Thoughts about facing stronger opposition?

[bere23]

hi guys i wanted to share some of my thoughts about stuggling against stronger opposition..i have two examples to give me some ideas to try:

1st is how to react when opponent press me hard? 

2nd is how to react when opponent have me in my own third and attacking me and has the possesion?

well before u help me let me share my "logical thoughts" about these situations..so to the 1st example would be better to avoid that press using higher tempo in attempt to move the ball quickly and try to avoid that press and find the enemy unorganized?maybe qicker tempo and shorter passing ?or quciker tempo and put a notch my atck width wider to stretch them and maybe tire them?(i play balanced mentality)

and to the 2nd example maybe to increase my close down a notch?or with increasing press shall i increase a notch my def line to higher to try to step out a bit of my own def third?lowering a bit my LOE to be more compact to pressing?

well i really dont know how to adapt and sure you will tell me "dude why dont u try it and see?" i know guys i have but honestly i cant see clearly whats happening in field so to understand the impact of TIs.i dont have the terrific experience of amazing @herne79   to spot issues in game.

tnx in advance guys

[Lord Rowell]

A lot of this does depend on what kind of players you have, your team shape and so on.

Much of what you say I think works in different situations.

I'll just add one thing you haven't written here. With good players, I often use "be more expressive" to break a press as using this instructions gives players more freedom to roam from position and hence provide more passing options. For me, as a regular ECL side it works. Not convinced it would work with players of lower ability though - I'd then likely favour high-tempo / direct, maybe even with a target-man of some kind.

 

[bere23]

@Lord Rowell tnx mate i will try it.im in serie A btw and my player are good mostly on determination,agression and some good technicals.although i tried sometimes to press my opponents with higher line but doesnt work coz my players arent superb atm and for shape u said play 4-1-4-1 for more stability

[Rashidi]

Like Lord Rowell mentioned this is subjective, and it will be different for different kinds of sides. Personally when sides close me down, I just changes one or two roles within my system and bypass their press and get behind them to score. So it really depends on your style of play. Do you want to play yourself out of trouble or do you want to hit them quickly and force them to retreat. Remember they can also counterpress you if they are better. So you could defend well win the ball with a defender, try to play your way out and then get hit by the counter press and then concede. The choice you make depends on your formation and players.

[bere23]

@Rashidi tnx for your advice,well i dont want to change my roles to take advantage and  bypass them.i want to stay to my formation and roles i picked,dont want to adapt to my enemy.im trying to find ways to escape from pressing or their time on ball without been stucked in my defence.do u think any of my thoughts can work in these situations?

[FMunderachiever]

9 hours ago, bere23 said:

hi guys i wanted to share some of my thoughts about stuggling against stronger opposition..i have two examples to give me some ideas to try:

1st is how to react when opponent press me hard? 

2nd is how to react when opponent have me in my own third and attacking me and has the possesion?

well before u help me let me share my "logical thoughts" about these situations..so to the 1st example would be better to avoid that press using higher tempo in attempt to move the ball quickly and try to avoid that press and find the enemy unorganized?maybe qicker tempo and shorter passing ?or quciker tempo and put a notch my atck width wider to stretch them and maybe tire them?(i play balanced mentality)

and to the 2nd example maybe to increase my close down a notch?or with increasing press shall i increase a notch my def line to higher to try to step out a bit of my own def third?lowering a bit my LOE to be more compact to pressing?

well i really dont know how to adapt and sure you will tell me "dude why dont u try it and see?" i know guys i have but honestly i cant see clearly whats happening in field so to understand the impact of TIs.i dont have the terrific experience of amazing @herne79   to spot issues in game.

tnx in advance guys

Both examples for me are where id trying to be utilise pace and direct balls in behind as a threat.

If the opponent had extended possession spells in my half, id try and frustrate them, holding shape as much as possible and closing down less, to stop the opponent opening up gaps to play around me.

But to do this id need players with high levels of concentration, stamina, positioning etc.

 

It all depends on your players

[bere23]

@FMunderachiever i dont like to play to passively thats why i was thinking about press them a bit as result will have more time on the ball and imagine i have the best Aggresion,desicions,determination and vision in the leauge at comparison

[Rashidi]

4 hours ago, bere23 said:

@Rashidi tnx for your advice,well i dont want to change my roles to take advantage and  bypass them.i want to stay to my formation and roles i picked,dont want to adapt to my enemy.im trying to find ways to escape from pressing or their time on ball without been stucked in my defence.do u think any of my thoughts can work in these situations?

Well if you have tried pressing more and squeezing play with the LOE, then I am afraid you could be running out of options. 

[Dfs]

7 hours ago, Rashidi said:

Like Lord Rowell mentioned this is subjective, and it will be different for different kinds of sides. Personally when sides close me down, I just changes one or two roles within my system and bypass their press and get behind them to score. So it really depends on your style of play. Do you want to play yourself out of trouble or do you want to hit them quickly and force them to retreat. Remember they can also counterpress you if they are better. So you could defend well win the ball with a defender, try to play your way out and then get hit by the counter press and then concede. The choice you make depends on your formation and players.

What would be the typical roles changes that you make to bypass heavy press? I donno maybe this question is too generic because it depends on formation, instructions and the players but are there some general rules for that or roles that help? I usually make my formation narrower when I have problems with keeping the ball but thats not a lot.

[sporadicsmiles]

6 hours ago, Dfs said:

What would be the typical roles changes that you make to bypass heavy press? I donno maybe this question is too generic because it depends on formation, instructions and the players but are there some general rules for that or roles that help? I usually make my formation narrower when I have problems with keeping the ball but thats not a lot.

I do this by creating a "pressing trap" against teams that are pressing high and heavy. I will have my goalkeeper distribute to CBs, but not use play out of defense. So my CB gets the ball, and is closed down. Usually the ball goes back to the 'keeper (sometimes to the other CB) and draws them in further. I then have my FBs further up the pitch (I use at least one as a FB(A) in most cases). The 'keeper will often play the ball to these fullbacks. Who are most often still behind the press. This can easily chop 4-5 players from play for the AI, and leaves you will a chance to launch a direct attack from the FB. I don't have access to any of me FM games here, but I can try to find an example of this from one of my saves, because I thinking seeing would illustrate this better.

In this case I actually do not change any roles or duties either. I just have my GK distribute to the CBs, and tell them not to play from the back. You probably need players who do not panic under pressure to do this, and it is bloody risky too (sometimes it fails and you are under sudden and immense threat).

[bere23]

1 hour ago, sporadicsmiles said:

I do this by creating a "pressing trap" against teams that are pressing high and heavy. I will have my goalkeeper distribute to CBs, but not use play out of defense. So my CB gets the ball, and is closed down. Usually the ball goes back to the 'keeper (sometimes to the other CB) and draws them in further. I then have my FBs further up the pitch (I use at least one as a FB(A) in most cases). The 'keeper will often play the ball to these fullbacks. Who are most often still behind the press. This can easily chop 4-5 players from play for the AI, and leaves you will a chance to launch a direct attack from the FB. I don't have access to any of me FM games here, but I can try to find an example of this from one of my saves, because I thinking seeing would illustrate this better.

In this case I actually do not change any roles or duties either. I just have my GK distribute to the CBs, and tell them not to play from the back. You probably need players who do not panic under pressure to do this, and it is bloody risky too (sometimes it fails and you are under sudden and immense threat).

i have tried this exactly but with play out of defence and it seems working..but why u are not selecting play out of defence?also what are u doing when they have possesion in your own half?do u press them?

[sporadicsmiles]

34 minutes ago, bere23 said:

but why u are not selecting play out of defence?

I do not want to keep the ball in my half too long. The more passes we make under pressure, the greater the chance we make a mistake. Or that one of my players just has to punt it down field. Which I want to avoid. I want to draw them on to me and then hit them with a fast attack. Playing out of defense will not do this as well. I also typically do not play as very good sides, so my players are not really going to be good enough to withstand a sustained press and play around it. The better players you have, the better you can do this. With a world class side, I might not change anything.

36 minutes ago, bere23 said:

also what are u doing when they have possesion in your own half?do u press them?

Pressing depends on who I am playing and what I am looking to do. Against strong sides, I will typically press less and focus on my players creating a packed defense. I do not totally abandon the press, but I do not press hard. When I am playing an equal or weaker side, I tend to press higher and harder. It will also depend what I see. If the press is not working all that well, I will abandon it or dial it back. If it is working very well, I may go more agressive.

[djpdavey]

I am currently playing a 4-4-2 as a side which is only in it's second season in the league after promotion. Sitting in the top after 3 months.

When the other team is better and or constantly in possession in my half I will drop my pressing intensity to standard making sure I keep shape. When I do this I know that the only way they will score is if I give a way a penalty or they get a long shot but I don't give them enough room to get in the box. I know that late in the game the opposition will get desperate and try launching balls over the top. I will drop the DL to lower.

I was watching one of @Rashidi's recent videos which went into adjustments he makes depending on what he sees. If the Opposition is attacking me but keeping the ball centrally and trying to go through my middle I will defend narrow.

I will use pass into space if I can see players in space. Maybe hit early crosses but I have 2 forwards and an inverted Winger and a winger looking to get on the end.

One thing I have found is that sometimes to avoid the press I would need to have a couple of deeper roles which would (if pressed) open up a world of options. Maybe if you're using a 4-1-4-1 your DM should be a playmaker. Maybe look at the FB's to see if their role makes them available when the DM & CM are being pressed as an outlet. Would if help to ask one of the FB's come inside as a IWB to offer another option?

Often if none of this works I will try upping the mentality to Positive or Attacking to see if the added urgency, wideness and risk taking will assist. Hope this helps. This is how I am currently playing.

 

 

[Rashidi]

9 hours ago, djpdavey said:

If the Opposition is attacking me but keeping the ball centrally and trying to go through my middle I will defend narrow.

Good spot :-)

[djpdavey]

1 minute ago, Rashidi said:

Good spot :-)

You were actually explaining how to spot when the opposition was defending narrow so to break them down you'd need to play wider. I applied the same logic to defending :-).

More videos like that please!!!

[Rashidi]

1 minute ago, djpdavey said:

You were actually explaining how to spot when the opposition was defending narrow so to break them down you'd need to play wider. I applied the same logic to defending :-).

More videos like that please!!!

I think I better watch my own shows before I get on Twitch, too much emotion on Twitch I just fail to spot things like that