Robson 07

Great era for our club TMS. I have given you 'likes' even for just reminding me of the good old days. Pleased to not see Fred

Taking a step back for a second, that just says throw everything in the middle. Beef up a passive approach; water down an aggressive one. Everything ends up in the middle? That can't be right. You're left with no flavours, it's just offering up a middling landing.

Ok great @FulchesterFred, it's just a suggestion. When you see lower or much lower line of engagement and you combine that with positive or attacking mentality it may play more how you are expecting to counterattack football. Conversely when you see higher or much higher line of engagement (for example Tiki Taka) and combine with a lower mentality like cautious you might get a more aggressive press with possession football. The roles and duties, plus the TI's don't look wildly wrong to me in the the presets, it's a simplified adjustment.

Quick solution for you to try with the preset tactics. Change the overall mentality but keeping the rest the same. I suspect you may find those counter attack presets (both the fluid one and the direct one) start to seem a lot better, and may even play as you would hope then to, if used on Positive or Attacking.

Think about formations. Shapes like the 4231 defend aggressively. When you counter press or transition to defence you immediately have players in positions that pressure the opposition full backs and defensive midfielder. It is unlikely to fare as well in a low block as it may leave people ahead of the ball. If you want to play differently, a more passive approach, this needs some thought. A couple of considerations - 1) When you attack or counter attack from a low block your team may fly up the pitch leaving behind your defensive line and a very large gap to your central def

Some really good advice in the post a couple above, nice work @Domus Clamantium

Yeah but style is important. What we are seeing (again) is that when you under achieve you become open to questions on style. Spurs are 8th in EPL, and are out of Europe. They don't pass the ball well & play defensively, leaving the best striker in the league to feed on scraps. Tactically JM looks like a dinosaur who hasn't kept pace with his peers. It's a career that seems to be in a downward spiral and it would be no surprise to see Tottenham part company with him at the end of the season. Speaking as a Man Utd supporter he was damaging to my club and the his style of play wa

He probably means camp on the edge of your own penalty box and admire 90 metres of space between his team and the opposition goalkeeper.

It's a lovely thread @Cult of Football Manager thank you so much for sharing your ideas. Reminds me a little bit of one of O-zil's threads and there isn't a much higher (FM) compliment I can pay you than that. Very clear; no ambiguity, hints of cleverness or click-bait to get you to visit a channel or any of that nonsense.

@DNZ-8 I've tested it some but you're right it wasn't really my intention to create something that is very fluid due to the number of supports. I have both my other tactical slots trying similar-ish 235 hybrids and one of those has both the wide players as Raumdeuters. At the moment that's holding my interest and I'm wondering whther that role could work its way into this tactic somehow. To your suggestion, I have been nervous of trying an attack duty on one of the two central midfield roles even if it is of the attacking gang of five.

So I have tried the 4231 this way with a simple redistribution of midfield positions. 2 or 3 roles and duties may be improved though so I'm open to suggestions:- The Two CD x 2 The Three Inverted wing backs and the DLP shifted into the centre The Five Mez breaks fwd, wingers x 2, AMC shifted to the right and CF(s)

With the 4231 I was thinking you may have to offset the positions slightly. Makes it slightly asymmetrical in appearance but once you have done that it opens more possibilities. I'm experimenting with something and may post it later if it delivers results.

It's a great thread, always enjoy these types. Keen to learn if anyone has done similar (235) out of formations other than 4141/433. Particularly would like to know how others might go about it or even have a achieved it successfully from a 442 or 4231.

Very short passing set up. Do you have the team for it and realistically is it suited to the argy bargy of the premier league? Maybe its something you very slowly evolve towards if you're dominant.

@Christopher S Or short story, swap the midfield roles to put the AP on the right side and Mez on the left. Yes indeed. I quite like laying down the occasional challenge. 1, why be bland? 2, let's see where it goes...