Are fans and FA of big (footballing) countries spoilt?

[Koki]

What has striked me in this WC is the fact that both fans and FA of many countries seemed to have high (unrealistic) expectations. I mean, there are a lot of good nations and only 4 semi-final spots and still most countries are disappointed if they don't make it to the semi-finals regardless whom they got knocked out by. I mean, if England had beaten Germany after the group stage, it would have been okay for me, because England are good opponents.

Now you might say the way England lost was embarassing or whatever and therefore one needs find the reasons (manager, tactic, players) and change things but surely you can't only have noticed that after the Germany match? What if the match would have gone the other way? (and don't tell me it wasn't possible - at least half the users here had confidence that England would win the match). Would everything have been okay with the manager, the tactic and the players? I hope I'm getting my point across that people shouldn't put everything into question after just one single defeat and an early-knock out. Where's the shame in losing against Holland (Brazil) or Germany (England, Argentina)?

[georginho_juventusygr]

It depends on the expectations. A comparable example: the expectations for the England national team were sky-high. When they got knocked out by Germany, there were disappointing people of course because England were thought to be on par with Germany. On the other hand, nobody expected Uruguay to go this far, and regardless who knocked them out, they are still regarded as a good team.

[skybluedave]

They weren't sky high ffs.

Only 13% thought they'd win the WC iirc

[Koki]

the expectations for the England national team were sky-high.

Of course the expectations for England were high. But they were also high for France, Brazil, Argentina, Germany, Holland, Portugal, Italy and Spain. That's 9 teams for 4 semi-final spots. So even before the WC 5 teams were bound to 'fail' and question their manager, tactic and players afterwards. What I'm trying to say is that nations can get knocked out of the tournament without having done everything completely wrong - because there are too many teams that are expecting to proceed to the semi-finals.

Another example: In a league with 3 CL-spots are 6 clubs with the goal to qualify for the CL. So 3 teams are bound to fail even if they play a good season. They don't necessarily need to change everything to have success in the next season.

[Svenc]

Another example: In a league with 3 CL-spots are 6 clubs with the goal to qualify for the CL. So 3 teams are bound to fail even if they play a good season. They don't necessarily need to change everything to have success in the next season.

Yeah, knock-out tournaments are like that. Make a mistake and you're out. The few couple of countries though that are talking about massive change though now, I don't think there are many that are actually overreacting. Brazil has a history of never keeping the manager after a World Cup is finished, regardless of results. But there must be some talking in Argentina now, since even if they produce quality players on a regular basis, they haven't reached a semis in 20 years now. And with England it's a trend, both long-term (1966, sorry), but also short-term: this generation of players have never performed well at the World Cup, and even 2004, where they were at their best IMHO, they went out against in a way that appears to be typical for what they are being critized for, not being able to hold possession, hold onto a lead, etc. England aren't thinking results as such, it appears, going out in the first knock out stage against another big guy is always a possibility. But their last two World Cup performances overall where just in shambles overall.

As for the fans, that depends. There's a bit of a different culture in each country, I guess, but I can only talk about Germany, where expectations have been comparably modest for quite a while. There is a very critical and short-sighted assessment of the German national team going around in some parts, where each friendly loss means impending doom and each narrow win is luck and both are of course always the benchmark of the team's strength for months to come. Maybe this all dates back to the days of Teamchef Beckenbauer - he must have been the only German manager in existence that was having a laugh in public at the thought winning a World Cup (1986) with his squad at disposal, constantly embarassing his own team by ridicouling individual players, at least until 1988 or so came around. In 1990 he turned the complete opposite, as we know now in his legendary press conference after that night in Rome.

[tdpatriots12]

Well, the disadvantage is you can't just have your major papers shrug and post "Ah it's a stupid sport anyway" like the NY Post did after the US was eliminated by Ghana.

[David Pagi]

It's not just the fact England failed, it's the fact we were absolutely hopeless v 3 of football's lesser nations and were DESTROYED by a German team that we should at the very least compete with. If we losted on pens after an even game fair enough but we didnt.

[SeanNUFC]

It's not just the fact England failed, it's the fact we were absolutely hopeless v 3 of football's lesser nations and were DESTROYED by a German team that we should at the very least compete with. If we losted on pens after an even game fair enough but we didnt.

And its nothing to do with expectations, too me that's just too easy an answer. If we had the right tactical system we would've done alot better. Its not about having world class players in every position, as Germany and Holland have proved.

Edit: Oh and uruguay.

[iamjerome]

yeah. if only we had a more tactically astute manager than fabio capello. or sven goran eriksson. players blameless. tactics purely at fault!

[SCIAG]

I'd have been pleased with a quarter final and delighted with a semi final tbh. To be honest, a lot of the typical English football fans (not those on here, thankfully) are very ignorant and don't realise just how good Germany and co. are- I doubt the average council estate, benefit swindling fan had heard of Oezil or Mueller or Khederia, assumed they must be rubbish, and thought we'd walk over them. Likewise, 2006 and Portugal, though 2002 wasn't as big a surprise.