Long shots now even worse! Savic Crazy throw in long shot!!

[MBarbaric]

19 minuti fa, Svenc ha scritto:

Whilst teams of highest quality can wait for the right moment for something better to open up, as the move is far less likely to break down for them.

actually, there is a table in linked article that specifically shows that long shots might actually be of more benefit to poor teams as they simply don't have the ability to work their way into the box, compared to better teams. but yes, it is for SI to research.

[grkmori]

On 20/03/2018 at 14:35, jujigatame said:

Shooting accuracy is dodgy as hell in the FM18 ME and I suspect SI were unable to address it significantly in any of the patches because it would lead to major imbalances and high scorelines.

I recently had 3 missed penalties and 5 woodworks in one match, and I've only seen around 4 DFK goals (both for and against me combined) in a 5-season career.  There have been several matches where it seemed like I could have scored 10-15 goals if shooting accuracy were improved.

Watching matches the ME team has a problem with defense, or more specifically marking. Players on the ME have difficulty to do a good individual marking and have a disastrous difficulty to do mark as a team...

[Svenc]

2 hours ago, grkmori said:

Watching matches the ME team has a problem with defense, or more specifically marking. Players on the ME have difficulty to do a good individual marking and have a disastrous difficulty to do mark as a team...

It's decent enough to cope with the attacking phase, unless exploited. Upon such, the forward would pop in space every time, and you score a fist ful every single match, no matter much the player quality. Including double digit scorelines, in particular in friendlies, or when the AI is set up to not cope at all. jujigatame having a bit of a mare here likely when arguing he should have scored a dozen+ easily -- or he's one of those TV pundits who yell "he should have scored / hit the target with that easily" at every second  crap shot (but when fielded on the pitch, would miss them all). But yeah... defensive phase needs work. But as MBarbaric argues, if it would get one, the attacking phase would need a significant overhaul too as it wouldn't be able to cope all that well with proper zonal defending, arguably. If teams defended as units, they would be much harder to break down, and upon doing such, the off the ball movements and decisions in the attacking phase also would need improving.

The ME builds that either have generally much too many goals or much too few, thus, where the balance between both phases is off, are never made public, usually. Former patch notes were often quite revealing here, highlighting or at least hinting at how even a few tweaks made to defensive line positioning could have various knock-ons across the board. I'm still interested into @Rashidi's own method of gauging chances. If it's decent, he may forward it to SI so that they may implement a few better feedback! "Good Chance Indicator" sounds like it might. AFAIR former mods used to highlight what worse/better chances are, they worked out what that roughly means, and their playing experience proved them right -- but they were  ignored in favor of all kinds of bad theory, as the game is open for all kinds of subjective interpretation. So whatever point you're trying to make, and even it it's outright nonsense, you can.

[RBKalle]

15 ore fa, Svenc ha scritto:

"Good Chance Indicator"

But that'd be a decent enough way to address the "25 shots, 1 goal" complaint/misunderstanding, which, while important, is NOT the topic at hands here.

The problem is that players keep on blasting nonsensical shots from 25 yards out despite having better passing options, the chance to run a bit more with the ball or, unheard of, starting all over again with a backpass or a sideways one.

Here are two examples from my latest game...  Same player (Long Shots 12!), same awful decision.

The WHOLE goal was obstructed by 5 players, so he'd have picked the obvious through ball to his left for an easy low cross into the 5-yards box. Instead he shot at 45° with his left foot

 

Again, almost no visible goal here, but a completely open teammate coming up.

And THREE against one defender on the left side. So there were two options: the direct one and the possession-oriented one. Of course, he chose to hit the guy on row XY behind the goal

 

Just for fun, here's the shooting map for both teams... The AI (left) managed a couple of truly abysmal attempts

[Svenc]

4 hours ago, RBKalle said:

 

Again, almost no visible goal here, but a completely open teammate coming up.

The 3 on 1 is out of the player's view, plus physically he'd need to do like a 180 degrees turnaround. How many of those shots were free kicks? Plus, did the AI again do garbage such as this? Long-term this needs to be a balance hopefully. How often do you watch a match of football and struggle to comprehend how a player has made a particular decision? Everybody knows better, in particular in hindsight. This includes shooting decisions too.

[RBKalle]

17 minuti fa, Svenc ha scritto:

The 3 on 1 is out of the player's view, plus physically he'd need to do like a 180 degrees turnaround. Long-term this needs to be a balance hopefully. How often do you watch a match of football and struggle to comprehend how a player has made a particular decision? Everybody knows better, in particular in hindsight. This includes shooting decisions too. How many of those shots were free kicks?

Fair enough, the 3-on-1 was impossible for the player to see right away, but the #12 was CLEARLY in his line of sight.

Sure, you often watch and wonder "why?!", but as you can see by the overall shots map for that game, that question must have popped in the hypothetical viewers' minds like 25 times in the short span of 90 minutes.

Frankly it's a mistake rate I haven't seen in friendly kickabouts involving guys with zero professional background and whose "best player" is the athletic but clumsy kid who played 5 minutes at Level 6 when he was 18...

 

To me, it all stems from FM players still being TOO GOOD in the buildup, thus creating way too many decent chances, or at least vaguely dangerous situations. In real life, that happens much less often. Turnovers and lost possessions in the final third are a common occurrence, especially when the level of football isn't top-notch.
FM, for some reason, has players taking random shots at the end of reasonably ok buildup, while the same teams in real life would have squandered possession long before being in a shooting position.

[fmfan74]

I've been patiently quiet on this over many years.  i raised an issue in relation to accuracy back then for many situations.  Now I am seeing the same problem years later.  You can see if it was a pass or shot  through the team analysis window.

The issue i raised back then was a complaint on accuracy where my striker was facing head on the goals and no bodies in sight.  what did my striker do might you ask, yes the same problem i am seeing now in this post.  I am not saying it shouldn't be happening at all cause we do see some real life situations like that, but the frequency would have had the player purged from the team give it if mourinho was managing the team.  If it is a goal attempt it would make me cry at disbelief given this players high stat pack.  Still the angle that was shown in the picture is something very very rare to see pogba do for the talent he has.  Again if it's a shot then the angle is very horrible and does need some work yet again, otherwise if it was a pass then thats another story.

Ok it's normal to miss, but the angle is very very common in this game from what I am seeing.  I would like to hear what the devs have to say about this in more detail.  Given that it could be a shot or pass my next question is - How can we reduce the angle or shoot/pass error angle ?  How does this affect training.  Can the player be trained to reduce that type of frequency/angle error ?.

[shadster]

I stopped caring about this issue a while ago... I'm back playing FM, enjoying it, but definitly this must be sorted for FM 19.. The amount of long shots close to corner flag is not aceptable. I know the tactic setup influences it, but playing on counter, work ball into box, etc should reduce those kind of shots, as an example.

And just for fun, the game counted this as a shot!....