The Return of the Manchester United Thread v1.3 - The Future Starts Hereâ„¢

[James M]

I don't really see Niemi as much better than Howard, myself :/

[Eastwood]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by James M:

I don't really see Niemi as much better than Howard, myself :/ <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd say he is, but considering Howards what 7 years younger surely it's better to help iron out his faults than just buy a new player.

[Paul Scholes\' Regen]

Niemi would be a decent temporary solution but wonder what his signing would do to Howards confidence or desire to stay at the club. Think we should keep what we've got and stick Timmeh back between the sticks. Howard hasn't had the benefit of playing behind Rio much this season either (Or at all iirc), I'm sure now our back four looks quite strong he'll get back in form (If he's reinstated as #1 that is)

[Ryno]

Forlan just scored a cracker against Barca.

How much could we do with his unpredictability and misses right now?

[Ryno]

However, he then proceeded to miss and open goal 5 minutes later.

[Nick OGS20]

Typical

Diego :*)

[gonch19]

niemi and gravesen don't win you the champions league or the premiership.

oh, and 4-5-1 at home to a conference side is almost beyond belief tbh

[Paul Scholes\' Regen]

Well Porto had some players who I probably wouldn't have taken at United before they won the CL, Vitor Baia and Costinha for example. And Arsenal won the Prem with the tart in goal, and I'd say Niemi is better than both her and Baia. And Gravesen would be a good experienced alternative for our central midfield.

[Nick OGS20]

Niemi's one of the best keepers in the country, in Europe even. He was arguably more deserving of the keeper's spot in the Premiership XI last year than Timmeh was. Having a keeper of that quality saves you god knows how many points a season, not to mention gives your defence added security (would reassure Rio and co. that the guy behind them isn't about to throw the ball in his own net for a start).

As for Gravesen, no, he won't win us the Champions League or the Premiership on his own, but name me a player we could afford and who'd be available that would do so? We're all bemoaning the lack of quality/depth we have in central midfield and the fact we have Djemba-Djemba/Miller as back-up. Bringing in Gravesen gives us genuine options there - he's proven Premiership quality, he's hard-working, puts himself about and is genuinely creative, not to mention the fact that the guy delivers a hell of a set-piece. And all that for £2m (that's a third of a Kleberson, a half of a Djemba, or two thirds of a Bellion), which isn't going to break the bank. Like I said, if there's a genuine chance of getting him for that price, as far as I'm concerned it's a no-brainer.

[James07?]

I’ve just had a thought about Fergie’s ‘tactics’ for ‘reserve’ games…

Bellion up front on his ownaah haa haa haa ahhaaaa haaa hahaaa ahaaha aaaah hhaaahah ahahah ahaa haahaa

[Scatter]

is liam millers time at the club already up then?

i think it's pretty obvious - and has been for a while - that the djemba twins won't cut it. but i don't think i can remember a worse performance in a red shirt than millers against sperz. and whilst i didn't see the exeter game, according to all reports he was equally poor in that match too. but, he did show in the champions league for celtic signs that he is a quality player, and came with a reputation as a real prospect.

so, clearly not good enough, or needs time to show his worth?

[Taz & The Devil]

Miller will never be Man Utd quality for the simple fact that he offers nothing going forward or in defence. He is a guy who will stand in the middle of the pitch and pass silly neat little passes a yard to the side or a yard backwards.

[Blaine]

Backbeat reckons we are offering Miller back to Celtic as p/x for McGeady.

[Taz & The Devil]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Blaine:

Backbeat reckons we are offering Miller back to Celtic as p/x for McGeady. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I hope so, i havent seen anything of McGeady but i've heard great things. Yet again i heard great things about Miller.

[Scatter]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Blaine:

Backbeat reckons we are offering Miller back to Celtic as p/x for McGeady. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Given the acrimonious nature of Millers departure, I doubt that move is a starter at all...

[Blaine]

Me neither but thought I'd mention it.

[mattmorgan]

I read on Ceefax that the Exeter replay is on the BBc, which is cool. I think it is on the 19th.

[RedBlood]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mattmorgan:

I read on Ceefax that the Exeter replay is on the BBc, which is cool. I think it is on the 19th. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>They keep saying 19th on sky but on the ticket application part of www.manutd.com says 18th at 7:45

[RedBlood]

web sites changed to 19th now got work that night why say 18th ffs

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JulesMUFC:

At least with Graveson you know what your getting too, a hard working hard tackling player who will give you 100%.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

i didn't think there was anyone out there who still thought Gravesen was that type of player. He's the opposite of that, he's a creative, attacking player who needs a holding player next to him to allow him to play. Just because he's bald

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Eastwood:

wouldnt mind to sign him for that fee of £2m, is established as a solid player in the premiership, cerainly more so than players like djemba and kleberson. tbh i'd sell richardson, djemba, kleberson, bellion and possibly p. neville if we can get a decent enough fee (and do sign Gravesen obviously). let the players like jones and eagles have a chance when we do have a shortage of midfielders.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you sell both Phil Neville and Djemba, who will play as the defensive midfielder? Gravesen doesn't do that. I believe that's Jones' job, but wasn't that his first start for us? If not, he's not played more than a couple of carling cup games. If we sold them, and Keane got injured just before the Milan game, would you be happy throwing him in there? I wouldn't. So who's left? John O'Shea?

I'm all for getting rid of some of the dross from our reserves, but not while there's only untried kids to replace them. The only youngster who's shown enough to suggest they could cope with a run of games in the first team is Spector. I hear great things about Eagles, but i've yet to see anything that suggests he's ready for the first team yet, assuming he ever will be. Even more so Richardson, i think he'll go in the summer. Some of the others have shown promise, but not yet. So unless we sell to buy, which i can't see happening in january, we're stuck with the dross, at least until the summer.

[RedBlood]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mark g:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JulesMUFC:

At least with Graveson you know what your getting too, a hard working hard tackling player who will give you 100%.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

i didn't think there was anyone out there who still thought Gravesen was that type of player. He's the opposite of that, he's a creative, attacking player who needs a holding player next to him to allow him to play. Just because he's bald

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Eastwood:

wouldnt mind to sign him for that fee of £2m, is established as a solid player in the premiership, cerainly more so than players like djemba and kleberson. tbh i'd sell richardson, djemba, kleberson, bellion and possibly p. neville if we can get a decent enough fee (and do sign Gravesen obviously). let the players like jones and eagles have a chance when we do have a shortage of midfielders.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you sell both Phil Neville and Djemba, who will play as the defensive midfielder? Gravesen doesn't do that. I believe that's Jones' job, but wasn't that his first start for us? If not, he's not played more than a couple of carling cup games. If we sold them, and Keane got injured just before the Milan game, would you be happy throwing him in there? I wouldn't. So who's left? John O'Shea?

I'm all for getting rid of some of the dross from our reserves, but not while there's only untried kids to replace them. The only youngster who's shown enough to suggest they could cope with a run of games in the first team is Spector. I hear great things about Eagles, but i've yet to see _anything_ that suggests he's ready for the first team yet, assuming he ever will be. Even more so Richardson, i think he'll go in the summer. Some of the others have shown promise, but not yet. So unless we sell to buy, which i can't see happening in january, we're stuck with the dross, at least until the summer. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kleberson can play dmc as can fortune, oh and oshea

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RedBlood:

Kleberson can play dmc as can fortune, oh and oshea <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kleberson . Just because he's listed as DMC in FM, doesn't mean he can actually play that position you know. You need to be hard working and be able to tackle.

Fortune has done OK the few times he's played there, however. I had forgotten him. But can you rely on him to be fit to take his chance?

[AlphaDevil2]

Well what a game the east stand tier 2 was absolutely rocking all you could hear was the city faithful.

Bit sad united hardly muttered a word, if they did, an electric atmosphere could have been made. However I understand a lot of your support was from the prawn brigade .

So hardcore man united fans such as nick and james et all, who is coming?

Is it going to be one of these occassions when your away support is much noisier then your home support?

Will offer help and advice if needed.... hope to see you all there soaked in the away stand.

[Blaine]

I've booked the time off in the unlikely eventuality I hear of a ticket.

[AlphaDevil2]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Blaine:

I've booked the time off in the unlikely eventuality I hear of a ticket. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

How do they decide which united fans are entitled to tickets?

[James07?]

I'll be going down if I get a ticket.

[mark g]

A teams away support is always noisier than it's home support, because you've got more hardcore fans in a smaller area. On the same lines, most away sections think they outsung the oppositions home fans, because a) all you can hear in an away section is your own fans, and b)the home teams hardcore support is now more spread out.

But it's also true that the very top teams grounds have become less noisy for "run of the mill" games, as expectation is higher, and there is generally a larger proportion of occasional fans who manage to get tickets for these games. But places like OT still rock for big league games, and the big european nights as well. That's not to denigrate exeter, it's just that we expected to win, and when that happens what you get is frustration and anger, rather than getting behind the team when things aren't going to plan.

[mark g]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AlphaDevil2:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Blaine:

I've booked the time off in the unlikely eventuality I hear of a ticket. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

How do they decide which united fans are entitled to tickets? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

A huge game of paper, scissors, stone.

[Blaine]

To cut a long story short, season ticket holders can apply for away games and are separated into two 'pots' - one 'standard'/one 'loyalty'... can't remember exactly how many are in the loyalty pot but it's not that many ( > 1500)... James will probably know better than me.

I don't even have a season ticket so any away ticket for me is gratefully received

[AlphaDevil2]

How many season ticket holders do you have?

Also nice programme, this has been echoed by fellow grecians although the inclusion of Uri Geller was not well thought out.

There is still a lot of bad blood about him and the past board

[James07?]

Didn't think much of the exeter fans tbh. Not hugely loud and incredibly unoriginal. Probably because half of them only go to a game every 5 years.

[Bagpuss]

Quite??

Should of been up the top of the streetie then

nice and noisy up their

[AlphaDevil2]

It sounded loud where I was but of course I was in the midst of all the support.

On the note of fans only going to a game every 5 years that is true, there has been much bickering and annoyance to this. For example some people did not even realise we had been relegated from the league.

Hopefully however people will support city because of this more. This will help to even the bank balence as we are still using thousands a month.

[ACou2000]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AlphaDevil2:

For example some people did not even realise we had been relegated from the league. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> And people complain about our 'fans'..

[AlphaDevil2]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ACou2000:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AlphaDevil2:

For example some people did not even realise we had been relegated from the league. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> And people complain about our 'fans'.. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Typical southenders eh?

[Blaine]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>MANCHESTER UNITED V AC MILAN,WEDNESDAY 23 FEBRUARY, KICK OFF 7.45PM

Sales will commence to Season/LMTB Holders who can purchase their own seats at the times stated below on production of voucher 29 (duly completed) and their membership card. Alternatively ST/LMTB Holders unable to make a personal application can purchase their own seat by telephoning the MUFC Ticket Order Line on 0870 442 1999 at the same times giving details of their customer number and credit card, by clicking here to make an on line application or make an immediate postal application enclosing relevant documentation, payment and first class sae. (Please note an administration fee of 3% is charged on all debit/credit card transactions).

Wednesday 12 January 9am to 5pm

Thursday 13 January 9am to 5pm

Friday 14 January 9am to 5pm

Saturday 15 January 9am to 1pm

ADDITIONALLY, ALL SEASON/LMTB HOLDERS WHO HAVE REGISTERED FOR THE AUTOMATIC CUP SCHEME SHOULD NOTE THAT TICKETS WILL BE PROCESSED DURING THE FIRST WEEK OF SALES.

ST/LMTB Holders who wish to purchase other than their usual seat can do so on Sunday 16 January from 9am until 1pm, by telephoning the MUFC Ticket Order Line or alternatively by making an IMMEDIATE postal application enclosing letter of application, seating preference, voucher 29 (duly completed), first class sae, open cheque (made payable to MUFC) or credit/debit card details.

Please ensure the incoming envelope is clearly marked “AC MILANâ€.

Members can click here to make an immediate online application, register an application by telephoning the Ticket Order Line on 0870 442 1999 or make an immediate postal application enclosing match ticket order form (noting price changes for this competition), payment and first class sae. Please note tickets are not allocated on a first come first served basis. If successful, tickets will be sent to the Member who registered the application. All payments must be made by either debit/credit card, however please note that if successful, an administration fee of 3% per transaction is charged for this service.

Any new members can also apply by forwarding a letter of application, quoting Name, Address and Telephone details of each member, relevant payment and sae.

Members prices (subject to availability):

North and South Stands Upper and Lower £32.00

North Stand 2nd Tier £30.00

North East / West Quadrants Upper and Lower £28.00

East and West Stand Upper £28.00

East and West Stand 2nd Tier £28.00

Family Stand £28.00

North Stand 3rd Tier £26.00

East and West Lower £24.00

A half price facility is available to under 16s and over 65s.

We anticipate a huge demand from members for this game and in the event of tickets remaining a further announcement will be made after 5pm on Tuesday 18th January

Updated Monday 10 January 13:00 <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[SirZ]

Do none members have any hope of getting tickets to this?

[Bagpuss]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SirZ:

Do none members have any hope of getting tickets to this? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

not likely no

you have time to join and apply however

[pjburrage]

Potentially tricky tie against Boro' in the next round if we can get past Exeter.

Replay live on BBC1 Wed 19 Jan.

[SirZ]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by John O'Shea:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SirZ:

Do none members have any hope of getting tickets to this? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

not likely no

you have time to join and apply however <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So None fans can join and be members? cool...

[Paul Scholes\' Regen]

Gary Neville is at deaths door

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Manchester United's medical staff have conceded that they are struggling to establish the exact nature of Gary Neville's illness.

The England defender has been forced to miss United's last five games with the virus that has also afflicted Old Trafford team-mates Liam Miller, Eric Djemba-Djemba and Paul Scholes.

However, whilst the aforementioned trio have made speedy returns to action, Neville is still struggling for fitness.

Red Devils chief Sir Alex Ferguson has conceded that he is concerned about getting to the root of the problem, with United keen for the experienced defender to make a return.

''Our medical people can't get to the bottom of Gary's illness,'' said Ferguson.

''All the tests have been done but we still don't know what's wrong with him.

''He feels fine one day and then the next, the bug has returned.

''I'm sure it will clear up eventually but just at this moment I couldn't say when he will be fit to play again.'' <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[Terry Cheung]

Maybe Gaz is pining for Becks.

Seriously, hope he gets well soon and comes back to score the winner against Milan.

[Blaine]

Has anyone noticed this:

"If successful, tickets will be sent to the Member who registered the application. All payments must be made by either debit/credit card, however please note that if successful, an administration fee of 3% per transaction is charged for this service."

What about cheques?

[ericcantona7]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Blaine:

Has anyone noticed this:

"If successful, tickets will be sent to the Member who registered the application. _All payments must be made by either debit/credit card_, however please note that if successful, an administration fee of 3% per transaction is charged for this service."

What about cheques? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

we don't have any, the last one was Poborsky.

[exchampionsfan]

poor 2/10

[Paul Scholes\' Regen]

Are you available for a Bar Mitzvah this Thursday?

[ericcantona7]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Paul Scholes' Regen:

Are you available for a Bar Mitzvah this Thursday? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'll go to a bar anytime anywhere, now what's this place Mitzvah?

[Taz & The Devil]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>

FA Cup: Manchester United draw exposes the need for a clear out

Football at the top level is a squad game. It must be, so many people are convinced of it. Premiership teams need twice as many players as they can physically play to cope with injuries and suspensions. But the real demonstration of a team’s power is just how many players it has that are of a sufficient quality to mean that injuries and suspensions can be laughed off.

Manchester United have long had strength in depth; the current squad appears to belying this reputation and possibly tarnishing that of Sir Alex Ferguson. It is almost unprecedented that the United manager would apologise to the fans for a home performance. He did make apologies in the late 1980’s – but this writer can remember none since the FA Cup success of 1990.

In short United were abject against Exeter. Woeful, lacking in character, thought, effort and at times even ability. At the end the home fans left Sir Alex Ferguson with no doubt that they felt cheated by having to pay full price for that display – and certainly encouraged the manager to make his apology.

But the warning signs that this type of performance would happen were there. The first sign that the shadow XI was not good enough was during a thrashing at Fenerbahce in the final group game of the Champions League. Already qualified, Ferguson sent out a team that was pretty similar to this one – and were soundly beaten. As it was an irrelevant away game the backlash was pretty muted. A desperate performance against an Arsenal youth team was rewarded by a win – but only through a giveaway goal. If this team plays against Chelsea it will be routed.

Against Exeter the suspicion that the reserves were simply not good enough was borne out. But it is not the youth team players that are coming through that are the problem. A series of inadequate, relatively cheap players have come in to fill the gap between the first team and reserves and they are simply not up to scratch.

Liam Miller must consider that his United career cannot have much further to fall. Put in the centre of midfield to provide a creative spark, he seemed disinterested and a couple of yards of the pace. For an international midfielder he was harassed and bossed about by non-league journeymen – a desperate sight for a man who was supposed to supplant Paul Scholes. Instead Scholes replaced him in this match in a late bid to win the match. That Scholes created two or three times as many chances as Miller in the last 20 minutes is very instructive.

Alongside Miller, Eric Djemba-Djemba was equally awful. No first touch, little in the way of a second, he can barely shoot, pass or tackle – what exactly is he for?

And up front was the Bambi-on-ice figure of David Bellion. He has pace and is developing a powerful shot but his anticipation of anything is woeful. He never gambles, chases lost causes or attempts to make anything happen. He looks for all the world like a School third team player who, after some rave reviews, is suddenly drafted into the first XI and is trying not to do anything that will upset anyone – so he is doing nothing and REALLY upsetting everyone. He probably has ability – he should be allowed to demonstrate it in the Championship.

Kieran Richardson seems to have had enough chances without impressing and Phil Neville seems to be drifting away. This meant that almost all the experienced players in the line-up were below par and didn’t look out of place playing against non-league opposition.

On the plus side Wes Brown’s latest return from injury went OK, Tim Howard looked more confident than he has for a while, Pique and Spector were combative and will improve. But easily the best United players, before the substitutions, were David Jones and Chris Eagles. Jones was quick, direct and aggressive. As he is also tall and left footed - he must have a better than even chance of becoming a Premiership player. His right footed alternative Chris Eagles was of a similar mould and could also have a future. But that is the limit of the plus points.

When Paul Scholes, Cristiano Ronaldo and Alan Smith were introduced the ability and fight of the United team roughly doubled – and a late win was always a possibility. The conditions were difficult – but when good players arrived on the pitch they were easy to spot.

Exeter player a solid 4-5-1 with a little flair and were a match for United for large parts of the game. At no stage did they attempt to kick their way out of trouble or even lump the ball in to touch at any opportunity. This was a footballing teams that played within its limitations and to its ability.

Manchester United were missing a dozen players for a variety of reasons, but the shadow team showed that it needed breaking up. Players like Miller, Dejemba-Dejemba, Kleberson, Bellion, Phil Neville, John O’Shea and Richardson need to be moved on because they are not pressuring the first team and they are stopping the likes of Jones and Eagles from coming through. It’s like 1993 all over again – United need to give the kids a chance; the only forward is to sell the players that simply aren’t good enough.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I took this from recafe, i dont know where its from but its a good article. I agree with 99.99% of it. I thought Eagles was as bad as Richardson and will go the same way but i agree with the rest. I found Jones final ball a bit poor but i'd say that was more down to the options open to him than anything else and if Fletcher gets games in the first team when theres injuries it cant be a bad shout for young Jones to get a game instead.

[Blaine]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AlphaDevil2:

How do they decide which united fans are entitled to tickets? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Just thinking about this in terms of the Milan game. You will notice new members are invited to apply and that their are no special selling arrangements, meaning people that have applied to every game have the same chance as someone who hasn't applied for a single one.

This post doubles as a 'first dibs on a Milan spare, please?' should I be unlucky - which is due to happen anytime soon.

[phatty2003]

By the way is anyone here going to Milan away?

How much you paying for the trip and are you going to be hoping get a ticket just before the game possibly in the black market?