poobington
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Posts posted by poobington
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18 hours ago, Macgreg said:
Thanks mate. Could you help with your tactical setup
I don't know what you mean? I either use the overload tactic from the video (just copy the roles Daljit uses) or I use the Gegepress 4-2-3-1. The most important thing I have found is squad building, and identifying the right sort of players who can perform well.
An example I would use at the moment is my IFa Tahith Chong. He is a mercurial talent, very quick great dribbler, but his metals are a bit on the low side. Now he has got youth on his side and might improve in that respect, but at the moment he is quite inconsistent, and there are times where due to his lower mental attributes he makes the wrong decision, electing to dribble to long rather than pass.
As I am using high pressing systems I have set a minimum requirement of 15 workrate for all my players. Only excpetionla players get a free pass, and even then I would not go lower than 13. Setting myself these restrictions has allowed me to unearth some great players. My personal favourite has been Lyes Houri. A hardworking, extremely creative French midfielder who I signed for £2.6m from the Hungarian Premier League.
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21 hours ago, Macgreg said:
Could you share them with me so I could have a look
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None at all. I actually looked at some of @Rashidi's Creating: Tactics series (the 4-3-3 one and the 4-2-3-1) and I am using the overload tactics he has there. If I am in need of a goal though I'll just switch to the 4-2-3-1 Gegenpress tactic and grab a few goals. The high press on that tactic is really great and I usually get a mistake out of the opposition which leads to a goal.
Over a whole season it was good, but consistency was an issue, but that may have been down to a lack of depth in my squad. I have bolstered my squad quite a bit, so next season I will try again the whole season and see how it does.
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22 hours ago, Rashidi said:
This preset and the vertical tiki taka presets are very strong but they aren't OP because they have some flaws which are easily remedied.
What sort of remedies?
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On 20/06/2021 at 07:18, mibsweden said:
It is very good. So is the control possession.
I will have to try this one out. I did try the tiki-taka 4-2-3-1 and it does play some nice football albeit it toothless at times.
I have been running a pretty low effort set up of the Genepress 4-2-3-1 preset, and switching to the Gegenpress 4-3-3 preset when in need of a goal, or playing narrow formations. Playing in Serie A you tend to encounter a lot more different types of formations, and the 4-3-3 seems to play wider and exploit that space.
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Just a question really to see if people have had similar experiences to mine.
I was playing my save struggling tactically, and in search of just something simple I used the 4-2-3-1 Gegenpress tactic and have to say it has been fantastic and recaptured my enthusiasm.
Has any one else had any success with this preset tactic or any of the others for that matter.
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Bumping this, but is anyone setting up the tactical challenge this year?
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Love the tactic. Having a great time with Leeds, building the squad, and seeing some great football along the way.
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@Cult of Football ManagerAre there any specific attribute criteria for players to play in this system? I have had a go trialing it with Leeds, as I thought out of the teams outside of the Europa places they looked to have the squad best suited to this style. Essentially just holidayed out of curiosity. Finished 13th, with some good performances by Bamford in the poacher role grabbing 18 goals. I am going to give it another go for a season having signed some players to boost the rotational options.
When it works it works brilliantly, with excellent football. But against the top teams it does sometimes end in a drubbing.
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@Cult of Football Manager Is this all using the main tactic? Impressive stuff to only concede 4 goals!
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Bumping this as recently I have been enamoured with Ralk Rangnick. Has anyone had any success in implementing a 442 or 424?
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@coach vahid No Pis, just the roles and TIs as you see them.
If I am playing as a worse team I would change the SKs to a SKd, and lower the tempo to "much lower"
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Thought I would share my interpretation of the system. On paper it looks extremely aggressive, and it is.
I would go as far as saying it plays some of my favourite football I have been able to recreate on FM21, and it echos OPs posts in a similar fashion. My main aim was to obtain that W shape build up with the IWBs tucking in and the wingers staying wide. So far I have tested it with several elite teams (PSG, Juve), and they are absolutely steam rolling through teams.
I have ene tried it with Burnley of all teams, and whilst they don't have the same quality, for example their dribbling is off, and they don't have the vision to pick killer passes, they are still have good enough teamwork and decision making to hold their shape, interchange positions and pass the ball well.
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Some results with AS Monaco below. Predicted 6th. Currently sitting in 1st. Only the 1 loss to PSG, and they are so far ahead of everyone else in the league. AS Monaco have a better standard of player than Newcastle so the results are more consistent. Didn't watch any of the games, this was all done on holiday. No signings.
Poacher - Wissam Ben Yedder - 21 goals and 5 assists in 18 Appearances
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I have tried this tactic with Everton, Leicester and now Newcastle. I have taken Newcastle to 5th, with a few signings to boost areas we were lacking. Diego the 35 yr old brazilian who used to play for Werder Bremen has been excellent as a Trequartista. The striker in the poacher roles is lethal. Needs to have pace.
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Have to say this is a fantastic tactic. Ofte with tactics you might get good results, with pretty much the same exploitative goals scored over and over. I have tried this tactic with 3 different teams and the goals have been really fun to watch. Another thing is that there are loads of great highlights to watch, even when watching on key highlights.
Good job!
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Good luck mate. Well reasoned and thought out post. I hope you have success. I must admit your attempts to nail it have inspired me and I am trying all sorts of permutations to get it working. I like the idea of no Tis and balanced mentality to see how the roles interact with each other.
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What tactic are you using? Is this your Sacchi one?
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Has anyone got any idea how to implement a style like this again? I feel like with the change in Team instructions, especially with in transition options and lines of engagement off the ball, the parameters have changed and I am not sure how to follow the principles set out.
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Haha worth a shot I guess. I am currently in the process of rehashing one of Cleon's old Art of Possession formulas to ee how that fairs on the new ME. Initial results are promising, so if its got any legs I'll let you know.
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Another test, which albeit not fool proof is to use the Rate My Tactic App. I did that for the Control Possession preset. Appreciate it isn't your tactic, but indulge me.
The tactic scores very well in terms of solidity, and that certainly seems the case with the ey test and results. The control possession preset, and by extension what you have produced, doesn't produce goals, but at the same time very rarely do you get absolutely drubbed.
The penetration score is okay. I tend to find that top heavy tactics do far better in this area.
The support score is very poor, especially down the right and might be why the tactic it is struggling to score goals. If we cannot provide adequate support to attacking players and create high quality chances, then obviously xg and goals scored will be low for the tactic.
Overlaps - this something you wanted to achieve and the tactic will do that naturally on the left. On the right you will get an overload with both the winger and the wingback getting forward and providing width. This might also be perhaps why your winger isn't staying as wide as you would like as they are probably trying to occupy the same spaces. Maybe experiment with the fullback role.
What is the solution? Honestly, I can't tell you. The rate my tactic app would suggest you drop one of your attacking roles to a support role. I have seen other suggest you add more attacking roles.
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Heres the 4-3-3 control possession variant. Instructions and role selections seem fairly self explanatory. Being honest, I haven't fully ready your posts subsequent to your opening post, but
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@Christopher S have you considered using the tactic creator, and the control possession pre set, and then tweaking it to fit your vision? Some of the TIs might give you some inspiration?
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Gegenpress 4-2-3-1 Preset - Is it OP?
in Tactics, Training & Strategies Discussion
Posted
Thing is I wanted to understand why? I was hoping that some tacticians more well versed in the game could help me unpack what is going on and understand it a bit better so that I might be able to try my own tactic. For example I am very keen to be able to create a 4-4-2 gegenpress tactic akin to what Ralf Rangnick implemented at RB Salzburg and Leipzig.