poobington
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Posts posted by poobington
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I know it's quite late, with FM20 on the horizon, but I finally have made a tactic which creates great attacking football, but on the defensive side can be quite inconsistent. Can anyone give me some advice on how to shore things up defensively speaking?
The tactic attacks well on the break and through the wings, but we are often susceptible to counterattacks, leading to inconsistency.
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I know it's quite late, with FM20 on the horizon, but I finally have made a tactic which creates great attacking football, but on the defensive side can be quite inconsistent. Can anyone give me some advice on how to shore things up defensively speaking?
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Do you have a screenshot of what you're using at the moment?
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You should do one of these for attacking principles
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Thats what i mean. I watch it on full, because i like to see how we build up from the back. Usually onanything but full it seems to ignore goal kicks and I can't see how we build up. But like you say I do see some pressing but to often it is hap hazard and uncordinated e.g a winger could track back and press a player more intensely meaning that the ball near central mid can keep position , but does not.
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Is anyone struggling in FM17 to create a highpressing system such as this? I have tried some of these formations and others combining a high back line and heavy pressing and I tend to always get exposed. I must caveat this that I am using it with teams like Bayern or Real madrid, who should have sufficient quality to ensure that they can carry these systems out but they just don't seem to be providing the desired results. Usually the pressing just seems to bring certain players out of postion, so when they press they do not cover the passing options behind them.
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Not Fm related but quite interesting that this exact formation has been suggested as potential solution for fitting in Jesus and Aguero at city.
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OK so a couple of people have asked me about how I'd approach tactics for a lower league side, so I decided to put together a quick post.
I chose to put this in the Sacchi thread, as I believe the Sacchi system is the most applicable to a lower league club - how many lower league sides have the personnel to get a back 3 going or play a rapid attacking style?
So.. I picked a random club.
Club Arbroath
League Scottish League Two
Status Semi Professional
Reputation 1 star
Finances OK
Training and Youth Facilities Basic
Media Prediction 6th out of 10
Perfect.
Building Blocks
Starting out, my priorities are very short term. I'm on a 1-year contract, so my only real priority is to perform well enough to get an extension.
My Assistant Manager is as good as I can get at the moment, so I offer him a 2-year contract. I have no scouts, but am allowed 2 so I instantly sign the best at judging Potential and the best all-rounder available then start scouting Scotland.
Starting Squad
- OK, not great Goalkeeper.
- One decent Centre-Back
- Decent fullbacks
- Poor central midfielders
- One good, one decent wide player.
- Good attack - one good supporting striker, one quick striker (who can also play wide) and one target man.
Looking at the team comparison page, 8-10 is going to be a decent attribute, 12 or above is good.
The Transfer Market
My scouts quickly identified some good solutions to my problems. Basically brought in a new 'spine' of a team. 4 signings, for a combined £8,000.
Goalkeeper - William Muir, free
Central Defender - Kerr Young, free
Central Midfield - Kieran Miller, £8k and Ally McKerracher, free
As before, the approach is to look for players with:
- Technical Aptitude
- Intelligence
- Work Ethic
In the lower leagues, you're obviously not going to find the same quality of player but as long as they are relatively strong on this areas, you'll be fine.
My Squad
Comparison with the rest of the League
Strengths
- We are the hardest working in the league.
- We are 2nd fittest.
- Our first touch, vision, decisions and team work are all very good.
- Our defence is quick, and good on the ball.
Weaknesses
- We're weak and poor in the air.
- Our technique and passing let down our overall intelligence.
Tactics
I've gone for a very simple 4-4-2. Flexible and standard because the players movement, intelligence or technical ability aren't up to fluid or very fluid. My starting mentality is Standard but I will use Attack regularly. Standard offers more variation and balance. Attack allows me to take advantage of width and my target man.
Off the ball, we will press heavily and take advantage of our work rate and stamina. Also a high line allows us to mitigate our lack of physicality in defence and take advantage of our pace.
With the ball, we're balanced. We have width on both flanks, and intelligent central midfielders. Up front we have a physical target man and a hard working, intelligent supporting striker. We can make our approach more aggressive, changing mentality.
Positive start..
Forfar are local rivals, from the league above. As you can see we dominated them and won comfortably.
Longer-term
Once I have a longer contract and the faith of the board, my priorities will be.
- Improving the personality of the squad - prioritizing Determination, Work Rate and Professionalism.
- Progress through the Scottish leagues and gain Professional status.
- Improve youth and training facilities and establish a production line, using the first team squad as mentors.
- Continually improve the quality of the staff - building up to an Assistant Manager, Chief Scout, Head of Youth Development and Director of Football all supporting me in handling their respective areas.
Really enjoyed this part of the thread. I would be very interested if you have time if you could progress this further as a separate topic.
0 - OK, not great Goalkeeper.
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Any updates on this Sherring?
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I play a much higher line anyway. With / without a DM. Overall, I prefer the way the a defensive MC interacts with the rest of the team.
The only reason I ask specifically about the DM is because I am doing the tactical challenge and can't change the position. Thanks for your help!
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Either will work. Personally, I prefer to keep the band of 3 for pressing purposes. Also, I observe that a DM makes a system less compact (drops defensive line) so you'll notice, I rarely use one.
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As the DM drops the defensive line would you suggest maintaining the Much Higher Defensive line? I noticed in your Ajax thread you used either a DLPd or a DMs in the position. I would be interested if you remember which worked better.
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I have a couple of questions as I would just like to get an understanding of some of the changes you make.
How did you find the interplay between the strike partnership in the England save? I switched to it for a match and they seemed to perform well but have now fizzled out. Did you give your strikers any specific instructions? With the AF already moving into Channels, I suspect you would not want the Complete forward doing the same.
Additionally on your England diamond, did you find yourself exposed with 2 WBa? Again I have a similar back four with a diamond albeit with a DM and the AM role at Cm. I suspect my lack of success is due to the quality of my squad and the lack of pace for some of my defenders, however I am intent on recreating the philosophy. As I have a player in the DM slot a much higher line is probably overkill, I have pushed it down to slightly higher and have considered just having a normal defensive line whilst maintaining the pressing. What woudl you do if you were trying to create a similar system with a player at DM?
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I had considered changing the Right back to attack, but I only want Darmian to push forward when relatively risk free which he is doing. The way I view my play is Mata can be penetrative from the right in a deeper position but via diagonal or sideway balls and this is happening....I'm wondering if my prob
In regards to the regista, I had considered changing Carrick to a HB to help the defence, but teams aren't creating much chances against me...and my full backs are getting forward, perhaps I will try this and this will help my team not being so deep.
I think the key to solving my problem is by tweaking / finding the balance from Carrick (RGA), Mata (WPMS) or Rooney (DFD). Problem is, I'm happy with the way each of them are playing in the purpose I want. Mata is linking up players from a narrow wide position, Rooney is putting pressure on defenders whilst ot of possession and Carrick is doing his best to play the possession play I want. I will try your suggestions and perhaps try Mata with a more attacking mentality.
Others have also mentioned it but it seems you have too many conductors in the orchestra with no one to play! With a RGA, WPMs, and APs you have three players all looking to get the ball and looking to thread through passes but no one to run onto them.
Your striker as a defensive striker will not be looking to make runs behind the opposition defence and instead is likely to get in the way of your APs, especially during transitions. Just picture the scenario where you are looking to break, or perhaps you are camped on the oppositions area probing away. Your AP has the ball and instead of seeing people making runs so that he can pick them out, they're all just standing there. A more aggressive striker going forward but who can still hold up the ball might be useful ( CFa/DLFa). Depay would be perfect as an IFa as this would allow him to make runs behind the defence onto the passes from your midfield. Currently on a support duty he won't do that and will merely congest the space in midfield.
If you are intent on keeping Mata as an WPMs, perhaps changing Darmian to a Wbs to offer some additional overlapping support.
Hope this helps
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Hi Cleon, been a big fan of your work for a number of years. First time I've ever felt obliged to post in one of your threads however.
This year I'm struggling with trying to build a possession tactic, I have certain elements of it working the way I want, but certain other elements are just not clicking. Here's how I currently line up with Man Utd.
-----------------------------------De Gea (GK-D)----------------------------------
Darmian (FB-S)-----Smalling (CB-D)------Blind (BPD-D)---------Shaw (WB-A)
---------------------------------------Carrick (RGA-S)-----------------------------
Mata (WPM-S)---------Schneiderlen (B2B-S)-------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------Herrera (APM-S)-------Depay (IF-S)
---------------------------------------Rooney (DF-D)------------------------------
Team is set up: Structured, Control
TI's are as follows: Normal Defensive Line, Narrow play, Low Tempo, Mixed Passing, Look for Overlap, Close Down More, Prevent Short GK Distribution and Play out of Defence.
My only player instructions are for my Two wide defenders to stay wider, Luke Shaw is also encouraged to run at players more.
What I want to do is keep the tempo low, and control the game but I don't want my players to be too restricted in passing, I want to build out from the back I want my wide attackers to bring the play inside, whilst encouraging overlapping runs from my full backs.
In defence I want my team to be compact which will make us harder to break down and want to ensure the other team doesn't build from the back also. Having a defensive forward in this method helps.
I'm struggling to control possession, and in certain games I'm struggling to even create penetrative football.
Things that are working well.
Shaw / Depay are working well together on the left flank, Shaw getting forward on the overlap and putting crosses in, unfortunately his crosses are hit/miss but that's down to the player rather than tactics IMO, I'll work with him on that.
Rooney is coming deep as I want him to be and is putting pressure on the defence when out of possession, in possession, he's holding the ball up and more often than not he's linking with Mata / Depay on the flanks which stretches the play and creates opportunities with either full back getting forward or else Schneiderlin & Herrera offering support in middle.
Carrick is also playing well, he's the key to my system and his passing is top notch.
Mata is roaming around and finding space and to me is playing how I want him to play, not stuck out wide and attempting to beat players but floating inside and picking off passes.
I'm struggling to control possession, and I believe it's because my team is too deep.
Herrera / Schneiderlin aren't doing what I want, I believe Schneiderlin should be moving up and down with play, but he often seems to be running around like a headless chicken. Herrera is getting on the ball, but his passing has been shocking, perhaps because there's no movement from him, but my complaint with him is that he isn't getting into goal scoring chances.
Previous years, I've often struggled to play penetrative / possession football, but this year I'm struggling to play either or.
On the face of it your central midfield seems to lack a defensive presence, perhaps changing the regista to a DM(d) might help sure up the defence. In doing so it may open up the possibility of your full backs being able to go forward.
On your right wing you seem to lack penetration. Make either your fullback more attacking allowing him to over lap the cutting in WPM or select a more attacking role for mata. That's all I've got at the moment
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Defensive advice fo r4-1-2-3-1 DM
in Tactics, Training & Strategies Discussion
Posted
What fixes would you suggest? I have tried for now dropping one of the IF to a support duty., even though I would prefer to keep them as attacking outlets. The aim of my tactic is to get the ball to them as quick as possible and have the rest of the team be solid.
Goal scoring wise it is very potent. Jamie vardy got top scorer and both IFs got 15+ goals. I'm just at a loss on how to create a bit more stability? I have tried WBs on defend duty but still not as solid as I would like.