

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Originally posted by www2:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by HydeFantics:

ur quitting FM ??? icon_frown.gif

Probablly not.....well no not at all, but I dont think I will be playing any more of 2008, atleast not 8.0.2.

Just have to decide what I hate more:

8.0.1....with shoats to goal ratio issue

or

8.0.2.....with goals galore issue

.......gona have to wait for 2009.....but who knows maybe I am just in a faze, maybe it's those days in the month </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Try setting yourself higher personal targets and keep us posted.

How about, get a player through your youth system who scores 40 goals in a season?

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