FM 15: Creating Klopp

[killbill]

Hi all,

First thread, but keen to crowd source some opinions on how to create Jurgen Klopp's Dortmund.

First, lets cover off what we're trying to achieve:

- A direct & high tempo style, with the passing range remaining short. "no sideways passes"

- Close range support. Even when countering, players will essentially crowd a smaller section of the pitch

- Flair: Kagawa, Reus, Goetze to name a few in recent years, have eseentially been allowed to do what they like as long as the adopt the overarching defensive strategy

- Shooting from central areas, long and short.

- Expecting to concede goals, which is fine, because they'll hopefully score more

My initial experiements have looked like this

ATT 4-2-3-1

GK - DEF - Distribute to BP CB

WB L&R - SUP - Stay Wide

Ball Playing CB - Def - Close down less

Limited CB - Stopper - Close Down Less, pass shorter

CM - Def - tackle harder - Swap with Roaming Playmaker - With these two, the aim is to get them taking it in turns to go foreard

Roaming Playmaker - More direct

Winger - Sup

Inside Forward - Sup

Treq

Advanced forward - Hold up ball

Team instructions:

• Overload
  
• Highly Structure
  
• Pass it shorter
  
• Close down much more
  
• Much higher line
  
• Higher Tempo
  
• Narrow
  
• Shoot on site
  

I'm going to test this, but if anyone has an opinion on things to change or something I've missed, please drop a note!

[bigwoody]

I'm working on a gegenpressing tactic myself. I don't feel like I have it quite right yet, but I'll start posting more once I feel like it's nearly there.

Good luck!

[RTHerringbone]

It sounds like a decent attempt. At first glance, you may struggle to get many bodies in the box, and I'll be interested to hear how it fares defensively. Might be worth considering a Sweeper Keeper to close any lose passes behind the defence.

[Cleon]

Have you read this excellent thread from FM14 about it?

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/367741-Replicating-Dortmund-s-gegenpressing

It's all still relevant and should provide you with lots of information.

[killbill]

So far, it's strangely working. By that, I mean that I'm Leeds, predicted to finish 20th. I have a young-ish, high stamina and work rate but lacking technical quality team.

We're not getthing thumped!

The pressing works very, but, there may need to be an accompanying setup to "rest" as the team burns out by the 70th minute and then will concede an equaliser.

I'll give a better update once I'm further in to the season.

Thanks Cleon for the thread, I missed it!

[bigwoody]

Dortmund itself has now adapted a sort of control tactic for that very situation (holding a late lead). Consider developing one that fits your team.

That and train up stamina and concentration.

[jimbobBRFC]

Love this idea, im a massive fan of the Klopp tactic as it takes the high pressing of Barcelona with the more direct fast attacking football that barca sometimes lack. Will be my first attempt at creating a tactic on FM15 when I purchase.

bigwoody seems to have it spot on, adapt a Control tactic to switch to which almost turns the team into the complete possiesion orientated machine that is Barca

[jimbobBRFC]

Love this idea, im a massive fan of the Klopp tactic as it takes the high pressing of Barcelona with the more direct fast attacking football that barca sometimes lack. Will be my first attempt at creating a tactic on FM15 when I purchase.

bigwoody seems to have it spot on, adapt a Control tactic to switch to which almost turns the team into the complete possiesion orientated machine that is Barca.

How does the high pressing seem to work on FM15 for anyone whos tried it? Could never get it working properly on FM14

[EdH1977]

Hi,

I played 4-4-1-1 last year with a midfield of BWM - D and DLP - S, worked really well, but I cannot get it to work this year, I tried BWM - D and the new Roaming Playmaker and it seems to work well... how have you found using the CM - D and RP?

Ed

[killbill]

It's evolved a bit...

GK - d - pass shorter ( he still kicks long)

WB - a - Stay wider, Run wide

CB - d -

CM - s -

BWM - d - Niklas Stark

Advanced playmaker - s -

AMR - Radaunthingy - close down more -

AMC - Attacking midfielder -

AML winger - support -

Def Forward - support

My instructions vary a bit, but esstenially the manic pressing works well IF, you can ensure you give it away in the right areas. Losing it in their box is fine, anywhere in the middle ends badly.

The Striker and the (sorry I can't spell it) Raudengoalmachine work very well. Equally as impressive are the CMs.

I'll post some screenshots when I can, but just drew 3-3 with chelsea and had 67% possession. My media prediction is 17th.

Unfortunatley, passing into space is slightly suicidal at the moment.. had to go for very slow but direct. Seems to improve pass decisions.

[Torskus77]

AMR - Radaunthingy -

Had a really rubbish day, and that really made me laugh a lot for some reason lol

Thanks

[bigwoody]

I'll admit I'm having a very hard time getting Gegenpressing right. Not only am I not able to strike quick on the break, but the pressing is generally ineffective.

This is with Bayern, fully fluid. Tried:

• 4-1-4-1: Can't get the STC involved, and in-cutting wingers don't seem to translate well from M(RL).
  
• 4-4-1-1: Better on offense, though can't get a break-out, but ineffective pressing makes me vulnerable to goals.
  
• 4-2-3-1: Since AM(RL)s don't track back, my press is weak.
  

I have a long way to go...

[killbill]

I'll admit I'm having a very hard time getting Gegenpressing right. Not only am I not able to strike quick on the break, but the pressing is generally ineffective.

This is with Bayern, fully fluid. Tried:

• 4-1-4-1: Can't get the STC involved, and in-cutting wingers don't seem to translate well from M(RL).
  
• 4-4-1-1: Better on offense, though can't get a break-out, but ineffective pressing makes me vulnerable to goals.
  
• 4-2-3-1: Since AM(RL)s don't track back, my press is weak.
  

I have a long way to go...

I got round that by making it structured. It means they press as a formation rather than idiots.

Use "Roam from position" and "Be Expressive" to replicate fluid movement when you have the ball.

[bigwoody]

Yeah, I'm trying that now actually. An unbalanced 4-4-1-1/4-2-3-1 hybrid with flexible fluidity is doing a fair bit better.

To be honest though, it's like my Barça tactic with crappier defense. That's why I'm disappointed with the results so far.

[jackane24]

Your defense will struggle unless you have EXACTLY the right kind of players needed.

I presume you're playing a much higher line? Given the AI's tendency to have the CBs come flying out unless you play a DM, it's best to play a CB-X CB-C combination. Both should have excellent team work, decisions, anticipation, acceleration & positioning. The CB-X should have a high aggression stat (12+) otherwise he might not come out quick/hard enough. The CB-C should be as rapid as possible. Acceleration & pace MINIMUM 14+, preferably higher.

Your fbs should have excellent teamwork, positioning, anticipation, bravery, work rate, determination & acceleration.

But you have to get the balance right in a 4231 to make it work. I've not got FM15 but I've got a sick gegenpressing tactic going in FM14, goals galore, CCCs galore. Cannot stress the importance of balance enough. No balance and your team will fall apart.

Attacking - very rigid - much higher tempo - much higher line - direct passing - hassle opponents - pass into space - play narrower - roam from positions - be more expressive - look for overlap

LB; FB-A

RB; FB-S

CB-X on the right side

CB-C on the left (this might work better the other way, I don't know. It might disrupt the balance. I like the stopper playing behind the DLP-S.)

LCM; BWM-D (pass it shorter)

RCM; DLP-S (close down more, play it shorter) These 2 guys are there to shield your defense. You just want them playing simple balls into your front 4.

LAM; IF-S

CAM; AM-S

RAM; W-A (might be better as DW-S)

CF-A upfront (fewer risky balls)

But honestly it's a waste of time trying this tactic unless practically every player in your team has a high work rate, stamina, natural fitness, acceleration & team work stat. Will fall apart.

[bigwoody]

The funny thing is my defense is fine, my goals surrendered rate is quite low.

The thing is I've ticked every pressing box I can think of other than the "Overload" mentality. The players just won't go out and press! Midfielders are more focused on maintaining a defensive shape than hassling.

[jackane24]

Post a screenshot of your tactics?

This is what I have set-up.

Ignore the result for the Augsburg match obviously. Robbery.

Actually managed to get more possession than Barcelona in the Nou Camp playing this tactic, with 2nd choice players playing in CM (Sahin & Kehl).

A few major issues I've had so far;

a) struggled to get the defensive balance. The players' roles have to be perfect like I said. I think I've now got the balance with the back 4 posted above in the same roles. I'll see.

b) Conceding straight after scoring & conceding from set pieces. The latter is easily fixed. The former, not so much. I think it's down to a combination of my attacking tactics and a lack of concentration on my players' part - Gundogan, Papastathopolous, Mkhitaryan, Reus, Aubameyang, etc all have pretty low concentration. 2 of those guys (the former 2) are key defensive players. I have had excellent defensive runs. See here;

The 2 I conceded were freaks. Shakhtar was a Luiz Adriano long shot (go look at his long shot & finishing stats) from 30 yards and the Hertha goal was last minute after I'd gone down to 10-men.

c) My goalkeeper. Owing to the attacking nature of this tactic, you'll more than likely find an errant ball over the top or a quick cross catching your high-line out. Get a sick goalkeeper with acceleration, anticipation, decisions, one on ones, reflexes, concentration 13+ and it'll help a lot. Ter Stegen is excellent for the role, particularly given his communication & command of area stats. He'll sort your defense out a lot, especially with his leadership stat.

Full-backs are key to this formation. Key. Need to find good players for the role. Ricardo Rodriguez seems to be well suited. I think Coleman & Peruzzi will be good at RB.

[jackane24]

If you're struggling away from home, change CF-A to DF-S, AM-S to AM-A and W-A to either W-S or DW-S, depending on who's playing (Aubameyang the former, Blaskjakjzkjakjqkjqkjskjssky the latter). Did this just now, 1-0 up away to Mainz (through a penalty) at half-time. Won 4-0. Mkhitaryan scored all of them.

[jackane24]

Just did this

Using this

GK - distribute to defenders

CBs - play it shorter (players will automatically try and pass to your playmakers so play your stopper behind the DLP-S to make sure he doesn't do any stupid cross-pitch passes to try and reach him)

LCM - play it shorter

RCM - play it shorter & close down more

LAM - dribble more

ST - move into channels

Also did this to Napoli

Higuain scored with 2 ridiculous long-shots. I think it's important to try and target any opposition players who are good at long shots. Use OIs to target them. Or get an incredible goalkeeper (not Weidenfeller). Marking tighter with the CBs might help.

[sirfletch2006]

Just finished my first season using a variation on Klopps system

Team Instructions:

shorter passing

much higher defensive line

play narrower

close down much more

get stuck in

Average possession: 51%

Front 4 all scored a shedload

Ozil was a complete star, making twice as many key passes than anyone else

[jackane24]

How many did you concede? How did you do against big teams? How did you do away?

[sirfletch2006]

How many did you concede? How did you do against big teams? How did you do away?

Conceded 43 in the league, most teams would create at least 2 clear cut chances against me, its definetly a score more than you tactic.

I did take some hammerings against the big sides early on, identifying their main threat and using opposition instructions can neutralise them a bit.

Managed to pick up some good results towards the end of the season, drew at Man City and narrow wins against Man Utd and Liverpool.

[xantheose]

Using this

Uhh I'm seriously wondering how you didn't get ripped apart so far, Attacking + Much Higher Defensive Line is almost suicide.

[jackane24]

Playing very rigid with the correct TIs and players for the role is essential. The pressing I see in the ME is perfect. We win the ball back constantly.

I've been reading articles about Gegenpressing & reading other threads. Should be able to make this a much more stable defensive formation whilst maintaining the attacking prowess. One option is making it a 4411. I saw a great thread about even turning it into a 541. Middle CB as a stopper with more closing down to try and replicate Bender/Kehl. Gündogan in CM as DLP-S on the right with the Mkhitaryan role a CM-A on the left. Then you've got the AML and AMR just like in my tactics with the right and left-sided CBs covering. RB on FB-A duty and LB on FB-S. Replicates the shape (theoretically) beautifully. Will give it a go at some point. Could work brilliantly with Juventus - Pogba/Marchisio playing DLP-S (might need to change this to BBM to suit Pogba better but I don't like his work rate stat for that role and it doesn't hold well when the RB gets forward - in about 2 years he'll play CM-A instead of Vidal), Vidal CM-A, Lichtensteiner the attacking full-back, Asamoah the supporting full-back, Chiellini the CB-X (Bender role), Bonucci and Ogbonna covering, Padoin AMR and Giovinco AML. Tevez upfront (20 work rate).

But the tactic I'm working on is excellent. Little bits of tweaking and I'll have it sorted. Just did this first game of the season with it;

[killbill]

I just beat United 4-1 WITH LEEDS. My media prediction is 17th to give that context and my back four is James Husband - Jason Pearce - Craig Dawson - Sam Byram

I think everyone on this thread is getting to closer, however. I think the key positons are:

- Ball playing defender - someone to get the ball forward quickly and accurately

- Inside forward - Think Reus

- Winger - I think Aubamayang is a bit of a donkey, but during the days of Blaz, decent crossing ability

- Deep lying forward - I've got davie Selke playing this role (he's like a defensive forward) but it enables the three behind to get ahead of him!

[jackane24]

A BPD suits this formation but it also means he's prone to mistakes. The point of gegenpressing is shielding the back 4, so the last thing you want to happen is for the back 4 to lose possession. That's why I think a BPD isn't good, especially given you should have a creative outlet (a DLP/BBM) just in front of him.

Everybody concurs that an IF is needed. Or a WM with get further forward.

A DW-S is best for conservative situations (either in the AMR or MR slot). Sit narrower & get further forward. Then have the RB on FB-A with stay wider & get further forward. I read another thread where somebody said he should cut inside.

Everybody seems to be at odds over what to do with the striker. I've had runs of Lewandowski scoring 8.8 over 5 games with a silly amount of goals as CF-A. I've also had him scoring hat-tricks as DF-S. Depends on everything else. I'm trying to find a balance.

[jackane24]

Ok restarted so I could buy the right players I needed.

I had to ask the board for more money, also said I'd win the league and I'm paying most of that £26m in 48-month installments. Also bought Volland who'll join next year. I thought it best he stay playing 1st team football this year instead of wasting away on the bench.

What I've done I think is set up the team for the next 4-5 years minimum.

Hoffman isn't even on there (out on loan) - he's a ready-made replacement for Blaszczczczczczczczikowsky. He needs to improve physically a LOT but if he does, he'll be a better player.

I'm hoping selling Blaszczczczczczikowsky & Subotic next year + the transfer budget I get will pay for a rapid brilliant covering CB - I'd love that player to be Marquinhos. Then I can play Hummels as the CB-X with the speedy CB covering.

I've gone for Ease off tackles and Cut in with ball as per recommendations I found on other threads. I'm on the fence about ease off tackles.

Papasthiodopsolous' aggression is so high that I might tell him to ease off tackles. Alternatively I might go all out and tell him down to close down more (which would work better if the covering CB were quicker, just incase the CB-X is beaten).

Again, ease off tackles as per recommendation on another thread.

I've got Sahin selected at the moment, but when Gundogan's back from injury I'll possibly ask him to dribble more. BBM-S is also an option.

I worry that the CM-D role is too static. I used BWM-D before and I brought in Rode almost primarily because of his pace, which I'm not sure he'll be able to use well in this role. We'll see.

This isn't a role Aubameyang can play. Good for Blaszczczikowsky and Hoffman though.

SS-A I think is best because he'll look to win the ball back.

I've struggled to get Reus working consistently and others have too in this system, so for now we'll just do this.

First game home to Bayern in the Super Cup. Not sure how well I'll do because I've brought in 1 player more than I normally do, Gundogan's injured and I was training 2 tactics at once so familiarity level isn't great.

[jackane24]

Ok 4 minutes into the game and already noticed a couple of things.

Take 'close down more' off the DLP-S (Sahin in this instance). Very bad.

Schmelzer also keeps making ridiculous long balls. So fewer risky passes.

I've also changed Rode to a BWM-D. Much more aggressive in attacking the ball, which is exactly what we want.

1-0 down at HT because Jung (jumping reach 8) didn't even bother going for a ball that floated right over his head. This will be an issue, especially playing such a high defensive line so I'm now going to train him on jumping reach.

I'm going to try playing narrower in the 2nd half. I won this game in the last game I started up 4-1 by playing narrower. Took it off this time to see if it was necessary or not.

Reus has played appallingly. I worry about the CAM playing SS-A because he'll take the space that Reus needs to cut in. So I've changed CAM to AM-S. He still closes down more which is what I want.

Went 2-0 down in the 68th minute because for some reason Hummels didn't go for a ball that was literally right next to him. Let Mandzukic walk past him.

70 mins, Lewandowski scores. Was a very nice goal but I worry that I don't have enough attacking mentality in my team. I now only have 1 attacking duty in the team - my RB!

We lost 2-1 but a bunch of bad performances. Also like I said, low familiarity. Not worried. I know how close this tactic is to perfection 8-)

I've made my in-game changes permanent now. I worry about only having 1 attacking role like I said so I'll give Reus a go at IF-A to hopefully make him cut in more. I think I might have created a bit of imbalance here now though - IF-A with a BWM-D next to him I don't think is great!

I'm also considering a BBM instead of DLP.

[jackane24]

Schmelzer playing long balls may be a result of

a) playing attacking

b) not having fewer risky passes activated

c) having a bwm-d next to him

d) not playing narrower

If he does the same in the next game with fewer risky passes on, I'll change to play narrower

[jackane24]

2nd game, away to Fortuna in the German Cup. 3rd minute and a headed goal for Jung from a right-wing cross from Blaszczcikowsky.

7 mins gone and another goal in similar fashion. Reus at the far post to smash it in.

10 mins, 3-0. Another goal created from the right-wing.

So the right-wing has been responsible for all 3 goals. It's working beautifully. Blaszczc then scores from a Schmelzer cross to make it 4-0.

I've noticed Lewandowski being a bit hesitant, preferring to pass than shoot. So shoot more often for him.

This is a good shot showing how the team essentially lines-up.

Reus is in the top right-hand corner, basically playing striker with Lewandowski. I can see those 2 linking up a lot this year like that. On the near side is Blazczc with Jung supporting him.

it seems like fewer risky passes has worked for Schmelzer because he's just held off playing a long ball and given it to Sahin instead. Next to Sahin we have Rode (higher up the pitch despite playing a defensive duty). Jojic is waiting for the pass from Sahin and then we should be able to make a nice attacking move. It results in a corner from a longish effort from Blaszcz. Not many players were getting forward. Given I'm 5-0 up and it's a weaker team, I'll try Sahin as a BBM.

One thing to note is just before this play started, Rode tried heading the ball to Reus but Reus had already started running forward and that forward movement put a defender in the way. I may need to drop from a 4231 to a 4411 to fix this.

[jackane24]

Look who's on the edge of the area to receive the ball from Blaszczc - Sahin with his new BBM role! He then passes to Lewandowski who scores, but it's offside. Sahin could've gotten more forward to help us out during the match so I'm giving him a BBM-S role with get further forward, mark tighter and close down less.

Ended 5-0. Predictable domination.

I'm giving Lewandowski shoot more often, also taking off dribble less to see what that does. I'll hold off changing from a 4231 to a 4411 until they have 100% familiarity. Want to see how it works in full motion first.

[jackane24]

Ok, first league game, home to Leverkusen. Familiarity is getting there.

I have 2 concerns about the team at the moment - not enough attacking movement and the connection between Rode and Reus.

So I will change AM-S to AM-A to get him further forward. Also I'll change Reus back to a IF-S to get him closer to Rode. I've given him get further forward and dribble more. Get further forward might negate changing from IF-A to IF-S. We'll see.

If this works, 2 birds with 1 stone.

Sahin is the player at the top in the middle of the picture. I think I might get rid of 'get further forward'

But Reus is the player just up from Schmelzer which is much better. He's there to offer Schmelzer support while Rode covers them right of shot.

The move actually ends with a goal from Blasz, a rebound from a Lewandowski shot. But a better team could catch me out with Sahin's positioning. Wonder if it's also worth making the keeper a SK-S instead of SK-D.

And yup, 6 minutes later, move down the right-wing but this time look where Sahin is

Before he would've been at the edge of the area by now. And sure enough look who's there to play the ball back into the box when it gets headed out.

The balance here looks excellent. The 2 CMs in the middle of the pitch, the 4 attackers all in and scattered about the area and the full-backs there to defend or put in crosses. Look how much space Reus is in! And yup, Sahin passes to Reus, Reus passes it to Lewandowski and he scores. Perfection.

[killbill]

Ok, first league game, home to Leverkusen. Familiarity is getting there.

I have 2 concerns about the team at the moment - not enough attacking movement and the connection between Rode and Reus.

So I will change AM-S to AM-A to get him further forward. Also I'll change Reus back to a IF-S to get him closer to Rode. I've given him get further forward and dribble more. Get further forward might negate changing from IF-A to IF-S. We'll see.

If this works, 2 birds with 1 stone.

Sahin is the player at the top in the middle of the picture. I think I might get rid of 'get further forward'

But Reus is the player just up from Schmelzer which is much better. He's there to offer Schmelzer support while Rode covers them right of shot.

The move actually ends with a goal from Blasz, a rebound from a Lewandowski shot. But a better team could catch me out with Sahin's positioning. Wonder if it's also worth making the keeper a SK-S instead of SK-D.

And yup, 6 minutes later, move down the right-wing but this time look where Sahin is

Before he would've been at the edge of the area by now. And sure enough look who's there to play the ball back into the box when it gets headed out.

The balance here looks excellent. The 2 CMs in the middle of the pitch, the 4 attackers all in and scattered about the area and the full-backs there to defend or put in crosses. Look how much space Reus is in! And yup, Sahin passes to Reus, Reus passes it to Lewandowski and he scores. Perfection.

Try telling your full backs to run less and cross more often. It's led to my full backs causing havoc with first time crosses. As you play (and dortmund do) narrow, there's loads of space for the full backs to step forward and hit crosses.

[jackane24]

Ripping Leverkusen apart. 3-1 at half-time. Their goal just down to poor keeping from Horn. No surprise, he's only 20. I expected this kind of stuff 1st season. They were through on goal from a ball behind the defense but that's the risk you run with a high line. Changing the GK from SW-D to SW-S does seem more appealling but Horn only has acceleration 10 pace 8. I'm working on improving them. His decisions 12 is a bit iffy but he's not eccentric and has anticipation 14. It might work in a year or two.

Anyway, HT.

Jojic way too far forward. Back to AM-S for him. This means my RB is the only player in my team with an attacking duty which I don't like one bit. But we'll give it a go this half. Also a huge gap between Schmelzer and Reus.

I changed Schmelzer from fewer risky passes to play it shorter during the game owing to passes like this. He continued doing them, which means he doesn't have enough support. I'm going to have to drop Reus to ML.

I have got Reus cutting in though!

Lovely stuff from 7 of the players. Bringing Reus down to ML should get Schmelzer and Reus' completion up to 80%+.

Horn messed up again for their 2nd goal Blaszc completes his hat-trick with a header from a Schmelzer cross. And a Blazczc penalty for 5-2.

A good start, especially given the 2 goals conceding were GK error.

[jackane24]

Try telling your full backs to run less and cross more often. It's led to my full backs causing havoc with first time crosses. As you play (and dortmund do) narrow, there's loads of space for the full backs to step forward and hit crosses.

Ok I've given Schmelzer those PIs along with ease off tackles and stay wider.

I've not given my team the TI play narrower. Haven't seen any need to so far, although I did use play narrower with them in the last game I played with them. We'll see.

[jackane24]

Rode missed 3/4 tackles against Leverkusen. This got me concerned about his strength 10 tackling 13 stats so I checked out his missed tackles. They were all in the 2nd half and he dove in for all of them. He 'won' the tackle he stood up for (needs much better strength because he barely won it and in his role he needs to win those like bread & butter). I'll keep an eye on this. If he consistently misses them I'll have to teach him not to dive in.

[jackane24]

Ok, away to Mainz. Play gung-ho could get me caught out here. Control & retain possession might be necessary instead of attacking.

Well I'm delighted about the clean sheet but I have serious concerns. The goals were fortuitous. Lewandowski's opener was brilliant, perfect DF-S behaviour. Midfielder headed it back to the defender, Lewandowski chased him down, won the ball and scored a sublime goal. The 2nd was a penalty after a foul from a set piece.

11 long shots is not good. 3 of them were from Sahin. He had other options but chose to shoot. So I'll train him to look for pass instead of shooting. Reus had 6 shots. He's set to shoot more often though to turn him into a LAM IF-S. So I'll turn them off.

Reus didn't cut in once. This concerns me. Blaszcz was awful. Low pass completion %, way too deep, only ran past a defender twice compared to 9 times vs Leverkusen.

Also BBM for Sahin in this set-up is not good at all. So he's back to DLP-S and Blaszcz is now a W-S with mark tighter, which might actually work better. He can't sit narrower though, which might affect how Jung plays but he's set up to cut inside anyway.

[jackane24]

I'm going to continue my updates in this thread - http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/373623-FM14-Borussia-Dortmund-Echte-Liebe/ - which is better suited for what I'm doing.

[sirfletch2006]

I went for a BWM (S) and an DLP (D) in the centre of midfield.

I didnt want the ball winner anchoring the midfield, with a DLP on defend it works like the Stopper/Cover partnership in defence.

[jackane24]

Yeah I was doing that too. However I put it back to BWM-D and DLP-S and my possession instantly shot up by a few %. Makes sense, the creative force in the middle of the pitch to pass to the attackers instead of the creative force behind the BWM-S who'll more than likely not have good passing stats and might struggle to reach them with his passes.

It's difficult getting the BWM role correct. Sometimes I look at what he's doing and I think it's too aggressive. But CM-S/D is not aggressive enough. It's very difficult. Putting him into a DM slot might help. I have a few things I want to try, determined to make this work perfectly.

4141 an option. So is 541, also 4411.