Classic 4231 for 18.3.3 - 5 Promotions in 7 Seasons

[matty8787]

8 hours ago, TioPatinhax said:

For example in the case of the striker, you use a DLF correct? What if I have a really good Target Man, would it ruin the whole strategey employing that role?

I changed mine to CF and they are working well.

[scottnmcleod]

Decided to do give this a try in my Aberdeen save. Was going for 5 league title wins in a row but started to stutter and allowed Celtic to catch up a 10 point gap and go 3 points clear. Switched to this and won the league. Played 12 games, 9 wins 3 defeats although they were against Lyon in the Euro Cup, a narrow defeat to Celtic in the Scottish cup against the run of play and a 1-0 defeat after the league was won with a weakened team. Started the following season with 3 convincing wins. Going for 6 in a row. Impressed and pleased. Many thanks for taking the time to create and post.

[Mr U Rosler]

Halfway into 1st season in Prem I had to abandon the 4231, too attacking for such a relatively weak team and I was heading for relegation.

However I was largely happy with the mentality and Team Instructions so I had a re-think on the formation and player roles focusing on good pitch coverage, varied attacking play and a better defensive shape.

I'd also got a couple of very high potential Strikers in my youth intake so I was looking for a 2 striker set up.

Settled on a 3232 (WB) which season 1 saved me from relegation and got me as high as 6th in season 2 before I decided to blood some youngsters and fell away.

Its a much better tactic all round I think, i'll put it up tonight.

[sparkysrovers]

36 minutes ago, Mr U Rosler said:

Halfway into 1st season in Prem I had to abandon the 4231, too attacking for such a relatively weak team and I was heading for relegation.

However I was largely happy with the mentality and Team Instructions so I had a re-think on the formation and player roles focusing on good pitch coverage, varied attacking play and a better defensive shape.

I'd also got a couple of very high potential Strikers in my youth intake so I was looking for a 2 striker set up.

Settled on a 3232 (WB) which season 1 saved me from relegation and got me as high as 6th in season 2 before I decided to blood some youngsters and fell away.

Its a much better tactic all round I think, i'll put it up tonight.

Hallelujah! The tactic is fantastic in the lower leagues no doubt, but I finished my second season in 8th but did manage to get to the final of the FA Cup. I cant wait to test out the new one as I'm about to start a new season.

[sparkysrovers]

Time to watch the real life team now. 

[Mr U Rosler]

Ok, as discussed above, the 4231 struggled my first season in Premier League so switching to the 352 saved my bacon before recording a good finish in the 2nd season.

 

TACTIC - 352

Classic 352.fmf

[sparkysrovers]

Have some good players in the IF position that I'm going to find a home for as strikers, but then I'll have loads of strikers. I know its only a game but I do have some loyalty to those players. Its a funny old game.

[Mr U Rosler]

The Mezzala's end

30 minutes ago, sparkysrovers said:

Have some good players in the IF position that I'm going to find a home for as strikers, but then I'll have loads of strikers. I know its only a game but I do have some loyalty to those players. Its a funny old game.

The Mezzala's end up operating in a similar space to the IFs when attacking, if any of them have any positional ability for midfield might be worth retraining especially if they have high work rate.

[sparkysrovers]

Yeah I was thinking that alright, I'll have another look, thanks mate

[PaddyTaka]

I’m on fm touch - do you have the player instructions too please?

[Cuper]

On 19. 04. 2018. at 12:00, Mr U Rosler said:

Halfway into 1st season in Prem I had to abandon the 4231, too attacking for such a relatively weak team and I was heading for relegation.

However I was largely happy with the mentality and Team Instructions so I had a re-think on the formation and player roles focusing on good pitch coverage, varied attacking play and a better defensive shape.

I'd also got a couple of very high potential Strikers in my youth intake so I was looking for a 2 striker set up.

Settled on a 3232 (WB) which season 1 saved me from relegation and got me as high as 6th in season 2 before I decided to blood some youngsters and fell away.

Its a much better tactic all round I think, i'll put it up tonight.

i tried 4231 with swansea twice, both time i struggled really.

Going to try the new tactic, can you put player attributes requirements like you posted on the first page

Thank you

[Mr U Rosler]

Using a mix of both tactics at the moment.

But CONTROL mentality now.

[sparkysrovers]

12 hours ago, Mr U Rosler said:

Using a mix of both tactics at the moment.

But CONTROL mentality now.

Do you use the mix depending on home/away matches or on being favourites/outsiders?

[Mr U Rosler]

1 hour ago, sparkysrovers said:

Do you use the mix depending on home/away matches or on being favourites/outsiders?

My team now favour's the 4231 (on Control), but i'll slip in the 3232 occasionally or to break a poor run of form.

Keep changing my mind on which way to go but I have some great Inside Forwards.

 

 

[sparkysrovers]

Do one season with one and one with the other to see which is better?

[sparkysrovers]

Going to stick with 352 on Control and if hit a bad patch switch to 4231 on control

[Mr U Rosler]

Back on the 352 myself.

[Cuper]

Mr U Rosler - the 352 is going really strong, all games were played on attacking mentality

[sparkysrovers]

Bar you're last eight games. I started with a good pre-season on attacking, in the first two games shipped 7 goals. Changed to Control and managed to get 3 wins. Going to stick with control and switch to 4231 if I hit a bad run.

[JK Galgreefe]

I've been using the 3-5-2 with good results with Aves in the Portuguese League. I had to make a few tweaks to suit my squad. I moved the CM back to a Regista, added Close Down More to the team instructions, and switched to Counter mentality. Then I added Move Into Channels to the strikers to make them find space out wide when we win the ball back, ready for a quick transition out of defence.

The defence is really solid and we score loads on the counter. It isn't the easiest football on the eye at times, but it's effective.

[Cuper]

9 hours ago, sparkysrovers said:

Bar you're last eight games. I started with a good pre-season on attacking, in the first two games shipped 7 goals. Changed to Control and managed to get 3 wins. Going to stick with control and switch to 4231 if I hit a bad run.

every test i made was with swansea and with the majority of the tactics i tested after 10 games i'm rock bottom (without any transfer), exceptions are Knap's 4213 343 and this one

[sparkysrovers]

Lost three matches on the trot 1-0 in each game, it's just like we needed that something extra, changed back to 4231 and on control this time and it seems to be that something extra needed. I'll keep an eye on it.

 

It's kind of funny/annoying, anytime I get close to breaching the top 6 - I go on a rubbish streak of games. 

[Mr U Rosler]

Not quite satisfied with either formation myself, my Stockport team is an established premier league team now but i'd like European football. 

Were very competitive against run of the mill premier league teams, but the top 4 or 5 teams are at a different level. Like real life really.

Man United have won the league 11 times in the last 12 seasons, they have elite players everywhere, ridiculous wingers.

I have a couple of my academy players in the full England team but they are not world level.

I have one guy who I think will be world class, i'm hoping he can carry the team into europe, but will need a better tactic to challenge Man U, looking at some variations now.

[sparkysrovers]

Since I've changed to 4231 (control) I've played six, won 5 and drawn 1.  Like your game, Man Utd are all encompassing, they lose very little matches, its very tough to break into the top six, being holding on to 6th place now for a few games.

[sparkysrovers]

So at Christmas, I went on a run of 4 games losing, held a team meeting, and went out against Spurs, in the place below me in the league and recorded my biggest ever win in this save 7-1. Scored 7 goals in the first half!!

[Mr U Rosler]

Using the 4231?

[sparkysrovers]

Yep on control - i just need the teams in 3rd, 4th & 5th to slip up and drop points, and for us to keep winning and we might make 4th this season. We're in a with a shout, morale is pretty good in the team. I like how the tactic plays on control, some of the tricks and skills from my players using the tactic are really good. 

[Mr U Rosler]

Always liked the attacking play of the 4231, but in the premier league I've found the defence a bit suspect, having said that my teams a bit better now and I've not really given it a good run on control mentality.

I like the way the 3 centre backs/wingback set up defends, forcing opponents into longshots.

 

[sparkysrovers]

could you move the FB's to attack or support duty with 4231 in control or would that not work?

[Mr U Rosler]

The 4231 is already defensively vulnerable, I wouldn't mess with the Full Back duties unless you are one of the top teams in the division.

I'm revisiting the 352, not getting the returns i'd expect from the Mezzala's, think there is a better arrangement of roles and duties across all of midfield. Will report back.

[Mr U Rosler]

Ok,

Made a few changes to the roles in the 352.

As mentioned above, I wasn't seeing a good return from the Mezzalla's so I've shifted the wide attacking responsibilities to the Wingbacks, we are covering their foray's upfield by employing Carrilero's who cover laterally, the fact that they are more defensive means our central midfielder can go on attack duty, which means i'm now happy for the forwards to pull wide into the Channels creating space centrally for our runner from midfield.

A bit like this;

All outfield players in the screenshot, our right sided Carrilero on the ball with an easy pass to the right Wingback or a reverse to the left Wingback. Out Central midfielder is making his run into the box, 1 Striker in the channel with the other central. A lot of options for our man on the ball.

Defensively we are really solid, one of the best records in the league.

Finally look like we're pushing for a European spot.

Obviously my teams a little stronger each year but this set up seems very well balanced so far.

 

 

TACTIC

 

Classic 352v2.fmf

[sparkysrovers]

I'm doing quite well with the 4231 but I'm interested to see how this will turn out. I'm facing into Feb in 5th place with a match against the league leaders and champions Utd, so will see how that goes. Played City a few matches ago and they were barely able to beat us, 1-0 due to a flukey goal.

[snowymuk]

can you post player requirements  for each positions and training etc please

 

[Mr U Rosler]

13 minutes ago, snowymuk said:

can you post player requirements  for each positions and training etc please

 

Training

 

Pre-season 

Fitness/match tactics

 

Then

balanced/teamwork

 

Suggested player attributes;

 

DLF's

Finishing

Composure

Off the Ball

Acceleration

Apart from the obvious requirement to finish moves, you need these guys adept at finding pockets of space, the pace to run in behind is always useful.

 

Carrilero's

Work rate

Marking

Tackling

Passing

Very much a support role, in attacking phase can be involved in early build up play before lurking outside the penalty area to recycle possession and break up counter attacks if you lose possession.

 

Centre Midfield/Attack

Off the ball

Flair

Technique

Passing

A key component in your attacks they link the midfield to the attack during build up play before arriving late in the box to get on the end of moves, they also put a good shift in defensively. Put your best midfielder here, converted AMC's are fine.

 

Complete Wingbacks  

Work Rate

Dribbling

Acceleration

Crossing

Whilst they still have defensive responsibilities they are the players which will have acres of space to receive the ball and play. The ability to go past a man is very useful meaning they can get to the byline and cross from there. Whilst its great when they whip a cross onto your forwards head, even misplaced crosses can be dangerous as your central attackers get to a knockdown or 2nd ball first. If I had a big budget to blow, I's spend it here.

 

Centre Backs 

Marking

Tacking

Positioning

Jumping Reach

With decent defenders there will be a lot of games where your opponent resorts to longshots unless they have real quality players who can hurt you. They usually have easy passing option up the flanks to Wingbacks which is an effective way to start attacks.

 

Goal Keeper

Reflexes

Handling

Aerial Ability

One on One's

A good shot stopper is fine, they will be dealing with long shots most of the time with exception of set pieces. 

 

[snowymuk]

thanks

 

[sparkysrovers]

On 27/04/2018 at 23:36, sparkysrovers said:

I'm doing quite well with the 4231 but I'm interested to see how this will turn out. I'm facing into Feb in 5th place with a match against the league leaders and champions Utd, so will see how that goes. Played City a few matches ago and they were barely able to beat us, 1-0 due to a flukey goal.

Ended up finishing sixth which in the grand scheme of things I'm not too unhappy about. Other teams had games in hand on me so that came in to play. The new 352 was a lot better defensively with combined with half of the season with 4231 created a new record at the club of 15 clean sheets. Ended up with a few draws too which were never really there under the 4231 and hey 1 point is better than none, am I right?

And we managed to beat Utd twice (once in the league and once in the semi final of the FA Cup) speaking of FA Cup - won that for the first time since 1928. Already planning for next season. The 4231 definitely plays a bit more sexier football but look the 352 gets the results and thats the basis of Sam Allardyces long ball career. It gets his teams results. There have been one or two outstanding victories with the 352 and some absolutely amazing goals.

[Mr U Rosler]

Managed to finish 4th, within sniffing distance from Chelsea & City but miles behind United. Mourinho is still at UTD, hoping when he leaves they calm down a bit.

The new 352 has been defensively outstanding, also beat the clean sheet record, although I did have a run of 5 games without scoring myself, you are relying on your Strikers being on form, finished the season really strong with 6 straight wins conceding only 1 goal and scoring freely so hopefully that's a better reflection of the tactic.

My squad is pretty maxed out other than a young striker and wingback who can improve a lot, hopefully Champions League football will see a reputation jump which will help me attract better youth players so in time I can challenge Man u. Only giving myself to 2040 though as id be 70 then and would retire.

 

   

[sparkysrovers]

Plenty of time

[sparkysrovers]

How are you doing Mr Rosler? Season so far is going well with the 3 - 5 - 2! We've only lost two matches across all competitions since the start of the season and we're into december. Sitting 3rd in Premier League and top of our europa league group

[sparkysrovers]

Sadly despite a great start to the season, we've been throwing away points and our performances have become quite boring with the players not receiving that many good ratings despite our lofty top half position. Dont know whether its the match engine or what the hell is going on. Maybe its the players themselves, I'm not quite sure, as I thought this was going to be our season! 

[Mr U Rosler]

Had a good season with the 352 finishing 3rd in the Prem, before deciding it was a bit too boring. Tried the 4231 but that is a bit mental at this level.

Essentially I've now mixed the 2 tactics, hopefully best of both worlds.

image upload no ads

Closing the gap on Man U, maybe next year.

343

 

Classic 343if.fmf

[johangod]

Any hints on the attributes of players for the new 343 ?

 

Always loved your tactics and suggestions for attributes as it seemed to work wonders to pick out the right players who would often overperform if chosen right.

 

About to give this a go with an Arsenal side in the 6th season that I haven't had luck with using the tactics I did with Dortmund and Juventus where I built sides that walked the leagues and won CL with both. cheeers

[sparkysrovers]

• Any update on how the 343 is going? I've had to stick with the 352 as it was pretty hard to find any wingers that wanted to play with the team

[johangod]

Used the 343 for about a season and a half.

It's super effective defensively but relies very much on your front 3 to be on form to net goals, then it can be amazing and I managed to get Lyon to the finals of the CL with a team that was never supposed to get there, but in the league I couldn't keep up with PSG as they dominate so hard. I drew quite a few games but only lost twice to PSG and then two other random losses when I was starting to focus on CL as PSG had ran away with it. 

 

It can sometimes be a very deadlock tactic where no key highlights come until the 30th minute, but if you start the game well which can happen you can easily grab solid wins. My highlights were beating Chelsea 4-2 at home in the group of the CL, got up 3-0 and they pegged two back in the last 10 minutes, 3-0 drubbing of Dortmund which are ranked 1st in the world in terms of reputation.

 

I'm now trying to find a more attacking tactic for games where I think I can play like that, but the 343 he's made is superb in most ways, just sometimes you can get locked out if your front 3 aren't on point.

[Mr U Rosler]

Not played any more games since last post, taking a break.

I still think the 343 is the way to go.

johangod, I've noticed some flat first half performances with all tactics, maybe i'm getting my pre-match team talks wrong, after a first half with not much happening i'll give them the hairdryer treatment which normally see's a much better 2nd half performance.

  

[sparkysrovers]

Going to start next season with the 343 - hard to find quality out and out strikers though that want to play for Blackburn even though our facilities are top notch and have a growing rep. 

[Mr U Rosler]

 

343

Player Roles and Overview.

Judging by a couple of posts, thought I’d better clear up a bit about the Tactic as it play’s out slightly differently than the other one’s I’ve put up.

As alluded to earlier, we have a defensively sound formation, a back 3, Wingbacks ‘only’ on support duty ensuring they defend well and a midfield that closes down aggressively. No obvious weak points or areas where opponents can focus attacks.

Unusually for me this year I have the AMR/AML (Inside Forwards) on attack duty which means their defensive work is limited, the upside of this is that they are usually ahead of the ball when we win back possession and with the right players you’ll see some devastating counter-attacks.

They are often in advance of our Striker who acts as a deeper creative pivot feeding passes into our Inside Forwards.

 

IF                                                                            IF

 

                          

                                  DLF

 

With the Inside Forwards sitting narrower than traditional wide attackers they are often ‘in the channel’ and are not being directly marked.

During more sustained attacks, the Wingbacks over lap whilst the central midfielders support centrally giving us a lot of options.

Although I’m doing an Academy Challenge my 3 best players are my 3 forwards, my Inside Forwards are both naturally two footed and they create havoc.

Its fair to say you are reliant on your front 3 doing a lot of the attacking work between them, so I’d blow whatever budget you have on these roles.

 

 DLF

Whilst they still carry goal scoring responsibilities they are also required to be creative and should have the vision and passing to hit you IF’s early.

I’d look for;

Passing

Vision

Technique

Finishing  

 

IF’s

Ideally you would like explosive pace, with and without the ball, to expose defenders on the counter attack. Think Salah, Sterling, Rashford etc. Hybrid creator/goal scorers.

Ideally 2 footed, if not you can train anyone to be ‘reasonable’ on their weaker foot.

 

Acceleration

Dribbling

Flair

Technique    

 

Box to Box

At first glance you’d think these guys will get outnumbered in midfield and overrun. However, the Wingbacks step into midfield at times, they have 3 centre backs blocking the middle of the pitch and all of the forwards will eventually drop back if you are under sustained pressure.

Having said that, they do carry a big workload, moving up and down the pitch with a mixture of defensive and offensive responsibilities. Hard work and determination are a priority, if they can play a bit, all the better.

Work Rate

Determination

Stamina

Passing

 

Wingbacks

Another 50/50 role, whilst they are tasked with protecting the flanks the wider centre backs will cover & help them out when they venture forward. When its relatively safe to do so they will get to the byline and across from there as well as pinging in some crosses from deep.

Again, balanced ‘all round’ footballers is what you after, I’d look for;

 

Decisions

Determination

Work Rate

Passing  

 

Centre Backs

Bread and butter Centre Backs are fine here, they usually have simple passing options available so basic competence on the ball is fine, pacey, tacklers who are good in the air is what you want.

Marking

Tacking

Jumping Reach

Acceleration   

[johangod]

Yeah honestly, I've now done two full seasons with Lyon and the tactic is very good. Super solid at the back and if you get your front men on form they will score enough to give you solid results.

 

I did adjust the basic tactic to utilize a CF/s, just because my forward is that good - don't think it changed much how the tactic runs. Again the only issue can be it's sometimes hard to grab goals, I did create three hybrids of the tactic, one to slow down a pace of a game, sort of a more defensive approach that I will only ever swap to if I'm two goals ahead at like the 70 or 75 minute. Then a SUS tactic which I also only swap to if I'm up and really want to see out the result. Those don't really seem to fail, it's the exact same but just swap mentalities and then ask players to take breather and slow it down overall.

 

I did also create a Pressure tactic, where I up the mentality to Attack, shape goes to Flexible, I tick work ball into box and up the width one notch - it has worked to grab goals on some occasions but it also can lead to conceding, it probably needs some other adjustments.

 

But the standard tactic is again really solid and if you score early it's a god send - it usually draws the other team out and you grab a bunch of more goals, the only issue I have is that I'm in a league with PSG who are just way to overpowered, they don't go under 94 pts and it causes me so little room for mishaps and it's so annoying. I'm hoping I can grab the league title I'm after in the next one or two seasons, I'm on a mission to win every big league in Europe and only have France and Spain left.

 

League table in the two seasons I've been at Lyon and then my CL campaign in the first season, it does screw the order a little of the games but just know that, the final is there in the middle for some reason and the 1st knockout round is up top

 

[johangod]

It is so insane to try and fight PSG...

 

First of all they just don't do wrong, I just looked and in my 3 seasons, placing 2nd always with 84, 86 and 89 points, I would have won every big league in Europe with that point count all 11 seasons that have been played barring like 3 seasons in Spain were Real Madrid are dominating, and then my own Juventus seasons in Italy where I rocked the league. Other than that, those points would suffice for a title in a huge majority of the cases. It's just so disheartening.

 

Then it's the fact the giants of EU just harass all the good players I have, I always have to get like two to three new starters every year. I've made like a net profit of 100M in the three seasons I've been here but still I've kept up with the same performance every season but getting PSG is just so impossible.

 

 

[Mr U Rosler]

Same in my game with Man United absolutely dominant, they've won the league 12 seasons in a row. Mourinho still there.

Need to beat them home & away in the league to have half a chance.