SIMPLICITY - How to make a SOLID & SIMPLE 4-4-2 set

[crouchaldinho]

So crouch, if my CB's are slow should I deepen my defensive line?

It's an option for the attacking tactic. But you might find you can cover the opposition for pace using one of your defenders. In my BSS campaign, I had one quick and one good in the air. I would make sure they were up against the right opponents for each match. That's why I advise checking scout reports and looking at attacking players as basic match preparation.

In general, I would personally not deepen the defensive line but look to make some alterations to marking. I wouldn't want to compromise the attacking nature of the tactic.

That tactics website I linked you to earlier explains how to deal with pace in simple terms.

Man-to-man marking requires [...] good decision making on the part of the manager. If a slower defender is matched up with a pacey striker, the results could be grim to say the least!

That's probably what is happening to ricrpor. Especially if he is tight man marking. Loose man marking at least gives his defenders a bit of room for manoeuver.

It goes to say that zonal marking can:

cover for a team’s (or player’s) lack of pace or technique, every defender and midfielder is given a particular zone on the pitch to cover when the opposition has the ball. This [...] does rely heavily on every player fulfilling their duties and keeping their concentration.

[...]

The defensive line is particularly important as, with proper communication and synchronised movement, it can exploit the offside rule and prevent all long-balls and through-balls succeeding. [...] However, it can be fraught with danger if any individual fails to cover his area of the pitch.

So that's it in a nutshell.

At non-League level, I would recommend sticking with man marking on the centre-backs where possible but just making good decisions about covering opposition forwards for pace. This is because you probably won't get many players with the necessary qualities to play zonal marking and offside trap, but that's just my opinion.

C.

[mista T]

Hey crouch, decided to start again with a promoted team from the BSS, Dafuges challenge style. So basically, now I pick whatever team gets promoted from the Isthimian etc and play with them, will let you know how I get on

[crouchaldinho]

Hey crouch, decided to start again with a promoted team from the BSS, Dafuges challenge style. So basically, now I pick whatever team gets promoted from the Isthimian etc and play with them, will let you know how I get on

Try to see if you can get Boreham Wood (Saints' arch-rivals). I will then 'help' you with your tactic.

(Help you to sabotage it so that the Wood get relegated... muhahahahahaha! )

(Only kidding...)

C.

[mista T]

Got Staines, Boreham would be pretty hard (hope you see what I did there )

[crouchaldinho]

Got Staines, Boreham would be pretty hard (hope you see what I did there )

I saw what you did and quite frankly I was impressed. Not many people would have the audacity to try such crazy wordplay.

You know you can save and keep reloading right?

I actually got Boreham Wood up for a friend of mine who wanted to do the Dafuge challenge with them. Took me quite a few reloads, I can tell you!

C.

[mista T]

Yeah lol, not the most patient of people, had a save at 24th of june and just decided "what the hell, let's doo eet :D"

crouch, any time you wanna play a network game, PM me. Would be fun

[mista T]

Haha silly me, just realised I already have a save game with staines will carry that one on. BSP about 4 seasons in.

[Celtic_1967]

Just wanted to post a quick update and ask for some advice.

Having changed to this tactic I won my first 5 matches in row, but now it seems inconsistant. I win some games I should lose, lose some games I should win and most annoyingly get dominated at home and struggle to a draw. Also my forwards seem to take it in turns to get awful ratings!

I have tried to shorten the passing in the hope of passing teams to death and bringing the strikers in more but it doesn't seem to have worked. I am comtemplating setting passing inbetween the edge of short and the mid point on the slider in the hope that this gives us a better range of passing whilst looking more often for the short option.

With the forwards I have matched the players to the positions according to their attributes as best I can but they just don't seem to want to do it.

Any ideas? Thanks

[crouchaldinho]

I win some games I should lose, lose some games I should win and most annoyingly get dominated at home and struggle to a draw.

Which system are you tending to use and are there any motivation problems?

Do you have a good squad for the level that you are playing at?

Also my forwards seem to take it in turns to get awful ratings!

Can you see statistically any reason for their low ratings? Are they young? Is it anything to do with motivation? Are they losing a lot of headers? Have they got good pace or are they slower? What sort of chances are they getting when they do get chances?

I have tried to shorten the passing in the hope of passing teams to death and bringing the strikers in more but it doesn't seem to have worked.

I'm sorry, I can't remember which team you're managing? If you have a quality side, you could consider playing short and slow.

Are you an absolute favourite in the division? If so, it might be time to get the 'control' tactic out in order to totally dominate.

Let me know a bit more about your situation and I will be able to make some more firm suggestions.

C.

[crouchaldinho]

Ah, yes, I remember that you are playing as Celtic. Should have guessed by your username.

Could well be that the opposition are now defending in great numbers, wasting time and playing with a very slow tempo. From memory, when they are playing like this, you will notice that when you have the ball there is maybe only one player up field ready for a quick attack. It's harder to break them down with a normal attacking system. Then your players can become frustrated.

If the match odds are looking very long then it is probably time to go for 'control'. You'll notice 'relax - you can get the win' on the team talks normally. If you have a team of good professionals, I would use this and a control system.

Basically, use your attacking system, but lower the d-line to normal, reduce closing down slightly in the midfield area and make your side play much slower and shorter.

What you'll see on the 3D representation is when you are attacking them on the edge of your area, they have their players all behind the ball and behind you is lots of space. When they clear the ball and attempt to play their lone striker through, you will simply regain possession as the striker doesn't have a chance of attempting to break. If the opposition try to play in the gap, they will come forward a little bit and then you will be able to win the ball and then attack. Around 60% possession and lots of shots on goal is not uncommon when I've played with control previously.

I don't know who discovered this idea of unlinking defensive line and mentality for 'control' (it is WWfan's tactical name, so I assume him or someone from his team). I would never have thought of doing it. But it does work. Try it yourself.

I assume that this will be your problem with home matches certainly.

C.

[Celtic_1967]

Thanks, I'll give that a try. Also I have a couple of players who have excellent attributes for the FCd position. They have high Creativity & Flair and good passing etc. I was considering playing him as a playmaker in the hope that this brings them into the game more. Would it be a good idea to also give him a free role / high creative freedom. (I was worried that a free role would see him going AWOL from his 'linking' position.

[crouchaldinho]

Thanks, I'll give that a try. Also I have a couple of players who have excellent attributes for the FCd position. They have high Creativity & Flair and good passing etc. I was considering playing him as a playmaker in the hope that this brings them into the game more. Would it be a good idea to also give him a free role / high creative freedom. (I was worried that a free role would see him going AWOL from his 'linking' position.

I give my FCd high creative freedom as he is one of my most creative players. I have him primarily set as a deep forward who holds up the ball and plays others in. However, giving him high creative freedom means he will also abandon these instructions and try something out. As a result, he was my top scorer last season as well as near the top of the list for assists. He also got the most MoM awards in my team.

Giving him a free role sounds like a good idea. He will move around and follow the ball, so to speak. He'll come and get it and should link up with others that way. I can't remember right now but I'm pretty sure that for my 'control' I've got my FCd on a free role.

C.

[mista T]

I'm really having trouble finding a game I can stick to, none of the ones I pick interest me for more than a day. Any suggestions Crouch? (please not Albans )

[crouchaldinho]

I'm really having trouble finding a game I can stick to, none of the ones I pick interest me for more than a day. Any suggestions Crouch? (please not Albans )

Bit off-topic but as it happens I do have a few suggestions:

1) Manage FC Vaduz (who are a team from Liechtenstein and play in the Swiss league). Aim to take them to glory and then take over the Liechtenstein team when the job becomes available. As FC Vaduz improve, your regens should get better, and you can use these for the national team. Then take Liechtenstein to glory too.

2) Pick a country (let's say Italy) and load their league structure plus all leagues from England. Start at the bottom in Italy and don't move to an English club until you have won Serie A. Then you can have a glorious homecoming and take over an English club! Great career! I mention Italy because I like Italian football but also because there are some very big teams with potential in their lower leagues which should prove fun to manage.

3) Pick the your most local club at BSS level (or below and reload until they come up) and then take them to glory. I always find this addictive because you will probably have (or be able to build up) a genuine attachment to them, whereas with other teams you haven't got that element (or it is harder to come by).

There are a few interesting ones for you.

C.

[ricrpor]

ok will do report feedback soon.

i also thought about your sugestions but i think they are only part of the problem... no the solution.

thanks again

[crouchaldinho]

As a few people seem to be doubting that the simple approach can work well, especially with the big clubs, I decided to spend some time playing as Liverpool. I wanted to see if I could find out where people were struggling. I also wanted to prove that having success with big clubs can be just as tactically simple as playing with smaller sides.

I’m using the same tactics as I did at St Albans City for this but I have made changes to the specific player instructions (e.g. through-balls, crossing, long shots etc.) depending upon the players I have available to me. Where I have made other changes, I will be explicit about it. But for now, passing and closing down is all the same as in my Saints games.

I will be using the Liverpool squad on the patch 9.3 database with no new signings. I holidayed through pre-season and so off we go straight into a new campaign.

Liverpool 3 – 1 AaB

Liverpool aren’t really the easiest side to manage with a 4-4-2. They are lacking in quality wide players and, Fernando Torres aside (and he is injured), the forwards don’t have the quality and they aren’t quite what I’m looking for. Nevermind, I will soldier on.

AaB play balanced system against me today and so I go with my own balanced system (as I am a cautious manager). I’m letting Sammy Lee pick the team, do the press conferences and pick the team talk as I can’t be bothered. I’m also not doing any OIs. This is a comfortable win, 54% possession and created more than AaB, as you would expect.

West Brom 1 – 2 Liverpool

It’s balanced again today. Sammy Lee picks ‘for the fans’ every time. He does it in the first-half today and the performance is pretty poor. I decide to give the team talk in the second-half and this ends up pretty comfortable. We create more than them. The possession is about even but that poor first-half was part of the problem. West Brom get a late goal, mainly due to our tiredness. I haven’t got much in the way of quality to bring on in the wide positions. The team is still blending so this is a good result. Off I go on holiday until the next match.

Newcastle 1 – 1 Liverpool

It’s good to have Fernando Torres back in this game. He scores but then limps off with an injury after 30 minutes. Balanced again today.

For some reason, Gerrard has a shocker today and so I have to sub him off. So I’m missing two of the best players in the team. To make matters worse, I played this game with N’Gog and Nemeth up front, which, and let’s be honest about this, doesn’t strike fear into the hearts of many Premier League defenders.

In the end, Newcastle pull one back. However, the stats show that Liverpool should probably have edged it. 53% possession and more clear cut chances. If only Torres and Gerrard had played the whole game I probably would have won. Still, it’s a good away result for a team that is still gelling. Back on holiday I go.

AaB 1 - 2 Liverpool (5-2 on agg.)

Balanced again. Not that surprised by the close scoreline. I rested all of the big names and played a few players out of position. Should have thrashed them really. 66% possession, 6 clear cut chances. They had 34% possession and 1 clear cut chance, which they scored. Safely through to Champs League group stage. Back on holiday.

Liverpool 3 – 0 Portsmouth

Comfortable victory. Finally a team was defensive against me and so I thought I would get the chance to play an attacking system. However, Portsmouth were at fairly long odds today so I decided to play a control system (see opening post) to draw them out and punish them. All I did was make the passing shorter than I would normally have done for my Saints team. To be honest, during the game I felt this might have been the wrong option. Portsmouth were playing defensively but they were coming forward a little bit and we gave them too much space. I should probably have played an attacking system and pushed up. As a result of this, we didn’t have as much possession as I would have liked. I was too lazy to change it! It was still an easy victory anyway.

Liverpool 0 – 0 Tottenham

This isn’t a great result. You see, I’m not trying to say that my tactics are some sort of miracle worker. Today I don’t have Fernando Torres, who is now missing for 3 weeks. Also, I’m probably too cautious here. Tottenham’s approach is balanced and so I choose the same system. However, my balanced system plays on the break and is quite direct plus fairly cautious. Perhaps I should have aimed to shorten passing and aimed to keep the ball instead of playing counter-attacking football.

The stats show that I was unlucky. 56% possession and 3 clear cut chances. I did dominate the game. Perhaps this result just shows that Liverpool aren’t clinical enough in front of goal without Fernando Torres. The forward options just aren’t good enough. No wonder Benitez plays with a lone striker!

I did make one tweak during the game today. Dirk Kuyt is playing up front for me and I noticed that he was losing tons of headers. Spurs were powerful in the air at the back, but not so quick on the deck. So in the second-half I directed the players to play through to Ryan Babel as target man with delivery set to run onto ball. It nearly paid off. Babel had a good few chances using his pace to get in behind the slow Spurs defence. He was my best player. The Man of the Match award went to the Spurs ‘keeper Gomes, so that probably tells you all you need to know about this match.

Liverpool 2 – 0 Olympiakos

Balanced today. 2 clear cut chances, 2 goals. Noticed Kuyt losing headers again and did the same as in the last match. Won at a canter and gave Olympiakos no chances to score.

Liverpool 3 – 0 Stoke

I’ve gone one better than Rafa here. Stoke are at very long odds and my scout report says they will sit behind the ball. So I play control. I dominate and win very comfortably. With a decent striker in the side, i.e. Torres, I would probably have totally thrashed Stoke. 3-0 is pretty decent though.

The team have gelled pretty well now. Performances are looking better and that’s now 4 clean sheets in a row. Admittedly the last two were against sides I was expected to beat comfortably.

Crystal Palace 1 – 0 Liverpool

Well, I won’t lie to you guys. Losing this cup game was 100% my fault. I thought I was invincible. You see, after this game Liverpool play Manchester United, and so I tried to be clever and play the youngsters. In short, they weren’t good enough.

To be honest, I deserved to win this! Here are some stats: 63% possession, 16 shots, 7 on target. Palace had a single shot on goal and scored with it. N’Gog and Nemeth played very poorly up front and totally let me down. Just one of them days I guess! I had wanted to post this up as 10 games unbeaten but oh well. League cup was never a priority. Bring on United!

Manchester United 1 – 1 Liverpool

I’m going to Old Trafford looking for a draw and that’s what I get. United are going to attack me in this game and so I play with my defensive system. I actually spend a bit more time preparing for this game but ultimately the tactic is the same as the one I would use for Saints. United score first from a corner. Liverpool equalise in the second-half from a free-kick. I’m more than willing to admit that I was lucky getting a draw out of this. I couldn’t wait for the final whistle to go. I don’t have the kind of pace that I would want in the side and I’m really missing Fernando Torres, who would have made the difference this afternoon. Still, great result as far as I am concerned. A couple more games? Oh go on then.

Schalke 1 – 1 Liverpool

Liverpool are actually one of the toughest sides I could have picked in order to play 4-4-2. They haven’t got the quality up front and haven’t got quality backups in the wide positions. Today I rotate and the results are pretty poor.

The first-half doesn’t go well and I’m 1-0 down. I notice that our counter-attacking approach isn’t creating much. Schalke have tons of pace in their team and so it is proving ineffective. So, for the second-half, I make my balanced system less cautious. I untick counter-attack and make the fullbacks mark zonal with higher closing down. I also shorten the passing. Result? We dominate the second-half and make more chances. We equalise to make it 1-1. If Dirk Kuyt misses many more chances then I might have to murder him.

I wonder what I could do with this Liverpool team if I was able to get some quality in on the wings and bring in a good deep-lying striker? I doubt I will play to the next transfer window though. Anyway, a draw away from home is no disgrace in the Champions League.

Liverpool 1 – 0 Chelsea

This was always going to be a tough game. As we all know, Chelsea play with a lone striker and two wingers, so I had to make some slight tweaks today. I played balanced but made one of the defenders man mark Drogba while the other went tight zonal. I also made my FCd man mark their DMC to stop him having too much of an influence on the game. That would make sure that I wasn’t losing a man in midfield and would ‘match’ their formation in terms of marking.

We weren’t as defensively sound as I might have hoped. I will explain why this is in a minute. Several players also had extremely poor games today, including Gerrard and Kuyt. Torres was back from injury but unable to start due to low fitness.

We didn’t really get this game going until Chelsea switched to 4-4-2 in the second-half. I immediately made a series of tweaks that totally changed the game in our favour. I brought Gerrard off, who was playing poorly, and put Alonso on. I also subbed off the poor Dirk Kuyt and brought on Torres. I switched back to man marking at the back, shortened the passing and took counter-attack off. My hope was to impose the game on Chelsea a little more. Torres made all the difference, even half-fit, and setup Alonso to score the winner. It was backs to the walls defending for the last 10 minutes.

Pretty crap performance to be honest because I let Chelsea have too much of the ball. But it’s the result that counts. It is important to make adjustments to marking when playing against a different formation like I was today. After the game I saw that one of their midfielders had seen a lot of the ball this afternoon. I should have noticed this early and made sure someone paid more attention to him. I didn’t get it quite right but it was good enough to prevent a goal being scored. There was probably an element of fortune too.

Liverpool 2 – 0 West Ham

West Ham were playing another one of these fancy lone striker formations. I didn’t bother putting as much planning into this as the Chelsea game. I felt that my team’s superiority would shine through. I played the game on the fastest speed. Scored two early goals. Took off Gerrard, Torres and Kuyt. Then just cruised the rest of the game. System was balanced again. I was expecting them to come and defend. I’m sure sides will start defending against my team soon because our form is very decent now.

Liverpool 5 – 1 Celtic

What a difference a fit Fernando Torres has made to my team. Finally firing on all cylinders.

IMPORTANT: What’s more is I think I’ve finally worked out why you guys in the top leagues are struggling. There are a lot more teams playing single striker formations and if you don’t deal with it then you are in trouble. I use specific marking to nullify the threat and match the opposition shape. Most important is to man mark the lone striker with your best defender. You can put the other defender on zonal and tight so that he picks up anyone who comes into his zone and stays tight to him. The main thing to cope with is what the opposition do with their extra man in midfield. You’ve usually got 2 v 2 in the centre and then either a DMC or an AMC. It is pretty vital to mark up the AMC. I suggest tight man marking with your MCd. When up against a DMC, you can stop him seeing a lot of the ball by marking him with your FCd. Loose marking means that you FCd will be close enough to him to put in a challenge but also won’t be too close to his man when you take up possession again.

Today Celtic played 4-1-4-1. I got my best centre-back to tight man mark their striker with my other centre-back tight zonal marking. Then I got my FCd to loose mark their DMC.

You can’t always expect to get loads of possession against these systems, especially if you are playing against good sides, but you can reduce space and nullify the thread like I did today. Be careful with specific instructions and don’t try to get too clever. Plus, watch what is happening on the match screen and see what your players are doing when the opposition are on the ball. Also, check the match stats for more clues.

Liverpool 4 – 1 Wigan

Another lone striker formation. Got my DCs sorted as I’ve said above. Asked my MCd to pick up their AMC. Played control system as was heavy favourites. 4-0 up at half-time so subbed all of my best players for youngsters. Not so good in the second-half as a result. Conceded one but still very comfortable. Onwards and upwards. Just one more game? Ok then.

Bolton 0 – 1 Liverpool

So this is what I have been waiting for. Finally, I get a team who are playing defensively and who I need to use the attack system against.

I’ve been waiting for this all along. Half of the reason I picked Liverpool was because they are notoriously slow at the back (the other half of the reason was because they were my childhood team). I wanted to try pushing up, with a zonal system and also play offside. I am working with high quality players here so I should be ok to do this. I wouldn't try it with my Saints team though!

As I am using a zonal system with higher closing down, I don’t need to make specific adjustments to take into account that Bolton are playing a lone striker formation.

All I do is use the attacking system I’ve described on the front page of this thread with a few minor adjustments. First of all, I make both DCs zonal mark and increase their closing down (to normal/middle of slider). I also make my MCd zonal mark. Then I tick ‘offside trap’. I make other minor changes to player instructions and shorten the passing and the tempo to match.

Result? Well, I totally outplayed Bolton. Should have won by a hatful. 59% possession. 5 clear cut chances. Jaaskelainen got the man of the match award, so that tells its own story. Torres had an off day in front of goal but still played well. Kuyt missed the usual hatful of chances. Good result anyway and very pleased with the performance.

Conclusions:

I've played 10 games in the league so I'm going to leave it there for now.

My record in the league is:

 
Pos			P	W	D	L	F	A	GD	Pts
2nd	Liverpool	10	7	3	0	18	4	14	24

I'm level on points with Manchester United but they have scored four more goals than I have.

My record for all competitions:

	P	W	D	L	F	A	GD	Pts
Liverpool	16	11	4	1	31	9	22	37

1.9 p/m scored. 0.6 p/m conceded.

It's a good record but then I was using a good team.

I would have done even better with more quality in the forward and wide positions. In fact, I doubt I would have kept that form up over the course of the season with that squad. All the more reason to stop now.

I just want to stress that I used the tactics in the opening post. All I did was tweak them slightly to suit the team in the same way as I did when I tweaked for my St. Albans City team. I also tweaked depending upon the opposition formation. I followed scout reports and watched what was happening in the game. I rarely tweaked in the game unless I could see something clearly doing wrong. I watched most of these games on super fast as I was trying to get through them quickly yesterday evening.

Anyway, I can't wait to get back to my Saints game any longer.

Any feedback on this post would be good.

C.

[ricrpor]

I tend to work with the centre-line as my reference point.

My three references points are generally - five clicks up from the far left (defensive), five clicks down from the far right (attacking), in the middle (balanced).

It seems that the central line isn't actually the middle, which is FM getting all postmodern on us I would say! Our assumptions are challenged and undermined; one must question everything!

To be honest, it shouldn't make much difference whether you use 10 as your central point or the centre-line (11) as your base point. I just find it easier to use the middle line.

C.

can you send me your balanced tactic just to make sure we are on the same note?

[crouchaldinho]

I've sent you a PM ricrpor.

[Finknottle]

Hello "C", I just want to ask, what does "thup" stand for? I know I'm going to regret the question. Oh! what the Heck!! As an after thought as I have played only four matches, here are results only. Everton [A] 1-1. Villa [H] 1-1. W.B.A. [A] 1-2 L. I missed W.B.A going attacking when the wretched telephone rang. Brighton L.C. 2nd rnd 8-7 [pens] and Blackburn [H] 3-1. All using the 4-5-1 system, although my SUS tactic is not too good. Kind regards.

[crouchaldinho]

Hello "C", I just want to ask, what does "thup" stand for? I know I'm going to regret the question.

Basically you can use 'thup' between two colons to make this --->

I see above that I have missed a colon off and put :thup instead!

I am not particularly knowledgeable about Internet shorthand so I tend not to use any! If there is anything indecipherable in my messages it is probably a typo!

Everton [A] 1-1. Villa [H] 1-1. W.B.A. [A] 1-2 L. I missed W.B.A going attacking when the wretched telephone rang. Brighton L.C. 2nd rnd 8-7 [pens] and Blackburn [H] 3-1.

That seems like a good set of results with Hull (assuming the Blackburn at home game was a win). Good result away at Everton and beating Villa was always going to be tough. Shame you missed West Brom going all out attack. You do have to watch out from about 75 mins onwards in case a team decides to go for it!

I take it the team is still gelling? A few more games in and you should be set for some more consistency.

All using the 4-5-1 system, although my SUS tactic is not too good. Kind regards.

Do you feel as though you have the 4-5-1 working well now?

You will find your side is more resilient in defending against an all out attacking team in the last 10 mins when they have gelled better. Also, be very wary of stamina. I find that I usually have to watch out for my wide players in particular, as they are closing down heavily and covering a lot of ground out wide. A few tired players on the pitch will not help you see out the result and will cause all kinds of problems.

C.

[Finknottle]

The Blackburn result was a win. I was 3-0 to the good but they scored after 88mins a full 10 mins after I went SUS. The set is still WIP. I have just cut down on the long shooting and only have it for at most two, of my players, Geovanni and Cousin. My two main reasons for using 4-5-1, are that the tactic allows me to put all of my beat players in their best positions and the layout of the system gives, what I feel, is good cover all over the pitch.

I wasn't going to post at all until after my 15th league game, but the "thup" was keeping me awake at night!! Kind regards.

[crouchaldinho]

I wasn't going to post at all until after my 15th league game, but the "thup" was keeping me awake at night!! Kind regards.

Haha!

Well, I hope you continue to improve. Looks like a decent start to me and glad that the 4-5-1 works for you.

C.

[MartinH]

any chance you can upload these tactics crouchaldinho?

[crouchaldinho]

any chance you can upload these tactics crouchaldinho?

No, I'm not uploading any tactics. The idea is for people to use these ideas as a foundation for making their own tactics.

It doesn't take too long, it doesn't have to be too complicated, and the satisfaction will be greater when you see your team playing how you want them to and winning games.

C.

[MartinH]

Ok.

I'm using this idea for league one MK dons, should I leave my d-line where it is on the Standard tactic (in the middle)?

[MartinH]

Oh & one other question.

Should I change "Focus Passing" to Thru the middle for defence tactic, mixed for standard and flanks for attacking or just leave them all on mixed? Thanks.

[crouchaldinho]

Ok.

I'm using this idea for league one MK dons, should I leave my d-line where it is on the Standard tactic (in the middle)?

Have a read through the opening post. Defensive line is normal for balanced and should be linked to mentality to keep your team compact.

C.

[crouchaldinho]

Oh & one other question.

Should I change "Focus Passing" to Thru the middle for defence tactic, mixed for standard and flanks for attacking or just leave them all on mixed? Thanks.

Depends on how you want to play. You may want to focus your efforts on wingplay if you have excellent players in those positions. Alternatively, you might have excellent players in the middle of the park that you want to take advantage of. Personally, I leave them mixed as I don't want to focus passing in any specific way like that.

C.

[MartinH]

Ok, thanks.

We'll see how this goes now

[MartinH]

Lost 2-1 to Southend first league game of the season, not bad though... their media prediction is 6th and mk don's is 19th.

[MartinH]

I just lost to Walsall (away) 1-0 although my team had 65% possession they still couldn't score. Any suggestions?

[psilord80]

Hi Crouch,

I was just wondering what instructions should I give to my goalies. Any advise would be appreciated. Thank you.

[marioneta]

I already read the very good opening post and have only one question in the Team instructions when in refer that for balanced tactic:

Team instructions:

We’re playing balanced so everything needs to be in the middle or set to ‘normal’. The one’s you really need to worry about here are Tempo, Width, Time Wasting and Defensive Line. You could set ‘counter-attack’ and I do tick it because I want my players to break when they can. The rest we are going to set individually.

What Tempo, WIdth, Time Wasting and Defensive Line should we put one the sliders?

Leave it in the Midle or should mess with them?

Apoligizes if this has already been answered but i couldn't find any in the post, only see that for attacking tactic it's defined but not for balanced.

Thks

[Finknottle]

Hello again "C", I would appreciate knowing what tactics you would have used v. Arsenal [A]. The media said,"Hull face the impossible". The odds were Arsenal 1/6 fav. and Hull 10/1.

My best scout said. "Arsenal play 4-4-2. They often look to draw the opposition ont them before attempting to counter attack. Pitch on shorter side. Cause congestion in the middle. Difficult to find space". I interpreted this to mean that I should play the "attacking" tactic and drop my defensive line [2 clicks].

He then went on to report. "Wenger likes his teams to play possession football. Will look to get the ball down and play it. They have a strong defence, difficult to break down. Midfield good, can make chances. Important to defend deep or use fast defenders. Their attacking pace may cause problems". I interpret this to mean that I play the "defensive" tactic with counter attacking.

I am now unsure of what tactics to apply. Thinking in terms of real life, I thought it unwise to play attacking against them. Likewise, by playing defensive I can see the media's odds becoming true! So, more out of luck than judgement I opted to use the "standard" tactic with counter attacking. I dropped the defensive line by 2 clicks, to 8 on the slider. I put my back four to individually man mark their attackers and use hard tackling.

We took the lead from a corner, [Turner] and held on until the 68th minute, when van Persie scored from a free kick, [35yards out]. By using my "iffy" SUS we managed to hold out for 1-1. I'm still unsure of the choice ot tactics I used as the scouts report appears to say on the one hand, play defensive counter attack and on the other play attacking. Kind regards.

[crouchaldinho]

I just lost to Walsall (away) 1-0 although my team had 65% possession they still couldn't score. Any suggestions?

What about stats for chances?

What did you scout report say and what system did you play?

Did any of your strikers have a bad day at the office?

1-0 sounds like perhaps an unlucky result to me rather than down to any tactical deficiency. It could possibly be down to a team that hasn't gelled or a failure to motivate your players. Difficult to tell without any more information.

Hi Crouch,

I was just wondering what instructions should I give to my goalies. Any advise would be appreciated. Thank you.

I usual go mentality same as defensive unit, closing down couple of clicks in from the left, everything else on rarely. Then 'defender collect' for attack, usually 'quick throw' for balanced and 'long kick' for defensive.

I already read the very good opening post and have only one question in the Team instructions when in refer that for balanced tactic:

What Tempo, WIdth, Time Wasting and Defensive Line should we put one the sliders?

Leave it in the Midle or should mess with them?

For tempo, I would tend to link to your passing, but I tend to play normal and leave it in the middle.

For time wasting, I leave in the middle.

Defensive line should be at the mid-point between your defensive unit and attacking unit, which is dead in the centre of the slider for balanced.

C.

[crouchaldinho]

Hello again "C", I would appreciate knowing what tactics you would have used v. Arsenal [A]. The media said,"Hull face the impossible". The odds were Arsenal 1/6 fav. and Hull 10/1.

Always going to be tough playing Arsenal. As usual though, I would follow scout reports and also watch the 2D/3D representation to see what they were doing.

My best scout said. "Arsenal play 4-4-2. They often look to draw the opposition ont them before attempting to counter attack. Pitch on shorter side. Cause congestion in the middle. Difficult to find space". I interpreted this to mean that I should play the "attacking" tactic and drop my defensive line [2 clicks].

The scout says they play just '4-4-2' with no indication of whether this is defensive or attacking. This generally means that they will be playing balanced against you. Having said that, the second line you have put is one that the scout normally says when a team is playing a 'defensive 4-4-2'. Are you sure he didn't say that it was defensive?

If not, then I would be going balanced against Arsenal. I would imagine that the balanced tactic should stand you in good stead for this match, especially if you have set it up similarly to opening post. It's quite cautious and I find it normally ideal for playing bigger teams.

He then went on to report. "Wenger likes his teams to play possession football. Will look to get the ball down and play it. They have a strong defence, difficult to break down. Midfield good, can make chances. Important to defend deep or use fast defenders. Their attacking pace may cause problems". I interpret this to mean that I play the "defensive" tactic with counter attacking.

Really, the scout isn't telling you much that you didn't know already here. But don't get confused between mentality and style.

All this is telling you is Arsenal's style and strengths. I would personally stick to my own style in this game, rather than trying to adjust mine to counter Arsenal. The important thing from your point of view is the comment about pace. Study their attackers. Try to match up your best defenders. I would also try to put as much pace in the side as possible as that may help you.

I opted to use the "standard" tactic with counter attacking. I dropped the defensive line by 2 clicks, to 8 on the slider. I put my back four to individually man mark their attackers and use hard tackling. [...] We took the lead from a corner, [Turner] and held on until the 68th minute, when van Persie scored from a free kick, [35yards out]. By using my "iffy" SUS we managed to hold out for 1-1. I'm still unsure of the choice ot tactics I used as the scouts report appears to say on the one hand, play defensive counter attack and on the other play attacking. Kind regards.

Well, it sounds like you made the right choice for sure. A 1-1 draw away to Arsenal is a terrific result, especially with Hull. Congratulations on that fine point! Shame that they eventually equalised. I expect that they put you under a lot of pressure late on. One thing you could have done to help your chances was check your players at around 60 mins and sub off any particularly tired players (less than 80%). Your wide players might well be the ones to think about subbing as they tend to tire quickly. That might have helped you to hold on. But, I'd say it was probably inevitable that Arsenal were going to come on strong late in the game. Still, I would say that is a top notch result for Hull.

As to the mixed message of the scout report, you are generally looking at what it says next to the formation. Either defensive, attacking or nothing (which generally means balanced). The other clues are generally about the opposition's style and threats. It is quite possible to play a balanced system and to counter-attack or play possession football.

In fact, if there was a scout report for my 'balanced' tactic it would say something like: 'Crouchaldinho plays a 4-4-2. He team often looks to draw the opposition on to them before attempting to counter attack. Crouchaldinho likes his teams to play mixed passing.' &etc.

C.

[Finknottle]

Always going to be tough playing Arsenal. As usual though, I would follow scout reports and also watch the 2D/3D representation to see what they were doing.

The scout says they play just '4-4-2' with no indication of whether this is defensive or attacking. This generally means that they will be playing balanced against you. Having said that, the second line you have put is one that the scout normally says when a team is playing a 'defensive 4-4-2'. Are you sure he didn't say that it was defensive?

If not, then I would be going balanced against Arsenal. I would imagine that the balanced tactic should stand you in good stead for this match, especially if you have set it up similarly to opening post. It's quite cautious and I find it normally ideal for playing bigger teams.

Really, the scout isn't telling you much that you didn't know already here. But don't get confused between mentality and style.

All this is telling you is Arsenal's style and strengths. I would personally stick to my own style in this game, rather than trying to adjust mine to counter Arsenal. The important thing from your point of view is the comment about pace. Study their attackers. Try to match up your best defenders. I would also try to put as much pace in the side as possible as that may help you.

Well, it sounds like you made the right choice for sure. A 1-1 draw away to Arsenal is a terrific result, especially with Hull. Congratulations on that fine point! Shame that they eventually equalised. I expect that they put you under a lot of pressure late on. One thing you could have done to help your chances was check your players at around 60 mins and sub off any particularly tired players (less than 80%). Your wide players might well be the ones to think about subbing as they tend to tire quickly. That might have helped you to hold on. But, I'd say it was probably inevitable that Arsenal were going to come on strong late in the game. Still, I would say that is a top notch result for Hull.

As to the mixed message of the scout report, you are generally looking at what it says next to the formation. Either defensive, attacking or nothing (which generally means balanced). The other clues are generally about the opposition's style and threats. It is quite possible to play a balanced system and to counter-attack or play possession football.

In fact, if there was a scout report for my 'balanced' tactic it would say something like: 'Crouchaldinho plays a 4-4-2. He team often looks to draw the opposition on to them before attempting to counter attack. Crouchaldinho likes his teams to play mixed passing.' &etc.

C.

I don't know how to put parts of a post into just bits,"like wot you do"! Thanks for the encouragement. It is the last two lines that prompted my aging brain to respond. It has just dawned on me. Teams that might play as you do may not always be playing defensive counter attacking but sometimes might use the standard with counter attacking. Oh! That those that do not see, would but see! Anon. Kind regards.

[marioneta]

One other doubt, if we have a similar striker partnership can we put them change places?

Or it's not advisable at all?

[polat_dgn]

well i have a question, Crouch, i manage Inter and for the front two, who would be better suited for FCa and FCd roles? Should i put Ibrahimovic into FCd or FCa position?

[crouchaldinho]

Yes, swap positions can be good. Think about the defenders they are up against though before the game.

I once tried swapping one of my strikers with my AMC (in a 4-4-2 diamond) and it worked pretty well. The two players offered something slightly different and I was hoping that the AMC would be able to use some of his pace as a 'surprise' against the slow opposition defender. My AMC scored a goal in the game I tried this in, by switching with my other attacker. So it can work well.

C.

[crouchaldinho]

well i have a question, Crouch, i manage Inter and for the front two, who would be better suited for FCa and FCd roles? Should i put Ibrahimovic into FCd or FCa position?

Ibrahimovic is perfect for the FCd role.

Great strength, great first touch, decent jumping, lots of creativity and flair, great movement, decent passing, terrific technique. Also, has the PPM 'tries killer balls often'.

I would have him in the FCd role. In attacking tactics, I would give him high creative freedom, a free role, through balls often, hold up the ball etc.

If you have a look further up this thread, I have detailed the kind of attributes I want from the FCd and FCa, so that should help you decide.

C.

[marioneta]

On the attacking tactic when you say:

My most creative player is in the middle of the park, my MCa, so I am going to give him 4 clicks above the middle ‘much’.

Is it the maximum number on the slider? Or it's 4 for to the right than the middle?

[20Reedy07]

Played my first league game using the balanced tactic mentioned in the opening post, i was up against Birmingham (whom are tipped to win the league) away, talk about a difficult first fixture! Used a few OI on who i considered to be there key players. Man marked both forwards who i kept rather quite so quiet Marcus Bent was subbed after 20+ mins!.. I was much the better side throughout the game so all in all happy with the result.

Very good thread this Crouchaldinho. *Thumbs up*

[crouchaldinho]

On the attacking tactic when you say:

Is it the maximum number on the slider? Or it's 4 for to the right than the middle?

In that quotation, I am talking about four notches above the middle (i.e. 4 to the right side of the middle line).

[crouchaldinho]

Played my first league game using the balanced tactic mentioned in the opening post, i was up against Birmingham (whom are tipped to win the league) away, talk about a difficult first fixture! Used a few OI on who i considered to be there key players. Man marked both forwards who i kept rather quite so quiet Marcus Bent was subbed after 20+ mins!.. I was much the better side throughout the game so all in all happy with the result.

Well done. Sounds like you did the business there.

Good luck with your campaign!

C.

[Codename47]

Yes of course fully understood bud. Just needed clarification in line with my thinking. Not knocking your thoughts and suggestions and records at all ;-)

[fatboyjohnmulhern]

Bad start using the formation, lost 1-0 at home, not happy after spending hours doing this tactic and it gives me no reward, i will plough on to see if things turn around!!

[marioneta]

I'm on fire with this set played 15 won 12 draw 2 and lost 1 against mighty Arsenal all the games played away.

Finished in 2nd in EPL only 2 points away for the not obvious champion Man City.

Thks for your advices "C" , i'm gona try to implement the tactic also at home in the next season.

I'll report feedback

[crouchaldinho]

Bad start using the formation, lost 1-0 at home, not happy after spending hours doing this tactic and it gives me no reward, i will plough on to see if things turn around!!

Who are you playing with fatboy?

Sorry to hear you had a bad start. Could you see anything specifically going wrong during the game?

I'm on fire with this set played 15 won 12 draw 2 and lost 1 against mighty Arsenal all the games played away.

Finished in 2nd in EPL only 2 points away for the not obvious champion Man City.

Thks for your advices "C" , i'm gona try to implement the tactic also at home in the next season.

I'll report feedback

Wow, that's a really good record away from home. Top job.

And you were playing with Newcastle as well. Very impressive.

Good luck with your title challenge next season!

C.

[Wesley Brown]

I have created a balanced and offensive tactic from your guide with Aston Villa. So far I'm doing okay, but lost 3-1 away against Newcastle now. Actually I have had some luck in the wins as I find it hard to dominate the matches. Hopefully it is because of the bad morale, so I guess I just have to be a bit patient.

But I am just wondering if it is a reason for why you are using Man Marking, but not Tight Marking, and what the differences are between them. Is tight marking supposed to be used only if you use OI?