FM15 - The community formation experiment

[Deego619]

The 4-1-3-2 Narrow has been well...

Brilliant.

We went 2014 unbeaten in the league before succumbing to Malaga thanks to a Corner and a rare misfiring day for Luciano Vietto, who has been a revelation in this high tempo system.

Team Instructions

My first XI when fit. Jaume Costa is never fit.

Notable Results

1-1 vs Barcelona

2-2 vs Real Madrid

5-3 vs Atletico Madrid

Euro Cup

Progressed from a group containing Hull pretty easily. But finished second on GD to Dnipro. Mainly played a rotated team. Playing Steaua in the 1st K/O round.

Spanish Cup

Lost 3-1 over two legs to Real Madrid. The league is main focus right now so less games is always good with a small squad.

Final Thoughts

The Formation is great with a fast paced system. Think of Rodgers' Liverpool last season. Quick transitions from back to front.

The Defence holds relatively solid. Mario and Cheryshev get up and down the flanks well but their output in terms of assists is poor (5 all together). Trying to find a way around this, perhaps stopping them crossing so often.

Midfield is holding steady with good balance. DLP/D and DM/D hold whilst the RPM and CM/A push forward. At times, with roaming on, it looks like a box shape in midfield. In CM/A I find Trigueros better than the player I signed to play in the position, Germain. Neither chip in with goals but Trigueros has provided 8 assists compared to Germain's 1. The role seems to play more like a Playmaker than a Goal Scorer, but it's worked so I can't really complain.

Forwards are what make this team. If they have an off day, like against Malaga we will struggle to gain a point. Thankfully, there hasn't been a lot of those with Vietto in such stunning form. Gerard Moreno from the B team has provided fantastic cover, scoring 10 goals off the bench. When fit, Giovani Dos Santos is sensational as a False 9, scoring and assisting in equal measure.

[felley]

@JDeeguain

Great results so far. It's a shame you've had trouble with Jaume Costa's fitness as he's been consistently excellent for me. I guess that's the luck element... In a reversal of fortunes, Vietto has never really put in a consistent run of performances for me (played as the Advanced Forward in the 4-2-4 Wide). He finally seemed to have arrived with a double hat-trick and 10.0 rating, then got a 2 month injury a couple of games later. He's back for my end of season run-in so I hope he can finally get involved as he looks a top prospect.

Regarding your wide defender's play, there are a few things I could point out that may help you. First of all, the FB(A) is going to be inclined to cross more often than normally and from relatively deep. This wouldn't be a problem if you had an aerial/physical presence/numbers in the box... but the only person likely to be there is Vietto who is weak, short and may be roaming about as a CF(A). Maybe try your LB as a Wing Back? He would cross less often and get into more advanced positions where you have more numbers in the box to make something happen. The duty would depend on how adventurous you wish to be, but I reckon you could almost go all out with that midfield set-up. Also, have you thought of altering your crossing instructions to "Low Crosses" or perhaps "Drilled Crosses"? Once again, your forwards are quick and agile as opposed to tall and strong, so you want to accentuate that with a fast and low ball that they can latch onto (I have my crossing set to low and i've scored 20+ goals that way this season - Jaume Costa has 12 assists!).

[dirkTLB]

So to my update with screenshots (hopefully)

My tactic, the 4-5-1.

I wanted support from my fullbacks with the WM's funneling inside to hit the space created by the F9, with the added bonus of the CM(a) joining in (but in all honesty I havent got that part working how I want just yet, but I have a few more ideas I want to try before the season has ended). The DLP is the starting point of many if not all my attacks and rarely gives possession away whilst the B2B gives me both some defensive cover and an added option going forward.

The mentality and some of the TI's are amended depending on the situation, but Standard is my starting point for most games as I feel it gives the most flexibility.

We have been performing to my expectations to be honest, although conceding more than I'd like:

F|ixtures so far, with the undoubted highligh of beating Atletico home and away in the Copa del Rey:

My apologies if those dont work or are messed up in some way its a long time since I've tried doing that.

[Deego619]

@JDeeguain

Great results so far. It's a shame you've had trouble with Jaume Costa's fitness as he's been consistently excellent for me. I guess that's the luck element... In a reversal of fortunes, Vietto has never really put in a consistent run of performances for me (played as the Advanced Forward in the 4-2-4 Wide). He finally seemed to have arrived with a double hat-trick and 10.0 rating, then got a 2 month injury a couple of games later. He's back for my end of season run-in so I hope he can finally get involved as he looks a top prospect.

Regarding your wide defender's play, there are a few things I could point out that may help you. First of all, the FB(A) is going to be inclined to cross more often than normally and from relatively deep. This wouldn't be a problem if you had an aerial/physical presence/numbers in the box... but the only person likely to be there is Vietto who is weak, short and may be roaming about as a CF(A). Maybe try your LB as a Wing Back? He would cross less often and get into more advanced positions where you have more numbers in the box to make something happen. The duty would depend on how adventurous you wish to be, but I reckon you could almost go all out with that midfield set-up. Also, have you thought of altering your crossing instructions to "Low Crosses" or perhaps "Drilled Crosses"? Once again, your forwards are quick and agile as opposed to tall and strong, so you want to accentuate that with a fast and low ball that they can latch onto (I have my crossing set to low and i've scored 20+ goals that way this season - Jaume Costa has 12 assists!).

Thanks .

Since I've made that post Vietto has been on something of a drought for me (0 goals in 4) and I even dropped him for Moreno after he came off the bench to score yet again. From what I've seen around these forums he (Vietto) turns into a bit of a beast, so it's well worth trying to keep patience with him. When I first took a look at him when I started the save I could only really ever see him being the focal point in a direct system with his pace. Perhaps try something a bit more direct with him and see how it goes?

My thinking behind my Full Back set up has it's beginnings in my successful 442 diamond in FM14, where I prefer one raging full back (CWB) and one slightly more deeper player to retain some asymmetrical balance, since the CM on the left side (Romero) has some freedom to roam around that area of the pitch. I have already selected "Low Crosses" in my TI posted above, it's had some success throughout the season with it but I reckon I could experiment with Cheryshev (who's now a natural LB thanks to Crocked Costa) and later Costa with some Wing Back duties and see how it goes. The pace of my team means that usually only Vietto and maybe the CM/A are on the end of crosses, so that's perhaps something to look at also. But thanks for taking the time to try help me out man, much appreciated

On Deadline Day. Urgh Rodgers.

[aRj00]

I'm now just over halfway through the season and so far its going quite well:

2nd in the league behind Barcelona. Although defensively I was poor, conceding far too many goals and chances against me (highest conceded out of top 9!) Im 2nd in goals scored.

Lots of i'll score more than you results which is disappointing.

Got to quarters of Spanish cup only to be knocked out by Barcelona on penalties.

Finished top of group in Euros (contained Hull, Besiktas and Slovan Bratislava) an about to play Kobenhavn in the 1st round.

Tactics evolved into a less attacking mentality as I wanted a bit more defensive stability, past 6 games (bar freak Athletic 3 goals) have shown much improvement

Control/Fluid

Had a few nasty injuries including Ulche out for 4 months and Rukavina out for 5 months, plus with injuries to key players, lack of rotation is playing havoc with their fitness levels.

[DurinVIII]

5-2-3 Narrow

Finally finished the season with the 5-2-3 Narrow, following the introduction in post #67 and the half season update in post #175.

We start with a quick glance at where we ended in the table:

Managed to qualify for the EL, but in the end I'm a bit disappointed, as I felt we were in a good position to challenge for the CL places at the winter break. Unfortunatetly, we were inconsistent in the second half of the season:

As mentioned in my winter break post, I changed my BWM/s to a CM/a in order to get more offensive contribution from the position, but after the dreadful spell in January, I reverted back to using a BWM/s. So in the end, my settled formation with roles looked like this:

From that picture we're also able to see how I spent my remaining loan signing. Through the season we've suffered longer injuries to both Uche, Vietto and G. dos Santos, so I opted to bring in a loan striker. And who better to be a presence in the box and contributing in build up play through the right side than Nicklas Bendtner? Quite a few, I suppose, as he only scored a single goal (albeit a beauty) and had no assists. Though to be fair, he got injured in his first match, was out for a couple of months, and struggled with match fitness after that.

As we're wrapping up both the season and the tactic here, I'm gonna check if it actually worked. To recap, the overall match plan is to draw the opposition deep unto us, close down aggresively when they're in our half, win the ball back, and then quickly work ball predominantly down the left flank. From the schedule, it's fairly easy to see that the formation rarely contribute to high scoring games. Through the course of the league, we only scored 3 goals or more in 6 games, but we also conceded 3 or more at only two occasions. A more detailed look at how these goals are scored and conceded follows:

Goals

Assists

Not too shabby, all things considered. Duhamel was my top scorer with 13, with Moreno as the runner-up with 9. Nearly all of these came from the DF/d, which in the end was a tad unexpected. Assist wise G. dos Santos lead the line with 9, all from the AF/s position, tied with Manu Trigueros, who has played in both the DLP/d position and the BWM/s position.

As we're wrapping this up, I'll make just a few final remarks. I pity the fools that have had injuries or otherwise been unable to play Jaume Costa. Been my best player by a mile, performing with bravado as the sole contributor of width down the left. Not that Mario hasn't performed admirably at right back either, but I don't feel like the IWB/s has come into any effect. He's performed exactly like a WB or CWB in my eyes. Maybe this role needs a wide man ahead for it to work. Over the season I've also noticed that this is a formation and playstyle that demands a lot from the players. In general, my players were knackered on the occasions where we played every 3 days. An extended EL and/or cup run would have put a tremendous strain on my team.

With that I'm laying the 5-2-3 Narrow to bed. It's been an interesting season I'm reasonably satisfied with, barring an early exit against a bunch of minnows in the EL. It's been great reading about all your seasons, and I'm impressed by what you accomplish with the same player material.

[felley]

Ok guys, so this is my final update using the 4-2-4 Wide. I had an absolutely cracking season and thoroughly enjoyed the gung-ho attacking displays that the team put together. Here's how the table ended up:

As you can see, we finished in 3rd which I think is pretty much the best we could've hoped for. Barca and Real absolutely blitzed the league putting 2-5 goals past every team in the process. They were on another planet.

As for the other competitions, we got all the way to the semi final of the Europa league only to end up having to play Real after they bizarrely finished 3rd in their Champions League group, dropping down into what should be an easy competition for them. Benzema basically assassinated us with 2 goals in each leg as we struggled to find a way through them. We also played in the final of the Copa del Rey as mentioned in a previous post, but in this match we faced Barca! Couldn't overcome the Messi curse as he cut us to ribbons with a hat-trick and left us with a 100% defeat record against the Catalan giants. These fixtures really hurt us and in effect signaled the end to a great season. The last stretch of fixtures is below:

What is interesting to note again were our results in the Europa League. The ties against Wolfsburg and Lille were pure entertainment with both teams going all-out for the win. Hitting 7 goals past Lille at home was a big highlight, as was the 3-0 battering of Atletico which effectively secured us 3rd place. The only disappointment was how it all fell to pieces towards the end (the Atletico game was the last time we played with real dominance) as the amount of fixtures caught up with the squad and the injuries started to hurt us. We lost Cani for the rest of the season in March, J. dos Santos for the rest of the season after that, Asenjo for several weeks in the first leg of the semi against Real (also basically ending his season) and Brown to suspension. Additionally, Vietto never really recovered from his injury in January, Angel Correa lost form massively in the last 10 games and Bruno just never really got going meaning I always felt a little light in midfield.

So finally, here are some basic stats for you all to check out which I will use to assess how well the tactic worked:

I have highlighted the stats that were most impressive in orange. The main stand-out things to note were the sheer amount of chances created and goals scored, meaning our tactic was incredibly effective at the business end of the pitch. I feel this is partly down to the aggressive shape (having essentially 4 up front) and also down to how I constructed the roles to take advantage of the players and their PPM's.

You can see here also the incredible impact that Correa made after arriving in January on loan. His return from 27 games is just phenomenal as he surpassed his original status as Uche stand-in and became a key player through February and March. Atletico are certainly lucky to have him... he's only 20!

I have also underlined in green the players that I particularly grew fond of for various reasons:

- Uche because he is just a really solid forward player. His attributes don't really stray into the realms of excellence but he has enough about him to score and create plenty.

- Correa for the reasons outlined above. What an impact. The only negative was his loss of form and squandering of chances near the end of the season, but he's young so he's excused.

- Jaume Costa due to his all-round contribution. Solid in possession, excellent defensively and a threat going forward with 12 assists from the wing. He played virtually every game.

- Balanta because he's a beast. Like I said originally, i've not actually used him since FM13 so I wasn't aware of how good he actually is but wow. Bar a few off-games here and there, he was monstrous at the back.

- Trigueros becuase he was such a surprise package. At first glance I had him on a par with Moi Gomez and Javi Espinosa but he kicked off the season so well by learning his new positions fast, then taking to them like a duck to water. Once Cani was injured, he became the first choice at AML and really shone ending up with a remarkable 20 assists.

- Giovani for obvious reasons! What's not to love? He's lightning quick, blessed with skill and has an eye for goal. Some of the delicious finishes he pulled off would've made memorable goals in real life. The inside forward role is made for him, especially at AMR. He cuts in, drives at goal and usually creates something by either winning a free kick/penalty, scoring or setting someone up. Top class.

So that's it for me guys! If Jambo hands me another formation, i'd be willing to carry on with this experiment, but as it stands this save is on the back burner.

Hope you're all progressing well.

[peleJunior]

If you want to give away my formation Jambo that's ok. I just can't get into this save for a few non FM reasons.

[Deego619]

The 4-1-3-2 Narrow has been well...

Good.

A stuttering 2nd third of the season blipped our soaring early season form. I've been bogged down in Uni work recently so this half season was a bit of a drag.

Team Instructions

Euro Cup

Comprehensively beaten by Zenit in the 2nd K/O round. They were just the better team. Nothing really to add.

Spanish Cup

Knocked out by Real Madrid in only the 5th round.

Final Thoughts

I really really like the formation.

I made few changes in the 2nd half of the season. Changed my FB/A to CWB/A on the left side and it seemed to defend the flank better. I was conceding a enormous amount from out wide and saw that it was just the weakness of the shape and there was little I could do, so attack is the best form of defence. Cheryshev really seemed to enjoy being let loose on that side.

Injuries and Giovani Dos Santos being a general b*tch hampered our performances and we lost the consistency we had in the early season. Luciano Vietto finished on a remarkable 28 goals from 38 starts and is being courted by Europes big boys. They had the cheek to offer me only £4M for his services. £4M for a Striker that scored 27 goals in one of the world's top leagues? Below his market value? Erm...no.

I'll play a second season with the formation and see how it develops. It'll be an interesting summer with big clubs courting Giovanni, Vietto and Mario.